Monks in Hell's Precipice

No, actually. Elitism is about entitlement; simply thinking you are better than others doesn't make you elitist.

In any case, there's nothing particularly elitist about what's going on in HP. As I said, there's no reason for a team to gimp themselves by taking players with non-optimal bars. That's common sense, not elitism.

The problem is that the substandard players are the ones that might want to pay for a monk. They might not even do well with a good monk. This could then be blamed on you. Not the best in game money making method.

H/H HP ftw. Really the only profession that you may struggle with that method would be as a monk yourself. I have now completed it on 6 of my chars H/H without any deaths. Typically my team is only Livia and 1 monk henchie healer

stop sucking and use paragons

they're on fire+TNTF = GG mission

No need to use the lame ass Imbagon build either.

lol, the most recent time i did it we had sor x2, imbagon, cruel spear, ele with ward harm and random water hexes, rt w/ splinter etc, me, and a smite monk. pew pew

I felt like doing that mission with actual players for a change, we had a monk, he was annoying, and a bad monk.

He: I'll leave soon, damn noobs! you all suck!
Me: Then leave...
He: I will if you say that again! then you're all gonna have to start over!!
Me: Leave...?
He: has left the game.

We complete the mission 2 mins later.

gg.

hero ranger with winter and greater conflagration.

h/h monks all you need.

2 or 3 hero monks are superior than the average drone players that are out there, particularly the quality in the post ursan/dead era of GW.

Having said that offering monk services for hire is far less offensive than most of the scams going on at Spamadan.

I'd charge triple for ursan groups though - they are more difficult to listen to.

Winter is bugged right now. No point in bringing it for Hell's until it's fixed.

Winter has been screwed since 2004

QFT

I'll take Alesia before I pay for some PUG monk of unkown skill/maturity/ability to waste my time.

Work great. Granted, I am running a rit, so I'm crapping extra defense and explody splinter weapons all over the place. I have no idea how it would work for different classes, but I've found that most of the popular PvE builds don't synch quite as well with a rit - sabway favors caster heavy builds, massed paras favor physicals. Rits are a caster class that relies on heavy physicals, so there's a slight problem with both of those.

It is to bad because Alesia isn't in Hell's Precipce you are stuck with Mhenlo who still isn't as good as Alesia.You never know how good that PuG Monk might be and it is a team decision not just yours.The reason why Monk don't have to do this mission for the most part is that there is no elite skill in it for them and most had to go and cap restore conditions using before heros just using henchies.The same could be said for shield of deflection.It took me 10 times on my second Monk to cap this skill although the group was willing to pay I refused but they weren't willing to help me cap SoD.My boss wasn't spawning.

If I had a choice between a player monk and a henchie monk, I would take the henchie monk every time. Heroes are even better. I'v seen a few (3-4) monk players that knew what they were doing and kept the group alive in other missions, But over the years I'v noticed a serious lack of know how with monks.

People talk smack about wamo's but monks are the true noob profession.
The problem is they only know how to 55 with no skill in healing or support at all. Someone needs to post a video on Utube on how to heal properly so all these monk players can learn how to do it, Just like they learned how to 55. (Utubienoobies)

I will agree with you on some of your Points but not all as there are a lot of good Monks in the game but they are doing others thing like hmm GvG perhaps or HA/TA.Why would they want to go and Monk for you and the ones that are struggling sure they are farmers but went about learning their roles the wrong way.

They get runs and get power lvled and go get and ascended this is not their main char it is their 3rd or 4th char.Yes they made it up for farming but not all 55ers are bad at Monkng as most would rather do that than Monk a pug group that have bad bars and if the mission goes south they blame the Monk.Monk is by far not the noob prof. in the game.

Heh. I won't even 'monk' for my heroes/hench anymore, let alone a PUG. Every now and then, if I am feeling very masochistic, I will monk with a PUG, but for the most part I just go smite and let either heroes or hench handle the healing for the party.

Anyway, the first thing that I thought of when I saw the topic for this thread was the monk strike. That was funny stuff back when it happened.

If you can get someone to actually pay for your help, then good for you. You'd deserve to be paid to help someone who can't do this with Mhenlo and Lina. Course, that's only if you actually help. If you leave half way or something then that's just scamming.

How can there be a shortage of monks?

Heros are there for a reason

Very much so - back a few pages ago someone else mentioned the Monk Strike and I said, given that people still blame heroes. I was informed that had *nothing* to do with it. Well, no, the strike in and itself didn't cause it but the *attitude* of it did. The general attitude was "Do what I say or I will take my ball and go home" - they were then told to "go home". That wasn't just confined to Monks, however they tended to be some of the worst at it. There is the same attitude with charging someone to play the game with them - *that* is what killed PUGs. People had forgotten the "group" part and PUGS had been on a steady decline for some time, the amusing outcome of the strike was that when forced to use the AI many realized how horrid the human monks were in general and that they *could* tell them to take their ball home, that they no longer needed to put up with the crap.

All heroes ever did was give people something else to do besides quit the game (and is largely why Anet put them in there). Heroes are not that good, a decent group of players (even if they are random people/classes) are MUCH easier to play than a full hero team would be - there is a reason that even before heroes were released the majority of the community had switched to the AI or quit and it all came down to PUGS were *not* fun.

So, again, to the OP question there is nothing wrong per se with charging (or going on strike or many of the outward signs of being a prima donna), especially true if you are actually that good. However, community wise, it is a recipe for failure, especially when those prima donna's can't play the game and are mostly blaming others for their failures. You can find the ones on this thread that *still* believe that a monk has the right to dictate such things when even Alesia and Mhenlo proves that they are incorrect (and I note those are mostly the people who hate the AI being there). Those people are not going to be fun to play with regardless of the character they play.

Wow, I can't believe that people are still going on about the monk strike.

OP, is there anything wrong with charging for it? No. If people feel the need to pay for a real monk to do the mission there is no reason you shouldn't make a quick quid off it. Do I think there are many players who will take you up on your offer? No. Why? Heroes, and the abundance of bad monks. Generally speaking only bad monks pug nowdays. Why? Most good or even average monks won't pug. Most monks got sick of the abuse players heaped on them because they couldn't heal the wammo who used spirit to get two aggro bubbles ahead and then activated frenzy and heal sig. And before anyone says no one uses frenzy and heal sig anymore - a brave guildie who decided to monk HP the other day discovered differently, the wammo in question had orison, mending, and "charge" for good measure.

Charge money if you want, but understand this - you charge money to put up with bad attitudes (though not necessarily bad players). If you want to be blamed for everything from the state of the weather to the rise of Hitler and/or white supremecy you'd best hope the money you make off it is worth it.

Umm who died and left you god of the definition of Elitsim bud? I say what I say it is and that's what the majority think it is anyways not your ELITIST definition. See folks this is a pure example of an Elitist attitude he feels HIS definition is the ONLY definition of Elitist. Proves my point to a tee. See, I didn't say NO your definition is wrong like he did, I merely gave the definition of what I've heard many others compare Elitism to and it's mostly about attitudes, arrogance, better than you are type players, much like that poster and his definition.

This is all fine and dandy untill you find out how bad their heros bars and I have seen some real winners out there.They don't know anything about Monking or how to put together a solid build or ones that herso can actually play without spamming the heck out certain skill like PoS Tahlk. spams it like no tomorrow and when it is not needed.It would be nice if Hench Monks were correct from capable Monks that know better.

I refine my bars every once a month maybe 2 or if there is a skill balance they can't Henchies as well as those with heros don't bother.

if you need a human monk here - then youre doing it wrong and need to L2P.

I used to charge up to 35k for this mission which I ran with hero/hench. But that was when heros were just introduced and not many people mastered the use of it.

Good times back then

LBS use to charge 250k for RoF missions back in the day.

You can charge whatever you want to run the mission, but Tahlkora and Dunkoro are always ready to do it for free and best of all they never complain threaten to leave the game while doing the mission.

Except it's not 'my' definition, it's the definition that's in the dictionary. You know, the general authority on what words actually mean? Try looking in it before you go off on how other people are pushing 'their own' definitions on other people - which, ironically, is exactly what you're trying to do here.

I also like how you don't bother to address my main point - that kicking people from your party for bad bars is the common sense thing to do regardless of what your definition of 'elitism' is.

And yet, even then many - if not most - still find it better than playing with a bunch of whiners and monks who refuse to heal you because they think they should be able to tell everyone how to play. Even worse was when they wanted to charge for that "service".

Which, again, comes back to the same answer given the OP several times. There is nothing wrong with that per se - it just isn't going to work out the way you want it too. It either drives people away from the game or right into the AI (especially true once they realize that the AI does good enough that they can beat all the missions in the game - even with those really crappy skill bars or the hench). If they are failing a human monk or a better skill bar on their hero isn't going to fix it.

I just logged into HP a few minutes ago (last mission I need on that character for her protector titles) and saw at least three separate monks spamming LFG. My guess is that the OP will not really get much in the way of gold for monking said mission. The good ole' days were ruined because so many wanted to charge gold or dictate everything to the party and drove people to learn to play with the AI.

the so called good old days....i kinda miss em it was funny pissing off the charge monks saying that the 2 monk henchmen could do better than most every other monk. I got some really funny flames on that one and the sad thing was that the monks in factions were actually pretty good.

If they can't manage the mission with just henchies, or heroes thereafter, and they refuse to respec builds, then they have but one option left to them, pay me money.

Then you're just a runner. Get the gold, give the sex, and both parties can go on their happy way.

I often pimp out my monk... I never charge, but I always accept tips. I H/H my way through the game and then let people who can't do that borrow my time and skills.

You could pay a Monk or you can wait for one to do it for free.The Monks that don't charge you please do as they ask if they are experienced like please take res etc..What I am pointing out is that still that an experienced human Monk is far better than AI.I do use AI Monks to get me through some missions but I will give a pug a chance.

The Faction Monks are terrible even the NF ones are.This whole topic though is about real Monks charging would I do it no unless I start getting grief from other players who won't listen to me which forces me and other Monks to over compensate for the lack of experience and bad bars form the party.

Well, to be honest, watching the people in Hell's made me realize how dramatically the player quality in GW has declined.

Ursan for that... brr...

I'm a pretty decent monk in my own opinion; probably not awesome, but I'm okay. Definately not bad (I've taken no abuse for my monking in PUGs, although I do confess I'm picky about PUGs; I watch how people interact in the district before I'll join a group). I personally would not charge for a mission.

Charging for a run? Goodness because you have to do it solo.

Charging for being part of a team? Sure, you could do it, but I will echo that heroes will do the job any day. Dunkoro doesn't have the judgement I do, sure, and he can't listen to player needs as well, but he's got killer reflexes and will suffice in a pinch. If you can get someone to play, that's great! Money's hard to come by. But there's better ways to make money (go get to the end of EotN and do Destroyer runs, for instance)

As for kicking for bad bars... It really depends on the bar and the people. I don't mind a weird bar - I think being creative with skills is a GOOD thing (shocking, I know). If I get a warrior carrying nothing but fire ele skills (too expensive for a warrior energy pool) or an ele with nothing but assassin skills (and no ele skills to speak of), or are spread across 5 attributes (...), I might be a little concerned. But I had a lifestealing Rt in a group a few months back, and one guy left the group laughing at him because he didn't like the bar. Once we were in the mission, I quickly saw that the skill bar worked just fine. Sometimes, something YOU might not think works might be something someone spent months fine tuning and making work. I really doubt any of us could say we know ALL the skills and know in a moment how ALL of them work together.

My policy is if in doubt, ask. If they can explain the benefits and how it works, then it might be worth a try. If it sounds like they dumped random skills into their skillbar, NICELY explain some alternatives and see what they do. If they seem receptive, they might be a perfectly decent player without the same grasp of skills that you have, and maybe just need some teaching (I know from experience that I was one of those players, I loved to play but just didn't have a great grasp on making a good build; someone did take me under their wing to teach me a bit, but they were kind of mean about it sometimes, which I don't think really helps, it just makes people mad). If they pitch a fit and get surly, they're probably not a nice person to play with anyway, and at that point, they're asking to be kicked.

Attitude is everything. Treat people with respect, play with people who treat you with respect. And don't take life so seriously!

(maybe I should finish the S. Shiverpeaks missions and get my butt over to HP to help monk! )