Mesmer buff, they deserves some.

The inspiration line should be buffed.

While I don't play mesmer in RA anymore I do give advice to others from time to time. And most of the time I give them some surgestions they come back with a smile on their face.
It's more about the mindset of people and not the actual profession/skills.

When looking at PvE, mesmers could use a buff, but that's more related to the way PvE functions and not the profession itself.

Yesterday for example I was opening chests in the Ring of Fire mission NM for a while.
The team I took: Me (mesmer), 2x para hero, 1x Dslash warrior, 2 warrior hench and 2 monk hench.

The enemy mobs there are relatively small, so would be good for a mesmer.
However, since the foes don't kite and are no real danger for such a team, there is no need to run some kind of shutdown or disabling.

On the other side there are the large mobs in the various areas where some kind of AoE nuking (prefer armor ignoring) makes more difference then single target shutdown.

The best place for the current mesmer (or assassin) is the situation where a mid-sized balanced group is encountered and casters cannot be balled/blocked as easily to get nuked.
And where going brute-force for those targets would expose the back-line.
But this would require too much work on AI side, team positioning and it would upset a lot of people used to a certain playing style (yes, tank/nuker/healer again).

A good example of such a place is the first assault on the turtles in Gyala.
There are several groups arriving from several points and monks in several of those teams.
If the siege turtles were not there, most teams would have a hard time without a mesmer or an assassin.

Consider the impact of a more powerfull CS on some HA maps.
Or at VoD or tight combat in GvG.

Though I do agree here a bit, the inspiration line was nerfed partly because of 'abuse' by other professions.
Moving some to FC and buffing then could be a solution or keeping in inspiration and buffing in slightly faster recharge with higher FC could solve this.
However, in my opinion a mesmer should not rely on spamming spells, making e-mgt less of a problem.

Balance and RA go together like....well, two things that shouldn't go together.

I think mesmers are fine tbh.

mesmers suck in PVE? those sunspear PVE skills can nuke quite well....signet of illusions+arcane echo + ebon vanguard assasin support is also quite good, in high level areas where mobs have lots of armor a mesmer can outnuke a ele...easy

Mesmers be fine the way they are imho

I like how one move by a mesmer (or a succession of moves) in PvP can force wipes and win matches. Really, all ANet need to do imo is buff some of the inspiration spells so monks can bring other types of energy management instead of GolE.

Overpowered...might become one of those farming skill like splinter barrage...and too powerful in PvP.

Eg. one mob of 10 clustered together =
(8 x 12) x 10 = 960armour ignoring dmg...

Um...cause RA is the definition of high level PvP

oh wait

Have one.
Leveled by playing the game. Completed all three chapters.
They don't need buffing.

Just a small note which may have already been mentioned -

Interrupting the foes attack goes against the mechanics of this skill. The foe needs to attack in order to suffer the dmg/blind.

Interrupting the attack would basically be a warning to anyone with half a sense of reaction to stop attacking -thus not suffering the dmg/blind.

U C?

When I play Mesmer (..and I have for over 2 years now) - it is the Illusion line I find to be the most lacking.

Inspiration and more so Domination, always leaves me spoilt for choice. I normally end up wanting to run Shutdown/Anti-melee/Anti Caster & E-denial all at the same time.

The options are fantastic in my opinion, and obviously trying to do about 17 things at once with 8 skills is not the way to go.

I like speccing to perform a specific role, and going out there (be it PVP or PVE) and doing my job. If that job is performed well, then it normally goes unnoticed by your average team....and I wouldnt want it any other way.

Despite the number of illusion skills, it feels like: degen degen degen, and the odd bit of anti melee. I never feel spoilt for choice...and my necro can perform that role far more effectively, without boring me to death.

Hmm...what was my point again?

Illusion - bad - lacks variety

Insp/Dom - good times.

ESurge is already very strong against Archers at VoD, we don't need it any stronger.

This thread made me lol.

So? I was just thinking of loseing energy from all foes, the dmg ignored from the skill is active right now...

Totally agree with that, I've had the same thought since Prophecies.

Personally I don't see them needing any major buffs. I do feel that some skills need to be revisited and have some minor adjustments made, but overall I find Mesmers to be powerful/weak based on the situation regardless of PvE or PvP. I could also say the same thing about most other professions, but since I primarily play Mesmers, that's what I'll comment on.

I will say that with some of the more recent changes to a few Mesmer skills, I've been using those skills more like Power Spike, Drain Enchantment. I do think Crippling Anguish could see a drop in energy cost. I would be willing make the tradeoff to increase the recharge on it for a reduction in energy. Energy Surge and Energy Burn got a slight buff recently, I believe, and I think that put it at just the right spot. Chaos storm...well I use it from time to time, but find most of the time I'm wasting energy when I use it.

Yeah, a class need a buff because it doesn't function to its fullest in RA.

Let's buff Warriors too, since they get shut down easily in RA by all the mass hexes/blind.

Let's buff Paragons too, since in RA, only having 4 people screws Leadership so they need some buff to compensate.

Or let's, you know, focus on organized PvP, instead of the wahmo arena.

Also, I've gotten glad points as a Mesmer in RA with a mending wahmo, a smiter, and a fire ele, so I don't see how the hell RA can seem like a good argument to anyone with a brain.


Well, to respond to the OP:

As someone said about MoR, it would make them increase recharge of other spells(That's why Diversion went from 10s to 12s recharge, IIRC). The E-Surge buff would make it a pre-nerf Signet of Weariness effect on top of the AoE damage. It's used enough as it is, does it really need anything else? Plus, how would that help in PvE, which is the place where Mesmers could probably use a bit of help? Unless you're farming, E-denial = fail in PvE. I guess the CA buff could be useful, though I doubt that'd make it see more play. The same goes for Instability.


EDIT:

Yeah, we kinda brought that on ourselves by abusing the hell out of it. >_____> I guess it wouldn't be as bad because you wouldn't have a bunch of boonies running around spamming it, but when they kill something, they tend to leave it dead, especially considering how long Inspiration was used. I agree it'd be nice to have back, and it does kinda suck that Mesmers pay the price for it, but I'm not banking on it happening.

I completely agree with this post. I have played a monk, ranger, warrior, elementalist, and mesmer entirely through Factions. What I observed was...

(1) The mesmer had the hardest time finding groups -- not just harder but much harder.
(2) The mesmer died most often of the five characters, though I tried a wide variety of builds. In fact, my builds started looking so "elemental" that I figured, heck, why not just play my elementalist?
(3) When things get "hot", the mesmer -- unlike other "squishies" -- has no way (that I know of anyway) to drive off a swarm of attackers. Yes, you can do a lot with your secondary, but a class should really be able to hold its own with its own skills -- or it isn't much of a class, in my opinion.
(4) The mesmer had the hardest time hero/henching the missions (which he usually ended up doing anyway due to observation 1 above).
(5) For reasons 1 to 4, I'd say the mesmer was the most challenging and (at times ) least fun of the five characters to play. I brought him over to EotN but got fed up with him because his defensive abilities just seemed so weak and his offensive abilities seemed so ... slow and indirect. A skill such as [skill]Spiteful Spirit[/skill] really belongs in the mesmer branch of skills, in my opinion.

I can't speak to PvP, but for PvE, this is what I encountered. I had fun with the mesmer, but the continual stomping I received (raptor swarms, lol ) just got ... really old.

I have a lot of respect for the class and for people who play it well, but I found the mesmer class to be, ultimately, just not that great.

While I do see the points you have, my personal experience is different.
Harder to team? Yes. But the teams I got into were mostly more organized and success most of the time. So for me that does not matter that much.
And the desperate team invites I sometimes get are funny to join when I'm up for some fun and have some spare time. It's in those teams an experienced player, even if it's a mesmer, can make a difference.
Died more often? Happens most of the time due to bad team/skill setup and not because of the mesmer profession. Especially when playing with H&H.
Unable to deal with swarm of attackers? Yes, part of it is the PvE mesmer problem, huge mobs and no large number of AoE spells. However, with a decent team, knowledge of the enemies and good choice of skills this should not be too much of a problem.
Hardest time H&H? Teaming problem, not mesmer problem.
SS as mesmer skill? Please

In the end: mesmer class not that great?
While mesmer is my main character, I do have to agree on this one for some part.
I can do everything I can better with other professions perhaps using x/Me for some specific skills. I can run Ne/Me with full mesmer bar and benefit from Soul Reaping. The difference between 12 and 14 on Dom/Ill is not that huge. Or run E/Me with the same type of bar and benefit from E-storage. The lack of FC is compensated by inherited E-mgt.
It's also easier to join the average PuG with most other professions.
And the game is more tuned to nuking or heavy melee than target specific shutdown, which is what the mesmer is best at.

The only reasonable buffs I can think of would be making some inspiration skills linked to or benefit more from FC for better e-mgt.
Most other buffs in favor of the PvE (specific AoE or shutdown) mesmer could overpower mesmers in PvP and need carefull consideration.
And those are not mesmer problems but generic design problems that need more work than just buffing the mesmer (and assassin).

Well, i do agree that Stolen Speed needs some buff.
You CANT spam that much, you would need a lot of fast casting to keep it at 3 targets, and at the end you wont need it because you will have about 14 fast casting.

Anyways... there is nothing wrong with mesmer at PvE.
The real problem is that most of Elite Areas... wait, who am i trying o fool? ALL Elite Areas at pve FAVOR the Tank, Nuke & Heal strategy.

None of these "Elite Areas" require skill or a decent strategy.
These areas are filled with ignorantly large mobs with massive damage but at the end they can be overrun by getting them all at a corner with a "super tank" and use Meteor Shower. And thats the only way it can be done.

You CANT get balanced group to fight a group of 15 level 26 with cross-profession skills, nice heal, interrupts, wards and etc. Its just impossible. Even with 2 monks, 1 para and 1 rit you defenses wont last enought to kill them, the damage just wont be enough to breakthrought all the heal and everything.
And remmeber that even the tank, nuke and heal can still find some trouble on taking out some of them because they can heal and prot handsomely. So if it can be hard for the appealing strategy (wich is based on doing massive damage) why wont be hard for the balanced group, wich is balanced?

And dont think that the mesmers are the only ones that suffer from this... Assassins, Paragons, Dervishes, Ritualists also do. Today the end-game is based on Warriors, Eles and Monks... the game just favors them... thats a fact.

The end-game favored the holy trinity at Sorrow's Furnace, the end-game favored the holy trinity at Urgoz and The Deep, the end-game favored the holy trinity at DoA and the end-game favored the holy trinity at Slaver's Exile.
Thats just what it is...

They didint changed the type of end-game at any of the chapters or the expansion even knowing that the type they exposed favored only 3 classes, at this point i can say "they really dont care".

They could have made smaller and powerfull mobs, like mini-bosses, level 33 monsters with monster-only skills or 3 classes skills... something to really test the players skills... but they didint. They insisted on making ridiculously large mobs because at their opinion, thats what we will like... well... at least the holy trinity will like.

No, the problems isnt within the classes, the problem is the type of content they offer us... wich has been the same since sorrows furnace. DoA resumes the whole game.

Edit - Overall The Mesmer is one of the fun classes to play. It takes a lot of knowledge and skill. Not the select target space 123. Strategies change on the fly skills need some skill to use etc.. Playing one can make you a better player. I think the problem with the Mesmer is it was set to play PVP / 1vs1 and the prophesies campaign is as close to that as you can get. When Faction came out the Mesmer was a bit set back. The AI on monsters got better the skills on monsters got better and the overall play got a little more challenging and the group size got bigger. Then Nightfall came out the same thing happened again larger groups and more dmg output. This is a limiting factor for the Mesmer is they have only a few skills that work against a group, and almost no skills that other party members directly see as help to the group (example: Watch yourself, Aegis, Well of blood, etc…) The EOTN is an expansion that sorta solved the problem for the mesmer smaller yet very powerful groups which are closer to 1vs1. The Mesmer can shine. I personally like posts like the OP set out there. It lets me brainstorm a little the big question is does A-net listen to complaints about the Mesmer ?

End of edit

My thoughts


Ineptitude - this spell now interrupts the foes attack aswell.

I like it as it is

Energy Surge - Target foe and all nearby foes loses 8 energy, for each energy lost on target foe that way, all nearby foes lose ½ the energy that target foe lost and take 12 dmg for each point lost this way. Recharge would have to reflect and be lengthened.

Mantra of Recovery - give back it's 55% speed, increase recharge abit. EDIT: Any ideas on how to improve it? Obviously it isnt in it's best at the moment.

Leave the speed the same but change it this way when mantra ends all skills are recharged mantra is disabled for 5 seconds for each skill recharged

Crippling Anguish - decrease recharge time to 15 seconds. (this one bothers me the degen is weak)

I would say leave the same but increase degeneration

Psychic Instability - Target foe suffers 53 dmg and is knocked down every time that foe is interrupted

Target foe and foes adjacent to that foe suffer knock down and dmg (it is an elite that needs to be trigger by an interrupt it should be Nasty)

Stolen Speed - Target foe casts 50% slower EDIT: Would be too overpowered on spamming. Increase recharge time to 10 secs.

Target foes skills cast 50% slower (stances of course would remain the same)

Move [skill]Spiteful Spirit[/skill] into Domination, where it should have been all along (it's more or less AOE [skill]Empathy[/skill], after all)...

>_>

Well, have to disagree with you there.
As you said earlier: "ALL Elite Areas at pve FAVOR the Tank, Nuke & Heal strategy." That's true.
However: Rt spike is very possible, Dervish can tank (I have at least one very experienced obsi-dervish DoA tank in the guild).

That would leave Assassin, Paragon and Mesmer.
Now we take a look at the Paragon. As long as A-net does not nerf SY (too much) the paragon can have a role in those areas, in more coordinated teams (or Ursan/Volfen/Raven-way in the current form).
The paragon can also have a good (support) role in a more heavy-armor team instead of a mostly caster team. Also needs more team coordination, but also very doable.

Which leaves the Assassin and the mesmer when looking at the primary profession.
Both have several huge disadvantages.
They can't nuke. They can't tank (well, can, but less efficient than ele or warrior) And they can't provide much party wide support.

Not entirely, but it leads to the core problem, the most fail-safe way to play those areas is with tank/nuker/healer.
It's not even the fastest way but it's the way even a beginner can play with some help (stand here, wait for all red dots to gather around player Y, wait for signal, press MS, press SF, press .... Foes dead? Move to next spot and repeat. Monks, heal player Y at all cost, all run if he loses aggro).
The next safest way would be Ursan and variants on that.
Slightly more risk since monks have to focus on more players. Decrease risk 2with SY paragon. Some teambuilds include nukers, also Rt ones.
Then we have the organised team.
When playing in a balanced, well organised guild team, it can outperform the Ursan team (one of our alliance guilds runs such a build at Deep, as far as I have heard).
It has somewhat more risk and takes a lot longer to perfect. But the reward is fast finishing of an elite area.

And at the very bottom is the mixed, not so well organised PuG.
This will hardly ever work in any elite area.
Because critical skills could be missing missing (no NC/CC in Urgoz, snares for some quests) or because the roles are not clear enough.

Now, if someone does not play these areas in a guild and is introduced to an elite area, what will he/she encounter?
Either the proven PUG builds (tank/nuker/healer, B/P) that succeed or the 'bad' PUGs that fail miserably.
And since T/N/H works, why try anything else, since for most players the only goal is to finish in reasonable time and get as much reward/gold as possible.
You know a 'random' team build does not work and a certain team build does work. So you take that certain build and work with that.
And variants of that build work everywhere.
There are only a limited number of people/guilds that think out of the box and try something different.
I could not get a certain guild team in ToPK going because "we don't want to go there, not enough profit".

It's not only because of the content.
It's because most players don't want to take a risk when playing.
They don't play for fun or invention anymore.
They want reward. Either gold or titles.
Taking more risk means possible longer time for the reward.
When they fail a 4-DoA run, they don't think they had 2-4 hours of fun + hard work, they think: "*#^@!, have to work an other 2-4 hours to get me gemstones/title/statue/whatever".
They don't look for the error and try to solve that, they take the same 'proven' build and do the same again.

And to be honest, it's a player's mentality problem.
You can get away by being just good enough.
There is no pressure to practice something a lot.
You can be a bad player in a bad team and still 'win' because the team's skillset leaves a lot of room for error.
A-net introduced the PvE skills and consumables for those who are even worse so they can still finish what they want.

It's not fair to blame A-net for this problem.
They failed to change the mechanics for the elite areas, that's sure.
But it's also the average player that is too stubborn to change his way of playing and is crying out loud when he can't get things done.

for those of you who keep wanting to add dmg to psychic instability ur crazy
lightning javelin/warmongers weapon and you have a constant kd AND dmg source kd is powerful enough as is

The Jos,
That all sounds really pretty and all... but surely does not match the game's reality.
For example, try DoA with your friends withou having to appeal to the holy trinity? Or try Salver's Exile at hard mode with a balanced group!
It just cant be done... like i said, too many mobs, too many damage on the entire group. Spirits are made of air at HM, you summon them and they die, paragon's shout dont give the bennefit enough to compensate the damage per second... the game forces you to appel.
Some areas like UW, FoW or even The Deep and Urgoz (at normal, of course) can eb done with balanced group... but DoA and Slavers HM (doa specially) just cant, its retarded actually

From all I have agreed, mesmers are just too diffrent in PvE. Mesmers needs either a change or a buff.

i have yet to see any necromancer get jealous over any mesmer skill, talking about how: "it should have been me..." but i see things like what you guys stated above popping up, not all the time, but quite frequent enough. the mesmer should consider themselves fortunate as being viable in a certain area of the game. a game that is supposedly designed around one main focus, competitive play, PvP. for once, who's to say that empathy should have been in the necro's line. not that i would want it but still, just for the sake of discussion.

"Anything you can do I can do better, I can do anything better than you."

"No you can't."

"Yes I can."

"No you can't."

"Yes I can..."



Jayce Of Underworld

@ jayce: Spiteful Spirit is Empathy with AoE. Mesmers would need a decent AoE spell, and Spiteful Spirit or something much like it would be completely at home in the Mesmer line.

@ tmr819: Yeah, mesmers are a priority target in PvE and in PvP, and have poor tankability and no decent self-heal compared to other squishies. Mesmer survivability is the lowest of any profession I've tried.

@ everyone who said that bringing a mesmer to RA is pointless: yeah, so what? It's still an excellent way to find out that mesmers have severe energy management issues, that all enemies have hex removal that is cheaper and recharges faster than the mesmers best hexes, that mesmers can be good against casters OR good against melee, never both, and that they're targeted first by the entire enemy team.
Basically that people complaining about being warriors and getting raped by mesmers need to take a mesmer to RA to get some raping-perspective.


Mesmer is a good secondary profession, but there's very little reason to be a primary mesmer. Maybe that's where the buffing needs to go - into beefing up the useless Fast Casting primary attribute?

What? No the real problem with being a mesmer in RA is because it's pointless. Your team might be filled with stupid wammos who can't capitalize on the disruptions. After all, mesmers are seen in TA. Not a big mystery.

No, mesmers can't be anti-everything in one go or they'd be too powerful. And no, SS, SV, insidious parasite, empathy etc. does not stop a person and merely punishes them for doing a certain action. SS on a warrior may not stop him from killing you or a team mate with an eviscerate spike especially if the opposing monk is on the ball. Blackout will ensure he just lost his adrenaline build up and can't proceed with the spike. Have you stopped to think about why mesmers are high priority targets by the enemy team?

Another no - in most cases hex removal can't keep up with mesmer hexes unless they keep a copy of convert hexes on an off monk or are running elite hex removal. Even then, they probably can't keep everyone clean but they will at least get rid of the important hexes that are causing them problems. There are some steps you can take to make sure they are expending more energy though to do so:
1. Strip veil with shatter or drain enchant.
2. Cast hexes.
3. Interrupt veil and other spells or drain it as soon as they complete it.
4. ?????
5. Profit.

Is fast casting weak? Probably. Adding signet support helped a bit only to find a few signet times were increased in response in the same release if I remember correctly. Some of the interrupt spells can be used without FC or at least not very many points. Others benefit from it though such as clumsiness but unless you are running mantra of recovery (though most likely even with it), FC probably won't where you first stick your points.

In that case I am a necro, but I'd like to cause good shutdown too.
So I'm yealous of [skill=text]Psychic Instability[/skill] opposed to [skill=text]Soul Bind[/skill], it is obviously able to knockdown more often.
And [wiki]Sum of All Fears[/wiki] and [skill=text]Arcane Conundrum[/skill] are much more effective at slowing damage output than [skill=text]Shadow of Fear[/skill] or [skill=text]FaintHeartedness[/skill].

Put simply, Curses and mesmers have similarities, perhaps that is a mistake on Anets part.
However, curses is mostly damage, it lacks good shutdown.
Mesmers can make a foe harmless and kill them at the same time, that is where their power lies.

A power that is useful in PvP but in PvE it needs a buff;
I vouch for AoE shutdown, instead of all the damage boosts that just make mesmers more like curses necro's, make mesmers like mesmers, boost them so their PvE skills can protect their team, instead of just hinder a insignificant 1 out of 20 foes.
Make [wiki]Sum of All Fears[/wiki] AoE
Make an elite 5 energy quicker recharging version of [skill=text]Cry of Frustration[/skill](Foes go "Shazbot!")
Bring [skill=text]Power Block[/skill] on par with [skill=text]Xinrae's Weapon[/skill] as the same profs of 1 mob always have the same skills, but can have 3 or 4 attributes at 18 or sumsuch.
And change [skill=text]Spirit of Failure[/skill] so it is spammable again, just make the miss chance 9...21...25 or sum such, so it will require reasonable investment, miss chance is a much better defense than blocking, but this skill can't be used defensively anymore as the person you want to protect will definitely be dead by the time you finish casting it.

I like the fact alot of people think, they ARE a mesmer, ARE a necro, ARE a warrior.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Numa Pompilius Mesmer survivability is the lowest of any profession I've tried.

Don't blame the profession, blame the terrible Monks.

Your understanding of the Mesmer profession is pretty limited, judging by your statements on the subject thus far.

Agree on Faint, not on Shadow.
In a lot of parts Shadow is better since it's AoE and PvE seems to be about groups of foes.

Let's first take a look at the most used T/N/H build.
We have a tank (most probably some form of terra tank).
Why? To make sure all damage is focussed on one heavy protected target.
A minion master has the same kind of role. Minions prevent that players are hit. The damage the minions do is bonus.
Then we have a nuker. The most common nukers I am familair with are the SF/SH ele and the SS necro.
Their role is not pure damage dealing, but also shutdown.
MS is great AoE shutdown on a balled group. And a lot of necro's use Reckless Haste, which also counts as shutdown.
The last role is the healer. The main task is to prevent too much damage on the tank and at keeping the red bars up bu preventing them going down or healing them up.


Now we take a more balanced group to the same areas.
What we would need there is:
Damage migration, AoE shutdown and AoE damage.
That can be done by other means than the T/N/H setup but you would still need a strong frontline to prevent the backline.
So probably 2 warriors or maybe specific Dervish build.
What we would need next is more protection of the backline.
The whole defense of the T/N/H team is the tank. The rest of the team, excluding the healers, can focus on pure offense with MS as shutdown skill.
Changing the team would mean taking out a lot of offensive skills and put more defensive ones in. SY para can be part of that
You'd also take some of those mob-shattering skills. A foe in Maelstrom can't get a spell off but will try to run out of it. Melee standing in Eruption is no threat, but will run away. Bad when you tank, not so bad when you want to protect yourself. Afraid of interrupts? There are counters for that.

The main difference would be actually killing the foes.
When the foes make a nice ball around the tank, the team's nuking DPS is huge. You can't easily achieve the same DPS by playing any other way.
So you will probably be slower killing the foes which means more threat for the team.
You can't PUG anymore, can't H&H. You need good human players and a lot of coordination. Learn to play the whole level again.
Learn the weakness of each mob (there are, but they don't matter when tanking them) and adjust the team to the most optimal build.
Then you learn to play that team build better and speed up.

But even in these kind of teams the mesmer and assassin would have a marginal role.
The necro benefits from larger groups (more energy gain), the elemetalist has better AoE damage prevention, the Rt could place defensive spirits out of range of the foes. Ranger could migrate damage with traps.
The main role for the assassin could be taking out a single critical caster and the main for the mesmer could be shutdown of a single critical foe.
The moment there are 2 or 3 of those in a group they would have a hard time and they could better be replaced with raw damage or AoE damage prevention.

Now why does no-one ever play these kinds of builds?
Well, some do. But you will never see them outside guild/friends or alliance.
And even most guild teams follow the T/N/H team setup. Or Ursan.
Because that team works, requires no more effort than learning to play it which is not that hard and it gets things done.
Why spend weeks to make a team that is 1 hour faster in (full) Slavers?
The only reasons I can think of is that you want to be the ultimate Slaver's guild. Or like a challenge. As long as people play for profit, loot and titles they will stick to the T/N/H team.

Mesmers shine at psychological warfare between themselves and their opponent which is why their use of skills can turn around a PvP match. Some of their skills are simply golden.

The problems with mesmers in PvE is that there is no psychological interaction between the player's Mesmer and an AI controlled monster. PvE demands more of the well-known 'tanking' 'nuking' and healing to succeed rather than degen pressure, interrupts and shutdown. Neither of those 3 tactics are useless, per se, but there are more straightforward pug-friendly alternatives in PvE.

Rather than buffing Mesmers, I'd prefer it if they made the AI smarter with better skill bars and it might create a need for Mesmer techniques.

Stolen Speed - Hex Spell. target foe's next 1...2 spells takes 50% longer to cast and your next spell targeting that foe takes 50% less time to cast.

Increase recharge to 5-8 seconds?

Just a thought.

T/N/H is actually the most planned team build, not the most used team build.
When people just get some guildies together for some help, they often end up with:

Puller(Any physical, at times an acceptable tank, but usually not)
Nuker/Breaker(Breaker because they protect by making foes spread out)
Shutdown(The lack of a good tank makes warders, barrage/preparation interrupts, SY war/para, non-channeling spirit spam necessary)
Healer(/duh)

Which is also often what you end up with when you play a non-tank in H&H, so there is no need to practice for any1.

Note that there is no mesmer in there!
I think that it is disturbing that a elementalist is preferred over a mesmer for the job of shutdown.

While I agree mesmers lack a place in the T/N/H too and that boosting their AoE damage should let them in with the nukers, but will mess up the balance they need for PvP, leading to mesmers their shutdown being nerfed instead of buffed. Then all mesmers would do in PvP is just fastcast Arragodon's Gaze.

there is only one problem with the mesmer. Its more useful as a secondary than a primary. thus it can be exploited

Necros are anti melee and mesmer are more shutdown & have anti cast abilities. I never understood why mesmer never got an ss like skill against spells (Backfire deals dmg to a singe target only & Mistrust only works on the next spell and has 20 recharge.)
[skill]Panic[/skill] deals aoe dmg but it's a counter against stupid signets, wtf. Imo it should have been a counter to spells since day one: Panic: For 5-17 seconds, target foe and all nearby take xx damage whenever they cast a Spell or use a Signet.

You, sir, should learn to play instead of blaming Monks like someone who just opened their Prophecies box a week ago.

Anet should have a think about it. From proph to factions there werent a problem with mesmers since it was more or less single foes areas, not a bunch of 20000 summits or 2000 destroyers caused mesmers to be liked. This problem really needs a solution after all the new dungeons, elite missions, doa...

Empathy is whenever that foe attacks, SS is attacks or uses a skill. They are very different.

I know Distortion was incredibly powerful the way it was, but I really feel it allowed mesmers to function as a stronger split character. I think it deserves a revert or slight buff.

I don't see how it is?

If you have a healer in the skirmish, and a mesmer whose bar has no survivability skills, why wouldn't you heal them???