Buff to Spawning Power

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My idea has always been energy based, Rit's are the main class that have almost no energy gain options besides those outside of its class. Having several high energy skills, especially inside the Communing class, they need some energy buff. What I was thinking was "For each rank in spawning power, you gain 2% of the energy cost of every binding ritual that you successfully cast." This would give you energy back, however it's not THAT much and only works if you successfully finish a ritual. Better then what they have now. This would allow more use for other elites, besides OoS which is the favored Rit elite cause most others are too hard to e manage. :/

Ok Anet, 9 pages of people who want Spawning Power changed.

Can you take the hint yet?

What I would love is a SP hex removal. As it stands rits are decent healers in my mind, with the exception of hex removal. If they created a few hex removal spells I'd love it.

Maybe like

Spirit's Sympathy
Spawning power
5e 1c 12r

Remove a hex from target ally. If a hex is removed that ally and the nearest allied spirit are healed for 50...75...90.
I like that idea.

just need more useful skills in spawning power. A spawning power version of vengeful weapon would be great because then we'd be able to abuse [skill]wielder's zeal[/skill], and it would give rits something nobody else can have *cough*necros*cough*. which would ultimately make rits better healers, etc.

i think anet just needs to start supporting channeling/restoration rather than the support theyve been giving spirits lately. Channeling and Restoration are the only things that are ever used seriously, and if spawning power started having more skills that supported that playstyle it would be for the better.

make it like strength. other classes can use warrior builds, but the warrior will always be better with them, not because the passive effect is awesome but because he has awesome skills within strength. ([skill]warrior's endurance[/skill], [skill]primal rage[/skill], etc..)

Weapon of Renewal: 5e 1second cast 10rec

For 0..10 seconds, target ally has a Weapon of Renewal. When target ally attacks or uses a spell they lose 1..2 Hexes and Weapon of Renewal ends.



Being non-elite, AND a Rit ONLY hex removal (that would counter Diversion and Shame), Rits would have a GREAT new use for PvP, let alone PvE.

That is way to powerful for a non elite skill. 5e 1c 10r? Rits are going the way of Paragons, just accept it and move on tbh <_<;

I refuse to accept that honestly. Paragons are still very much so used in PvE anyhow. Maybe my initial design for that skill IS a little TOO powerful, but overall, it was an example to show how Rits could get something more versatile for their primary.

That will never happen. I mean, that's EXACTLY the warriors attribute - Strength. Besides, it's a stupid idea. How does x% armor penetration help rits? exept for when they are ash spikers? It's a dumb idea.

Easy for you to say, perhaps, since your main character isn't a Ritualist (indeed, it's a Necromancer, a class that gets all the benefits of Ritualist skills). Even then, Ritualists are NOT going the way of Paragons.

Paragons in PvE are ridiculously overpowered due to the SY/TNtF Imbagon build.

Ritualists? In all probability, the weakest class.

So I'm not sure why you say Ritualists going the way of Paragons.

What kind of GW do you guys play?
Elite hex removal in Spawning is going to be a PvE worthy elite?
Transforming you into a spirit is going to be PvE elite worthy?
A change to SP that buffs spirits in PvP also?

Spirits are dead with a single reason. PvP guys do not want them around. And nothing has changed about this. Thus - if SP should buff spirits, the change MUST be PvE only.
Otherwise - SP should just move away from spirits and let them die. Because there is just no way to make the change relevant if it needs to be PvP balanced.


Personally, I still stand by my PvE-only spirit buff, it's the core of the class and it would be nice if it was at least playable in one part of the game (the same way a MM is playable in PvE.). Otherwise - I'd focus on making SP more Spirit's Strength oriented. SS is just a very sweet concept - and if build on it - SP could become the "physical" line of the ritus. That would demand a change to many SP skills - but let's be honest, they pretty much all suck in their current forms.

What I kind of want to see happen to spawning is whenever you spawn something you get maybe 1 energy for every 3 ranks, in addition to a slight buff to weapon and item spell duration(maybe 3%-5% instead of 2%), maybe a buff to spirit armor or spirit level in PvE. Like when a weapon spell, item spell, spirit or player gets spawned in earshot you get energy(even if you didn't cast it yourself).

Linsey has been made aware.
Somebody didn't bother reading the last, what, 7 pages? *rolls eyes*

Can you blame him?

It's not impossible but it's hard.
I'd really like to see a SP buff.

But I doubt it will happen.

because it's a lot of work

Hey, how come this topic just made it big now? I mean, didn't people complain about spawning power since forever? Did all the frustration and pent-up disappointments and stuff reach a peak level now? Just wondering.

btw, buff spawning power. We need to able to kick ass w/ spirit sh*tters.

Of course a SP buff would be sweet.
But the buff needs to be done to the extent that players will invest points in SP rather then go for a 12/12 Chan/Resto spread.
And given the fact that SP has a ton of shitty skills, the fact that Channeling has 2 useful skills - it's a bit iffy. You need a good effect and you need good skills. And given that - combined with the PvP hate of spirits - just focus on PvE spirits. Bring back RL and gives us an offensive spirit army.
Screw the PvP ritualist.

I also would like to modify my suggestion about SS. It's shit.
It's not comparable to other physical options - so no need to waste a whole attribute following that path.

I was just trying to suggest something to help channeling, and that would be added to the existing spawning power...but i was just trying to start an idea it wasnt that serious.

no one is talking about the one on the first page anymore, people have made much better suggestions

/unsigned

-with this, i think Rits would be to big of a beast

let SP unbind spirit's 1 per 3 rank so @ 12 you have 4 mobile spirit's

They got it right when they buffed Xinrae. They made a useful skill that people would actually use. Now they just have to bring those kind of buffs over to Spawning Power (and Communing).

also read past the first 2 posts before you post.

Yes, but the problem is that they made it more or less a variant of another commonly used skill, [[Weapon of Remedy]. In the last few updates we've seen skills being made into elite versions of useful non-elite skills, like [[Life Sheath] to [[Reversal of Fortune] and [[Primal Rage] to [[Frenzy]/[[Rush]. The problem is that there's only a handful of options for this, as many of the standard Ritualist skills are already very strong without a method of Weapon Spell removal and it still doesn't solve the fundamental problem of Ritualist skills being more effectively run by other professions, notably Necromancers. While some of these types of buffs may be a good idea, it won't solve the problem at hand.

The stacking attributes points per ranks in SP is a decent idea in my opinion. It encourages tactical attribute splits without changing the entire functionality of the skills themselves.

I agree. I don't know what is more difficult to achieve though.....make a SP change PvE-only or make a SP change the same for both PvE and PvP and then just make PvP versions of those spirits to nullify the new effect that SP would have.


I would like to see something like:

For each X ranks of Spawning Power you have, creatures you create (or animate) will have 1 more Level. Weapon spells you cast last 2% longer and have Y% more effectiveness. Some Ritualist skills, especially those related to Spirit creatures, become more effective with higher Spawning Power.

With Y% more effectiveness, I mean the variables in the weapon spell descriptions.

Examples
Spirits:
---[[union]---
* PvE-only could be buffed=> Create a level 1...10 spirit or something. Let's say X would be 2, then at 10 SP and 12 communing, a PvE Union spirit would be lvl 15.
* PvP-only would be something like=> Create a level 1...3 spirit. X=2 like above, then a PvP Union spirit would be lvl 8, which is pretty much the same as it is now.

Weapon spells:
---[[weapon of warding]---
** If a non-rit uses it at 12 resto: WoW will last 10 secs and has 4 regen.
** If a rit would at 12 resto and 10 SP: WoW will last 12 secs and has Y*10*4 regen. Say Y=2, WoW would have 20% more effectiveness, rounded up to 5 regen.

---[[xinraes weapon]---
** If a non-rit uses it at 12 resto: XW lasts 8 secs and steals up to 68 health.
** If a rit uses it at 12 resto and 10 SP: XW lasts 10 secs and steals up to 82 health. (Y=2)

It could even be changed so that Y is more (3 or 4) and the weapon spells toned down more to make the difference between a Rit primary and the rest larger (after all weapon spells are rit spells).

Item spells:
Something to compensate for the loss of our weapons. Can't think of anything right now.

Spawning Power spells:
Just make them more useful.

p.s. I suck with numbers, above numbers are merely to illustrate the changes.

yeah most of those ideas have been covered already. for items you could do, "while holding an item, you gain X Health and Y energy for every Z ranks in SP"

a couple of options for SR (Soul Reaping) model:

1) For each rank in SP, every time a spirt U control dies, U gain that much E

2) For every 3 ranks in SP, every time ANY ritual dies (nature or binding) U gain that much energy

a couple of options for ES (Energy Storage) model:

3) For each rank in SP, your max E TEMPORARILY goes up by that amount for each binding ritual that U control

4) For every 3 ranks in SP, your max E TEMPORARLY goes up by that amount for each binding ritual in the area

idea's enough. but good ones are rare. but still good idea's can give A-net idea's enough.

Maybe it's not a bad idea to sum up all idea's we had untill now.
This also goes for idea's for other thread's that I can Remember.
good and bad.

energy related:

• Gain EN on item creation.
• Gain EN regen while holding a item.
• make SP 'expertise' for spells.
• make SP 'Soul reaping' for spirits.

Lastingtime:

• Make item spells last longer.
• make weapon spell's last longer.
• Make spirit's last longer.

Spirits buff:

• Per # ranks of SP allow copies.
• Per # ranks of SP make spirit's mobile.
• Increase Spirits (/minions) level.
• Decrease cast time.
• Decrease recharge time.

Other:

• Armour penetration on rit skill's per rank
• 'divine favor' rip off's.
• Increase range of item spells
• Just buff SP SKILLS

Ill add other idea's that you post

Perhaps the Spawning power discussion should be related more to a professional ideal. For example Necromancers are supposed to gain power from Death... hence Soul Reaping gives energy when things die. Warriors are supposed to be people that can slash and smash better than others, so Strength gives them the ability to hit for a bit more via armor penetration. If you look a it more in depth, you'll find that most professions primary attribute is there to support the type of persona that class represents... Mesmers are tricksters and so need to be quick, Monks are healers and so gain a benefit from healing, etc. I think you'd find that every other profession besides ritualists have primary attributes that support their professional roll, regardless of how balanced it is in game (Soul reaping says hi).

The given description of a ritualist is: Ritualists channel other-worldly energies that summon allies from the void and employ mystic binding rituals that bend those allies to the Ritualist's will. They hood their eyes to better commune with spirits that grant great power and protection to Ritualists and their comrades. The energy they channel drives Ritualist skills which enhance the deadliness of an ally's weapon and wreak havoc on an enemy's health. The Ritualist can also use the remains of the dead to defend the living-not by reanimating corpses as a Necromancer would, but through the ritual use of urns and ashes. Where the Ranger lives as one with the spirit world, the Ritualist can and will be its master.

So to be consistent with the other professions, Spawning Power should be something that makes the ritualist better at doing these things than any other profession.

Possible ideas:

1) Spawning Power gives health/energy upon creation of spirits/minions and items.

2) For each rank in Spawning power, spirits/items/weapons are created faster and cost less energy.

3) For each rank in spawning power, spirit attacks and duration/effectiveness of weapon/item spells is increased by X% (could be something like 5%)

As it is Spawning power generally offers little power towards spawning or towards much else of use. Even the skills in this line are generally of poor quality. Personally, I'm in favor of #1 above the most, but any of them would be better than the current Spawning Power in my opinion.

I personally find rits overpowered in many ways. The fact that they can adequately spike/support/heal makes me wonder if it's spawning power that needs fixing or just the addition of more versatile skills.

Oh, I finally notices what's left.

Ritualists are more likely to hold bundles. But they will lose weapon stats when doing so.
Why not giving them +3 Health and +1 Energy for rank of Spawning power while holding a bundle? That would be +48HP and +16 Energy with rank 16. Considering you will lose other kinds of bonuses such as half casting or armor, that won't be too much.

I like these. Would be particularly happy with spirit level boost, mobility, and copies. Cast and recharge time would be beautiful as well.

And of course SP as spell expertise would be nice, though I don't think it would be a good idea to combine it with the spirits buff.

I would love to see something along the lines of x% casting speed increase to rituals, as well as tougher spirits, SOMETHING needs to be done especially since Ritualists are supposed to deal with spirits, and in HM that is basically impossible to do..bring back the spirit builds!!

The problem isn't really that rits are underpowered as a profession (although they aren't top-tier), but that they don't need their primary attribute for anything. This means that most primary rits go channeling/restoration (communing is generally seen as a weak attribute, and not without reason), while N/Rts and E/Rts, which DO have useful primary attributes, are overpowered. Heck, it's not hard to make a Ritualist build that would be benefited more by Fast Casting than its own primary!

If you'd read through the thread, you might have noticed that a lot of suggestions are aimed at allowing secondary Rits to be nerfed a little by proxy while leaving primary Rits at their current power levels.

A secondary issue is that spirits themselves are quite underpowered - outside of one-on-one spirit spamming builds, spirits tend to be used only as cheap tokens to tick the proverbial box on skills with spirit-related conditional effects.

What will we gain of that? I think it's useless.
Doesn't fix the problem.

It gives them something. Something is better than nothing. And most other things you can think of are either already taken by other professions, too much, or too less.

I know! Put all the Rit skills into the Spawning Power tree! That'll show them! XDDD (Kidding, kidding!)

I love all these ideas. I was hoping that the big content update included a buff to Spawning Power, but alas...

Those of us who've been keeping up-to-date with happenings in Linsey-land knew it wouldn't be months ago - basically, it hadn't come to her attention while the April update was being planned and when it was brought to her attention, she already knew that the big update was going to be too big to slip anything else in. High hopes for the next quarter, however.

at least they can's say that they didn't have time :P

Spawning is still kind of useless, and most rits spend their elite slots on energy management like OOS. So I was wondering, what if their was a complete change to the functioning of spawning? It could be something like: For each character affected by a weapon spell and each spirit in the area, you gain XX energy every XX seconds. What do you guys think? Could easily be OP, but it all depends on how much energy you get and how often it happens.

Edit: Oh, and it would actually make primary rits more popular, as opposed to the all the necros with rit secondaries that are taking over.

If you're running a true MM build (Not a minion bomber build) rit primaries still are awesome. Animate Bone Minions + explosive growth with a goodly bit in spawning (14-16) means a lot of damage and a lot of good tanks.

I've actually switched out my sabway MM for a rit MM. Doesn't kill as fast, but it works in places that the sabway MM never could.

Also, boon of creation > nerf'd soul reaping.

Ugh, yes, my rt mm would be terrible, i wouldn't be able to use Weapon Of Quickening for my dungeon running/VSF, my spirits wouldn't dominate RA, Attuned would fail, weapon spells would last less than half the time they do now, and yes, boon of creation + explosive growth = sexy. Please don't change spawning

Just buff those plentiful useless rit skills.


oh and yes i know WoQ is in communing, but w/o spawning it would never last, anywhere near what i use it for, so i kinda mentioned that twice there.

and as a side note, WoQ > QZ

completely OP in a team consisting of [Weapon of Warding]+[Weapon of shadow] even at low specs,add in some channeling spells and a caller for wielder's strike and u got a team full of healers/protters/spikers with a bunch of energy to waste.
All i think they should improve is the affected time on weapon spells,it could be 3-4% instead of the nearly nothing 2%,which is only useful at high specs,not allowing you to be very versatile on atribute spread.(most people just go 12 resto/12 chan/3 spawn or something close to that)

Who cares if it's OP? Necromancers can do this already. Paragons can do better with SY, as can Warriors. Monks have SoJ teams.

It would not be new.

Exactly, the thing is that people need a reason to use rit primaries. It would be hard to make it useful and not be OP, but I think its worth a try.

Please search before posting a new thread.