Rant: What's with so many elitest PVP guilds?

I'm going to be fairly honest and realistic in this rant.

I'm done with PvE and I've already dominated all the elite areas. So I decided I wanted to get into PVP a bit. Specifically GVG and HA.
Problem? All the guilds recruiting seem to be a bunch of Elitest retards who literally reject everyone, or bullshitters who don't live up to their hype and advertisement.
For weeks I've been searching for a decent PVP guild. And to this day, I'm STILL searching for a PVP guild. Yet almost about every guild I went through, has a stupid rank requirement, or, like said, reject everyone for stupid reasons, or bullshitters who use false advertisement.
Let me take a look at the most common requirements for a non-rank based PVP guild, in which, I meet:
Knowledge on the Meta? Check
Proper grammar and speech? Check
Politeness? Check
Analyzes GVG/HA matches? Check
Willing to, or takes part in GW communities? Check
Ventrillo or Team Speak? Check
Working Mic? Check
GVG/HA experience of knowledge? Check
Being able to put together any build for the class we claim we play? Check

And yet, most of them don't even give you a chance to even apply for those requirements, and just make up some dumb excuse like that "They have 600 players pming them" (Despite saying they're a new guild), just because of the mere mention of "A high-end PVE player wanting to get into PVP".

Quite honestly, I'm tired of these guilds wasting my time.
I'm not going to give out names, but if you're going to be so damn picky or retarded on potentially great players for your guild, just don't freaken' recruit in the first place since you're not even giving them a chance to show that they meet the requirements.

"No rank/requirements required" BULLSHIT!!! Because we all know it's false advertisement, hoping you will attract the r9 glad!

Elitests are on par with some of the worst Guild Wars players out there and the fact there are no decent PVP guilds these days is truly getting on the nerves because they aren't even allowing people to even get the experience that they demand so much.
I really wish I could find an actual decent PVP guild that takes things seriously AND intelligently, in which, intelligence is what a lot of guilds these days lack <_<

</End rant>

Anyone else share my pain on this matter? It's impossible to find a good PVP guild these days that actually act like a guild.

Good guilds DO exist, you just hafta slowly weed them out.

Why don't you make your own guild with your high-end PvE friends?

You have actually played this game with other people, not just abusing PvE skills and hero/hench, haven't you?

What's with so many retarded anti-elitists?

The whole point of the game is to abuse skills...

Yes I have, my good sir. However, they quit GW and/or still aren't interested in PVP.
Also, what does PVE skills and H/H have to do with anything?

What's with so many retarded anti-anti-elitists?
See? I can make a stupid response too!!!

Pug HA for r3 and do some RA til you get a glad title, most guilds just want to see you are mildly capable of doing any sort of PvP and are willing to work with you. You could of done this all while sitting in a PvE guild, takes a double weekend to easily get r3 hero and then just RA in your free time and gg.

Simply wanting someone who's experienced and has a clue doesn't make you an elitist it means the game is 4 years old and we want someone who's worked at it as much as we have to play with at nights after spending our days getting irritated by incompetent players.

Knowledge on the Meta? Check
Proper grammar and speech? Check
Politeness? Check
Analyzes GVG/HA matches? Check

Which you can get from passing the 5th grade and hitting B to observe a single match to see everyone on both sides are running X. Does that mean you understand why or could do it as efficiently? Not really. Unlike high end PvE sabway won't overcome most weaknesses and a guild is as strong as it's weakest link so asking them to be your level until you improve and not being able to carry them with pimped out heroes is what you might not be getting.

You can't just jump into the pool without dipping your foot in some water first. I'd have to say PvP honestly isn't for everyone nor is it something everyone can excel in, you can try, you can think you're good or win a few matches but like the almighty Athene says...

"Either you're pro or you're noob, that's life."

Dunno if KiSu is still around but I guess you could try there... Most guilds will look for ranked players because it (usually) shows that they have atleast some PvP experience. If they are serious about it they won't take a PvE player who has GWAMM, because that means shit in PvP.

PS: It's "elitist".

I dont share my pain, but I see everyday atleast 10-12 guilds in AD RA spamming...

"New Guild recruiting for Daily GVG/HA, no rank req!"

Try hanging out there for a while and you will find your "nice and friendly" pvp guild. But heres a quick tip, if your looking to do "friendly" pvp, I would stay away from HA and GVG, nothing friendly about those whatsoever. Its a "who-has-a-bigger-e-peen contest", and frankly it gets annoying.

Also if your looking to join a top 1k, or even top 500 guild with no rank, good luck, its probably not going to happen, unless they know who you are. But other than that, just stay away from the Rank req. guilds, we are elitists, and we know we are good. /sarcasm

Good luck, and pm me in game if you need a non-req pvp guild, I can help you out.

IGN: Death By Rangers

Have we forgotten that even PVE players have glad titles?
Also, last I checked, wasn't HA PuG impossible these days?

This thread isn't about titles though, as most of the rant applies to non-title req guilds. As for guilds with false advertisement, most of the guilds recruiting in RA don't actually GVG or HA as much as they say they do. I've been through about 5 of those guilds and they just sit afk all day. No joke.

Let's be honest, a lot of high-end PvE people get there by abusing AI and retarded things like Discord spikes and Cry of Pain teams. Saying you have DoA done doesn't necessarily mean shit because it well could have been done by seven Ursans and a HB monk while not really learning anything about skillbars and the like. Not saying that's your situation, but try to understand their point of view too. PvP people are simply skeptical of PvE people, end of story.

I was just about to suggest KiSu as well.

Elitism in PVP!? What a surprise. Hey, I guess they enjoy watching their "community" shrink more and more everyday.

Because PVP doesn't utilize the best class/skill setup possible to get things done.

True Virtual Love KiSu takes most people and gives them a try fair warning though if you're a monk there's a ballpark and a half of monk trying to learn/prove themselves, it has quickly went from the most wanted profession to the most generic and populated one because it's cool now apparently. So depending on what you do might tbh affect what you can do, if you're a Dervish or Para persay I would understand a PvP team usually not wanting you or having to go a few runs before they can squeeze you in.

Might be better off going for a new smaller guild, even if they have no more experience than you it's better to be patient and learn together than to not have a steady team and get nowhere just to get matches in here and there.

Maybe I'm not being very clear ^^ KiSu had a lot of members last I checked, might of changed but there wasn't always room =) btw I don't think I've ever heard of anyone doing DoA without a gimmick tbh... =\

Are you any good: no.

No one wants to have to lose a lot of matches just because player a. has to get carried every match.

High-end PvE means nothing. Nothing. You can blow up shit? Ok, cool beans.

My guild doesn't specifically have any requirements, but people have them nonetheless. No one wants someone just getting into PvP - no req guild normally just means it's a bunch of players with some experience forming a pug guild.

No requirement doesn't mean they'll take just about anyone, it means they don't have stringent requirements establishing a threshold of experience.

Getting into PvP means putting yourself out there. A good start would be contacting the posters making guild recruitment threads on guru.

No offense, but if you have no experience, why would someone want you? Do you think a decent PvE guild takes someone who's not experienced in all the farms, dungeons, and high-end areas? No. So why should PvP guilds take you, where the stakes and success are harder?

PvE hasn't required skill for months now, so saying you're a high-end PvE player translates into "Hey, I've played a boring game where all the builds are gimmicks centered around impossible amounts of defense and offense, and all of our mistakes are voided by the consumables."

- I think there should be r6 requirement for HA team leading and bad RA players should go back to PvE. We better-than-average players are tired of watching tank warriors with flare especially in our teams. If it's the enemy we laugh.

I think you just need to accept the fact that you'll have to start from scratch.

I've actually heard a lot about KiSU and even bookmarked their forums.

Also, about abusing AI.
I've played before even Nightfall was released. And even when it was, I played through the game with my Dervish without even using heroes (I was skeptical of them at that time.) or PvE skills whatsoever. Heck, when they finally released skills like Critical Agility and Eternal Aura, I simply couldn't believe how overpowered they were. Before the Critical Agility nerf, did you see how overpowered those Mesmer Illusionary Weapondry builds were? Of course, the mesmer reign in PvE lasted only a short amount of time.
I'm also one of the few r10 norn paragons who didn't abuse Ursan. Back then, all we had some a gay man in a skirt, and careful usage of Cruel Spear. And when DoA first released, normal mode was like hard mode!

Though, that being said, PVE and PVP are two different games. But on the bright side, it teaches you about all the skills and their potential in moth metagames.

Kay.. Let me explain something...

If you were crying about this 3 years ago when it may have been hard to get good groups because there were a small group of people that had tigers and for the most part all knew each other (aside from the koreans), then it would maybe be understandable.

But now when the game has been out for over 4 years and you can't even manage to grind out some kind of rank? That's just sad quite honestly. You can give any pathetic kind of excuse you want, but guess what? Everyone had to do something somewhere to start and if you just want to complain about elitism and requirements and crap, then why don't you take charge? Don't cry so damn much.

If you don't have rank, make groups yourself. What are they going to do, ask YOU to show YOUR rank? Just call them noobs, kick them and get someone else.

90% of the time pugs are going to fail hard in the first place. If you want to succeed, play with friends and keep playing with them until you are comfortable with each other and you will eventually start doing better. Keep making the same groups with the same friends, eventually people are bound to get better at their roles and each person will know their team mates on a more personal level so they play better together.

I'm tired of these stupid bs rants.. People have been crying about this since the game came out. I have like what, 5 tigers now? Whats your excuse to not even be able to get a deer? Even a wolf isn't difficult (and in 4 years, you should at least be able to have grinded a tiger by now...). If you want to cry about not being able to get groups or get guilds, then make your own or shut up.

What do you want from this? You already have an option, you just want to cry about it. Help yourself, don't moap around wanting pity, actually do something about it.

Jeez...

So are you a Dervish? If so I can tell you to hang that up right now if you intend on doing any serious PvP sorry =) What do you play?

Who says we don't have titles? You're missing my point here.
Are you saying it is a requirement to not take frequent breaks from guild wars, and to play for 4 years straight just to get into a guild that claims they have no requirement?
We're not talking about flare warriors. We're talking about people like BHA rangers who just plain want to see other PVP players. It doesn't take 4 years to learn the game or basic strategy. It takes skill.

Dervish is now an old mule that I use to play back when they were true enchantment jugglers and Warrior's Endurance or Critical Scythe wasn't part of the "meta"
I play Monk, Warrior, Mesmer, Ranger, Assassin, and Paragon

[build prof=Warrior/Elementalist][Glyph of Essence][Frenzy][Eviscerate][Executioner's Strike][Phoenix][Rush][Lion's Comfort][Resurrection Signet][/build] [build prof=Warrior/Elementalist][Glyph of Essence][Frenzy][Backbreaker][Crushing Blow][Phoenix][Rush][Lion's Comfort][Resurrection Signet][/build] [build prof=Mesmer/Monk][Echo][Arcane Echo][Arcane Mimicry][Arcane Thievery][Arcane Larceny][Diversion][Power Drain][Resurrection Signet][/build] [build prof=Mesmer/Monk][Echo][Arcane Echo][Arcane Mimicry][Arcane Thievery][Arcane Larceny][Diversion][Power Drain][Resurrection Chant][/build] [build prof=Ranger/Mesmer][Apply Poison][Archer's Signet][Concussion Shot][Distracting Shot][Pin Down][Hunter's Shot][Troll Unguent][Dryder's Defenses][/build] [build prof=Assassin/Monk][Shadow Form][Deadly Paradox][Heart of Shadow][Dismiss Condition][Infuse Health][Gift of Health][Signet of Rejuvenation][Signet of Devotion][/build] [build prof=Assassin/Monk][Shadow Form][Deadly Paradox][Heart of Shadow][Dismiss Condition][Infuse Health][Gift of Health][Signet of Rejuvenation][Remove Hex][/build] [build prof=Warrior/Necromancer][Sever Artery][Gash][Distracting Blow][Sprint][Riposte][Deadly Riposte][Healing Signet][Grenth's Balance][/build]

No way we can lose!

As an other PvE-er trying to get in to PvP, currently pugging to R3 Hero - I have to state the following:
Bitching about elitists gets less fame than just trying to PUG in HA. It also gets you more "respect", if you can use that term. I wouldn't be surprised if people who read this and who HA will vaguely remember your name and put you under a "don't bother" category.

Besides, requiring rank is logical. As a R0 or R1, you probably don't know most map strategies. Or maybe you know the general strategy, but you move too slow on cap points. This can lose you a match. Perhaps you don't notice the snare coming up on you at the relic runs, and you're too late with piling everything on him. Perhaps you're too late with the WoW, MH or SoC.

Guilds want to win. Inexperienced people are a liability. Most groups want to limit the liabilities as far as possible.




In short: PUGing with (mostly bad) teams and winning the odd battle gives more fame than bitching on forums.





PS. Try Mathway or IWAY. They're the easiest to run for grinding to R3.

You can lose. You forgot mending!

Also, yes, IWAY is awesome for grinding ranks. I <3 the warrior. It lets me bring in my useless Black Widow and soon to be Moss Spider :3

I think we can put mending on the ranger!

Another thing that probably puts people off, we want to know what you play not what you can play or have played but the job/position you play best.

Also wipe para and 80% of the time sin off that list. Imo if you really think you're that capable this game really needs some good mesmers/rangers again and not ones that simply do.

If you had titles you'd use them to get into guilds, hell I'm C3 and I don't even put that down when I apply for guilds anymore just my experience and I get in stand alone off that. You claim to be polite but you are here ranting and shooting everyone down, you can put up a front but when the pressure gets going you are usually the kind of person who points fingers and people end up not wanting to play with from the sounds of it.

You know, I'll admit. You do make a damn good point there. Perhaps I'll admit, I got impulsive and I said some very stupid things in my rants. Okay, I RED ENGINE GORED ENGINE GORED ENGINE GORED ENGINE GOed up.

Low-end GvG experience is pretty much impossible to prove since champ points can only indicate top 100 experience or so, but how can you claim to have HA experience without even having r3?

There are elementary things that experienced HA players know. For example:
- Which way do you go on courtyard from each starting location?
- How far from the altar is the ghost in capping range?
- Yellow shrine is disabled during 1v1 cap points in HoH
- How do you open the gate on antechamber?
- How do you open the gate on antechamber from the middle shrine?

Those are only examples related directly to maps. Builds, tactics, and individual skills (using ward vs foes, going around said ward, bodyblocking in 20 different scenarios, etc) excluded. You can't possibly learn that and still remain unranked, because in the time it would take you to learn, you'd accumulate more than 100 fame.

Basically, any tactical map is guaranteed to be a fail with players who have no clue what to do. People with experience are fully justified in rejecting random unranked pugs if they don't want to deal with any of the above. (Chances are they'll have to anyway, because I see a r9 moron who can't snare practically every day, but at least less chance of it happening that way)



Anyway, what class(es) do you claim to play, and are you aiming specifically at GvG or HA?

OP: Your problem is that you're too focused on your own needs. The only way that you're going to be a success in the PvP community is by figuring out what the team needs and conforming your behavior to match the team's needs.

Unless you have spent a ton of time in PvP, there are many, many things that you do not know. It is impossible for a group of regular players to communicate those concepts to you quickly or efficiently. No good group will tolerate having you on the team until you can do a respectable job of playing your bar and know at least the basics of strategy for the job you play. Teams can give you subtle pointers as you go. If you need more than that, you're just not going to work out.

Your lack of titles sends a strong signal that you're not going to work out. You haven't yet paid your dues.

Stop worrying about what you want and focus on figuring out how to give the team what they want.

Gee, its sure is second job around here.

Just to emphasize.
I'm going to apologize. I've been having a very bad week and maybe I took it out on you guys?
Sorry. I got impulsive again. I was frustrated.

Wow, you were really spoon fed all that bs, weren't you?

It doesn't take skill. It doesn't take any skill at all... Some of the worst players I've ever seen at least know strategies and have decent rank.

I knew this one guy 4 yrs ago, stupidest mofo I'd ever met.. He had r9. He was an absolutely horrible monk.. People took him on their teams just because he was hilarious in how stupid he was. He didn't even try to be, people just loved making fun of him. He wasn't the worst monk ever, but a hench probably would have done better. Yet, he still had a tiger within the first 3-5 months of GW.

It's not about "skill." It never was about skill. It's about playing well and communicating well with the rest of your team, and sticking together. If you have good communication and work well together, you're going to get somewhere as long as you stick together, even if you aren't the best players. You can be the best player in the world and play with different people every time and one bad team after another, and you're still going to suck because this isn't a 1v1v1v1v1v1v1. . . game. HA is 8v8. That 1 person doesn't matter how skilled they are or not, what matters is how well the team works together.

4 years..? Huh? I haven't played GW in months.. I logged on last night I think it was, and got 10 fame, just screwing around cause a friend invited me to come play with her. That's an absolute horrible amount of fame too, but even if you got 10 fame a day, you'd eventually get lucky and get a bit more, and you'd get fame np...

If it's not about fame, then why the hell would you keep joining "no rank requirement" guilds?

And wait.. Please tell me you didn't just say BHA rangers.. BHA rangers..?

You mean the rangers that shoot 1 skill on a caster then just let their bow auto fire, occasionally moving so they're actually shooting the target?

You RA a lot, don't you? You call that "skill..?"

LOL!!!!

Okay. You win the thread, it's okay. You can have your wrist slashing crymo event. I don't even care...

Like anything with this game, the more time spent bitching and whining that you're not doing something = less time when you could actually BE doing something.

I was just saying to a guildie that I'm at the point where I'm feeling the same in regards to PvE. It's just getting boring, even without lolwin pve skillbars, it's easy. But we're going to start out at the bottom, as... that's where we should be right now. We know game mechanics, we know how to make effective skillbars, but we need to learn how to adapt what we know to PvP.

'High End' PvE groups don't take any joe blow from the outpost on a mission with them, I'm not sure why high end PvP groups should. I guess it's all depending on your definition of decent, too. Sure, you'll be able to get into groups doing so-so on the ladder after you get experience, but nobody rolls out of bed and falls into a cape trim.

Do hardcore HA'ers even enjoy what they are doing? What's still game about the game when it requires you to take it more seriously then your job and even your family?

I think farming 15 juni berries is much more rewarding then practicing six months just to make it to the hall.

Hooray! We got in the hall and got pwnd instantly. But at least we got in!

I'm pretty sure that anyone ever can be a high end pve player. Heroes can do it without any gear.

I'm pretty sure telling people that you are a high end pve player is why you get rejected. Were there actually any good PvErs (I could probably name one or something), I'm sure someone in some guild would have heard of them and would have known that you were not one of them and rejected you even moreso.

Saying "I was one of the first x" is just stupid. You can't prove it and it doesn't mean anything even if you could.

Actually, I think it's harder to start off now.

There's a lot less players than 3 years ago... maybe 1/10th of what it used to be. A lot of the people who play are already high-ranked and that means a) There's less groups for unranked players to join, b) There's much less unranked/low-ranked groups to beat up on the first few maps.

Because of that, it's harder to get fame. You're not going to run into 4 groups of noobs one after another, because they will be weeded out by the 4th map. In fact, a lot of times you'd be in HoH by then because of skips. Full runs are less frequent, so less fame overall.

I also haven't seen anyone hold... say 10 rounds for a very, very long time. In fact, I don't think it's possible, other than by luck (get 5 1v1s in a row, etc) due to stupid victory conditions. I mean, relics in halls is pretty much anet doing /roll 3 to decide the winner. So there's no potential for top players to hit the jackpot.

tl; dr: Getting fame sucks now. At all levels.

Well, personally I do not take any interest in ranks except for that bragging is cool and so are tigers.
However, you have to understand that taking a random PvE'r who, very likely, has little to none PvP (not counting AB, RA or other random stuff) experience into a team is not something anyone experienced would prefer.
Also it is very doubtful that you are, as you are suggesting, a good player, considering what I just said.
You'll have to climb up.^^

With the HA Zquests it's at least possible to get a crappy random group together once every two hours. If you are lucky, you run into another bad pug and you can actually win. (!!!) Before Zquests i assumed HA was a place where everyone knew each other.

Calling everybody retards but misspelling "elitist" constantly.

You just have to keep searching and be patient.