Originally Posted by TheMosesPHD
They already deleted your account and moved on, so it actually would be quite hard for them to undelete something. With all the activity of the game, your slot on the server was probably overwritten by some other data in less than a second after it was deleted so there isn't any way to recover it. Like I said earlier it would be impractacle to spend the time to one on one hear out every single person they ban list out their explanation/excuses. Once again it's quite unfortunate, and it's quite easy to understand how much it sucks. But like I said you can't do anything about it so stop coming in and whining on the forums.
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Big Disappointment on GuildWars' System Admins
Ricebox
Quote:
leprekan
The OOPS our bad email from anet concerning my ban.
Discussion Thread
Response (GM Phields) 04/06/2006 02:54 PM
Hello Leprekan X,
Thank you for contacting Guild Wars Support. After reviewing the issue, it appears your account was blocked in error. The ban has been removed and you should now be able to log into Guild Wars. I am very sorry for any inconvenience this may have caused.
Take care,
GM Phields
Lead Guild Wars GM
Discussion Thread
Response (GM Phields) 04/06/2006 02:54 PM
Hello Leprekan X,
Thank you for contacting Guild Wars Support. After reviewing the issue, it appears your account was blocked in error. The ban has been removed and you should now be able to log into Guild Wars. I am very sorry for any inconvenience this may have caused.
Take care,
GM Phields
Lead Guild Wars GM
Ricebox
Quote:
Originally Posted by FeroxC
I dont think Anet should disclose why you were banned, as you or anybody else could easily post the information on a public forum alerting thousands of botters as to how ANET goes about hunting them down.
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Ricebox
@ Leprekan
How many days did it take you to get your account back?
How many days did it take you to get your account back?
leprekan
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ricebox
@ Leprekan
How many days did it take you to get your account back? |
Ricebox
Quote:
Originally Posted by leprekan
1 day but my guess MANY more emails than you have sent=p
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Loviatar
ummmm.................
has anybody noticed that those are not the regular auto respond messages but were handled by specific identified GM with the second message being bumped up to a senior GM who gave a more specific answer?
i have used the service and the first autobot responce is a series of suggestions that might help.
has anybody noticed that those are not the regular auto respond messages but were handled by specific identified GM with the second message being bumped up to a senior GM who gave a more specific answer?
i have used the service and the first autobot responce is a series of suggestions that might help.
Francis Crawford
Besides the compelling evidence that they can unban somebody , here's a theoretical reason -- backups and audit trails. They know what prior database transactions and/or states of the database were, at least to some extent.
A "database transaction" isn't just a trade, but can be any inventory change, any move from town to town, any change in any kind of status, any change in your XP, any change in your attributes, etc.
Most of those are written to disk at some point; many are preserved either on disk, on tape, or whatever.
A "database transaction" isn't just a trade, but can be any inventory change, any move from town to town, any change in any kind of status, any change in your XP, any change in your attributes, etc.
Most of those are written to disk at some point; many are preserved either on disk, on tape, or whatever.
leprekan
Quote:
Originally Posted by Loviatar
ummmm.................
has anybody noticed that those are not the regular auto respond messages but were handled by specific identified GM with the second message being bumped up to a senior GM who gave a more specific answer? i have used the service and the first autobot responce is a series of suggestions that might help. |
ummmm................ yeah.
Why I told him to keep sending support tickets in. Eventually you get moved up the food chain.
One of the suggestions is to ... "post on a fansite forum" Guru is listed as one of those "fansite forums" btw.
leprekan
Quote:
Originally Posted by Francis Crawford
Besides the compelling evidence that they can unban somebody , here's a theoretical reason -- backups and audit trails. They know what prior database transactions and/or states of the database were, at least to some extent.
A "database transaction" isn't just a trade, but can be any inventory change, any move from town to town, any change in any kind of status, any change in your XP, any change in your attributes, etc. Most of those are written to disk at some point; many are preserved either on disk, on tape, or whatever. |
Markaedw
Well Rice GL
Pandora's box
"in dept analyses" are probably computer analyses, just like most responds are automatically generated responds. Once this keeps happening resistance is futile since computers don't argue:
http://www.atariarchives.org/bcc2/showpage.php?page=133
Sounds familiar?
(read colums from top-down starting at the left, than to the right, top - down etc. press 'next at the bottom for the next page)
http://www.atariarchives.org/bcc2/showpage.php?page=133
Sounds familiar?
(read colums from top-down starting at the left, than to the right, top - down etc. press 'next at the bottom for the next page)
Str0b0
The bad thing is I'm stocking up on crafting compoenents. Not to sell to some third party site but to make a little in game gold and to help my guildies make armor and such. I'd like to know what protocols they use to determine if a person is selling for profit or just trying to make a little gold. Crafting components are some of the easiest ways for players that can't access the higher end levels to make a little extra cash in the game. If you pick up all the crafting components and all your loot throughout the game then by the time you hit Droks you can turn those cache's into at least 100 plat if you can sell it all off.
Rayne Nightfyre
Hearing things like this definitely can make you afraid, but if you just play the game normally and do quests and missions from time to time on various characters, it shouldn't come up looking like you're a bot or something. Cases in which someone is banned are extreme cases of farming, likely for many many hours on end. And of course ArenaNet will not ban someone unless they have ample proof that the person was associated with some sort of illegal action.
Imaginos
Quote:
Originally Posted by aron searle
You could be lying through your teeth, or anet could have made a mistake. In either case its resonable they should tell you what you did (specificly), if they have done in depth analysis like they said, that wont prove difficult.
In both cases those e-mails look to be auto-generated, if your innocent then persist, if not then give up. |
Imaginos
Hunter Sharparrow
Quote:
One of the suggestions is to ... "post on a fansite forum" Guru is listed as one of those "fansite forums" |
TheMosesPHD
Quote:
Originally Posted by leprekan
Prime example how some people will express their opinion even if they have no knowledge on the topic. If you aren't part of the solution then ...
You are incorrect. I was PERMANENTLY BANNED (error code 045) and managed to get my account UNBANNED. It took MANY emails to support before they figured out THEY OOPSD. For those saying why post here ... where else can they post looking for help on this topic? Anet is not a roadmap of help ... Anet sends people to sites like this one for help. |
TheMosesPHD
Quote:
Originally Posted by Hunter Sharparrow
I sometimes wonder if anets referal to fansites for certain things is just their way of saying "go away, I don't want to hear it".......
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yesitsrob
GW Support is questionable at times, a very funny thread I have read elsewhere involved gw support getting the name of the person wrong, and not understanding the most clear of descriptions about a bugged skill....
Ricebox, if you are genuinely innocent I very much hope you get your account back, if on the other hand you are guilty and know it... well...
I do think they should take a less "we got it right and we know it so don't care what you have to say approach" because quite often they do get things wrong, and they do mess up... 250 gold superior absorbtion runes anyone? And if you can accidentally screw up the entire economy and force a roll back then you're pretty capable of many other mistakes.
It is worrying in a way, I could trade a gold item with some bot (and not know it's a bot... lots of people say "20k ok?" now ^^ ) and i could have traded with someone i shouldn't have without really knowing... and get banned for this :\ hmm, good job i tend to use the auction system here
Ricebox, if you are genuinely innocent I very much hope you get your account back, if on the other hand you are guilty and know it... well...
I do think they should take a less "we got it right and we know it so don't care what you have to say approach" because quite often they do get things wrong, and they do mess up... 250 gold superior absorbtion runes anyone? And if you can accidentally screw up the entire economy and force a roll back then you're pretty capable of many other mistakes.
It is worrying in a way, I could trade a gold item with some bot (and not know it's a bot... lots of people say "20k ok?" now ^^ ) and i could have traded with someone i shouldn't have without really knowing... and get banned for this :\ hmm, good job i tend to use the auction system here
Gwenhywar
Quote:
Originally Posted by coldplay
I choose to believe A-net that they did the right thing upon your action in game.
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And they just banned him for that o.O. Luckily he managed to get his account unbanned, but it took him around 2 weeks and LOTS of effort on his part (while ANet were just trying to shake him off).
Soooo ya ... trust ANet with that. Especially since I personally know so many people that are buying ebay gold (and bragging about it everywhere) and haven't even received a warning.
Stabber
I support a policy of banning anyone for any reason at all, no explanations needed. I imagine their EULA already boils down to exactly such a policy. A company is not a government -- their policies are, and should be, geared towards maximizing their profits and sustainability, not bending over backwards to guarantee their customers life, liberty, and the pursuit of happiness. If they want to eradicate bot farming, they can ban everyone who has ever had a transaction with--or even been in the same district as--a botter, and still be within their rights. (They will lose a lot of customers if they do anything that crazy, but one assumes that they will balance this risk with the benefit of the action they take.)
On the personal aspect: Anet haven't banned me yet, but if they do, I'll take it as a blessing and stop giving them money. No need to take it as a personal affront -- just a termination of a business relationship. There are other companies, other games, and other ways to spend one's time.
On the personal aspect: Anet haven't banned me yet, but if they do, I'll take it as a blessing and stop giving them money. No need to take it as a personal affront -- just a termination of a business relationship. There are other companies, other games, and other ways to spend one's time.
lishi
Quote:
Originally Posted by Stabber
I support a policy of banning anyone for any reason at all, no explanations needed. I imagine their EULA already boils down to exactly such a policy. A company is not a government -- their policies are, and should be, geared towards maximizing their profits and sustainability, not bending over backwards to guarantee their customers life, liberty, and the pursuit of happiness. If they want to eradicate bot farming, they can ban everyone who has ever had a transaction with--or even been in the same district as--a botter, and still be within their rights. (They will lose a lot of customers if they do anything that crazy, but one assumes that they will balance this risk with the benefit of the action they take.)
On the personal aspect: Anet haven't banned me yet, but if they do, I'll take it as a blessing and stop giving them money. No need to take it as a personal affront -- just a termination of a business relationship. There are other companies, other games, and other ways to spend one's time. |
Stabber
Quote:
Originally Posted by lishi
so if for error they kick you out from a hotel in at middle of night after you paid the fee you will just find new hotel?
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Banin Galori
Quote:
Originally Posted by Stabber
I support a policy of banning anyone for any reason at all, no explanations needed. I imagine their EULA already boils down to exactly such a policy. A company is not a government -- their policies are, and should be, geared towards maximizing their profits and sustainability, not bending over backwards to guarantee their customers life, liberty, and the pursuit of happiness. If they want to eradicate bot farming, they can ban everyone who has ever had a transaction with--or even been in the same district as--a botter, and still be within their rights. (They will lose a lot of customers if they do anything that crazy, but one assumes that they will balance this risk with the benefit of the action they take.)
On the personal aspect: Anet haven't banned me yet, but if they do, I'll take it as a blessing and stop giving them money. No need to take it as a personal affront -- just a termination of a business relationship. There are other companies, other games, and other ways to spend one's time. |
When I have purchased a game for $50 dollars, I expect to be able to play it within the rules that the game company provides. Banning me for any reason at all is a violation of the EULA, since Guild Wars has agreed to provide me subscription-free access to the game as long as I follow their rules. No where in their rules do they reserve the right to ban someone for no reason.
I'm not sure what you're thinking, but you've already given them your money. Really, I'm sure the company would like it best if you bought the game from the store and promptly threw it in the trash. After all, this is a subscription-free service.
That being said, I believe it is necessary for Guild Wars to provide a valid reason for banning someone - which they do. Ideally, Guild Wars would provide concrete evidence for their reason as well. Realistically, however, the sheer amount of effort required to deliver evidence to all banned accounts is probably too much for them to handle.
If you really believe you're innocent, you'll just have to nag at them, all the way from the bottom to the top, until your complaint is heard. There's nothing else you can do.
Edit:
Quote:
Originally Posted by Stabber
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I have paid for the Guild Wars game to play it, with the guarantee that I won't be banned unless I violate our contract.
I have paid for a room in the hotel to stay there with the guarantee that I won't be kicked out unless I violate our contract.
Guild Wars bans me when I have not violated our contract.
The hotel kicks me out when I have not violated our contract.
The hotel has violated our contract.
Guild Wars has violated our contract.
Both are business models that involve paying for a time-dependent service. They are both fundamentaly similar, and the analogy is a valid one. Their contract with their customers is a fundamentally similar aspect.
Stabber
Quote:
Originally Posted by Banin Galori
When I have purchased a game for $50 dollars, I expect to be able to play it within the rules that the game company provides. Banning me for any reason at all is a violation of the EULA, since Guild Wars has agreed to provide me subscription-free access to the game as long as I follow their rules. No where in their rules do they reserve the right to ban someone for no reason.
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3. LICENSE TO USE(emphasis mine)
Subject to the terms of this Agreement, NC Interactive grants to you, for your personal use only, a non-exclusive, revocable, nontransferable (except as permitted in Section 4(a)) license to use the Service, and a non-exclusive, revocable, nontransferable (except as permitted in Section 4(a)) license to use the Software in connection with the Service, without charge except for new Chapters which will be charged on a prepaid basis according to Section 5.
Banin Galori
Quote:
Originally Posted by Stabber
IANAL, but from the EULA:
3. LICENSE TO USE(emphasis mine) |
(a) Terms of Agreement. NC Interactive, Inc. and ArenaNet Inc. (collectively, "NC Interactive") offer to allow you to play its multi-player online computer game "Guild Wars" conditioned on your agreement to all of the terms and conditions contained in this Agreement and your compliance with the posted Rules of Conduct.
14. TERMINATION
(a) NC Interactive reserves the right to suspend or terminate this Agreement (including your Software license and your Account) immediately and without notice if you breach this Agreement or willfully infringe any third party intellectual property rights, or if we are unable to verify or authenticate any information you provide to us, or upon game play, chat or any player activity whatsoever which is, in our sole discretion, inappropriate and/or in violation of the spirit of Guild Wars as described in the Rules of Conduct.
Should NC Interactive decide to suspend or terminate this Agreement with a User under any circumstances, the User will lose access to your Account.
(b) You agree that if the Service or your Account is suspended, terminated or cancelled for any reason or length of time, you are not entitled to any reimbursement or refund of any fees or unused access time.
Of course the license is revocable. If it wasn't, they won't be able to ban ANYONE, would they?
As stated in the first section, NC Interactive allows us to use their service provided we do not violate any terms of the agreement.
Nowhere in the terms of agreement does NC Interactive reserve the right to terminate any license for any reason at all.
What the DO reserve is the right to terminate the agreement should you conduct any inappropriate activity that violates the EULA or the spirit of Guild Wars.
Just because the license is revocable does not mean they can revoke it for ANY reason.
Edit:
Source: http://www.guildwars.com/legal/users-agreement.php
dsd
man there is to many words on this page 4 me or some 1 else to read lol
Stabber
Quote:
Originally Posted by Banin Galori
14. TERMINATION
(a) NC Interactive reserves the right to suspend or terminate this Agreement (including your Software license and your Account) immediately and without notice [...] upon game play, chat or any player activity whatsoever which is, in our sole discretion, inappropriate and/or in violation of the spirit of Guild Wars as described in the Rules of Conduct. [...] Nowhere in the terms of agreement does NC Interactive reserve the right to terminate any license for any reason at all. |
However, I am not a lawyer. Also, as Slashdot constantly reminds us, "EULAs have never been tested in court", so this is all moot anyhow. Personally, I believe that they have left enought things undefined that any particular interpretation of the EULA is not necessarily the only one.
Metanoia
EULA's mean about as much in court (and thus, legally) as used toilet paper, to be fair.
IMO if they're going to ban an account they should provide their evidence even if they're not willing to dispute the issue. At least that way the owner of the account has something to present their lawyer... assuming they're willing to take it further.
IMO if they're going to ban an account they should provide their evidence even if they're not willing to dispute the issue. At least that way the owner of the account has something to present their lawyer... assuming they're willing to take it further.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Wikipedia is your friend
EULA: Enforceability
The forceability of an EULA depends on several factors, one of them being the court that the case is heard in. Most courts that have addressed the validity of the shrinkwrap license have found them to be invalid, characterizing them as contracts of adhesion, unconscionable, and/or unacceptable pursuant to the U.C.C. |
Banin Galori
Quote:
Originally Posted by Stabber
I read the bolded bit above as saying that Anet reserves the right to do, essentially, whatever it wants, as it keeps the definition of "inappropriate" vague and in their sole control.
However, I am not a lawyer. Also, as Slashdot constantly reminds us, "EULAs have never been tested in court", so this is all moot anyhow. Personally, I believe that they have left enought things undefined that any particular interpretation of the EULA is not necessarily the only one. |
My point was, anyhow, that most customers of a service expect to be able to continue to use the service under normal circumstances. Even when a EULA claims the right to modify itself at any moment, most customer expect that nothing drastic will happen without good reason and some warning. This is simply good business on the company's part.
That being said, having your service discontinued when you felt you've done nothing wrong would naturally feel like an injustice. In that case, it would be much to the company's advantage to provide concrete evidence.
Phaern Majes
I guess the moral of the story is only sell items to merchants. That way you can't "assist ebayers".
noice1
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ricebox
Response (GM Mollusk) 04/15/2006 01:02 PM
Hello, Thank you for contacting us about your Guild Wars game account. Your account was permanently closed because you engaged in the sale of in-game items for cash or other items with real world value, or you engaged in gathering items to be sold for cash or other items with real world value. Both actions are against our User Agreement, where Section 7 states, "You may not sell or auction any Guild Wars accounts, characters, items, coin or copyrighted material, nor may you assist others in doing so." |
Ricebox
Hi everyone! Thanks for participating in this thread, my Deepest thanks goes to you all! Thank you very much!
Anet has finally Unban my account!
This is the last answer i got from their Automated Support Team!
Response (GM Dynamite) 04/16/2006 05:32 PM
Hello,
Thank you for contact Guild Wars Support.
Upon further review of the issue, it appears that your account was blocked in error. Your account is now released and you should be able to log in to Guild Wars. We apologize for any inconvenience this may have caused.
Take care,
The Guild Wars Support Team
>> Same with Leprekan eh... hehehe! see ya guys! and thanks!
Anet has finally Unban my account!
This is the last answer i got from their Automated Support Team!
Response (GM Dynamite) 04/16/2006 05:32 PM
Hello,
Thank you for contact Guild Wars Support.
Upon further review of the issue, it appears that your account was blocked in error. Your account is now released and you should be able to log in to Guild Wars. We apologize for any inconvenience this may have caused.
Take care,
The Guild Wars Support Team
>> Same with Leprekan eh... hehehe! see ya guys! and thanks!
Omega X
Quote:
Originally Posted by Banin Galori
I agree. All the iffy language in a EULA does leave the company much room to do whatever it wants. And, as Metanoia says, it seems that they don't really count for much - which might be a good thing.
My point was, anyhow, that most customers of a service expect to be able to continue to use the service under normal circumstances. Even when a EULA claims the right to modify itself at any moment, most customer expect that nothing drastic will happen without good reason and some warning. This is simply good business on the company's part. That being said, having your service discontinued when you felt you've done nothing wrong would naturally feel like an injustice. In that case, it would be much to the company's advantage to provide concrete evidence. |
Yeah, EULAs in court without concrete evidence is garbage. I remember when AOL tried to change the EULA on AIM a while back trying to allow itself to invade privacy. IT sent the entire user community into outrage. The EULA changed a couple of days later and removed that addition.
So, that means that they can change the EULA however they want. But its the customers who decide what they are going to tolerate.
shezbian
Should have stopped farming
SnipiousMax
Have you ever sold a -50 Grim Cesta to someone?
Stabber
Quote:
Originally Posted by noice1
I want every auction on ebay for Guild Wars gold closed and the ebay accounts banned permanently. If Anet wants to wield a ban stick, why not Ebay? They are allowing this crap to continue. I say again, I thought this crap was taken care of a few MMORPG generations ago?
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Reason #2 is more serious, and I think a cartel of MMO(RP)G companies can easily band together and put some collective pressure on Ebay to get their act together. I get the impression from my friends who play WoW that this Ebaying problem is many times worse there. Surely NCSoft and Blizzard can find a common interest in stopping these goldfarmers!
Kakumei
Quote:
Originally Posted by Stabber
However, I am not a lawyer. Also, as Slashdot constantly reminds us, "EULAs have never been tested in court", so this is all moot anyhow. Personally, I believe that they have left enought things undefined that any particular interpretation of the EULA is not necessarily the only one.
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Stabber
Quote:
Originally Posted by Kakumei
Haha you read Slashdot what's wrong with you?
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leprekan
Congratz Ricebox (told you blow up their email) =p
After reading most of this page ... I see many people just post to post something not to help people.
After reading most of this page ... I see many people just post to post something not to help people.