My paragon's buddies

For just about every area I've cleared on hardmode including dungeons, 3/4ths of vanquishing, and missions I've brought along the following heroes. The only area I encountered with some difficulty was vanquishing Joko's Domain; I lacked adequate hex removal at the time.

Player Bar:


Mash Save Yourselves! as it fills, mash your attack skills as they recharge, mash There's Nothing To Fear! as it recharges; such a simple bar with such effective results. If you like to maintain the +100 AL cast Ebon Battle Standard of Honor only when Dark Fury is in effect and Save Yourselves! is filled. This will allow you use the shout, drop the ward, and refill the shout before it wears off even with a lower rank in your Kurzick or Luxon title. Cycle Focused Anger and For Great Justice! while the other is not in effect to maintain a constant double rate of adrenaline gain.

Unfortunately to make this build work to its fullest you'll need to grind out a max Agent title and at least rank 3 in Luxon or Kurzick.

Weapon Sets:


The shields are the main focus here. 15 armour level with either 7 in command or motivation allows you to spec your Spear Mastery to 14, Leadership to 12, while still achieving as much defense as possible with the remaining attribute points. If you cannot find a shield like that adjust your attributes as necessary; 13 spear, 12 leadership, 9 command/motivation.

Main set will be the vampiric and +10 vs. fire setup. As a paragon you are not targeted that often. Most of the damage you'll receive is typically AoE commonly found in the fire magic tree. That and because you'll typically find fire in a lot of the endgame areas (Fissure of Woe, Underworld, etc...).

If you're expecting blind you'll want to sit on the reduce blind shield set naturally. As the only one in the party that can really take damage I don't want to be sitting on my vampiric weapon either. In which case you'll want to either use Sundering or Furious on the spear in that slot. Normally elemental would be the better choice as you could swap to it when dealing with warriors but because this setup has Order of Pain on the hero you lose some of your damage against normal foes. I stick with Sundering since I won't be blind all the time and I don't lose all that much damage compared to Vampiric.

In the other two slots you'll want a staff and something to pull with. Alem's Remedy is really easy to find because everyone who maxed their LB title during Requiem of a Brain and A Show of Force will have one. In the event you die you'll want something you can swap to for putting Aggressive Refrain back up quickly. Or if you've built a lot of DP because you're bad and need the extra energy for whatever reason. Any longbow works for pulling I just stole one off my hero (hence why it is customized in that shot).

Healing and Offensive Support:


When playing as an SY paragon this character can be used in place of a monk in the typical two monk backline. It provides strong healing support as well as a great boost to all of your physical's damage, maintaining Order of Pain and Dark Fury as often as it can.

You'll want to equip this hero with a staff with two 20% faster cast mods for blood.

General Morgahn; Main Setup:


Typically I slotted a more defensive setup on this hero's bar but with SY pumping out so much defense it was redundant. Originally I used Anthem of Weariness and Defensive Anthem which are now replaced with Anthem of Flame and Stunning Strike. Stunning Strike is my favored elite choice given the spammable nature of the skill with Dark Fury. Monks were previously an annoyance on hard mode. Hexbreaker Aria benefits quite well from Dark Fury as well, allowing your casters to focus hex removal on the physicals while staying clean themselves.

Anthem of Envy I prefer over Go For The Eyes! for a few reasons. Against higher level enemies and armoured foes, which become more common in hardmode, scoring a critical isn't very noticable. +damage skills become stronger in comparison. With the 4 second recharge now the skill barely benefits from Dark Fury as well, even though Anthem of Envy has a 6 adrenaline cost it can be used more often as it lacks a recharge. Finally it pushes the enemies faster towards achieving a Deep Wound via Merciless Spear slotted on Hayda's bar.

General Morgahn; Hex Heavy Setup:


Hexes are very spammy in hardmode. Slotting one Expel Hexes barely helped in the past. I have learned not to make that same mistake again.

General Morgahn; 4 man setup:


I've been vanquishing the four man zones with no monks, just these heroes. Almost all of the heals are party wide so it makes sense to divide the damage up to prevent those heals from being wasted. Angelic Bond does this nicely, and is especially useful when enemies start to attack me as I lack the +100 AL boost. Spear Swipe replaces Stunning Strike from the main setup. Although there is a lot of offense completely shutting down one monk can make a world of difference, especially against the grawls.

With only one adrenaline chant on this bar it is best to disable Spear Swipe and Angelic Bond. They can become too costly when the energy return on Anthem of Envy is only 4.

Hayda; Main Setup:


Song of Purification does an excellent job of cleaning conditions with Dark Fury. Spear of Redemption is mostly there as a hope that it will remove blind if she hasn't built adrenaline for a Song of Purification. In 4 man zones however I replace Spear of Redemption with Chorus of Restoration for an extra heal on the paragons.

You can probably play this build with less Leadership and more Spear Mastery as the bar is mostly adrenaline skills. Just remember that her Aggressive Refrain is shorter than yours and Morgahn's.

Hayda; Hex Heavy Setup:


Minor tweaks to deal with an area more focused on hexes than conditions. Nothing special to take note of.

Builds at a quick glance (thanks to Natural Sugar for typing it out):

[build name="SY! Player" prof=P/W Leadership=11+1 Command=6+1 Motivation=0+1 SpearMastery=12+1+1][Vicious Attack][Swift Javelin][Focused Anger]["For Great Justice!"]["There's Nothing to Fear!"]["Save Yourselves!" (Kurzick)][Ebon Battle Standard of Honor][Aggressive Refrain][/build]

[build name="Orders" prof=D/N Mysticism=10+1+1 WindPrayers=11+1 BloodMagic=10][Arcane Zeal][Dark Fury][Order of Pain][Mystic Healing][Vow of Piety][Watchful Intervention][Faithful Intervention][Dwayna's Touch][/build]

[build name="Morgahn Main" prof=P/W Leadership=10+2 Command=8+1 Motivation=0+1 SpearMastery=12+1+1][Blazing Spear][Vicious Attack][Stunning Strike][Anthem of Envy][Anthem of Flame][Hexbreaker Aria][Aggressive Refrain][Signet of Return][/build]

[build name="Morgahn Hex" prof=P/Mo Leadership=10+2 Command=8+1 Motivation=0+1 SpearMastery=12+1+1][Blazing Spear][Wild Throw][Swift Javelin][Anthem of Flame][Hexbreaker Aria][Empathic Removal][Aggressive Refrain][Signet of Return][/build]

[build name="Morgahn 4-Man" prof=P/W Leadership=10+2 Command=8+1 Motivation=0+1 SpearMastery=12+1+1][Blazing Spear][Vicious Attack][Spear Swipe][Anthem of Envy][Anthem of Flame][Angelic Bond][Aggressive Refrain][Signet of Return][/build]

[build name="Hayda Main" prof=P/W Leadership=11+1 Command=0+1 Motivation=10+1+1 SpearMastery=10+1][Wild Throw][Spear of Redemption][Merciless Spear][Aria of Zeal][Song of Purification][Mending Refrain][Aggressive Refrain][Signet of Return][/build]

[build name="Hayda Hex" prof=P/Mo Leadership=11+1 Command=0+1 Motivation=10+1+1 SpearMastery=10+1][Wild Throw][Merciless Spear][Hexbreaker Aria][Aria of Zeal][Empathic Removal][Mending Refrain][Aggressive Refrain][Signet of Return][/build]

Alternate builds for the player character (original post here):

Quote: Originally Posted by Shru Ranger:[build name="SY Ranger" prof=R/W marksmanship=12 expertise=12][distracting shot][save yourselves][triple shot][dual shot][rapid fire][ebon battle standard of honor][infuriating heat][resurrection signet][/build]

Assassin:[build name="SY Sin" prof=A/W criticalstrikes=12+1 daggermastery=12+1+1][Golden Phoenix Strike][death blossom][Moebius Strike][Save yourselves][critical agility][critical defense][critical eye][for great justice][/build]
with the attack speed of this guy, you're safe to drop [for great justice]and[golden phoenix strike] in favor of a better lead combo, something like [golden lotus strike]+[golden fang strike] or [golden fox strike]+[golden fang strike]

Dervish:[build name="SY Derv" prof=D/W Mysticism=12+1 ScytheMastery=12+1+1][protector's strike][eremite's attack][save yourselves][aura of holy might][heart of fury][for great justice][avatar of lyssa][eternal aura][/build]or mel derv[build name="SY Derv" prof=D/W Mysticism=12+1 ScytheMastery=12+1+1][wearying strike][save yourselves][aura of holy might][heart of fury][zealous renewal][for great justice][avatar of melandru][eternal aura][/build]

Warrior:[build name="SY War" prof=W/P Swordsmanship=12+1+1 Strength=12+1][Dragon Slash][brawling headbutt][steelfang slash][Save yourselves][flail][enraging charge][enduring harmony][for great justice][/build]

Necro:[SY Nec;OAFCQsxkKEU1NYngoHWxVBGH](thanks go to Moloch Vein for the build)


Ritualist:
And currently playing with the rit builds, I don't have a rit to test energy costs and such so no actual builds yet.
for Spirit's strength I've been toying with sword and axe builds using some of these:
[brawling headbutt] [steelfang slash] [whirlwind attack] [cyclone axe][dismember] [spirit's strength] [sight beyond sight] [save yourselves] [for great justice] [weapon of aggression] [great dwarf armor]

and a channeling caster similair in play style to the N/W
[weapon of fury] [save yourselves] [spirit rift] [splinter weapon] [ancestor's rage] [for great justice] [flurry] [warmonger's weapon]


I know some of these builds aren't optimal (help with mel derv and rits please?) but these are all just suggestions and examples. Post anything you think should be changed on them, and I'll update them as I see new and more powerful ones emerging. NOTE: The attached file contains the details within the pictures if they're not loading.

Oh I wish I could do awesome setups like these with my monk..

And very nice, Racthoh, or whatever your name is.

gz, finally some real competition for sab ^^
you may want to add the template codes in the thread as well =)

Used the other paragon team you suggested awhile ago and it was amazing ^ ^.

Very nice i'll be sure to try this

Nice guide rac, I just have one question for you.

If you have a friend who can come with you in an 8 man area, or if it's you+ henchman what hench would you bring with you? Any ideas for more heroes to group up with those 3 either for more synergy.

Quote: Originally Posted by MercenaryKnight

Nice update Racthoh

Quick question - why don't you use [skill=text]"They're on Fire!"[/skill] ?
Is it because damage mitigation is already over the top with TNTF and SY?

I run a noobier defensive build on my toon to keep my target burning and the adrenaline pumping -

Aggressive Refrain
Focused Anger
For Great Justice!
Blazing Spear
Spear of Fury
They're on Fire!
Save Yourselves!
There's Nothing to Fear!

ToF is the core of the build for the extra damage reduction and to maintain AG between mobs. SoF is for a quick adrenal spike to keep up the Blazing Spear and SY spam. I also slot [skill=text]Finale of Restoration[/skill] onto the Motivation hero for some impressive over-healing

I haven't done any end-game vanquishing yet (easily vanquished areas thus far with this build) and will likely change to Rac's build when i become more attuned to the Paragon. It's working well for my needs while i learn the subtleties of managing appropriate adrenaline, healing and damage mitigation levels.

Now the only thing I will have to test, is what 3 heroes and builds can synergize with these 2 paragon+ order hero the best for general pve/ vanquishing/ whatever.

I've been experimenting with two accounts for a one human, six hero team build. I've been running Sabway on the other account which works fine, but i'd prefer greater synergy.

A few skills i've been toying with are [skill=text]Mark of Rodgort[/skill] for the obvious tie-in with "They're on Fire!" as i usually equip heroes with pre-order fire damage weapons (Fiery Sunspear / Hourglass Staff etc). [skill=text]Splinter Weapon[/skill] and [skill=text]Ancestors' Rage[/skill] are always handy. [skill=text]Broad Head Arrow[/skill] and [skill=text]Barrage[/skill] are other obvious options. Maybe [skill=text]Warmonger's Weapon[/skill] could be useful for some interrupts.

Does [skill=text]Animate Bone Fiend[/skill] benefit from Ebon Battle Standard of Honor? It'd be hard to drop a Minion Bomber in favour of a Bone Fiend MM, i'm just curious about the damage potential.

If i could have 7 heroes i'd take 2 Paragons, 1 D/N Orders, 1 E/Rt MB/RI Warder, 1 N/Rt Healer, 1 N/Mo MM and a BHA Ranger. Given i can only take 6 i'd drop the BHA or the Warder... or both for the SS :/

I use Anthem Of Flame and Spear of Fury. Instead of Ebon Standard of Honor (since I havn't gotten that far) I use "They're on Fire!". It works pretty good, esspecually with my Vekk running an SF build, but I find myself having a severe overabundance of energy that I feel should go somewhere. perhaps that's why people use two spear attacks :P

I'm also running 16 leadership, which I suppose can be toned down. I run Tactics instead of command or motivation right now since I don't have any good sheilds for paragon req :/

Quote: Originally Posted by Antithesis Quick question - why don't you use [skill=text]"They're on Fire!"[/skill] ?
Is it because damage mitigation is already over the top with TNTF and SY? They're On Fire! would just be extra reduction that I don't feel is necessary. Pretty much the only reason I'm taking There's Nothing To Fear! is for my own safety and the heal. Save Yourselves! is doing all the work. It also means I have to slot a reliable source of burning and I generally dislike eles save the few humans I get to play with who know the profession very well. But in those instances I don't have my heroes anyway.

Quote: It'd be hard to drop a Minion Bomber in favour of a Bone Fiend MM, i'm just curious about the damage potential. They should receive the bonus but there are two problems. There is no guarentee they will stay in the ward that well, even though I've never seen a minion kite there is no way to predict their behavior. Second they'll attack random targets. The benefits of the physical buffs present in this build are that you can overwhelm the biggest threat of the group very quickly. Minion masters throw around random damage, not my preferred style of play.

If I wanted a necromancer it would have to be human with a bar like this:

Barbs
Great Dwarf Weapon
Finish Him!
You Move Like A Dwarf!
Rend Enchantments/Rip Enchantment (depending on the area)
Signet of Lost Souls
Splinter Weapon
Offering of Spirit {E}

Just off the top of my head. Actually that's a pretty sexy bar. WT B necro friend.

Everything that a necromancer is good for becomes overshadowed by SY unless you're abusing Soul Reaping in some way.

I've been following the evolution of your (and others') Paragon team builds and have also realised the problems.

It is very easy to overprotect in a Paragon team, and end up with less damage output. While not usually a problem, it just slows down the game with redundant defence.

However, perhaps as a better player than I am, you may not have encountered the situation of the player himself dying. That kinda removes quite a lot of defence from the whole team, if your Morgahn is solely there to output damage. I try to spread defensive and offensive responsibilites between myself and Morgahn to mitigate this. But it happens very seldom, and the team recovers from it quite fast.

I will definitely look at Empathic Removal, which I think is your main change in this version. Soothing Images still cramps my style.

Why is there less Swift Javelin this time round? I must say that Spear of Redemption is a cool idea for removing Blind.

And what is your opinion of the Orders guy carrying a Spear and a Blood focus vs. a staff?

Looking forward to the next improvement.

Quote: Originally Posted by Racthoh They're On Fire! would just be extra reduction that I don't feel is necessary. --snip -- It also means I have to slot a reliable source of burning... Figured as much, i'm over-prot'ing. I'm not keen taking an Ele squishy along just to apply burning, a little AoE (ineffective in end-game) and redundant wards. But it can replace Herta and Cynn in 2 player + hero parties.

Quote: Originally Posted by Racthoh The benefits of the physical buffs present in this build are that you can overwhelm the biggest threat of the group very quickly. Minion masters throw around random damage, not my preferred style of play. Good answer.

Quote: Originally Posted by Racthoh

Quote: Originally Posted by arsie It is very easy to overprotect in a Paragon team, and end up with less damage output. While not usually a problem, it just slows down the game with redundant defence. This is the main reason I reposted the builds I was using. There was far too much defense with the original setup. That is what lead to the creation of the N/Rt, while lacking the healing power of the D/N it was a great boost to party's damage capabilities. However now I just run the D/N and completely drop a monk giving me a whole 8 slots to then worth with.

Morgahn had 12 spear and 14 leadership, Defensive Anthem and Anthem of Weariness in the setup that I used. I've pumped his spear up to 14, added a spear elite, and swapped Weariness for Flame. I've dropped a source of weakness and my unstrippable party wide block in favor of more damage. I feel it's a change for the better.

Quote: However, perhaps as a better player than I am, you may not have encountered the situation of the player himself dying. That kinda removes quite a lot of defence from the whole team, if your Morgahn is solely there to output damage. I try to spread defensive and offensive responsibilites between myself and Morgahn to mitigate this. But it happens very seldom, and the team recovers from it quite fast. The majority of my playing is with hero/hench; I have 590 health the henchmen do not. I even play on the side of caution and draw my bow well before I aggro ensuring all of the AI runs in ahead of me, if I feel it necessary that is.

There were times when I would die when I still ran the setup with two monks, along with the D/N bot. Even without my SY the group managed fine. It was situations like that which made me realize that I am really going overboard on the defense. However, things still die. I think this is mainly because I use the Ebon Battle Standard of Honor with Order of Pain; despite the lower level of Spear Mastery that my heroes had it provides a huge boost to their damage.

Quote: I will definitely look at Empathic Removal, which I think is your main change in this version. Soothing Images still cramps my style. It's also nice because it cleans the Cracked Armor from Aggressive Refrain, less Dismiss Condition from the protection henchmen. Nothing major but I know it is an issue for some.

Quote: Originally Posted by arsie And what is your opinion of the Orders guy carrying a Spear and a Blood focus vs. a staff? I actually always wanted my orders heroes to use a spear/offhand but there's one prob - for some reason, if they arn't close to the enemy being attacked, they don't seem to use orders. Tested it outside the pvp isle....it's pretty annoying. Kinda forces you to set your heroes to attack sometimes, and that means if they had a spear, they'd be pretty up close trying to attack with it =\

Quote:

Originally Posted by Antithesis Does [skill=text]Animate Bone Fiend[/skill] benefit from Ebon Battle Standard of Honor? It'd be hard to drop a Minion Bomber in favour of a Bone Fiend MM, i'm just curious about the damage potential. The best thing about the Honor ward: All non-armor ignoring damage gets the increase. That includes damage done by ele's.....it makes the earth hench's Stone dagger spam actually abit useful. Spells that do damage on each sec (Savannah heat, Sandstorm, etc) also get the +dmg each time. It's basically orders for everything. The AoE effect on Icy veins also counts. Our guild has been running a similar setup for a while whenever we do high-end pve areas (DoA, Slaver's, etc). We usually always have a human nec with Dwarf weapon and it's a beast. When I'm henching I usually slap Blood ritual on the orders. I didn't really put it on a Derv primary but the recent buff made it easier on their energy.

I don't suppose you could try and build the whole thing with different primaries in mind? I run SY on my Warrior (Godmode ftw), and I'm assuming it won't make too much of a difference between me and your para, unless there's something I'm missing. What would you recommend people run with different primaries, and if the heroes would be adjusted in any way, is what I'm asking.

Also, it's nice to know what those 15AL shields for for

Quote: Originally Posted by Marty Silverblade

I'm curious as to how you've noticed your heroes using Empathic Removal. The last time I slotted that one a heroes bar, they spammed it over and over to remove the cracked armor from all the paragons..

I was just wondering, do the heroes need any managing, or just pre casting AS before battle? I went to the temple of balth and melonni ran out of energy straight away, didnt bother casting arcane zeal first so should I do that before battle. However the reason she ran out of energy is that she doesnt have the staff yet, so she should probably have enough I think with the staff

Also, Im planning on using this with my ranger. Originally I was thinking a build something along the lines of

Apply poison, Burning Arrow, Flurry, Lightening Reflexes, Ebon Battle standard of honor, "FGJ!", "SY!" , res

Sorry dont know how to the skills yet. Anyway I was thinking maybe a little bit of degen could be good. Flurry for IAS to power SY, and Lightening reflexes keeps me safe for abit when needed, while still having IAS. Considering taking the res out for something like "You move like a dwarf".

After thinking though, I was wondering if BHA might be a better choice. If I use that, I could free up morghans elite, but not sure if it is necessary or needed.

Thoughts?