Guild Wars Diversity - Discussion of new Races in the GW Universe

Stev0

Stev0

Lion's Arch Merchant

Join Date: Apr 2005

Halifax, NS, Canada

I see no reason why we cannot have player characters using current npc races.

Shiverpeak Warriors
Maguma Warriors
Stone Summit Warriors
Civilized Charr (some variation of the race)

All new races can have varying bonuses/penalties (higher movement rates, cannot be certain classes, access to special weapons only THEY can use, restricted to certain level, XP bonuses/penalties for certain class choices)

As for balance. I seriously doubt that this game is perfect for balance, no game is Rock, Paper, Scissor balanced.

I say leave out elves. Elves are done to death in every game.

Also if anyone thinks that Warcraft is completely original has'nt heard of Warhammer or any of the product from GamesWorkshop. WARcraft... WARhammer. Hmmmm. Warcraft is almost a direct rip-off of GamesWorkshop's Fantasy genre from Dwarves with Mechanical knowledge right up to the general Look and Feel of the world.

Getting back to GW however. There is no reason why GW should'nt have original player races in effect since to me ... the whole world seems a cross between Fantasy and Alien visuals.

Also this can be implimented through the expansion to avoid storyline problems.

CryingWolf

Ascalonian Squire

Join Date: Apr 2005

Charr would just be cool to play!!!

RepinsMirg

Krytan Explorer

Join Date: May 2005

Tacoma, WA

First Name Only

W/E

I think we need race of giant caterpillars I don't think I have ever seen that done yet.

TheIrishman

TheIrishman

Ascalonian Squire

Join Date: May 2005

Currently: NJ

Wanderers of YS

N/W

3 Quick things -

Weezer Blue, I've seen you ingame before - I believe it was either a GvG or an Arena match...

William of Orange - Forever Shall I Dislike your Name (William of Orange was a major no-no in Irish history), But I like your idea.

I LOVE the turning into an Undead thing - It should be offered At Ascension, or at somepoint afterwards. That would prevent the lil humbugger noobies from starting off as an undead and thinking "W007z0|2, 1 15 B4d455!!!111oneone" (That's an actual quote, guys.). I think it would actually be very useful ingame though, as alot of Monk spells focus on undead targets, thus giving them a wanted edge in PvP (I'd love to see my Fire/Smiting RP character actual do something in PvP), as well as giving the Undead-er a few wanted edges.

For example, I play a MUD (Old Fashioned Text Based Online Game) called LordTrox. In it, should you choose to be Undead, there are a couple types you can be, each having different abilities.

Implement that idea into Guild Wars. You have Proffesions, why not subclasses? For players who wish to remain Human upon ascension, why not give them a "subclass"? For example, A Fire/Smiter Mo/E or E/Mo could become a "Wrath of God", increasing the power of their skills and making them even more effective on undead.

For a player that wished to become undead, however, offer other such subclasses like "Death Knight" for N/W or W/N, giving them increased life + mana, as well as a special buff ability in each of thier Necromancer skill sets, such as "Fleshless" in death magic, which would allow the player to not have flesh for the next X seconds, making them immune to effects such as Bleeding and Disease, or "Soulshredder" for Blood Magic, which "As long as you mantain this enchantment on self, upon hitting an enemy, they suffer health degeneration of 1 and you gain health generation of one. This ability does not stack", giving the player a sort of built in "Life Syphon".

Just my (very long) humble thoughts.

Sirocco Starluck

Sirocco Starluck

Academy Page

Join Date: May 2005

Denial

Ether Jar [Ethr]

N/E

It'd be fun to play the "baddies", have characters that are already implemented monsters but on your side. I want a centaur. ;___;

Allanon Dark

Allanon Dark

Academy Page

Join Date: May 2005

im thinking that they might use something that nobody is thinking of. in the manuscript that came with the game they mention a wizard, Ordan i think, who opened portals to MULTIPLE worlds. so maybe a new race could come from one of those multiple worlds. but i couldn't see this coming anytime soon though. i think traveling to the underwold through the rift would be cool. who knows, maybe the person controlling the undead is on one of those other worlds.

Canook

Canook

Frost Gate Guardian

Join Date: Apr 2005

Toronto, Canada

Saints of Sin [SAS]

Mo/Me

as appose to new races, i'd like to see new character customizations...different faces, maybe clothes for in town, stuff like that. tatoos, scars, eye color, and maybe something with ur secondary. say ur a r/n for instance, you have the ranger look, but your skin is like an undead sorta color. that would be cool me thinks

TheIrishman

TheIrishman

Ascalonian Squire

Join Date: May 2005

Currently: NJ

Wanderers of YS

N/W

Quote:
Originally Posted by Stev0

Also if anyone thinks that Warcraft is completely original has'nt heard of Warhammer or any of the product from GamesWorkshop. WARcraft... WARhammer. Hmmmm. Warcraft is almost a direct rip-off of GamesWorkshop's Fantasy genre from Dwarves with Mechanical knowledge right up to the general Look and Feel of the world.
Another Warhammer fan.... I used to play before it became 35 Us Smackaroos for 10 guys....Stupid Capitalistic Bastards.

A: That is SO true.
B: Every. Bit. of. It. is. copied. And I Hate that. I hate WoW in General, but eh.

2 things:

1. Canook - Thats a good idea. I'd LOVE to see my N/W be somewhat buff. He'd look more like me then - Pale, Skinny, and >Somewhat< in shape. .

2. I have a cool idea - Transformation moves. 1 for each type of magic. For example - An Undead Lich for the Curses, a Vampiric Bieng for Blood Magic, the Fourth Horseman (IE: Death) for those who use Death Magic, etc.

For Smiting, have Azrael, the Winged Messenger of Death.
For Fire Magic, a move that makes you catch fire (in a good way) and grow.
etc, etc.

What would the purpose of this be?
When you're in these modes, you suffer from certain +'s and -'s.
For Example - The Lich would take extra damage from Smiting skills, as well as have decreased life, but would gain + to Curse magic and more mana.

The Fire Elemental would be immune to fire + have permanent Fire Attunement, but Cold Damage would be doubled, and his life + mana would be decreased.

Also, while in these forms, you can Only Use the Magic that you are Embodying (Note - Warrior's would only be able to use thier Weapon type)! These spells would be Uber Powerful, but the only spells you can use.

Gimme your thoughts.

Winterclaw

Winterclaw

Wark!!!

Join Date: May 2005

Florida

W/

Quote:
Originally Posted by Jia Xu
Personally :
1) any races added - they should come into the game and storyline in later chapters.

2) all race choices should be purely cosmetic. No more game balancing issues already! the character classes have been painstakingly balanced by the Dev team so that they are all perfectly viable options for play - now you want them to do that with races as well?

3) Add more faces/hair please! - and if you look at Necros btw, they practically are undead for all intents and purposes - check a comparison between a necro with white skin and Kain from the Soul Reaver series
I think Jia got it right, especially with number 2. The only other thing I can think of is give every race one generic skill.


Races that I'd like to see added:
Elves
Half-elves
Half-dragons
Charr
Dwarves
Lizardmen (if halfdragons aren't a possibility)
Maybe playable drakes or dragons (have their own special classes)

shady_knife

shady_knife

Frost Gate Guardian

Join Date: Apr 2005

Australia, Victoria

R/E

races are fine atm, i think just more skins colours, more hair styles, more hair colours, more faces, so you can make an orc, or undead, or drowl.....

Rhunex

Rhunex

Krytan Explorer

Join Date: May 2005

Dark Nightmare

E/

Well, when considering adding new races, you should all remember that GW as is, is only chapter 1 of their story. If you weed through the info on their site, they hint at adding new chapters which would include: New races, new professions, new skills, maps, quests, missions...pretty much like an expansion pack(and I think it will be sold as such, given the large size it couldn't be an effective update like the little ones they have). If this is the case, then I'm sure the team has already thought out which race(s) they'll be adding and other such things. Only time will tell I guess.

As a last thought...just think of how hard it would be to add a new race to the existing game in a reasonable sized update...it'd be near impossible because you need to plan out quests, skills, vendors, armor/weapons skins, and everything else that makes a profession unique.

Rowne

Pre-Searing Cadet

Join Date: Jul 2005

Me/R

Firstly, a lot of the aspects are already in place. What I'd like to see is a spin on the story from the Charr's point of view. Perhasp there was an instigation towards this ferality and they might even have a complex culture there with their own variant of right as to the war they're waging against the humanfolk.

I'd really like to learn more of the Charr and this seems to be the most sensible way. If this game really is akin to a book and following that ethos, selecting the Charr would be a sensible step forward as we've already seen so many of them and their individual classes.

Lastly I'd just like to note that it would be refreshing to play a Charr. The Tauren in Warcraft were rather nifty but they weren't all that original. The ancient Greeks came up with Minotaurs; Blizzard's work never was very inspired (that's just a personal opinion, no need to hate me for it).

However, I was stunned to find out what the Charr actually are and I looked up a few resources just to make sure I wasn't seeing things. They're Armadillos? How many games have we seen that involve gigantic, feral Armadillos? How many of those have seen them wielding weapons or as a playable race?

If you want originality, it doesn't get any more original than that.

Finally, I support the idea of the race being aesthetics only. For example; Hunter could be a renamed Ranger whereas Shaman could be a renamed Elementalist. This is what I'd personally like to see, simple renaming for exactly the same skills. What I'd really like to see (as they've done with the humans) is effort into showing their culture because culture is a truly grand thing.

Vusak

Frost Gate Guardian

Join Date: Apr 2005

well it seems obvious to me that the following will be playable races at 'some' stage in the future:

charr
dwarves
centaur
tengu

because they have differentiated models for the various professions.

undead i dont think is as likely because they are the typical mindless denizens of doom and destruction that wage war on all etc. etc. further some of them have resistance to bleed/poison and despite the weakness to holy, im not sure they would make the cut.

The undead Mesmer

The undead Mesmer

Delphian Scribe

Join Date: May 2005

Holland

No guild ;_;

N/Me

some ideas here hehe if they put in Tengu you should be able to chouse in wich clan you are like the caromi or avicari that gives you more cosmetical options no increased stats or annything only cosmetical so you could have 1 caromi tengu and 1 avicari tengu as your character

for elfs *blugh* i hate elfs they shouldnt be implented in the game they dont belong in it.

and last but least the Charr and the forgotten those 2 races are one of the coolest ever created (beside Tengu)

Fog Accomplice

Fog Accomplice

Ascalonian Squire

Join Date: May 2006

Lords of Midnight [oOo Alliance]

Hey guys-

I've been taking a look at the WoW stuff and I've decided that I think it'd be really cool if we were to have the option of choosing our race. The 8 professions are always fun but I just want to go for a bit more diversity between the character models. The new races, IMO, would add a bit more interest in your character.

My personal belief is the more you are able to customize your character's looks, the more interested and in-to the game you become. I personally would love to play as a night-elf or dwarf or whatever.

Anyways, voice your thoughts. Please no stupid insults, this is just an idea (which I'm sure has been given before, so sorry in advance ...).

fezpenguino

Ascalonian Squire

Join Date: Jun 2006

England

HoB

Mo/W

Since I started playing Guild Wars I have also agreed and thought of this idea. It's the natural thing to do, in a world like Tyria and Cantha, you can't really expect there to only be one race. I suppose ANet just didn't want it right off from the bat, otherwise they'd have done it the first chapter.

But indeed, this would add a LOT more diversity. People could specialise their characters a ton more.

You could add different innates for each race. Trolls would have thicker skin, so they'd have a natural 'armor' and of course, be somewhat stronger. But perhaps slower to attack.
Dark-Elves could have natural resilience against spells, but their offensive capabilities are slightly less.
Elves could have a boost to archery. But take a lot of melee damage.
Dwarves are harder to hit and gain a boost for using axes.
And humans would just be in between, with pretty normal innates.

Each race would have their pro's and con's.

KvanCetre

Wilds Pathfinder

Join Date: May 2005

The Madison Scouts

E/Mo

Fezpenguino
No, no, no. Different stats for each race throws off the whole balance issue anet has worked so hard to produce.

You wouldn't have anything but Dwarven Warriors and Elven Rangers.

Where do people keep getting elves from? There are no elves in guild wars!

Based on the fact that dwarves seem pretty content to stick to the Shiverpeaks, I doubt you'll ever see them elsewhere... honestly, there is no reason to play as anything but humans. Besides, in WoW you get a whole 4 or five faces, skin colors, and hair types.... so I'd say you get more options as a guild wars human than any race in WoW...

toon-a-loon

toon-a-loon

Frost Gate Guardian

Join Date: Jun 2005

Belton, Missouri

W/R

If we had like 3 more races like the Charr, avircara, and yeti. That would mean like to much work for anet. All the armor that is for the race we have now would have to be made from each race. If not atleast 3 different types of armor for each race.

NatalieD

NatalieD

Desert Nomad

Join Date: Aug 2005

I like that GW has only humans.

There are plenty of other games that have multiple races. Why should GW have to be like all the rest?

bilateralrope

bilateralrope

Desert Nomad

Join Date: Nov 2005

New Zealand

Xen Of Onslaught (Xen of the Pacific division)

If multiple races get intorduced, then I doubt they will have any stat differences from humans for balance reasons. So the closest we are likely to get is minor differences from a human figure like fur all over, different facial structure (say the ears get moved and reshaped), maybe a tail, etc.

Zui

Desert Nomad

Join Date: Mar 2006

The Benecia Renovatio [RenO]

Mo/

Quote:
Originally Posted by KvanCetre
Where do people keep getting elves from? There are no elves in guild wars!
There are elves in WoW.

@ Fog and Fez,

If you want to play a game exactly like WoW, go play WoW, please. Some people play GuildWars because it is not WoW. This would unbalance the game, just think of the bodyblocking possible with a frame 3x bigger than a normal charactars, much less special attributes... The day ANET screws over PvP and unbalances the game, is the day I quit and go find another game.

BrotherGilburt

BrotherGilburt

Wilds Pathfinder

Join Date: Feb 2006

USA

Mo/

Quote:
Originally Posted by fezpenguino
Since I started playing Guild Wars I have also agreed and thought of this idea. It's the natural thing to do, in a world like Tyria and Cantha, you can't really expect there to only be one race. I suppose ANet just didn't want it right off from the bat, otherwise they'd have done it the first chapter.

But indeed, this would add a LOT more diversity. People could specialise their characters a ton more.

You could add different innates for each race. Trolls would have thicker skin, so they'd have a natural 'armor' and of course, be somewhat stronger. But perhaps slower to attack.
Dark-Elves could have natural resilience against spells, but their offensive capabilities are slightly less.
Elves could have a boost to archery. But take a lot of melee damage.
Dwarves are harder to hit and gain a boost for using axes.
And humans would just be in between, with pretty normal innates.

Each race would have their pro's and con's.
Yes this would through off the game alot. WE can have differant races but they should be no differant than humans except for look...

Quote:
Originally Posted by toon-a-loon
If we had like 3 more races like the Charr, avircara, and yeti. That would mean like to much work for anet. All the armor that is for the race we have now would have to be made from each race. If not atleast 3 different types of armor for each race.
Char and yeti would not be good additions. Anet should only add races that are civilized and work with humans. There are 2 races that do so. The avicara and Dwarf. Therefor those should be the 2 added. Char and Yeti would be unrealistic as there is not one(except a single yeti collector) that don't attack humans on sight. A troll walking around and talking to humans in cinamtics would ruin Guild Wars. But avicara and Dwarfs can talk so adding them would make it weird.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Zui
There are elves in WoW.

@ Fog and Fez,

If you want to play a game exactly like WoW, go play WoW, please. Some people play GuildWars because it is not WoW. This would unbalance the game, just think of the bodyblocking possible with a frame 3x bigger than a normal charactars, much less special attributes... The day ANET screws over PvP and unbalances the game, is the day I quit and go find another game.
If dwarfs and Avicara were the added it wouldn't unbalence the game(However anyother creature would). They are both about the same size as a human. However Char and Yeti and Such should NOT be added as they would mess up the game.

Brother Gilburt

Imp

Imp

Krytan Explorer

Join Date: Apr 2005

Novum Igneus [NI]

Rt/

Quote:
Originally Posted by Zui
There are elves in WoW.
and we are not playing WoW...

I like it all being human, feels good.

KvanCetre

Wilds Pathfinder

Join Date: May 2005

The Madison Scouts

E/Mo

They would have to re-voice all the cinematics for new races. Not fun.

fiery

fiery

Banned

Join Date: Oct 2005

maryland

InYurFace Gaming [IYF]

R/

I like my gnome in WoW, but I can't stand playing the game for more than an hour cause of boredom, and this is to just having the game for 3 days. Keep the game to humans.

New voices would be easy just get a intern to snarl and grawl in the background.

Draxx

Draxx

Frost Gate Guardian

Join Date: May 2006

England Baby!

The ONLY way and i mean only way to make this work, woulb be to have a new race, that could ONLY be one class.

obviously which would not add much diversity like being a Night Elf Warrior, but that would not make a diff to me.

making perhaps elven druids that are specific to a new chapter coming out and obviously the only way to have the elven skin would be to have it as a primary class.

obviously even THIS causes problems with secondary professions working properly.

but it leaves ANET a door open *shrugs*

Kakumei

Kakumei

Forge Runner

Join Date: Jul 2005

Grind is subjective

learn this please

The day they introduce races is the day I probably stop playing.

echo envitas

Ascalonian Squire

Join Date: May 2006

E/W

Quote:
Originally Posted by Kakumei
The day they introduce races is the day I probably stop playing.
Now why would you say something like that?!


Seriously. If they just added in a couple more races you could look like, (i.e. Tengu) that had no other different stats, what would the difference be?
They would be the same - just different skins!

And it would add some much needed variety... I am personally so sick of seeing all these 'pretty people' everywhere... All of the cute little elementalists dancing around in underwear. ARRG!

I don't understand why anyone would be against this...

And btw, I'm a girl in rl, and I would still want to play a big Tengu over a "hawt" ele.

actionjack

actionjack

Furnace Stoker

Join Date: Oct 2005

Kali

W/E

There is always a race thread poping up every month or so....

Lots way to do race, in term of their ablity, way to added it, how they share with the exisiting human and profession, etc. Such work can go from serious undertaking (with all that combination of possible art assets and character animation) to sample, as just doing a new monster group.

But what I am more interested to know, is what is the player mentality behind wanting to play as a new race. Why why why? Is it because they want more variety? (if it is only interm of skills and playing style, new class can easily fill that role) They want it to be more of a Fantasy escape, which they are just not happy with their "human lifes"? They want to role play as another species? The attraction of unique cultures? The inter-racial hot loving?

Would be interested to hear a in-depth (in term of social behavior, player mentality, basic desire and needs, etc) disscussion on this.

dreamhunk

Banned

Join Date: Mar 2006

:P

E/Me

Quote:
Originally Posted by Kakumei
The day they introduce races is the day I probably stop playing.
that is why your going to see less and less people playing guild wars. there is no freedom in this game. it so lacking!

lyra_song

lyra_song

Hell's Protector

Join Date: Oct 2005

R/Mo

i personally dont see the need to play other races. Guild Wars depends on balance and as it has been said already, those new races would merely be humans with different animations/skins, so whats the point?

From my experience with other MMORPGs, having other races is just an excuse to say that you have more playable character types.

Instead of giving you the true costumizability of your build like in Guild Wars, whatever race you're in is pigeonholed into certain classes.

Bone Jangle

Bone Jangle

Ascalonian Squire

Join Date: Sep 2005

Border City Bandits [BCB]

Other races would be neat, but only if they're not any different stat-wise than humans.

Cjlr

Wilds Pathfinder

Join Date: Aug 2005

SMS

E/Me

Great idea! I've certainly never seen this brought up before... I know the search button almost never works, but could you at least try it? As a formality?

I've already said what my views on the subject are. Playable races are only viable if there are NO INHERENT MODIFIERS.

Plotwise, there are about five races that are developed enough to sustain playability. That is, they actually have some sort of civilization. Not to mention the fact that they can actually be any of the core classes. Yetis, Ettins, Gargoyles, those kinds of monsters just are not suitable for playing. The ones that are are Charr, Tengu, Dwarves, Naga, Dredge. No other race seems to demonstrate all the necessary criteria (of which I'm sure to miss a few): architecture, manufacturing, profession variability, nationhood, appendages, sensory organs, cognizance...

Rogmar

Rogmar

Wilds Pathfinder

Join Date: May 2005

W/

They do have different races
Canthans are different than Tyrians, ie Canthans are darker and faces are bit different than Tyrians...and this is only 2 Chapters...

Trylo

Jungle Guide

Join Date: Jan 2006

[Here] | CKOD

E/R

Quote:
Originally Posted by Fezpenguino
You could add different innates for each race. Trolls would have thicker skin, so they'd have a natural 'armor' and of course, be somewhat stronger. But perhaps slower to attack.
Dark-Elves could have natural resilience against spells, but their offensive capabilities are slightly less.
Elves could have a boost to archery. But take a lot of melee damage.
Dwarves are harder to hit and gain a boost for using axes.
And humans would just be in between, with pretty normal innates.
Elves? oh man...

Do you have a problem with being human? seriously? I HATE MYSELF CUZ IM NOT A L33T ELF! OMG!

how many people in GW say that...

I wouldnt mind looking at a different race every once in a while, it would be fun to be a sensali tengu (r those the nice ones?) or even a naga. But this would rise to armor and art problems... I would like to be a forgotten really their eles look pretty sweet when casting spells, but still i think its good only being human, it is easier on Anet, and also it just makes more logical sense during the storyline and the alliances.

Symbol

Jungle Guide

Join Date: Aug 2005

So let's examine this idea and see why it's a total waste of time. First of all there's play balance, as has been mentioned, which means races are merely cosmetic. Then consider the amount of work that has to be done, all the art assets for every combination of armor type and profession have to be redone for each race, along with new animations for each type of weapon.

Why should A.net do this instead of adding skills and new professions that actually, you know, add to the gameplay?

Deus Condo

Deus Condo

Ascalonian Squire

Join Date: Jan 2006

Virginia, United States

Play the Game [PtG]

W/Mo

I though dwarves were a different species entirely.

Cjlr

Wilds Pathfinder

Join Date: Aug 2005

SMS

E/Me

Quote:
Originally Posted by Rogmar
They do have different races
Canthans are different than Tyrians, ie Canthans are darker and faces are bit different than Tyrians...and this is only 2 Chapters...
I think it was fairly obvious that we were discussing the possibility of playing as members of a different species, but in case not...

We weren't talking about races as in variations within Humanity, but races in the sense of Humans vs Tengu vs Dwarves vs whatever.

Deus Condo

Deus Condo

Ascalonian Squire

Join Date: Jan 2006

Virginia, United States

Play the Game [PtG]

W/Mo

I think that different races would be cool, but without the racial mods. So there would be no difference between a dwarf or a human stat wise. And of course it would take some work to recreate armor and such, but no customization for our characters would be nice. I don't like seeing 5 different characters with my face when I walk through Forge. It would also lay way for racial wars like the ever-so-famous dwarf vs. elf war.

/signed (*no stat mods*)

Rogmar

Rogmar

Wilds Pathfinder

Join Date: May 2005

W/

Quote:
Originally Posted by Cjlr
I think it was fairly obvious that we were discussing the possibility of playing as members of a different species, but in case not...

We weren't talking about races as in variations within Humanity, but races in the sense of Humans vs Tengu vs Dwarves vs whatever.
I know, but it doesn't quite occur to everyone that maybe Anet wants to keep it a game full of humans...