Petition: Re-Skin Endgame Armor
Bryant Again
Quote:
Originally Posted by lyra_song
The armors have been leaked since around July. People thought they were fakes.
I guess that really said a lot, huh? (Do not read this as a cynical tone, cuz it ain't!)
Gattocheese
Quote:
Originally Posted by Neo Nugget
r1- cosumables
r2-weapons
r3- armors.
All i ask. I actually think the consumables should be at the higher level than the crappy reskinned armor or the weapons. The consumables are rather powerfull and are the only thing that is actually worth the time to get.
r2-weapons
r3- armors.
All i ask. I actually think the consumables should be at the higher level than the crappy reskinned armor or the weapons. The consumables are rather powerfull and are the only thing that is actually worth the time to get.
keikokoala
To those who use the statement "it's just armor, you don't HAVE to buy it," you are missing the point.
So let's see, I am assuming those who use this reasoning either like the GW:EN armors, do not care about GW:EN armors, or just want attention by disagreeing with the majority of forum posters. That's fine.
But, what do these people like? The GW:EN scenery? The GW:EN "new" weapon skins? What if we, those who actually like discussing about ARMORS in general, bash a scenery or weapons thread with that kind of reasoning?
In a weapons thread:
"If you don't like the new weapons, you don't HAVE to buy them... because we like the armors.."
In a scenery thread:
"If you don't like the new scenery, you don't HAVE to look at them... because we like the armors.."
It doesn't validate your post with that kind of reasoning in this thread.
Now, let's see... how about those who use the reasoning "it's personal taste, if you don't like the armor, don't buy it."
I only have one reply to that. After all these posters who agree that the "new" armor skins are disappointing, do you really think a lot of disappointed people fit the word "personal" at all?
How about looking at the bigger audience that are disappointed, does that look "personal" to you? Don't think so. Last time I checked, "personal taste" means individual opinion. The disappointed people are not just individuals, they are a HUGE GROUP of individuals who share the same opinion (the opinion that the "new" armors are disappointing). So, do not come in here and say it is a "personal taste" issue, because obviously, it literally isn't.
You must be thinking, "why do you have to be so literal?"
Guess what, we literally have to, because you know how A-Net works... if it's not clear, they won't give a sh**.
Perfect example:
"40 'new' armor sets"
That's not clear (or even true, for that matter), so they won't give a da** what people think.
So let's see, I am assuming those who use this reasoning either like the GW:EN armors, do not care about GW:EN armors, or just want attention by disagreeing with the majority of forum posters. That's fine.
But, what do these people like? The GW:EN scenery? The GW:EN "new" weapon skins? What if we, those who actually like discussing about ARMORS in general, bash a scenery or weapons thread with that kind of reasoning?
In a weapons thread:
"If you don't like the new weapons, you don't HAVE to buy them... because we like the armors.."
In a scenery thread:
"If you don't like the new scenery, you don't HAVE to look at them... because we like the armors.."
It doesn't validate your post with that kind of reasoning in this thread.
Now, let's see... how about those who use the reasoning "it's personal taste, if you don't like the armor, don't buy it."
I only have one reply to that. After all these posters who agree that the "new" armor skins are disappointing, do you really think a lot of disappointed people fit the word "personal" at all?
How about looking at the bigger audience that are disappointed, does that look "personal" to you? Don't think so. Last time I checked, "personal taste" means individual opinion. The disappointed people are not just individuals, they are a HUGE GROUP of individuals who share the same opinion (the opinion that the "new" armors are disappointing). So, do not come in here and say it is a "personal taste" issue, because obviously, it literally isn't.
You must be thinking, "why do you have to be so literal?"
Guess what, we literally have to, because you know how A-Net works... if it's not clear, they won't give a sh**.
Perfect example:
"40 'new' armor sets"
That's not clear (or even true, for that matter), so they won't give a da** what people think.
Lucien Beaumont
I guess the only thing we can do is give our guild members and friends a benefit we did not have and warn them about what they are actually getting for their money. Maybe they will listen, doesn't seem any of the developers care to.
Aethon
Some of the armor is good, and some of it is bad; I just wish the good:bad ratio was higher.
If they were going to take the easy route like this, they could have just released the previously NPC-only armor sets for the professions. For example, I would love it if my Ritualist could get armor like Headmaster Quin, or my Paragon something like The Big K. Speaking of which, we already have the blindfold, so would that really be hard to do, I wonder?
If they were going to take the easy route like this, they could have just released the previously NPC-only armor sets for the professions. For example, I would love it if my Ritualist could get armor like Headmaster Quin, or my Paragon something like The Big K. Speaking of which, we already have the blindfold, so would that really be hard to do, I wonder?
Gattocheese
The heros use the same models as us, when they fight, when they move, dance ..ect. it really wouldnt be to hard for anet to create some original armor for us. I have been hearing some people speak of the realm of gods update, hoping maybe they have some sort of elite original looking armor involved in it.
lyra_song
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bryant Again
Quote:
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Originally Posted by Gattocheese
The heros use the same models as us, when they fight, when they move, dance ..ect. it really wouldnt be to hard for anet to create some original armor for us. I have been hearing some people speak of the realm of gods update, hoping maybe they have some sort of elite original looking armor involved in it.
THis is all just my speculation based on my observation through texmod.
The heroes dont have to worry about dyes, mixing armors and armor seams. The armors of players are designed of multiple parts, NPCs meanwhile are a singular mesh. The Players are also composed of the flesh of the player, and the armor for textures. NPCs are composed of single textures. Theres less worry about designing across seams because there are none and no need to worry about dyeability. NPC armors are really more "simple" than player armors and that gives them leftover polygons for extra detail and they take up less ram so they can use higher resolution textures.
Jeremy Untouchable
factions=OMG warrior wants Kurzick armor
nightfall= Omg warrior wants primevil armor Gw:en = OMG warrior wants more grotto armor with the money i saved for qwen. Gattocheese
Quote:
Originally Posted by lyra_song
I thought they seemed fine to me because of the texture quality being consistent with the previous games.
THis is all just my speculation based on my observation through texmod. The heroes dont have to worry about dyes, mixing armors and armor seams. The armors of players are designed of multiple parts, NPCs meanwhile are a singular mesh. The Players are also composed of the flesh of the player, and the armor for textures. NPCs are composed of single textures. Theres less worry about designing across seams because there are none and no need to worry about dyeability. NPC armors are really more "simple" than player armors and that gives them leftover polygons for extra detail and they take up less ram so they can use higher resolution textures. I understand all that. The extra detail in hero armor is alot of work. I would know, i am a Tier 1 graphics designer. I am just saying, that the time difference between creating a new hero armor and creating a players armor is not as much as you would think. I would of actually prefered them not to add a 3rd set of hero armor, and worked on something original for our characters. They can take the time to give us something new, instead they give Razza a new armor set with this new update.
Lucien Beaumont
It is actually an existing armor set for Razah that wasn't showing up in game due to a bug.
CHunterX
Quote:
Originally Posted by lyra_song
The armors have been leaked since around July. People thought they were fakes.
Even if Anet didnt allow us to have armors during the previews, those pics were out. They also weren't confirmed, as far as I know. (and didn't include every gender/job combo) Catch my drift? mafia cyborg
i decided NOT to buy gwen cos:
- no new armour (all reskins) - even environments are reskins....hardly any new modelling - pvp skills mostly dupliacates (and the mesmer ones are beyond pathetic) - dungeons suck
Shadow of Light
I'm disappointed by the reskins. I don't own GW:EN, but I checked out the screenshots as soon as they were available to see if there was anything I 'had to get' (answer: 'no').
It'd be nice if there were some original armours... the hero stuff looks pretty sweet. I've always wished Female Ele armour would make Cynn's wardrobe available, too. *wanders back to replaying Space Quest. Janitor's Uniform ftw* TabascoSauce
Quote:
Originally Posted by keikokoala
Now, let's see... how about those who use the reasoning "it's personal taste, if you don't like the armor, don't buy it."
I only have one reply to that. After all these posters who agree that the "new" armor skins are disappointing, do you really think a lot of disappointed people fit the word "personal" at all? How about looking at the bigger audience that are disappointed, does that look "personal" to you? Don't think so. Last time I checked, "personal taste" means individual opinion. The disappointed people are not just individuals, they are a HUGE GROUP of individuals who share the same opinion (the opinion that the "new" armors are disappointing). So, do not come in here and say it is a "personal taste" issue, because obviously, it literally isn't. I would be very comfortable stating that a majority of people in the United States does not like modern, abstract art. I am one of those people, because I can weld a bunch of aluminum tubes together in some silly jagged shape just as good as the next guy, but I cannot sit down with a landscape in front of me and render even a semi-accurate painting. I believe that classical art takes skill, as opposed to abstract art and welding tubes. That is my opinion of art. It is shared by the majority of people. But abstract art does sell, so someone appreciates it, even if they are a minority. My opinion, even though shared by the majority, does not invalidate the pleasure of people who enjoy abstract art. Whether a majority or minority "like" art, it still comes down to a personal judgement of the aesthetics. So where am I going with this? A few more points to ponder for you. It is illogical to believe that Barry Bonds will hit every time he is at bat. It is illogical to believe that ANet will make everyone happy all the time. Get my drift? So they screwed up, then tell them. That is what the feedback process is all about. But put yourself in their shoes - would you want to be called some of the names used in this thread? I'm shocked, personally. In all my threads about my complaints about the game, particularly Soul Reaping, I never said they were no-talent hacks, or lazy, or retarded. I said they screwed up, and here are the reasons why (etc). The worst I have ever done is say that they do not play their own game, thus the nerfs. So for all you people who are going personally after the artists with name-calling, I'm here to call you a lazy no-talent retarded piece of $*!t. Sure makes you wanna empathize with me, doesnt it. I'd be happy to get in your face and say back the &*#% off. Everyone says they did great stuff with Prophecies, Factions, and/or Nightfall. It is inevitable that they will have ups and downs, so cut them some slack. You aren't rising and shining every morning. I'll agree with your right to tell them you do not like the art, but anything more than that is just sheer tomfoolery. And FYI, I do not like the Grind. Period. I'm not doing it now, and I'm not gonna do it in GW2. If that makes the game short(er) for me, then so be it - but there are a whole bunch of people who seem to like it. Blows my mind, but people are getting those crazy titles every few minutes. I'm not telling you not to buy the armors you do not like, I am telling you that attacking the artist staff will get you squat. Thanks! TabascoSauce
pixiLated
I signed this a few pages back to say /unsigned. Well after a lot of brooding and teeth gnashing about how screwed over my ele was in the armour stakes; I'm back to say:
/signed for completely new sets to be added Whilst what looks good is purely subjective - see my opinion above on the ele armour as an example, when I see the love and attention to detail that has gone into the hero armour and hero armour upgrades, as a player I'm feeling royally shafted. I would therefore be eternally grateful if Anet would add some totally new; and I mean new not yet more re-skins, armours to GW:EN.
Buzzer
Quote:
Originally Posted by mafia cyborg
i decided NOT to buy gwen cos:
- pvp skills mostly dupliacates Read them again? There are no duplicates.
kev doppleganger
OK, the lazy attitude of anet towards weopons and armour is a DISGRACE!!! I feel cheated been playing for 26 months
lyra_song
Quote:
Originally Posted by Gattocheese
Im not talking about TIME limitation. Im talking about TECHNICAL limitations. It doesnt matter if you had all the time in the world, if the game can only handle a certain workable size for armors say.....a certain poly count, and a maximum file size/color depth/resolution for the armor. For example, if your armor was a very simple shape, your texture can be higher quality. If your armor was a complex shape, your texture quality goes down. Thats why i mention that players are composed of 2 texture sets and multiple pieces of armor and NPCs are a singular entity. Whats the polygon limitation of the game engine? How much memory is allocated per NPC/Player char? Whats the render speed of the game? In my experience with skinning for TS2, ive created and seen items that were BEYOND the average polygon count of the objects and meshes that Maxis made, but these objects usually have a little warning that says, you should have more ram/processing than what the game requires because the objects are MUCH higher quality. Remember Guild Wars is an MMO and even in town, when the game uses lower quality textures, it can get slow. Bottom line: IMO, Anet can create more complex Hero armors because NPCs take up less memory, and can allocate memory towards more complex designs and higher quality textures..
Spazzer
/signed
All the new content is great, but I think arenanet had more fun with texmod than we did.
Croco Clouds
The more Armors that Anet puts, the better the game would be
genofreek
Quote:
Originally Posted by Croco Clouds
The more Armors that Anet puts, the better the game would be
Not neccessarily. To be honest I would rather have have one or two sets per class that show care and style than what we got.
Muspellsheimr
While I agree that the reskinning was a bad move by ArenaNet, some of the new skins are superior to the originals, and I am sure some enjoy their new armor, therefor, it would be a very bad idea to simply redo all the EotN armors.
Keep all the EotN armors as they are, but add additional new armor. That should make everyone happy (except those who want all the elite skins without spending a fortune...).
Hyper Cutter
Wait, why are people complaining about weapons now? There are plenty of new weapon skins...
Noa Lutra
I have mixed feelings about the armors... But when I hear people saying that making meshes and skins is hard, well, I beg to differ. Take a look at this page from an Oblivion mod site, look at the different armors crafted by people like you and me. If these people can make that kind of stuff, well...
I do know that ANet reads the different forums but I don't think they'll do anything about it. I just hope that somewhere between now and GW2 they'll come up with ways to make up for it.
genofreek
I do too, but it seems like a lost cause at this stage. We'll probably get additions here and there, but I don't see them adding more armor.
lyra_song
Quote:
Originally Posted by Noa Lutra
I have mixed feelings about the armors... But when I hear people saying that making meshes and skins is hard, well, I beg to differ. Take a look at this page from an Oblivion mod site, look at the different armors crafted by people like you and me. If these people can make that kind of stuff, well..
I could make some amazing models for GW, complex designs, animated textures, full normal mapping, but such files wouldnt run too well on other people's PCs. This is an MMO. Oblivion is not. If you wanna lag your PC, thats well and good, but built in meshes must be efficient.
Ive seen lots and lots of modders make skins and models thats excessive.
Bryant Again
Quote:
Originally Posted by lyra_song
I could make some amazing models for GW, complex designs, animated textures, full normal mapping, but such files wouldnt run too well on other people's PCs. This is an MMO. Oblivion is not. If you wanna lag your PC, thats well and good, but built in meshes must be efficient.
Ive seen lots and lots of modders make skins and models thats excessive. While I disagree about GW being an MMO, I agree with the "NPCs take up less memory" bit. That would explain why players have low-res textures in outposts while NPCs are fine.
Ensign
It seems obvious from looking at the results, and knowing the kinds of people Arena.net has working for them, that most of their art team has been busy creating new content for Guild Wars 2. While previous games had one of the best art departments I've seen working on it, EotN only had a shadow of that. It would seem that EotN had a much smaller budget for original artwork, and much of the content was having to be pulled together from existing concepts by the EotN team.
I gather that this is standard practice, as a way to put out releases cheaply to generate sales while working on a new title. Personally I have no issue with recycling a lot of old artwork, especially when in doing it right you can barely tell where it came from. How many of you, went into many of the ice caves in EotN and immediately thought Jade Sea? Elements from Sorrow's Furnace, the Underworld, and Fissure of Woe, remixed and lighted in a different context, created some intriguing and seemingly original landscapes. All were great examples of recycled content. What A.Net is quite rightly being blasted for is poor allocation of the original art resources they did have. The contrast between the amount of work that went into the various hero armors, compared to what went into player armors, is particularly galling. A.Net could have easily recycled some of those hero armors onto player models (certainly, that takes a good deal of work to chop up, scale, and adjust those models to dye reasonably), and, as they have before, simply given out heroes player armor - Zenmai and Olias, for instance, received player armor for both of their prestige sets, and no one would think to complain about that. Instead they chose to largely recycle old armor models for players in EotN, often mixing and matching pieces that don't have matching models at all - and frequently choosing common and 'cheap' armor profiles to rework. It is completely obvious that approach would not be well received by the majority of their playerbase. They either knew it was coming, in which case they've already planned on getting blasted for neglecting player armors and accept that; or they didn't, and they deserve to be blasted for making such a clear blunder. In any case, I'm always a bit disappointed when a series ends with the lowest budget, least polished products. But I've gotten used to disappointment. EotN has its high points, and I've enjoyed its strengths immensely - despite some cut corners and a few unrefined areas, the dungeons in EotN are generally quite good. But on the whole, it simply does not live up to the standard of quality that the first three chapters set. IlikeGW
Quote:
Originally Posted by lyra_song
I could make some amazing models for GW, complex designs, animated textures, full normal mapping, but such files wouldnt run too well on other people's PCs.
Yeah god forbid they can't play a game on their pentium II laptop. Thank god GW2 is moving forward, but GW1 looks downright dated in places, especially if you turn off post process filtering and actually get a look at the textures.
And I think they need to take a hard look at the resolution issue for the future. Players should be getting the best of all worlds on their avatar. The fact that heroes and NPC's can surpass them easily in GW1 because of their fixed nature suggests a design flaw they shouldn't keep. At the very least, high res data should be there for the player graphics for those who can view it (and eventually you figure they'll catch up with a new pc) but they're not even producing it right now which is sad because GW1 will be forever stuck at the current limits without totally remaking it. liner
what is this doing on page 3? bump!
Darlichay Dalinar
Unless ANET plans on re-doing how the armor looks like Blizzard did with Burning Crusade (World of Warcraft) then I'm not sure... I completely agree with how you feel, however, on the lack of time spent and the amazingly recycled amount of content (boss fights, armor, weapons, etc...) that I've seen in, I feel, any game I've played that has had a sequal...
Loviatar
there have been many posts on many threads which seem to sum up what most of the armorfest people are saying here once again cross thread cross forum and even cross site but this poster said it best.
*I DONT LIKE QUESTING, I DONT LIKE MISSIONS, I DONT LIKE EXPLORING. I WASTED 40 DOLLARS ON ARMOR I CANT SHOW OFF* bottom line he/she couldnt wait 2 days to see what the armor looked like because he/she had to be the first to run back to the other chapters to epeen the people that didnt have their expected epeen+10 show off armor. they were buying an armor pack not a game to play and that seems to be majority opinion here as well. i bought a very nice game expansion for the QUESTS MISSIONS NEW THINGS TO SEE A STORY TO BE TOLD THE FUN OF PLAYING A GAME in my nightfall no rune/insig armor in town and my trusty DROK armor for fighting in i hear there is armor in GWEN and i will eventually get around to looking at it. if i see something i like i will get it as the cost is not high. i bought a game not an armor pack after all 
Bryant Again
Quote:
Originally Posted by Loviatar
they were buying an armor pack not a game to play and that seems to be majority opinion here as well.
Do not assume. The way I see it, many people may like GW:EN but are just pretty bummed about all these armors. Armor collecting is a huge hobby in Guild Wars, and the fact that these armors are claimed by most (and by some of the most respected people on this forum) to be horrid, in what may supposedly be the last expansion/addon for Guild Wars, is quite a large letdown.
When you're done with all those quests, missions and dungeons, there isn't a whole lot to do. The fact that the one thing that a lot of us *do* like to do after we beat the game - collecting armor - isn't worth are time is very upsetting. Don't get me wrong, I really like the new expansion and the areas, but a lot of us are just really into the armors - and there ain't nothing wrong about that.
Nevin
Quote:
Originally Posted by Loviatar
i hear there is armor in GWEN and i will eventually get around to looking at it. if i see something i like i will get it as the cost is not high. i bought a game not an armor pack after all
Hahaha... No wonder you don't agree with this thread. Hexum
I don't like the armor for any character in GWEN (except some of the gloves). I have always gone on looks that please me, not status or price. I won't be buying any of this new armor.
Gattocheese
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bryant Again
Do not assume. The way I see it, many people may like GW:EN but are just pretty bummed about all these armors. Armor collecting is a huge hobby in Guild Wars, and the fact that these armors are claimed by most (and by some of the most respected people on this forum) to be horrid, in what may supposedly be the last expansion/addon for Guild Wars, is quite a large letdown.
When you're done with all those quests, missions and dungeons, there isn't a whole lot to do. The fact that the one thing that a lot of us *do* like to do after we beat the game - collecting armor - isn't worth are time is very upsetting. Don't get me wrong, I really like the new expansion and the areas, but a lot of us are just really into the armors - and there ain't nothing wrong about that. You have taken the words right out of my mouth. People who say stop crying and play the story or whatever, need to learn what i enjoy doing in guildwars is my own. I dont yell at grinders, questers, farmers, ect.. if you enjoy a certain aspect of the game, by all means have fun. I enjoy pimping out my characters with the coolest looking armor and weapons. What i expected from GWEN and what i got were two different things. I dont think GWEN is a horrible game, just my expectations where high and i got a huge dissappointment. Alot of the armors may look better with thier new skins, but its still the same for me, and some of the GWEN armor is mix and match from different sets and dont look good at all. Yes GWEN is nice, and the guildwars community needed something. But a major part of what i enjoy is a big bummer.
..L..
I agree with the majority of complaint in this thread, the Gw: En armors are poor reskins of already existing armors that some already have 15k versions of. Anet reskinned Tormentors armor way back they added knights 15k and the glads helmet, instead of working heavy on balance changes they could right this wrong first, because they can. After 3 campaigns anet should have known armor is important for everyone in the game by now, if not their company is running on sheer luck wich I have to applaud cause even luck runs out some time. So anet do us all a favor make a armor contest let Players vote on wich armor should replace wich, then the majority of the people will be pleased and it would definatly highten anets status among players.
knifff
A "Draw your Armor" contest could be a good alternative.
agriasreinas
/sign
would like new skins. esp with the grinding you have to do.
Vel
/bump to keep it relevant.
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