No loot scaling for GWEN
Noz Crow
/signed Loot scaling was the worst idea since the state of California allowed Micheal Jackson to have his own amusement park. If you want to get rid of bots make common stuff like skills and max armor (excluding 15k and fow armor) easier to obtain. Done and done.
cosyfiep
No I actually DO understand what loot scaling is....and before it I got lots of drops, lots of coins etc, now I get almost nothing either in hm or not.....loot scaling affects you whether or not you solo....I dont take 8 with me, but I have noticed that the drops have gotten far worse and less in the last few months since the introduction of loot scaling...this is what leads me to believe its loot scaling that has cut my regular share of the loots!
No I dont hard core farm, dont have the time, but I do like to repeat some areas and quests-----and I am not getting what I used to in terms of items or coins.
from wiki:'When farming solo or having party members, you get less items than you normally would, and that amount is now comparable to that of full group farming.'maybe I should bring a full group with me now
No I dont hard core farm, dont have the time, but I do like to repeat some areas and quests-----and I am not getting what I used to in terms of items or coins.
from wiki:'When farming solo or having party members, you get less items than you normally would, and that amount is now comparable to that of full group farming.'maybe I should bring a full group with me now
lord_shar
I farm quite often and have gained even more high-end GW items since loot scaling went into effect.
Loot scaling reduced the total amount of gold being generated by players. However, it did not increase the non-farming player's buying power since their gold-generation/income was also cut. If anything, loot-scaling simply put most 15k armors well out the non-farming casual players' immediate reach. Solo farmers are still largely unaffected because they are still pulling in much more gold than the non-farming casual player -- enough to outpurchase the latter consistently in the present deflated virtual economy.
So, what was the point of loot-scaling again?
Loot scaling reduced the total amount of gold being generated by players. However, it did not increase the non-farming player's buying power since their gold-generation/income was also cut. If anything, loot-scaling simply put most 15k armors well out the non-farming casual players' immediate reach. Solo farmers are still largely unaffected because they are still pulling in much more gold than the non-farming casual player -- enough to outpurchase the latter consistently in the present deflated virtual economy.
So, what was the point of loot-scaling again?
freekedoutfish
Quote:
Originally Posted by Omniclasm
It is not like killing things by yourself is any more challenging, if anything its easier. So my question.....Why should Player B get atleast 8x as much gold as Player A for doing something he enjoys? They both enjoy what they do, but one is so rich he can't spend it all, and the other can barely afford armor and skills.
. Your right to say it might not seem fair, but unfortunately we need drastic action to sort out the economy in GWs.
And one major issue was the staggering number of rich players, compared to poor ones, and the inflated prices due to that.
Loot scaling just means you cant solo farm and make 8 times as much as an 8man team. Its intended to cut down on people making oober amounts of gold, and to cut down on the number of rich players.
It may not be fair, but its required.
. Your right to say it might not seem fair, but unfortunately we need drastic action to sort out the economy in GWs.
And one major issue was the staggering number of rich players, compared to poor ones, and the inflated prices due to that.
Loot scaling just means you cant solo farm and make 8 times as much as an 8man team. Its intended to cut down on people making oober amounts of gold, and to cut down on the number of rich players.
It may not be fair, but its required.
Azza
Hello all, been a long time since ive been on this site, about 5 months now, i hate the moderators, and i think they hate me. Since loot scaling came in i havent bothered to play GW at all, i have deleted the game from my computer,
Loot scaling was the last straw for me, after nearly two years of playing the game and seeing all the bots in the same place month after month and nothing being done, the same leechers month after month with nothing being done, nerf after unwarrented nerf and people like me are being punished for doing what we are supposed to be able to do. "Stick to genuine player? hmm yeah, great idea!" I didn`t Solo a great deal but did enjoy doing a few runs a day to help buy npc`s for my guild hall and extras for my heros and other stuff etc etc, this didnt make me rich but did help me when i wanted the extra stuff
i cant see myself playing GW again, even if they reverse loot scaling
How about they spend time thinking of ways to get rid of the people who spoil it for others instead of just spoiling it for all
Loot scaling was the last straw for me, after nearly two years of playing the game and seeing all the bots in the same place month after month and nothing being done, the same leechers month after month with nothing being done, nerf after unwarrented nerf and people like me are being punished for doing what we are supposed to be able to do. "Stick to genuine player? hmm yeah, great idea!" I didn`t Solo a great deal but did enjoy doing a few runs a day to help buy npc`s for my guild hall and extras for my heros and other stuff etc etc, this didnt make me rich but did help me when i wanted the extra stuff
i cant see myself playing GW again, even if they reverse loot scaling
How about they spend time thinking of ways to get rid of the people who spoil it for others instead of just spoiling it for all
freekedoutfish
Quote:
Originally Posted by Azza
Hello all, been a long time since ive been on this site, about 5 months now, i hate the moderators, and i think they hate me. Since loot scaling came in i havent bothered to play GW at all, i have deleted the game from my computer,
Loot scaling was the last straw for me, after nearly two years of playing the game and seeing all the bots in the same place month after month and nothing being done, the same leechers month after month with nothing being done, nerf after unwarrented nerf and people like me are being punished for doing what we are supposed to be able to do. "Stick to genuine player? hmm yeah, great idea!" I didn`t Solo a great deal but did enjoy doing a few runs a day to help buy npc`s for my guild hall and extras for my heros and other stuff etc etc, this didnt make me rich but did help me when i wanted the extra stuff
i cant see myself playing GW again, even if they reverse loot scaling
How about they spend time thinking of ways to get rid of the people who spoil it for others instead of just spoiling it for all Does no one actually play this game for the sheer joy of playing the storyline, or competeing against other players?
You all seem pre-occupied with making gold and farming items. Gold and wealth is not the be-all and end-all of this game, there is a storyline, missions and quests there you know.
Loot scaling was the last straw for me, after nearly two years of playing the game and seeing all the bots in the same place month after month and nothing being done, the same leechers month after month with nothing being done, nerf after unwarrented nerf and people like me are being punished for doing what we are supposed to be able to do. "Stick to genuine player? hmm yeah, great idea!" I didn`t Solo a great deal but did enjoy doing a few runs a day to help buy npc`s for my guild hall and extras for my heros and other stuff etc etc, this didnt make me rich but did help me when i wanted the extra stuff
i cant see myself playing GW again, even if they reverse loot scaling
How about they spend time thinking of ways to get rid of the people who spoil it for others instead of just spoiling it for all Does no one actually play this game for the sheer joy of playing the storyline, or competeing against other players?
You all seem pre-occupied with making gold and farming items. Gold and wealth is not the be-all and end-all of this game, there is a storyline, missions and quests there you know.
Azza
Quote:
Originally Posted by freekedoutfish
Does no one actually play this game for the sheer joy of playing the storyline, or competeing against other players?
You all seem pre-occupied with making gold and farming items. Gold and wealth is not the be-all and end-all of this game, there is a storyline, missions and quests there you know. I could have been a lot clearer, soz for that, i have completed all 3 campaigns with 3 characters and have numerous titles, i didn`t like PvP as there was way too many leechers and rejects, Pugging isnt fun, there is always at least one who is way to serious and ends up abusing some poor noob who is only trying to learn how to play the game. i was not "wealthy" but farming was what i was enjoying apart from helping mates out.
My main point is: loot scaling only stopped genuine players from playing, bots are still botting and leechers are still leeching. Spend the time to fix that problem instead of nerfing stuff and making the game unenjoyable for genuine players
It shouldn`t matter if there is one or one hundred thousand Solo Farmers, every person has an individual preference as to how they want to play the game and as long as they are not scamming the game its shouldn`t affect anyone else as to how they play.
Unfortunately for me Area nerfed drops and thus this was the last straw for me
You all seem pre-occupied with making gold and farming items. Gold and wealth is not the be-all and end-all of this game, there is a storyline, missions and quests there you know. I could have been a lot clearer, soz for that, i have completed all 3 campaigns with 3 characters and have numerous titles, i didn`t like PvP as there was way too many leechers and rejects, Pugging isnt fun, there is always at least one who is way to serious and ends up abusing some poor noob who is only trying to learn how to play the game. i was not "wealthy" but farming was what i was enjoying apart from helping mates out.
My main point is: loot scaling only stopped genuine players from playing, bots are still botting and leechers are still leeching. Spend the time to fix that problem instead of nerfing stuff and making the game unenjoyable for genuine players
It shouldn`t matter if there is one or one hundred thousand Solo Farmers, every person has an individual preference as to how they want to play the game and as long as they are not scamming the game its shouldn`t affect anyone else as to how they play.
Unfortunately for me Area nerfed drops and thus this was the last straw for me
freekedoutfish
Quote:
Originally Posted by Azza
My main point is: loot scaling only stopped genuine players from playing, bots are still botting and leechers are still leeching.
I dont quite understand your term there.
I'm what you might call a "genuine player" because im on nearly every night PvEing. But I never farm and im quite happy with the drops I get from either quests, missions, exploring, vanquishing.
Whether it be in normal mode or hard mode, Im happy with the drop rate and It hasnt effected my ability to make gold. I just sell everything to the merchants and I can make gold very fast in no time.
If by genuine players, you mean casual pve'ers who just play for the story and the missions, etc, then I dont understand why people have issues making gold.
As for botting and leaching. There isnt alot they can do with leaching, because you cant prove someone isnt just afk for good reason.
Botting they are trying to resolve, but it doesnt matter what you change ingame, people will always find a way around it with 3rd party software. The botters are always one step ahead.
I'm what you might call a "genuine player" because im on nearly every night PvEing. But I never farm and im quite happy with the drops I get from either quests, missions, exploring, vanquishing.
Whether it be in normal mode or hard mode, Im happy with the drop rate and It hasnt effected my ability to make gold. I just sell everything to the merchants and I can make gold very fast in no time.
If by genuine players, you mean casual pve'ers who just play for the story and the missions, etc, then I dont understand why people have issues making gold.
As for botting and leaching. There isnt alot they can do with leaching, because you cant prove someone isnt just afk for good reason.
Botting they are trying to resolve, but it doesnt matter what you change ingame, people will always find a way around it with 3rd party software. The botters are always one step ahead.
Azza
genuine as in not botting or leeching, it doesnt matter how often you are on so long as your game play is not detrimental to others.
If you are happy with the loot scale drops then its no problem for you.
For me, i wasn`t happy so it was a problem for me, i didn`t feel it was fair to players and mainly myself who solo farmed, we put our experience into it, we should and did get rewarded for it. they nerfed it, i didn`t like it, i don`t play anymore. i, like many other long time players have had enough of being penalised because of others greed and there have been plenty of suggestions for leechers, have they at least tried anything???, doing nothing just shows they dont care about it, but this is now getting off topic.
Loot scaling for me was the worst thing they have done yet? it didnt stop any bots, it just stopped the genuine people who where using it as an alternative to the PvP and PvE group playing
If you are happy with the loot scale drops then its no problem for you.
For me, i wasn`t happy so it was a problem for me, i didn`t feel it was fair to players and mainly myself who solo farmed, we put our experience into it, we should and did get rewarded for it. they nerfed it, i didn`t like it, i don`t play anymore. i, like many other long time players have had enough of being penalised because of others greed and there have been plenty of suggestions for leechers, have they at least tried anything???, doing nothing just shows they dont care about it, but this is now getting off topic.
Loot scaling for me was the worst thing they have done yet? it didnt stop any bots, it just stopped the genuine people who where using it as an alternative to the PvP and PvE group playing
lennymon
removing loot scaling from gwen will only ensure the botters will hack your account to farm there, not remove them from the equation.
lord_shar
I think ANET went the wrong direction. Rather than punishing solo-farmers with loot scaling, why not reverse the strategy and reward grouping by increasing drop rates for partied players? In other words, why not simply reward group players as opposed to punishing solo play? This was a pretty successful strategy in another MMORPG I used to play. The increased item supply along with hard mode will still keep item prices low while still curtailing gold-sale generation since gold will also be plentiful. However, this strategy allows casual players to be able to afford 15k and other vanity armors, unlike the present set-up.
Loot scaling can work if used as a bonus instead of a penalty.
Loot scaling can work if used as a bonus instead of a penalty.
Omniclasm
Quote:
Originally Posted by freekedoutfish
Your right to say it might not seem fair, but unfortunately we need drastic action to sort out the economy in GWs.
And one major issue was the staggering number of rich players, compared to poor ones, and the inflated prices due to that.
Loot scaling just means you cant solo farm and make 8 times as much as an 8man team. Its intended to cut down on people making oober amounts of gold, and to cut down on the number of rich players.
It may not be fair, but its required. I'm not sure what you are talking about? Are you saying you are for or against loot scaling?
It also sounds like you think I am against loot scaling? Which is untrue, I am 100% behind it.
Loot scaling is fair.
And one major issue was the staggering number of rich players, compared to poor ones, and the inflated prices due to that.
Loot scaling just means you cant solo farm and make 8 times as much as an 8man team. Its intended to cut down on people making oober amounts of gold, and to cut down on the number of rich players.
It may not be fair, but its required. I'm not sure what you are talking about? Are you saying you are for or against loot scaling?
It also sounds like you think I am against loot scaling? Which is untrue, I am 100% behind it.
Loot scaling is fair.
MSecorsky
Quote:
Originally Posted by lord_shar
I think ANET went the wrong direction. Rather than punishing solo-farmers with loot scaling, why not reverse the strategy and reward grouping by increasing drop rates for partied players? In other words, why not simply reward group players as opposed to punishing solo play? This was a pretty successful strategy in another MMORPG I used to play. The increased item supply along with hard mode will still keep item prices low while still curtailing gold-sale generation since gold will also be plentiful. However, this strategy allows casual players to be able to afford 15k and other vanity armors, unlike the present set-up.
Loot scaling can work if used as a bonus instead of a penalty. Believe it or not, this can be answered fairly simply... limited storage space on a character. What good is it if you have 100 items drop for you but you can only carry half of them?
I've always run with full parties and I've actually seen my gold go up since Hard Mode and Loot-scaling came into effect. Just about the only PvE I do right now is vanquishing. I always take a ring of lockpicks and open every chest I come across. Every tome I get now I use. I also ID every white I get before merching (this really is an effective way to get more gold!). My gold in storage has climbed from a bit over 60 Plat to over 100 Plat.
Granted, I'm not breaking the bank doing this... but I'm also not a farmer looking for excessive something for nothing.
Loot-scaling has been friendly to me (coupled with Hard Mode I should add).
Loot scaling can work if used as a bonus instead of a penalty. Believe it or not, this can be answered fairly simply... limited storage space on a character. What good is it if you have 100 items drop for you but you can only carry half of them?
I've always run with full parties and I've actually seen my gold go up since Hard Mode and Loot-scaling came into effect. Just about the only PvE I do right now is vanquishing. I always take a ring of lockpicks and open every chest I come across. Every tome I get now I use. I also ID every white I get before merching (this really is an effective way to get more gold!). My gold in storage has climbed from a bit over 60 Plat to over 100 Plat.
Granted, I'm not breaking the bank doing this... but I'm also not a farmer looking for excessive something for nothing.
Loot-scaling has been friendly to me (coupled with Hard Mode I should add).
lord_shar
Quote:
Originally Posted by MSecorsky
Believe it or not, this can be answered fairly simply... limited storage space on a character. What good is it if you have 100 items drop for you but you can only carry half of them?
...<SNIP>... The above isn't a logical answer. Anyone with space-issues can easily salvage mundane items for raw materials and make large profits. However, rare-item yields will dramatically increase, thereby benefitting everyone, especially the casual player.
...<SNIP>... The above isn't a logical answer.
Loviatar
Quote:
Quote:RIGHT SHERLOCK
the same *casual so called* player with hours to spend going WTS/WTS/WTS
OH YES INDEED
the casual players are playing the game not farming for vanity anything.
look at the threads/posts since loot scaling and all you see is a bitchfest on how do i properly equip 15 chaacters and their heroes properly on my reduced loot? properly bring at least 15k armor
almost (not all) bitching is about 15k armor keys extras not basics
oh wait 15K IS THEIR IDEA OF BASIC
lord_shar
Quote:
Originally Posted by Loviatar
RIGHT SHERLOCK
the same *casual so called* player with hours to spend going WTS/WTS/WTS
OH YES INDEED
the casual players are playing the game not farming for vanity anything.
look at the threads/posts since loot scaling and all you see is a bitchfest on how do i properly equip 15 chaacters and their heroes properly on my reduced loot? properly bring at least 15k armor
almost (not all) bitching is about 15k armor keys extras not basics
oh wait 15K IS THEIR IDEA OF BASIC First, there's no need to be snide.
EDIT: basic laws of supply vs. demand dictate that if you have an abundant supply of any item or low demand of that item, then the item's price drops. Increased rare drop frequency = higher rares supply, thereby dropping prices. Just look at the colosal sword, deadsword, deadbows, etc... They started off high-priced, only to sink to affordable prices due to a general market glut. The bulk of rare-item drops are still less-than-optimum, so rather than wasting time spam-selling them, these junk rares go straight to the merchant, thereby giving me more time to solo farm. The same goes for all mundane items and raw materials -- selling these in high volume to the merchant results in large amounts of gold/platinum in the player's pocket. This would only be possible if loot scaling promoted drop bonuses favoring a larger party as opposed to the solo farmer.
Second, I know a number of guildies and friends who don't farm but still want to be able to afford something beyond their current 1k armors. They are the ones I'm speaking out for. Most of them have been playing for a few months but want to be able to change armors some time before GW2.
Third, I've already made a fortune in this game and continue doing so under the present patch. Loot scaling doesn't really hinder my ability to purchase since UW is my 2nd home, and ecto is scaling-code-exempt.
So, what is loot scaling's purpose again?
Nuclfus
Quote:
Originally Posted by Burning Blade
Quote:
Quote:
What has decreased in price based on this deflation? Make a list of things effected. Here is a start|
- The reduced prices of merchanable items have nothing to do with LS, instead it is because of increased rare drops in HM. When i say merchanable I mean the prices sold to traders and to real players are not significantly different.
Disagree. You'll probably agree that lootscaling has decreased the quantity of available gold. As far as I know this means deflation, which means lower prices by supply/demand mechanics.
fog_of_redoubt
Quote:
Originally Posted by Nuclfus
Disagree. You'll probably agree that lootscaling has decreased the quantity of available gold. As far as I know this means deflation, which means lower prices by supply/demand mechanics. |
Greens? Yep. (but weren't these introduced so the "casual" player could get perfect weapons like all the farmers had?)
Material (non rare), Nope. pretty much fixed price.
Material (rare), Yep. But isn't this for high end armor? Not meant for casual players? "don't need it" as so many people like to say?
Rare Skins, Nope. Ha, you say these have decreased? Dead Swords, Colossal Scimitars? Not because of loot scaling, because they are no longer rare skins.
15k Armor, Nope
Skills, Nope
Runes, Yep, Ha, also not because of lootscaling, because of increased drop rate. Players (farmers) never set these prices.
What prices did LOOTSCALING (not drop rate changes) lower??? Greens, the item that was created SPECIFICALLY so casual players could get perfect weappons, But that wasn't good enough for said casual players. They didn't want to have to work so hard to get the green they wanted. They wanted the terrible farmers to farm them and then they wanted to buy them cheap so they didnt have to work for them, since they are ENTITLED to have whatever anyone else has. Sounds like 4 year olds arguing at playtime
freekedoutfish
Quote:
Originally Posted by Omniclasm
I'm not sure what you are talking about? Are you saying you are for or against loot scaling?
It also sounds like you think I am against loot scaling? Which is untrue, I am 100% behind it.
Loot scaling is fair. Sorry I thought it was made clear. I'm for it, I agree with it, I think it a good idea and doesn't even effect your ability to make gold.
It also sounds like you think I am against loot scaling? Which is untrue, I am 100% behind it.
Loot scaling is fair. Sorry I thought it was made clear. I'm for it, I agree with it, I think it a good idea and doesn't even effect your ability to make gold.
Diddy bow
Yep i agree
but then again who in the right mind thought loot scaling was a good idea in the first place?
but then again who in the right mind thought loot scaling was a good idea in the first place?
Darko_UK
Quote:
Originally Posted by freekedoutfish
I think it a good idea and doesn't even effect your ability to make gold.
Loot scaling was made so that the most common way of making money takes even longer. The main gold income from solo farming places like the desert is all the white drops which sell for 50gp each, Along with gp drops. Now it takes 8x longer. Not much difference noooo
Darko_UK
Quote:
Originally Posted by Twinsoul
Completely and totally /unsigned. I may be in the minority here, but I HATE solo farming... Only time I did it was after I decided I wanted a Colossal Scimitar to use on my monk, and that bored the hell out of me. Loot scaling puts people with the time and desire to solo farm for hours on end on the same level with casual players, and that's the way GW should be.
So like if i max out my treasure hunter title then it should reset cuz lyk that way ZOMG everyone is equal again? r tard
freekedoutfish
Quote:
Originally Posted by Darko_UK
Loot scaling was made so that the most common way of making money takes even longer. The main gold income from solo farming places like the desert is all the white drops which sell for 50gp each, Along with gp drops. Now it takes 8x longer. Not much difference noooo
So your telling me its completely impossible to make gold ingame with loot scaling inplace?
Its impossible to make enough gold to live, buy armor, weapons, dye and other equipment and materials?
Thats its just sheer impossible to make at all, even for expensive items.
If thats so, then explain to me how I went from having zero gold, and then managed to buy 5k vabbian ele armor in about a month. All I used was gold I made from questing, and missions, bad trading and the odd vanquishing.
I sold everything that dropped to the merchant and amazingly...
...I managed to afford the second most expensive armor ingame within a month! Explain that to me! Im not a farmer or an expert trader or an expert at making gold.
I might be a long standing player, but ive never been great at selling items. Yet I managed!
Loot scaling has not crippled the ability to make gold, or enough to live on.
The only people it has effected are those players who want to be "rich" and have more then they need to survive. So forgive me if I dont have sympathy for a player who is just trying to be oober rich and lord it over everyone else.
Its impossible to make enough gold to live, buy armor, weapons, dye and other equipment and materials?
Thats its just sheer impossible to make at all, even for expensive items.
If thats so, then explain to me how I went from having zero gold, and then managed to buy 5k vabbian ele armor in about a month. All I used was gold I made from questing, and missions, bad trading and the odd vanquishing.
I sold everything that dropped to the merchant and amazingly...
...I managed to afford the second most expensive armor ingame within a month! Explain that to me! Im not a farmer or an expert trader or an expert at making gold.
I might be a long standing player, but ive never been great at selling items. Yet I managed!
Loot scaling has not crippled the ability to make gold, or enough to live on.
The only people it has effected are those players who want to be "rich" and have more then they need to survive. So forgive me if I dont have sympathy for a player who is just trying to be oober rich and lord it over everyone else.
Risa
Arguing over stupid things is fun, so I might as well join in.
I'm very much against loot scaling.
Arguement #1 - While many have pointed out that the prices of many items accross players and traders have dropped, they have certainly not dropped 700% to make up for the roughly 1/8 of the drops a solo farmer may be getting.
Arguement #2 - You can't force people to be social. I don't see why any of the players here should be able to say that playing in a group is how things should be done. Nor should a player have to interact with others to sell items. If a player wants to solo & make more cash, it will generally be slower than a group of 8 farming the same area, even with a farming build. That lone player should make the same amount as that group of 8 would. Bleh, this arguement was no warrant. It's more likely than not that the general opinion that governs the world of Guild Wars is that "Group playing is how things should be done in an MMO." Though I'm all for going it alone. xD
Arguement #3 - If someone wants to devote his time on Guild Wars to accumulating large sums of money, why exactly shouldn't he? Is it something with morals or whatnot? Similar to my previous arguement, why is it that someone using a lazy enchantment-filled build should not become rich? He's not progressing on his storyline, or making any companions in Guild Wars. That's the drawback to this playing style. Should the guy going through the missions with his guildies be making the same amount as the farmer? Shouldn't that be the drawback to that choice of playing style? Gaining less money?
& to a previous poster that suggested sending a game administrator to a farming location and start banning anyone farming there...Actually, I don't really have a message to you in paticular. I'd just like to say that there are humans farming those locations as well. I, myself farm in tatts on my monk.
Again, if its decided that playing in groups is how things "should" be done, then stating your opinion doesn't really matter if your against it. It's like you saying to your government that mass murder is acceptable because your opinion is that it should be. I posted here knowing it wouldn't really have any impact. I posted this knowing another person would come in counter everything I said. I also posted because it's my own opinion... :/
But I'm all for farming! Here's to it!
I'm very much against loot scaling.
Arguement #1 - While many have pointed out that the prices of many items accross players and traders have dropped, they have certainly not dropped 700% to make up for the roughly 1/8 of the drops a solo farmer may be getting.
Arguement #2 - You can't force people to be social. I don't see why any of the players here should be able to say that playing in a group is how things should be done. Nor should a player have to interact with others to sell items. If a player wants to solo & make more cash, it will generally be slower than a group of 8 farming the same area, even with a farming build. That lone player should make the same amount as that group of 8 would. Bleh, this arguement was no warrant. It's more likely than not that the general opinion that governs the world of Guild Wars is that "Group playing is how things should be done in an MMO." Though I'm all for going it alone. xD
Arguement #3 - If someone wants to devote his time on Guild Wars to accumulating large sums of money, why exactly shouldn't he? Is it something with morals or whatnot? Similar to my previous arguement, why is it that someone using a lazy enchantment-filled build should not become rich? He's not progressing on his storyline, or making any companions in Guild Wars. That's the drawback to this playing style. Should the guy going through the missions with his guildies be making the same amount as the farmer? Shouldn't that be the drawback to that choice of playing style? Gaining less money?
& to a previous poster that suggested sending a game administrator to a farming location and start banning anyone farming there...Actually, I don't really have a message to you in paticular. I'd just like to say that there are humans farming those locations as well. I, myself farm in tatts on my monk.
Again, if its decided that playing in groups is how things "should" be done, then stating your opinion doesn't really matter if your against it. It's like you saying to your government that mass murder is acceptable because your opinion is that it should be. I posted here knowing it wouldn't really have any impact. I posted this knowing another person would come in counter everything I said. I also posted because it's my own opinion... :/
But I'm all for farming! Here's to it!
Risa
Quote:
Originally Posted by freekedoutfish
Does no one actually play this game for the sheer joy of playing the storyline, or competeing against other players?
You all seem pre-occupied with making gold and farming items. Gold and wealth is not the be-all and end-all of this game, there is a storyline, missions and quests there you know. Yes, and that's an enjoyable part of the game. One who devotes more time to solo farming is losing out on the joy of the storyline, and playing with others. Is that not enough? A solo farmer is losing out on certain aspects of the game, while a party player is currently recieving no less gold than a solo farmer, and still is enjoying the other aspects of the game. What is the exact reason a solo farmer should be making the same money as the party-player, when he's already missing out on the things others enjoy?
You all seem pre-occupied with making gold and farming items. Gold and wealth is not the be-all and end-all of this game, there is a storyline, missions and quests there you know. Yes, and that's an enjoyable part of the game. One who devotes more time to solo farming is losing out on the joy of the storyline, and playing with others. Is that not enough? A solo farmer is losing out on certain aspects of the game, while a party player is currently recieving no less gold than a solo farmer, and still is enjoying the other aspects of the game. What is the exact reason a solo farmer should be making the same money as the party-player, when he's already missing out on the things others enjoy?
Omniclasm
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Originally Posted by Risa
Yes, and that's an enjoyable part of the game. One who devotes more time to solo farming is losing out on the joy of the storyline, and playing with others. Is that not enough? A solo farmer is losing out on certain aspects of the game, while a party player is currently recieving no less gold than a solo farmer, and still is enjoying the other aspects of the game. What is the exact reason a solo farmer should be making the same money as the party-player, when he's already missing out on the things others enjoy?
Encouraging "an enjoyable part of the game" is a bad thing how?
You make it sound like the solo farmer is losing out on so much enjoyment by solo farming. Why do they play the game if they are making it like a 9 to 5 job?
That must mean that they enjoy solo farming, just like the other people enjoy playing with a team. Why should one make more than another?
You make it sound like the solo farmer is losing out on so much enjoyment by solo farming. Why do they play the game if they are making it like a 9 to 5 job?
That must mean that they enjoy solo farming, just like the other people enjoy playing with a team. Why should one make more than another?
Willow O Whisper
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Originally Posted by lord_shar
I think ANET went the wrong direction. Rather than punishing solo-farmers with loot scaling, why not reverse the strategy and reward grouping by increasing drop rates for partied players? In other words, why not simply reward group players as opposed to punishing solo play? This was a pretty successful strategy in another MMORPG I used to play. The increased item supply along with hard mode will still keep item prices low while still curtailing gold-sale generation since gold will also be plentiful. However, this strategy allows casual players to be able to afford 15k and other vanity armors, unlike the present set-up.
Loot scaling can work if used as a bonus instead of a penalty. hey i like ur idea beacuse it rewards the causal player for going into a party + it doesen't hurt the farmer in this way everyone is happy.
Loot scaling can work if used as a bonus instead of a penalty. hey i like ur idea beacuse it rewards the causal player for going into a party + it doesen't hurt the farmer in this way everyone is happy.
lord_shar
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Originally Posted by Willow O Whisper
hey i like ur idea beacuse it rewards the causal player for going into a party + it doesen't hurt the farmer in this way everyone is happy.
Yeah, the best part about the proposed reversed loot scaling (giving human parties bonuses instead of penalizing solo-farmers) is that it holds back no one. Soloers can still solo all they want, but party players would get an income-boost just for playing the game normally. Either way, both sides win.
Omniclasm
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Originally Posted by lord_shar
Yeah, the best part about the proposed reversed loot scaling (giving human parties bonuses instead of penalizing solo-farmers) is that it holds back no one. Soloers can still solo all they want, but party players would get an income-boost just for playing the game normally. Either way, both sides win.
Solo'ers would still whine like hell. They seem to think since soloing is soooo difficult they should get WAY more drops than people who chose to play the game differently.
reetkever
/signed
loot scaling is the dumbest idea A-net ever had, since it doesn't make anything better and doesn't reward anyone. It just tomes things down and only punishes certain classes of players.
And all the reasons A-Net had to install the scaling are dumb and proven that it doesn't work. Prices are NOT going down to being affordable. Bots are STILL alive. Rich people STAY rich. Poor people STAY poor. Avarage players go from avarage to POOR. A-net's pride seems to be in the way of repairing this, however...
However, I can't see bots buying this expansion, cause it forces them to first beat the game, and then find a good farm spot. They could use the cash on another Prophecies, instead.
loot scaling is the dumbest idea A-net ever had, since it doesn't make anything better and doesn't reward anyone. It just tomes things down and only punishes certain classes of players.
And all the reasons A-Net had to install the scaling are dumb and proven that it doesn't work. Prices are NOT going down to being affordable. Bots are STILL alive. Rich people STAY rich. Poor people STAY poor. Avarage players go from avarage to POOR. A-net's pride seems to be in the way of repairing this, however...
However, I can't see bots buying this expansion, cause it forces them to first beat the game, and then find a good farm spot. They could use the cash on another Prophecies, instead.
lord_shar
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Originally Posted by Omniclasm
Solo'ers would still whine like hell. They seem to think since soloing is soooo difficult they should get WAY more drops than people who chose to play the game differently.
I play both sides of the isle: I solo when I want fast-plat, and party when guildies and friends need help. Even now, I generate more plat than any casual player I know under the present system. However, the present loot scaling system is based on extreme prejudice. There is absolutely no reason to punish those who prefer to play the game their way if it doesn't harm others. However, ANET can easily reward players who follow their intended cooperative party system with increased loot drops.
No matter how loot is generated and distributed, there will always be enterprising go-getters who will outproduce the rest of the population. So rather than letting envy dictate policy, why not give the general partying populace a boost?
No matter how loot is generated and distributed, there will always be enterprising go-getters who will outproduce the rest of the population. So rather than letting envy dictate policy, why not give the general partying populace a boost?
Omniclasm
I suggested something like that earlier, but its more of a 50/50. Soloing takes less of a hit, and party playing gains less of a bonus compared to yours. You suggest 700% increase to current drops, while I said 200%. However, we do both agree that from where it is stood right now, everything could receive a boost and be happy? And I have confused myself, so this probably doesn't make much sense.
lord_shar
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Originally Posted by Omniclasm
I suggested something like that earlier, but its more of a 50/50. Soloing takes less of a hit, and party playing gains less of a bonus compared to yours. You suggest 700% increase to current drops, while I said 200%. However, we do both agree that from where it is stood right now, everything could receive a boost and be happy? And I have confused myself, so this probably doesn't make much sense.
The above sounds acceptable. However, in the present patch, soloers are only seeing 12.5% of normal drops, while full parties members see 100%, all for executing the same number of monsters.
If any employer tried "salary scaling" with their employees in the real world, their workers would riot. I know GW is just a game, but the principle behind loot scaling is nothing short of reprehensible. Equal pay for equal work would be nice, but I guess it doesn't apply in ANET's world...
If any employer tried "salary scaling" with their employees in the real world, their workers would riot. I know GW is just a game, but the principle behind loot scaling is nothing short of reprehensible. Equal pay for equal work would be nice, but I guess it doesn't apply in ANET's world...
reetkever
Or they can just change the scaling to normal, and give bonusses to the drops in 8-man parties.
How about 800 gold dropping in a party of 8, and only 100 gold in a party of 1.
Of course, the area you are in can change this amount, but it will make both party and solo happy. Maybe give normal monsters the ability to drop 2 or 3 items like bosses do in a party.
This way, the party still gets more loot, but the people farming or being forced to farm can get their needed stuff like skills, armor and cool stuff like buying tickets for rings, buying keys for double-chance-on-rare-loot-from-a-chest-weekend etc.
As for the 'prices rising'... Look at the prices now. A casual player STILL can't afford most of the stuff. Things are STILL 100K + ecto. THe price going up doesn't affect the casual players. It does affect the farmers, but hey, they get way more loot so can afford the weapons after a while.
How about 800 gold dropping in a party of 8, and only 100 gold in a party of 1.
Of course, the area you are in can change this amount, but it will make both party and solo happy. Maybe give normal monsters the ability to drop 2 or 3 items like bosses do in a party.
This way, the party still gets more loot, but the people farming or being forced to farm can get their needed stuff like skills, armor and cool stuff like buying tickets for rings, buying keys for double-chance-on-rare-loot-from-a-chest-weekend etc.
As for the 'prices rising'... Look at the prices now. A casual player STILL can't afford most of the stuff. Things are STILL 100K + ecto. THe price going up doesn't affect the casual players. It does affect the farmers, but hey, they get way more loot so can afford the weapons after a while.
Omniclasm
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Originally Posted by lord_shar
The above sounds acceptable. However, in the present patch, soloers are only seeing 12.5% of normal drops, while full parties members see 100%, all for executing the same number of monsters.
If any employer tried "salary scaling" with their employees in the real world, their workers would riot. I know GW is just a game, but the principle behind loot scaling is nothing short of reprehensible. Equal pay for equal work would be nice, but I guess it doesn't apply in ANET's world... Individuals in a party only see 12.5% of the drops, the same as a solo farmer.
I suggested each getting 25% of the drops.
Salary scaling would probably please more people than upset.
Edit: About the equal pay equal work, if that was the case, solo farmers would get about 3-4% of the drops.
If any employer tried "salary scaling" with their employees in the real world, their workers would riot. I know GW is just a game, but the principle behind loot scaling is nothing short of reprehensible. Equal pay for equal work would be nice, but I guess it doesn't apply in ANET's world... Individuals in a party only see 12.5% of the drops, the same as a solo farmer.
I suggested each getting 25% of the drops.
Salary scaling would probably please more people than upset.
Edit: About the equal pay equal work, if that was the case, solo farmers would get about 3-4% of the drops.
cR4zY-n^
Drops should simply NOT HAPPEN once player enters area alone? xD~
Willow O Whisper
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Originally Posted by cR4zY-n^
Drops should simply NOT HAPPEN once player enters area alone? xD~
Ur Name says it all......
lord_shar
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Originally Posted by Omniclasm
I suggested each getting 25% of the drops.
I agree that individuals in an 8-man should receive more than 12.5% total loot to encourage group play. This is where ANET is in a position to reward instead of punish.
"A carrot usually works much better than a stick..."
Quote: Originally Posted by Omniclasm Salary scaling would probably please more people than upset. Collectively yes, but the above also promotes lower individual worker output, which long-term is bad for any business trying to compete.
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Originally Posted by Omniclasm
Edit: About the equal pay equal work, if that was the case, solo farmers would get about 3-4% of the drops.
This flies in the face of all modern industry-metrics.
Consider two groups: A) a soloer that kills 100 monsters and B) a full party of 8 that kills 100 monsters. Which one has the higher total measurable output, and why? Omniclasm
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Originally Posted by lord_shar
This flies in the face of all modern industry-metrics.
Consider two groups: A) a soloer that kills 100 monsters and B) a full party of 8 that kills 100 monsters. Which one has the higher total measurable output, and why? This depends, are we basing it on work force put in, or work force put out? A solo'er does very little "work" but kills a lot of things. Someone in a party actually puts in more "work" but gets less done. I know in the real world that people care about getting things done, so they pay you to get things done, the faster the better. However, this is a video game. NOBODY cares if John The Farmer goes out and kills 100 monsters. Killing monsters, the work output, is irrelevant since nobody cares. So the only thing left to compare it to is the work input, which a solo farmer really lacks.
lord_shar
Quote:
Originally Posted by Omniclasm
This depends, are we basing it on work force put in, or work force put out? A solo'er does very little "work" but kills a lot of things. Someone in a party actually puts in more "work" but gets less done.
I know in the real world that people care about getting things done, so they pay you to get things done, the faster the better. However, this is a video game. NOBODY cares if John The Farmer goes out and kills 100 monsters. Killing monsters, the work output, is irrelevant since nobody cares. So the only thing left to compare it to is the work input, which a solo farmer really lacks. I believe you are confusing effort with productivity. Productivity isn't measured by effort -- it is measured by tangible results. Working intelligently is often more productive than simply working hard. But back to the game... GW is a game, and its objective is to provide players entertainment. However, different players derive entertainment in different ways. Some prefer PvE missions, while other prefer PVP or resource-gathering. Regardless of what players prefer, ANET should not punish any one group for their play style preference so long as they stay within the EULA. ANET can add additional incentives and rewards to those who follow their "ideal" player mold, but why should they take away anything from any one group for using the product they've already purchased? It's times like these that I wonder if ANET's developers are deliberately trying to sabotage their flagship title... |