To the vaporware people...

If SW:ToR comes out before GW2, which it seems is a good possibility, then I will be playing that, and if its as fun as KOTOR was then I will probably not buy GW2. Whether or not you consider GW2 to be vaporware, Anet has treated its established fanbase poorly and seems to have no intention of changing that trend.

You can not possibly think that a modern MMO can be finished in 1-2 years. EON was released 1.5 years ago so that's exactly how much they are into GW2. It is true they announced beta for late last year, but I am glad that instead of making "upgraded GW1" they take the time and create an entirely game.

I will answer the first half of the First Question

Currently im not waiting on any new games to come out
But i am looking forward to Star Craft 2

Even though i enjoyed both Diablos and the modded versions of said games i find myself extremely...unexcited about the 3rd franchise of the said game.

GW2 wise..be it in production or be it on hold it is just a game. If it comes it comes if it wont it wont no 1 looses anything from costumer side.

Now before youget started on ?new chapter every 6 month" crap please think of how many 20-40$ games can provide 3 years plus of game time. Now Diablo 2 Starcraft Warcraft 3 etc are Big big titles with what...10years + service....GW compared to them is a 3.5 year old todler...so you comparing these games together puts GW on a unfair field of comparrison. And if you are Comparing these games together it means GW is a hit .

So lets stop comparing a Tank( Diablos Starcraft Warcraft Neverwinter ......)to a Barel with Wheels (GW) not fair right

Ghost Omel

GW2 doesnt exist untill we get to play it

oh and some evidence of its active deleloment would be a start

Vaporware or not some people argument is a bunch of pull.

Someone said they think that devs from anet have been pulled off to work on Aion. Which is stupid people do not get pulled from one company to work for another. Which is what this suggests, now it is possible they may make the choice to quit the job with Arena to go and work for NC, but I for one would not quit a job with a company that is hiring for one that just announced massive layoffs.

For those that keep making comments about the financial standings of NC had you read the full report you would have seen that ArenaNet and a few other subs were the only part of the company making money. It was the projects that NC did by them self that fell to pieces.

And finally for those that say no news. Anet announced that that the beta would not happen in 2008 a few months ago. Yea it sucks and the fact that it may not even happen til 2010 is a bummer, but personally until it goes a decade without information I don't like to slap the vaporware label on it.

GW2 will come out, just wait for it damn it. Be the definition of vaporware whatever it is, 90% of the people here use it implying that the game doesn't and never will exist wich that alone makes me want to murder them for their ignorance.

Guilds Wars 2 will come out, be it next week or next year and even though we haven't seen nothing yet it would only be logical for it to exist for a lot ot reasons previously stated. And not only lying to their comunity for 2 years, but keeping that lie alive promising that they will release some info about it (just not now) is plain and simply stupid. I read these foruns nearly every day and I'm RED ENGINE GORED ENGINE GORED ENGINE GORED ENGINE GOING tired of seeing the same QQ and same stupid vaporware bullshit over and over and over again.

Be patient, I'm here also dying for some info but I understand why they're keeping everything a secret and why they had to annouce it when they did, so I'll keep waiting.

I RED ENGINE GORED ENGINE GORED ENGINE GORED ENGINE GOing love you. Read this and stop making these useless threads.

Or probably they're just being realist.

Wait, look at this. Look, Duke Nukem Forever has an official website too! Fansites! And a developing team! It even has SCREENSHOTS!!! ...and it's the epitome of vaporware. Since 1997...

Nobody really believes it will ever see the light of the day, and 3DRealms has even published screenshots and trailers, which never happened with GW2, go figure. Even if it comes out now, DN4E will need to live up to the expectations raised in 11 years of waiting.

"Vaporware" is not such a negative term as you seem to believe. It's a label often stick to products like this, whenever the development is suspectly silent and secret. I find pretty reasonable for people to loose interest and faith about something they get to know so little about. That's hopefully a calculated risk Anet is taking. Time will tell.

BTW, I play GW1 everyday, I still enjoy it very much and I've never planned to buy GW2 anyway, so I'm none of the above.

If you are not planning to buy GW2 never planned and simply dont care. Why do you even bother posting and analyzing GW2 threads. Person with no interest in the theme wont even bother sneezing on it and yet there you are.

GW is a no monthly fee MMO. EotN has run its coarse and is at the end of its marketabillity. So why keep us in the dark. If ANET has no intention to release GW2; announce it. Hell it will save them money in the end cause 90% of the actual playerbase will quit the game; and they can shutdown 90% of the servers saving more money in the process............Besides i i was ANET i would anounce it if it where true so players wont wait to buy AION. Vaporware or not. Keeping us on hold has no value unless there will be a GW2. Wich leaves us with the release date issue. This is pure speculation. It may even take 10 years before its released.

On a side note. The AION trailer looks great. If the game is anything like GW who needs a GW2!

The only people losing faith seem to be a small percentage of people on the forums. If you have no intention of buying GW2, then for you to post as you have, means you are just out there trolling.

ME I like to get a game hat has no need of a monthly fee and Play it.

No im not poor and yes i can afford it but i find it extremely stupid to play a game that you already payed for.

eh guild wars 2 could be vaporware or not, its been 3 months since we had any "decent" information, 09 is early and there is still a lot left of the year. All you gotta do is have alittle "patience"

Aion looks like its going to be a badass game.

Diablo 3 looks good too, But its easly not going to be out till late 09 early 10 because they are still working on changeing, fixing, adding and other stuff to it.

Like I said before, think about this rationally and logically:

If Aion is released in March and is successful, it will be recieving strong sales through Christmas '09. ANET does not want one of their own major products to compete against another one of their major projects. That's just plain old bad business.

Also, rumor has it that Diablo 3 is slated to be released later this year, around September or November. This game is going to be huge there is no debating that and trying to compete head to head with a game that has a decade+ worth of legacy and rabid fans to boot would also not be very intelligent.

Think of it like this. When ANET is deciding when to release it I guarentee you they put themselves in the shoes of a customer at a game store. This customer is standing in front of a rack that has 4 games on it, WoW, Aion, Diablo3, and GW2. Which game does the customer buy? At this point they only have a 1/2 chance that the game this customer will chose will be a NCSoft game and this poses another problem. Unless the customer buys both games, they are only making half of the money they have spent to produce both games and effectively splits the customer one of two ways, a.k.a competing against themselves. Now take GW2 off the shelf. There is a much higher percentage that Aion will be chosen, GW2 is no longer an alternative and WoW is an old game. They now have a 50% chance based on odds alone that this person will purchase a NCSoft product.

Now, if they wait until say....march of 2010 and release it, at this point the rush of buyers for Aion will have slowed way down since it is now a year old and Diablo 3 will have been bought by the vast majority of people who wanted it within the first 4 or 5 months, because it is just an instant classic like that, it's going to sell like crazy for a few months and then taper off drastically because it cannot sustain the initial sales rush due to lowering demand. This is the perfect time to release GW2. Customers are going to have a choice between the one year old Aion, the immensly popular but increasingly aging WoW, Diablo 3 (which if they are into RPG's they probably already have) or GW2. GW2 would be an obvious choice and furthermore it won't cut their sales in half between Aion and GW2.

Expect it between March and August 2010.

I see angry people and I see fanboys.

@fanboys:

if one of your friends promisses you that if you worked hard he would give you a candy and after you work hard he asks you to be patient to the point that you start nagging for your candy and he starts ignoring you, what would you do then ?!

its not fair to say that it doesn't matter if the game gets released or not .. it wouldn't matter if they didn't say anything about gw2 ... in fact let them say they have another game in devolpment called gw2 and let them delay it ... all that wouldn't make so many people angry ... what would make them angry is what anet did ... and it went like follows:

Hey guys ... did you hear whats going on ... we are going to make a new game called gw2 (so far so good) ... and tell you what, if you buy our grindfest expantion called gwen you gona have alot more fun with our new game "gw2" .. all you have to do is give us some $$ and grind your a** till we are ready to release gw2.

and people did just that ... people payed cash and time based on the promise that anet gave to them of a game called gw2 and the glory they would get if they bought gwen.

after all that and you don't want the community to get angry?!?!

tell me that you didn't buy gwen because you wanted to move your hard work to gw2 as promised by anet ... its hard to believe that gwen would have sold better than now if they didn't mention the hom thing and gw2.

Last thing I wana say to fanboys:

if you guys are tired of people who QQ all the time about anet for not releasing any info about the game then please close your browser and don't visit this forum for 10 years and I promise you that you will feel alot better ... now this is a promise that is more garanteed than the promise that anet gave to us ... but I know for sure that you fanboys won't do that cuz you guys are also thirsty for more info just like us.

just my 2 QQ.

I think the vaporware sentiment comes up not just because there's no GW2 information, but because the weird strategy of abandonment towards GW1. I remember thinking as soon as GW2 was announced it could be a good thing, a chance to better a lot of things but that the only way it was a good idea was if GW1 still had a sizable live team making people's experience good.

Imagine buying GW1 today, with the deserted worlds, jaded community, no dev communication anymore... it's a different game and different experience. And the long term players suffer the same problems. Most have packed their bags ages ago and maybe even given up on this kind of gaming, so disappointing are options like GW that seek to get you in with a bang then abandon any attempt at entertaining you, and give long term support in terms of addressing problems 6 months later. So it may not be vaporware technically, but the series does have a spirit now of abandoning the audience before they expect it.

Small percentage of people on the forums + tons of people that already left the game about a year or more ago.

I guess if you have played for more than a year you probably have at least 20-30 friends on your list.

I have about 50-60. And I never see more than 3-5. And from those offline all the time, maybe 2 or 3 are on these forums (Tyla, Snow Bunny... gah, I think that's it), the rest has forgotten GW.

You pay for regular updates, content... Oh, yeah, CONTENT.

Last thing with a bit of "content" was EotN. And even then maybe 53% of it was not recycled.

You also pay for COMMUNITY MANAGER THAT DOES HIS WORK (aw ye Lorde). And developers that tell you what they are about to do in a month.


Written on Windows 7, true Windows XP + (Vista - shit requirements and options). And it's going to be awesome, as Beta is already better than Vista. On a virtual machine not using graphic card power.

So many people think A-Net and NCSoft West are the same company, working on the same projects and sharing talent. Funny stuff.

I think the beta date would probably be closer to the end of this year and they probably have too many features in that should be cut. Otherwise why would they take so long?

The problem is, deciding which features to cut. If they release a screenshot now and cut it later, then some people would QQ again. If they have not decided what to cut, they cant publish information on what they intend to release.

- I've been the first to call GW2 "vaporware" in the thread which spawned this one. I just wanted to make my point of view clear, since I'm the "vaporware person" which caused this all.

- As far as I know, this is a forum. People discuss on forums. I'm not insulting anyone, I'm just explaining my arguments with definitions and examples. Arguments that still stand. If anything against the arguments of the OP is trolling, well, there's nothing to discuss about. /closeforum

- I've NO PLANS about GW2 yet. This doesn't mean I have NO INTENTION to get it if it ever gets released. I just want to see it first. So far, infos have been so scarce I hardly can make up my mind about it.

Mark my words, we will all look back on this thread one day, after GW2 beta, and realize how impatient and childish people are.

This is planned to be a stable beta, very close to the release date, unlike GW1.

Oh for Flying Spaghetti Monster's sake, stop feeding the trolls!

Oh yes, and make all the trolls left over feel so much more superior about themselves that they take this sense of entitlement into the rest of their lives. Why should we be chased out by you? We're just as "entitled" to our opinion as you are. Grow up and learn to debate properly.

If I Remember correctly When GWEN was announced it was a suprise and came out in something like 7 mos. or so after the statement. Anet it seems prefers the short wait and hype as opposed to lengthly times where more and more stuff is needed to keep people interested after the anouncement. I think some patience is needed. I would like some more information on it like every one else.

And while NCsoft is the publisher Arena net makes their game. Guildwars was/is a success cause of their bussiness model not inspite of theirs. Many people don't feel like a monthly payment for a game they have already bought agrees with their belief. I personally don't believe in continuing to pay for a game I already bought. Unfortunately this will keep me from a number of cool games: Stargate Worlds, Startrek, and Aion will all be subscription based. GW2 will still be popular because of its business model whenever it is put out. Esprecially how bad some games have been received of late Rohan: Bloodfued, Age of Conan (heard there are many issues), and Tabula Rasa (outright closed).

Also their goal to make GW runable on moderate or so hardware systems is a big draw. Many people don't want to upgrade their computer every couple months just to play the New and Shiney. It is yet another thing that works for them.

My point is whether you QQ about Vaporware, or threaten to leave, or casue "you" are not being addressed for your specific issuses or greviences(sp?). You don't make the world go around that way.

Anet has done something right. Trust that they have an idea about what they are doing.

Whether you are a Fanboy or a Greifboy. It's still about choice, what you believe, but is it REALLY worth all the arguing... and greifing. Its not worth the effort to get upset about it, let it go.


OMMMMMMmmm :-)

This quote is so filled with fanboyism it's almost possible to cut it with a knife and make sandwiches with it.

Rule nr 1 of the Internet - You are special, therefore you are always right.

Rule nr 2 of the Internet - If someone has a different opinion than you, call him a troll and tell him to grow up, even if he's older and more experience than you.

Troll fight!!!

I quote you, "BTW, I play GW1 everyday, I still enjoy it very much and I've never planned to buy GW2 anyway, so I'm none of the above.

I'll also be interested to see what happens when GW2 info is released. I think the vaporware-people will feel happy that there's info and the game is coming, because quite a few of them actually care about GW (while others are just raging). But also, maybe, just a tiny little bit ambarassed about this opinion they carried during all these arguments here.

And if they're right, and GW2 will never see the light of day, we'll all be sad and move on to new (e-)shores. But my personal opinion is that it's nearly impossible, Anet devs are way too talented, GW1 has been and continues to a certain extent to be such a nice game, there's going to be a GW2. I've read so many "cues" so far, that I can almost feel there's a "big tide" coming (Wow, D3, SC2 are not important to me, I won't have the time to be on different gaming fronts). We'll have to see what this original idea of emmergent complexity is and the awesomeness of improving GW1 graphics.

I just had a thought (people probably already mentioned this here): what if this lockdown on GW2 info is actually a weapon that NCsoft is keeping safe, just in case they need it at a later point? Jeff Strain and Patrick Wyatt are in NCwest now. Or is it to actually protect it from the whims of the MMO market which is going to get a lot of new blood in the coming year+? GW2 has a tremendous potential given the uniqueness of GW1, even if it's in a niche market. Maybe they know they're not going to waste it against any of their competitor's coming games, and they have a belief that most of the playerbase will be back to try it, despite the Guru-gloom-and-doom on GW2.

Come on, please, update your Internet to version 2.0, the old one was broken and they decided to create a new one. Age doesn't matter, you can meet quite a few of very bright, talented and smart kids in GW1. Experience without being wise brings little benefit.

Given GW1 is basically abandoned and on maintenance-only at this point, then if you think GW2 is vaporware, what do you get out of coming to these forums, as opposed to finding another game to play?

This isn't a GW2 website.

Besides, this is a FORUM of Guild Wars. So I can discuss about any game of the series, either existing or not.

I wouldn't be here if I didn't care about the game. Because playing a game for over 36 months without caring about it is called idiocity.

Biological age is no indication of emotional intelligence or maturity.

If I see someone being an arse, I call arse.

And idiots don't exist maybe?

Why dont you go read the GW2 FAQ then if you dont believe me?

Oh that's right, you dont believe anything ANet says, so why ask for more information. Go QQ somemore...

I think alot of people love gw1, and I'm really wondering if the goose really is going to lay the another golden or not. Hellgate had talent, and looked what happened to it. Personally i don't plan on buying gw2 because i don't know if i will enjoy the game or not. There alot of things that gw didn't have that i enjoyed them missing like: kill stealing, spawn camping, spawn training, gear dependent character development, and mudflation.
Also those saying Aion may be a competitor to gw2, well I believe they may not be because Aion is a korean MMO, which typically do not do well in western markets, and its a p2p. GW2 is in theory a western MMO, and is f2p. I'd think D3 would be closest because i assume its multilayer going to be f2p unless they change battle.net.

There are actually two meanings of vaporware; its actual definition, and its (much more common) colloquial use on internet forums. Its actual definition means no visible signs of progress, whereas its colloquial use is "It's a hoax/this game is NEVER coming out". What some people are trying to do is get meaning #1 to stick, knowing that almost everyone else actually uses meaning #2 and will treat it as the latter.

There's always good stuff coming out though. This year we have Aion, Starcraft 2, Diablo (not to mention even minor things such as WoW's Ulduar patch to drag people back into that game; count on them to release that exactly when Aion comes out). Next year there'll be other games/expansions to worry about. I really can't see ArenaNet just sitting on a GW2 that was ready to go, until March-August 2010 just because of other things that might come out. They could certainly use some cash flow.

I think NCSoft has been pushing ArenaNet to release something near the end of 2009, even though ArenaNet would much rather release it in 2010 as originally planned. That is probably why they responded in their earnings conference call with "We are looking at a bunch of release dates" and "We hope to have something around holiday 2009" (but no official commitment). My guess is some features have been/are being cut to try to make that date, and they still might not make it anyway.

NCSoft isn't completely stupid though, one of their Aion representatives recently said the reason Aion hasn't been released in NA/EU, and doesn't even have an official release date here yet when it's already been released in Korea, is that they know they have to release something super polished in today's market.

Although ArenaNet has pretty much been left to its own devices, for fear of an Age of Conan/Warhammer style unpolished failure, I'm sure they are getting gently kicked in the behind to be more realistic about getting something out there sooner rather than later.

NO MATTER WHAT ILLBE PLAYING AION MORE THEN GUILDWARS 2 SO IDONT CARE WHAT HAPPENS WITH GUILDWARS!!!!!

yay caps ftl lol serious i barly play guildwras now as it is playing atlantica atm more, waiting no aion to come out later this year

As i heard Basic Battle.net 2.0 functionality will remain free (possibly add supported), but there might be options to pay for advanced functionality. But it's too early to judge it, since Blizzard keeps awfully quiet about it. In the end it's just vaporware.

WARHAMMER failure?
Funny

I wonder who does the marketing for GW2. Is it Anet, or is it NCsoft?

Whichever it is, saying they're going for the silent approach and then releasing a finished product could mean that they're saying in fancy words that they're cutting costs and skipping on a marketing campaign.

Not impossible. Official statements by developers often, if not always, have a spin to it to make things sound positive. I'm not saying everything they say is worthless, far from it, but it's not a bad thing to keep in the back of your mind.

If they weren't working on GW2(assuming the vaporware situation), what do you think they have been doing?

That's what I've been wondering...