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Originally Posted by FyrFytr998
... Or even an Elite skill that summons all animals in the immediate area to your party's aid.
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| ... Make preparations on par with Rits spirit spamming. |
So, what's next on your priority list for PvE balance?
Amy Awien
some guy
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Originally Posted by Shriketalon
Monks: Worst energy management of any caster, terrible smiting prayers, and the only primary attribute in the game which offers no benefit to any secondary skills. Nothing in the Monk's arsenal can compare to Spirit Siphon, Lyssa's Aura/Power Drain, Signet of Lost Souls, or the way Soul Reaping lets Necromancers go “Lol, energy”. If other caster classes can be perfectly viable without relying on secondaries just to get by, the Monk should be able to manage his own energy without using other professions as a crutch. And while they do fine in the support category, Monks have very little diversity; smiting prayers are practically worthless except for a single elite and get no benefit from Divine Favor, and their primary attribute can't boost their signets, their offense, or any secondary/PvE only skills. Improving them a little would give monk players other things they can do. |
miriforst
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Originally Posted by shoyon456
Do you see any class running around performing a Ranger's role with a bow better than a Ranger? No, you do not.
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I am surprised such a lot of people actually wan't the ranger to be next considering the previous campaigns on buffing the paragon that was going on at the same time as the dervish threads
I see no reason to really set my foot in pve as a ranger since AS nerf except maybe rolling my Beastmaster build but guys lets be real, they will never roll another skill update of importance. The amount of time this one took along with the fact that they probably won't give a brick about gw1 and focus on their new darling gw2.
We are the oldest child now and a there is a new kid in the familly. And our "parents" are going to focus every point of affection on it
Voodoo Rage
How about an elite that lets you charm ANY animal you come across on the map and they immediately level up to the current level up to your existing pet. The number of animals you can have is limited by every 3 ranks of Beast Mastery. Too OP?
Bassma
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What do you think needs balance now? |
Bassma
A good ranger improvement would be to make preparations last 60 seconds with a 10 second recharge. Also allow rangers to have more than one prepartion active at a time. That would put them back up there again. Oh and make Escape last 12 seconds.
Also allow rangers to have more than one prepartion active at a time. That would put them back up there again. Oh and make Escape last 12 seconds.
Ugh
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Originally Posted by Voodoo Rage
How about an elite that lets you charm ANY animal you come across on the map and they immediately level up to the current level up to your existing pet. The number of animals you can have is limited by every 3 ranks of Beast Mastery. Too OP?
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Something like:
Charm Animal (PvE)
10e 10c
Skill. Charm target animal. If you have an animal companion, this skill activates x% faster, and target animal travels with you. This skill is disabled.
would be fun, imo, especially if pet attacks applied to both pets.
Still used the same way to charm your legit pet, but now it doesn't turn useless as soon as you get one. Doesn't recharge on morale boost, so there's a max of two pets. PvE/PvP split removes the functionalities made redundant by Comfort buff, mostly just because the skill description would be long as hell. It would still buff the animal to the level of the pet, but I don't know how to word that in a non-awkward manner.
I don't see this happening, though. I don't expect any update to rangers, but if there is going to be one, it probably won't have complex functionality changes.
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Originally Posted by Bassma
Oh and make Escape last 12 seconds.
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AndrewSX
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Originally Posted by miriforst
Ehh not to start any trouble but ritualists and assasins makes better barragers than rangers, and thats one of the few "ranger roles with a bow" left.
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| I see no reason to really set my foot in pve as a ranger since AS nerf except maybe rolling my Beastmaster build but guys lets be real, they will never roll another skill update of importance. The amount of time this one took along with the fact that they probably won't give a brick about gw1 and focus on their new darling gw2. |
miriforst
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Originally Posted by Ugh
Or make Escape give a 66% speed increase with no blocking. That'd be fun.
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To have rangers as the fastest class would make sense, and with ranger melee gimmicks gone it wouldn't be as much pain to balance.
Ive though about something like "loose X hexes" to be added to the current escape to make it an actual escape.
Thematically Rangers are supposed to have nature on their side and thus strong vs spell casters and the unnatural. But they choosed to instead make them weak which ofc is logical but more ranger hex hate would be nice, elemental armor covers from elementalists and ritus.
But this function would be to escape only ofc to make it at least good at what it is made to be.
ensoriki
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Originally Posted by miriforst
To have rangers as the fastest class would make sense, and with ranger melee gimmicks gone it wouldn't be as much pain to balance.
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All the Beast Mastery elites should make your pet come along, except Lacerate.
IMO Whenever you que a Pet attack, A) the pets current action is canceled or B) increase the pets attack speed 60% or something until the attack lands so that they can get those attack skills off properly when you want them to.
One of those should happen so the pet attacks go off when desired since Pet AI doesn't seem like it's going anywhere.
Traps should just be changed. One ranger shouldn't be able to place more than one of the same type of trap (2 barbed traps) within in the area range of one another. The individual traps should be improved. I don't think traps will ever be anything more than rather niche though which is fine.
Expertise should lower the recharge of nature spirits, legit.
miriforst
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Originally Posted by ensoriki
Where in the Rangers concept did it tell you they had anything to do with speed? Oh wait it didn't, that's Assassins with their get in and get out philosophy hence Shadowsteps, and the skill Dash (now competing with Pious Haste).
All the Beast Mastery elites should make your pet come along, except Lacerate. IMO Whenever you que a Pet attack, A) the pets current action is canceled or B) increase the pets attack speed 60% or something until the attack lands so that they can get those attack skills off properly when you want them to. One of those should happen so the pet attacks go off when desired since Pet AI doesn't seem like it's going anywhere. Traps should just be changed. One ranger shouldn't be able to place more than one of the same type of trap (2 barbed traps) within in the area range of one another. The individual traps should be improved. I don't think traps will ever be anything more than rather niche though which is fine. Expertise should lower the recharge of nature spirits, legit. |
Rangers where first m8, and they have a ton of agility and speed themed skills. They were concepted as the agile class before the assasin came along and mad the whole concept ninja. Rangers are swift, assassins are acrobatic with ninja tricks.
ensoriki
Being first doesn't mean anything at all.
Their called agile and wily, agile having 2 definitions one relating to movement and the other referring to the mind. Considering it was used right before wily, I'd assume the description of the ranger says they are quick minded cunning individuals. Not speedsters. Not a lot of discussion is needed for this, either when they said rangers are agile they meant in the mobile sense or they were talking with their mind which fits in rather well in the context in my opinion.
Regardless swift is directly used to refer to the assassin, not the ranger, so that's the end of that.
Their called agile and wily, agile having 2 definitions one relating to movement and the other referring to the mind. Considering it was used right before wily, I'd assume the description of the ranger says they are quick minded cunning individuals. Not speedsters. Not a lot of discussion is needed for this, either when they said rangers are agile they meant in the mobile sense or they were talking with their mind which fits in rather well in the context in my opinion.
Regardless swift is directly used to refer to the assassin, not the ranger, so that's the end of that.
Del
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Originally Posted by ensoriki
Being first doesn't mean anything at all.
Their[sic] called agile and wily, agile having 2 definitions one relating to movement and the other referring to the mind. Considering it was used right before wily, I'd assume the description of the ranger says they are quick minded cunning individuals. Not speedsters. Not a lot of discussion is needed for this, either when they said rangers are agile they meant in the mobile sense or they were talking with their mind which fits in rather well in the context in my opinion. |
ensoriki
How about we use a dictionary instead of wikipedia.
Also it's not the same situation.
Your "fat and stupid" line doesn't work. Im saying in the context used it appears that they are using 2 words to describe the mind. As agile can mean that you are quick witted, and wily means that you are cunning. Hardly the same as Fat and stupid meaning you have...a fat brain? Wtf? Your example doesn't make sense.
Swift can also mean that you are cunning. Though it has greater support in describing the assassins speed because the manuscripts put emphasis on the assassins presence and their evasion.
"nowhere and everywhere all at once" "prefer to avoid damage by not being there when the enemy's strike lands". There is greater emphasis on Assassin mobility than Rangers, which should be enough to understand my point.
Also it's not the same situation.
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World English Dictionary — adj 1. quick in movement; nimble 2. mentally quick or acute [C15: from Latin agilis, from agere to do, act] 'agilely — adv agility — n |
Swift can also mean that you are cunning. Though it has greater support in describing the assassins speed because the manuscripts put emphasis on the assassins presence and their evasion.
"nowhere and everywhere all at once" "prefer to avoid damage by not being there when the enemy's strike lands". There is greater emphasis on Assassin mobility than Rangers, which should be enough to understand my point.
Ugh
If Escape was given megaspeed, it would probably have to have a longer recharge so a ranged class isn't shittons faster than everything all the time.
Okay, no one uses agile to refer to the mind. Ever. Seriously. And it would be redundant if "wily" followed it, so that makes it even less likely, tbh.
Also, this is a stupid argument for several reasons.
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Originally Posted by ensoriki
Being first doesn't mean anything at all.
Their called agile and wily, agile having 2 definitions one relating to movement and the other referring to the mind. Considering it was used right before wily, I'd assume the description of the ranger says they are quick minded cunning individuals. Not speedsters. Not a lot of discussion is needed for this, either when they said rangers are agile they meant in the mobile sense or they were talking with their mind which fits in rather well in the context in my opinion. Regardless swift is directly used to refer to the assassin, not the ranger, so that's the end of that. |
Also, this is a stupid argument for several reasons.
Del
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Originally Posted by ensoriki
Your "fat and stupid" line doesn't work. Im saying in the context used it appears that they are using 2 words to describe the mind. As agile can mean that you are quick witted, and wily means that you are cunning. Hardly the same as Fat and stupid meaning you have...a fat brain? Wtf? Your example doesn't make sense. |
ensoriki
Even so it wouldn't change what the point of my argument.
Rangers were described Agile and wily, even if Agile is referring to speed.
The assassin is also called Swift, evasive tactics were well implied by the manuscript, and then theres the whole Shadowstep situation.
So I don't see how Rangers are supposed to be the fastest at all.
Rangers were described Agile and wily, even if Agile is referring to speed.
The assassin is also called Swift, evasive tactics were well implied by the manuscript, and then theres the whole Shadowstep situation.
So I don't see how Rangers are supposed to be the fastest at all.
Ugh
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Originally Posted by ensoriki
Even so it wouldn't change what the point of my argument.
Rangers were described Agile and wily, even if Agile is referring to speed. The assassin is also called Swift, evasive tactics were well implied by the manuscript, and then theres the whole Shadowstep situation. So I don't see how Rangers are supposed to be the fastest at all. |
More importantly, that escape buff was a random, out-of-the-ass suggestion that won't happen, so we shouldn't even be discussing it.
ensoriki
I wasn't talking about balancing merely that it made "sense" in the way described.
FyrFytr998
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Originally Posted by Amy Awien
The return of the original Otyugh's Cry ... It wasn't even elite, and, if I remember correctly, had the secondary (primary) effect of increasing the AL of all allied pets ... and still nobody thought it was useful. The problem with wildlife is/was that their level is too low to have any meaningfull impact.
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I guess reworking the preparations would be the most worthwhile thing. A longer duration prep and shorter activation time, would make keeping conditions on a foe easier. I had always thought they should have had a tear gas type AoE preparation that caused blindness with each shot like Ignite Arrows. Just that alone would make me play my ranger outside of ZE again.
Dust Tip Arrows: Preparation, 25e, 3/4cast, 45recharge - For 45 seconds your arrows explode on contact causing blindness for 3 to 7 seconds to target and foes adjacent to target.
That's what would make me a happy ranger.
mr monk rupsie
The first 10 posts contains to BUFF proffesions to a new hight. I would strongly dissagree to buff again.
Instead of buffing a proffesion more and more, how about give the monsters better bars, without the overkill-monster skills of course.
Like in Eye of the north or even better, War in Kryta.
And if A-net balance it in this way give them a particular weakness, (they have lack of anti-melee or have lots of enchantments).
Bring the level down of HM to just max = 20. And let the build matter how hard a group can be, not the more health, 33% more auto-attack and speed + overpowered lv 28 invoke lighting or whatever kind-of-high-level-spell-that-kills-a-single-unprotected-person.
In this way you have balanced PvE again in a great way. while keeping gimmick builds in check.
Instead of buffing a proffesion more and more, how about give the monsters better bars, without the overkill-monster skills of course.
Like in Eye of the north or even better, War in Kryta.
And if A-net balance it in this way give them a particular weakness, (they have lack of anti-melee or have lots of enchantments).
Bring the level down of HM to just max = 20. And let the build matter how hard a group can be, not the more health, 33% more auto-attack and speed + overpowered lv 28 invoke lighting or whatever kind-of-high-level-spell-that-kills-a-single-unprotected-person.
In this way you have balanced PvE again in a great way. while keeping gimmick builds in check.
Ugh
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Originally Posted by mr monk rupsie
The first 10 posts contains to BUFF proffesions to a new hight. I would strongly dissagree to buff again.
Instead of buffing a proffesion more and more, how about give the monsters better bars, without the overkill-monster skills of course. Like in Eye of the north or even better, War in Kryta. And if A-net balance it in this way give them a particular weakness, (they have lack of anti-melee or have lots of enchantments). Bring the level down of HM to just max = 20. And let the build matter how hard a group can be, not the more health, 33% more auto-attack and speed + overpowered lv 28 invoke lighting or whatever kind-of-high-level-spell-that-kills-a-single-unprotected-person. In this way you have balanced PvE again in a great way. while keeping gimmick builds in check. |
Amy Awien
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Originally Posted by FyrFytr998
... A longer duration prep and shorter activation time, would make keeping conditions on a foe easier.
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That'd be fun.
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Dust Tip Arrows ... That's what would make me a happy ranger. |
But also simple changes like making forked arrow hit two nearby guys and removing stupid preconditions like 'when not enchanted'. I mean, c'mon, 10E for that crap.
Xiaquin
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Originally Posted by Amy Awien
But also simple changes like making forked arrow hit two nearby guys and removing stupid preconditions like 'when not enchanted'. I mean, c'mon, 10E for that crap.
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But then there's just plain baffling: Precision Shot; low damage, yet unblockable, but 10e and easily interrupted.
Kunder
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Originally Posted by miriforst
Ehh not to start any trouble but ritualists and assasins makes better barragers than rangers, and thats one of the few "ranger roles with a bow" left.
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lolno. Tell me when rits can triple class to warrior and keep up SY while barraging. What does assassin add to barrage exactly? Critical barrage is lol.
Del
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Originally Posted by Amy Awien
I mean, c'mon, 10E for that crap.
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House Silvermoon
i cant even read past the first page of suggestions because of the gross lack of knowledge of guild wars and of how to balance a game. the retarded power creep being suggested is absurd. i sincerely hope anet doesnt listen to any of u.
Ugh
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Originally Posted by House Silvermoon
i cant even read past the first page of suggestions because of the gross lack of knowledge of guild wars and of how to balance a game. the retarded power creep being suggested is absurd. i sincerely hope anet doesnt listen to any of u.
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How about sharing your views instead of just criticizing?
FyrFytr998
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Originally Posted by FyrFytr998
Dust Tip Arrows: Preparation, 25e, 3/4cast, 45recharge - For 45 seconds your arrows explode on contact causing blindness for 3 to 7 seconds to target and foes adjacent to target.
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Version 2 would make it an Expertise Elite skill. With the duration of the preparation dependent on points invested in Expertise. Squishy support FTW.
Happy Rangers rejoice!!
Powercreep? Whatever. The game is in its twilight. Why not let folks have some fun before we drop our hard earned cash on GW2?
Del
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Originally Posted by FyrFytr998
Powercreep? Whatever. The game is in its twilight. Why not let folks have some fun before we drop our hard earned cash on GW2?
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ensoriki
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Originally Posted by Del
Since when does making a game piss-easy(well, even more piss-easy) make it more fun?
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Lanier
Ugg, I hope anet doesn't read this thread... they need to keep to their word and give paras an update before focusing on rangers. I wouldn't mind an update that targeted both classes but, unfortunately, anet chooses to focus on one class at a time (which is stupid...) and I would far rather paragon get their update. At least rangers are somewhat fun to play, even if they are subpar. Imbagons are boring as hell (and need to be nerfed to hell), and anything else a paragon can do is even more subpar than rangers.
FyrFytr998
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Originally Posted by Del
Since when does making a game piss-easy(well, even more piss-easy) make it more fun?
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Serious gamers are serious. In fact I'll make a deal with all the elitist gamers out there. Gimme my buffs back and 7 heroes, and I'll stay right here when ya'll leave. Sound good? This game is just a time killer for me. I have enough "challenge" and "strategy" raising my young daughters day in and day out.
Kunder
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Originally Posted by Del
Well, if you're paying 10e for forked arrow, you're already doing something wrong.
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Del
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Originally Posted by Kunder
Part of the problem is that ranger skills are 'balanced' so that you have no chance in hell to use them without expertise, and even WITH expertise you struggle to use them even half as often as a warrior/assassin/derv/paragon uses their skills. This works for PvP because rangers bring other very important tools to the table, namely interrupts and preparations. Neither of those have much effect in PvE, all the Ranger can try and do is attack spam and suck at attack spamming.
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Kunder
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Originally Posted by Del
You're probably just an utter failure at playing ranger. I pve with spammy builds all the time, energy is never the issue.
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ensoriki
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Originally Posted by Lanier
Ugg, I hope anet doesn't read this thread... they need to keep to their word and give paras an update before focusing on rangers. I wouldn't mind an update that targeted both classes but, unfortunately, anet chooses to focus on one class at a time (which is stupid...) and I would far rather paragon get their update. At least rangers are somewhat fun to play, even if they are subpar. Imbagons are boring as hell (and need to be nerfed to hell), and anything else a paragon can do is even more subpar than rangers.
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My Paragon doesn't even have SY, 2 lazy to take it to guild hall.
Also lol at the hostilities above me yelling failure this and failure that.
Del
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Originally Posted by Kunder
And how many 10e skills does that include? At 5e after discount you can't afford to use them more than once every other attack, which is pathetic. If you think what you can do is 'spamming' then chances are you are the utter failure at guild wars.
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mr monk rupsie
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Originally Posted by mr monk rupsie
The only thing worse than power creep is an uneven distribution of power creep (edit: actually, power creep isn't really even a problem if it's evenly spread). You can't just leave rangers, eles, and paras in the shitter because you don't want skills to be more powerful.
How about sharing your views instead of just criticizing? |
So it is better to alter this game to button smashing for all classes, then to a few?
Making the game more fun mostly means it is a challenge to complete the task.
Buffing another group of proffesions is not.
miriforst
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Originally Posted by Kunder
lolno. Tell me when rits can triple class to warrior and keep up SY while barraging. What does assassin add to barrage exactly? Critical barrage is lol.
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And if you were going for SY on ranger i would test out infuriating heat volley, supporting your adrenaline based professions (which are more numerous today thanks to dervishes). How strange does it not sound i know, but infuriating heat is one of the few spirits i can live with using. Fast cast, positive effect (for the most part) and fast recharge.
