Still doesn't change the fact that two skills Vamperic Bite and Vamperic Touch are exactly the same.
I think nerfing them isn't the way to go. I think making every other profession have duplicate skills is.
How to nerf a touch ranger.
Aisius
Evilsod
Quote:
Originally Posted by Aisius
Still doesn't change the fact that two skills Vamperic Bite and Vamperic Touch are exactly the same.
I think nerfing them isn't the way to go. I think making every other profession have duplicate skills is. Ancestors Visage
Sympathetic Visage
Sundering Attack
Penetrating Shot
Point Blank Shot
Zojuns Shot
Dodge
Zojuns Haste
Tenei's Heat
Searing Heat
Penetrating Chop
*duplicate name*
There are loads of duplicate names for other professions. If you actually looked you know that, its just none of them are used in the same respect as Bite/Touch.
I think nerfing them isn't the way to go. I think making every other profession have duplicate skills is. Ancestors Visage
Sympathetic Visage
Sundering Attack
Penetrating Shot
Point Blank Shot
Zojuns Shot
Dodge
Zojuns Haste
Tenei's Heat
Searing Heat
Penetrating Chop
*duplicate name*
There are loads of duplicate names for other professions. If you actually looked you know that, its just none of them are used in the same respect as Bite/Touch.
Dyon Adell
Well. I play Spike 90% of the time, and I rarely meet problems with touch rangers, as long as I get a decent team(a team that has a caller and the rest cooperate) at RA.
But more than half the time, especially when I'm with 2-3 rangers in my team, I normally do Drain Enchantment, someone cripples him, and we spike the shet out of him. Then some drama goes.
My team's ranger: Haha noob touch!
Touch ranger: sdfu
Second ranger on my team: Aww... touchers just suck!
Me: Lol
There was only one occassion my team got pwned by a touch ranger, and that's cause no one communicated in team chat at all.
But more than half the time, especially when I'm with 2-3 rangers in my team, I normally do Drain Enchantment, someone cripples him, and we spike the shet out of him. Then some drama goes.
My team's ranger: Haha noob touch!
Touch ranger: sdfu
Second ranger on my team: Aww... touchers just suck!
Me: Lol
There was only one occassion my team got pwned by a touch ranger, and that's cause no one communicated in team chat at all.
twicky_kid
All they have to do to nerf this is add a clause to the touch skills stating "Expertise does not lower the energy cost of this skill"
That doesn't change the power of the skills.
IMO touchers are junk. I kill them in RA and AB very easily with just about any build I use. Its not the build that counters touchers its tactics.
That doesn't change the power of the skills.
IMO touchers are junk. I kill them in RA and AB very easily with just about any build I use. Its not the build that counters touchers its tactics.
Aisius
Quote:
Originally Posted by Evilsod
Ancestors Visage
Sympathetic Visage
Sundering Attack
Penetrating Shot
Point Blank Shot
Zojuns Shot
Dodge
Zojuns Haste
Tenei's Heat
Searing Heat
Penetrating Chop
*duplicate name*
There are loads of duplicate names for other professions. If you actually looked you know that, its just none of them are used in the same respect as Bite/Touch. Ancestors Visage max use 18 secs 10 energy 30 secs recharge
Sympathetic Visage max use 18 secs 10 energy 30 secs recharge
Sundering Attack 10 energy 3 secs recharge
Penetrating Shot 10 energy 3 secs recharge
Point Blank Shot 10 energy 3 secs recharge
Zojuns Shot 10 energy 3 secs recharge
Dodge max use 10 secs cost 5 energy 30 secs recharge
Zojuns Haste max use 10 secs cost 5 energy 30 secs recharge
Tenei's Heat use 3 sec cost 25 energy 30 secs recharge
Searing Heat use 3 secs cost 25 energy 30 secs recharge
Penetrating Chop 5 adren
Penetrating Blow 5 adren
Vamperic Bite steal life max 65 damage cost 15 energy 2 secs recharge
Vamperic Touch steal life max 65 damage cost 15 energy 2 secs recharge
Because there skills energy cost is reduced maybe if other professions had a way of reducing there costs I would agree the examples you gave make the whole skill duplication across all professions balanced.
Sympathetic Visage
Sundering Attack
Penetrating Shot
Point Blank Shot
Zojuns Shot
Dodge
Zojuns Haste
Tenei's Heat
Searing Heat
Penetrating Chop
*duplicate name*
There are loads of duplicate names for other professions. If you actually looked you know that, its just none of them are used in the same respect as Bite/Touch. Ancestors Visage max use 18 secs 10 energy 30 secs recharge
Sympathetic Visage max use 18 secs 10 energy 30 secs recharge
Sundering Attack 10 energy 3 secs recharge
Penetrating Shot 10 energy 3 secs recharge
Point Blank Shot 10 energy 3 secs recharge
Zojuns Shot 10 energy 3 secs recharge
Dodge max use 10 secs cost 5 energy 30 secs recharge
Zojuns Haste max use 10 secs cost 5 energy 30 secs recharge
Tenei's Heat use 3 sec cost 25 energy 30 secs recharge
Searing Heat use 3 secs cost 25 energy 30 secs recharge
Penetrating Chop 5 adren
Penetrating Blow 5 adren
Vamperic Bite steal life max 65 damage cost 15 energy 2 secs recharge
Vamperic Touch steal life max 65 damage cost 15 energy 2 secs recharge
Because there skills energy cost is reduced maybe if other professions had a way of reducing there costs I would agree the examples you gave make the whole skill duplication across all professions balanced.
Dyon Adell
Yeah. Basically, the touch build is like a sword. How deadly it is is dependant on the weilder. Same goes to all other builds. Should be "How can I improve against strong touch players", not "How to nerf touch rangers".
Ure Maker
if u nerf touchers u nerf necros, many necros use some touch spells to stay alive so they can run to regen, or blood spiker builds that necros use, they use these spells, necros will be hit hard with any sort of nerf that touch rangers get.
Sir Mad
Quote:
Originally Posted by Aisius
Ancestors Visage max use 18 secs 10 energy 30 secs recharge
Sympathetic Visage max use 18 secs 10 energy 30 secs recharge
Sundering Attack 10 energy 3 secs recharge
Penetrating Shot 10 energy 3 secs recharge
Point Blank Shot 10 energy 3 secs recharge
Zojuns Shot 10 energy 3 secs recharge
Dodge max use 10 secs cost 5 energy 30 secs recharge
Zojuns Haste max use 10 secs cost 5 energy 30 secs recharge
Tenei's Heat use 3 sec cost 25 energy 30 secs recharge
Searing Heat use 3 secs cost 25 energy 30 secs recharge
Penetrating Chop 5 adren
Penetrating Blow 5 adren
Vamperic Bite steal life max 65 damage cost 15 energy 2 secs recharge
Vamperic Touch steal life max 65 damage cost 15 energy 2 secs recharge
Because there skills energy cost is reduced maybe if other professions had a way of reducing there costs I would agree the examples you gave make the whole skill duplication across all professions balanced. Compare what is comparable. You're saying for example that having Dodge and Zojun's Haste is not a problem because of the recharge time. However with both skills you can avoid 78% projectiles and move 33% faster 22 secs out. Isn't it really powerful as well? A skill is not only about the energy it costs or the recharge time, you know, it's also about the effect...
Sympathetic Visage max use 18 secs 10 energy 30 secs recharge
Sundering Attack 10 energy 3 secs recharge
Penetrating Shot 10 energy 3 secs recharge
Point Blank Shot 10 energy 3 secs recharge
Zojuns Shot 10 energy 3 secs recharge
Dodge max use 10 secs cost 5 energy 30 secs recharge
Zojuns Haste max use 10 secs cost 5 energy 30 secs recharge
Tenei's Heat use 3 sec cost 25 energy 30 secs recharge
Searing Heat use 3 secs cost 25 energy 30 secs recharge
Penetrating Chop 5 adren
Penetrating Blow 5 adren
Vamperic Bite steal life max 65 damage cost 15 energy 2 secs recharge
Vamperic Touch steal life max 65 damage cost 15 energy 2 secs recharge
Because there skills energy cost is reduced maybe if other professions had a way of reducing there costs I would agree the examples you gave make the whole skill duplication across all professions balanced. Compare what is comparable. You're saying for example that having Dodge and Zojun's Haste is not a problem because of the recharge time. However with both skills you can avoid 78% projectiles and move 33% faster 22 secs out. Isn't it really powerful as well? A skill is not only about the energy it costs or the recharge time, you know, it's also about the effect...
Aisius
Quote:
Originally Posted by Sir Mad
Compare what is comparable. You're saying for example that having Dodge and Zojun's Haste is not a problem because of the recharge time. However with both skills you can avoid 78% projectiles and move 33% faster 22 secs out. Isn't it really powerful as well? A skill is not only about the energy it costs or the recharge time, you know, it's also about the effect...
Wasn't what I was trying to get at though. Only reason I listed those abilities was because that's what was put forward as being duplicate spells.
In the examples I gave the effect duration v's recharge time is what makes or breaks a spammable skill set.
From what I'm aware (could be wrong) with 16 points in expertise the 15 energy cost is reduced to near 5 energy and as those skills are a 2 sec recharge they become spammable for a touch ranger.
If your aware of any more abilities in professions that are "powerful" by all means list them. I'd be interested to see some duplicate abilities that will dominate AB /pvp like the Vamp touch/bite combo.
In the examples I gave the effect duration v's recharge time is what makes or breaks a spammable skill set.
From what I'm aware (could be wrong) with 16 points in expertise the 15 energy cost is reduced to near 5 energy and as those skills are a 2 sec recharge they become spammable for a touch ranger.
If your aware of any more abilities in professions that are "powerful" by all means list them. I'd be interested to see some duplicate abilities that will dominate AB /pvp like the Vamp touch/bite combo.
Evilsod
Quote:
Originally Posted by Aisius
If your aware of any more abilities in professions that are "powerful" by all means list them. I'd be interested to see some duplicate abilities that will dominate AB /pvp like the Vamp touch/bite combo.
You don't know what your talking about... They have 2 duplicate skills... yes... they can spam them alot... yes... therefore they're been abused? In that respsect i could say using Sympathetic Visage and Ancestors Visage is powerful merely because it gives twice as long with 0 energy/adren for Monsters in PvE. The duplicates exist, just because they don't have a build dedicated to them doesn't mean they should be nerfed because people are too dumb to bring a counter. In ABs there are 12 players. 4 of whom you can choose. If your telling me that there is no space in any of 32 slots for something specifically anti-touchy, then its no-ones fault but your own.
Please, no bullshit about how you shouldn't have to counter them. Eles bring Blurred Vision and Blinding Flash for a reason. Rangers bring Cripshot or Interrupts. Mesmers bring Interrupts, snares, degen or shutdown. Players will often bring Veratis Gaze/Aura to counter MMs. People bring LOTS of things to counter in AB.
As for how Diversion has a massive weakness, let me point 1 thing out to you. If you have ever played a touch ranger you'd know that to continue spamming skills against 1 target you have to keep that target *selected* You can't casually press Alt to see whats going on around you like a warrior can, there is very little chance a touch ranger will see Diversion coming, when he does, its probably too late. Also why not bring along Scourge Sacrifice? 40% health sacrifice? No thanks. Sacrificing about 200 health and only gaining 4 more touchers isn't that good a deal. Not to mention its perfect for MMs, specially if they bring Veratis Aura to counter yours, 66% health sacrifice is not pleasant.
Please, no bullshit about how you shouldn't have to counter them. Eles bring Blurred Vision and Blinding Flash for a reason. Rangers bring Cripshot or Interrupts. Mesmers bring Interrupts, snares, degen or shutdown. Players will often bring Veratis Gaze/Aura to counter MMs. People bring LOTS of things to counter in AB.
As for how Diversion has a massive weakness, let me point 1 thing out to you. If you have ever played a touch ranger you'd know that to continue spamming skills against 1 target you have to keep that target *selected* You can't casually press Alt to see whats going on around you like a warrior can, there is very little chance a touch ranger will see Diversion coming, when he does, its probably too late. Also why not bring along Scourge Sacrifice? 40% health sacrifice? No thanks. Sacrificing about 200 health and only gaining 4 more touchers isn't that good a deal. Not to mention its perfect for MMs, specially if they bring Veratis Aura to counter yours, 66% health sacrifice is not pleasant.
xnightmythx
Here, let me do the moderators job since they are asleep at the wheel.
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antoninus
Interrupt and snaring would mess up an unprepared touch ranger (i see a lot using Whirling Defense). I say snaring would be the easiest way to counter them. If he can't get near you, he can't touch you and he's useless. With my ranger i use Crippling Shot + Hunter's Shot + Apply Poison against Touchies. Sometimes i go Interrupt and just anticipate the touches. its not that hard :P
Sir Mad
Quote:
Originally Posted by antoninus
Interrupt and snaring would mess up an unprepared touch ranger (i see a lot using Whirling Defense). I say snaring would be the easiest way to counter them. If he can't get near you, he can't touch you and he's useless. With my ranger i use Crippling Shot + Hunter's Shot + Apply Poison against Touchies. Sometimes i go Interrupt and just anticipate the touches. its not that hard :P
Well there are threads about touchers in every forums except Ventari's Sell so I'm sure I've already posted that somewhere.
Indeed, snare is the best crippling skill vs a touch ranger. The standard touch build includes whirling defense, throw dirt, and Dodge (78% with 16 exp), which means Crippling Shot won't be that efficient against an experienced touch ranger. However, most of the team do one mistake againt touch rangers - typically their team chat sounds like:
X: A noob toucher, kill him!
Y: I'm using Crippling Shot on Touch Ranger!
Z (melee fighter): I'm attacking Touch Ranger!
(2 secs)
Z: WTF?!
Z: I have crippled on me!
Don't forget touch rangers bring Plague Touch. If you want to put conditions on them, fine, but then kite them. If someone is close, the touch ranger will spam Plague Touch to get rid of his conditions. And actually crippling can help him if he tranfers the condition to the nearby oponent he wanna kill: he won't be able to run then. Pets are also generally loved by touch rangers for that as well, thanks to their poor AI: they'll keep attacking and following them for a while even if their master has switched to another target. And having a pet to follow you is having somthing to transfer his conditions to in 1/4 secs all the time.
In my mind (as someone who has played a touch ranger), the best way to kill a a touch ranger is the degens. With -8 or -10 degen and targets kitting, the touch won't last long. Touch rangers don't have self healing except the 2 vamp skills, ie: they can't heal if there is no one around.
And to those who complain about the spammability of the vamp skills: just use a skill that becomes more efficient against spammable skills - SS anyone? How many times have I seen necros using SS against a monk when it could have been way more efficient aginst the touch ranger?
Indeed, snare is the best crippling skill vs a touch ranger. The standard touch build includes whirling defense, throw dirt, and Dodge (78% with 16 exp), which means Crippling Shot won't be that efficient against an experienced touch ranger. However, most of the team do one mistake againt touch rangers - typically their team chat sounds like:
X: A noob toucher, kill him!
Y: I'm using Crippling Shot on Touch Ranger!
Z (melee fighter): I'm attacking Touch Ranger!
(2 secs)
Z: WTF?!
Z: I have crippled on me!
Don't forget touch rangers bring Plague Touch. If you want to put conditions on them, fine, but then kite them. If someone is close, the touch ranger will spam Plague Touch to get rid of his conditions. And actually crippling can help him if he tranfers the condition to the nearby oponent he wanna kill: he won't be able to run then. Pets are also generally loved by touch rangers for that as well, thanks to their poor AI: they'll keep attacking and following them for a while even if their master has switched to another target. And having a pet to follow you is having somthing to transfer his conditions to in 1/4 secs all the time.
In my mind (as someone who has played a touch ranger), the best way to kill a a touch ranger is the degens. With -8 or -10 degen and targets kitting, the touch won't last long. Touch rangers don't have self healing except the 2 vamp skills, ie: they can't heal if there is no one around.
And to those who complain about the spammability of the vamp skills: just use a skill that becomes more efficient against spammable skills - SS anyone? How many times have I seen necros using SS against a monk when it could have been way more efficient aginst the touch ranger?
SnipiousMax
Quote:
Originally Posted by Sir Mad
Indeed, snare is the best crippling skill vs a touch ranger. The standard touch build includes whirling defense, throw dirt, and Dodge (78% with 16 exp), which means Crippling Shot won't be that efficient against an experienced touch ranger.
Crippling shot doesn't miss. It can't be blocked or evaded, so Whirling and Dodge do nothing to get away from Crippling Shot. I also cover my Cripple with other condtions (ie... Poison) that are easily reapplied and prevent the toucher from easily removing cripple. Granted it still requires people kiting.
LordLucifer
change vamp skills to spells, reduce the cost to 10 energy, problem solved
yes i did play toucher, yes it is powerful and boring to play and yes it needs a nerf badly, or make it like a normal attack, affected by evasion, block and blindness, afterall its easier to swing a sword and hit something blind than trying to...touch ppl blind
yes i did play toucher, yes it is powerful and boring to play and yes it needs a nerf badly, or make it like a normal attack, affected by evasion, block and blindness, afterall its easier to swing a sword and hit something blind than trying to...touch ppl blind
Evilsod
Quote:
Originally Posted by LordLucifer
change vamp skills to spells, reduce the cost to 10 energy, problem solved
yes i did play toucher, yes it is powerful and boring to play and yes it needs a nerf badly, or make it like a normal attack, affected by evasion, block and blindness, afterall its easier to swing a sword and hit something blind than trying to...touch ppl blind Did you read anything other than the threads name?
yes i did play toucher, yes it is powerful and boring to play and yes it needs a nerf badly, or make it like a normal attack, affected by evasion, block and blindness, afterall its easier to swing a sword and hit something blind than trying to...touch ppl blind Did you read anything other than the threads name?
LordLucifer
Quote:
Originally Posted by Evilsod
Did you read anything other than the threads name?
of course i did!...the 1st post!
btw if touchers dont need to be nerfed why is the "smart thinking" required to defeat them but no other builds in this game need such a thing? hmm yah they surelly dont need a nerf...
edit: now lets focus on thinking of ways to defeat the goldy axe spikers and MMs in PvP.....¬¬
(note: all PvP builds should have 6 optional skills, 1 res and 1 smart anti toucher for now on cause game will be ballanced again if we do that)
btw if touchers dont need to be nerfed why is the "smart thinking" required to defeat them but no other builds in this game need such a thing? hmm yah they surelly dont need a nerf...
edit: now lets focus on thinking of ways to defeat the goldy axe spikers and MMs in PvP.....¬¬
(note: all PvP builds should have 6 optional skills, 1 res and 1 smart anti toucher for now on cause game will be ballanced again if we do that)
Evilsod
Quote:
Originally Posted by LordLucifer
of course i did!...the 1st post!
btw if touchers dont need to be nerfed why is the "smart thinking" required to defeat them but no other builds in this game need such a thing? hmm yah they surelly dont need a nerf...
edit: now lets focus on thinking of ways to defeat the goldy ask spikers and MMs in PvP.....¬¬
(note: all PvP builds should have 6 optional skills, 1 res and 1 smart anti toucher for now on cause game will be ballanced again if we do that) What the hell are you talking about? If you'd of read any of this thread (or the other 300 threads about them) you'd see a few 100 people whining about them, and just as many simply reeling or all the counters available.
Erm what the hell is an ask spiker? If you mean Air Spiker, interrupt it... its not hard. MMs? You don't have a clue do you, the entire smiting line is a counter to MMs. Even the MM himself usually carries 1 of the biggest counters (in order to counter-counter).
Is it just me or does that note: not make sense?
btw if touchers dont need to be nerfed why is the "smart thinking" required to defeat them but no other builds in this game need such a thing? hmm yah they surelly dont need a nerf...
edit: now lets focus on thinking of ways to defeat the goldy ask spikers and MMs in PvP.....¬¬
(note: all PvP builds should have 6 optional skills, 1 res and 1 smart anti toucher for now on cause game will be ballanced again if we do that) What the hell are you talking about? If you'd of read any of this thread (or the other 300 threads about them) you'd see a few 100 people whining about them, and just as many simply reeling or all the counters available.
Erm what the hell is an ask spiker? If you mean Air Spiker, interrupt it... its not hard. MMs? You don't have a clue do you, the entire smiting line is a counter to MMs. Even the MM himself usually carries 1 of the biggest counters (in order to counter-counter).
Is it just me or does that note: not make sense?
LordLucifer
corrected the typo
hmm you really didnt get the sarcasm? lol
(yah i know they are powerful but not overpowered, most ppl can defeat them without "special skills")
hmm you really didnt get the sarcasm? lol
(yah i know they are powerful but not overpowered, most ppl can defeat them without "special skills")
muymoo
well, i don't think anyone else has recommended this counter, but with a cripshot build but as a R/N you can take out a touch in no time. just crip shot, which cannot be blocked, and throw on rigor mortis For 8-18 seconds, target foe cannot block or evade. cost 10 casting time 2 recharge 30. yes, it isn't the cheapest, but 1v1 the touchie has no chance, and it's only substituting one skill so u dont have to change ur whole skill bar for only one build. do u really need diversion in AB?
roughly my build
cripshot (elite)
apply poison or kindle arrows (with kindle substitute dual shot for any other attack skill)
hunter's shot
debilitating shot
troll
any stance
running skill
rez
roughly my build
cripshot (elite)
apply poison or kindle arrows (with kindle substitute dual shot for any other attack skill)
hunter's shot
debilitating shot
troll
any stance
running skill
rez
Evilsod
Looks like my build for AB
Cripshot
Distracting
Savage
Hunters
Apply
Unguent
Whirling
Res... been messing around with Scorpion Wire recently too, they can't get away even if they try
It counters anything that needs to come close. Great fun against warriors
Lucifer... why are you posting...?
Cripshot
Distracting
Savage
Hunters
Apply
Unguent
Whirling
Res... been messing around with Scorpion Wire recently too, they can't get away even if they try
It counters anything that needs to come close. Great fun against warriors
Lucifer... why are you posting...?
LordLucifer
idk, why are you?
Red1086
Okay, I didn't read all the posts cause I really didn't feel like it, so if this has been said already, forgive me.
There is an in-game nerf to Touch Rangers. I have experienced it myself. It is called BLACKOUT. It is also called INTERRUPT. Oh, and do not forget, ENERGY DENIAL.
Bam, three counters to Touch Rangers and no need for actual nerfs.
Thank you.
There is an in-game nerf to Touch Rangers. I have experienced it myself. It is called BLACKOUT. It is also called INTERRUPT. Oh, and do not forget, ENERGY DENIAL.
Bam, three counters to Touch Rangers and no need for actual nerfs.
Thank you.
Sir Mad
Well I don't think you needed to bump ALL the topic about touchies to say that... but thanks for the 2 cents.
Evilsod
Quote:
Originally Posted by Red1086
Okay, I didn't read all the posts cause I really didn't feel like it, so if this has been said already, forgive me.
There is an in-game nerf to Touch Rangers. I have experienced it myself. It is called BLACKOUT. It is also called INTERRUPT. Oh, and do not forget, ENERGY DENIAL.
Bam, three counters to Touch Rangers and no need for actual nerfs.
Thank you. Yeah those have never been said ^^
In the 100s of pages an 1000s of replies of people moaning about them and the reels of counters...
Lucifer, because i have something to bring to it, unlike your posts. (ironically this post doesn't
)
There is an in-game nerf to Touch Rangers. I have experienced it myself. It is called BLACKOUT. It is also called INTERRUPT. Oh, and do not forget, ENERGY DENIAL.
Bam, three counters to Touch Rangers and no need for actual nerfs.
Thank you. Yeah those have never been said ^^
In the 100s of pages an 1000s of replies of people moaning about them and the reels of counters...
Lucifer, because i have something to bring to it, unlike your posts. (ironically this post doesn't
)
Robin_Anadri
Quote:
Originally Posted by Evilsod
... been messing around with Scorpion Wire recently too, they can't get away even if they try
ZOMG I hadn't thought of that... EVIL!
Must... get... home... to... try...
ZOMG I hadn't thought of that... EVIL!Must... get... home... to... try...
Ristaron
Quote:
Originally Posted by AndrewAtHome
In a recent appearance, my guild leader managed to speak to Gaile about changing the description of Expertise, in a similar way to what you've mentioned, and she said she'd have a word with someone about it. Lets cross our fingers.
NO!!!!!!!!!!!! LEAVE EXPERTISE ALONE!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Make the stupid touch ranger skills into spells for the love of God, that will solve the problem and not affect ANYTHING ELSE.
Make the stupid touch ranger skills into spells for the love of God, that will solve the problem and not affect ANYTHING ELSE.
Dark Tykane
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ristaron
NO!!!!!!!!!!!! LEAVE EXPERTISE ALONE!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Make the stupid touch ranger skills into spells for the love of God, that will solve the problem and not affect ANYTHING ELSE. No dont touch the touches, turning them into spells would be idiotic as well. The best way is just to STOP TALKING ABOUT THEM and just do versatile builds that will kill a normal player and disable a toucher AT THE SAME TIME
now stop saying to switch them to spells if you knew enough about the balance between these skills and the spells you would know there are many problems with them ever being spells.
LEAVE NECRO SPELLS AND SKILLS ALONE...LEAVE EXPERTISE ALONE....just be more smart.
Make the stupid touch ranger skills into spells for the love of God, that will solve the problem and not affect ANYTHING ELSE. No dont touch the touches, turning them into spells would be idiotic as well. The best way is just to STOP TALKING ABOUT THEM and just do versatile builds that will kill a normal player and disable a toucher AT THE SAME TIME
now stop saying to switch them to spells if you knew enough about the balance between these skills and the spells you would know there are many problems with them ever being spells.
LEAVE NECRO SPELLS AND SKILLS ALONE...LEAVE EXPERTISE ALONE....just be more smart.
Hyprodimus Prime
Water eles can nicely take out touchies, other eles, and wars (and squishies) hey that everyone isnt it?...well if its 1 on 1. If youre against a group of touchies then its harder. I like to use somesort of water slowdown like ice spikes or icy prism, then spam water trident with arcane echo. Water trident will cover any +speed they have because of knock down.....and armor of mist wont hurt either. bring rust for tanks and bonders....ouch.
Eles have lower armor against water. mesmers can try to interupt but water trident is fast recharge. Spirit spammers will hurt i think that they are the only ones who can beat this build 1 on 1.
treat touchies like warriors. they can hurt if they cant touch. and if u expect facing barragers or any rangers bring along blurred vision, armor of frost or some nice mesmer skills.
I guess like most squishies u cant heal very well so degen would be a problem.
Anyways. I say dont nerf the touchies, the bigger they are the harder they fall.
Eles have lower armor against water. mesmers can try to interupt but water trident is fast recharge. Spirit spammers will hurt i think that they are the only ones who can beat this build 1 on 1.
treat touchies like warriors. they can hurt if they cant touch. and if u expect facing barragers or any rangers bring along blurred vision, armor of frost or some nice mesmer skills.
I guess like most squishies u cant heal very well so degen would be a problem.
Anyways. I say dont nerf the touchies, the bigger they are the harder they fall.
LordLucifer
Quote:
Originally Posted by Evilsod
Yeah those have never been said ^^
In the 100s of pages an 1000s of replies of people moaning about them and the reels of counters...
Lucifer, because i have something to bring to it, unlike your posts. (ironically this post doesn't)
yah right, you do bring quite a good fanboy vision to this thread alright..
anyway point has been made, if touchers are so ballanced how come no other builds need so much.."smart thinking" to beat?
besides its a game, whole point is to have fun, touchers eem to annoy more ppl than anything else, doesnt seem like this contributes to what a game is about..
(and no, i havent such huge problems with them unless im on my war, but its clear they need a nerf, i played touchers too, easy way to kill stuff in PvP when i want faction and dont wanna sweat)
In the 100s of pages an 1000s of replies of people moaning about them and the reels of counters...
Lucifer, because i have something to bring to it, unlike your posts. (ironically this post doesn't
)
yah right, you do bring quite a good fanboy vision to this thread alright..anyway point has been made, if touchers are so ballanced how come no other builds need so much.."smart thinking" to beat?
besides its a game, whole point is to have fun, touchers eem to annoy more ppl than anything else, doesnt seem like this contributes to what a game is about..
(and no, i havent such huge problems with them unless im on my war, but its clear they need a nerf, i played touchers too, easy way to kill stuff in PvP when i want faction and dont wanna sweat)
Rite
Can't believe I'm bumping this thread just to say this, but to all the people who are so sure that ANet's about to nerf the touchies, I think that's a really unlikely proposition seeing as when touchies were mentioned in one of the "the scribe"s, the tone was more of someone being extremely proud of them than of someone saying: uh-oh, we need to nerf that one.
Evilsod
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Originally Posted by LordLucifer
Quote: anyway point has been made, if touchers are so ballanced how come no other builds need so much.."smart thinking" to beat? Meaning? Could you at least make things clear. I can't tell whether you mean people are too stupid to bring counters or they just require someone with more than 1 IQ to beat.
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i have over 1200 hours of gameplay..have seen it all now|
besides its a game, whole point is to have fun, touchers eem to annoy more ppl than anything else, doesnt seem like this contributes to what a game is about..
You've never played a mesmer have you? Or indeed a ranger by the sound of things. I'm sure the constant stream of interrupts, shutdowns and debilitating things isn't annoying in the slightest. Quote:
Not a big fan of tag teaming... but...
You did say this: Quote:
Quote: You've never played a mesmer have you? Or indeed a ranger by the sound of things. I'm sure the constant stream of interrupts, shutdowns and debilitating things isn't annoying in the slightest. |
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So what? An ele is a joke against any ranger, toucher or otherwise. The only difference is a flash bot can actually make a difference against other rangers. 20 hours of cripshot? You do realise that practically all Cripshotters run Apply Poison w/ an optional Hunters Shot for a rather nice 7degen + Cripple (i love this in AB so much |
Originally Posted by SnipiousMax
I find it enjoyable when I go up against a difficult to beat character. I've no enjoyment at all steam rolling weaklings. I enjoy competition.
i hate easy games, theres nothing better than a warrior fight with 2 great builds (no matter the weapons) that may last long, or maybe some nasty mesmer battles (those can be really great)
but like you said, some random guy, with no skills at all, you do know exactly what hes gonna do, he doesnt even have to look at the screen, its aproach, touch, use stances sometimes and thats it.. and over 50% of the builds that were in the battle cant do a thing abt it is fun? idk abt that..
Evilsod
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Originally Posted by LordLucifer
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). Plus any ranger with Seeking Arrows who is in the least bit competant can predict when to use Distracting Shot. Beleve me you lose alot of healing and power with only 1 touch skill. Nobody really cares if a warrior can't kill it, there are things in this game a warrior isn't suppose to be able to kill (easily). People are stupid.. face it. Yesterday i fled a Paragon as a toucher with 30 health left, ran round a corner and watched radar... he followed. Dodged 1 spear, ran up and survived the next to blind him. Stood there and slowly touched all his health away... he landed ZERO hits and make NO attempts to run. People that stupid deserve to die.Quote:
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again, mesmers...besides it was just lack of attention like you said
Yes i've been utterly owned by degen mesmers too. 1.5 second cooldown (equivilence of the 2 skills), 10 degen. If target kites... your dead. I had to turn to touching a pet or a nearby spirit just to stay alive a bit longer. Quote:
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