Killcount In Ha: "Looking Into Further Changes"? I Think Not

Well the Ha community finally got 8v8 back. Many people are happy about the change, and greatly appreciate the attention that Anet has given us.

So what is the problem?

That was months ago!

Overwhelmingly the HA community on this forum, and most other fan site forums do not want kill count. It makes no sense, limits the possible types of builds that a team can play, ect. However, I am not posting simply to list the problems with killcount. I am posting here to hopefully get the attention of the Devs who have ignored this thread and everyone who has posted in it. I would like to at least see someone from the Anet staff (preferably Gaile) post in the HA section, giving the community some kind of information on the progress of the Devs.

Hopefully this will bring some sort of attention to the problem, and changes will be made.

Murderball is even dumber than kill count imo.

IMO this topic is dead talking about it is just like beating a dead horse. Chances are its in the works behind a long list of higher priority things to work on.

Really? Who told you that?, because the last time I heard about "changes in the works" was months ago. Well..where are they?

I guess those "high priority things" to work on are birthday cupcakes right?

Higher priority things? like double xp skill cap weekends? Yea... gfg, everyone knows ANET favors the pve carebears over everyone else. Anet just doesn't give a damn about HA because frankly, HA is like farming pvp and GvG is the primary PvP, pretty much the only place they actually listen to people about and then everything else is for the pve carebears

You can't have everything, getting 8v8 back was a big step and how long did that take? The better part of a year, it'll probably be the same for killcount. Rofl its just a game, have fun.

Anyone who says "PvE carebears" should have their whole statement automatically deleted.

The situation in HA needs to be addressed, but Anet is not a very big company. They juggle people around and everyone has multiple tasks. Theres no instant ANYTHING. Have some RED ENGINE GORED ENGINE GORED ENGINE GORED ENGINE GOing patience.

Sorry I'm having a little trouble having fun while all I can play is an ele, paragon spiker, or thumper. Perhaps you like the INSANE KILLING FEST WOOT, but I would rather put some skill into the game.

Instant? Its been MONTHS. There have been threads complaining about it for MONTHS. Even if they are working on it, thats FINE. BUT SAY SOMETHING ABOUT IT. Just leaving the entire forum in the dust isn't informative at all. If they are busy and can't deal with it, then they should SAY IT.

No... I'm still waitting for Gaile to reply this one thread so my mini koss can get his weapon ^^;; (Oh shi interweb police already replied this thread ><)

It's cute when ANet ignores a 7-page petition thread for 2months.

Well if you'd rather put some skill into the game... go do it! Use youre head and figure something out instead of finding the easy way out. As i said, you can't have everything, maybe its time for you to adapt and evolve. Quit QQ and get on with it.

You've doomed this thread to a lot of 'learn2counter" posts by people that don't actually PvP, by posting in riverside. I would suggest ignoring these rather than trying to argue as it will be fruitless.

How many more changes are you going to whine for until you realize that the changes aren't doing anything? It was a gimmick game 8v8. It was still one when they made it 6v6, and still one when it went back to 8v8. It was a gimmick when it was all super-defensive altar capturing nonsense. It still is with the random gametypes. It has been through two years of expansions and balance changes. And that's because: three team arenas are random and gimmicky by definition. No gametype changes will fix it. No skill changes will fix it. Every time they try, the players pick some random other mechanic to whine about and start over.

Anet should just admit they screwed up and bring back altar maps, and get rid of retard ball and crap points.

The same can be said about PvE's Hardmode.

The Hero/Henchmen AI has been relatively terrible,yet no word has been said on it.And don't give me they don't have time horseshit.

I can go find you several of Gaile's posts about minpets and the like in the last week.Yet no word on actual problems that affect game play.We just want confirmation as to whether or not its being looked into.

HA is a joke in its current state. It will take more than just the removal of killcount to fix that. So hopefully that is what Anet is trying to accomplish.

I love how people EXPECT changes.

<sarcasm> I know that when I bought this game, the developers would be constantly bowing to my whims even though, myself as an online poster, represent only a minority of the two million plus other gamers who also purchased the game. </sarcasm>

A bit overboard, but you get the idea.

Any update you get, is more than you were originally promised. I know when I bought prophecies two years ago, I didn't know they'd be constantly updating the game and paying attention to some of their customers' insights.

Even if every GW-based forum said the same thing, it still wouldn't represent the majority of Guild Wars players. As I said in my rant on Polls, its a skewed population, hardly a random sample.

And as far as petitions, lengths in threads, etc. go ... look at the Chapter scenario. The developers said they weren't going to do it, no amount of community uprising is going to change that.

Be patient, MAYBE you will get your change. And if you don't, be mature enough to accept it (or at least debate it rationally.)

Patients Grasshopper

Are you kidding? The solution is so simple, just replace the new objectives with the old ones, and halls is fixed.

Anet isn't doing this because they are in denial about how badly they screwed up halls.

HA had problems before 6v6 and the objective changes, why do people always forget this? I hope anet is taking the time to address those issues as well as the crap that is there now. I too am frustrated with HA. My guild (a strictly HA guild, and one of some repute) completely died because of HA being crap, but I'd rather anet actually fixed it than just putting it back to the crap it was before. I would be ok with waiting a long time if it means we'll get some thing like new maps, they just better not do something stupid like reverting back to the old way cuz then it would mean that they wasted a lot of our time with this crap only to revert it. In the case of 8v8 over 6v6 it was totally warranted, but the new objectives could be fun. They just need a lot more work to get to that point. Work we have yet to see.

/rant
You people DO realize that fixing an entire format is going to take a lot more work that making a cupcake drop in game or doubling XP for caps, right? You aren't actually serious when you suggest that those things are higher priority than HA and that's why it's taking a long time, right? You are just being sarcastic and don't really think it's the same people doing that stuff as who would be working on HA, right? Cuz that would be so naive if it wasn't just sarcasm...
/endrant

Coders make items drop and double XP, that's easy, a Designer would be needed for HA and I'm sure they are more worried about putting out GW:EN at this point. Anet is clearly interested in fixing problems in the game or they wouldn't ever do updates other than to add new Chapters, but a company does need money to survive, so new products always take precedence.

I don't think that anet has to give us regular reports of "yeah we are working on it" to make me feel secure in the fact that they are working on it. But if by the time GW:EN comes out, we haven't heard ANYTHING? Imma be pissed.

I was a long time HA player from around when the game came out until actually it was made into 8v8 for the second time... permanent. I just got so annoyed that just because they made it 8v8, they thought there job was done. Now I go only once and a while. Its funny how ive said a million times "Just make halls back to the way it was before," You might get a response like " Dude HA was dieing when it was its old system and 8v8 , you just have to learn how to adapt to how much it sucks or stop QQing". Yeah though I see your point for posting about it here because Gaile basically only looks at this forum.

Good, someone finally posted in riverside, maybe Gaile will actually read it. Anet also needs to read the HA section and "petition to remove killcount from HA". HA is currently an AoE scrubfest, and it's dead because no one decent plays it any more. Revert back to old objectives and remove all the new crap.

Haven't you been listening to the smart folk who spam the HA forum? Anet have a button right in front of them that'll change HA back to alterhold, but they won't press it because THEY DON'T WANT TO ADMIT THAT THEY SCREWED UP.

They still have a lot more farming nerfs on the way before they get to HA.

KANE

HA is pvp so that means arena.net will totally ignore it.


What it really needs are more maps, and gameplay modes that actually make sense. Killcount and murderball are about the farthest thing from fun you can get in the game.

I've really heard all this 100 times before, the fact is that HA was not crap, and had a large, and loyal player base. The main problem in the past was gimmick builds that abused certain imbalanced skills to defeat teams more skilled then them, this problem plagues the entire game and is not just isolated to HA.

I don't really care if Anet makes the current objectives changes a waste of time and reverts back to the old objectives. At least Anet would admit they made a mistake a fix it instead of giving us false hope with objectives changes that are unneeded.

Wow did someone actually say Anet favors PvE players over PvP .... Does anyone here not understand that for a while PvP was the only area of the game that was getting ANY attention? Now there's hard mode and the new PvE skills coming up, but PvP changes are coming really soon, such as ATS!!! The point is that Anet likes both and switches off working on them. They can't do everything at once, sheesh.

Anyway I havent HA'ed in a while, because almost no people play any more. The worst move Anet could have made was making HA 6v6 in the first place, because, while good, old habits die hard. IWAY ruined HA, but it was what kept its popularity for tons up. Now it just seems that either the population of PvPers is rapidly dwindling (some people ONLY play PvP) or everyone is just stretched thin among everything to do in this game.

If HA isn't a part of your game play, please don't try to chime in.

Kill count has been in for way too long and ruined HA for me and others. I havent played there in a couple months now because of it. I really hope this ACTUALLY gets changed soon.

1v1 kill count is pointless, almost no difference from annihilation.

If waiting till the last 2 mins is your only problem with old altar system, I think you need to re-evaluate the situation.

New altars result in an unwinnable situation, when one team gets enough points to clinch a victory, old altars you always had a chance (unless there isn't enough time for the ghost to cast claim resource, but that doesn't really count.). New altars encourage you to rush in at the beginning and kill, kill, kill cap, hold for points, rinse repeat. Old altars placed more emphasis on capping, while new altars placed more emphasis on holding. Old altars allowed for more tactics that why I preferred it.

From what I can tell, the quote above is ANet's standard operating procedure.

The bold part at the end refers to the usual case that they're too busy working on "higher priority" tasks, such as destroying other parts of the game, removing fun and enjoyment, and generally causing the game to sink to new lows.

All in the name of the "grand vision" of course. I'd love to be a fly on the wall when Anet gathers into one of their brainstorming sessions, and see just what rationales and logic these people come up with to justify some of awful changes that have been endemic to the game in the last year and more.

Agreed, I cannot imagine one person who casually plays Heroes Ascent that would come in here and debate its removal. And while we are on that subject, I would like to hear ONE person's explanation on why killcount is better then any other format that could be introduced. (ALTAR should not be a word in your explanation)

Kill count is better because Gaile thinks it's cool.

It should be clear by now that anet has a gross misconception of player's tastes regarding HA -- and by players I mean people who actually play in HA, not people who 'play' it on forums only. The cause of this mess in the first place was anet actually buying into forum QQ'ing, reading the eloquent and detailed posts regarding possible HA improvements from players who are either retarded or don't play HA, and then implimenting them under the impression that GW's problems would be solved, /endQQ.

I'm not one to jump on the Gaile bash wagon, after all she's just an employee of a company and as far as I'm concerned does a reasonable job relaying information to the community, all while wading waist-deep through bullshit. But I have to admit that it is a little disheartening to see GW's lone community representitive basically shrug off the concerns of the majority of HA'ers out there and show no understanding of the issues at hand. I think the mis-communications go both ways though, as she basically tried to own some ATS doubters last night by stating they would find some pleasant surprises regarding the ATS system today at noon. Turns out the pleasant surprise was more delays. I chuckled.

Problem is, anet broke the game I originally bought. I expect them to fix it.

Just because the solution is simple doesn't mean its a direction the company wants to go.

While I agree it might be disappointing to see something you like change, saying they "broke" it isn't going to be a viable option. After all, it says in the game manual and EULA that ANet (although not on the box...) would periodically make updates to the game and also I believe "game play subject to change."

What you have to remember is ANet made the change. So they are doing one of two things purposefully:

A) Making changes the community hates (essentially shooting their selves in their collective feet) and lying about it (as Gaile made several announcements about how the new format met wild success)

or

B) The small minority of forum posters (GWG has just under 130k members, roughly 5% of the Guild Wars population, for a note) among the various fan sites don't speak for the majority of PvP players.

The squeaky wheel gets the grease, the silent one keeps on running. In other words, if things are functioning properly, people don't complain.

They said they are looking at it, that should be good enough for you. Do you want them to rush into making a decision and perhaps add more fuel to those who endlessly complain?

They're working on an expansion, an entirely new game and every person who wants a change thinks their idea should get priority.

Let them do their job.

Yeah, all those Double Fame & double factions weekends really where great for all the pvers. Here's the thing, EVERY change that is being complained about happened because people begged, whined, & pleaded with Anet to make them, then the ones that don't like it beg, whine, & plead for Anet to change it back. For those of you that don't like Killcount, would you rather go back to just holding builds that can't kill worth a flip, all they do is cap the alter 1st then just keep the ghost alive for 10 mins? yeah that was real fun. From what I read on this forum, basiclly we should just do away with HA entirely, I mean, eveyone hates killcounts, they hate alter maps, they hate 6v6, they hate 8v8, heck I don't see why you babies play HA if you hate it so much.

Read between the lines then I supose.

The same type of maps and rules get really dull after the 500th time you've done them. It needs to change from time to time. Although I can't say I had this much of a hatred towards the old halls, which I enjoyed.

tbh. they should just bring back the old holding in halls, and make the map last 1:30, relic runs etc only matter in the last 30 or so seconds, why have pointless time wasted when everyone is going to moreorless gain nothing over a longer period of time, also, why are noob teams making it to halls? the otehr day i was playing against mystic pwnsyou, he was running SFway...as always, and we were winning in broken around 16-10-3, then when we get to 21, 30 secs or so before the end mystic steals all of our kils ending up 21 21* so that he wins bc he got the last kill, it was gay mystic is a noob and yet he gets to halls because there are more and more noobs comining to halls. tbh they should have a <3 areana where ppl can gain rank and stop this farm of the nabs. im sorry but i mean i go to halls about 90% runs in the last 2 weeks, and then we end up being ganked in every 2nd 3way map. it sucks, why? becuase the recognise the name - Borat Ownz Yooo or Electronic Empire [eE]. ganking is ruining the game and just becuase 1 noob team doesnt know good tacs for capture points they decide hmmm i dont like that guy that has success lets beat on him, and so end up loosing to noobways it sucks, good teams shouldnt have to play against that. u dont have to be ranked to be good, thats understandable and true, but i mean when personel quams come in the way of a good game it just ruins it. sportsmanship should be more common, to often to i see "fu noob scrubs" or w/e before a match, and when they get rolled its "learn to play" n stuff, yet they were pwnt, one of the best matches this week was against a guild group "heroes factory" rank5, while i was running with some guildies, borat, was calling an the match lasted 45mins, it was great, while fustrating and tireing for 8 fame, it was good, there was no flaming or bitching, it was spike vs spike, as always we were runnning rit spike, while they were running paraway, most of the time borat was dead, and blocked sinc they knew he was the caller, so with calling coming from beyond the grave and from party members within the group we managed to outplay them, however only slightly, this match i felt was a good game, while others such as ones in burial which last 1 min ish against some flamers is just terible. player attitude needs to be worked on. i think that halls would be alot better if all maps were either 1 on 1 , 4 way, or like scared eath. remember that map where there was 3 sections, in each section there would be a team fighting and once a party was defeated in that section the door would open into the middle, where other doors were closed until the other teams had stopped fighting, while there were a few problems such as teams taking forever to beat eachother, it stopped the chance for ganking which ruins ha.

ganking needs to be fixed not the skills, lame builds (in my opinion) such as SFway, paraway and iway (new iway) are all very sucky but still they are meta and so must be good as it helps newer players get into groups as not much co-ordination is required, and teams, if they are good should be able to counter the meta always and therefore not complain about looosing to popular build, thats fine, its when 2 noob teams gang up on the good team before /roll 100 or fighting eachother, sucks, while alot of the time i can beat the gankers it leaves a nasty taste in my mouth about HA. it just sucks!!!
EDIT the solution. make gaile/members of the GW team come and sit in halls and after the win the winning team should be question as to what they think or...they could send out questionaires? im sure theyed get a clearer responce then...

also, kill counts, meh, i dont mind them, but i see how they disrupt the game, on the other i think capture points is more of a problem.

I think the biggest problem with kill count is that it's not 1v1. 1v1v1 is just stupid and imbalanced, since there will ALWAYS be ganking.

It took over a year for additional storage and since when did Anet have to answer to you. Any previous communique was a courtesy and not a requirement.

/signed


edit: L A W L Z @ thread in The Riverside Inn. Its about time~