There won't be titles in GW2, right?

Im most lightly not getting it but i rekon there will be if not at the start. Just like this people will play for this "fun" some people speak of them people will get bored of that and a-net will buff the life span for the expansions by giving us more stuff to grind for ^^. Whether or not they will have effects like some of the titles is the question though.

And gaining ranks in these titles requires ... dun dun dun ... grind!
Before titles, I had 75% chance to retain my armor, while now the default chance is 50%. And gaining 2 ranks won't yet get me back up there were chances once were.
Lockpicks confer you economic advantages after ... grind, again! Be it money farming to spend on rings or "golds", or chest farming with costy keys.
Now, what if I don't wanna "stand out" by a meaningless word string under my name? Why should I be disadvantaged for actually playing the game, rather than working it?
I have 2 things to answer to that:

1. Perfect salvage kits require me to purchase another product; if I choose not to spend more money, I am stuck with "grinding or failure".
2. In case it escaped your attention, the subject is titles in GW2. So, I was using GW1 and its flaws as a referential cadre towards GW2; with that in mind, there's little relevance in bringing upfront the "perfect patch" EotN brought to cover GW1's "surgery gone wrong". Or, to say it simple: we're not here to just complain about the finished project, GW1, but to express our worries about GW2.

I see ... and where would you place me?

Whats wrong with titles. Yeah, get rid of the functionality. Thats fine. I mean, I like some of the PvE skills, and, if I were ever to get it, a 50% chance of keeping lockpicks would be nice, but other than that, what on earth is wrong with them?

Yeah, perhaps a grind title like lightbringer or one of the EotN race titles is fairly pointless, but I enjoy vanquishing and the like, and the little reward at the end, even though it has no use in any shape or form, is a nice added touch. And for the massive titles, like gladiator or hero, are stupidly long to amass the points for. But theres no actual reward for them! And, though not something I'd enjoy, some people must, otherwise they wouldn't invest so much time into doing it. You can't take away something that other people enjoy just because it ruins your utopic view. And to the OP, since when does a major section of the player-base work on survivor? Those arenas are empty because there are 4 games now, with 4 sets of things to do. And to everyone who has posted something of the like, I enjoy playing my character. I'd stop playing guild wars if I didn't.

After reading through this topic, the only argument that holds any water is the functionality of titles.

quit whineing about us people who play like we wanna, not how you wanna



i get runs, play seriously, and dont help noobs

and i have fun doing it

GW, proudly announced as the game where skill > time.
Let's look at it now.
We have Johnny and Bob who are both GW players. Their skillbars are identical, their in-game-skill too. They have the same equipement.
But what's this? Bob spent more time grinding Lightbringer and he's R3 when Johnny is R1.
They both attack that poor Margonite and despite the fact that they're identical Bob hits harder. Or, if you like it other way around- Johnny hits for less because he didn't spend so much time grinding LB rank.
Skill > time? Hah!

Thank you titles that give benefits.

Yeah, but it takes skill to know how to devise a good skill bar. You are comparing two people with equal skill and different grind.
Even if Johnny has higher lb then Bob, if Bob is a more skilled player, he will likely be more helpful to the party. Even if Johnny is R3 and Bob is R1, Johnny could have mending and power attack on his skill bar while Bob has Executioners/Evisercate.
So while time CAN be the deciding factor when skill is even, when skills aren't, the player with more skill will still do more damage and have more utility.

I said in my previous post that they're both the same- same skillbars, same skill.
So, Bob will be more helpful to the party. Why? Because he deals more damage. And why is that? Because he's been grinding more than Johnny.
From a game where skill > time I would expect that people with the same skill will be equally good.
But it seems Propheces/Factions time is over.

wow.....

btw doing ss/lb farm from salanja its pitifully easy to get to r6 sunspear and r5 lb which is just fine for anything outside of HM

and for those that say its impossible to beat NF without LB rank, my ele finished as rank 2 LB, and those lb points were gained from bounties


seriously people if you don't want to grind then don't

and if ya can't live without having the "grind" titles that benefit you, and ya don't have the guts to max them, then quit

i maxed my ss/lb and it bored me practically to death, but you can save yourself a lot of it by just getting rank 9 sunspear and rank 6-7lb and you have less than half the time spent, closer to a third of it. if the damage from lb means that much to ya, then max the darn thing

and yes, i have my tormented shield with "sleep now in the fire" so flame away

Yeah, yet another 'grind is easy' guy.
Tell us something we don't already know, Sherlock

Which part of "skill > time" you don't get?

Don't ever assume something is a "flaw" just because you do not enjoy the particular thing. I absolutely LOVED getting Legendary Survivor. It was a challenge to be sure, it involves skill to be sure. And to be sure I had a blast getting to legendary survivor, every step I took was a step forward in the process and as I continued I was having more and more fun!

What will I be going for next? Vanquisher, why not. Why? Because I also find that fun, as do a few of my guildies. Once again it's a challenge and you get much better loot on top of that.

Also might I add this is Guild Wars. Created by Anet. You should know by now that Anet loves to reward players, especially since in every interview I've EVER read about them someone always says that Anet loves to reward those that are devoted to it's products.

Just remember... Even if only a minority of people like it, that minority counts for something, even if something less. When people say ditch titles in GW 2. It's like saying "Hey forget that 11 gold on the ground".

Someone that takes that seriously wouldn't even use the skills. And in all honesty I didn't even know about LB skills untill well after I had beaten NF. With H/H, mind you. Nobody is forcing you to grind, it doesn't leave you at a disadvantage in any meaningful way.

Although I can admit I don't like the r5 requirement on the armor in EotN. But it's not like they have better stats in ANY way! If you think GW is grindy even a cent's worth, go play WoW, or EQ. Or Lineage 2. Or EQ2 or Rappelz or ANY other MMO and you'll see what grinding REALLY is, where it's essentially forced on you if you want to progress your character even the slightest bit once you hit the level cap.

Let's see.
1) If you are rank 1 LB people will laugh at you if you'd like to do DoA
2) Rank 1 lb- 1 dmg reduction, 5% more damage vs r8 lb - 8 dmg reduction and 40% more damage
35% less damage.
No DoA.
No disadvantage?

Yeah, I see it now, GW 2 and WoW- will you be able to tell the difference?

I never got laughed at when I did DoA. Nobody cared about my LB rank. I was asked maybe.. Oh say... ONCE my entire time playing GW and even then, they didn't care. It helps, but if anyone thinks it's required, then you're better off not grouping with them.

And for the record. Would you people please CALM THE FRICK DOWN?! GW2 BETA isn't starting until late 2008 and has barely started down the road of completion and people assume that it's going to be some horrible game just because the level cap has risen a great amount (POSSIBLY). Lemme guess? You forgot the part where they say it'll be like a "power plateau" in which case as you progress you stop gaining as much benefit? Thus still giving people mostly even footing. Do you even know how hard/easy it will be to level up or progress? Did you also not read the part where they clearly stated that much of it is not written in stone, and that they're still thinking over many ideas?

Those that think they know everything often know nothing. I'll leave you with that.

This whole thing would be easier for everyone if you paid any attention to GW developement.
Lemme see grind...
Proph- lol wut grind
Factions- get to 10k factions to move in the storyline
NF- you hafta get to r7 sunspear and r1 lb
GWEN- grind which is 'optional' meaning that those 40 armor sets which were proudly announced are optional... Funny, because they didn't say anything about that, eh?
Oh, and also, by grinding you'' get higher rank, meaning better titles and your skills will be better
Where's your skill > time now?
[quote]Those that think they know everything often know nothing. I'll leave you with that. [/quote[
Those that are afraid of making educated guesses are often dissapointed.

this topic has been beaten to death. i haven't read anything in this thread that hasn't been said before.
maybe we could merge the 400 "titles are optional/no they aren't wahhhhhhh" threads into one big whine-fest?

Yeah and no one ever had to grind for armor in Marhan's Grotto, or FOW. Those just fall right into your lap. Everyone who just does quest progression and missions gets all the cash and materials for these "prestige" armors right?

Elite armors don't give you anything else than having a nice look.
Skills give you an advantage. And on top of that, armors which were a big part of the promotion aren't avaliable for everyone if you don't want to spend your day farming. And it's ridiculous. "Oh yeah, like, you saved the world (and me) more than once, but I can't give you a friggin piece of gauntlets, noob."

I don't have anything against titles ; but they shouldn't reward you with something useful.

Yes there will be titles afterall GWEN leads to GW2 if you recall so there are titles and reputation in that so there will also be in GW2. Probably more grinding than you've ever seen before in GW2, but, of course just like GW1 it won't be necessary or required. But, if you want to have prestige and be considered a GREAT player because you have the additional skills then you'll probably want to do the titles and reputation features afterall..

same here. im guessing there WILL be titles in GW2. titles will probably unlock (some) of the coolest stuff (ala rainbow phoenix)....and titles will continue to annoy some players. if titles have taught me anything its this.

either decide your going to be a title achieving player....or not. and decide very early on. (its not a nice experiance trying to achieve legendary guardian 2 and a half years down the line from the release....you probably wont find anyone).

im planning not to give rats-A in GW2. my chars gonna be running around cheap armor forever XD im gonna concentrate more on enjoying the game and playing with other people than be a gear/title-wh0re.

I don't really care much for titles tbh. However, I don't have a problem with them being added to GW2. It'll give those who love to grind something to spend their time on.

GW2 is going to be designed for the old and the new. I'm sure they want to draw some of that population from WoW and will make GW2 that type of a draw without it being such a pure grindfest. It's just going to be more of both I think. A larger world to play in. More people in a combat zone (hopefully no ksing or whinning and griping about this is my spot type stuff though) and they will finally separate pve from pvp so pve players don't feel ripped off everytime there is a pvp update. It's going to be much better an improved for everyone and only the old grogs who don't want anyone to be able to play any other way but their way will be disappointed in it. Those that scream the excuse time and time again GW is suppose to be skill>time, well it was for awhile but anet never said it would be this way forever.

I really hope GW2 will have titles, and I expect it to have them.

For me, titles proved to be a nice target to work towards in the game and achieve something not every other player has. Titles are a nice way to distinguish your character imo.

See, titles would be OK, if you have the choice to leave them but and not be disadvantaged for that choice. As it is now in GW1, that's not the case for title tracks as Treasure Hunter, Wisdom, Luck, Luxon, Kurzick and Lightbringer, who put players at a disadvantage, if they don't gain ranks in them.
So am I, but I do hope we will not be virtually taxed for actually playing the game in GW2.

Titles don't distinguish you, because, in a gameplay wrapped around titles, everyone has them.
The only thing they do, is showing how hard players work the game, as they gain ranks slower or faster than each other.

Titles don't distinguish you? Haha then why do I get asked all the time about my Imp Slaying title? Oh they distinquish you alright it just depends on the title. Just like the rank emotes distinquish skilled players in pvp. Some titles distinquish you for skilled play and extended play in the pve game. Some titles are envyable and don't think some of them are not. I figure most people that complain bout titles are the jealous ones who just don't have the "TIME" to go out there and get them. Thus why they bring up skill>time rediculous argument everytime something doesn't go their way. But, as I said before Anet never said skill>time would always be their #1 priority and that things would never change. Things do change and have changed and for the better and it's grrrrrrrrreaaaaaaaaaat.

They sure don't distinguish you from another with that title. You're just another guy with the Imp Slaying title.
You honestly believe that? How comes I <without rank emote> can still beat players with a rank emote?
Oh, I've no problem with you having your decorations.
However, I object to being taxed on my salvages and PvE über-skills for not having grinded sufficient rank.
Have you ever thought it could also be that those who complain don't have the time and are penalised by the game for not having sufficiently high ranks (think Treasure Hunter, Lightbringer, etc.)?
Actually, it is just the opposite: grind came up our way, when we didn't want to commit to it.
I recall them stating "skill > time" as one of the main principles GW is build upon.
They also sold us the game under that claim.
Then whyyyyyyyyyyy are people so unhappy with it?

AFAIK, higher Hero rank doesn't give you any bonuses. No +dmg, no dmg reduction, skills don't become more efficient.

how misleaded u are. U clearly dont see the cheese above ur heaad do u?

Gw2 will have titles and we will all complain about it.

Titles are meant for u to waste time on game so u can be l337.

More time to waste ty anet btw i seriously bet they will have titles

gg anet

Bolded the ones I disagree with. There is one thing people ALWAYS forget about with those titles. Yes, having treasure hunter, wisdom, and luck will allow you to make more money over time with salvaging and chest opening. HOWEVER, the initial investment to get those titles in the first place is a large sum of money. So to get those titles in the first place, you have to go in heavy debt. Although you could eventually work it off, the amount of money actually "earned" by having those titles isn't as signifcant as a lot of people assume.

Debt? I ain't seen no banks in GW1.
... after an incredibly insane amount of grind.
Loosing a 15K armor piece because insufficient rank has been grinded or not daring to salvage costy components of costy weapons, that would both earn more K's separately, does not strike me as insignificant.

Slayer of Imps a distinction?

Thanks, but I don't need that kind of distinction.

What's next? People being amazed at someone logged in?

Then again, people will take flattery over anything, so if that's all it takes to keep people happy (the title owners) and amazed (the non title owners), then it would merely define the usual lowest common denominator gameplay.

The reason people so strongly defend the titles in GW, is because compared to any other game, most of them are insanely easy to obtain.

This aspect of PvE will be sorely missing from GW2. Then, many of those who enjoy their special status right now, will face the true grind and true level dependence.

GW is still skill-based. Same goes for almost all titles. GW2 will be grind-based.

Not sure what you're talking about, but, higher faction with kurzicks or luxons do increase your skill power with the skills you get from them.

To the other character above who tore my post up into quotes. As many people are happy with the changes as those that aren't. Since there is no data to support either side it's easy to make these "assumptions" like you did. Just have to face it whatever GW was built upon is merely the foundation, there are still walls and floorings and windows and decorations to follow. So, skill>time was a mere starting point it wasn't the beall endall of the game design as you can see from the recent chapter and expansion. Grind and titles and all those things that go along with it are HERE TO STAY bud, you can either go along with the flow or quit dontchaknow?

Actually you are wrong here because you don't have to spend one dime to get the treasure hunter and wisdom titles. All you have to do is play and get the key DROPS and I get two keys nearly ever zone I go into so I'm not spending anything if I dont want to. Now, if I want to RUSH a title then it will cost money, but, if you play casually you don't have to invest a dime.

Kurzick faction for the PVE skills is another one where you make money everytime you go out on a faction adventure. Some would call it grind, I personally have fun doing it. Doesn't cost me a dime and I get gold drops and keys still from doing it.

I have a HARD MODE area I play in constantly that yields 2-4 golds per run and still lockpicks that DROP off the mobs. I'm finding if you complete the ENTIRE zone you get a lot more LOOT than if you just try to farm a portion of it. You also get more key drops and thus more chests to open for treasure hunter title and gold drops to inspect for wisdom title.

Works for me and not costing me a dime.

Still, a question goes through my mind.
Why does Anet want me, who payed for all chapters, and even bought GWEN on the online store, to be "punished" (not rewarded) because I don't like grinding ?

If people get rewards from killing masses of Guardians, then I want a reward for roleplaying.

Yeah, the more time you spend in ab/on FFF the better your pve skills get.
GG AN.

I bet you 5k that someone will jump out with "you don't have to grind or use pve-only skills" or something like that

Right. Lucky title costs over 2 million gold to max.

And the money I'm talking about making is money you make by salvaing blue items in mass to make money over time.

The money "lost" by breaking expensive armor or items can be avoided by using perfect salvage kits. I'm talking about breaking down cheaper items for profit.

Didn't see anyone complain about titles until this thread was posted.

/Hopeful titles stay

Titles are optional, you don't absolutely need any title. For me, titles are something that I can do and they give me a goal in the game. Others don't care as much for the idea of titles, and aren't forced to do them. I don't see the problem.

I don't think skill poses a problem there; I managed to make a start in all those titles (except the GvG one and the EotN one, 'cause I haven't decided to buy it yet), but realised it would take a insanely amount of grind repetion to make usefull advance. It was, simply, not fun to keep at it.
Oh, I really hope not; grind should be completely optional (thus not give gameplay advantages), lest they intend to become "just another subscription free MMO".

Oh, I don't know, and neither do you. What I do know, is that alot more people could be happy if they weren't taxed for not grinding.
I've no data, but only my experience with GW from the Open Alpha, the Open Beta and from 1 month after realease till now.
Titles and the decision to add grind instead of interesting new gameplay came halfway through GW's lifespan, between Factions and Nightfall. Which was about the time the devs decided to "remake" into GW2. Oh, I agree: compulsory grind will STAY HERE IN GW1. But we're talking GW2, which hasn't been confirmed to be grind-enforcing.
Eh ... noe!
If the flow runs into a bottomless pit, I'd rather attempt to readjust it; but you go ahead!
And again, we're discussing different flows: you're talking GW1 and I'm talking GW2.

So you optimalised your grind? Nice for you, but at the best you'll get it, it's still mind-numbing grind! And the title tracks that tax you are among the most grind demanding.
The difference between me and grind-lovers is that I can't keep on running on the grindmill like a hamster without getting absolutely disgusted by it.

They came too late and are costing skill points (which require grind too) on top of the regular grind.

Well, you didn't look well enough then. When people talk about grind in other threads and in the game, what do you think they're talking about?
This thread is only the tip of the iceberg, that just pierced through the surface. Dissatisfaction was there growing all the time; it has become concentrated enough to voice itself.

They're not all that optional; read up.

However, I don't get why some want certain titles to remain compulsory; why do grind-enforcement defenders want everyone to be compelled into the grindmill or taxed for failing to grind enough?

I think they might've mentioned something like this when the Hall of Monuments was brought in, don't really remember though. It'd be nice, but not a necessity.

Is this what you're referring to when you say to read up?

"thus not give game play advantages"

Just because they decided to reward the people who have decided to angle their game play towards the title-grind does not mean that the title is no longer completely optional.

Optional - Adj. - left to one's choice; not required or mandatory

So, what are any of the titles required for? Anet lets you choose in which direction you angle your game play. The fact that it gives you a slight advantage (almost non-existent and not required to play the game) does not compromise the fact that it is still optional.