Rant from a new player about other players

I'm new to guild wars, been playing for just over a week. I'm liking it but I suppose as with any large online community, there are a variety of people who are all going to have different agendas.

That being said, begin rant:

I decided to start my first character as monk, eventually I plan to get a few people I know playing and set up a guild for us. For now however I'm just playing the game trying to learn the ropes. I'm not a particularly skilled player nor do I claim to know lots about how the game should be played. I do however know of one skill in particular that is very important, which is known to be lacking in many younger people. PATIENCE. In reference to my particular situation I'll give some examples. When you are in a mission think about the person healing you. A monk as with all characters has a limited amount of energy, he can not heal a party of 8 nonstop without stopping to regen energy. So if you rush from one group of enimies to the next without stopping to let him regen his energy, it makes it extremely difficult to keep you alive. Stop and wait after every group of enemies so that the monk can regen his energy, and thus keep you alive. Further more, when you rush ahead and get to far away to fight more monsters it presents a couple of problems. First if you are to far away, the monk cant heal you, second if you leave enemies in the back, you leave the softer ranged characters to die. It is much easier for a monk to keep a tank alive from the back. If a tank runs to far ahead he dies because there is no one to heal him, and the ranged characters in his party die because there is no one to protect them. So in summation, be patient, take one group of enemies at a time, then give time for the party(especially the ones keeping you alive) to regen some energy. Stay with the group, and make sure all the monsters in the immediate area are dead before you move on and start on a new group. These seem like fairly simple concepts but yet they don't always appear to be so common.
I'm done now, and if anyone would like to offer helpful tips for a new monk they are welcome.

The big problem is most of the people who play in that manner are 12 year old w/mo's and don't read fan forums or wiki to realise they have no clue.

I have little experience playing monk i'm sure others will be able to offer better advice but try and specalise in either healing or protection. protection if often favoured because it is better to stop damage that try and fill the red bars.

GL and if you find pugs too much trouble you can count on hero's and hencehmen

Not sure if you know how to ping your status to the rest of the group, but it might help.

Hold down the CTRL key and then click on your energy bar. That should put a message in team chat saying you have 8 of 45 energy or something like that.

Most people understand that if you have no energy then you can't heal (most, not all ;-)), and that is a quick, easy way to let them know.

You might want to warn any melee class characters to be careful of how far they go from the group before you start the quest/mission. And then don't heal them if they go too far in. If they complain tell them you won't jeopardize the rest of the party to keep him alive.

I don't think most people play multiple classes and, as a result, don't really understand how what they do can affect them.

As for beginning monks...concentrate on using 5e spells, don't try to keep the health bars topped off, protection is better than healing because it's easier to prevent damage than to heal up after it, but having both on your bar is fine.

Have fun and try to find a fun, helpful guild. Makes things a lot more fun and less frustrating.

bring energy management

Also, you may already be doing so, but if not, try taking a secondary that gives you some energy management options. Trust me I understand you can't constantly heal, but I think part of your problem may be that, people have come to except a certain speed to completing missions. By all means they shouldn't rush you and as I said you may already be doing this. Just something to consider if you aren't already doing it.

Theres a couple of simple solutions to your monking problems:

1) After each mob, Ctrl-click your energy bar. This will show your party members how much energy you have left, and hopefully they should wait. If not, simply type 'Wait for regen'.

2) Look into some energy management spells. Popular ones are Glyph of Lesser energy if your running expensive skills, then theres plenty to choose from the mesmers line of inspiration. Channeling will give you a decent energy return if there are enemies near you, which tbh, there will be plenty of anyway. If your good at interupting, you might want to try Power Drain which gives the best energy return of any spell, its only drawback being its long recharge, and if you miss with the interupt, no energy.

Also use the monk signets that heal. If your laying prot, put signet of devotion into your bar for a free heal every 5 seconds. Its drawback is its 2s cast time, but it will allow you to regen a bit of energy in between heals. If your playing healer, signet of rejuvenation is a fantastic heal, it can heal up to 150 ish when the condition is met for no energy.

Also, dont spam high energy skills like heal other, heal party, or protective spirit, only use thes when they are absolutely required. Keep cheap spells on your bar like Dwaynas kiss + Words of Comfort for some low cost heals, and for better efficincy try to meet the conditions those heals have.

Also for elites, Light of Deliverance is by far the most energy - efficient healing elite, the amount it heals across your party is unmatched by any other spell, and it only costs 5 energy. If your playing protection, Zealous Benediction gives a nice energy return when cast on someone below 50% health.

Ok, im aware you may not have all these skills yet, but at least it gives you an idea of which skills to look out for you as you progress through the game.

Happy Monking

You can't really understand a monk until you play one for a while. The best you can hope for is that they will listen to you when you explain what the problem is. Unfortunately, a lot of players are just a**holes who have no clue as to how to stay in range or don't know what energy management is, etc. Then they blame you when they die. And have a hissy fit if you don't rez them right away. Best thing to do with a bad group that blames you for their own obvious problems is to leave.

Hee hee.
This brings back memories of EQ2 pugs.
Me as healer after fight "OOP guys"
Tank aggroes another mob.
Tank yells "Heal me for crying out loud!!!!""WTF?!?"
/me sits down
"Still OOP buddy"
These are the same players that leave as soon as they ding.
DING!
"Ohhhh, I'm so tired guys, gotta go." lol

I believe your biggest problem was that you're the only monk in a party of 8. Generally, decent groups will aim for two monks or a monk backed by a support healer such as a Ritualist. Use greater discretion when picking your groups. With two healers, your party should be able to steamroll through many of the games obstacles, as long as someone is organizing the assaults or at the very least as long as the majority of the players have decent builds for the situation.

Furthermore, sometimes patience is not an option. This is especially true of Factions, where getting Masters on a mission involves beating a preset timer. Obviously if a group wants to get masters, they can't wait for you to regenerate energy.

I know a new game can be frustrating but perhaps before ranting you should explore all of your options and configurations. As another player suggested, energy management could be a good idea if you constantly find yourself low on energy. Being a secondary mesmer, for instance, allows you to use the Channeling skill, which is a popular choice for PvE Monks.

tis the harsh reality of pugs.

pugs r.i.p.

Hero/Hench ftw. No whiners, no rushers, no self-proclaimed group leaders. Nobody to insult or question your builds, nobody to blame you when they screw up and die.


But yeah, in a full player group:

-don't be the only monk. Being the only monk in an 8-player PUG is asking for a headache. Insist they get a second, or have someone bring a hero
-as Crom went into detail about below, PLAN before you start. Don't jump right in because that one guy is saying "Cmon go go I only have x minutes till bed/supper go go go!!!!" ESPECIALLY if the one trying to rush you is a warrior. Bad sign right there, lol.
-bring energy management, keep the 10e+ cost spells to a minimum (Heal Party spam FTL)
-don't "overheal"
-ping your energy when it starts to run low
-laugh at the wammo that runs ahead and dies regardless of your warning

I think it has partly to do with adrenaline junkies.
One of my friends was an adrenaline junky.
Only worried about adrenaline and didn't want it to run out.
Never thought that others had to rely on energy only.

One of the biggest problems in GW is the lack of team or party planning before a mission or quest.

A pug group is formed with the right proffesions then imediately starts the mission assuming everyone knows their roles.

Take the time to find out if your War's are running on all adrenaline builds, this is often what drives them to press forward once they get there adren built up.

Make sure you know what is concidered a priority target for the entire party, if the mob has a monk boss at the back the war may feel that is where he should be. Make sure you have a plan, say a ranger or a nuker with interupts, so that the tank can deal with secondary targets.

Talk about what skills everyone in the party is bringing, see if someone has a build that compliments yours or works against it. This could be a Blood Ritual Necro to help the monks regain energy.

Spending 5-10 minutes talking about a mission will guarentee you beat the mission in the first try rather than attempting it over and over again.

wow some paragraphs in op would be nice as its kinda painful to read

To the OP:
The second character I rolled in GW was a monk/mesmer. I generally make it a practice to get god with a character before I try grouping with people, because with a monk, I wanted to make sure my skills were up to the job, and that no one was going to blame me first for a failed mission.

My suggestion: you can go through at least half the game with henches (or more). I made it to the desert (Ascension missions) before grouping with people. I must have tried a dozen or so variations of builds (I went primarily as a healer, with a mesmer skill or two for hex reversal), before I found a build i was very comfortable running--one that didn't leave me dry of energy after each encounter, and let me do a decent job of keeping teammates alive.

I also suggest that you insist that the group take a second monk. Early on, you can be the only monk in a group, but when the groups go from 6 people to 8, and the missions get tougher, it's really unrealistic for people to expect a lone monk to heal everyone. PUGs are generally an impatient bunch (though you will come across a pretty good PUG every now and then--they more an exception now).

If you have team members that insist on rushing so far ahead that it puts you in danger of dying while trying to heal him, then follow this simple rule: let him die a horrible death. Chances are, that's a bad player, one you can hope will drop out, so you and the rest of the team can complete your mission.

Most people do realize and appreciate what a good monk can do. Just make sure your skills are up to it, your group has SOME type of strategy going into whatever mission you're doing---and don't forget to have fun.

Also, remember--as a monk, you're going to get more than your share of invites to groups. If a group is really making you feel like crap, and you know you're doing a good job, drop out. You'll get another invite in 2 minutes or less...

Just wanted to point out one flaw in your rant (not trying to be mean I know its very difficult playing as a monk tried it once will never do it again) but there is not set tank in GW like there is in other games I've seen a monk tank very well and I've seen a Assassin tank almost as good heck I've seen a Monk beat a Warier in one on one hand to hand combat. It wasn't pretty and didn't last long. So forget what you know about MMO's that will kind of help in the long run and there are a lot of people on this site that can help you set up a Monk to meet any need just look at the build forum and modify to your liking. oohhh one more thing a monk is like a QB when the mission falls they usually blam the monk or the Wammo lol I get blammed alot and alot of the time they are right of course I don't know my job as well as most I don't play that often I have a life sort of. I just play to escape and kill time. Just have fun and I'll see you around sometime maybe.

I'm pretty sure that it's if you know how to use your energy efficiently you can rip through PvE pretty easily in the way you describe as being bad.

If there's a necromancer in your group, tell them to bring this: [skill]Blood Ritual[/skill] Any good necromancer should bring it, as even at 3 blood magic, a monk appreciates it.

Wasted skill slot. Just take like Glpyh Lesser or Ether Signet or Power Drain.

Maintain awareness of what's happening at all times. Bad monks only watch red bars, decent monks have faster reaction times because they can see things about to happen before they actually do. In PvE it's not so much a big deal, but every advantage helps.

Wasted skill slots. My necromancer has no problem fitting blood ritual on any build. Then again, I make my own builds and not Wiki them...

Unyielding Aura or Vengeance is always fun to bring along with a PuG. Mostly for the amusement factor. However, there's also a practical benefit - leeroys won't accrue DP if they die under UA, and they'll be dead before they can rush into the next mob if you use Vengeance. Heck, bring both skills

Not wasted at all. Monk carrying his own energy management is a lot more likely to be a good monk than one who has to rely on the crutch of a necro carrying blood rit. Don't get me wrong, blood rit is nice to have occasionally, but it's not something I'd recommend to a new monk, as he or she might become used to having it and not be able to function without.

lol, the Wammo leash. Always amusing xD

One of the best ways for a new monk to handle themselves was said earlier: Don't spam high energy skills, carry low cost energy skills which can be spammed. That alone leaves no issue with healing OR energy.

Oh and a side note, always make sure you know the other monk's build. Having one Healing and one Protection monk usually works far better than two healing. I tend to run a protection monk since it usually negates most of the damage and the healing monk just patches the damage that leaks through. Also, there's usually very few protection monks around as opposed to healing.

lolok. Cos on a Necro I definately want to stop casting stuff to kill quicker and go spend 3s casting Blood Rit because a Monk doesn't know how to manage energy / weapon swap. Yeah!

Also, GvG monk Builds > PvE monk Builds. Running full healers is pretty bad.

If I ever make a monk I am going to try that

Running any healing at all is bad. Go smite. That's where it's at. Armor ignoring damage woo!

Also if the team you're with knows wth it's doing, you should not run out of energy either. In GvG you plan differently of course, but that's because most PvPers are smarter than AI. In EotN enemies are a bit smarter, so some builds might have to change a bit, (not really though). But everywhere else in GW besides elite missions Deep, Urgoz and DoA..you can run 5e build without trouble. I always do and bring no e-management of any kind simply because power drain would take out a needed skill.

WoH
Orison
Dwayna's
Breeze (for yourself mostly if things are hitting you and you need to heal the team)
Heal Seed or Seed of Life
Cure Hex, Holy Veil, Deny Hex, Remove Hex..whichever you wanna bring
Heal Party
Rez

That's what I usually bring to FoW and I never have energy problems. That will also work in almost every other place. Might have to change a few things sometimes. Power Drain if you really must have it, could probably fit over breeze but then be prepared to kite, unless you have a good team...in which case you won't need power drain anyways.

In Hard Mode, yeah expect to change your build (I wouldn't worry about HM, OP till you're a bit more experienced).

For EotN you just fix a few things..make your elite LoD and things work good that way too.


Many builds will work in PvE, especially in Prophecies PvE. You can be the monk that carries your team (which will happen a lot, that's why you should probably bring at least one emanagment), you can find a team that'll actually know what teamwork is and not have to worry about e-management cause you won't be healing as often (rare,unless you have a guild) or you can do what I do, pick your comfortable build, hope for the best (usualy get the worst) and not give a damn cause this game is too boring to play anywhere outside EotN for 5 min anways.

I ran;

LoD/Infuse/RoF/SoA/RemHex/Prot Spirit/Guardian/Ether Sig

the other day in Frostmaw. Was a pretty terrible team and the other Monk was useless but we still barely died and I only had energy problems like twice which weren't even problems because of high-set.

Before blaming others first, look at yourself first. Thing is ... you as monk should be able to manage energy well.

If fight drains you to point that you need to regen, something is bad. Either damage dealers are too slow to monsters outpace them ... which means that you spend longer time healing (dont make warrior tank enemies, make him kill them, make sure that everyone can deal damage, if you are not healing, attack called target with wand. if your groups has no called targets, you can expect troubles you are getting), or people are playing stupidly (not kiting monsters - caster just standing there getting hit), or you are inefective.

After one week, you are be still very unexperiened, so listen to advice (you hear most of it here, just ignore people suggesting usage of skills like healing breeze or heal party)

Make good bar. Skill costing 10 and more energy are really bad for monk (two exceptions: Protective spirit and Spirit Bond). AOE Healing skills are mostly waste of resources (dont get lured by big blue numbers on Divine healing or Heal area).

Use protection too. Monk can easily hybrid to heal/prot/divine. Protection prayers outpace healing as they generally provide better effect for same cost. Protection/Healing hybrid is currently most powerfull combo.

Use energy management. In either form of signets you use to heal up or/and mesmer skills. If you are different secondary, there are some options too.

Dont overheal. people who need healing are the ones that are activelly taking damage or are left on dangerously low health (<75%). Dont make red bars go up to 100% for no reason. For example, if someone is at 90% health and you heal him with some 5 energy skill for ~100 hp, you just wasted 2-3 energy because that person was only about 50 health down from max. Anything from 90% upwards is comfort zone. signet heals are best suited for that, players with self heal can take care of that too.

Bottom line is, you will run out of energy with bad players and there is nothing you can do against that, but if you are in good team, you as monk should be able to keep up without running out of energy.

If heroes and henchmen can keep up, humans surely must be able too.

As a new player, barely a week in, (s)he probably doesn't have access to elite skills and other later game skills that can manage energy. And the whole insta-weapon swap out that many guides recommend takes both advanced play skill (timing, speed, and planning) and a lot of cash on the characters to buy high end gear - or countless hours self farming it all.

Bring energy management is more of a proper response to give an experienced player.

Even playing in PvP where you can start with a max character - a week in you won't have unlocked any elites yet, and you won't yet have the response time to make good use of what few items you have acquired.


This is kind of why I posted (somewhere) asking about leveling builds - the game is very different pre-20 and before you get a large stack of elites and funds, but a lot of people who've been around for 3+ years don't remember what it was like.


As for 'go go go' players - you find them in every online game. And they tend to play warriors or similar classes. In part, they get this way because with those classes you often only need to watch one bar - the life bar. And you have to 'go go go' zerg it in order to keep adrenaline up...

It doesn't help that several of the post-searing missions are led by Prince Rurik, and he rushes through them giving not even a fellow zerg-warrior time to keep up...

And no energy management can keep up with the others in the group are overtaxing you. Unlike a tank or DPS character, a support character's energy is defined by what the others in the group do just as much if not moreso than what they themselves are doing. As a monk - your energy is being used based on how much they need of it, rather than based on just your own choices. If they rush too fast, they need more healing. If they slow the pace, or manage aggro better, they need less healing.


As for advice to a new monk; check out the guide to playing a monk on the guild wars official wiki. It's pretty well done. Take your time, learn how to use the skills you have, and get your interface set up to work well for you.

When I'm on my monk - I spend most of my time using keyshorts to cycle through party members and (when needed) casting protection spells on them. When not needed, I try to just cycle to the one I expect to need something next.

For just about all cases, qft.

Monks should maintain energy with energy management and use of prot, and regen while the group is moving to the next pack. For a new monk, build design, skill usage, and weapon swaps (the things mentioned in this thread) are the most important things for you to learn.

Ignore pugs. Go with friends or people that know what they're doing and won't criticize you for stupid things like that.

In my view best tip you'll ever get in regards to GW is never ever play in PUGs any more. Instead, use friends/Guildies or Heroes and Henchmen exclusively.

What you've described in the OP is in my view typical of very close to 100% of GW's PUG-playing population.

PUG players as a whole are never, ever going to learn any of the things you've described in the OP. So best way to save yourself from the aggravation of that is to simply not play with them. Trying to tell them how to play decently will unfortunately have no impact whatsoever on the grand scheme of things. Their destiny is to play badly forever, and they always will. If they were ever going to get better, they would have by now, but they didn't.

With the advent of Heroes as of NF and now again in EOTN, most good players stopped playing in PUGs entirely. Because Heroes are millions of times better than the typical PUG player is, every single time.

Team with out any skill that reduce the total damage usually fail. 2 Monks usually enough for any balanced team.Team of full henchmen in the later chapters are quiet balanced and all round with heroes who will patch up the hole you should be able to clear 95% of any mission without trouble

While unorganized Pugs run anything they like and leave a huge weak spot for PvE monster to crack your team down.

Or if you're in chapter 3, skip the warriors in your PUGs. Dervishes can fill the same role in a group, but also use energy - so they don't 'go go go'.

Even when I hench / hero, I choose a dervish over a warrior if I can. Koss only comes out when he's required (or if I'm leveling him up).

Warn people, and if they don't listen; Let them Die.

I always do it, I'm feared by many ingame friends for it. When I say something about regen or character play, you better change your way or your gonna die.


And I don't res if there being an ass, But I also never rage quit from a team lol I leave that to the Ele/D who is QQ cause someone wipped there enchantments (I'm sure its new age echo mending)

Difference between a good PUG and a bad one.

You get through a tough mission. No one had healing problems, and very few deaths.

A good PUG: "GG Monk." "Nice healing"

A bad pug: No thanks to the monk, who saved their asses.

I've never played a monk, but I can understand it's the most thankless job in the game. Outside of PvP, people think that you can stick anyone in the position and they are God for healing. Hell, I had one PUG take a lvl12(!) monk for Vizunah Square! You'll find a lot of experienced players here who refuse to PUG anymore.

If you like being a monk, then just tough it out till you get a good guild or have access to heroes.

Oh, and self-heals should be a f'in requirement for everyone. If I had a dime for every Naruto-boy with a 4-chain attack combo and no self-heal skill, I'd be a billionaire. "It's the monk's job" is a phrase used by a retard.

hey, it could be worse. You could've chosen a mesmer.

Should Monks say "gg Warriors, thanks for doing damage?" or "WAY TO GO NECROS! SPREAD THOSE HEXES!" or something as well then? That's ridiculous. I'm not going to go and say thanks to someone on an individual basis for doing what their character was made for...

Then again, I might call someone stupid if they run a Healing Hands/Breeze Warrior, or a Monk who specs in Smiting without them having meant to do so, or a Ranger who runs any Prep / Barrage, etc.

You missed the point.

If he is just doing his job, no. I was talking of a situation where the monk does an excellent job, not a job that Dunk/Talk could do.

You probably don't think about the fact that with a good monk, your red bar never goes below 50%, or conditions never stick on you. Granted, those are few and far between, but when they do happen, I find it well within my time and motor control to type "GG monk". It's a lot easier to put out damage to one foe or aggro(warrior) than it is to keep an eye on the overall game and heal/protect 7 other people while making sure you don't get killed in the process. Yet you find it easy to type a scathing missive to someone doing a bad job. Interesting.