im having a whinge

No it's not. Get a real build if you're failing.
OH NOES! THE RUNNERS ARE GONE!
H/H>pugs, what else to say?
The game is five years old.
You don't have to. NM is just loleasymode. NO area except where henchies are unavalible aren't doable on NM.

No, they're not. Also, WTS friend list, there sure are some people willing to help you if you really can't do it for whatever reason.

Eh, no. They made Shadow Form a little less OP(It still is) which is a good thing. And you can also still 600/smite shit with SoJ.

If you could do it before the runner appeared, you can also do it now that they're disappeared

QQ more. I still run dungeons.
^See above.

It doesnt matter if you're an 'average player' or not, you could let your h/h do the work for you easily.

It's not a troll attempt, or it wouldn't be called "A whinge". It would be called "AMG DUNGEONS R OP".

Anyway if you can't H/H it, either change your builds alot until you come across something that works for you; change tactics (Lure more, give aggro to something, ball stuffs) or get some friends to help.

I only ever play dungeons with eight players, and I never have trouble finding allies to join me. That could just be my double-standard of patience in outpost, though.

Have these people tried to find people? From their friends list, Guild Wars Guru, or their alliance?

That's your problem, right there. It's not impossible to do HM dungeons now, not by a long shot. Ask anyone who did them without SF or 600/Smite, let alone those who completed them all with H/H (and there are plenty of those people on these forums). The fact that you think it's impossible to do something in HM without god mode tells me that one of the primary arguments against SF - namely, that it rewards bad players and doesn't contribute to helping people get better - was spot on.

Again, how is this a bad thing? You should not be able to complete the hardest team content in the game by paying one guy to do it with his hero.

Wrong, they damaged the game by allowing 20 min speed clears and dungeon runners to become the norm and now the fix has come way to late.

I hope in GW2 they introduce similar concept as in Aion, once you do a dungeon you cant enter it again for a set numbers of hours. i.e 4/12/18

Few things you may not have considered. As noted, most dungeons, even in HM are able to be done with heroes and hench. I even did Duncan with hero and hench once on my Mesmer, which many people feel is one of the worst PvE classes in the game. Also, if you can't find PUGs, good. PUGs are not the best way to get things done as you are relying on people you know nothing about. Using people in your friends list, guild, and alliance is a much better option. If you are in a guild or alliance that doesn't offer help, or can't, then you are not in the right guild/alliance. Try finding a new one that focuses on PvE and has enough people in it. Lastly, runners should not be used (in my opinion) until you have completed the dungeon/mission/quest at least once yourself (and I mean once in NM and HM each). After you have finished the dungeon once, and want to use it for various reasons (rep points, fun, loot, etc.) you then can start using runners (remember, this is my opinion). But runners doing everything for you is a bad idea, a very bad idea. Why play a game if you are going to ask other people to play it for you? Seems like you have no fun if you sit and watch someone else do all the work.

I really don't understand the mentality of someone whining they they can no longer pay another person to play a portion of the game for them to get a title that shows off their GW skills. :facepalm:

cause then they can't call other people noobs who don't have the titles and stand around AFK in Kamadan

Same thing happened to DoA with a previous nerf. It went from several districts to...1? some people move to different areas...some move to different games altogether.

The same thing has happened to the guild and alliance that I'm in. I'll agree to an extent with some of the other posters that the game is getting old. But I've noticed a trend that with each successive nerf, the number of people in our guild/alliance dwindles faster and faster each time.

Sadly, if you couldn't do it without ridiculously overpowered builds that bordered on invincibility, then quite frankly, you didn't deserve to do it in the first place. It wasn't quite "cheating", but it was an exploit. It was using parts of the game in ways for which they were never intended to give one an unfair advantage over the game.

So, get better. Make good builds. Find people who actually know how to play and group with them. These areas are quite doable. You can do it; you just need to not suck.

Or you could PLAY the game. In which case, everything is okay.

Sorry to be a douche, but if you can't complete something, improve your build, improve your skills, find better guildmates, or learn how to counter and build teams. I'm not anti-runners or anti-farming, but you shouldn't have the entire game played for you.

It's really your guild's fault for attracting a membership base 50% of which was comprised of farmers.

I remember playing /w a guy in our guild who did nothing but farm for the two months following up to the SF nerf. He literally played like someone who was doing nothing but farming for two months. Completely incapable of tracking party member (monk) positions, over aggro, poor targeting, you name it. After playing for a week or so and realizing he sucked, he pretty much quit GW.

Tough luck, the ppl that quit b/c they don't have insanely OP farming builds aren't exactly the kind of people I'd want to be playing with on a regular basis.

There actually are other options, they're limited, but they are there.

What I find the most suprising about the para, is that of the 3 builds I've managed to put together that aren't imba, I see people coming up with variations of pretty much the same builds independently. That pretty much smacks of a very limited set of useful skills, forcing players to fall back to the same ones repeatedly.

Well, at least the news that the Mesmer will get some love with the next skill update means that ANet's actually looking in the right direction in terms of what needs love.

Just bring 2 minion masters and good game. It's that easy. You just need to learn how to play pl0x.

I've been away for quite a while and I don't find it any harder than it used to be.

I did get run through thirsty river on my native prophecies Mesmer because she didn't have any heroes and i couldn't do it with just henchies.

meaning of this thread:

no very easy SC = impossible to do
.

u can h/h all dungeons and elite areas in hard mode, with 2 players u can do anything u want. And Im playing with derv so u cant call it too easy class.

And I assume you can h/h (1 player + 3 heroes... no dual boxing) UW HM? Or DoA? All quests, of course, not just monsters.

lol you got that soooooooooo right. Too many brats in this game. I think this game is good proof of what happens when you don't charge a monthly fee like a WOW or EQ or DAOC etc. Nothing but whiney crybabies all the time everyday. Lazy kids who just want someone else to do it for them so they can have bragging rights like those that worked for them. lol

Lots of relevant points from most of you and I thank you all for making me realise that all is not lost, as i have stated before i guess i had got really lazy.

Only points id like to re-iterate is:

1...I dont 100% rely on runners as some of you seem to think.

2... Im no gaming wizard who can work out the mathematics in game builds,i tend to throw a build togethor that i think may work and if it dont work then its back to drawing board.but this sometimes gets weary after hours of failures.

3....personally the runner builds were not invincible as far as im concerned,they still required good gaming skills and were enjoyable gaming platforms.


4....my guild didnt purposely enlist farmers.

5...when i say anet damaged the game, I mean that many ppl have stopped playing the game, i know the age of the game contributes towards ppl moving on, ive done it myself for periods of time, but blatant signs that ppl left in their droves is easily noticable after the last nerf.

obviously i can see there are anti-runner posters here and so probably cannot see it from the runner side, let me give you another example.

Zaishen bounty/missions....since they were introduced they have become a busy commodity, many many ppl are rushing all chars on their accounts through these, whether its for the title for themselves or just to trade in Z keys.
As much as some of you hated the runners, it was here that they were invaluable,ordinary PUGS could NEVER do DOA HM in the time a runner could,everyone was a winner,the runner got paid for running, the team got their Zaishen done relatively quickly and through drops/gems and Zaishen reward got their money back, everyone was happy.
The game wasnt always dependant on runners,most missions still relied on the PUG/Guild teamwork to complete,whereas some merited the runner IMO.
Most ppl are working with at least 4+ chars on their accounts, (I know some who have ten chars) can you possibly imagine how long it would take to get 10 chars through FOUNDRY HM using PUGS??IT WOULD never happen.

The FACT that once busy towns are now the way of the DODO is a testiment to the fact that the nerf to the runners was a bad move.
Whether you like the runners or not,they attracted ppl to towns and made the game still feel like it was in abundance with ppl playing GW, but now that illusion have been destroyed.

Yes, probably. But what is your build to fight 6 Angorodon's in HM, without anyone dying, and no Assassin support?

The opp is right about empty outposts. It IS considerably more quiet since the nerfs.