600/smite should just go away
. Shadow Form must follow though :>PS - I can't raptor farm anymore...easily...but who cares
. Now they need to buff Alliance Battles so MQSC..etc will never be done again!
Petition to split Mantra of Resolve for pvp/pve
Sifow Chan
/Notsigned
600/smite should just go away. Shadow Form must follow though :>
PS - I can't raptor farm anymore...easily...but who cares. Now they need to buff Alliance Battles so MQSC..etc will never be done again!
600/smite should just go away
. Shadow Form must follow though :>PS - I can't raptor farm anymore...easily...but who cares
. Now they need to buff Alliance Battles so MQSC..etc will never be done again!
subarucar
Quote:
|
Originally Posted by The Drunkard
/not signed
Raptor farming deserves to die as you're farming ~30 monsters from 1-2 min (vaetir anyone?). All anet needs to do is add twisting fangs to nestlings to stop sins and wars. Lets just hope anet keeps to their word and stops shadow form too, so that people can start playing the dungeons as they were supposed to be played. |
After UWSC, FoWSC, DoASC, Dunegon Running, etc, get nerfed, then Raptor Farming can die. Raptors are a nice training spot for more complicated farms. Almost every class can farm them, moving away from the Monks/Sins only farming thing. Raptors require little time commitment, as you said its only a couple of minutes. Some people don't have an hour to do DoASC or want to make a new character just to UWSC. They are so overfarmed the drops are worthless anway (Except for event items).
Raptor farming can go when all the more OP are gone.
I have no problem with them getting rid of 600, that is almost as OP as SF
Yojimaru
Quote:
|
Originally Posted by Saph
/signed
Senseless that MoR was nerfed. And yes 600/smite is a farm build, but come on, its no where near as easy as SF. So why was 600 hit first? Why not hit both at the same time? And on that note, why do some people absolutely hate farming? I can understand if its done to an extreme like UWSC and what not, yes I admit those are bad. 10-15 mins in an elite area doesn't seem right. But this 'play the game how its suppose to be played' argument is quite obnoxious. These skills are in the game are they not, so how is using them not playing the game correctly? |
I can see why MoR needed to be toned down, I used it in JQ on my mesmer, being able to pull off fire magic AOE combos was nice, but a fixed five second duration with no adjustment to it's recharge!? Isn't that a bit heavy handed? Now it's really not much better than MoC and significantly less useful than GoC. MoR wasn't a perfect defense to begin with, plenty of things stopped it. There was of course stance removal, but there was the lesser practiced forms of interrupting known as knock down and skill disabling. Power Block in particular wiped the floor with MoR.
Anyways, /signed for the split.
BlackSephir
Wait what. AN nerfed a farming build and people are whining?
I sure didn't see that one coming! Now just nerf SF and we're set.
I sure didn't see that one coming! Now just nerf SF and we're set.
Witch Alderine
It's a usefull skill in PvE, not only for the 600/smite team.
/signed
/signed
Gill Halendt
This so-called nerf to 600/Smite isn't pushing ANYONE toward permas:
- 600/Smite is still playable. Just needs some more ability. Sorry if you can't steamroll through the game anymore. Not every 600/Smite build requires it, so, not really a problem.
- It was hit first because it was probably easier to hit. Actually, Cryway was hit first and much worse than this, and at least Cryway used to be a "team-build" and required a full team to work.
- Don't worry, SF isn't being left untouched. It's probably the next skill to meet the nerfbat. You didn't really expect a nerf to SF to come with this balance update after this, did you?.
- 600/Smite is still playable. Just needs some more ability. Sorry if you can't steamroll through the game anymore. Not every 600/Smite build requires it, so, not really a problem.
- It was hit first because it was probably easier to hit. Actually, Cryway was hit first and much worse than this, and at least Cryway used to be a "team-build" and required a full team to work.
- Don't worry, SF isn't being left untouched. It's probably the next skill to meet the nerfbat. You didn't really expect a nerf to SF to come with this balance update after this, did you?.
Saph
Quote:
|
Originally Posted by Yojimaru
Well, one highly likely possibility is that they stand to gain from less farmers. Less farmers of valuable things means that there is a decreased supply of said valuable things, thus causing the prices for them to increase.
|
Gill Halendt
Quote:
|
Originally Posted by Saph
without ways to farm and make quick cash, we're stuck with a grind game.
|
Guild Wars is not your life. You can quit and get back whenever you like.
Saph
Quote:
|
Originally Posted by Gill Halendt
You are not. If you've played all the available content in the game and are now tired of it, no one is forcing you to keep on playing. Grinding is not mandatory.
Guild Wars is not your life. You can quit and get back whenever you like. |
I also dont think I said I was gonna quit. I'm saying, without ways to farm (excluding high end farming like 600 and perma because these two obviously dominate). There is no real way to do anything but grind for something you want, unless you get lucky. And I'm sure no one wants to grind. Maybe I'm just not saying it right. It's late and maybe I just cant type out what exactly my mind is thinking atm.
Shasgaliel
Quote:
|
Originally Posted by Saph
Ah, when you look at it that way I can understand. Dungeon running and the influx of high end items into the economy is a bit bad. But it seems to me, most people want farming to vanish all together. Which I dont get, since without ways to farm and make quick cash, we're stuck with a grind game.
|
Gill Halendt
Quote:
|
Originally Posted by Saph
There is no real way to do anything but grind for something you want, unless you get lucky. And I'm sure no one wants to grind.
|
Lishy
/signed
It's pretty useless now.
It's pretty useless now.
Shadowhaze
Quote:
|
Originally Posted by Witch Alderine
It's a usefull skill in PvE, not only for the 600/smite team.
/signed |
This.
/signed
But on the farming note, sure things shouldn't be super easy to get, yet they also shouldn't take forever to get either. One means of farming gets hit hard while the greater offender is left alone.
Barrage
Quote:
|
Originally Posted by Shasgaliel
Go learn how to play.
|
Greaver
Are you guys being serious?
Nerf to 600 / smite? Why is it even needed? For farming UW you can use something like frenzy, go go win. In a lot of the areas you don't even need it...
Maybe some areas are now not doable, Fine, go find somewhere else. If this skill is getting this much crying I can't wait to see the replies when Shadow form takes a hit.
Greaver.
Nerf to 600 / smite? Why is it even needed? For farming UW you can use something like frenzy, go go win. In a lot of the areas you don't even need it...
Maybe some areas are now not doable, Fine, go find somewhere else. If this skill is getting this much crying I can't wait to see the replies when Shadow form takes a hit.
Greaver.
Barrage
Quote:
|
Originally Posted by Greaver
Are you guys being serious?
Nerf to 600 / smite? Why is it even needed? For farming UW you can use something like frenzy, go go win. In a lot of the areas you don't even need it... Maybe some areas are now not doable, Fine, go find somewhere else. If this skill is getting this much crying I can't wait to see the replies when Shadow form takes a hit. Greaver. |
naughteblonde
/signed for split
MoR was useful in PvE for things other than farming.
MoR was useful in PvE for things other than farming.
Gill Halendt
I can believe this...
People have been so vocal about SF. Now one of the multiple variants of 600/Smite becomes harder to use, and people complain about it. To me, this was a good sign of some attention given to problema such as OP run and speedclears... Whatever, people find something to complain about every time...
Anyway, SF is going to be nerfed somehow, we already know this. The nerf hasn't come yet, but that doesn't mean it won't come at all, so I don't see a problem with 600/Smite being nerfed first (even if I wouldn't call this a nerf).
I'm all for a split, as long as the PvE variant is altered so that it's usable efficientlu only for those "things other than farming".
People have been so vocal about SF. Now one of the multiple variants of 600/Smite becomes harder to use, and people complain about it. To me, this was a good sign of some attention given to problema such as OP run and speedclears... Whatever, people find something to complain about every time...
Anyway, SF is going to be nerfed somehow, we already know this. The nerf hasn't come yet, but that doesn't mean it won't come at all, so I don't see a problem with 600/Smite being nerfed first (even if I wouldn't call this a nerf).
I'm all for a split, as long as the PvE variant is altered so that it's usable efficientlu only for those "things other than farming".
Greaver
Fair enough, But there are plenty of ways to get around Interrupts,
And the 600/smite still had a HUGE variety of places it can farm, it now just needs a little bit of rework and luck to get round interrupts in areas with them. Most of the 600/smite build don't even use mantra (For the dungeons anyways).
Raptor runs can still be done, but just needs different builds other than the mantra ones.
And yes, I am still puzzled why SF hasn't been hit, it is over powered and does need to be sorted.
And the 600/smite still had a HUGE variety of places it can farm, it now just needs a little bit of rework and luck to get round interrupts in areas with them. Most of the 600/smite build don't even use mantra (For the dungeons anyways).
Raptor runs can still be done, but just needs different builds other than the mantra ones.
And yes, I am still puzzled why SF hasn't been hit, it is over powered and does need to be sorted.
Nihal
/signed i prefer the 40++ seconds mantra for pve. but i like 5 sec in pvp
Enon
Quote:
|
Originally Posted by HawkofStorms
I know its great for raptor farming and 600 builds... but even if that nerf is an inadvertent to the nerf for PvP, those builds also needed to be nerfed.
|
s3bek
/signed
I love being 600 and now in some places it has been taken from me
I love being 600 and now in some places it has been taken from me
Lil Leena
/signed.
But I tried it earlier in the farming builds I use [CoF 600/smite & ele raptor farming] and it works just fine. Timing is the key
But I tried it earlier in the farming builds I use [CoF 600/smite & ele raptor farming] and it works just fine. Timing is the key
Shayne Hawke
I sure wish people would drop the "it makes no sense to nerf 600/Smite when SF still works" argument, seeing how that wasn't the point of the nerf at all.
Also, 600/Smite, while it may not be as foolproof as SF, still tackles a large number of dungeons and vanquishes will similar proficiency and ease. It wouldn't make sense for ANet to say, "We're going to eliminate one of the worst farming setups in existence, but this next bad one is a-okay!"
Aside from the farming aspect, I doubt MoR was really ever that powerful in PvE, and it was never exclusively used on Mesmers.
Also, 600/Smite, while it may not be as foolproof as SF, still tackles a large number of dungeons and vanquishes will similar proficiency and ease. It wouldn't make sense for ANet to say, "We're going to eliminate one of the worst farming setups in existence, but this next bad one is a-okay!"
Aside from the farming aspect, I doubt MoR was really ever that powerful in PvE, and it was never exclusively used on Mesmers.
rokocoko
/signed
Nerfing MoR won't make me use perma. So maybe the split will come.
Nerfing MoR won't make me use perma. So maybe the split will come.
Reler
/signed
I can understand that it might need a change for PvP to give interrupters a chance.
I don't see why they need to nerf every dang farming build. The game economy is already gone to hell. People ARE HAVING FUN farming, or just need to, to get enough cash to buy some of the more exclusive items and don't have the time to play 24/7 regular style.
Some of the farming builds also make it possible to finish some of the harder areas of the game that alone with H/H are impossible or that there are not enough pugs to do them (eg. The Deep).
Besides all that, they already admitted they screwed up the skills in GW1, it is mentioned in one of the GW2 interviews.
They say it takes a lot of time to balance them due to the number of them.
Can't they stop wasting time on PvE skill adjustments and only concentrate on PvP balances? Leave the PvE skills as is unless they are really broken/bugged. Frees up some time for the bigger fun projects they want to do.
Sidenote:
As they are not likely to lower the sweet/alcohol/party titles due whiners that complain they invested more time money in the titles and that it is not fair to them. If they would like to make a change is to make the items for the titles more general available at a cheaper price.
Said items have a rather high price compared to other items you can buy from merchants. I'll leave it at this and open for discussion in another thread.
I can understand that it might need a change for PvP to give interrupters a chance.
I don't see why they need to nerf every dang farming build. The game economy is already gone to hell. People ARE HAVING FUN farming, or just need to, to get enough cash to buy some of the more exclusive items and don't have the time to play 24/7 regular style.
Some of the farming builds also make it possible to finish some of the harder areas of the game that alone with H/H are impossible or that there are not enough pugs to do them (eg. The Deep).
Besides all that, they already admitted they screwed up the skills in GW1, it is mentioned in one of the GW2 interviews.
They say it takes a lot of time to balance them due to the number of them.
Can't they stop wasting time on PvE skill adjustments and only concentrate on PvP balances? Leave the PvE skills as is unless they are really broken/bugged. Frees up some time for the bigger fun projects they want to do.
Sidenote:
As they are not likely to lower the sweet/alcohol/party titles due whiners that complain they invested more time money in the titles and that it is not fair to them. If they would like to make a change is to make the items for the titles more general available at a cheaper price.
Said items have a rather high price compared to other items you can buy from merchants. I'll leave it at this and open for discussion in another thread.
Shayne Hawke
Anyone ever consider that nobody actually plays the game because everyone else is doing nothing but farming?
Targren
Quote:
|
Originally Posted by The Drunkard
Lets just hope anet keeps to their word and stops shadow form too, so that people can start playing the dungeons as they were supposed to be played.
|
Quote:
|
Originally Posted by Reler
Sidenote:
As they are not likely to lower the sweet/alcohol/party titles due whiners that complain they invested more time money in the titles and that it is not fair to them. If they would like to make a change is to make the items for the titles more general available at a cheaper price. Said items have a rather high price compared to other items you can buy from merchants. I'll leave it at this and open for discussion in another thread. |
BlackSephir
/signed for leaving mor as it is both in pvp and pve and for deleting shit titles like drunkard etc.
It's always fun to watch farmers whine and their "arguments". It's like watching Religulous again, but with farmers.
It's always fun to watch farmers whine and their "arguments". It's like watching Religulous again, but with farmers.
Tom Swift
Quote:
|
Originally Posted by Targren
Judging by the design and reward quality/time ratio of the dungeons, that would be "not at all?"
|
And /signed
Yasmine
/signed
I fail to see the reason for totally killing this skill in PvE, don't we have a lot of useless skills already?
I fail to see the reason for totally killing this skill in PvE, don't we have a lot of useless skills already?
Steps_Descending
/ NOT signed
Some fact I can see :
1. This balance was a PvP balance
2. We either have some form of full-time anti-interupt mode (or almost full time) and are able to farm, or have very little solo (or duo...) farmign in the game. UNless we start being good players and can farm using a "classic" 4-party in 8man HM area. (I'm sure it's possible)
3. PvE/PvP splits are a good but HIGHLY innelegant idea for a game. They would be better to make PvP and PvE-only (or make the skills only viable on one side)
My conclusion : keep MoR the way it is. Then either kill SF or change a PvE only skill to act as anti-interupt.
Some fact I can see :
1. This balance was a PvP balance
2. We either have some form of full-time anti-interupt mode (or almost full time) and are able to farm, or have very little solo (or duo...) farmign in the game. UNless we start being good players and can farm using a "classic" 4-party in 8man HM area. (I'm sure it's possible)
3. PvE/PvP splits are a good but HIGHLY innelegant idea for a game. They would be better to make PvP and PvE-only (or make the skills only viable on one side)
My conclusion : keep MoR the way it is. Then either kill SF or change a PvE only skill to act as anti-interupt.
sonofthort
/signed
I was most upset to see this update as it effects my 105 build for dual uw (105/ss). There is no reason to nerf dual uw, and if they want to nerf 600's there is a better way to do it besides nerfing a skill which effects other not as over powered builds. Terrible.
I was most upset to see this update as it effects my 105 build for dual uw (105/ss). There is no reason to nerf dual uw, and if they want to nerf 600's there is a better way to do it besides nerfing a skill which effects other not as over powered builds. Terrible.
BrettM
Quote:
|
Originally Posted by Shayne Hawke
Anyone ever consider that nobody actually plays the game because everyone else is doing nothing but farming?
|
I'm a newer player (17 months now), so I'm still playing the game and have plenty of content left to finish. But, I'm also doing more and more farming. I don't have several years behind me during which I could have built up stores of cash, materials, party points, etc. through regular gameplay, and GW2 IS getting closer. What alternatives do you have to offer for the newer player who would like a chance at some of the nicer things in GW1 before then? Even with prices declining and the opportunity to buy some of these things from other players, it still requires a substantial amount of cash, which is not going to magically appear during the course of playing the game.
I don't want to speed-clear anything. I don't want to run dungeons. I don't want to make a character of a profession I don't think I'll enjoy just to farm. I don't want to be obscenely rich with 20 mules to hold all my stacks of ecto. I don't want to become the Tycoon of Kamadan. I just want to play my characters and have a shot at getting the things I desire over the next year or so without needing to become a 24/7 GW geek. A little raptor genocide here, a little tengu genocide there, a little hulkie genocide on the flip side. Nothing "game breaking" in any of that. Is that really so much to ask?
tl;dr version: /signed, with a bullet.
N1ghtstalker
/signed
want my damn 600 back the way she was
want my damn 600 back the way she was
Steps_Descending
I wonder if we'll start seeing monks going /W or /R for blockign stances...
EDIT :
Out of cusiosity, what goals are unobtainable for a dedicated by playing the game for 1 year. Remember most title came up when GW2 was at least 4 years away. ANd probably if they had nerfed farming builds from the start of titles, we wouldn't have the idea that the titles MUST be farmed, maybe we'd think titles are 1-2 years project, who knows.
EDIT :
Quote:
|
Originally Posted by BrettM
What do you expect? ANet set up a bunch of goals that are impractical to achieve without farming. So people farm to meet those goals.
|
Dawn Angelheart
I love this update. I thought that doing dungeons was supposed to be a group thing.. not a paying for a runner thing. So im very happy with it being killed...
Also.. waiting on shadowform to die a horrible horrible death also.
Also.. waiting on shadowform to die a horrible horrible death also.
athariel
I can 600/smite HM Shards of Orr without MoR, so this doesn't hurt 600/smites as much as it killed raptors.
QueenofDeath
/not signed
This helped end the 600 build and the build of many others who overused it for indivdiual gain. 60 seconds is a long time to be pretty much invulnerable to interupts. Even though I used it on all my monk heroes I'm glad it got what it deserved. Keep the game pugging. )
And with 33% of the vote that is plenty enough to keep the update as it is. You know anet you're going to have more whiners than agreement everytime you nerf something. So, don't change your minds and make them play some other way.)
This helped end the 600 build and the build of many others who overused it for indivdiual gain. 60 seconds is a long time to be pretty much invulnerable to interupts. Even though I used it on all my monk heroes I'm glad it got what it deserved. Keep the game pugging. )
And with 33% of the vote that is plenty enough to keep the update as it is. You know anet you're going to have more whiners than agreement everytime you nerf something. So, don't change your minds and make them play some other way.
)
HawkofStorms
The logic of "they should nerf all the farm builds at once, or none at all" is assine. If they had nerfed SF in this patch, but not 600, the qqing would have been the exact opposite (OMG why nerf SF and not 600, I don't want to make a monk). If they had nerfed both, people would just be threatening to rage quit (but not actually quit).
We all know this build should have been nerfed. Dungeons that should need a full party should not be 2/3 maned.
I expect A.net nerfed 600 before they nerfed SF just to gauge the reaction (ie, see how many people actually carried out their threats and quit the game) so they could know if it would be smart to nerf the much more popular SF.
Hopefully, the community doesn't rage too much. If you continue to threaten and complain about how nerfing 600 was bad, A.net might back down and not nerf SF, and completely undercut your own arguement.
We all know this build should have been nerfed. Dungeons that should need a full party should not be 2/3 maned.
I expect A.net nerfed 600 before they nerfed SF just to gauge the reaction (ie, see how many people actually carried out their threats and quit the game) so they could know if it would be smart to nerf the much more popular SF.
Hopefully, the community doesn't rage too much. If you continue to threaten and complain about how nerfing 600 was bad, A.net might back down and not nerf SF, and completely undercut your own arguement.