Rare Minipets

The answer of work for it is true... to a degree... but this does not apply to the super high end market.

When you see ppl buying mini-polar bears for 1500 armbraces+ then that hasn't been worked for it has been exploited and wasn't caught, same can be said on most high end trades nowadays.

No one can work for that amount of armbraces (do the math it is impossible inside of 4 years of 10 quadruns per day) and no one can work for a similar amount in ectos (nearly 80,000) there simply shouldn't be anywhere near as much money in the game as there is, the only reason there is is from duping and a lot of those were simply never caught.

I have made a few million in the 8 months I have been playing but understand just how hard it is to work to make money in game.

Rares are rare for a reason and I agree that there should be rares, unfortunately the rares are now at a price that will simply never be acheived by honest players.

ya and the reason to do it is, because uncomplete collections are senseless, when you start collectign somethign, then it makes only sense, when you collect really all parts, until you have all...

the fact is: as the rare minipets are now.. they are unfair, because they ARE limited, theres no chance for collectors to get one, when when you not had the chance to participate on one of those contest or living in taiwan ect.

All i want for fairness is having ingame somehow a chance to work for those minipets, without getting forced to powerfarm for ages.
A small chance to get these pets ingame, which makes them "theoretically" unlimited.

Like mithran suggested.. let them drop out of Chests from Elite Areas/Dungeon, or let the equivalent creatures drop them at low rare...
the rest, wehich have no equivanten creatures can be made then through long and hard moa bird similar crafting quests, which take for as example more than 10x the time effort, as the quest for the moa bird...

Or make some of them the new 3rd year birthday presents... for example grawl, yeti, naga, oni, shiroken sin, vizu, kanaxai and the polar bear could be parts of the upcoming 3rd year presents

And for the lost of super rare minipets, which will decrease then in value, due to becomign alot more coming, anet can implement new super rare materials as alternative so that the hardcores receive something new uber rare for powertrading and farmign for ect.


Really... don't you think not too, that in kind of gameplay - that it makes alot more FUN, when you do for those mentioned minipets moa similar craftign quests, then to grind for ages the platin and the ectos to receive a SMALL chance, that after all that insane effort you will eventually find someone, who will sell to you an undedicated uber rare limited minipet ???

forget that..the chance to find such people reduces over time more and more to 0% ...


People can easily collect all Elite Armors for the HoM without any stupid limitation problems, they can easily collect all Destroyer Weapons for their HoM without any problems like stupid limitations...they can collect all 25 randomous armor remnants for heroes without any stupid limitation problems, they can collect any wanted title without any braindead limitation problems ..

SO WHY THE **** must naturally have Minipets such god damn braindead limitation problems for people, which have the goal to PERFECTIONIZE their hall of Monuments...
Can you understand, what it means to perfectionzie your Hall ? or won't people understand this, because they fear to lose some stupid items, which can make them instant uber rich oO ...

I can't really understand it, why it must be the minipets, which should be so uber rare >.>
Wtf can't it be something else, what is total uninteresting for collectors and has nothing to do with the HoM ?????


My suggestion of implementing 3 new uber rare materials for PvE Character Improvement would be imo the ideal solution to this problem (as long those benefits get resetted, when you go with such an improved PvE-Chara into PvP to keep them balanced naturally)

I'm sure, it is for Hardcore Gamers alot more interesting, to use their richness to make their PvE-Characters for PvE stronger, thus becoming more and more able to play Solo, then to use their richness to become only much more rich, until they reach sooner or later the point of becoming unable to become more rich, cause of having everything total full until the limits.
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I can only agree to Onyx

[QUOTE]another whine to match TW

they are rare because everybody cant have one.

look at the elitests screaming because ANET made it easier for more people to have nice things.

typical recent whine.....all i see are poeple in elite armor so how can i show off i am better/worked harder than they did

everybody cant have a rare and if it was available to all you wouldnt want it.

and how many in tiawan didnt get one either????????

Eh... no... they are Rare because Anet has decided to make them rare.

It's normal that just 1 out of x people get a green miniature.

What it should be it's a wahy to remove them (like custmization with weapons) while having another source of them.


But eepen the amounts of each rarity:
- A lof of white ones.
- Some purple ones.
- Few gold ones.
- A little few green ones.

every1 pls listen to mithran he/she has it right and thers really not much arguing with her/him....this time

[QUOTE=Loviatar]gotta agree with that. if they make these "rare" mini pet drop so easily then theyll just be mini pet, not rare anymore.

[QUOTE=PinoyRurik]OK, this has been skewed way out of proportion, the OP suggestion was not "Give every GW account a free uber rare minipet!" It was more along the lines of "Give the Zaishen Chest a 0.0001% chance to spawn a rare minipet"

It will not be an "easy" drop, and it would not be a "common" drop. Mini Pandas won't flow from the chest like Firewaters.

[QUOTE=Kanyatta]I agree, aslong as it is a pretty rare drop (like the everlasting beatle tonic or somthing) from Zaishen chest, or similar to the Ghostley hero drop rate, i wouldnt mind. I wouldnt never want rare mini values to drop below what they are now, but atleast make it so that once tonnes are dedicated, there are still new ones coming in. Besides, they give people like me a source of income (buying and reselling for ecto profits) .

BTW i was at international dis. Kamadan when gaile talked about non-bday mini's, and how we'll soon have another chance at getting them .

Hmm

1 thing, they said they'd add an ultra rare item that's never been seen ingame.

For all we know, it could be a new minipet.

But, I would like a chance, just a small chance from the Z-chest. That's all.

/signed sort of

[QUOTE=Loviatar]

How wrong you are, i wouldnt care if more of these pets where more common, I WANT ONE. I am a minipet collector and its BS that they make half of them so unattainable. OP = good idea

If there wasnt xunlai house tournament... Maybe. But people abuse xunlai house tournament and get so many zkeys for free. That is not earning them whatsoever. Learn to make money and save up for a rare mini. They are hard to come by but there doesnt need to be anymore added. By the way, I dont personally have one. But by adding this silly idea prices would drop and people would abuse xunlai house tournament even more.

Unlike armor anymore this actually sets the elitests apart. And by the way, if everyone had them no one would want them. Look at ele swords. Perfect example. Enough said

/unsigned.

Well this thread seems to go to hell fast. Nice moderation since it states "constructive" in the sticky. Instead of reading about Epeens and people who dont care about mini pets at all, flaming of ideas and insults of people...put this to a vote.

The truly high end mini pets are rare for a reason, to create a desirable 'limited resource' that can be used as a prestige item... the reasoning behind them is sound, but they are well beyond the amount of money even the most dedicated farmer could hope to earn now days.

The fault isn't with the rareness of the mini's themselves, that is actually a good thing, nor the method of originally obtaining them (though it could have been better) the problem is the high end market inflation that resulted from armbrace duping, a legacy that Arenanet could never undo, and that still plagues the games high end even now.

Adding the ultra rare mini pets to the Zaishen chest with abysmally low drop rates might work, hell, it would be interesting... and it would mostly be putting the most expensive commodities this game has to offer into the hands of the people with 10-20+ accounts solely for the sake of XTH profiteering. ie. No solution at all.

Truthfully, GW is dead, let it go. The best we can hope for is that the devs have learned from all the small mistakes and missteps made in GW1, and will not repeat those errors in GW2.

Yeah TL: DR, I know.

Stop crying. If you want something bad enough you can go work for it. People who have the real high end crap worked hard for it. Why should you get it because you said it was unfair? Too bad if you want a panda if you really wanted one you wouldnt be posting nonsence threads youd be out trying to get one

This coming from some PVE scrub in DF. Did you buy an invite there or did you just join with all the other bad HAers/pvers. The fact of the matter is, to generalize, people like you are all about the money. If you wanted you could buy an enormous amount of champs or fame, or even a gold cape. While this may enlarge your e-pene... you are still bad. All these people are saying is that they want a very very small chance of getting a rare mini. The distribution system for them was unfair - done by specific regions - and now the only way to acquire them is through obscene amounts of money. I'm sure if 10 more of them were introduced in game, your epene wouldn't shrink too much. You already have a strong gold cape, which you honorably earned, and I'm sure you are so "good" at GW that you can handle a few other people having some nice items.

Just becasue people like you want things done the easy way AND YOU DONT WANT TO WORK FOR ANYTHING doesnt mean anet should add more minis if you want a ded panda THEN GO GET 5,000-6,000E why should more be added because you want one? they shouldnt so get over yourselves.
"all the people want is a small chance of getting one"
PEOPLE abuse the system theyll do runs for 23 hours do get the mini then the mini drops in price. Everthing has lost value in GW due to the fact that EVERYONE has to have EVERYTHING. Just because some players are smart and know how to make money doesnt make it right for other to have a shot at that mini. If you want something work for it. How would people feel if anet implemented this: every month 10 lucky people Get Maxed Gods title. Now you got all the people who spent years getting theirs upset. You dont need these minis you want them. Just because u want something dosent mean you need to get it. Hopefully no more minis are added to the game. If you cant find a way to get one or dont want to spend the time you dont deserve it PERIOD.

when did the word rare get another meaning?

Don't talk about people exploiting the system to get mini pets when most of the people who can afford mini pets got their money by exploiting the system.
Some of the richest people I know are as follows:

1. Merchants
2. Champ farmers/Champ-range guild sellers (they make a lot)
3. People who used to scam
4. People who actually earned their money honorably

The first three, who I see commonly in possession of rare minis, made their money very dishonorably. Please don't use the phrases "worked hard" and "earned" for these people. While some of these methods take some smarts, the time these people spent is not proportionate to the money they made, in the same way as the 4th group of people.

your god walking amongst argument is very weak btw. Unlike the acquisition of money, that title takes far more grinding. Therefore, giving it out would be incredibly more unfair. Money works functionally different than titles, remember that.

What I believe is a good system is the one used mini polar bear. Sure it encourages rampant farming, but many of the people who own them have done thousands of runs...I give more credit to someone who did 1k runs for a mini polar bear than to some fgt who bought some ectos with 800 dollars and then acquired it. And in the case of the mini polar bear, the drop rate is still so low that it is a very rare item, and is still very expensive (to the average player). I don't believe adding a fractional chance of acquiring a panda in game would kill the prices too much anyway. I would rather see some average joe get very very very very lucky and get a polar bear, than someone who sold champs and bought one.

BTW, I could careless if I had a mini panda or not. I just believe this system gives access of these high end pets to people who don't want to engage in dishonorable money making practices, or who didn't happen to be Taiwanese.

It is your attitude that screws up the game imo. You have loads of money, and you believe it entitles you to everything. Are you chiizu? If not, then I don't think you deserve a DF gold cape right now. You didn't "earn" it through honorable gvg, but you simply bought it. So once again don't talk about rich people deserving these pets because I'm sure your money has given you titles and luxuries that you shouldn't have, due to the fact that you are a scrubby player.

1) if you must give out minis make a new mini and give that out because even if you think a small chance wont destroy the minis pandas value, your mistaken.

Next ive noticed a Jab at the Merchants. If you dont mind i would ask that you explain one thing. How are you going to tell me that people who actually take the time to get the correct value of an item down and go out and buy if off people who are to ignorant to get it PC'd or to even care is Not-Honorable method of playing the game?
If i take the time to to learn that item X is worth 400e but the noob next to me dosent care and wants to get 100e for it i see nothing wrong with that.

My final argument is this. You claim that people who want a rare mini should have an opportunity to get one. These people dont want to spend the time to get the money fine. They dont want to farm fine, they dont really want to do anthing but get the mini. If there is someone who wants to be in a gold trim cape with out going through the hassel of forming a guild then teaching all there members how to pay gvg and to actually win a tornament i see no reason why they cant buy into one. They like the way it looks, it seperates then from the avg Joe. I see nothing different in the argument u make between one being handed a Panda. And one buying into a Gold trimmed guild. On one hand you say give the panda to Joe who does nothing, on the other you say that It is scummy to just buy into a gold trim guild. I would thus ask that you make your mind up. You fight for the rights of a player to be given a panda for free and yet fight against those who wish to be in a guild with out doing much of anything. I see them as the same thing. People dont want to do any of the hard work but they want the rewards.
I feel you are either a Commy or A hypocrite. ><

At this point in the economy, the only way you can be wealthy is to simply get lucky

Next ive noticed a Jab at the Merchants. If you dont mind i would ask that you explain one thing. How are you going to tell me that people who actually take the time to get the correct value of an item down and go out and buy if off people who are to ignorant to get it PC'd or to even care is Not-Honorable method of playing the game?
If i take the time to to learn that item X is worth 400e but the noob next to me dosent care and wants to get 100e for it i see nothing wrong with that.



i may be misunderstanding what you are saying here. but the honorable thing would be to tell the noob next to you that the item in question is worth 400e instead of leaving him ignorant and making 300e off of that. the top portion of my post is a quote from island guardian on the previous page.

Im not gonna babbysite these noobs if they dont spend time to look at prices its thier fault. And so i make profit

Ughhhh...I had a really well written reply, but then there was a database error -.-. So here it goes again. Firstly, I know my argument sounds Communist, but in reality I am the most free market, neoclassical guy, so coming from me, this is a little weird.

So to clarify:

I am talking about a very low frequency of introduced minis. While they would lower the aggregate price, the only people that would really get hurt would be the people merchanting them. Furthermore, if this change was made in the form of having them dropped from the zchest, than it would benefit rich people more anyway. Yes some people who didn't "deserve" them would have possession, but I do not think their would be many negative implications (more on this later).

Moreover, my argument is not hypocritical because it rests on the assumption that merchanting is not a difficult or skillful way to make money. In this way, the acquisition of pandas through merchanting, does not mean the player really "deserved" them. I know many players who are shit at GW - they have absolutely no skill, knowledge of tactics, coordination, timing, ect; yet despite being terrible they are absolutely loaded. Sure, as aforementioned, it takes some smarts and knowledge of prices to merchant, but I do not believe that it is that complex of a skill that it merits the owning of a panda. It's essentially a get rich quick scheme.

Now, let's compare this to the acquisition of a gold cape. It is not so simply "the hassle of forming a team" that wins a gold cape, as you put it. Rather, winning a gold cape requires an incredible amount of player skill and team coordination (rawr is not going to beaten anytime soon). Unlike merchanting, a gold cape requires innate ability and reflexes, as well as a much more intense commitment to the game.

So what is worse:

A bad player buying his way into a gold trimmed guild, or a good player having the very very very small chance of getting a panda, which doesn't take any skill or grind to obtain, but rather loads of money. Money can buy pandas...you can't bride anet to give you a gold cape - you actually need skill for that.

This being said, I can predict your rebuttal: "if merchanting doesn't require player skill, then why don't more people become rich enough to afford a panda" (of course if this were to happen then the price of the panda would go up, so let's assume it is static). Quite simply, in response, not that many people want to merchant. While it doesn't much skill to do, many would rather play the game to have fun and to improve their skills. Believe it or not, people actually try to improve their skills and work hard to get better, rather than buying their way into guilds, and not becoming better players. It is ironic then, that players can ultimately gain great prestige by merchanting, an act which requires very little player skill.

Now let's talk more specifically about the impact of rich pvers on the pvp community. While they do put money in peoples' pockets, they have essentially made the entire pvp community worse off. Because of people like you who buy their way into guilds and buy champs, ladder manipulation has increased in prevalence as the demand has gone up. Moreover, gvg in particular has been corrupted, and champ points have been greatly devalued. Money, it is thought by people like you, can buy you skill. If more pandas were added to guild wars, would the pve community be corrupted - no. Sure it would piss off some rich merchants (who probably are bad at GW), but in general, it would give some good players the opportunity to get some unique items.

In summary, I don't consider you a good player for memorizing some prices, and I don't believe merchanting is a very admirable skill. You can make money by taking advantage of noobs, but does that show player skill in any way - no. I hate seeing bad people with Pandas. On the other hand, you have a gold cape...just like Polly, who has led rawr to a ridiculous number of gold capes, and is a fantastic player. Quite simply, who would I rather see with a panda and the cape: polly.

JUST because some one is rich dosent make them a bad player so STOP hinting at that your not funny. Second In stead of playing for 50000 hours and farming uw and getting 1 eternal blade per month if i make good use of my time so be it because i can make more per hour than the average player can farm. You do realizes your talking about a game? i dont think the avg Joe sets aside 1-2 hours to "train" and get thier skills better. Did you pay some one to have ur guild in all japanese? reguardless you think that money is so worthless than why do the highest lvl of pvpers the GVGers win money as a reward for being good. You have changed the topic so far form adding minis to Defacing the smart Merchant. Minis shouldnt be added Because plp cry period. The reason some of the now highend minis were added was because America and Euro got minis while they Asian region was left out. What makes one better than another in Guildwars? thier titles? no any one can grind titles? thier minis- no any on can grind cash. Thier guild-no any one can put together a solid build and give Rawr a run for thier money so i ask you what Defines a leet player and what depfines a noob?

From this statement I have concluded that you are bad at this game, strengthening my argument. I'm pretty sure the entire pvp community would disagree with you on this one. This isn't merchanting we are talking about, guilds like these train for hours upon hours a day. I actually am in utter shock that you made this statement...utter shock.

Also, I have deduced that you are very unintelligent because you do not understand my argument. It is not money I have a problem with - I do not think it's useless - but rather, it is merchanting that I have a problem with. You seem to get the two confused. I'm arguing merchanting takes very little skill or grind, which you don't dispute. I never make a connection between wealthy people and being bad at the game. I merely point out many merchants are usually not good because you don't need much talent to be one, and they are tempted to buy themselves prestige, instead of actually earning it.

These observations were made in order to make the point that the people in possession of Pandas, are more than likely undeserving of them, and that adding a few to the game would give good people a small chance of acquiring them.

i agree that rare min-pets should be implemented with uber rare drop rate that allows no more than a few to drop a month. hell, they can even make it to were the chances of one dropping are shut-off after a certain un-disclosed quota is met per month. that way everyone spams keys right after the update every month, lol.

Zaishen Chest is what destroyed the value of many things. Some Minipets were created to be special unique rewards existing in a very limited number, and they should stay that way or their status will change completely. And that 1 chest shouldn't be a way to get everything, maybe there was a reason that it doesn't drop any minipets at all.

I'd like more if they added a superrare mini with a ridiculously low droprate to the end of The Deep / Urgoz chests, as even after many updates making their average drops very nice they still cannot drop anything of high value at all to make up for their elite status. A tiny tiny chance for something awesome could revive those dead areas, as the psychological effect which made people do thousands of Mini Polar Bear runs is stronger than cold calculation of average expected returns. But if say a Mini Island Guardian could drop from Urgoz chest with so ridiculously low chance that even if the area became as heavily farmed as UWSC is now (thats just impossible) it would drop maybe 2x in a whole year, and still it's status would change in many people's minds - it would become a "PvE farmable pet" instead of "Limited - not available for many years". And that's the problem.
But oh, what if they already can drop there, maybe with the same chance as getting an Everlasting Yuletide from FoW chest? We will never know, lol, as the areas are completely dead xD

Oh, and big lolz for calling GW an item-based game because of expensive minis :hahaha:

I think because so many of the ultra rare pets have now been either dedicated/ removed from the game(duping)/ no longer available (on"dead" accounts) or hoarded, then it seems reasonable to trickle feed ones in through the z chest.
/signed

The only good rarity I know is 'rarity over time'.
Let them be ultra rare for 3 or 5 years, and after that add another way to acquire them without limitation, but for a price or effort.

That way people have their exclusive stuff for some time, but since everything devalues over time, same would rarity of those items.
It already happens with almost everything else in the game.

im sorry when has the panda dropped in value?

Didn't the launch of Nightfall add 110 mini Pandas to the game (well, for the Taiwanese players anyhow)? In any normal economy going from a rarity of 16 in game to 126 in game would lower their value, but then GW's highend is dominated by Dupers, those who profit from dupers and scammers, so probably not.

Don't you have this backwards? The European magazine minipet give away and the American Minipet Madness competitions were because Asian regions (Japan and Taiwan) had been given almost all of the rare minipets previously.

Oh, wow, a thread rezzed from over a year ago to say that we still don't support it and to bash each other. gg.

My post from a year ago stands - rare items are rare for a reason.

the definition of what is rare and what is unobtainable is the issue though I think - even more so a year down the line - think Ive seen 1 panda for sale in the past year and the last Kanaxai(sp - cant be bothered looking it up) I know being sold was the one I sold maybe 2+years ago now.
If there were always the same in the game at any point in time it would be ok, but does anyone really know how many were removed with the duping bans before?

i think that they should be as rare if not more rare then everlasting tonics and i also think that they shouldn't be added to the zchest but the hall of heroes chest seeing as its a lot harder to get to and it would make more people play OR they could fix up ye old tomes and add a end chest that would drop them.... though adding them to the zchest would raise the price of zkeys which would make me happy.

I LOLED wut are you talking about Oh you mean your shity "perfect" weapons in ph that dont have an inscription?