if ppl don't like it then dont use it.
it seems a simple thing to do.
i veiw these forums daily and listen to the this is a game of skill
and all the players useing wiki builds or other cookie cutter builds are low skilled button bashers i think it goes like this 1,2,31,2,3 1,2,3
where as the leet player just oh yes 5,2,8,5,2,8,5,2,8 their skills
instead of kicking those less able try helping a few show them how dont just
laugh when they dont understand not everyone is so talented.
The Sundering of the Community - UB Anet's Double-Edged Sword
bel unbreakable
bungusmaximus
Quote:
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Originally Posted by bel unbreakable
instead of kicking those less able try helping a few show them how dont just
laugh when they dont understand not everyone is so talented. |
Wildi
What exactly is overpowered ? The fact that you can only use bear skills, have no utility, no self heal no anything you can only hope your monks will heal and prot you ? Or is it ursan force, you run faster for 8-14 seconds.. awesome. It must be Ursan rage right ? Which knocks down adjacent foes but damn.. the damage does not even ignore armor. Maybe ursan roar ? Weakess + your party does more dmg with attacks only ? Or probably ursan strike, deal 40-75 dmg to target twice ? No one in my guild is using elite blessing skills simply because it replaces your complete skillbar and limits you to spam attacks.
cebalrai
Quote:
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Originally Posted by Wildi
What exactly is overpowered ? The fact that you can only use bear skills, have no utility, no self heal no anything you can only hope your monks will heal and prot you ? Or is it ursan force, you run faster for 8-14 seconds.. awesome. It must be Ursan rage right ? Which knocks down adjacent foes but damn.. the damage does not even ignore armor. Maybe ursan roar ? Weakess + your party does more dmg with attacks only ? Or probably ursan strike, deal 40-75 dmg to target twice ? No one in my guild is using elite blessing skills simply because it replaces your complete skillbar and limits you to spam attacks.
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Let's look at Ursan at say, level 7. Clear out Drakkar lake in normal mode a few times and turn in your books, and you can get level 7 in just a few days. But keep in mind that there's a big power jump from 7 to 8, so this analysis is a bit conservative. As time goes on, people's average Norn level rises, so level 7-9 is getting pretty common.
URSAN STRIKE - This is 126 damage that BYPASSES ARMOR and attacks at full spell range. It also recharges in 3 seconds. It counts as 2 strikes which means when you use it your energy actually increases (which is key for blessings). Holy crap!
Think of it this way... Assume you're fighting a common 100 armor target. You'd need to have a 252-damage armor-hitting attack to match Ursan Strike. And your 252-damage attack would need to be able to fire twice in four seconds. This skill is unmatched in all of GW.
URSAN RAGE - In that very brief 3 seconds when your Ursan Strike is recharging, you get to do a pb AoE knockdown. Not just that, but it's a 2-second knockdown. Yeah it hits armor, but it's still 110 damage to all adjacent foes which is a very powerful attack.
URSAN ROAR - Brief weakness, but it's to everyone in earshot. It also is going to make all your allies deal +12 damage. Let's say six people on your team attack twice during roar and two more don't attack. That comes out to roar doing an extra +144 damage. If you have multiple bears on your team (which is where this skill is really broken), you'll see this skill running pretty much constantly, meaning it easily leads to several hundred extra damage. It's a no-activation-time shout so it's just gravy anyway.
URSAN FORCE - at level 7, you can maintain a speed boost permanently. Not bad at all.
Also...
ARMOR BOOST - +17 armor. How significant is this? Let's say you're a 60-armor squishy and you get hit for 100 damage. You take 100 of course. Now let's say your squishy uses Ursan Blessing and now has 77 armor. That 100 damage hit now only does 74 damage - saving you 26 hps on every hit!
HEALTH BOOST - +167 maximum health. Very nice... especially since that extra health is protected by your armor boost.
Sweet Mystery
I read a lot of moaning here and to be honest can see a lot of people who are so full of themselves it's amazing.
I have UB... have I used it? Yes. Do I always use it? No. I primarily play a ranger and with my L20 Mursaat at my side, with ranged attacks and my H/H team I can pretty much to all missions. I've blasted through some hard mode missions without this skill being used.
UB was used on Abaddon's Mouth... why? So I could rip the mursaat and jade on the wall as bow attacks didn't cut it... once done reverted to my barrage/volley/needling shot setup.... oh look a 1,2,3 damage dealer still...
UB is a skill that can deal damge... ok can do 150 points every 3 seconds... what about Spoil Victor which can deal damage whenever a foe uses a skill? want to nerf that? chuck SV on someone then hit them with necrosis when you can and watch them drop.... I can solo titans in the torment with my 55 doing exactly that... people farm magma shields that exact way... should that be nerfed? should any skill set be nerfed because someone is so uber-leet that all of a sudden someone else can do things they spent time doing before quicker?
it's called evolution of the game, bringing new people playing more in the game.... want to limit other peoples playing experience and fun because you feel justified to have a moan about a skill?
let people play how they want to play.... or wonder why people always hate teaming with others... as all they will do is moan and kick and moan and kick
I have UB... have I used it? Yes. Do I always use it? No. I primarily play a ranger and with my L20 Mursaat at my side, with ranged attacks and my H/H team I can pretty much to all missions. I've blasted through some hard mode missions without this skill being used.
UB was used on Abaddon's Mouth... why? So I could rip the mursaat and jade on the wall as bow attacks didn't cut it... once done reverted to my barrage/volley/needling shot setup.... oh look a 1,2,3 damage dealer still...
UB is a skill that can deal damge... ok can do 150 points every 3 seconds... what about Spoil Victor which can deal damage whenever a foe uses a skill? want to nerf that? chuck SV on someone then hit them with necrosis when you can and watch them drop.... I can solo titans in the torment with my 55 doing exactly that... people farm magma shields that exact way... should that be nerfed? should any skill set be nerfed because someone is so uber-leet that all of a sudden someone else can do things they spent time doing before quicker?
it's called evolution of the game, bringing new people playing more in the game.... want to limit other peoples playing experience and fun because you feel justified to have a moan about a skill?
let people play how they want to play.... or wonder why people always hate teaming with others... as all they will do is moan and kick and moan and kick
cebalrai
Quote:
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Originally Posted by Sweet Mystery
UB is a skill that can deal damge... ok can do 150 points every 3 seconds... what about Spoil Victor which can deal damage whenever a foe uses a skill?
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Yang Whirlwind
I haven't really used the "Bear thingie" much - didn't seem that interesting to me.
So, now we could say "let the noobs have their fun - they can't do the hard stuff the regular way"! The major problems with this being (imo):
1. The noobs will never get any better - we got better because we had too if we wanted to complete "the harder stuff"!
2. The harder areas tend to yield the rarest items in reward,- with noobs clearing the "elite areas" the economy will deteriorate even further!
To me this is a question of overall game-balance more than a question of letting people play the game however they please.
There's nothing wrong with using the skills available,- so I can't fault those who want to use this "cheat"/godmode ability as long as it gives you an edge.
Anet should look into rebalancing this skill if its actually as overpowering as it is being suggested here.
Don't kill the bear - just file down its teeth and claws
Just my 5-cents!
So, now we could say "let the noobs have their fun - they can't do the hard stuff the regular way"! The major problems with this being (imo):
1. The noobs will never get any better - we got better because we had too if we wanted to complete "the harder stuff"!
2. The harder areas tend to yield the rarest items in reward,- with noobs clearing the "elite areas" the economy will deteriorate even further!
To me this is a question of overall game-balance more than a question of letting people play the game however they please.
There's nothing wrong with using the skills available,- so I can't fault those who want to use this "cheat"/godmode ability as long as it gives you an edge.
Anet should look into rebalancing this skill if its actually as overpowering as it is being suggested here.
Don't kill the bear - just file down its teeth and claws
Just my 5-cents!
bungusmaximus
Quote:
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Originally Posted by Yang_Whirlwind
To me this is a question of overall game-balance more than a question of letting people play the game however they please.
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Be good: Farm über rare items
Be baed: Buy über rare items from scoundrels that charge too much ^^
Now who said noobs can't get the nice goodies?
milan
This is all well and good, but based on past events, you know that Ursan Blessing is going to end something like.
You have +5 armour and +10 health
Ursan Strike - Strike once for 30 damage - 10 second recharge
Ursan Rage - Knock down 1 adjacent foe, if a foe is knocked down, you lose 25% health
Ursan Roar - for 3 seconds you deal +5 damage
Ursan Force - for 6 seconds you move 10% faster.
You have -5 energy degeneration.
When they do get around to nerfing this pve only elite, expect it to never be seen on a skill bar ever again.
You have +5 armour and +10 health
Ursan Strike - Strike once for 30 damage - 10 second recharge
Ursan Rage - Knock down 1 adjacent foe, if a foe is knocked down, you lose 25% health
Ursan Roar - for 3 seconds you deal +5 damage
Ursan Force - for 6 seconds you move 10% faster.
You have -5 energy degeneration.
When they do get around to nerfing this pve only elite, expect it to never be seen on a skill bar ever again.
cebalrai
Quote:
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Originally Posted by milan
This is all well and good, but based on past events, you know that Ursan Blessing is going to end something like.
You have +5 armour and +10 health Ursan Strike - Strike once for 30 damage - 10 second recharge Ursan Rage - Knock down 1 adjacent foe, if a foe is knocked down, you lose 25% health Ursan Roar - for 3 seconds you deal +5 damage Ursan Force - for 6 seconds you move 10% faster. You have -5 energy degeneration. When they do get around to nerfing this pve only elite, expect it to never be seen on a skill bar ever again. |
Bryant Again
Quote:
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Originally Posted by milan
When they do get around to nerfing this pve only elite, expect it to never be seen on a skill bar ever again.
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N E D M
Quote:
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Originally Posted by spazzer
I heard Contra takes no skill because it's the same thing every time you play.
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bungusmaximus
Quote:
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Originally Posted by Bryant Again
Sledgehammer approach: they do it every time...
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Bryant Again
Quite honestly I have no idea what ANet will do with this skill. Sure, they've balanced PvE up a bit (SR, TNTF), but they've let a *lot* go untouched ("Save Yourselves", Paras.)
Snow Bunny
Quote:
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Originally Posted by Bryant Again
Quite honestly I have no idea what ANet will do with this skill. Sure, they've balanced PvE up a bit (SR, TNTF), but they've let a *lot* go untouched ("Save Yourselves", Paras.)
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Ursan just adds firepower where the defense already exists :P
cebalrai
Quote:
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Originally Posted by N E D M
up, up, down, down, left, right, left, right, b, a, start
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It's up, up, down, down, B, A, B, A, select, start
hahaha.... It's burned into my brain.
Zahr Dalsk
Oh no! Ritualists (and other classes that aren't part of the Holy Trinity) can get into a party for elite missions now!
Quit whining. Play H/H if it bothers you so much.
Quit whining. Play H/H if it bothers you so much.
Epa epa
Reasons why UB shouldn't get nerfed:
1- You don't solo farm with it
2- You don't self heal with it
3- It's only 80-150 armor ignoring dmg to a SINGLE target if it were AoE I'd agree to nerf it but it's not AoE. Plus its a PvE only skill, you get more damage with more ranks it's not like everyone gets the 150dmg, some get 104, some get 84, etc.
4- If you don't like it don't use it...
1- You don't solo farm with it
2- You don't self heal with it
3- It's only 80-150 armor ignoring dmg to a SINGLE target if it were AoE I'd agree to nerf it but it's not AoE. Plus its a PvE only skill, you get more damage with more ranks it's not like everyone gets the 150dmg, some get 104, some get 84, etc.
4- If you don't like it don't use it...
cebalrai
Quote:
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Originally Posted by Zahr Dalsk
Oh no! Ritualists (and other classes that aren't part of the Holy Trinity) can get into a party for elite missions now!
Quit whining. Play H/H if it bothers you so much. |
Ritualists, etc still cant get into a party for elite missions. But bears can. See how this doesn't address the problem?
Zahr Dalsk
Quote:
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Originally Posted by cebalrai
Ritualists, etc still cant get into a party for elite missions. But bears can. See how this doesn't address the problem?
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manitoba1073
Quote:
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Originally Posted by cebalrai
No, no no you messed it up!
It's up, up, down, down, B, A, B, A, select, start hahaha.... It's burned into my brain. |
its up, up, down, down, left, right, left, right, A, B, A, B, Start.
Contra FTW
strcpy
Quote:
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Originally Posted by manitoba1073
Then why did you also mess it up lol
its up, up, down, down, left, right, left, right, A, B, A, B, Start. Contra FTW |
There have been a few other games that use variants of that which is what you guys are probably remembering. I had to look up which one was the actual "Contra" code - too many years and too many variants of it.
Crom The Pale
One of the biggest problems in GW is the elitest attitude of people that feel since they are obviously better than others they require something to show that to the world in general.
Giving less skilled players a means to play in and possibly complete an Elite zone where they would normaly stand 0 chance of finding a party let alone completing it is a great addition to GW.
However UB is not so powerful a skill that it guarentees anything, if your party does not understand how to play the zone or work together.
Im rank 10 norn and joined a pug asking for a UB for UW. We cleared the first quest and were wiped on the second when somebody took the wrong quest then agroed the aaxes to the reaper. A common mistake, but just one of many possible mistakes a party can make to end up losing in an elite zone.
Maybe if Anet were to fix EVERY broken skill, of which UB doest not count in my oppinion, then maybe we would have less threads about which skill needs a nerf and which is ok to leave alone. The fact is there are about 100+ skills that need changes to be made usefull or at the very least fun to use, but as it stands now those skills will never see any use except on a Hench
Giving less skilled players a means to play in and possibly complete an Elite zone where they would normaly stand 0 chance of finding a party let alone completing it is a great addition to GW.
However UB is not so powerful a skill that it guarentees anything, if your party does not understand how to play the zone or work together.
Im rank 10 norn and joined a pug asking for a UB for UW. We cleared the first quest and were wiped on the second when somebody took the wrong quest then agroed the aaxes to the reaper. A common mistake, but just one of many possible mistakes a party can make to end up losing in an elite zone.
Maybe if Anet were to fix EVERY broken skill, of which UB doest not count in my oppinion, then maybe we would have less threads about which skill needs a nerf and which is ok to leave alone. The fact is there are about 100+ skills that need changes to be made usefull or at the very least fun to use, but as it stands now those skills will never see any use except on a Hench
Darko_UK
A skill that promotes pugs? NOT ON MY WATCH!!! NURF PLZ K THX BAI
cebalrai
Quote:
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Originally Posted by Crom The Pale
Giving less skilled players a means to play in and possibly complete an Elite zone where they would normaly stand 0 chance of finding a party let alone completing it is a great addition to GW. |
IMO some areas shouldn't be doable by players who are inexperienced/sucky/don't try to get better. The game should (and does) give them the opportunity to get better. I think they should go that route and try to become more skilled (which is what Anet wants us to do) before being able to complete high-skill areas.
Star Gazer
Quote:
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Originally Posted by Darko_UK
A skill that promotes pugs? NOT ON MY WATCH!!! NURF PLZ K THX BAI
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to the OP:
seriously, its a skill. if you dont want it, DONT TAKE IT. I do not see why this community (especially all the GWG carebears) feels like they need to impose their playstyle on others. I play how I do, and I affect you in no way shape or form. You play like you do, and you affect me in no way shape or form. deal with and /gooutside
Crom The Pale
Quote:
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Originally Posted by cebalrai
So... shouldn't less skilled players work towards getting better? Why is there an overpowered skill that allows them to accomplish the same things as people who did the work to become skilled? In that sense there's no reason to become a better player... even though Anet is calling GW a skill game.
IMO some areas shouldn't be doable by players who are inexperienced/sucky/don't try to get better. The game should (and does) give them the opportunity to get better. I think they should go that route and try to become more skilled (which is what Anet wants us to do) before being able to complete high-skill areas. |
Your oppinion is shared by many, and that is the real problem here. People that believe part of the game should be denied to those that do not live up to thier standards. This is just a game, one people play to have fun. If you wish a balanced challenge go to PvP. PvE is never going to be balanced and some people will never reach a skill lvl allowing them to enter the most elite zones or will never find a group of people that they can party with to learn what to do in those zones.
Looking up a build on wiki and reading about an Elite Zone will never teach you how to play with a party or how to predict the movment of mobs. Only actual experiance fighting in those zones will, and UB is giving may people that chance for the very first time, why take it away from them??
draxynnic
Quote:
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Originally Posted by bungusmaximus
Not everytime, but some skills are either imba, or crap, the skill itself leaves no room inbetween (Discord for example). However, stuff like enraging charge still sees play even though it's nerfed. Nerf Ursan and it won't be any better then people's own skillbars, and therefore it will probably never see play again, and that's pity. Anet won't get any good out of it either, it's just like dangling a juicy sausage in front of your face and pulling it away afterwards, it pisses people off, and that's bad PR. So i will have to see what happens to Ursan.
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While if it's more powerful then the regular skillbar... you're essentially making everything that isn't Ursan or a support skill for Ursan to be a subpar skill.
Lady Raenef
I'd say, limit it to certain areas...like, limit it to the Norn areas, near the shrines themselves. Makes them useless, but are the Wolfen or Raven ones useful? Not really. Make Ursan the same.
cebalrai
Quote:
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Originally Posted by Crom The Pale
Your oppinion is shared by many, and that is the real problem here. People that believe part of the game should be denied to those that do not live up to thier standards. This is just a game, one people play to have fun. If you wish a balanced challenge go to PvP. PvE is never going to be balanced and some people will never reach a skill lvl allowing them to enter the most elite zones or will never find a group of people that they can party with to learn what to do in those zones.
Looking up a build on wiki and reading about an Elite Zone will never teach you how to play with a party or how to predict the movment of mobs. Only actual experiance fighting in those zones will, and UB is giving may people that chance for the very first time, why take it away from them?? |
GW isn't about progressing in levels. It's not about progressing in loot. It's not about finishing the relatively short campaigns. It's all about progressing in skill. Take that away and what's left?
Esan
Quote:
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Originally Posted by cebalrai
GW isn't about progressing in levels. It's not about progressing in loot. It's not about finishing the relatively short campaigns. It's all about progressing in skill. Take that away and what's left?
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The thing is, individual skill advancement in a team-based game is essentially irrelevant when you have the rest of the gaming population to bring you down. This is why the PvE meta has been trying to reinvent the gear tank, the pinnacle of PvE perfection, ever since that was removed.
Racthoh
Quote:
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Originally Posted by Esan
This is why the PvE meta has been trying to reinvent the gear tank, the pinnacle of PvE perfection, ever since that was removed.
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Esan
Quote:
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Originally Posted by Racthoh
Playing down a man was the pinnacle of PvE perfection?
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Amon Warrior
Why not have some few skills that might just be what some players call overpowered?
I like to call it FUN! I like the entertainment factor that it brings. Does it make things a bit easier? So what? It only affects PVE. Devs have been making a darn good job with balancing the game already. Don't you think things get a little boring without some spice into it?
Do I use UB all the time? No... I'm glad that I have the choice to try new skill sets. I prefer to use it when I really do need it.
Nerfing things to death absolutely kills the fun factor and that's what they probably going to do with Ursan Blessing, taken into account what's been written in this thread.
I like to call it FUN! I like the entertainment factor that it brings. Does it make things a bit easier? So what? It only affects PVE. Devs have been making a darn good job with balancing the game already. Don't you think things get a little boring without some spice into it?
Do I use UB all the time? No... I'm glad that I have the choice to try new skill sets. I prefer to use it when I really do need it.
Nerfing things to death absolutely kills the fun factor and that's what they probably going to do with Ursan Blessing, taken into account what's been written in this thread.
Drakken Breathes Fire
Hello my name is Guildwarsguru, you might remember me from such films as 'casual players can do what I do? Nerf!' and 'I'm not happy until you're unhappy.'
Seriously, you all make me sick. You all bitch and moan about the golden days of guild wars being gone, yet it's because of your complaining and whining that these nerfs started. It's because you wanted change they were made.
Enjoy the fact you had fun when you did, otherwise, shut the f*ck up and stop trying to ruin the experience for every NEW player who hasn't had a chance to experience guild wars yet.
I swear, you people wont be satisfied until every skill in the game only does 15 damage and ONLY while suffering froma condition WHILE below 50% hp, and every monster has a reusable res skill.
This is a GAME. An online game where everyone is welcome, power gamer, meta gamer, casual gamer, and of course, all of you whining pussies.
Don't touch this skill.
Save the bear indeed.
Save guild wars.
The rest of you emo kids, cry in a dark corner somewhere far away from me.
Seriously, you all make me sick. You all bitch and moan about the golden days of guild wars being gone, yet it's because of your complaining and whining that these nerfs started. It's because you wanted change they were made.
Enjoy the fact you had fun when you did, otherwise, shut the f*ck up and stop trying to ruin the experience for every NEW player who hasn't had a chance to experience guild wars yet.
I swear, you people wont be satisfied until every skill in the game only does 15 damage and ONLY while suffering froma condition WHILE below 50% hp, and every monster has a reusable res skill.
This is a GAME. An online game where everyone is welcome, power gamer, meta gamer, casual gamer, and of course, all of you whining pussies.
Don't touch this skill.
Save the bear indeed.
Save guild wars.
The rest of you emo kids, cry in a dark corner somewhere far away from me.
cebalrai
Quote:
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Originally Posted by Amon Warrior
Why not have some few skills that might just be what some players call overpowered?
I like to call it FUN! I like the entertainment factor that it brings. Does it make things a bit easier? So what? It only affects PVE. Devs have been making a darn good job with balancing the game already. Don't you think things get a little boring without some spice into it? Do I use UB all the time? No... I'm glad that I have the choice to try new skill sets. I prefer to use it when I really do need it. Nerfing things to death absolutely kills the fun factor and that's what they probably going to do with Ursan Blessing, taken into account what's been written in this thread. |
And unless something is overpowered it's not fun and can't bring "spice" to the game? That's a really awful way to look at things IMO
cebalrai
Quote:
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Originally Posted by Drakken Breathes Fire
Hello my name is Guildwarsguru, you might remember me from such films as 'casual players can do what I do? Nerf!' and 'I'm not happy until you're unhappy.'
Seriously, you all make me sick. You all bitch and moan about the golden days of guild wars being gone, yet it's because of your complaining and whining that these nerfs started. It's because you wanted change they were made. Enjoy the fact you had fun when you did, otherwise, shut the f*ck up and stop trying to ruin the experience for every NEW player who hasn't had a chance to experience guild wars yet. I swear, you people wont be satisfied until every skill in the game only does 15 damage and ONLY while suffering froma condition WHILE below 50% hp, and every monster has a reusable res skill. this is a GAME. An online game where everyone is welcome, power gamer, meta gamer, casual gamer, and of course, all of you whining pussies. Don't touch this skill. Save the bear indeed. Save guild wars. The rest of you emo kids, cry in a dark corner somewhere far away from me. |
leprekan
This is typical forum "the sky is falling" bs.
Sorry, but I have not seen this huge surge in UB only groups. I see as many generic build groups being formed (if not more of them) than I do UB. The whole point of PvE only is .. it can be overpowered and not throw the game out of balance .. you are not forced to group with UB people. Nerfing a skill because YOU feel it is overpowered or YOU are too cheap to buy GWEN should not call for a skill to be thrown in the shit can like so many have. This is pve ... hello you have your own instance so stop trying to dictate how people enjoy theirs.
Sorry, but I have not seen this huge surge in UB only groups. I see as many generic build groups being formed (if not more of them) than I do UB. The whole point of PvE only is .. it can be overpowered and not throw the game out of balance .. you are not forced to group with UB people. Nerfing a skill because YOU feel it is overpowered or YOU are too cheap to buy GWEN should not call for a skill to be thrown in the shit can like so many have. This is pve ... hello you have your own instance so stop trying to dictate how people enjoy theirs.
Gaile Gray
I'm sure you already realized this from past "hot topics," but we will pass this thread link along to the designers in the Community Summary, so that they can get a feel for the opinions on all sides of this issue.
Karyuu
Well, it's been fun...