A Note on Microtransactions

BTW, you are completely wrong about that:

http://www.playrequiem.com/news/news.aspx

The game has a micro transaction system, sold as game cards lol.

There is not one MMO that is truly free to play without some way of making money. That model is impossible, because you cannot run an MMO without income. If you think you can make a 100% free to play MMO with no fees or micro transactions, or other ways to make income over the lifetime of your game, then go ahead and make that MMO. I will slap a big /FAIL sticker on your forehead a year later when your company is bankrupt. GW's original model was new campaigns and chapters. Since they arent doing that anymore, they need another way to make money, hence thay are using micro transactions.

That new online RTS called Battleforge also uses gamecards. Gamecards are just a more childish and sucky way of using micro payment, because kids who are too young for credit / debit cards can go to shops instead and spend their pocket money on their MMO. Although this is no different to when I were in my teen spending my £20 a month pocket money on CD's, I am just saying it is not any different, better or worse than micro transactions are.

GW is still the cheapest, and fairest MMO you can buy in terms of quality and how much worth you get for your money. As long as the micro transactions are cosmetic and storage things only and dont affect gameplay, e.g. 2x EXP and Drop things, better stat items (Although these would be ok for PVE only), then their model is still superios to Maple Story and Perfect World, plus GW is actually a lot better, just boring now after 4 years.

People are dying everyday, and children are starving in the real world, yet you place such a high feeling of morals and ethics into a video game?

This is a genuine call for the saying - 'Get out more'. I dont understand how anyone can place morals or ethics into a video game. Anet make a product, they place a price on that product, you either buy it or you dont. I see no lack of either morals or ethics in that procedure.

All I want to know now is if they are going to mess with GW2 too, and if they have lied to us about the payment method for the second game.

I can pay for new features once or twice per year, but I can't pay for features every time I want to use them, and I definitely won't want to do so even if I could.

So, if they go that way, that means that I won't be able to fully use all the content in the game as I could until now, and there it would be better for me to start forgetting about getting GW2 before it's too late.

So it's better to get information as soon as possible.

Extra storage space, name changes, and changing your characters face =/= content. You could already buy "extra storage space" before with character slots, and the other 2 things are relatively minor and very few people should really need them. You are able to "fully use" all the game content of Guild Wars that you purchase, that is, all 3 chapters, the expansion, and if you buy it, the BMP.

Not being able to fully use all the content in the game is if you bought Prophecies but had to pay 50 cents to access Perdition Rock and beyond. What they are offering is not content, but utility options that do not give you an advantage over any other player.

The Stylist is an NPC that offer in-game services.

NPCs and in-game services are content.

Imagine having to pay to craft armors, or use traders. That's paying for using content.

Having to pay to use traders = affects game play and could give you an advantage over other players if said trader had existing stuff for cheaper/only way to get that stuff.

Having to change your name/how your default ragdoll looks = doesn't affect gameplay (just looks) and doesn't give you an advantage over other players.

What you're saying isn't even the same thing as what they've done and is a very far stretch to make because ArenaNet would have no intention of making a Korean cash shop esque deal that would give people who pay gameplay advantages over those who don't. Storage/name change/face change doesn't give you any gameplay advantages over other players. You still have to grind titles for that.

Simply dont pay for the features if you have a problem with it?

Imagine being able to pay for extra armor / weapon skins that are not available at the normal craters!!!

Anet hires extra artists to design nice armor and weapon skins, but instead of putting them in the game, they put them in the cash shop. You can still enjoy the game with the free skins that are available ingame, or you can purchase the ones in the shop if you like them.

Would this be any different to paying for a poster, or painting that you hang on your wall? Someone has created a piece of work for the game and they wish to sell it to make some money. Good for them if they manage to design something that people will actually want to pay for.

The only problem with this would be the ridiculous expiration dates on purchased items as found in other games like Maple Story. Buying something and only having it last for 1-3 months is bad. But if you could buy a new armor skin and have it forever, that would be a decent way for Anet to make more money, plus it gives them an incentive to actually go and create nice new items to make more income.

Neither would armor skins. Lets say that to buy a new skin, you already need to have an armor or waepon to place it on, maybe you could craft a special 'customisable' armor in the game, and then this special armor can recieve cash shop upgrades to change the skin. This would not be detrimental to the economy or gameplay because you would still have to pay to craft the armor, but you can then customise the skin however you like.

I should make an idea thread about that idea!

I don't mind paying for new features. I paid for a lot of new features.
But I paid ONCE.

I paid once for all other GW features,and for all other games I ever bought.
I had to pay once for Diablo and Diblo II.
I had to pay once for NEverwinter Nights.
I had to pay once for Dungeon Siege.
And the list goes on for all games I've ever paid for.
And one of the three main reasons I chose GW over other games because I had to pay once.

Paying is not the problem, the problem is the change in policy from 'pay once' to 'pay to use'. A way of payment that prevents me to access the content it grants access to.

And it' not a problem about something not neccesary to play, or just an 'extra'.

All prestige stuff such as different armors, weapon skins, miniatures or animals are extras too, but to get access to them you just have to have paid ONCE.

Just ONCE.

Seriously, stop beating around the bush and just say you are upset about the fact that you only get one use of the name change for 15 dollars instead of unlimited use. The reason there is so much arguing going on and you posting the same JUST ONCE crap is really annoying and is due to the fact that your wording seems to be confusing people. I understood it but since no one else has refuted what you are really trying to say and you keep having to repeat yourself over over, it is apparent others don't.

The main problem here seems to be with people who want these bonuses, but are either not willing to or simply can not pay the 10-15 dollars to obtain them. It is all opportunity cost people. If you want the items, buy them. If you have a better use of ten dollars, then stop complaining and go use your 10 dollars in that manner. Complaining about this because you want the content for something other than what it is offered for is asinine and pointless. Stop complaining, if you feel it is not worth it, then that is that, end of story.

And seriously stop the speculating on how this is going to ruin guild wars 2. The only way possible any micro transactions can ruin Guild Wars 2 is if they give you a competitive advantage. Extra storage does not give you a competitive advantage. Having an Asian warrior with prophecies hair does not give you a competitive advantage. Miraculously having your female character grow facial hair and experience a large increase in testosterone does not give you a competitive advantage.

None of these things prevents you from playing or enjoying the game like you have been for the past 4 years.

There are no distinctions.

If they make it for one thing, the next one may be a Xunlai Marketplace in which you have to pay for each transaction made in there separately.

"Pay per use" is something to be completely avoided in any way, and 'pay once to unlock' should be the only way to go. The only way.

It's pay per use because these are database changes that if you could do them whenever and a massive amount of people did them constantly, it'd really slow down the servers related to it.

Creating a guild is a neccessary function to do PvP/group PvE, they won't make you pay for that functionality ever. The Xunlai Marketplace would be a huge w/e since it's not really a gameplay advantage, but it doesn't make any sense to make people pay to have access to something that requires lots of people using it to work.

You're grasping at straws. Just because something is pay per use, doesn't mean they're going to go against their inherent belief that gameplay advantages shouldn't be in the store and make tons of pay per use stuff.

ArenaNet is a business, if they wanted to, they could have put gameplay advantages in the store a long while ago, and they'd probably make some good money off of it. But they know where to draw the line.

A small explanation about the usage of TL;DR, since the use of it in my posts cause some misunderstanding in AmbientMelody and pumpkin pie.

TL;DR means Too Long; Didn't read.

It has several applications.

The most common its to use when you want to complain to the author of a comment about the size and most likely poor format/language used in that comment, generally complaining about a wall of text.

A second and not noble use is trolling.

A third use of it is summarize a big comment, highlighting the main points. This usage has merit of reducing time necessary for new users, willing to jump in a thread, to read all the comments in very large threads.

I used TL;DR in this last way in my 2 posts in this thread.

Back on topic.
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In no way do the new anet shop options differ from options already present in the game, some for very long time.

Storage panes and name/appearance changes are very similar to the "character slot" options.

Pet unlock is very similar to the skills/item unlock packs.

Considering this in no way did Anet deviated from their path (although it makes you look twice at the way they are enforcing the name policy currently).

Most of these are perks and they aren't even perks other players can see/be jealous of.

You can see they are perks since most of people wont be willing to pay for them. If they were free of course they would use them, but there are no free meals. It would be extra storage/extra bandwidth consumed that Anet would have to pay.

Are these perks expensive? Absolutely. Some are outrageous. But this will reduce the number of people that would use them, since only people with a serious interest will pay for it.

Actually, in general I don't party with ugly characters... *rolls eyes*

Although the fist step to being a good liar is to believe in own lies, you won't fool others by fooling yourself this time.

Anet is a business that presented us with a product under a business model.

For some of us, the business model was one of the main reasons that made us chose the game.
Announce that a business model will last forever, and people get encouraged by that.
Change the business model later one, and that people will feel somehow betrayed.

Do I need 36 character slots? No. I can play even with just one.
Can I get them all? Yes.
Do Anet gets money from each of those transactions? Yes.
How many times must I pay for each one? ONE.

Do I need all skill unlocked from the start? No, I can unlock them ingame.
Can I get them all? Yes.
Do Anet gets money from each of those transactions? Yes.
How many times must I pay for each one? ONE.

Do I need all items unlocked from the start? No.
Can I get them all? Yes.
Do Anet gets money from each of those transactions? Yes.
How many times must I pay for each one? ONE.

Do I need all pets unlocked from the start? No.
Can I get them all? Yes.
Do Anet gets money from each of those transactions? Yes.
How many times must I pay for each one? ONE.

Do I need all storage slots? No.
Can I get them all? Yes.
Do Anet gets money from each of those transactions? Yes.
How many times must I pay for each one? ONE.

Do I need all 2005 and 2008 version upgrades? No.
Can I get them all? Yes.
Do Anet gets money from each of those transactions? Yes.
How many times must I pay for each one? ONE.

Do I need the BMP? No.
Can I get i? Yes.
Do Anet gets money from each of those transactions? Yes.
How many times must I pay for each one? ONE.

Do I need the CE editions? No.
Could I get i? Yes.
Do Anet gets money from each of those transactions? Yes.
How many times I had to pay for each one? ONE.

Do I need all GW camapigns? No.
Can I get them all? Yes.
Do Anet gets money from each of those transactions? Yes.
How many times must I pay for each one? ONE.

That's the way to go, pay once.
They get the money, we get the feature and forget about paying again.

+1 to this guy

Do I need to change the name of my character?No.
Can I change it? Yes.
Do Anet gets money from each of those transactions? Yes.
How many times must I pay for each one? ONE.

Do I need to change the sex of my character?No.
Can I change it? Yes.
Do Anet gets money from each of those transactions? Yes.
How many times must I pay for each one? ONE.

And why is that an issue?
The only issue that I see here is that you don't have the balls to tell them to suck it for providing you with a product that does not meet your needs.

If the people do not feel that they are getting what they want, the market should take care of that. The product in question should fail.



EDIT:
Hey babez!

They just want it frees Which is fine. But not the point being made.

What I see here is people expecting a product to succeed in a capitalist market, yet want it to be developed, produced and maintained in a very non-capitalist way.

Argue all you like with bullet points and Your Logic but it comes down to one simple thing: Entitled, Self Important Gamers Want Stuff For Free.

Get over it. It doesn't come for free. Nothing in life does.

This is somewhat tongue-in-cheek (at least I hope so) but let's look at what could be the next step in micro-transactions. Will this happen, don't know. Could this happen, certainly:


Per-event transaction fees for our new GW2 A-La-Carte Menu. For your convenience you can place your order via our user-friendly and safe In Game Store! Note, you're not required to order these, they're all OPTIONAL (if you want what others have):

Tournament entrance fee - $5
Guild Hall rental - $15
Guild Hall with NPCs - $35
Skill updates (monthly fee) - $10
Auction House membership - $75
New "Uber-Elite" Armor set - $15
New Weapon skins - $15
Special Event Weekend access - $25
Added content - (variable)
High-end areas accessible - $30
Character "Luck" upgrade - $25
Scalable storage rental - (variable)
Preferred Server priority - $50

Elite Membership - NOT priceless

I choose you, Diablo 3!
How about you?

JR made a good point at the beginning of this thread and some of you guys are being total idiots. I didn't realize how your character looks made you play better than someone else...

For me it's not about playing better of worse.

Is about doors opening.

Let's see how people like it if they add a Xunlia Marketplace and you have to purchase 'Market credits' to perform transactions there.

Some boundaries are not to be crossed. Changing the business model in a game that attracted a lot of players partially with that business model is one of those doors.
Let one step in, and the next one is GW having a 'VIP' feature players must pay very month like Dungeon Runners.

The only thing about this update I would seriously call into question is paying for the extra storage.

The last storage update we got was 100% free and linked to the # of campaigns you had bought I believe. Understandably if everyone bought the all of the extra storage updates, anet servers would be feeling some strain.

Storage CAN affect gameplay by forcing players to dump what might otherwise be valuable loot and force a narrow style of play/trade. I doubt they'll make this kind of thing on GW2, as they'll probably continue to supplement expansions with extra storage.

Oh no the sun is black the world is going to ennnnnnnnnnnnnnnnde!

Oh just a solar eclipse.

Well, I'm glad to see we agree its a problem, if apparently only fleeting.

Which coincidentally is how 99% of games in existence also work. Or perhaps you guys forgot that?

It isn't as simple as that. People would use your excuse for ANYTHING Anet sold. If Anet sold competitive advantages or things that definitively changed the gameplay (which I argue storage does but that is besides the point) there would be a lot of carebears on this forum proclaiming that we don't have to buy it if we have a problem with it. STOP USING THE "IT IS OPTIONAL" ARGUMENT EVERYONE. IT IS TERRIBAD.

Not to mention just because I don't buy it means it goes away. The problem is still there. I didn't pay to be a part of this type of game and I know a lot of others feel the same. Cue "then leave I don't care" post.

No...the only way they can ruin Guild Wars 2 is if they are in Guild Wars 2 at all. All Anet has to do is give us less out of the box and more out of the in game store. Microtransactions are already added to the list of reasons I am not buying GW2, and I know for 99% certain that they will be a part of the game on release date.

What I see here is people expecting a product to succeed in the marketing model the company gave it, and want it to be developed, produced and maintained with that same marketing model.

Argue all you like with bullet points and Your Logic but it comes down to one simple thing: Greedy, Self Important Companies Want to Charge its Loyal Players (who Paid for their Game) for Things that Should be Free.

Lulz. Lemme just go get all those Ursan and SF threads, we'll see exactly how many of you saying that "it's optional" is a bad argument were using it in quite often then.

OP is the first post I've seen on these forums for days that's made any kind of sense. I had almost resigned myself to just avoiding the copious amounts of stupidity present on these boards, but I now have a glimmer of hope that the community will pull its collective head out of its arse soon enough.

BTW:
Fixed!

Go ahead and find them. I'm sure you'll find me and others like me saying the "it is optional" argument was as stupid then as it is now. Of course back then people were calling it the "don't like it don't use it" argument which for all intents and purposes is the same thing.

So...I think you'll find that argument has always been crap and I'm sure you agree. It just coincidentally happens to be the most overused crap argument on these boards and happens to be the most used in favor of microtransactions. Do you know what happens when the only argument people can find is a bad one?

Same.

That is a TERRIBAD argument on itself.

Either GW is selling competitive advantages or its not! There is no mid term.

The argument of having the capability to store more and so be able to hold on stuff and sell for better prices doesn't work either. You can already buy more accounts and slots. Panes is just another way of getting it - and all of them cost money.

And that is if you believe the objective of PvE is to compete with other players to see who has more money.

I'll have to go look at the GW site to see if there's a rank of players based on money they possess and if they get rewards for it.

So until they sell a weapon that does more damage or a better skill, and keep making quality games, I'll buy their games and the optionals I consider interesting (like the character slots I bought. I wont buy those I don't consider worthy like a sex transformation pack).


If you consider these changes will give those that buy them an edge, either you buy them or you don't. If you don't buy them and keep playing its because maybe they aren't that advantageous. If you don't buy them and stop playing then you are making your point.

So how is it?

Are those things so TERRIBAD you wont be playing anymore, giving a slap to Anet?

Or is the game is enjoyable and you having fun despite those things?

Or do you want to rename your Dark Dreamwind character for free?

There are plenty of optional things that are paid once when you acquire the key that grants you access to it.

Prestige armors, weapons, pets, kits, miniatures...
So don't have to pay every time you want to use such features.


And you could even say that everything is optional in the game.
Playing the game itself is optional. You can buy it and not use it, or just login to chat.

So, yes, the 'optional' argument is not a god one here.

Ug... I just threw up a little bit

LOL WoW betrayed its customers by offering 15 dollar re-customization HURRR

I got the spiky hair for my orc warrior.

Do you want to change your characters names? Do you want to change their appearance?

If not what is the problem of that thing being there?

I'm sorry but that isn't the same thing as an armor that is part of the game.

Do you want more storage?

If not, what is the problem? They even gave you one free without you asking! Plus a 5 slot for weapons/armor for cheap in game money!

If you want more space, couldn't you buy more characters slots and/or accounts?

And you need to buy them once per slot too, not just go there buy "slots" and then new slots kept coming without additional paying.

Names and appearance change is the same - you buy a character sex change. You buy a name change.

You don't buy the ability to add slots at will and you don't buy the ability to change the sex of you character without deleting it at will.

All the rest is extrapolation.

Comparing this to the Ursan Blessing skill change is a sad history - for one part UB (and all the blessings) was bad - it killed build construction and killed the need for different professions/roles. But it allowed PuGs. Loads of PuGs. You fixed the first part but killed the PUGs.

Of course most of the noise wasn't about those ideals (even if sometimes people disguised those opinions into those ideals) - it was about the so called elite guilds losing control of the economy. Joining a guild that could farm certain areas that most people couldn't could cost you money. And the more farm happened less rare the items became and less money was to be made by those elite guilds.

Of course some idiots, like me, choose not to use UB and play normally, in a way it was fun for us, because we aren't in a competition for the largest bank account with the other players.

But some players want by force to make PvE into that.

Curiously, this update tries to increase pugging, and while it introduces the zcoin grind, it lessens all the existing grinds, including leveling the pets.

But people can only bitch because they couldn't get all the stuff for free.

Yes, there is the possibility Anet will become a greedy bitch company and will only offer minimal services and everything else in GW2 will have to be paid.

But people are innocent til found guilty in my moral system. And none of these changes and the past behavior of Anet shows that.

If it changes in the future, then it will be guilty. Not now when nothing happened. Or actually it happened I got 1 pane for free. I got new stuff in the game for free (or not for free but without paying anything else on top of the chapters prices and the slots I bought), from zaishen quests to the travelers gifts, to the menagerie to additional storage from the weapon/armor bags.

Anet does loads of mistakes and shit, which I believe its honest mistakes (or so far as in a business is honest), but they also try to keep their costumers happy and treat them well (bar the idiotic tranzi name policy).

The balance of this update is positive, not perfect, but positive.

Sweet, so basically for you it's all about the made up microtransactions-that-give-you-gameplay-advantages that could happen even though ArenaNet has only done microtransactions-that-don't-give-you-gameplay-advantages.

I know ArenaNet sucks in some places but they've at least proven they aren't stupid when it comes to marketing. They know how to pick their fights and where not to cross the line. This didn't open any "doors". There's not much else they can microtransaction here that fits Guild Wars and their store style.

If one day there's a skill pack that gives you 100 skills you can only get in the store or something, hey, I'll admit I was wrong and that ArenaNet really is stupid, but this day is never going to come because they still firmly believe that the store should not give out competitive advantages to people who pay and only to those people, and to this day, that is still true. Just because you assume a business has to be money hungry and will cross any line the instant they do something even vaguely related to something "bad", doesn't mean it's going to happen.

Ah geez not you. We've been over this already.

Let me put it this way, whether you agree or disagree with microtransactions is irrelevent. You can't say "microtransactions are good for everybody because if you don't like them you don't have to use them, it is optional". If you say that I'm sorry but you are idiotic and I hope to God I don't have to explain why.

I can respect some of the arguments in favor of microtransactions (such as some of JR's), but I only question whether or not it is coincidental that the idiotic argument is the major one being used as a counterargument to the people who disagree with the appearance of so many microtransactions.

Even if you don't personally purchase any microtransactions, DreamWind; Other people buying them DOES help you in a way. The company getting more money is a good thing for everyone who plays the game. As long as what is offered is sensible I have no qualms with the in-game store.

btw, microtransactions cannot affect actual ingame possibilities (by this, i mean you will never get the "here's 20 ectos, pay 25cents to loot). this is because they cannot charge a price low enough to make it profitable. keep in mind that handling the transactions cost money, and it will rapidly reach a point where the cost of handling that transaction outweighs the money gained.

so please, drop the whole "they're gonna charge you for everything world is gonna end waaaaaah" routine. it won't happen because it doesn't make financial sense.

Are any of the new micro transactions giving any play advantage?

Either they are and you can explain those or they aren't.

I guess being idiotic is pointing the gaps on your arguments - an argument that basically is "the new micro transactions will give advantage to the players", followed by the companion "Anet is a greedy company and GW2 will be a micro transaction fest".

Sincerely the Imp and the bonus weapons give an initial advantage than none of these new buy options give.

I have no problems with the way Arenanet is doing things with the storage,makeovers and name changes because they are all optional. None of them effect gameplay whatsoever.

I guess you missed the memo, oooh say 2 years or so ago, where Anet announced a change in plan. The BUSINESS model (marketing is a different game) has changed - if you can't change with it, not Anet's fault.

If you want the game to remain static as it was at the end of Nightfall, fine. You got it. No money earned from the game means no further updates to the original game. No live team.

But if you want this game to continue to be supported, tell us where the money is going to come from? Under the original model you're SO keen on, that money SHOULD have come from the expansions we were going to get every year (or was it 6 months). If there are no expansions, the live team need income to exist

You simply can't have it both ways. You can't have unsupported free content. It's just not financially viable.