GW Stock Market Crash!

Yes that is a sloution. And a real world one in fact. In real world, what do you prefer? 50% profit on a 100$ item or 5% profit on a 1 000 000$ item? The buy at low price, sell at high is what nerf the prices. Any mechant in real life will buy a item if it's in demand. If he offer 1 gold, none will sell to him. Therefore, he won't have to sell and thus won't make profit.

So the problem here is not % margin. It's that there is no margin (or a crappy one). Wheather it's 50%, 60%, 70% or 80% is important but less than the fact that, at first, there should be such a buy/sell margin.

Also, peoples are right. Making the game much harder for new players is not fair. And it contredicts the goal of the game: "not based on items but on skills and teamplay" because it create a huge difference between riches and poor players.

See, the thing is, some of us don't want to play the game... AGAIN. Some of us didn't get a lot of items during "normal" play. I barely got anything. I was the odd man out.

Some of us found the missions boring, repetetive, frustrating, and fruitless.
Frustrating because of parties.

Some of us don't want to go through that again, especially when there's an alternative that's almost the same.

Farming. It's boring, repetetive, not so frustrating, and better yet... It's not fruitless.

If not for gold or items, then for experience. I try different builds so that I can see what works best for me. I can't very well do that without farming something for the refund points. I can't get any new skills because I'm out of skill points. It takes forever to get the experience to re-level 20. I can't just play the game again for that, I'd only be getting experience for the latter part of the game.

It took me a while to finish the game. A few weeks, I think. Am I to spend another few weeks to inch my way to getting a guild hall? A better item? Etc?


I don't know, I just don't believe ANY of the points you made, sorry.

Let's get back to the basic issue. That's is whether or not the update help or beginning to help the general buy-to-use population. Go and check prices of ectoplasm and shard today and compare them to the spikes and inflated prices (15-20k for ectos) caused by hoarders who were making profit off the rare material traders in the last several weeks.

I guess the basic question everyone has to ask themselves is "why do I play the game?". Or why did you but it in the first place?

If the game is boring and not fun then I guess you need to stop playing it and find another game.

Also look at the games you have laying around the house. Why are you not playing them anymore? Probably because you "beat" them. That is why you don't play them.

If it takes 6 months to play your way to something you want, is that better than finishing the game in a week and never playing it again? (PvE of course)

If it is "boring" playing a game to get something, then people have lost sight of what actually playing a game is all about.

If you want it all and want it now I think Diablo is better suited, you can go to Ebay and buy all the best equipment and just run through the game with ease.

As for "hoarders" , of course people have to hoard. Not many guys are going to get 45 shards or ectos in a short time frame. I doubtthey are horading to inflate the price, they are hoarding until they get enough.

These prices are more a result of US holding favor a lot less these days. US used to have favor for days on end, now they hold it maybe 6-7 hours a day, and only late late at ngith or early morning hours on the east coast, when most normal people are sleeping. The ectos and shards are the one true commodity that is being priced on supply and demand. I ahve no problem with that side moving.

awesome explanation... thank you...

I say we screw the traders and outsource to cantha.

I fail to see how the traders are hurting casual players. Before a casual player was forced to deal with the farmer's in town who had the patience to sit in town for hours and spam items. Now the disparity is removed. In fact if the player so desires they can still buy off players. That option was never taken away. However now there is less of an information disparity between a casual player and the farmer. The casual player can always go to the material trader or rune trader to get a current snapshot of the maximum price of an item for the current time. In essence it allows comparison shopping. The player can either accept the conveinance of buying an item off the trader and take the higher price, or they can attempt to shop around for a better price direct from another player.

Most of this whining about falling rune prices is simply whining about the price gouging arising from a knowledge disparity being eliminated. Boo hoo.

Also, all your red herrings about communism are idiotic. This isn't communism. There is no entity forcing you to redistribute your wealth. I know its fun to try and sound like you have some modicum of knowledge, but really its just making you look foolish.

No. This is why everyone is complaining. Nobody wants to sell to the trader anymore because the trader pays crap. Therefore because there is no flow of stuff to the trader from players, prices rise. Even though prices rise, the trader still buys for crap so people go and spam district 1 and 2 to get a price around the trader. Repeat this process and you have a problem.

Yes, I am not against the traders and I don't whine about the rune prices falling--the traders provide a mechanism to efficiently price things based on current buying/selling patterns.

My complaint is that since the most recent update, the traders are no longer paying fair and reasonable prices when you sell something to them. No matter how expensive the item is or how much in demend it is, they continue to pay crap. For Example, They are selling Obsidian Shards for 4100gp, but if you try and sell them one, they only giveyou 100gp. ONE HUNDRED. How can that be considered a fair price? I tried to sell some leather, which costs 50gp + materials to make at a crafter, and I was only offered 42gp per leather. wtf? It used to offer anywhere from 50 - 150 depending on the current supply.

As others have said, this will cause less people to sell to the trader and more trades will be player to player, essentially taking the trader out of the loop, people will continue to buy from the trader though. The trader will see the dwindling supply and raise his sell price (but apparently not his buy price). People will quit buying from him and look to buy from players. But since players use the Trader's selling price to set their price, they will in turn raise their prices. Now player prices are again "close" to trader prices so buyers will go back to the Trader. Repeat until 1 wood plank costs 500g and then tell us there is nothing wrong.

In such a scenario, players will initially be forced to go acquire their own supplies via adventuring or farming as they cannot afford to buy them anymore. Money ceases to have value since everything is inflated.

In comes bartering. Expect new WTT spams to appear where players that need material X start offering to trade X for Y.

Traders are being reset after updates. Is the rare material trader still offering 100gp for an obsidian shard? I don't think so.

Have sell prices stabilized to even 50% of buy prices at least for any of the following: dyes, runes, rare materials?

Last I was able to see, buy prices were similar to what they were pre-patch, but sell prices were still hosed. If this is what was intended, then Anet should never have even put the NPC traders in the game in the first place... I for one will end up playing the game far less because I really don't want to forced to trade to other people for commodities.

EDIT: The the person that said that traders are being reset after updates... I will believe that if the trader buy prices would continue to rise to their pre-patch levels. Right now, the only pattern I've seen is a continuous decline in buy prices with a continuous steady increase in sell prices. This makes absolutely no sense economically.

Yeah the trader buy prices are still way down. Last I saw (few min ago), steel ignots: 50g!, globs of ecto: 100g! horrible.

I suspect the Traders do autostock a bit at certain times in the previous version. But it did not autostock fully. I suspect when the stock price is high, the Traders autostock a bit to help curb the price a bit. And when the stock price is low, I even suspect the Traders may remove a bit of the existing stock to float the price up a bit. But it's an unproven suspicion.

I also think the Traders adjust the prices periodically instead of instantly. Meaning they adjust the prices every half an hour or so instead of having the prices fluctuate whenever someone buys or sells. Because I have bought and sold hundreds of rare materials and only saw a single price change. And I saw the second price change about half an hour or so later.

So if there's only say 100 ectos in the market. I could keep on buying them for say 3k each. After I bought up all 99 ectos, the price of the last ecto will still remain 3k until the next round of price adjustment which could be half an hour away. This is how I make my money. I didn't have to work with the market because in a sense, I get flat rate from all my purchase/sells. Buying ALL the Parchment in stock for 400 G each. Wait for half a day, then sall ALL the Parchment back for 600G each. As long as I do it between each price adjustment, I won't have to worry about the price changing when I'm doing my trades.

Isn't what the Devs did to the Traders that omnipotent entity that is forcing us to redistribute our wealth, try to reduce the number of wealthy by removing their main source of income, and an attempt to bring rich Stock traders down?

My sentiment here... :/

Here's a tip for people to follow. Too often do people sell stuff to traders for low prices. Like minor runes for 25 gold. You should sell anything that is a minimum price to merchants! If the trader offers 1 gold for something and people continue to give it to them, they will keep offering 1 gold.

so what do u suggest? we drop our runes on the floor and run away? lol

so here i agree with u actually a bit... they should change the minimum paid price algorith for merchants but other than that selling prices are normal.

Okay, some of you aren't going to like this, but I think the traders' current prices are actually a good thing. The first is, since they are buying so low, less money is pouring into the system. I think one of the reasons everything got so expensive (a sword for 50K-200K???) was because there was too much money in the system, people were too rich. This has another benefit, some people use the traders as marks for buying and selling. If I want to offload something, and the trader is given me nearly nil and I know that people aren't going to want to pay full trader price, I'll have to sell it cheap. Cheaper than the trader anyways. Money is now exchanging hand between the players and both sides benefit, I'm still getting more money than the trader and the other guy is getting a deal. Finally, this is good because if you do buy from a trader, he now acts as a money sink.

So in short: traders are for the desperate.

I Suport your coment it is ludacris!!! Some of us enjoy PVE!!!!

we are definitely in 1932 ! The Great Guild Wars Depression! Note it

No wonder ectos prices keep rising... You were robbing the rare material trader.

You must be kidding?

Black dye for 2.2 plat!
Steel for 33 gold each!

It doesn't reflect market reality at all!

And responding to another guy's suggestion on how that present system would encourage botters eh?

Well, if that's the cause maybe they should just terminate everyone's account with the explaination "Sorry! We didn't want to take the chance of having bots play out game!"

That update effectively taken out a dimension of the game.. something that I can do in a Role Playing game, a trader.

And let's just say that there is VERY LITTLE to do in GW at the moment.

I hate to burst your bubble too, but I've played my final character from start to finish (including having "fun" playing the same missions for the 4th time), and I completely explored the crystal desert, and I didn't "run" anything..

And now that I've reached ring of fire I reckon I made a grand total of 14 plat in all.

On this last character I didn't spend any gold I had in storage on it.. so essentially it paid for its own upkeep.

Minus the cost of droknar armor (7.5 plat?) and thankfully I had a huge stash of materials so I didn't need to buy any from the trader, and yes, the nett total I have on it now is 6 plat.

People who are playing for the first time is going to STRUGGLE. Especially if they got taken in and paid to be ran to piken.. or ran to kryta.. or ran to aurora glaives.

Exactly, and this is a ROLE PLAYING GAME. Essentially players are supposed to play through PvE, unlock all the skills, and play PvP, and that's it? So it is "wrong" to do something like what Dazzler does?

In the meantime people still offer beacons to droknar running services, and yes, they make way more than us traders.

Anet seems to have a narrow perspective of what role players can do... jeez, what the heck is this? I envision they should just call the next area in Chapter 2... Singapore!

Sigils are raising, I remember when I paid them for 39.99K, now they goto 43.06 to 66+

i have around 80 blue dye i've been sitting on for a while... they used to sell for ~300 to the trader.

now i can only get like 85 for them. this is horrible.

meh... i guess it doesnt really matter as i have done everything i want in the game including the HOH. maybe it is time to stop playing....

This is a Competitive On-line RPG, it wasn't designed to Role Play a crafter, trader or any other job ala the other on-line games, here you ar RP'ing a hero, combatant. Keep in mind that all prices are set by SUPPLY and DEMAND, there is no Auto-stocking of the traders, if players don't sell to them they will run out of material to sell to the players, likewise if no one buys from them their prices will drop as inventory increases.

Yes yes yes..

Competitive On Line RPG.

Let's just put it simply, the latest patch has removed yet more value from the game. I do not give a damned for competitive play, and I'm sure many others here too, and perhaps you did meant Cooperative play.

Please refer to that FoW griefer's thread somewhere else on this forum.. sad to say, people like that come quite frequently too.

Essentially GW is to me "The occasional good party and generally henchmen game". And now with less and less possibilities left to do in the game.. screw it, I guess it's just overrated HYPE.

I have a couple points to make.

First of all, quit with the "just play through the game" suggestion. It doesn't work. The first time I played through the game, my first rare drop was in the D'Alessio Seaboard mission. Is that normal for everyone else? I have also NEVER found a black dye after what is most likely 200+ hours of play. Without the aid of farming, I probably receive a rare drop every 1-2 weeks of play, which is 21-42 hours of play. So at least for me, just playing through the game to obtain items and gold does not work.

Stop making Diablo comparisons when it is obvious that you've never played it. In Diablo you need to spend an ABSURD amount of time doing MF (magic find) runs. I remember doing over 200 MF runs running 3 bosses (anderial/mephisto/pindleskin for those who know) and only making an ist rune of profit which is not much at all. You can't just own all the monsters easily. In fact, without the aid of Ebay or any source like that, it took countless hours to make a character to withstand the hell difficulty setting. And making a sorceress and tele'ing to the bosses to kill them doesn't count as playing through the difficulty.

I honestly don't give a damn about what you people call this game, saying it was meant for "competitive" people and PvP.

I've never been much into farming, I want it back so badly right now because there's NOTHING ELSE TO DO. You can say this game is "PvP focused" all you want, if that be the case you mind explaining to my why the hell PvP in this game is so tiny and boring? PvP in this game is simply...not very fun, for me and well, many others. Problably those many many people who've gone and signed my "quit nerfing the hell out of us" petition in the sanitarium.

I've done what this game has to offer. I've PvE'd my heart out, and I've PvPed until I got...horribly bored with it. PvP in this game never changes, it's just the same small little arenas with the same groups of 8 all using the SAME "tactics" (builds) over and over again. "Oh look, another smiting group, well our build can't stop that so we're screwed this round." Next round "Oh well we managed to beat them, beat the spirit spamming team and those other guys, now we're at the HoH...wow this is...kinda...cool, I guess...seeing this same thing for the hundredth time. Oh look, I fought against those guys last time I was here...Oh damn, we lost. Guess I have to go do all that all over again just to get to the "HoH" and see some nifty text say I've got more fame now! Yippee!"

Yeah, I don't think so buddy. That gets old real quick, not to mention half the time you go there you've got someone on some team insulting all the other teams with immature rascist comments on your way up, someone on your team will go "afk" or leave the game for no reason, etc. I don't want to care about one person going afk, I want to FIGHT in PvP...not just dick around with some little "flag" in hopes of getting an oh-so-important morale boost. When are we going to have some real PvP that's not some tiny "arena"...? Then maybe I'd consider THAT half of the game more.

So since I...and many others as you'll see from multiple threads in the sanitarium, view this current system of PvP to be kinda...too small scale and boring, we do what we can with the rest of the game. And...that's not much. So we're trying to help and IMPROVE the game by voicing our opinions here.

The petition is increasing in size as the day goes by, that to me tells me people are pretty pissed and that they've done something wrong with their updates. See, it's not even so much that "Oh we want THIS! Everyone else gets it." It's the fact that they HAD it in the game and it's been taken out thus decreasing the games overall value as a whole.

My barbarian and amazon were for the win.
Leech rings, man, leech rings.
To stay is to stay kickin'.
Runs were pretty easy. My zon and barb were able to do the cow level alone on hell difficulty.

To stay on topic:

GW does have really limited PVP... And PVE... I wouldn't mind some larger map that's a little more complicated for PVP. Maybe more people per team...

Anyways, choices are getting limited, boring, and an expansion would only delay that for a short time.

Pretty Off Topic.

Dyeeo was right.

Now that I am awake again I will start responding.

I wholeheartedly agree with this last statement.

In fact, heck, if the NPCs were better implemented, they would not be creating gold out of nothing at all!

Currently all that is left to do are those UW/FoW runs/questing.. I pretty much captured all the elites there are to be capped for my primary and secondary professions, and have no need for skill points anymore, and those runs are just not worth it at all.

I even wonder how the drop system is implemented, because for each FoW run I notice that if I were to get a shard at all, I will get it only AFTER pretty much every one else gotten one, and that's usually at the Forgemaster's quest.

Nevermind the times when some party member decided to go afk, or the party got wiped (very often) etc.

It is slowly getting from fun to sickening, and there is no reward to justify it either.

I'll just shelf this game for a while I guess, and see how the 2 new "free" areas look like, and how the trader issues would be resolved eventually.

Don't get me wrong, I really loved this game, and I'm frustrated by how it has changed from a really nice RP game to a farked game, and as it stands now... it is best that Anet not count my $50 going into the next chapter, and I'm sure I speak for a sizable proportion of players too.

The devs might have something against the sins of Diablo or something.. heck, afterall some of themwere ex Blizzard employees, but whatever their motivations/reasons in leaving... just a point for you to ponder over, at least Diablo had more replayability.

They had less graphics, less immersion, less of everything, yet that game provided more.

GW had a lot more from the go get, it certainly can provide a lot more than Diablo.

There's something for you guys to ponder over.

wth happened??

i dont think i should unload my ecto at 952g a pop..

after reading this thread all i can see is people complaining cause Anet nerfed there way f becoming insanely rich.... and all i can say to you is get a life! who whants to spend hours and hours farming a chest just so they can make cash they cant spend!

however on the flip side i beleave they could have nerfed it more effectivly by making monster drops better so it was more profitable to simply go through missions so people had no desire to farm to get that 1mil gold....

as for the market crash, you keep forgetting that the prices may have been lowered but that makes it more effecitive for lower level players and the people just starting to get there amour and weapons so they can finish the game with out having to spend the 15 hrs farming to get the 50k you whant for 1 crafting material. i feel the balance is getting better in the game but still needs improving. hell have you tryed to get a sigil laty from just dong missions and enjoying the game? i have and i tell you know its not easy....

NO!! The price for you to buy the item from the trader has INCREASED or stayed the same.

The decrease is when you sell TO THE TRADER. He buys for less than 60% list price. This causes less people to sell to him. Less people selling to him causes a price rise. Combined with the nerfs that provided most players with their gold this makes it HARDER TO BUY ANYTHING even the droknars armor.

yea but that means PLAYERS sell lower cause they cant get as good a price. thus allowing people to get what they need from other players they reliying on the trader

The players sell price is based on the traders SELL price (not the price he will pay you to buy the item). Essentialy if the trader is selling for 10K the going rate is 8-9K and if you want a quick sale you sell for 6-7K but this whole time the trader is offering 4-5K to buy the item.Most no one sells to the trader and a few people still buy from him if they have the gold and don't want to wait at all.

What you say would be true except that many many players are already wealthy enough that they don't really care and will buy the 10K item for 8K, but the new character who has no money can't buy that item and won't ever be able to because of the farming nerfs.

I don't understand why devs and publishers create these problems for themselves. When you let players influence a living, mutable economy, prices will go nuts. When you introduce more mutability with traders and the like, prices will do what they're doing now. All fluid and chaotic elements should be stripped out of the game. A central trading "house" should be introduced, where all prices are fixed for items, materials, and services. Players' personal trade windows should be taken out. All trading should go through the house. This wouldn't be as exciting as the present looney situation, but it would stabilize the economy. "Stablize" is too gentle a word. It would kill the economy. But sometimes that's what you have to do with mad dogs.

Things are not that bad. Way back beforethe rune trader Sup absorb were around 75 plat each and sup. vigors were 100 plat a piece. Compared to those days those are cheap as heck.

It's quite easy to tell you skipped everything in the post and went to quick response and typed your statement in. If anything, the new update is making it HARDER for new players, as buying prices from merchants is high, while the selling price is drastically low.

This is not what we are complaining about. We are not complaining about the price of each item, but the difference between buying and selling price at the traders.