Droknar rushers in early arenas
funbun
running screws the economy, but nerfing doesn't? So, it's all our fault. That's why the economy is so bad. We reuined it. Thanks for the insignt, Arnold.
Lebdan
If there was no rushing, there would be no need for nerfing in this case. Sorry for ruining your point.
Red Sonya
[running screws the economy ] YEPPERS
[but nerfing doesn't? ] NOPE
[but nerfing doesn't? ] NOPE
Sofonisba
So... after reading this thread for a while... I could have this wrong, but there are some of you on this board who believe that Drok's Armor is okay to use at Ascalon/Yak's arena, because:
a) it doesn't give "that much" of an unfair advantage?
b) if you win, it's only because of your skill, your armor has absolutely nothing to do with it?
c) those attempting to beat on you for -1 damage, are getting a great learning experience? The noobs deserve it - let them learn the hard way that they will have to grind endlessly, or scam people in trade in order to earn enough to do what you did?
I have instructed my fellow guildies who are still eligible to go into arena at Ascalon and Yak's to TAKE PITY on those they see wearing platemail or using Barrage.
Pfft.
a) it doesn't give "that much" of an unfair advantage?
b) if you win, it's only because of your skill, your armor has absolutely nothing to do with it?
c) those attempting to beat on you for -1 damage, are getting a great learning experience? The noobs deserve it - let them learn the hard way that they will have to grind endlessly, or scam people in trade in order to earn enough to do what you did?
I have instructed my fellow guildies who are still eligible to go into arena at Ascalon and Yak's to TAKE PITY on those they see wearing platemail or using Barrage.
Pfft.
EverBlue
It's simple. Set level requirements for armour and elite skills.
What? Is it unfair that you have to complete the whole game AGAIN just to use them? Shut up.
Sure, you can still get RUN to Droknar's, but you won't be able to use any of the armour and elite skills. Or make it so only a "True Hero" can use that armour or elite skill. That makes it so that you must be Ascended, and completed the trials in the desert.
Just like ANet closed off FoW/UW for those who aren't ascended, they SHOULD do something about the low-level PvP arenas, which have just degraded to Faction farming.
I liked the idea someone brought up earlier, about not being able to enter an arena once you've progressed to a certain part of the game.
What? Is it unfair that you have to complete the whole game AGAIN just to use them? Shut up.
Sure, you can still get RUN to Droknar's, but you won't be able to use any of the armour and elite skills. Or make it so only a "True Hero" can use that armour or elite skill. That makes it so that you must be Ascended, and completed the trials in the desert.
Just like ANet closed off FoW/UW for those who aren't ascended, they SHOULD do something about the low-level PvP arenas, which have just degraded to Faction farming.
I liked the idea someone brought up earlier, about not being able to enter an arena once you've progressed to a certain part of the game.
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Once your character enters a city with an attached arena, you can no longer compete in the previous arenas. So Ascalon is available until you reach Yak's, Yak's until you reach Lions Arch, and so on. Sure there might be some folks that just progress normally through the game and get to Yak's before they would have stopped playing in the Ascalon arena, but those would be the minority. Entering the arena's is alredy checked against level, so why not have it also check to see if you've made it to the city that has the next arena? So now those folks that choose to go get armor... enter Droks and are flagged as only able to compete in Droks arena. Yes, someone could get run to Copperhammer or Marhan's grotto for the 15k armor without touching Droknars, but the developers can find those "gateway" cities that everyone has to pass through (rankor for example) or areas (Snake Dance) and add that to the list of "If you've been here then you can't go back to xxxx arena". |
funbun
Dronkar's really only helps Warriors in Ascalon. For everyone else it doesn't make much difference. I've taken down Mesmers, Necros, Monks, using Drankor's amror. Just pump up with major and superior runes and you will own them.
Also be sure to only pump up on one attribute. I dumped everything I had into Domination majic for my Mesmer. Many people don't understand and they try to divide thier attributes into 3 areas. That's too many for PvP. you need to focus on one.
Also be sure to only pump up on one attribute. I dumped everything I had into Domination majic for my Mesmer. Many people don't understand and they try to divide thier attributes into 3 areas. That's too many for PvP. you need to focus on one.
EverBlue
Because you have oh so many attribute points at those low levels, not to mention enough health to use a Superior Rune without being a complete waste of space.
hydrak
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Originally Posted by Lebdan
Seriously, it pisses me off and takes the whole fun in being a low level in pvp.
Doesn't matter how good you and your team are, it's pretty impossible to get a victory against a team with a rusher. And don't come talking that you've finished the game 400 times and etc, why not playing fair and square? ANet should implement a way to avoid these people to go into the earlier arenas. And by early arenas I mean Yak's Bend and Ascalon arenas. *Flame shield on* What are your thoughts about it? |
I mean they can't really do real PvP in tombs and they have alot of extra golds because they can trade and rip off newbies from Lion Arch.
the drizzle
it is pretty bad. after finally taking down a warrior somehow even though i was doing 0-1 dmg, he said how he owned because it took our whole team to kill him. Then he called me a noob because i told him having that armor wasnt fair.
hydrak
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Originally Posted by the drizzle
it is pretty bad. after finally taking down a warrior somehow even though i was doing 0-1 dmg, he said how he owned because it took our whole team to kill him. Then he called me a noob because i told him having that armor wasnt fair.
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Dax
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Originally Posted by funbun
running screws the economy, but nerfing doesn't? So, it's all our fault. That's why the economy is so bad. We reuined it. Thanks for the insignt, Arnold.
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Nerfing does suck, but you can blame that one on bots and people who exploited the system. It's two different issues
I do agree that there should be services high level people could do. In FFXI mages made a decent living doing transport services, but it wasn't the same as rushing. You actually had to be there atleast once to be teleported there.
funbun
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Originally Posted by EverBlue
Because you have oh so many attribute points at those low levels, not to mention enough health to use a Superior Rune without being a complete waste of space.
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Lebdan
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Originally Posted by hydrak
Why do you have to ruin it for the PvP handicaps with this thread?
I mean they can't really do real PvP in tombs and they have alot of extra golds because they can trade and rip off newbies from Lion Arch. |
I haven't seen someone that doesn't rush or w/e complain yet. Why is it that only people that gain something from the rushing complain? Also, save handicapping to your Street Fighter games, this is about fair play.
bobrath
A PvP created character will not be affected in the least by this. They can't get into the low level arenas (Yaks and Ascalon) so there's no harm or foul. Its the Elite/veteran skills + the better armor combination that's showing up in the lower arenas and giving new players an incorrect picture of what PvP is like.
If the first time you walked outside of Sardelac you encountered grawl tossing around Barrage or Poison arrow while they take -1 damage from your best attack... how long would you stick with the game? How long until a post came in here claiming that PvE was broken cause these skills and armor don't belong in such low level areas?
Rush all you want, just don't let it ruin the newbie PvP experience
If the first time you walked outside of Sardelac you encountered grawl tossing around Barrage or Poison arrow while they take -1 damage from your best attack... how long would you stick with the game? How long until a post came in here claiming that PvE was broken cause these skills and armor don't belong in such low level areas?
Rush all you want, just don't let it ruin the newbie PvP experience
funbun
Newbs are gonna get pwned anyway. They don't know tactics and team strategies. They rush the enemy team with no regaurd for their team. They don't know which attribute to use or which skills are best.
They are newbs and will get owned by veterans. It doesn't matter if the vets use drankor's armor or elite skills. I can't tell you the number of times I've pwn people using drankor's armor. That's because I'm a vet and I know what to do.
They are newbs and will get owned by veterans. It doesn't matter if the vets use drankor's armor or elite skills. I can't tell you the number of times I've pwn people using drankor's armor. That's because I'm a vet and I know what to do.
the drizzle
oh it matters. newb or not, everyone has a better chance when theyre doing above 1 dmg.
funbun
Then explains how I've owned so many n00b dranor's people? They don't know the game. They are just relying on armor. I've found that drankor's warriors are the biggest threat. With everyone else the advantage decreases.
You gotta admitt. There is nothing like pwning drankor's armor n00bs.
You gotta admitt. There is nothing like pwning drankor's armor n00bs.
Sofonisba
We are impressed by your pwnage of the n00bs in all arenas, regardless of class, armor level, you name it. (Did I just type those non-words? Hoo boy I've been influenced by this game!)
I guess some folks really believe there ought to be no learning curve? What about the individuals just testing the waters in PvP? Here I mean, those on their first character, the non-veterans and the non-rushers. They will still probably get owned, that cannot be helped. BUT they will also learn a heck of a lot more about the play, if there is parity in armor/skills level forced into the early arenas.
I guess we just shrug our shoulders and let them be fed to the sharks. Except for my righteous indignation, it doesn't affect me at all, anyway.
I guess some folks really believe there ought to be no learning curve? What about the individuals just testing the waters in PvP? Here I mean, those on their first character, the non-veterans and the non-rushers. They will still probably get owned, that cannot be helped. BUT they will also learn a heck of a lot more about the play, if there is parity in armor/skills level forced into the early arenas.
I guess we just shrug our shoulders and let them be fed to the sharks. Except for my righteous indignation, it doesn't affect me at all, anyway.
Alana
This is probably a dead horse at this point, but I'm really hoping that this issue gets resolved. Beyond the fact that I don't understand the point of running through the game (why pay someone to play the game for you?), this nonsense of going back to the Ascalon arena to "PWN the N00Bss!!!" with your silly Droknar's armor and elite skills is just sad. If you need to prove your dominance over something, go solo some mobs somewhere. The arenas are stressful enough as it is for newer players. They don't need the added grief of ridiculously overpowered players there. It will result in them never wanting to PvP again, or maybe not play the game again. And no one wants that.
*stepping down off soap box*
Ohhh man. I actually snarfed the water I was drinking from laughing at that. Nice! 
*stepping down off soap box*
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Originally Posted by EverBlue
It's simple. Set level requirements for armour and elite skills.
What? Is it unfair that you have to complete the whole game AGAIN just to use them? Shut up. |
Moltov joss
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Originally Posted by Sandman Uk
I agree
Its nothing more than an Exploit to be run to Drokners so they can then earn good faction in the low level arenas. Where they can now also level up at the same time. If it was a PVE bot exploit they would have put out a quick fix update to kill it off. Simple solution is to make the armours level specific. Drokners armour should be lvl 15+. Or level it by price. If the games played properly a lvl1 shouldnt have the money to pay for it or pay a runner to get them there. |
I believe that is the solution. Here is the best level to restrict the armor at. Level 16, it would prevent them from entering ascalon arena and as well yak's bend arena.
bobrath
Congrats to funbun on being such a l33t uber droknar killer...
Now then for the rest of the folks that haven't had the chance to get any skills or combat experience because they are just learning the game why can't we make sure their sandbox isn't too deep? Do you let kindergardeners play in the same area as 5th graders?
Setting a level limit on armors is a nice idea, but the armor is the smaller part of the "problem". Its the Elite and later aquired skills that cause much more imbalance. Not sure how you can limit a skill to a level since there's no precedent for that in the current game.
Now then for the rest of the folks that haven't had the chance to get any skills or combat experience because they are just learning the game why can't we make sure their sandbox isn't too deep? Do you let kindergardeners play in the same area as 5th graders?
Setting a level limit on armors is a nice idea, but the armor is the smaller part of the "problem". Its the Elite and later aquired skills that cause much more imbalance. Not sure how you can limit a skill to a level since there's no precedent for that in the current game.
funbun
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| Now then for the rest of the folks that haven't had the chance to get any skills or combat experience because they are just learning the game why can't we make sure their sandbox isn't too deep? Do you let kindergardeners play in the same area as 5th graders? |
bobrath
New players wouldn't know about droknars. So I can only assume that you're refering to those players that like to feel better by taking advantage of a system to win over other newer players.
Lebdan
Off all the suggestions about how to avoid the people that rush ahead in game, I think the best would be to have checkpoints in each city with an arena, or key areas you need to pass by to get to advanced cities. It's the best for avoiding both veteran/elite skills and armors. There could be some tweaks here or there on this suggestion, if there is any flaws. What do you think?
Mayar third Keeper
just prevent players with elite skill or higher armor to enter the arena. Like prevent nonascende from entering the uw. If they drop the elite skills and the armor they can enter. This should fix it without disadvantages.
Lebdan
But it's not only Elite skills that hurt in arena. Skills like Final Thrust and Galrath Slash are a pain. Or spells like Meteor.
Lebdan
This is definitely stupid. You can't go in Arena anymore without facing two or more rushers. Something has to be done. -.-
Winterclaw
I don't know which ones are worse, the warriors with the best armor, or the monks with Zealot's fire and Balthazarr's Aura? My guess is the latter since they can usually do a ton of damage to the other team.
funbun
Quit complaining. Learn the skill and killem.
Lebdan
funbun, stop replying like it's a normal thing to rush ahead just to pwn arenas.
Iraqalypse Now
You don't even have to ban people wearing droknar's armor, you just have to make the game treat droknar armor etc. as lower AR armor...
Get a good mes/nec or nec/mes with Soul Barbs and you can do quite a lot of armor peircing damage, and just go after warriors in general.
Get a good mes/nec or nec/mes with Soul Barbs and you can do quite a lot of armor peircing damage, and just go after warriors in general.
Sir Santiago
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Originally Posted by Winterclaw
I don't know which ones are worse, the warriors with the best armor, or the monks with Zealot's fire and Balthazarr's Aura? My guess is the latter since they can usually do a ton of damage to the other team.
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I faced both today doing some Yak's Bend Arena.
How is it fair if the warrior with Droknar's armor only takes 0-1 damage each time I hit him? He says, "so what", moves on, and ignores me. Other melee oriented characters can't touch him either. Oh, wait a sec -- casters can take him down or disable him, right? Nope. He takes them down in a few swipes. Forgot to mention he has an uber fiery dragon sword!
I ran into the Smiters with the Zealot's Fire / Balthazaar's Aura combo a lot more today than usual, maybe because I just got to Yak's Arena (it certainly seems less common in Ascalon). Needless to say, one monk in particular was a ton of trouble for my descent team (which won 11 consecutive, but in the end lost to a team with this monk). He completely wrecked us, and managed to tank both warriors for considerable time while dropping both of them to probably near 25% health by the time we could kill him, IF we killed him. All that focusing on one guy did no good, because the rest of our team died while we were trying in vain to take him down.. How is that fair?
Someone before argued that even with Droknar's armor, he is a vet. Ok, so let's say you and your team of Droknar's armor and elite using vets face an equally talented team of vets.. Who wins? You do. You have an unfair advantage, and you know it.
This matter needs to be fixed. For some of us who don't like rushing (remember those Diablo 2 days?) and actually play the game through, it's nice to once in a while take a break at the low-level arena.
Low-level PvP is ruined by these people. The amount of fair competition is dwindling fast. Why are late-game skills & gear allowed in these arenas? Shouldn't they belong in late-game PvP?
*Frustrated rant over.
Winterclaw
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Originally Posted by funbun
Quit complaining. Learn the skill and killem.
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Lampshade
Well I rushed my monk from Beacons to Droknars..... at lvl 19.
I'm not a very good GW player and the Dopplegranger is really hard with monks.
I'm not a very good GW player and the Dopplegranger is really hard with monks.
Lebdan
Well, if you did that at level 10 I'd jump on you. But I did that to my Mesmer at level 20, because I didn't know after the dragon thing mission you were warped to Droknar -.-;
funbun
The monk Mirror is easy. Just pump up on smite. You can't heal him to death.
Fox Reeveheart
my only 2 cents.
I dont want to have to go through the game again to get the good stuff, especially with how bad the gold is to get with new characters x.x UGH.
I dont even like pvp cause i am terrible at it (especially with crappy comp and lag OMG! THE LAG IN PVP IS TERRRRIBLE FOR ME SO I DONT EVEN PVP ANYMORE).
Because i dont get alot of cash, I wanna save up for the best stuff early and get it ASAP, i dont wanna go and pwn a bunch of low levels, no fun =\ i wanna go pwn a bunch of same level charr or dwarves! dont take away my ascension armor though i am not ascended e.e
I dont want to have to go through the game again to get the good stuff, especially with how bad the gold is to get with new characters x.x UGH.
I dont even like pvp cause i am terrible at it (especially with crappy comp and lag OMG! THE LAG IN PVP IS TERRRRIBLE FOR ME SO I DONT EVEN PVP ANYMORE).
Because i dont get alot of cash, I wanna save up for the best stuff early and get it ASAP, i dont wanna go and pwn a bunch of low levels, no fun =\ i wanna go pwn a bunch of same level charr or dwarves! dont take away my ascension armor though i am not ascended e.e
bobrath
Fox, no one is seriously advocating taking away the path from Beacons to Droknars. All we want is some parity in the low level arenas.
Half measures like adjusting armor to level, or trying to prevent entrance based on posession of armor/skills are far more difficult then a simple check of "have you been past city X". Once someone reaches Yak's Bend (there's no way around it), then they should never be allowed back into Ascalon arena. Once someone reaches Camp Rankor or Lion's Arch, then they should never be allowed back into Yak's arean. Its a simple fix that's easily enforced and allows "balancing" of the arenas soley based on where you can find skills or armor.
Even better this has *0* affect on the PvE game or on the folks that just want to open up all the skills for their pvp chars.
Half measures like adjusting armor to level, or trying to prevent entrance based on posession of armor/skills are far more difficult then a simple check of "have you been past city X". Once someone reaches Yak's Bend (there's no way around it), then they should never be allowed back into Ascalon arena. Once someone reaches Camp Rankor or Lion's Arch, then they should never be allowed back into Yak's arean. Its a simple fix that's easily enforced and allows "balancing" of the arenas soley based on where you can find skills or armor.
Even better this has *0* affect on the PvE game or on the folks that just want to open up all the skills for their pvp chars.
RebelLeader
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Originally Posted by bobrath
Fox, no one is seriously advocating taking away the path from Beacons to Droknars. All we want is some parity in the low level arenas.
Half measures like adjusting armor to level, or trying to prevent entrance based on posession of armor/skills are far more difficult then a simple check of "have you been past city X". Once someone reaches Yak's Bend (there's no way around it), then they should never be allowed back into Ascalon arena. Once someone reaches Camp Rankor or Lion's Arch, then they should never be allowed back into Yak's arean. Its a simple fix that's easily enforced and allows "balancing" of the arenas soley based on where you can find skills or armor. Even better this has *0* affect on the PvE game or on the folks that just want to open up all the skills for their pvp chars. |
Bob, Your ideas really suk... Now you start finding elite skills in high level places like the desert. People in the desert are normally lvl 18 and above.. Now why should the game balance skills if EVERYONE works to have the best build? So all their work on getting the best build is gone thanks to your suggestion. I dont know about you but ive been to droknars and it isnt what most people think... To buy the ultimate armor u will need about 15-17k on hands depending on the constantly fluctuating prices... A mere noob cannot get there, a low leveld player with a second account could though. Now something else i MUST clear up, until u get to the Tomb of Primeval Kings you will not see players using elite skills against you (Unless you g vs g). So in ascalon everyone has the noob skills, at yaks everyone has little less noob skills and so on. I went to through the strory and became ascended within 5 days that i got the game and evry elite skill i have ( only 5 or 6) has come through the Facets in the Dragons lair OR Bosses at desert.
entropy
I think it isstupid to complain when you get owned in ascalon arena. So what lvl some more and play in the lvl20 arena's its not that hard even if you only hacve an hour or half an hour a day to get there. Actually though about the post above I have seen rangers with the elite poison arrow in ascalon guildies and other people help the low lvl players by killing the bosses and letting the low level players get elite skills. As far as it goes so what? I as an ele have killed many rangers with elite skills and probably droks armor just choose your skills wisely it isn't as hard as everyone makes it out to be. Sure it isn't Fair but in every game there will be exploitation of some kind. Don't get all upset over it.