Survivor title for old characters

Before I get into my suggestion, I'd like to explain the premise of my idea. It's necessary, I think.

Firstly, having done it with one character, I have to say that starting from level 1 and getting 1,337,500 XP without dying is a truely impressive feat, and one worthy of recognition in a title. It is not my intention to cheapen this in any way, and if you'll follow me through some logic, I think you'll agree this wouldn't, or at least could be implimented in such a way that it wouldn't.

Also, given how quickly and easily level 20 can be reached by starting in Factions -- with full access to your Xunlai stash -- I would further suggest that were it provable, taking any character regardless of its circumstances and gaining 1,337,500 XP without dying once in the process would be just as impressive. Keep in mind that XP rewards for killing monsters are based on the relative level of the monster, and that high level monsters have more ways to quickly kill you. Also remember that a veteran character will likely have already done most of the easy quests already.

If you agree with me so far, then I think you'll also agree that gaining 1,337,500 XP without dying would be worthy of recognition in a title, regardless of how many times said character has died before going for the title.

If you agree with that, then finally, here is my idea.

A button in the interface or an NPC you can talk to. Regardless of how it is implimented, characters which have died can pay a fee (something around the cost of fully kitting out a new character with max armour, runes, skills, some of which from tomes, et cetera) to gain an empty 'Survivor' title track in their hero window. If they already had a title track, disabled by deaths and not maxed out, its count will be reset to zero. If they didn't have one, they will now have one with 0 XP listed in it. The character's level, skills, actual XP, et cetera would not change, only the title value would. From that point on, the title works as normal, increasing with XP gained until the character attains the maximum title or incurs a death. Should the character die, another reset can be purchased for the same fee, because after all, having to start over is bad enough.

Naturally there would have to be some safeguard, like typing the character's name, to prevent accidental resetting. And in case anyone wants to know why I'd like this, it's because my favourite character is actually as old as Prophacies. She has the most impressive accomplishments of any character of mine. She had 78% of Tyria mapped when titles came in. And of course, since there was no incentive not to die, she had over 100 deaths at that time too, meaning she never had a chance to go for the survivor title.


EDIT: I figure I should pull my updated argument into the first post.

Firstly, this could be further restricted to only those who have a Legendary Survivor character on their account already. Secondly, I think getting a survivor on a new character would actually be EASIER than getting one on and old character through this method. Here's why.

Making a new character:
Step 1) Start in Nightfall.
Step 2) Get to Kamadan without dying.
Step 3) Get into the consulate docks with help from friends, and buy max armour.
Step 4) With max armour, have a leasurly time getting to Factions.
Step 5) Use Factions' high XP quests to get to level 20 quickly with little risk by using non-party-member NPCs to help you.

With this method you can get to level 20 relatively quickly and with little risk, since most of it can be done killing monsters of level equivelant to yours, who can't really hurt you because you have max armour. However, using the method I suggested, the older character would have to get the same mount of XP killing monsters around level 20, which /can/ hurt a level 20 character with max armour. Quite badly too. So the initial 140,600 XP is easier for the new character, and after that the playing field is level.

Lastly, remember that this would cost money. If it was more than the cost of setting up a new character to be a survivor (skills, possibly tomes, armour, runes), I think people would stick for wiping characters unless they /really/ want to get the title on characters like my one. Then it would be fair.

In summary:
* Getting Legendary Survivor would be marginally easier on a brand new character if you spend enough money setting them up
* This method would cost as much or slightly more than that, and would reset your Survivor XP count to 0, no matter how far you'd gotten, so getting the title would be no quicker.
* Getting Legendary Survivor is NOT HARD, IF you use your brain and throw enough money at it. What it is, is time consuming. So if you're willing to put in the extra legwork, why should you be penalised for not wanting to delete your old characters?

Final thoughts:
* This should probably be restricted to characters who don't have 'Legendary Defender of Ascalon'.
* This would not involve resetting your death count. You would just have to gain the required XP without incuring any MORE deaths.

i seem to understand you about your favourite character but if u reallly, really want LS, just remake the char (same skin, same name...) the whole package of buying new skills, armor, weapons are part of gaining legendary survivor. they are things that make legendary survivor harder (in a way because u have to get the money and XP for them) besides fighting monsters for XP. so /not signed for me because if anet implements ur proposal, IMO LS will be somewhat "more comfortable" which would be totally unfair for those ppl who achieved LS the "hard way"

i'v had a sin who had 3 protector titles, 70%-80% explorer in 3 campaigns, 50% legendary elite skill hunter, 2 sets of elite armor and yet i deleted her because i wanted LS for my favourite character. now i have 9 maxed title and its still growing...

I knew someone would suggest that I remake her, but I don't have the time. I play pretty much nothing but GW, but I work for a living, so I don't have the time.

I also fail to see your point, since the only difference is the first 140,600 XP. Once you get that, you'll have all the skills and armour you need to go the rest of the way, and it's such a small fraction of the LS XP that it's negligable. So perhaps it would slightly cheapen the first rank of survivor. But still, not much, since even with maximum armour, once you're at level 20 you have to fight level twenty monsters to get XP, so it evens out.

If you still think this would be too cheap, perhaps it could be limited to people who already have a character with LS.

/signed

People shouldnt have to delete chars just to be able to get a title.

Isileth has my thoughts exactly. Even if it's not this method, even if it's something much harder to do than creating a new character from scratch, I think those with old characters and the determination to do it should be able to get this title.

I think perhaps requiring you to already have a Legendary Survivor character on your account would keep out people who couldn't get the title the real way, which would help keep from cheapening it.

/signed. The first 20 lvls of surivior usually do take the longest but the majority of survivor characters are given all the possible advantages at the start with max armour weapons runes etc, the time involved will still be considerable.. although I have found a spot where it is possible to get 40k exp in 10 mins with lightbringer scrolls

/notsigned
if you stuff up LS and you wan't it that badly start again.
if you have a character that you really like that you want LS on and you dont want to start over well, tough luck.
people shouldn't be given second attempts at a title where the whole point of it is not dying.
so as for all the 'old' pre title characters well tough luck, and besides its only 1 title - there are still another 40 out there for you to max out.

Actually, Zamochit, you make a good point. Let me outline how my survivor got her title.

Step 1) Start in Nightfall.
Step 2) Get to Kamadan without dying.
Step 3) Get into the consulate docks with help from friends, and buy max armour.
Step 4) With max armour, have a leasurly time getting to Factions.
Step 5) Use Factions' high XP quests to get to level 20 quickly with little risk by using non-party-member NPCs to help you.

In other words, the only part that really sets appart someone who started at level 1 from someone starting at level 20, is that the brand new character can work through the first few levels with relative easy in their max armour, killing low level monsters. In other words, I'm thinking it might be easier for them.

Not a bad idea. I also understand wanting to try for the title with a character that has been around since the begining. And starting over is NOT an option... are you kidding? Only a few months from a 3-year mini-pet! ;o)

I'd love to try that as well, but GW would have to place the SAME restrictions on it that everyone else must follow. Only characters OLDER than the Survivor Title Track introduction date are eligible. And if you die, you can NOT go back and reset to zero and try again. (Unless EVERYONE can do that... for a FEE).

A fee has always been my suggested method. See above, I've updated the first post. I think if it cost enough that it was as much as the cost of setting up a new character to be a survivor, or perhaps a bit more, then it would be fair.

My monk is the one now who seeks titles, for the most part. She was created prior to titles, so of course missed out on Survivor. I would have loved to have had the chance to gain the title on her, but remaking her was never an option.

Problem with this idea is map travel access to wherever you wish to go. That's a small part of the whole Survivor process, but important. You have to go through missions or places you'd rather not, depending at least on how or where you wish to earn the significant majority of your exp.

Much as I wish to support the idea, I cant. I made a new character for Survivor and that first ~150k and actually getting yourself to the ideal place(s) you wish to be is an important part of it. If I had a single-use death reset button to give Treya a shot at it, outside of lag, it would really not be so hard. So I suppose "yay" if this idea goes through and Treya can give it a whirl, but I cant sign it myself.

/unsigned

I don't see map access as that big a deal, but it is a point. Perhaps if your map access was temporarily lessened until such time as you gave up or succeeded or died... hm...

What about people with LDoA? then would be able to get both these titles, which then again makes its unfair to all the people who set out to be a legendary survivor. But if you could restrict this in a way. For example the reset guy saying to a LDoA
" Wow you are so leet already you dont need my help" then it might be a very nice idea. Personally I also think you should be able to only reset the title once and only for people who dont even have r1 in the survivor track.

/not signed, any hack can make it to Lutgardis and spam "lf hfff, will pay reward if needed". also means you can get access to all areas of the game risk free. This will cheapen the title even more than jade knight farming.

Well, it only ever was a farming title in its most efficient form anyway. If not Jade Knights then something else. HM just brought higher exp potential to the table.

Survivor was a joke title the secound they added HM and tomes, Honestly is it a hard to get to lvl 20 with max armor and elite skills...
I have no problem with it being the way it was UNTIL the HoM. That is only things that goin to be tranfered on. I have a surivor character, and it really is the easiest title to get PERIOD. Easier than protector. But it is not on my main, and with how HoM is character based, it pointless.
I want someway for my main to get it, seeing how she is the only things that matters.
Wish they just do a title tranfer, that fix most of the problem with people playing mutiple characters, transfer one title to another character, the origonal character get delited. Or just make LDoA and Surivor account based. Just something, it retarded that in a game that deaths were considered "not a big deal" that this title exists they way it does.
Reminds me of the refund point system.

ELite tomes,tomes, Wep And max armour is a massive advantage.

so if these were added to a char the title track of survivor would disappear if under R1, since thats the way its ment to be obtained isnt it?

if that doesnt coem in then any char shoudl be able to get it t anytime.

Does gettign 133,7500 exp. then tdyign make you more of a survivor then dying then getting the same exp.?

no

Anyway to get it to my old characters would be well received.

I'm not deleting them. That would be betrayal. Betrayers go to the Ninth layer of hell.

I think most people here get my point. Getting Legendary Survivor is NOT HARD, IF you use your brain and throw enough money at it. What it is, is time consuming. So if you're willing to put in the extra legwork, why should you be penalised for not wanting to delete your old characters?

I know some people delete and create them all the time, but I have an attachment to mine. I'm sure I'm not the only one. And in a Role Playing Game, I think /that/ should be more rewarded than people who remake all the time.

/signed

For those of us who made our characters before the Legendary Survivor, or if it was our first character through and we had no clue what the title was, there is no way to get that title. I have ~1000k worth of customized items/armor on my Ranger and spent over half of my GW time on him, and I do not wish to waste all that time to make a new Ranger.

It is HARDER to get LS at that point because I have all 3 Protectors already so missions will give me nothing, and most quests I have done. The only thing that remains is HM missions, and those are really quite risky. As for FFF, there will always be loopholes to titles. And there is no reason why you can't do FFF with new chars so I don't see the point to that comment.

And yes you have access to all areas of the game, but most likely you have all areas of the game done already, thus no more XP from missions and quests and whatnot. So there's really no point.
Farming IMO is not worth the risk for Legendary Survivor, one lag spike and there you go.

I think the way it should be done for old character is:
- remove/lock up all your armours (incl. all ones you placed in storage/mules), start with the starter one
- remove/lock up all your character's learnt skills, you'll have to learn them again
- remove/lock up all your unlocked towns/outposts on map traval, you'll have to unlock them again
- send you back into the intro movie
- reset your char level to lv1, and experience and death count to 0

You could keep Survivor for characters who actually earned it properly and introduce a different title opportunity for continuous experience gain.

It cheapens the pursuit of KoaBD, but if you're honest with yourselves, that's really all you want anyway.

I'd be happy with that, providing you get it all back again once you succeed, die or give up. Otherwise, what's the point?

But is there any need to do it like that? I still really think there would be more skill involved in getting that amount of XP without dying with an existing character, with the exception of map access. But if you're really going for Survivor with a new character, you'll pay people to run you where you want, get into Consulate Docks and get max armour at level 1, get all the skills you want with tomes, et cetera, and all the while have easy ways to get the first hundred thousand XP.

Not really. As someone pointed out already, Survivor is only one of 40 or so, and you only need 30 for max KoaBD. I'm just annoyed because I got Legendary Survivor easily enough, but noone knows about it because I never play the character I got it on.

/unsigned.

Oh please.

I can get 1,337,500 experience on an existing, fully kitted out, 200 att points, full unlocked skilled character in next to no time with so little chance of dying it's incredible.

As for the assumptions that new survivor prospect characters get run everywhere, you're wrong, you know what they say about assumptions.

Anet please please please, to stop these posts popping up every two weeks, introduce a different title for these people who won't take the obvious route available to them if they want the title badly enough.

Introduce a different title, make it a far higher xp threshold and let go for it.

You don't seem to understand. I already have the title on a different character. It was easy. The thing I refuse to do is throw away a 1,000 hour, 3 year old character. Also, I never said survivor prospect characters all get run everywhere, I'm just saying you can. Not doing so is a choice you can make to make getting the title more challenging. But by the same token, you could chose not to use this system if it were implimented.

However, another title would be a decent enough, second rate solution. Providing you can't get it if you already have Legendary Survivor.

/signed

Why get survivor on a char i hardly even play(still did it anyways though). But it would be fun to earn it on my tank. If you think about it no matter what the title is cheated anyways with Tomes and Powerlvling. So whats the differnece. unless you earned it the hard way its not really earn imo.

/signed

Something like this is really needed and is requested by players for a very long time. Now needed far more than before, with the current Anet's policy of rewarding just 1 character the title has a meaning only when it's on your Main character - now think of the huge loyal playerbase, who happen to have their Main characters be 2+ years old and not want to abandon that char and start everything all over again just because of a title. They got massively screwed.

Now there are many ways to fix the problem, for example:

1. Either implement a way for old characters to start the title track and accumulate those xp until next death;

2. Light version - make the title work for any character who happens to gain 1,337k xp without dying, no matter the deaths before;

3. Or something completely different - Let the title remain as it is now - old characters cannot obtain or show the title
BUT
make the Kind of a Big Deal title track count *unique maxed titles on the account* (so that odd new character being a Legd Survivor or another one being Legd Defender of Ascalon would add a +1 to the title track of your main)
AND
make the HoM of the primary developed character recognize those achievements done on an alternative char on the account (or better - make the whole HoM account based ftw!)

how can this wanting to do the survivor title with "pre title" characters cheapen the title any more then using texmod to gain cartography.

if using texmod to gain cartography isn't consider a cheat and also not cosider making the task anymore easier, then i definitely sign this to get a reset for characters that couldn't get the survivor title.

it's so much easier to get it on a new character, especially with all those double xp for elite cap weekends. It's much much harder for an older character to get it, especially one that has done a lot.

I'd also like a chance to get survivor title on my main (although I'd most likely screw it up really quickly), but it would take a very long time for me to get that kind of xp. Done most quests, got legendary guardian and skill hunter. that doesn't leave too many ways left to get a large income of XP.

Sadly I don't think they're going to bother changing it. This leaves me having to go for one of the goldsink titles to raise my maxed title rank which is pretty depressing. If my warrior eats much more of that pumpkin pie he's going to need bigger armour.

Because all texmod does is facilitate an interface for something easily done since Cartography was itself introduced - use Photoshop difference layers to see uncovered areas more clearly. Texmod or not you still need to go do it, regardless of if you used your eyes to discern the map differences, luck, someone else's eyes, Photoshop or Texmod.

Pretty much. I really do wish I could have gotten Survivor on Treya, as she never had the chance, and is the only one of mine who pursues multiple titles but:

Too much. Just make a new character. I would have liked to have tried Survivor, but I cant see adding all of this to an existing title and dont support it anyway. Anet would have to do all this otherwise an existing character would have the title too easily, and the only motivation would be one less truly annoying title on the way to KoaBD 6.

/signed

give em a chance

Bah. Softie.

reset or not still need to do it as well. lol you think reset, boom legendary survivor drops in your lap? its even harder to achieve since you already ran out of big chunky experience quest and mission.

and this is doing it yourself, not doing it with help from say texmod, its just a reset, and the player have to start getting those points themselves, as oppose to texmod "point here, you miss this spot, go map it right there"

/sign, this idea has been suggested before and its a really solid idea, i dont know why people dont like it. Its completly fair

=/ i gotta say, it would b making survivor heaps easier...
being able to reset the exp counter for 10k is an insult to all the ppl who deleted their characters.
And it would b really difficult to decide on a fair price, esp given that many ppl in the past have sacrificed a lot in order to gain the title.
Personally i think you should leave it as it is.
Its not like you can't get "god walking amongst mere mortals" without survivor.

Just because someone did it in the past doesnt mean everyone else should have to.
The fact that people had to delete chars to access it shows that there is a problem with gaining it. Its a bad game mechanic (especially in an rpg).

on the contrary it does...

If titles were "fixed" too frequently, there would be a growing expectancy for other titles to be "fixed", and as such, confidence in titles remaining as they are will dwindle, and nobody would really go for titles for a period of time.

Either changes are met with appropriate compensation, or they shouldn't be implemented at all.

edit: and meh, i don't think its such a bad game mechanic, cos its one of the few mechanics that seems to keep me interested.

others have suggested the same thing in the past, op, but what sets your post apart is the fact that you have turned your suggestion into a nice, detailed, persuasive argument--instead of just posting a title that says "make survivor for old chars" and saying in the body, "so, what do you think?" and getting all kinds of mixed reactions.

why would anyone disagree with this argument *in favor* of making survivor available to chars /age > [factions release date]? doesn't really make sense, as people had already bought FoW armor for those existing chars, had some titles prior to factions release, etc etc. yeah, just buy new FoW armor over again. and go thru all those missions/bonuses again. or for that matter let us do all 20+ of our maxed titles over again. plus hall of monuments and all the things related to it. right. who has the time for that? after putting all the time into it before?

holy cow. before anyone just suggests "delete and start over" make sure you know who your audience is. and how many players have dedicated part of their lives to this stuff. just look around you--you will see there are a lot more people who WON'T take that suggestion and rather not have survivor than delete.

if it is an option for us to reset our survivor over and over on older chars (or even chars who died after factions release), that would be obviously be a HUGE plus and those who will work on it WILL work on it.

i am in full agreement with the line about already having done practically everything; a character who has already capped all elite skills, gone thru all missions and bonuses, done all the big xp quests in cantha and elsewhere---are obviously going to have the toughest time if they are not a solo farmer of any sort. i actually invite this challenge to myself. capping skills and doing 3k+xp points per cantha quest was how i got 2 LS---and i would like to do it the REAL LONG way for once lol :P

/agree

Graphik Desine, thank you, THANK YOU. Not for agreeing with me, but for actually reading my arguement and thinking about it. I've seen far too many 'OMG CHEEPENZ TITLE GTFO!' knee-jerk reactions here; I was losing faith in humanity.

You still dont seem to realize that's what a great number of people did for Cartographer prior to texmod, only they compared their maps with 100% maps, looked on Wiki for glitches and things not to miss and got help from either map checker threads or Photoshop. Texmod does not make anything about Cartography any easier. You can do Cartography without careful map analysis, if you wish, but you're simply making it harder for yourself. I did it without texmod, dont plan to use texmod for cartography if I desire to do it again, and have no problems with texmod or anyone who uses it.

There's no comparison between texmod and Retro Survivor. As others have said, simply making Survivor available to a fully developed and explored character makes the title an awful lot easier, not to mention you obviously need a death reset since you've already failed the main requirement. My monk could make 1337k exp fairly handily, provided she doesnt hit a bad lag moment. Introducing a complex set of exceptions and reset mechanisms into the mix to remove map travel and other initial boons associated with a reset becomes more work for Anet and requires more testing. I just dont see it happening. Even then you dont have to get yourself back from level 1 to level 20, gain the required skill(s) you wish to use, get fully equipped etc - all of which are part of Survivor.

I wish I could get Survivor on my monk, but I cant support this idea. I'm just waiting for the thread to appear now asking for characters to be able to be reset to level 1 and returned to Pre, keeping their armor and belongings in storage, but being allowed to go for LDoA. Heck, why not both?