/not signed
plat/ecto/armbraces
Nothing wrong with current system, convert plat into stackable ecto or armbraces. Problem solved.
Raise the Gold Cap!!!
Wrath of m0o
gremlin
Quote:
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Originally Posted by Wrath of m0o
/not signed
plat/ecto/armbraces Nothing wrong with current system, convert plat into stackable ecto or armbraces. Problem solved. |
With the greatest respect and no insult intended but your dreaming.
Please explain to me why every player that wishes to buy high end items must either buy ectos ambraces from other players or spend valuable game time farming them before they can complete a trade.
lemming
Quote:
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Originally Posted by gremlin
Why do people keep saying there is no problem with the current system.
With the greatest respect and no insult intended but your dreaming. Please explain to me why every player that wishes to buy high end items must either buy ectos ambraces from other players or spend valuable game time farming them before they can complete a trade. |
So many people in support of this suggestion have been implying that they want to see people punished for accumulating wealth. That's a ridiculous sentiment.
gremlin
Quote:
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Originally Posted by lemming
How is that different from any real-life currency?
So many people in support of this suggestion have been implying that they want to see people punished for accumulating wealth. That's a ridiculous sentiment. |
I do not go along with the argument that anyone should be punished or lose out if the system was changed.
But it is commonly thought that some mega rich players want to preserve the current system for their own ends.
Why should the system change.
Anything you do in the game pretty much gives you gold this is automatically changed into platinum and gold as your wealth increases.
Under the current system there is a limit on how much platinum a player can spend on any one transaction and it is a bad idea for buyer or seller to pay in stages for items over the this limit as it can lead to scamming by either party.
So player must join the throng of ecto or similar collectors to enable them to make large purchases.
Some player have limited time to play the game forcing players to spend this time doing the very boring exercise of farming for ectos "however easy or difficult this is.
Alternatively they can buy ectos of other players and then hang on to these in case there is an item they want from some future player.
This system is not as flexible as gold and platinum you have a part currency part barter system and changing ectos for gold when you need to buy from traders and have run low on platinum or changing platinum back to ectos to buy off players.
The fact that a lot of players have bought into the ecto market and might lost out if it was changed should not be a reason not to change it.
Besides they could increase the cap or add another coin of a higher value to Platinum while at the same time freezing the value of ectos at the current price for a time to enable players to dump their ectos if they wish and start using coins.
Sethellington
/signed
we really need this...
we really need this...
Ewon
Quote:
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Originally Posted by gremlin
I do not go along with the argument that anyone should be punished or lose out if the system was changed.
But it is commonly thought that some mega rich players want to preserve the current system for their own ends. The fact that a lot of players have bought into the ecto market and might lost out if it was changed should not be a reason not to change it. |
Actually, suddenly changing the system that has been in place for years, causing lots of players to loose money, is a perfect reason not to change the system in place.
Quote:
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Originally Posted by gremlin
So player must join the throng of ecto or similar collectors to enable them to make large purchases.
Some player have limited time to play the game forcing players to spend this time doing the very boring exercise of farming for ectos "however easy or difficult this is. Alternatively they can buy ectos of other players and then hang on to these in case there is an item they want from some future player. |
Quote:
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Originally Posted by gremlin
Besides they could increase the cap or add another coin of a higher value to Platinum while at the same time freezing the value of ectos at the current price for a time to enable players to dump their ectos if they wish and start using coins.
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NerfHerder
Quote:
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Originally Posted by lemming
How is that different from any real-life currency?
So many people in support of this suggestion have been implying that they want to see people punished for accumulating wealth. That's a ridiculous sentiment. |
Most of us that have accumulated wealth in the game are already being punished. Your being forced to invest and trade in an unstable commodity. Sure its great when ecto value rises, but what about when it falls?
Your worth should not be dependent on what the trader says a rare item is worth. You shouldnt have to watch ecto prices like a stock ticker when your trading. And no one should have to invest into a trade item of variable worth, just because they reach thier gold limit.
Not to mention, ectos were never intended to be a form of trade(unless someone can prove otherwise), so it shouldnt matter if thier value changes. Thats the risk you took when you couldnt hold or trade more gold. I know its a risk because I have a couple stacks of ectos as well as nearly maxed my gold limit in my bank and most of my characters. It makes it a real hassle, even when I'm trading for just gold. I reach my limit, then I have to go buy more ectos. At least I'm willing to admit the gold system should change as the game progresses(like skills and content does). If you dont want this change because you have money invested in ectos/whatever, either your being selfish, or your not seeing the bigger picture. It might be rough at first, maybe worse than how HoM effected the economy. But, in the end, a change like whats in the OP would be better for everyone.
gremlin
Quote:
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Originally Posted by Ewon
You're not saying people should loose money, but you don;t think it's a good reason for the system to change?
Actually, suddenly changing the system that has been in place for years, causing lots of players to loose money, is a perfect reason not to change the system in place. Even if you removed ectos from the market, you would still need to farm all that gold. The item you are going for would just have a gold value instead. The items that cost ectos aren't going to going down in value, the ectos are what would go down. Do you honestly think Anet would put a freeze on ectos if they did change teh system? It would never happen, but I don't think they would change the system as this point anyway. Yes, the current system is flawed, but changing it at this point would be drastic. If a pure gold system was in place from the beginning, that would have been great. I agree, it would have been much better, just not 5 years into the game. |
2 you farm gold by playing the game you farm ectos by not playing the game, also many players have the gold, the game just prevents them from using it.
3 Its up to anet to freeze the price or not I simply suggest it as a way to allow a change without hurting people.
Freezing prices when they announce the change and giving a cut off date when the freeze would end could be a way to minimise any loss.
Mac_Eanruig
Yes lets help out our freinds in Asia who sit in internet cafe's all day long
selling gold over the internet, hacking accounts, and boting all over Tyria.
/not signed.
selling gold over the internet, hacking accounts, and boting all over Tyria.
/not signed.
NerfHerder
Quote:
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Originally Posted by Mac_Eanruig
Yes lets help out our freinds in Asia who sit in internet cafe's all day long
selling gold over the internet, hacking accounts, and boting all over Tyria. /not signed. |
yitjuan
Quote:
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Originally Posted by Mac_Eanruig
Yes lets help out our freinds in Asia who sit in internet cafe's all day long
selling gold over the internet, hacking accounts, and boting all over Tyria. /not signed. |
Necrin Blaed
I like how we have a fluctuating currency (ectos). It's kinda like an ecto standard (instead of a gold standard). Makes the game more interesting IMO.
Lord Mip
Giving fluctuating ecto prices as an argument is silly anyway. Money's worth also fluctuates because of inflation. You just can't express it in money so people don't see it.
newbie_of_doom
Quote:
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Originally Posted by Lord Mip
Giving fluctuating ecto prices as an argument is silly anyway. Money's worth also fluctuates because of inflation. You just can't express it in money so people don't see it.
|
Also, why does no one see that the gold cap is an excellent way to prevent inflation.
It's an amazing gold sink that people buy ectos from a trader.
Only for this reason, I would feel that the current system should stay. Besides, arguments of flushing away several millions on a lot players are solid. Especially while people are racing to the HoM.
Don't get me wrong, I do not like having to buy ectos because I have a million gold once more, but I don't really mind, especially because I know the consequences of their existence as a currency.
As for comparing this to real-life. You cannot really hold as much money as you want in a bank. You don't get interest over culcumulative money after you pass a certain absolute value.
fowlero
Just seems completely unnecessary to me.
People have made done with ecto/armbrace/zkeys or whatever for years since the game was out and it's brought an interesting dynamic to the in game currency.
It encourages people to trade between players rather than sit on their money which is in no way a bad thing. Plus to those agreeing to this as a good idea who are sat on stacks of ecto's, their price is going to plummit soon as people don't have to use them for 100k+ trades.
Much rather see their time spent on something new and/or useful.
People have made done with ecto/armbrace/zkeys or whatever for years since the game was out and it's brought an interesting dynamic to the in game currency.
It encourages people to trade between players rather than sit on their money which is in no way a bad thing. Plus to those agreeing to this as a good idea who are sat on stacks of ecto's, their price is going to plummit soon as people don't have to use them for 100k+ trades.
Much rather see their time spent on something new and/or useful.
NerfHerder
Quote:
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Originally Posted by newbie_of_doom
QFT
Also, why does no one see that the gold cap is an excellent way to prevent inflation. It's an amazing gold sink that people buy ectos from a trader. Only for this reason, I would feel that the current system should stay. Besides, arguments of flushing away several millions on a lot players are solid. Especially while people are racing to the HoM. Don't get me wrong, I do not like having to buy ectos because I have a million gold once more, but I don't really mind, especially because I know the consequences of their existence as a currency. As for comparing this to real-life. You cannot really hold as much money as you want in a bank. You don't get interest over culcumulative money after you pass a certain absolute value. |
GW has been around for over 5 years. Thats a long time for players to accumulate wealth. As skills and content change with the game, the developers should change the economy to accomodate it as well.
Quote:
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Originally Posted by fowlero
People have made done with ecto/armbrace/zkeys or whatever for years since the game was out and it's brought an interesting dynamic to the in game currency.
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Lanier
Quote:
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Originally Posted by NerfHerder
Oh yeah, sitting in an outpost for hours trying to get a good deal from players that are always trying to rip you off. Its about as interesting a dynamic as watching paint dry. I would rather play the game than sit in an outpost and waste my time watching grass grow. |
Why does anyone do it? I dont understand the appeal of having over a million k. If you're going to get that much money, why arnt you spending it? If you arn't spending it, why would you bother getting that much money? I mean there are plenty of things to buy in-game (for example, now that I have all the armors I want, i blow all of my money on lockpicks).
As for the original suggestion, I think there are far more important things that anet should be working on (skill balances and 7 hero teams).
newbie_of_doom
Quote:
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Originally Posted by NerfHerder
What consequences? We all take a risk when we buy ectos/armbraces/zkeys. They are not forms of currency. So you cant complain if thier value changes. Armbraces are a perfect example of this. Armbraces are worth half what they use to be. Did the market collapse? No. Did everyone who invested in them lose alot of money? Yeah. Did we get over it? Absolutely. If the gold cap was increased, ectos might lose about half thier value. Big deal. Its thier fault for investing in ectos in the first place. There is no guarantee ectos are set at a fixed rate. If the trading/bank cap were increased, the economy would stabalize in a month or so, and we would have a better trading system for it.
GW has been around for over 5 years. Thats a long time for players to accumulate wealth. As skills and content change with the game, the developers should change the economy to accomodate it as well. |
You ask with consequences, as trivial as this matter may be, let me point it out. O wait, you actually have yourself: "If the gold cap was increased, ectos might lose about half thier value. Big deal. Its thier fault for investing in ectos in the first place."
You are contradicting yourself. You know they have to buy ectos because they have to store money, yet you say it is entirely their own doing.
Then you say, the developers should change the economy to accomodate it as well. Obviously, you have not read my post very well, or at least you have failed to understand it. While I consider the change in the value of ectos to be harmful, this is not what I based my conclusion on. I merely stated that the gold cap is a good way to avoid inflation, and that that is why I, personally, want to keep it.
My conclusion is based entirely on this argument, yet you fail to adress it.
Your conclusion is based on the argument that the economy will finally stabillise and that you are of the implicent opinion that buying ectos is too much trouble or something of the sort. You have based this on absolutely nothing. Fact is, that there will probably be a large amount of inflation if the gold cap were to be removed. Not only because the gold sink of trading ectos would be removed, but also because of psychology.
Quote:
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Originally Posted by Lanier
Then why do you do it?
Why does anyone do it? I dont understand the appeal of having over a million k. If you're going to get that much money, why arnt you spending it? If you arn't spending it, why would you bother getting that much money? I mean there are plenty of things to buy in-game (for example, now that I have all the armors I want, i blow all of my money on lockpicks). As for the original suggestion, I think there are far more important things that anet should be working on (skill balances and 7 hero teams). |
Also, just to point it out, I myself do not think that it is hard to buy ectos.
And, please, stop using the argument that Anet has better things to do. It does not matter in essence.
lemming
Quote:
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Originally Posted by NerfHerder
We all take a risk when we buy ectos/armbraces/zkeys. They are not forms of currency.
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NerfHerder
It's getting to the point where people dont want gold at all anymore, even for items less than 100k. There is something wrong with that picture.
I bought the rest of minis I needed for my HoM today. Even though the cost was well under 100k, I couldnt find anyone that would take gold, they all wanted ectos. So I bought some more ectos because I was reaching my gold limit anyway. I found a good price for ectos, and asked the guy if he had anymore to sell. He said "yeah, but I need to buy some stuff first because I cant hold anymore gold." Sweet Irony. This was my own personal experience, but I know similar situations must happen all the time. It's utterly rediculous.
I'm not asking for the gold cap to be removed entirely. 2-5 times what we have now should do the trick. At this point I would be happy if they just increased our xunlai chest cap. I could then deal with bypassing the trading cap at my leisure. Although, the fact that we use ectos/whatever to bypass the trading cap makes me wonder. If we bypass the cap by other means all the time, why even have it? Why even have a gold cap at all?
Some say that the gold cap keeps inflation down. But, I'm not convinced. Goldsinks like merchant items(Lockpicks, ID/Salvage kits), crafting materials, Armor, and 9 rings sink alot of gold as it is. Should be more than enough to keep inflation down, only Anet knows for sure(if they know).
EDIT
Quite the contrary. The fact that we use ectos/whatever instead of gold should be questioned.
I bought the rest of minis I needed for my HoM today. Even though the cost was well under 100k, I couldnt find anyone that would take gold, they all wanted ectos. So I bought some more ectos because I was reaching my gold limit anyway. I found a good price for ectos, and asked the guy if he had anymore to sell. He said "yeah, but I need to buy some stuff first because I cant hold anymore gold." Sweet Irony. This was my own personal experience, but I know similar situations must happen all the time. It's utterly rediculous.
I'm not asking for the gold cap to be removed entirely. 2-5 times what we have now should do the trick. At this point I would be happy if they just increased our xunlai chest cap. I could then deal with bypassing the trading cap at my leisure. Although, the fact that we use ectos/whatever to bypass the trading cap makes me wonder. If we bypass the cap by other means all the time, why even have it? Why even have a gold cap at all?
Some say that the gold cap keeps inflation down. But, I'm not convinced. Goldsinks like merchant items(Lockpicks, ID/Salvage kits), crafting materials, Armor, and 9 rings sink alot of gold as it is. Should be more than enough to keep inflation down, only Anet knows for sure(if they know).
EDIT
Quote:
| We all take a risk when we buy ectos/armbraces/zkeys. They are not forms of currency. |
Quote:
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Originally Posted by lemming
Is there a reason you're saying this, or are you just inserting a claim and hoping it doesn't get questioned?
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A11Eur0
Quote:
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Originally Posted by lemming
Is there a reason you're saying this, or are you just inserting a claim and hoping it doesn't get questioned?
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What I have issue with is the requirement that everything cost so damn much.
Black Metal
/signed /signed and again /signed
the requirement to pay in ectos, armbraces, and placeholders obviously was never intended. The time wasted in-game buying and selling ectos just to get around the cap, or to complete high-end trades is crazy.
this is a no-brainer, no drawback, all upside deal.
edit: reading back a few pages and it's funny how ecto hoarders are against it. I've got 2 stacks of ectos and I don't care if they become worth half what they are now, this suggestion is a matter of integrity and principal.
It SERSIOUSLY sucks when another guild in my alliance suddently puts in alliance chat, 1 spot left for FoW leaving in 5 min, when my storage is at 1000k and all my toons are at 100k. When you literally lose a reward because you can't hold any more, and have to spam in GTOB to buy a freakin zkey just to do something in-game.
the requirement to pay in ectos, armbraces, and placeholders obviously was never intended. The time wasted in-game buying and selling ectos just to get around the cap, or to complete high-end trades is crazy.
this is a no-brainer, no drawback, all upside deal.
edit: reading back a few pages and it's funny how ecto hoarders are against it. I've got 2 stacks of ectos and I don't care if they become worth half what they are now, this suggestion is a matter of integrity and principal.
It SERSIOUSLY sucks when another guild in my alliance suddently puts in alliance chat, 1 spot left for FoW leaving in 5 min, when my storage is at 1000k and all my toons are at 100k. When you literally lose a reward because you can't hold any more, and have to spam in GTOB to buy a freakin zkey just to do something in-game.
Lanier
Quote:
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Originally Posted by newbie_of_doom
Because buying things is hard. I have had my thread open for years and I'm not going to bother with Spammadan.
Also, just to point it out, I myself do not think that it is hard to buy ectos. And, please, stop using the argument that Anet has better things to do. It does not matter in essence. |
The argument that anet has better things to do is perfectly valid. I would far rather them work on skill updates or the hero updates than on something useless like this. Its that simple, and yes, that is a perfectly valid argument.
gremlin
It has become blindingly obvious in this thread "not that it was ever in doubt" that the only reason not to either increase the gold cap or add a third tier of currency was the importance of ectos and similar to some players.
Those with stacks of ectos are quite rightly against a change that does not benefit them and may indeed ruin them.
So we either say to them tough luck or we try to minimise or remove any loss in their bank balance.
I suggest that since there are valid arguments on both sides we look for a compromise solution.
Firstly fix the ecto at its current price 9.5k at the moment.
I know ectos are rare materials not currency but lets ignore that for the moment and have the xunlai storage accept them as currency and offer a conversion service at the current ecto-platinum price.
result players will still farm ectos since they are valuable and needed for high end items.
Those players will no longer have to spend valuable farming time standing around selling them just dump them in storage and go back to the game.
Any player wanting to buy a high end item off another player can happily have the money on them so those trades go faster.
I don't see that anyone can complain about this no one loses money everyone trades faster and farmers still farm.
any problems with this I haven't thought of.
Those with stacks of ectos are quite rightly against a change that does not benefit them and may indeed ruin them.
So we either say to them tough luck or we try to minimise or remove any loss in their bank balance.
I suggest that since there are valid arguments on both sides we look for a compromise solution.
Firstly fix the ecto at its current price 9.5k at the moment.
I know ectos are rare materials not currency but lets ignore that for the moment and have the xunlai storage accept them as currency and offer a conversion service at the current ecto-platinum price.
result players will still farm ectos since they are valuable and needed for high end items.
Those players will no longer have to spend valuable farming time standing around selling them just dump them in storage and go back to the game.
Any player wanting to buy a high end item off another player can happily have the money on them so those trades go faster.
I don't see that anyone can complain about this no one loses money everyone trades faster and farmers still farm.
any problems with this I haven't thought of.
Black Metal
Quote:
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Originally Posted by gremlin
any problems with this I haven't thought of.
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Ectos should really be taken out of this equation, because the problem isn't ectos -- it's the gold cap. Raise it.
gremlin
Quote:
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Originally Posted by Black Metal
yes, and you even pointed it out: ectos are rare materials and their price at the trader depends on the economy. Ectos do vary in price, as skills are nerfed, broken, or certain bars get out to the public that are quite condusive to farming ectos.
Ectos should really be taken out of this equation, because the problem isn't ectos -- it's the gold cap. Raise it. |
Gold and Platinum are rare materials, not classed as such by the game but still that is what they are.
For that matter the game doesn't really emphasise gold and Platinum coins.
With both sides in this argument deadlocked those with ectos in quantity wanting no change and those wanting the gold cap increased to make trading easier wanting change, we are getting nowhere.
So a compromise that preserves the current system with just one change that of setting the player storage to deal in ectos would seem to be fair.
Farming preserved value of ectos preserved gold cap effectively increased so no time wasted buying and selling ectos.
Its not perfect as a solution but it is perhaps something that reasonable people on both sides could live with.
Black Metal
reality check: Anet won't remove ectos from the rare mat trader. That's just how it's going to be.
and....gold and plat ARE rare mats? Between ectos not being rare mats, and gold and silver are, you seem to have things backwards.
And the game doesn't emphasize money? Ever done a mission, quest, zaishen quest, challenge mission, etc etc etc? Gone to a trader, merchant, crafter, etc etc etc?
Are we playing the same game??!!?
and....gold and plat ARE rare mats? Between ectos not being rare mats, and gold and silver are, you seem to have things backwards.
And the game doesn't emphasize money? Ever done a mission, quest, zaishen quest, challenge mission, etc etc etc? Gone to a trader, merchant, crafter, etc etc etc?
Are we playing the same game??!!?
fowlero
Quote:
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Originally Posted by NerfHerder
Oh yeah, sitting in an outpost for hours trying to get a good deal from players that are always trying to rip you off. Its about as interesting a dynamic as watching paint dry. I would rather play the game than sit in an outpost and waste my time watching grass grow.
|
The problem you describe is more a problem with the games (lack of) actual trading system, leading to time wasted finding the right price (for you), than the fact we use ecto etc for 100k+ transactions.
gremlin
Quote:
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Originally Posted by Black Metal
reality check: Anet won't remove ectos from the rare mat trader. That's just how it's going to be.
and....gold and plat ARE rare mats? Between ectos not being rare mats, and gold and silver are, you seem to have things backwards. And the game doesn't emphasize money? Ever done a mission, quest, zaishen quest, challenge mission, etc etc etc? Gone to a trader, merchant, crafter, etc etc etc? Are we playing the same game??!!? |
The game makes some things materials some rare materials etc.
In the real world and consequently many ancient civilisations and much of fantasy literature Gold and Platinum are rare materials.
That is why they are valuable.
ok back to the game
The game doesn't make a big deal about gold and platinum being actual coins with a head and a tail side.
You can see tiny images on the wiki which seems to show gold as a disk or sphere and platinum as a bar shape.
It really doesn't matter what they are, except that they are in fact a unit of material that happens to have a value, ectos are also a material that has a value.
We are attempting to discuss here how the current situation can be altered to make things better.
Some say leave it alone others want change and what we really need are lots of ideas untill we come up with one acceptable to the majority.
For me the ideal situation is a third valuable item to go above platinum and the best idea I can come up with is to create a new material.
Second best option is to increase the gold cap but that has us dealing with huge numbers on some sales and it all looks a little silly.
Third option is the one I came up with to keep the ecto holders happy by making a material already in the game part of the currency.
That way those that want the gold cap increased get their way and those that do not want the ecto market ruined get their way.
As I said everybody wins
Don't like my ideas fine you come up with some, be part of the solution not part of the problem.
newbie_of_doom
Quote:
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Originally Posted by NerfHerder
It's getting to the point where people dont want gold at all anymore, even for items less than 100k. There is something wrong with that picture.
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Quote:
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Originally Posted by NerfHerder
Although, the fact that we use ectos/whatever to bypass the trading cap makes me wonder. If we bypass the cap by other means all the time, why even have it? Why even have a gold cap at all
|
Quote:
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Originally Posted by NerfHerder
Some say that the gold cap keeps inflation down. But, I'm not convinced. Goldsinks like merchant items(Lockpicks, ID/Salvage kits), crafting materials, Armor, and 9 rings sink alot of gold as it is. Should be more than enough to keep inflation down, only Anet knows for sure(if they know).
|
Merchant items are a very small part of the gold sink. The ectos probably cover well over half of the total gold sink. Other major players are (guest) invites and Guild Hall NPCs. In fact Merchants bring money into the game, because you sell stuff to them as well.
NerfHerder
It's true raising the gold cap will deflate the value of ectos. A simple fix would be to freeze ecto prices at the rare material trader long enough for players to cash in thier ectos, if they wish. Or even create an NPC for just that purpose. That would prevent the huge loss of wealth most players fear. And keep ectos as a rare material for crafting. I have a couple stacks of ectos, I dont want to lose all that wealth either. But, if I have to take a small hit for a better system I'm more than happy to.
Ectos are responsible for half of all gold sunk into GW? Poppycock.
Ectos are responsible for half of all gold sunk into GW? Poppycock.
Bright Star Shine
What's all this weird stuff about the ecto's? I mean, they have been in this game for the entire time, and they served that entire time as a way to transact money.. Some things just aren't to be payed with in gold... Try buying an unded mini kanaxai in gold... (Ehr, lemme think... That would be how much? 2500a? I actually have no idea at all.. I'm gonna say 2500 for convenience.. If I'm totally wrong, please do point it out..) So, my hypothetical 2500 armbraces will result in ~60.000 ecto's, which is ~420.000.000 gold... Yes, this isn't a standard thing that will be traded, and perhaps the most expensive item in the game.. But it should prove my point.. There are more than enough items in this game being sold for 150-500e.. Trading 1 million gold is just bad..
And what's this bullshit about locking ectocap, so we can sell em? Who's luminous idea was that? What good would that do? Some people have dumploads of ecto sitting in their xunlai chest and they worked their asses off to get it.. Now saying to them "Yeah ehm, I know you had like 50 mill yesterday, I'm sorry, it's only 5 mill now.. Sorry we decimated your savings just because someone thought it was a great idea" .You would blow up the entire economy and screw up this game.. Not that economy is great atm, but it's more stable than it's has been in a while (besides DwG armbrace prices)
Yes, xunlai chest might have a higher cap, perhaps 10 mill would still be ok, but trade windows and personal cap should be left alone.. Forcing people to still use other means.. Although the 1mill cap is still fine to me, never bothered me at all.. Just go kama "WTB 14e = 98k", wait 5minutes and there will be powertrades swarming around you to sell their 14e they bought for 15e=100k...
And what's this bullshit about locking ectocap, so we can sell em? Who's luminous idea was that? What good would that do? Some people have dumploads of ecto sitting in their xunlai chest and they worked their asses off to get it.. Now saying to them "Yeah ehm, I know you had like 50 mill yesterday, I'm sorry, it's only 5 mill now.. Sorry we decimated your savings just because someone thought it was a great idea" .You would blow up the entire economy and screw up this game.. Not that economy is great atm, but it's more stable than it's has been in a while (besides DwG armbrace prices)
Yes, xunlai chest might have a higher cap, perhaps 10 mill would still be ok, but trade windows and personal cap should be left alone.. Forcing people to still use other means.. Although the 1mill cap is still fine to me, never bothered me at all.. Just go kama "WTB 14e = 98k", wait 5minutes and there will be powertrades swarming around you to sell their 14e they bought for 15e=100k...
SpyderArachnid
Who cares if ecto/armbraces/etc drop in price? Raise the cap. It just makes sense.
If you lose money cause you invested your money into a crafting material, then too bad. Ecto is no where on par with platinum. Can you buy stuff from an NPC with Ecto or an Armbrace? No. The community made them worth something, not the game.
If Anet raises the gold cap, and it causes ecto prices to drop, we only have ourselves to blame for investing money in a crafting material. It isn't Anet's fault if we lose money cause they raise the cap. And no, platinum and gold is not a material. It is currency. Currency that you can actually use at vendors and such. Unlike Ecto or Armbraces.
So the gold cap needs to be raised. /signed
If you lose money cause you invested your money into a crafting material, then too bad. Ecto is no where on par with platinum. Can you buy stuff from an NPC with Ecto or an Armbrace? No. The community made them worth something, not the game.
If Anet raises the gold cap, and it causes ecto prices to drop, we only have ourselves to blame for investing money in a crafting material. It isn't Anet's fault if we lose money cause they raise the cap. And no, platinum and gold is not a material. It is currency. Currency that you can actually use at vendors and such. Unlike Ecto or Armbraces.
So the gold cap needs to be raised. /signed
Black Metal
yeah, it makes no sense (other than personal greed) to involve ectos in this discussion at all, as ectos aren't the problem, they are a symptom. The problem is the gold cap is way too low, leading to people contriving all these strange work-arounds; therefore, the solution should be the most direct one: raise the cap. As the OP suggested. That is all this is about and should involve.
Lord Mip
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Originally Posted by SpyderArachnid
If you lose money cause you invested your money into a crafting material, then too bad. E
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Bright Star Shine
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Originally Posted by SpyderArachnid
Who cares if ecto/armbraces/etc drop in price? Raise the cap. It just makes sense.
If you lose money cause you invested your money into a crafting material, then too bad. Ecto is no where on par with platinum. Can you buy stuff from an NPC with Ecto or an Armbrace? No. The community made them worth something, not the game. If Anet raises the gold cap, and it causes ecto prices to drop, we only have ourselves to blame for investing money in a crafting material. It isn't Anet's fault if we lose money cause they raise the cap. And no, platinum and gold is not a material. It is currency. Currency that you can actually use at vendors and such. Unlike Ecto or Armbraces. So the gold cap needs to be raised. /signed |
HEEEEEEEEEELLLLLLLLLLOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO!!!!!!!!! !!!!!!!!!!
You know why they are involved, because it makes SENSE! The goldcap is so low in order that instead of gold, players would come with solutions to trade valuable thing.. Rare weapons sometimes, Minipets etc and mainly Ecto and or Armbraces, because that's how economy works...
gremlin
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Originally Posted by Bright Star Shine
What's all this weird stuff about the ecto's? I mean, they have been in this game for the entire time, and they served that entire time as a way to transact money.. Some things just aren't to be payed with in gold... Try buying an unded mini kanaxai in gold... (Ehr, lemme think... That would be how much? 2500a? I actually have no idea at all.. I'm gonna say 2500 for convenience.. If I'm totally wrong, please do point it out..) So, my hypothetical 2500 armbraces will result in ~60.000 ecto's, which is ~420.000.000 gold... Yes, this isn't a standard thing that will be traded, and perhaps the most expensive item in the game.. But it should prove my point.. There are more than enough items in this game being sold for 150-500e.. Trading 1 million gold is just bad..
And what's this bullshit about locking ectocap, so we can sell em? Who's luminous idea was that? What good would that do? Some people have dumploads of ecto sitting in their xunlai chest and they worked their asses off to get it.. Now saying to them "Yeah ehm, I know you had like 50 mill yesterday, I'm sorry, it's only 5 mill now.. Sorry we decimated your savings just because someone thought it was a great idea" .You would blow up the entire economy and screw up this game.. Not that economy is great atm, but it's more stable than it's has been in a while (besides DwG armbrace prices) Yes, xunlai chest might have a higher cap, perhaps 10 mill would still be ok, but trade windows and personal cap should be left alone.. Forcing people to still use other means.. Although the 1mill cap is still fine to me, never bothered me at all.. Just go kama "WTB 14e = 98k", wait 5minutes and there will be powertrades swarming around you to sell their 14e they bought for 15e=100k... |
But there are alternatives.
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Originally Posted by Bright Star Shine
Torment Weapons, Obby Armor and Chaos gloves say
HEEEEEEEEEELLLLLLLLLLOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO!!!!!!!!! !!!!!!!!!! You know why they are involved, because it makes SENSE! The goldcap is so low in order that instead of gold, players would come with solutions to trade valuable thing.. Rare weapons sometimes, Minipets etc and mainly Ecto and or Armbraces, because that's how economy works... |
For some reason they never considered introducing a minipet in one part of the world only would ever lead to player considering them a lost masterpiece worth millions.
The trade in ectos ambracers etc just proves you cannot stop players playing the game the way they want to, so again I agree with you.
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Originally Posted by Lord Mip
Give me a viable alternative to Globs of Ectoplasm to store my 10 million gold in then ..
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Anet could and should create a larger unit of currency above platinum to replace ectos, . with the alternative suggestion that they could allow free exchange of ectos within the xunlai chest at a fixed price.
If you have 200 ectos today worth 8,000k apiece you would after the change still have 200 ectos worth 8000k apiece and they would work in exactly the same way gold and platinum works now.
They could stay in the rare materials trader but again at a fixed price.
Not as good as creating a third unit of currency from scratch but still a reasonable system to work with.
If we went with the ectos as currency what would be the result.
1 ectos would hold their value.
2 players could and would still farm ectos since they would be well worth it.
3 player could trade for items using ectos as they do now with no danger of the value diminishing.
4 everyone could just put their ectos into storage without trying to sell to players.
there are 2 downsides to using ectos as a currency.
Firstly you have a rare material that takes up storage space rather than a pure unit of currency that takes no space at all.
Secondly there would be no way to buy and sell ectos to power trade
Bright Star Shine
Thanks for agreeing with me, but I HAVE to disagree with you..
If Anet didn't consider that 1mill/person would be high enough and noone would need more, they would've been a bunch of monkeys throwing feces at retards, who would read the feces to come up with ideas on how to make a game..
Of course they considered it, why do you think Rare Materials are in the game? They are there for that exact reason..
And sorry gremlin, but capping Ecto's at their current rate is the dumbest idea of em all in this entire article.. It has no use, it makes no sense and it's just plain stupid.. It would destroy this entire economy (which is as it was intended) and just because some guy was too lazy to stand in kama or ToA to buy some ecto's...
And to all those people who are ranting about it, but are admitting that the goldcap is perfect for them because they will never reach it anyway, then why are you ranting in the first place? Say something useful instead please..
And can all of you PLEASE just think about this for one minute out of a rational perspective and come to the conclusion that as it is, it's perfect.. And messing with ecto has NO USE, because they are ment to be what they are now.. And don't give me the crap of "paying with a rare mat is stupid, because you need to may with money" What is money IRL do you think? It is a coin or piece of paper that represents a certain amount of GOLD (A RARE MATERIAL) that is stored somewhere in a big vault.. So, basing an economy on rare materials is stupid all of a sudden? What do you think your life is based on..
If Anet didn't consider that 1mill/person would be high enough and noone would need more, they would've been a bunch of monkeys throwing feces at retards, who would read the feces to come up with ideas on how to make a game..
Of course they considered it, why do you think Rare Materials are in the game? They are there for that exact reason..
And sorry gremlin, but capping Ecto's at their current rate is the dumbest idea of em all in this entire article.. It has no use, it makes no sense and it's just plain stupid.. It would destroy this entire economy (which is as it was intended) and just because some guy was too lazy to stand in kama or ToA to buy some ecto's...
And to all those people who are ranting about it, but are admitting that the goldcap is perfect for them because they will never reach it anyway, then why are you ranting in the first place? Say something useful instead please..
And can all of you PLEASE just think about this for one minute out of a rational perspective and come to the conclusion that as it is, it's perfect.. And messing with ecto has NO USE, because they are ment to be what they are now.. And don't give me the crap of "paying with a rare mat is stupid, because you need to may with money" What is money IRL do you think? It is a coin or piece of paper that represents a certain amount of GOLD (A RARE MATERIAL) that is stored somewhere in a big vault.. So, basing an economy on rare materials is stupid all of a sudden? What do you think your life is based on..
SpyderArachnid
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Originally Posted by Lord Mip
Give me a viable alternative to Globs of Ectoplasm to store my 10 million gold in then ..
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I don't know. Go buy something? Work on a title? Get stuff for your alts? Help out a friend/guild mate? Help out a random person?
There is several alternatives to what you can do with that money. I'm sure if you are sitting on 10 million gold, then you obviously have no use for it or else you would of spent of something that you wanted instead of storing 10 million gold.
And if you have 10 million gold in ecto/armbraces, then this is the reason why we say the gold cap needs to be raised. Cause then you won't have to carry about tons of ecto/armbraces just to have a place for your money.
So instead of complaining that you have no where to store your 10 million gold, then suggest something or do something about it. Raising the gold cap would take care of that problem for you, so I don't understand what the big deal is. If the gold cap is raised, then you can store your gold.
Anet didn't force you to spend your gold on ecto. You chose to do so. There is a million of things that you could invest your money into, but you as a player chose ecto. And if ecto prices drop because the gold cap is raised, we have only ourselves to blame for that, not Anet. They don't decide that ecto is a form of currency, we made it currency.
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Originally Posted by Bright Star Shine
And don't give me the crap of "paying with a rare mat is stupid, because you need to may with money" What is money IRL do you think? It is a coin or piece of paper that represents a certain amount of GOLD (A RARE MATERIAL) that is stored somewhere in a big vault.. So, basing an economy on rare materials is stupid all of a sudden? What do you think your life is based on..
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newbie_of_doom
Really? Do I have to repeat myself again?
It is not the main issue that raising the gold cap is going to deflate ectos and bankrupt a lot of players. The main issue is that the gold cap is a good way to prevent inflation.
Start discussing this, rather than ignoring it.
I'm trying to buy decent weapons, weapon mods and that kind of stuff without spending too much time getting. I mainly play PvP and fore some reason got insanely rich of it because zaishen keys are tradable. That's how I have trouble buying stuff. I , however, have not ever had any trouble buying ectos.
And, no it is not a valid argument for wether this a good idea or not. While this kind of pragmatic analysis is certainly a valid argument in deciding wether to progress an idea that is considered good, it is not valid in our current, theoritical discussion.
False, I think they actually did consider that players would need more money than did. Even if they didn't, it doesn't change that ectos are a great way of preventing inflation.
Not very good ones.
I detect mass-inflation.
So? Just powertrade zaishen keys or whatever.
I like being a rich boy.
Anet didn't force you to hang onto gold either. Your argument isn't very solid. While it may seem as though gold is a natural valuta, ectos and ambraces or whatever have become so as well.
On a way off-topic side note: Bright Star Shine, I did misread your post earlier, in the staff slaying mod thread.^^
It is not the main issue that raising the gold cap is going to deflate ectos and bankrupt a lot of players. The main issue is that the gold cap is a good way to prevent inflation.
Start discussing this, rather than ignoring it.
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Originally Posted by Lanier
I don't know what your trying to buy, but I have no problem spending my gold. Lockpicks are easy to find, as are kegs of ale, Zkeys, etc. I also spend money on prizes for games that I play with my guildies... so yea, I dont see how you could have trouble buying stuff (unless you have already finished everything left to do in the game... in which case, why are you still playing?)
The argument that anet has better things to do is perfectly valid. I would far rather them work on skill updates or the hero updates than on something useless like this. Its that simple, and yes, that is a perfectly valid argument. |
And, no it is not a valid argument for wether this a good idea or not. While this kind of pragmatic analysis is certainly a valid argument in deciding wether to progress an idea that is considered good, it is not valid in our current, theoritical discussion.
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Originally Posted by gremlin
The goldcap is so low because anet never figured that the players would ever need anything higher.
For some reason they never considered introducing a minipet in one part of the world only would ever lead to player considering them a lost masterpiece worth millions. The trade in ectos ambracers etc just proves you cannot stop players playing the game the way they want to, so again I agree with you. |
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Originally Posted by gremlin
I have given you alternatives in this thread no once but several times.
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Originally Posted by gremlin
If you have 200 ectos today worth 8,000k apiece you would after the change still have 200 ectos worth 8000k apiece and they would work in exactly the same way gold and platinum works now.
They could stay in the rare materials trader but again at a fixed price. Not as good as creating a third unit of currency from scratch but still a reasonable system to work with. If we went with the ectos as currency what would be the result. 1 ectos would hold their value. 2 players could and would still farm ectos since they would be well worth it. 3 player could trade for items using ectos as they do now with no danger of the value diminishing. 4 everyone could just put their ectos into storage without trying to sell to players. |
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Originally Posted by gremlin
Secondly there would be no way to buy and sell ectos to power trade
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Originally Posted by SpyderArachnid
How about ask yourself why you need to have 10 million gold?
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Originally Posted by SpyderArachnid
Anet didn't force you to spend your gold on ecto. You chose to do so. There is a million of things that you could invest your money into, but you as a player chose ecto. And if ecto prices drop because the gold cap is raised, we have only ourselves to blame for that, not Anet. They don't decide that ecto is a form of currency, we made it currency.
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On a way off-topic side note: Bright Star Shine, I did misread your post earlier, in the staff slaying mod thread.^^