Aight, my biggest problem with GW2 is that the gameplay and style will completely change if the cap is at 100 or limitless. Like a lot of skills in GW, they become more effective by their duration when you put in attribute points (ex: stances and snares). Now you can't have skills function that way in GW2 because the duration would just last forever unless you base it on a crappy skill system where you put several skill points into skills to make it better and the skills have a level cap. Also the main problem is the grind issues. People will have to keep leveling to stay competitive with others which is completely what GW was against. The system was based on skill and teamwork, not hours played. I dont want to be in these huge massive battles and see some invincible lvl 100 dude killing a bunch of lvl 50s. It would even be worse if there was no cap limit because then you would feel like you would never be as good as the guys who play 24/7 and you can't create a 2nd character and still stay competitve.
So what do u guys think
Pros:
Gives PvE something to work for
Lets people show off how long they have been playing
May attract more players
Ability to "pwn" lower lvl mbos - (Mordakai)
Gives people something to "do"
Possible side-kick system
Cons:
Gameplay/skill use change
Less skill more grind
Not for a casual player
Creating a 2nd character may make you less competetive with your 1st guy
Limitless cap would completely unbalance the game and make it unfair for others
High lvl mobs/increased gold drops could hurt economy - (Scorpian boy)
People who play less will feel at a disadvantage against higher lvl people who play much more
BTW: We don't exactly know what ANet will do, this is just to discuss the idea that they are planning on a lvl 100/limitless cap
GW 2 and the level cap
Sniper22
Mordakai
LOL! "Pros: To be listed." Come one. You can't think of a single Pro?
Let me help you out: (and believe me, I'm playing Devil's Advocate here. I'm not a big believer in the "no or higher level cap" idea)
Pro:
Gives PvE something to work for. (Remember, this only effects PvE, so it's not going to imbalance serious PvP. And no, I don't consider the World vs World "PvP" serious, it's for fun, and everyone joining such a slaughterfest would recognize that.)
Recognition for playing longer.
The ability to "pwn" lower level creatures (yeah, this is a weak reason, but I'm all for pleasing everybody)
_____________
Saying that, I hope that there is SOME balance. It should be possible to kill a higher level char, and it should never be impossible to join a group (hopefully, the sidekick idea will help here).
The bottom line is, I don't care about lack of henchies, level-cap, new races, new armor and weapons... as much as I care about one thing: Is it Fun.
That's all that matters. I trust Anet, they know that casual players make up the majority, they know people like creating lots of characters (esp. with the introduction of races!), and we don't want to be forced to only play one character to "stay competitive."
So, as long as the new level cap keeps the game fun, who am I to complain? More power to those who have the time to get to level 100. If it's super hard to do, there won't be many of them, and it won't be an issue. If it's not too hard... it won't be an issue. So, I'm taking a "wait and see" attitude.
Let me help you out: (and believe me, I'm playing Devil's Advocate here. I'm not a big believer in the "no or higher level cap" idea)
Pro:
Gives PvE something to work for. (Remember, this only effects PvE, so it's not going to imbalance serious PvP. And no, I don't consider the World vs World "PvP" serious, it's for fun, and everyone joining such a slaughterfest would recognize that.)
Recognition for playing longer.
The ability to "pwn" lower level creatures (yeah, this is a weak reason, but I'm all for pleasing everybody)
_____________
Saying that, I hope that there is SOME balance. It should be possible to kill a higher level char, and it should never be impossible to join a group (hopefully, the sidekick idea will help here).
The bottom line is, I don't care about lack of henchies, level-cap, new races, new armor and weapons... as much as I care about one thing: Is it Fun.
That's all that matters. I trust Anet, they know that casual players make up the majority, they know people like creating lots of characters (esp. with the introduction of races!), and we don't want to be forced to only play one character to "stay competitive."
So, as long as the new level cap keeps the game fun, who am I to complain? More power to those who have the time to get to level 100. If it's super hard to do, there won't be many of them, and it won't be an issue. If it's not too hard... it won't be an issue. So, I'm taking a "wait and see" attitude.
Scorpion Boy
About the level cap:
With no level cap the PvE'ers would've more to work on, besides the titles we've got now ofcourse. If there's no level cap Anet will obviously sell more copies of the game because of them WoW geeks will come to GW (I don't know if that's something to be proud of, but hey $$$
). But when the level cap will be higher...The skills must be adjusted also, wich will automaticly lead to one uber-skill for each profesion and that would suck IMO.
And if there are higher level players, there will be higher level mobs, wich will drop higher amounts of money. That would also ruin the econemy system in GW. This were just some of my thoughts about the stuff they might put in GW2.
~Boy
With no level cap the PvE'ers would've more to work on, besides the titles we've got now ofcourse. If there's no level cap Anet will obviously sell more copies of the game because of them WoW geeks will come to GW (I don't know if that's something to be proud of, but hey $$$
). But when the level cap will be higher...The skills must be adjusted also, wich will automaticly lead to one uber-skill for each profesion and that would suck IMO.And if there are higher level players, there will be higher level mobs, wich will drop higher amounts of money. That would also ruin the econemy system in GW. This were just some of my thoughts about the stuff they might put in GW2.
~Boy
Kityn
If the time to gain a level is equal or very close to what we have now in GW then I will have no problem with it. I do not want to spend several months grinding away just to get to the good areas. One thing I really despised about other MMOs. For instance. In Everquest you would have to spend hours in Dreadlands just to gain a level by killing the same mobs over and over again. That was extremely boring.
Something else I would not like to see is a higher level character having a far superior advantage over a lower level character. For those that have watched the South Park episode about WoW you know what I mean. I used to play Lineage2 a few years ago. Seeing someone 10 levels higher than you are and totally getting owned by that player was a total letdown. You stood absolutely no chance at all. I do not want to see that at all in GW2. Player skill rather than character level is what I want to see.
As long as the high level cap is done well I will not have any problems with it.
Something else I would not like to see is a higher level character having a far superior advantage over a lower level character. For those that have watched the South Park episode about WoW you know what I mean. I used to play Lineage2 a few years ago. Seeing someone 10 levels higher than you are and totally getting owned by that player was a total letdown. You stood absolutely no chance at all. I do not want to see that at all in GW2. Player skill rather than character level is what I want to see.
As long as the high level cap is done well I will not have any problems with it.
sdliddo
heres the thing... level cap without the level cap
ie: you stop getting attribute points after a certain level.
But that doesnt mean your level will not increase. Sure im a level 4000 chara but shit... my attributes are the same as a level 20
Something to think about eh.
Easy solution to those who feel being pwned by higher level people.
ie: you stop getting attribute points after a certain level.
But that doesnt mean your level will not increase. Sure im a level 4000 chara but shit... my attributes are the same as a level 20
Something to think about eh.
Easy solution to those who feel being pwned by higher level people.
Dougal Kronik
Seeing as how Anet has broken the mould with pretty much every approach to GW when compared to other online games, I think it would be best to wait for further information on how this high or no level cap will be implemented before spouting all the doom and gloom.
It may be something as harmless as your levels keep increasing after level 20, but 20 is the max point of attributes rewards. Kind of like each time you cyxcle a skill point, your level indicator would increase.
It may be something as harmless as your levels keep increasing after level 20, but 20 is the max point of attributes rewards. Kind of like each time you cyxcle a skill point, your level indicator would increase.
Knightsaber Sith
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Originally Posted by sdliddo
heres the thing... level cap without the level cap
ie: you stop getting attribute points after a certain level. But that doesnt mean your level will not increase. Sure im a level 4000 chara but shit... my attributes are the same as a level 20 Something to think about eh. Easy solution to those who feel being pwned by higher level people. |
Why_Me
Just because its level 100 doesn't mean its any different than a level 20 with more progression values. The game is balanced differently, it won't use the same skills, so what does it matter if you can put 73 in swordsmanship. Look in perspective, does it really matter. As long as there is a level cap (which there should be), it doesn't matter how many progression levels there are (assuming you can still make PvP characters).
Loviatar
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in case you missed it the GW1 low level cap does not exist in the completely new game called GW2
the need for a *strong sidekicking system* proves that levels are not cosmetic as many wish.
from the interview.
Quote:
| We will have a sidekicking system similar to what City of Heroes has, where if you're going out with a level 50 friend, and you're only level 15, then he can increase your power to be the same as his power. |
they are designing this new game with meat on its bones so you cant blow through it fast then say *what is there to do?*
Quote:
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Arena Net, it seems, is trying to tackle many of the biggest drawbacks most current massively multiplayer online games face. Chief among them is level capping. Why, once you top out, should you stick around in a game? Guild Wars 2 is trying to deal with that issue by using a system with a high level cap once that could be set to 100 or even boundless. "So there is not a level 20 cap," Strain said. "Either it will be a high level like 100 or unbounded, we haven't decided." |
Kijik Oni Hanryuu
simple answer, huge lvl cap will be mostly aesthetic, once you reach say lvl 30, after that level the gains per level will be severely diminished.. atleast this is the way I see it may happen.. But hey, if ya dun like it you still have GW1.
Sniper22
See the thing is, there should be more fun things to do in a game besides grinding for levels, like missions, quests, and elite areas. If there was nothing to do after you hit the cap, GW would have died out a long time ago. I know they are trying to attract new players, but maybe like a lvl 60 cap would do it or so.
Mordakai
Blast from the Past folks!
http://www.guildwarsguru.com/forum/s...ead.php?t=2662
NOTE: This discussion started during the BETA of the original Guild Wars.
I'm gonna be mean to Loviatar:
He-he!
http://www.guildwarsguru.com/forum/s...ead.php?t=2662
NOTE: This discussion started during the BETA of the original Guild Wars.
I'm gonna be mean to Loviatar:
Quote:
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Originally Posted by Loviatar
there will be no raising of the cap period
this is about skll not how many levels you grind out to be better than someone |
lyra_song
LOL
Hey you cant take Lovi out of context, this GW2, he was talking about GW1
Hey you cant take Lovi out of context, this GW2, he was talking about GW1
Loviatar
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Originally Posted by Mordakai
Blast from the Past folks!
I'm gonna be mean to Loviatar: He-he! |
<sticks out tongue while diving to safety and remembers MAXWELLSMARTS famous words at the last moment>(missed it by that much)
@ Kijik Oni Hanryuu
again you forget the article
LEVELS COUNT NOW
Quote:
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allow players of different levels to keep interacting in the persistant world-which is crucial, since as of right now, ArenaNet is planning a very high (100-plus), or possibly no level cap. there are also plans for a strong sidekicking system similar to City of Heroes, which allows a higher-level player to designate a player 10 or more levels below him as his sidekick, bestowing health, stamina, and other benefits that allow the lower-level player to sufficiently keep up with their higher level buddy. |
zwei2stein
You forgot 2 most important contra level arguments:
* Levels decrease amount of content
* Levels cause level discrimination
* Levels decrease amount of content
* Levels cause level discrimination
MirageMaster
I dont care,I rather have no lvl cap.
lightblade
Even if there's no level cap for PvP, the "side-kick" system would still balace the game out.
So no worries
So no worries
Jetdoc
We have absolutely no idea what increases in levels will be beyond the PvP level cap, so it's hard to describe pros and cons to it.
For example, what if they froze attribute points, and simply gave you 1 extra point of health for every level beyond 20? Not that much difference between a level 100 and a level 20, eh?
For example, what if they froze attribute points, and simply gave you 1 extra point of health for every level beyond 20? Not that much difference between a level 100 and a level 20, eh?
Knightsaber Sith
Quote:
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Originally Posted by Jetdoc
We have absolutely no idea what increases in levels will be beyond the PvP level cap, so it's hard to describe pros and cons to it.
For example, what if they froze attribute points, and simply gave you 1 extra point of health for every level beyond 20? Not that much difference between a level 100 and a level 20, eh? |
ravensong
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Originally Posted by Sniper22
Not for a casual player
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gasmaskman
Why do we ask these questions when the beta itself could very well be over 16 months away?
Why not just leave it until more information is release. The gold version could very well take up to three years to complete.
Why not just leave it until more information is release. The gold version could very well take up to three years to complete.
Sniper22
So with the side-kick system it's all about having a powerful buddy? Seems kinda unguildwars like to me. Should be more of a team boost thing anyway -- have the highest lvl member boost up the rest of the party a few lvls, hoping that you still need a party to do quests and missions.
The worst thing that ANET could possibly do is have no lvl cap IMO. But instead of this whole 100 lvls thing lemme suggest this.
Cap the lvls at 50, allow people to create lvl 50 pvp only characters ONCE they get one pve character at lvl 50
After that, there should be a pve rank system, like pvp ranks but with mild PVE ONLY boosts like the lightbringer title. You gain this title by earning pve xp points by doing quests and killing mobs AFTER you reached lvl 50. There can be a max of 10 or so ranks. Every rank you get increased dmg and defense in pve. You will also earn one or two pve only skills unique to your profession every rank.
If Anet did something like that, pvp and stuff can still be balanced out and people can have multiple characters if they want. Lvl 50 shouldn't be a total grind too reach, but people can still shoot for the pve ranks if they want to keep going.
The worst thing that ANET could possibly do is have no lvl cap IMO. But instead of this whole 100 lvls thing lemme suggest this.
Cap the lvls at 50, allow people to create lvl 50 pvp only characters ONCE they get one pve character at lvl 50
After that, there should be a pve rank system, like pvp ranks but with mild PVE ONLY boosts like the lightbringer title. You gain this title by earning pve xp points by doing quests and killing mobs AFTER you reached lvl 50. There can be a max of 10 or so ranks. Every rank you get increased dmg and defense in pve. You will also earn one or two pve only skills unique to your profession every rank.
If Anet did something like that, pvp and stuff can still be balanced out and people can have multiple characters if they want. Lvl 50 shouldn't be a total grind too reach, but people can still shoot for the pve ranks if they want to keep going.
Spartan117
I dont really mind if there is a lvl cap. its gonna be an entierly different game. lol, ive said this on several different links here. The information isnt here yet, we dont know. The limitless cap that they say they MIGHT have, isnt said for sure. I think that we need to remember that with the original game that weve been playing, is great! Why would they want to mess it up? I think the game will turn out fine, why wouldnt it? and im sure they are gonna put a limit on the attribute points, lol we would never be allowed in pvp again. So the no lvl cap im sure will have a bonus of its own, but im sure it will be cool.
Bowman Artemis
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Originally Posted by Sniper22
So with the side-kick system it's all about having a powerful buddy? Seems kinda unguildwars like to me. Should be more of a team boost thing anyway -- have the highest lvl member boost up the rest of the party a few lvls, hoping that you still need a party to do quests and missions.
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Quote:
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Originally Posted by Sniper22
The worst thing that ANET could possibly do is have no lvl cap IMO. But instead of this whole 100 lvls thing lemme suggest this.
Cap the lvls at 50, allow people to create lvl 50 pvp only characters ONCE they get one pve character at lvl 50 |
Quote:
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Originally Posted by Sniper22
After that, there should be a pve rank system, like pvp ranks but with mild PVE ONLY boosts like the lightbringer title. You gain this title by earning pve xp points by doing quests and killing mobs AFTER you reached lvl 50. There can be a max of 10 or so ranks. Every rank you get increased dmg and defense in pve. You will also earn one or two pve only skills unique to your profession every rank.
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Quote:
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Originally Posted by Sniper22
If Anet did something like that, pvp and stuff can still be balanced out and people can have multiple characters if they want. Lvl 50 shouldn't be a total grind too reach, but people can still shoot for the pve ranks if they want to keep going.
|
Knightsaber Sith
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Originally Posted by Sniper22
So with the side-kick system it's all about having a powerful buddy? Seems kinda unguildwars like to me. Should be more of a team boost thing anyway -- have the highest lvl member boost up the rest of the party a few lvls
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that's why CoV only lets you sidekick one person at a time.
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Originally Posted by Sniper22
Cap the lvls at 50, allow people to create lvl 50 pvp only characters ONCE they get one pve character at lvl 50
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Loviatar
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it says nothing about keeping any gains from the sidekicking.
Quote:
| there are also plans for a strong sidekicking system similar to City of Heroes, which allows a higher-level player to designate a player 10 or more levels below him as his sidekick, bestowing health, stamina, and other benefits that allow the lower-level player to sufficiently keep up with their higher level buddy. |
Lonesamurai
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Originally Posted by Knightsaber Sith
GW2 doesn't have PvP only characters.
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Knightsaber Sith
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Originally Posted by Mike O'Brien
we're really highlighting that aspect and making it easier to get into that aspect by saying, there's nothing you have to unlock, you don't have work your character up before they can compete in that aspect of the game. There won't be different character types for roleplaying and PvP, so you won't need to create a PvP character or anything like that. In Guild Wars 2, any character can go into the balanced, competitive PvP matches, and when they do they will have access to the high-end skills for their class like the other players, and they can immediately jump into high-end PvP.
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As I said, there are no PvP only characters!
Quote:
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Originally Posted by Loviatar
also according to the article the sidekick is not leveled but simply borrows what is needed as long as they are sidekicked.
it says nothing about keeping any gains from the sidekicking. |
TheLichMonky
The lower levels help them balance the amount of skill points and how they distributed them, i personaly like the lvl 20 level cap, its just makes it easier x.x
Alex Weekes
Hey all,
I thought I'd drop in here and point you to an interview on German site Gamona. Yes, I know what you're thinking ... but no, there's an English version as well that's good reading. Included is some clarification of the level cap situation.
I thought I'd drop in here and point you to an interview on German site Gamona. Yes, I know what you're thinking ... but no, there's an English version as well that's good reading. Included is some clarification of the level cap situation.
Caith-Avar
Quote:
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Originally Posted by Alex Weekes
I thought I'd drop in here and point you to an interview on German site Gamona. Included is some clarification of the level cap situation.
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Dj Tano
Ive got a question:
Gaile said that the "no level cap" system was to show off how long youve been playing.
But in the sense of "i started playing gw 15 monts ago" or in the sense of "i played gw 10.000 hours"?
Gaile said that the "no level cap" system was to show off how long youve been playing.
But in the sense of "i started playing gw 15 monts ago" or in the sense of "i played gw 10.000 hours"?
Mordakai
Quote:
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Originally Posted by Alex Weekes
Hey all,
I thought I'd drop in here and point you to an interview on German site Gamona. Yes, I know what you're thinking ... but no, there's an English version as well that's good reading. Included is some clarification of the level cap situation. |
Can someone quote the appropriate part about Level Caps?
I pwnd U
Quote:
| Arena.net: We know that there are some quite "precise" numbers ("Level 150") floating around. First of all, I'd like to say that there has been no final decision about the level cap yet. The numbers you heard should rather illustrate the fundamental idea of the "new" level system. What is sure by now is that we will have a much higher level cap in Guild Wars 2 than in Guild Wars or even won't have a cap at all. The reason for this is that in Guild Wars, the game does not really start until level 20. But after reaching the level cap - although there are so many ways in developing your character - Guild Wars is lacking public recognition of character development, because the level does not increase any more. That's what we're going to change in Guild Wars 2 by rising the level cap a lot. At the same time, we're flattening the power curve, so the difference between a level 50 and a level 100 character would be much bigger than between a level 100 and 150 char. This increases freedom in character development without making Max-Lvl-Characters too strong. |
Dj Tano
ZomRED ENGINE GORED ENGINE GORED ENGINE GORED ENGINE GO, 150lvls?
That is waay too much...
I would prefer a lvl50 cap where it take you quite a while to reach lvl50 then a lvl150 cap.
That is waay too much...
I would prefer a lvl50 cap where it take you quite a while to reach lvl50 then a lvl150 cap.
Spartan117
ya know, lvl 50 sounds pretty decent. Its higher than 20, but its still reasonable. As long as the attribute points are evened out, it sounds good to me. or they would have to make the game harder if they do have alot of points. it would be kinda pointless to go into the final area and hit the boss with one hit and win. it would have to be alot harder, if ya think about it. but yeah, if they had to go higher than 20, 50 would work alright.
Mordakai
Do you guys know a "curve" works? And what "flattens" means?
It means, even if there is not a "hard" limit (like 50); Anet could make it very difficult with little gain for levels after 50, so that for the few that do reach level XX, they are not THAT much more powerful.
So whats the point? To attract gamers who have previously been turned off of Guild Wars b/c of the level caps, never even giving it a chance.
It means, even if there is not a "hard" limit (like 50); Anet could make it very difficult with little gain for levels after 50, so that for the few that do reach level XX, they are not THAT much more powerful.
So whats the point? To attract gamers who have previously been turned off of Guild Wars b/c of the level caps, never even giving it a chance.
Loviatar
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Quote:
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| so the difference between a level 50 and a level 100 character would be much bigger than between a level 100 and 150 char. |
Baelasina NightSong
OR (as it sounds to me) the difficulty doesn't increase much, if at all, but the difference in abilities doesn't change much... I get this interpretation from them saying "...At the same time, we're flattening the power curve, so the difference between a level 50 and a level 100 character would be much bigger than between a level 100 and 150 char..."
Looks like Loviatar beat me to the punch by just moments...
Looks like Loviatar beat me to the punch by just moments...
Spartan117
well, i guess we just need to trust Anet on this. they did good on the first game, why screw the second? im sure they will make it just as good if not better. its gonna be a different game too, i think we all are forgeting this in some form.