Guild Wars, WoW, and Guild Wars 2

Hydras are know to die after rocks fall on them =)..

No 1 denies the fact that the returning titles are gonna become big once more...-_- But you can play it only so much in a day you are bound to be slightly tierd of the same gamplay...It wont hurt sales of other games.. just simply will hold them back for a week or 2 untill gamers will go back to playing muliple games as it happens very often =)

True, players like myself enjoy many games and don't just focus on a single game. BUT Blizzard games like starcraft, Diablo 2 LOD and Warcraft 3 have a steady following and still have a strong player base totaling millions on those three games. D2LOD has around 40,000-60,000 players online daily with nice spikes upwards of 70,000-100,000 players on the weekends and during summer. (don't quote me on these numbers.) Warcraft 3 has a massive following and Starcraft is far from abandoned.

Diablo 3 will see more than 3 million purchases within the first week. I wouldnt be suprised if they sold 5 million copies in less than 5 days. The thing about diablo is, its not a quick game in terms of collecting and outfitting characters. Being able to build and use multipul characters has always been a benefit to players and we will see that again. Alone, Diablo 3 will suck in, addict and keep millions of players who will log on and grind, daily.

Starcraft 2, the first installment (Terran campaign) will also suck millions in, although depending on the online playability and options, this game may not have a long lasting massive player base until the second or third installments. Not as many people like terran as protoss or zerg. Still, depending on the online funfactor and the world editor, we might see another Wc3 tft which was (IIRC) Blizzards number 1 rts game, beating out SC1.

Do I believe GW2 will tank? No, Far from it. But GW2 fans are a lot more weary of GW2 than D2 fans are of D3. The real difference between the two is, D2 fans, whether they like what they read or not, can't wait to get their mits on d3. GW fans are highly skeptical about the next game, outright bothered by some of the changes and some have even decided not to buy the game (wait and see if they are just talking bs). Many GW fans are perfectly happy on GW1 and won't switch over for a long time, depending on the features and options of GW2.

So I wish Anet good luck and I can't wait to play Both GW2 and D3 (But D3 is priority with me.)

PS: You would run out of rocks before a hydra runs outa heads. Its best to use fire on a hydra. Like a troll, its the only sure way to know its dead.

/end ultra mega nerd moment.

Geesh, by this "logic" it's a wonder Blizzard does not cannibalize itself!

Why are people talking about D3 killing GW2, when it's just as "likely" (ie, not as all) that D3 will kill WoW. (and before someone says "but they are completely different games....", that is exactly my point!).

Yes, some people will not buy GW2 right away because they are playing a brand new game. I'm sure WoW's active player base will dip slightly when D3 and SC2 come out (after all, Blizzard fans are Blizzard fans), but WoW is not going to be in trouble or die because of anything that comes out.

Neither will GW2. It will live or die on its own.

Bryant, I strongly, strongly suggest you check out the patch notes for 3.2. You'll know why.

Link? I'd like to see if WoW is worth trying out again.

I think the DK population is going to drown in its own tears once they read those patch notes. Good changes all around, though, although took them a long time.

http://www.wow.com/2009/06/18/patch-...r-patch-notes/

Specifically, I'm refering to the Emblems of Conquest change, which causes the reward for completing the highest raid and the lowest Heroic dungeon to be equal.

And I am a DK who is squealing at the nerfs. I am really, really glad I still don't play. If I did I'd reroll Shammy. :\

I'll know...wha? The only thing that I actually like the sound of in there is the new druid art and experience in BG's. I'll wait and hear from my guildiees how things change, but we haven't seen much entertainment since Wrath came out.

Well having a DK as my only 80 (and quitting in December), I can say they were ridiculously powerful (but also incredibly fun!), but after a supposed 6 months of nerfing, I think they probably finally went too far with the latest set of changes -- although hard to say because it's been so long since I played. I certainly am not motivated to reactivate and play mine after reading that. I don't think ArenaNet ever nerfed anyone that badly, did they?

WoW PvP gets a lot of flak, but playing my disc priest in PvP was so fun. The most offensive of the four healers, it had a bit of the mesmer playstyle (mana burn, double offensive dispel, aoe fear, mind control, and abusing sw: d to preemptively break CC) and was only part healer (an instant cast absorb, various types of heal including a high risk high reward channeled heal, and double defensive dispel). Its long term mana efficiency in PvP gear was the worst of the four healers, as it was designed around you using mana burn and your other offensive abilities to keep up with the others, but that was part of the fun. Unfortunately S5 arena (and apparently S6 too) was a giant pile of shit, so I wasn't motivated to level that guy up.

That got me thinking about how Guild Wars rewards specialization; for example, you don't see monks with Energy Burn and Shatter Enchantment on their bars, whereas in games where your class's base skillset is chosen for you, it is ok to have some baseline offensive skills on healers, because they come for free. That was why I thought it might be interesting if in GW2, you had a completely separate attribute point pool for your primary and secondary class, so that they felt a bit more like dual classed characters in the D&D sense.

I'd think the newest professions probably got a nasty shotgun blast to the face.

You must be new. Welcome.

If you liked it post TBC you'll probably love it now. If you liked it pre TBC then it's possible that you will cringe at the raiding and "PvP" which has dissolved into the laggiest PvP to meet your PC, and the e-sport inspired "arena". If you are seeking actual PvP go play WAR or stick with Guild Wars. WoW's PvP went from epic, always going on in nearly every area to the daily capital city raid for the achievement and the occasional ganking. Everyone else is queued to farm the BGs and Arena or they're farming/raiding. Le sigh. On the upside the newest expansion has some brilliant quests, and makes the game increasingly casual friendly.

A nerd moment where you call WC3 bigger than SC and ignore the eSports industry?

In any case, even the first installment of SC2 is supposed to have all available races for online play, and let's be honest, the campaign isn't what makes people play.

That's why C&C is selling so good on each iteration. It's EA's devoted focus of resources to PvP.

No, if 25% of buyer play more than five matches, then you can officially call it a game with "a lot of PvP activity". Just look at GW, when was the last time a PvP outpost had 10 districts due to a Zaishen mission?

Well even though WoW is abig big Giant when it comes to an MMos, i think that both WoW and GW2 along with D3 will have a very very intense fight wiht one Game/developer/epic sage/30 year old franchise that no 1 mentioned here yet...i think

THE OLD REPUBLIC MMORPG

is Developed by BIOWare and EA

This will be huge.. It bound to suck out Star Wars fans out of all above stated franchises + gather millions more.. Just look at the size of Star Wars Galaxies Before the Huge change they did... I think puting this thing into the market will effect even those precious decade old titles that finaly coming back.. Mark my words =)

Well i know il be definetly playing throuhg TOR but unlike most posters complainng they will bbe playing one game an done game alone.. il be playng all four....=)

What can I say, I guess I'm not a very good nerd. I do believe though that warcraft 3 does have a larger following. Warcraft is blizzards first born which came out (IIRC) sometime in 94 and SC didnt come out til 98. When Wc3 came out I believe it had a bigger purchase rate than SC did. (Again not 100% sure)

As for competitive Rts tournaments? I couldnt even begin to guess which had a higher sign up. Both ladder competitions are almost always full and I have no idea if SC's ladder is even still running (probably is) But I know Wc3 is still in full swing on ladder. (but a vast majority play UMS "Custom Maps) But to say the wc3 community is no less competitive or its ladder/tournaments are no less serious would be incorrect. But the whole RTS fad has been played out alittle so it might not be as advertised now. (outside of Blizzard sites and forums)

As for SC2, true, not many will be buying it for the 6-12 hour campaign. But the online element will be a stunted version. We will have access to a good sized variety of units to chose from, but it won't be until the 3rd installment that we actually have access to every unit in the game. I still plan on snatching up any collectors edition of SC2 I can get my sweaty mits on though. I happen to be one of the few players who enjoy the terran. (Mass ghosts with 6-12 nuke silo's! WOOHOO!) Although, again SC2 the first installment will probably not have the variety it will need to keep many players coming back daily. We will have to wait and see.


I don't think D3 will kill GW2, never said that. The only thing that will kill GW2 is, well, GW2 and the fans. Also WoW is at no risk of losing massive amounts of players because of the time and money invested in the game. Subscribers are some of the most hardcore loyal fans gaming has ever seen. People don't pay money to spend thousands of hours on a game they "Sort of like". Gw2 on the other hand will not be an estabilished game and people won't have a serious investment in it.

Its easy to dislike something new, when you have something else you really enjoy. D3 will suck in and addict millions of players, but there are others who won't like D3, or will play more than just D3 or simply don't care about the diablo series. GW2 is its own worst enemy and thats the point.


Speaking as a Kotor1&2 fan, I HATE the fact that Kotor3 is a MMO. I am not alone in this either, after spending some time chatting with many other knights fans, they are plenty upset about the change. Not to forget that the game is (last I heard) subscription only.

Now fans would not be so upset about this IF KotorO was not the only version we will get. Everyone, excluding the MMO fans, want our original game format. We want the single player rpg campaign. An online option would be great! But forcing kotor fans to pay to play a massive online game is just BS. I, like some, am skipping Knights Online all together.

You also must remember these simple facts. There are only so many video game players in the world, and only a small portion enjoy MMORPG's and there is a very good portion of the MMO fans who do not agree with subscriptions. If Eq,LotrO,WoW,Conan,D&DSW didnt have subscriptions, you would see a massive amount of anti p2p players buying each one.

PS: The lag on KO is gonna be horrible and the PC requirements are gonna be lol worthy. To play KO you are actually looking at, purchasing the game, paying the monthly fee, upgrading or buying a new pc. All for 1 game. Although from all reports of how KO is gonna be played and the measure of content, it may well be worth it.

I agreed with most of your points, but it should be noted that people thought EverQuest was the biggest MMORPG ever before WoW came along.

WoW won't have 12 million players forever. EVENTUALLY (not anytime soon) another game will take it's place. It may not be Guild Wars 2, but I think Guild Wars 2 will do quite well, better than the original Guild Wars in any case.

Ladder-wise, there's ICCup, and a notable professional scene (primarily Korean, but China has its own leagues I believe). For information!

Dont get me wrong.. i am as upset as you in this matter.. There is no way id expect them go this way.... But im speaking as a Star Wars fan not just KOTOR fan.. I own 95% of all games have been released for public use or at least played all of them.. just that feeling that i have to own the game in order to complete "Collection"....Hell i dont want to pay for playing online just like most people im completely agains Pay to PLay....But unfortunately my Star Wars fanboisim you can call it makes me think otherwise......I got WoW never even installed it so yeah im bad....Regardless im with you at everythign you said,,,,But it is still competition and a tought one.. im sure SWG players will be thrilled with TOR =)