Dervish update preview please - Guild Wars Guru archive powered by Guild Wars Legacy

NerfHerder

Wilds Pathfinder

Join Date: Apr 2010

28 Jul 2010 at 04:43 - 41

Quote:

Originally Posted by reaper with no name

This.

You can't nerf attack skill spam, because then scythes become useless, and it's the only thing dervishes can do somewhat effectively.

You can't buff attack skill spam, because other classes can already use the scythe better than the dervish, and that won't help.

You can't buff enchantment juggling, because...well, actually, you can, but unless you give all PBAoEs armor ignoring damage, 1/4 second cast times, 3 sec recharges, and 5 energy costs while giving all enchantment removal attacks 5 energy costs with instant recharges and 1/2 sec activations and +70 damage while reverting mysticism...then enchantment juggling will never compete with attack skill spam, and will therefore remain useless. Sadly, that's just how powerful attack skill spam is. Even with a 60 armor-ignoring enchantment every sec or so, you still need a 0.5 sec activation 100+ damage attack skill after it just to compete with zealous vow and warrior's endurance, to say nothing of beating them (and to beat critscythe? jeez, the numbers would have to be even higher). And it's highly unlikely Anet would be willing to do this, because these sorts of numbers look very overpowered until you actually do the math.

Realistically, the only thing we can expect from Anet that will really help the dervish is to link AoHM to mysticism, thereby making the dervish the best scythe user almost by default.

I agree with the attack spam skills and tying AoHM to Mysticism. The AoHM change is not a buff. But, it would more evenly balance Dervish Vs any other profession using a scythe. So from a balance perspective its an easy/no brainer fix for PvE.

As for buffing the Derv, Avatar and Dervish enchantments could be reworked to make the Dervish a more viable option. Im thinking more along the lines of how the Warrior was buffed recently. Even still, a hammer Warrior can not out DPS a dagger Sin. But bringing a hammer Warrior does add a unique type of crowd control and utility an Assassin cannot do. I would give some specific details, but this thread isnt really about skill changes. (there are or at least were some good suggestions in the campfire section.)

On Topic, I normally side with Anet when they come up with excuses for not updating often. But the change of command in the Live Team will be a perfect scapegoat for a few months.

saume

Frost Gate Guardian

Join Date: Jun 2009

bear

W/

28 Jul 2010 at 09:28 - 42

u cant really buff dervs, u would have to make them less enchantment dependant and that would kinda defeat the whole point of dervs, they already have a bunch of good enchantments, but theyre enchantments

i would like to see imbue health dervs in GvG but i doubt they will ever buff healer dervs enough to make them viable in GvG

Lanier

Desert Nomad

Join Date: Jan 2010

[Pink]

P/

28 Jul 2010 at 13:53 - 43

Quote:

Originally Posted by saume

u cant really buff dervs, u would have to make them less enchantment dependant and that would kinda defeat the whole point of dervs, they already have a bunch of good enchantments, but theyre enchantments

i would like to see imbue health dervs in GvG but i doubt they will ever buff healer dervs enough to make them viable in GvG

I was under the impression that the derv update was going to be more of a PvE one, and even if its not, there always are skill splits. In PvE, there is few enough enchantment removal that it would be possible to buff them in a way that they retain their dependancy on enchantments. Personally, I would like to see more of an enchantment juggeling (sp?) buff like someone earlier mentioned. In my opinion, scythe damage is fine as it is, and if a scythe dervish isn't as powerful as a scythe sin or scythe derv, then those options should be nerfed so that a derv is the most powerful scythe user.

Tullzinski

Jungle Guide

Join Date: Mar 2006

Trying to stay out of Ryuk's Death Note

N/R

28 Jul 2010 at 14:46 - 44

I resent this whole idea that the dervish needs updating, my dervish is an awesome mule. I would have to move all that stuff if ANET makes the dervish worthwhile.

Karate Jesus

Forge Runner

Join Date: Apr 2008

Texas

Reign of Judgment [RoJ]

Me/

28 Jul 2010 at 14:51 - 45

Quote:

Originally Posted by Shayne Hawke

Saying nothing else about the status of the update, I would advise you not to hold your breath.

So, it's either going to be incredibly late or incredibly bad?

Awesome....Anet strikes again Zzz

Silverblad3

Lion's Arch Merchant

Join Date: Apr 2007

UK

I use to love CB :(

Mo/

28 Jul 2010 at 15:18 - 46

Quote:

Originally Posted by Tullzinski

I resent this whole idea that the dervish needs updating, my dervish is an awesome mule. I would have to move all that stuff if ANET makes the dervish worthwhile.

Epic post. Have not laughed so much on a guru post in several months.....

aspi

Desert Nomad

Join Date: Jan 2010

eeew

N/Rt

28 Jul 2010 at 15:57 - 47

Quote:

Originally Posted by Karate Jesus

So, it's either going to be incredibly late or incredibly bad?

Awesome....Anet strikes again Zzz

Dude, really can't you just RED ENGINE GORED ENGINE GORED ENGINE GORED ENGINE GO off?

Karate Jesus

Forge Runner

Join Date: Apr 2008

Texas

Reign of Judgment [RoJ]

Me/

28 Jul 2010 at 16:13 - 48

Quote:

Originally Posted by aspi

Dude, really can't you just RED ENGINE GORED ENGINE GORED ENGINE GORED ENGINE GO off?

Hmm? Quoting a TK member and observing his implications means I should leave?

Also, whoru?

Gill Halendt

Desert Nomad

Join Date: Mar 2008

28 Jul 2010 at 17:00 - 49

Quote:

Originally Posted by Tullzinski

I resent this whole idea that the dervish needs updating, my dervish is an awesome mule. I would have to move all that stuff if ANET makes the dervish worthwhile.

'Balance Update: With this update we meant to address some issue with Dervishes and Paragons. Dervishes were fixed, while Paragons were finally given a purpose: pack mules."

belshazaarswrath

Krytan Explorer

Join Date: Mar 2006

AMP

28 Jul 2010 at 18:10 - 50

Quote:

Originally Posted by Karate Jesus

So, it's either going to be incredibly late or incredibly bad?

Awesome....Anet strikes again Zzz

How do you get incredibly bad out of that? He just said it's probably going to be awhile till the update comes.

FengShuiDove

Forge Runner

Join Date: Sep 2007

Trinity of the Ascended [ToA]

A/

28 Jul 2010 at 19:28 - 51

The Mesmer update was pretty high-quality folks. Given the amount of time and sole dedication that the Dervish update is going to get, it'll be fine. Though it's mostly repeating, here's my rapsheet:

1. Avatars suck -- they have bad functionalities and require an elite slot plus a PvE only slot to maintain. Fix it on one or both levels.

2. Mysticism sucks -- it sucks. There's not much else to say. The skills are bad, the functionality is worse. Fix it on one or both levels.

3. Dervish attack skills suck -- by and large, they're terrible. Too many conditionals, to long of recharges, too high energy with poor e-management. Yeah, we've got 5-7 good scythe attack skills, two of which are elite, and two normals of which are meta-game material.

4. Wind Prayers and Earth Prayers aren't worth the investment -- there are some decent skills in each line, but not enough to justify re-spec.

5. Dervish elites are bad -- again, by and large. Weird functionality, poor stats compared to similar skills from other professions, terrible attribute lines. Everything about the vast majority of Derv elites is outclassed by something else.

Overall, the list of Dervish's shortcomings is similar to the list of the Mesmer's. I enjoyed the Mesmer buffs and think ANet did a great job. It might take a while, but I think they'll do a good job.

And don't kid yourself about the update being something as small as "Aura of Holy Might ahs been linked to Mysticism." If that happened, lots of folks would rage. But it won't.

Lishy

Forge Runner

Join Date: Jan 2008

28 Jul 2010 at 19:58 - 52

Quote:

Originally Posted by Tullzinski

I resent this whole idea that the dervish needs updating, my dervish is an awesome mule. I would have to move all that stuff if ANET makes the dervish worthwhile.

Ahaha, same here. I'ma have to move the mule to my ele

shoyon456

Desert Nomad

Join Date: Jul 2006

D/

28 Jul 2010 at 20:07 - 53

Quote:

Originally Posted by Karate Jesus

So, it's either going to be incredibly late or incredibly bad?

Awesome....FAILnet strikes again Zzz

Fixed. There's a reason they haven't done a damn thing to address Dervs in years and seems like they removed them completely from GW2. They can't balance or spend enough time balancing their damn game and the playstyle/class isn't the most popular (compare to Failnet's Ken-doll Warriors).

Whether its late or terrible, this won't affect Anet much. Frankly it's completely in Anet's court. Not enough people main as Dervs to cause massive rage if the update is a failure, yet if it's good everyone will give them a pat on the back.

It's sad but true. I gave up on expecting anything from Anet quite awhile ago, especially while having my main as an undesirable expansion class.

belshazaarswrath

Krytan Explorer

Join Date: Mar 2006

AMP

28 Jul 2010 at 20:13 - 54

Quote:

Originally Posted by FengShuiDove

And don't kid yourself about the update being something as small as "Aura of Holy Might ahs been linked to Mysticism." If that happened, lots of folks would rage. But it won't.

Agreed. If that's all they were gonna do they wouldn't even mention it. IF they say they'll update they'll update.

Quote:

Fixed. There's a reason they haven't done a damn thing to address Dervs in years and seems like they removed them completely from GW2. They can't balance or spend enough time balancing their damn game and the playstyle/class isn't the most popular (compare to Failnet's Ken-doll Warriors).

Whether its late or terrible, this won't affect Anet much. Frankly it's completely in Anet's court. Not enough people main as Dervs to cause massive rage if the update is a failure, yet if it's good everyone will give them a pat on the back.

It's sad but true. I gave up on expecting anything from Anet quite awhile ago, especially while having my main as an undesirable expansion class.

BAWWWWWWWWWWWWWWW

own age myname

Desert Nomad

Join Date: Sep 2007

Minnesota

[TAS]

R/

28 Jul 2010 at 21:35 - 55

Quote:

Originally Posted by shoyon456

Fixed. There's a reason they haven't done a damn thing to address Dervs in years and seems like they removed them completely from GW2. They can't balance or spend enough time balancing their damn game and the playstyle/class isn't the most popular (compare to Failnet's Ken-doll Warriors).

Whether its late or terrible, this won't affect Anet much. Frankly it's completely in Anet's court. Not enough people main as Dervs to cause massive rage if the update is a failure, yet if it's good everyone will give them a pat on the back.

It's sad but true. I gave up on expecting anything from Anet quite awhile ago, especially while having my main as an undesirable expansion class.

Let me play a song for you...

StormX

Krytan Explorer

Join Date: Nov 2005

E/Mo

29 Jul 2010 at 04:54 - 56

Quote:

Originally Posted by shoyon456

Fixed. There's a reason they haven't done a damn thing to address Dervs in years and seems like they removed them completely from GW2. They can't balance or spend enough time balancing their damn game and the playstyle/class isn't the most popular (compare to Failnet's Ken-doll Warriors).

*BAWWWWWS* along with him. I was getting fond of my derv, guess I'll have to remake him as an...ugh...warrior, or whatever the other soldier class is.

reaper with no name

Desert Nomad

Join Date: Apr 2009

FaZ

D/

29 Jul 2010 at 05:45 - 57

Quote:

Originally Posted by FengShuiDove

The Mesmer update was pretty high-quality folks. Given the amount of time and sole dedication that the Dervish update is going to get, it'll be fine. Though it's mostly repeating, here's my rapsheet:

1. Avatars suck -- they have bad functionalities and require an elite slot plus a PvE only slot to maintain. Fix it on one or both levels.

2. Mysticism sucks -- it sucks. There's not much else to say. The skills are bad, the functionality is worse. Fix it on one or both levels.

3. Dervish attack skills suck -- by and large, they're terrible. Too many conditionals, to long of recharges, too high energy with poor e-management. Yeah, we've got 5-7 good scythe attack skills, two of which are elite, and two normals of which are meta-game material.

4. Wind Prayers and Earth Prayers aren't worth the investment -- there are some decent skills in each line, but not enough to justify re-spec.

5. Dervish elites are bad -- again, by and large. Weird functionality, poor stats compared to similar skills from other professions, terrible attribute lines. Everything about the vast majority of Derv elites is outclassed by something else.

Overall, the list of Dervish's shortcomings is similar to the list of the Mesmer's. I enjoyed the Mesmer buffs and think ANet did a great job. It might take a while, but I think they'll do a good job.

And don't kid yourself about the update being something as small as "Aura of Holy Might ahs been linked to Mysticism." If that happened, lots of folks would rage. But it won't.

Assuming Anet does fix AoHM (which they'd better, or I'll lose all hope in them again), it won't be the only change they make. But most likely, it will be the only one that matters. Unless enchantment juggling becomes more powerful than critscythe or Enduring scythe, it will remain absolutely useless. Unless the avatars can provide something useful to the party that nothing else can, then they too will remain useless.

Look at it this way: every class has to have at least one niche to be useful. There are 10 professions. That means that some of them will inevitably have a very narrow niche (especially with some classes like the necromancer and warrior filling multiple niches). The ranger, for example, is pretty much limited to ranged physical AoE at this point (read: Barrage), and all the Paragon has is party-wide defense buffs combined with some damage (ie, Imbagon). With the game set up the way it currently is, the only niche really open to the dervish is melee AoE, a niche currently occupied by the assassin and warrior (neither of which need it or are even supposed to be doing that).

Buffing the dervish in ways that don't help it to reach this or some other niche will not help it. There are only two ways the dervish can become the best general melee AoE: scythes or PBAoEs/scythes. The first requires AoHM be changed (well, there are other ways, but that's the easiest). The second requires the biggest buffs in the game's entire history. We're talking about the equivalent of making Mending more powerful than WoH.

So what do you think is more likely? That Anet will take a huge risk to fix the problem elegantly, or that it will buff one thing that will definitely work (albeit in a less than elegant way) along with some other stuff that won't actually matter but will make players think does?

Ghost Dog

Krytan Explorer

Join Date: Mar 2008

W/

29 Jul 2010 at 06:05 - 58

So much whining about an update that doesn't yet exist.

How do you people take yourselves seriously? Nobody is going to listen to you.

Morphy

Wilds Pathfinder

Join Date: Nov 2009

The Netherlands

Not going to keep up with that anymore

R/

29 Jul 2010 at 06:11 - 59

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ghost Dog

So much whining about an update that doesn't yet exist.

How do you people take yourselves seriously? Nobody is going to listen to you.

0/10. Try harder next time.

HigherMinion

Forge Runner

Join Date: May 2008

East Anglia, UK

Order of [Thay]

N/

29 Jul 2010 at 06:39 - 60

They should make Avatar of Grenth lifesteal adjacent foes with each scythe attack! Waaa

Infact, the avatars are so weak compared to attack-spamming, they might aswell remove the "Disabled 120s" clause.

Nechrond

Lion's Arch Merchant

Join Date: Oct 2009

Netherlands

Utrecht Usurpators

D/

29 Jul 2010 at 07:35 - 61

Simple changes I'm hoping for:
-Mysticism triggering off hexes ending as well as enchantments.
-Number of scythe targets tied to Scythe Mastery - 2nd target at 9, 3rd at 13, 4th at 16. Secondary scythers can't get higher than 12.
-Dimishing returns for weapon mastery attributes over 12 changed to normal returns. Scythe suffers more from this than other weapons, because it's more reliant on weapon damage instead of just skill damage.

All of these would help the Derv without helping secondary scythers. One of these would slightly harm secondary scythers.

reaper with no name

Desert Nomad

Join Date: Apr 2009

FaZ

D/

29 Jul 2010 at 07:37 - 62

That last one would pose problems for PvP. The others provide very minimal benefits. Honestly, hitting 3 targets is hard enough; 4 would be about as likely as 5 or 6.

Nechrond

Lion's Arch Merchant

Join Date: Oct 2009

Netherlands

Utrecht Usurpators

D/

29 Jul 2010 at 07:52 - 63

Quote:

Originally Posted by reaper with no name

That last one would pose problems for PvP.

Really? How? A tiny increase in the normal, armor-respecting part of an attack is only really relevant for scythes. Crit chance would end up slightly higher which might give Assassins slightly better e-management, but damage-wise it would, again, only be truly relevant for scythes.

Quote:

The others provide very minimal benefits.

Because hex-spamming doesn't ever happen?

Quote:

Honestly, hitting 3 targets is hard enough; 4 would be about as likely as 5 or 6.

If this weren't relevant, it would never have been restricted to 3 in the first place now would it? Play a game of AB with a Derv and then tell me again whether or not this would be relevant.

I forgot to post a fourth point by the way:
-"When this skill ends it is disabled for 15 seconds" instead of "This skill is disabled for 120 seconds". Avatars need lower downtime.

reaper with no name

Desert Nomad

Join Date: Apr 2009

FaZ

D/

29 Jul 2010 at 08:33 - 64

How often do you have 4 enemies in front of you in PvE? In my personal experience, the answer is "very rarely".

The only way better innate (or any, really) energy management can help the dervish on it's own is if it provided so much energy that zealous vow was no longer needed, thereby freeing up an extra skill slot for the dervish that a scythe warrior would not have. In other words, unless mysticism can consistently provide 15 energy every 5 seconds, it won't matter; you'll still need zealous vow for attack skill spam.

You want to make warriors do even more damage in PvP? Really? Keep in mind that the entire game is balanced around their damage before you answer.

Nechrond

Lion's Arch Merchant

Join Date: Oct 2009

Netherlands

Utrecht Usurpators

D/

29 Jul 2010 at 09:08 - 65

Quote:

Originally Posted by reaper with no name

How often do you have 4 enemies in front of you in PvE? In my personal experience, the answer is "very rarely".

But if you COULD hit that many, you might pay more attention to positioning, so that you'd have more opportunities to do so. Also, this would harm secondary scythers (2 targets instead of 3 is more relevant than 4 instead of 3), clearing the way for minor buffs to scythe attacks.

Quote:

The only way better innate (or any, really) energy management can help the dervish on it's own is if it provided so much energy that zealous vow was no longer needed, thereby freeing up an extra skill slot for the dervish that a scythe warrior would not have. In other words, unless mysticism can consistently provide 15 energy every 5 seconds, it won't matter; you'll still need zealous vow for attack skill spam.

Or be able to spam just a little less, but free up your elite slot. Sounds like a fair deal to me.

Quote:

You want to make warriors do even more damage in PvP? Really? Keep in mind that the entire game is balanced around their damage before you answer.

The damage increase would be totally insignificant for sword and axe warriors. A normal return instead of a smaller one for perhaps 2 attribute points over 12? You'll never notice it. Hammers? Perhaps, that remains to be seen. But I don't think it will matter much. Dervs though, with their free +25HP, can more easily spec their weapon mastery to 16 AND have a more damaging weapon AND benefit more from crits, because scythes have a wider damage range.

reaper with no name

Desert Nomad

Join Date: Apr 2009

FaZ

D/

29 Jul 2010 at 10:07 - 66

There is no diminishing return for crit rates due to weapon rank.

And replace their elite slot with what? If they're spamming a little less, they can't very well bring another attack skill. What would they do? Bring Wounding Strike instead of a standard attack skill? It takes only seconds for a zealous vow dervish to overcome the initial DW spike.

All right. Fine. Lemme do some math for sword and axe warriors to see what would happen if there were no diminishing returns. Just for laughs, I'll see if that would be enough to help dervs, too.

*number crunching*

Ok, by my math, removing diminishing returns on weapon masteries would give the dervish about a 7 dps advantage over a warrior (still wouldn't bring them anywhere near the scythe sin, though).

And what do you know? It also means a 7 damage per hit (too lazy to consider attack speeds) increase in the power of sword autoattacks (which is slightly more than a 20% increase in autoattack power, since it's going from 30 to 37).

And also a 7 damage per hit increase for axes, as well (once again, about a 20% increase).

Make of those numbers what you will.

Nechrond

Lion's Arch Merchant

Join Date: Oct 2009

Netherlands

Utrecht Usurpators

D/

29 Jul 2010 at 11:21 - 67

Based on an attribute of 14 and foes with 60 AR:

The difference for scythe auto-attacks, not considering criticals, is 8.33 damage per attack.
The difference for axe auto-attacks, also not considering criticals, is 5.66 damage per attack. I must admit that's more than I would have thought, though.

Then again, the difference at an attribute rank of 15 or 16, which Dervs are more easily able to afford HP-wise, would be even greater, because of the exponential formula for auto-attack damage. This would definitely help Dervs far more than any other class.

EDIT: I'll need to rethink this point. The effect on scythe crits would be over the top, since crits are based on max weapon damage and +4 attribute. With 16 Scythe Mastery and a way of guaranteeing a crit (say, Wild Blow or GftE!), Dervs could give sick spike assists. Wild Blow would deal 232 damage. Wild Blow on a scything Warrior would deal 164 damage, not factoring in Strength.

belshazaarswrath

Krytan Explorer

Join Date: Mar 2006

AMP

29 Jul 2010 at 16:13 - 68

Quote:

Originally Posted by HigherMinion

They should make Avatar of Grenth lifesteal adjacent foes with each scythe attack! Waaa

Infact, the avatars are so weak compared to attack-spamming, they might aswell remove the "Disabled 120s" clause.

They should have removed that instead of putting in eternal aura to begin with.

In my opinion they should change avatars like this

Avatar of Balthazar-You attack 33% faster and you take -15 damage/you deal +15% damage. No holy damage...

Avatar of Dwayna- Each attack you do heals you for X and you lose 1 hex and condition with each attack skill

Avatar of Grenth-Get rid of cold. Make attacks unblockable in general. Up the Life steal a tad.

Avatar or Lyssa-I would change the +20 energy part for steals 2 energy from every foe per attack.

Avatar of Melandru-This Avatar in my opinion is pretty good. Get rid of the stupidly high energy cost and the earth thing and it'd be pretty nice.

This is just my idea and there have probably been better ideas made. But something in the ballpark of this I think would make the Avatars more desirable.

HigherMinion

Forge Runner

Join Date: May 2008

East Anglia, UK

Order of [Thay]

N/

29 Jul 2010 at 16:52 - 69

Quote:

Originally Posted by belshazaarswrath

They should have removed that instead of putting in eternal aura to begin with.

In my opinion they should change avatars like this

Avatar of Balthazar-You attack 33% faster and you take -15 damage/you deal +15% damage. No holy damage...

Avatar of Dwayna- Each attack you do heals you for X and you lose 1 hex and condition with each attack skill

Avatar of Grenth-Get rid of cold. Make attacks unblockable in general. Up the Life steal a tad.

Avatar or Lyssa-I would change the +20 energy part for steals 2 energy from every foe per attack.

Avatar of Melandru-This Avatar in my opinion is pretty good. Get rid of the stupidly high energy cost and the earth thing and it'd be pretty nice.

This is just my idea and there have probably been better ideas made. But something in the ballpark of this I think would make the Avatars more desirable.

Nice ideas. I don't agree with AoB removing holy damage, because he's shown as a holy type, however:

Grenth is a Necromancer. Necromancers use hexes that generally only trigger on physical damage- so why is the Avatar of Grenth being so... Contradictory?

Avatar of lyssa as a frontline version of Channelling would help alot with energy.

vamp08

Krytan Explorer

Join Date: Nov 2006

PA, USA

[COPY]

D/

29 Jul 2010 at 17:04 - 70

Getting rid of cold damage in AoG is like eating a bowl of cereal...without the cereal.

Grenth is the God of Death and Coldness....keep it that way.

HigherMinion

Forge Runner

Join Date: May 2008

East Anglia, UK

Order of [Thay]

N/

29 Jul 2010 at 17:07 - 71

Quote:

Originally Posted by vamp08

Getting rid of cold damage in AoG is like eating a bowl of cereal...without the cereal.

Grenth is the God of Death and Coldness....keep it that way.

I've always thought drinking a glass of milk to be far more efficient anyway.

Lanier

Desert Nomad

Join Date: Jan 2010

[Pink]

P/

29 Jul 2010 at 17:07 - 72

I really dont think the functionalities of the avatars need much changing at all (with the possible exception of Balthazar - it might be nice to give its functionality something in place of the useless speed boost). Imo, just give all the avatars a manageable energy cost (5-10) and make them maintainable without eternal aura. Then, they would be just fine. Im all for keeping holy damage on balthazar, ice damage on grenth, and earth damage on melandru since those types of damage seem to be special to those gods. Maybe there should be more normal skills in the wind, earth, and mysticism lines that have an effect that activates on cold, earth, or holy damage (respectively).

HigherMinion

Forge Runner

Join Date: May 2008

East Anglia, UK

Order of [Thay]

N/

29 Jul 2010 at 17:17 - 73

Quote:

Originally Posted by Lanier

I really dont think the functionalities of the avatars need much changing at all (with the possible exception of Balthazar - it might be nice to give its functionality something in place of the useless speed boost). Imo, just give all the avatars a manageable energy cost (5-10) and make them maintainable without eternal aura. Then, they would be just fine. Im all for keeping holy damage on balthazar, ice damage on grenth, and earth damage on melandru since those types of damage seem to be special to those gods. Maybe there should be more normal skills in the wind, earth, and mysticism lines that have an effect that activates on cold, earth, or holy damage (respectively).

33% IMS means you deal damage to kiting foes, rather than 0 DPS.

Lanier

Desert Nomad

Join Date: Jan 2010

[Pink]

P/

29 Jul 2010 at 17:22 - 74

Quote:

Originally Posted by HigherMinion

33% IMS means you deal damage to kiting foes, rather than 0 DPS.

Well enemies rarely kite in PvE but i guess i can see where you are coming. They do kite occasionally.

belshazaarswrath

Krytan Explorer

Join Date: Mar 2006

AMP

29 Jul 2010 at 19:06 - 75

Quote:

Originally Posted by Lanier

I really dont think the functionalities of the avatars need much changing at all (with the possible exception of Balthazar - it might be nice to give its functionality something in place of the useless speed boost). Imo, just give all the avatars a manageable energy cost (5-10) and make them maintainable without eternal aura. Then, they would be just fine. Im all for keeping holy damage on balthazar, ice damage on grenth, and earth damage on melandru since those types of damage seem to be special to those gods. Maybe there should be more normal skills in the wind, earth, and mysticism lines that have an effect that activates on cold, earth, or holy damage (respectively).

Meh even if they do relate to the Gods I think it tends to weaken the skills overall. Unless they do what you suggest and have more skills that activate on the damage type then I'd be fine with the damage change.

It might also be interesting to make people resistant to the damage type rather than deal the damage type.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Lanier

Well enemies rarely kite in PvE but i guess i can see where you are coming. They do kite occasionally.

Yea but there are plenty of IMS skills for dervs. There are fewer IAS's and they are either elite or subpar. That's my reasoning for Making Balth increase attack speed rather than movement speed.

FengShuiDove

Forge Runner

Join Date: Sep 2007

Trinity of the Ascended [ToA]

A/

29 Jul 2010 at 20:30 - 76

You know what, I don't even care -- break the heck out of Dervs. I'm an Assassin main, and I love Critscythe as much as the next guy. But Dervs deserve to have their chance at glory. Make the avatars insanely strong, change Eternal Aura to a ridiculous Derv-only buff, do whatever.

At this point, even if Dervs make it into GW2, we know for a fact that scythes won't. Give them a last hee-haw before the mass migration to GW2 in a year.

Commander Kanen

Lion's Arch Merchant

Join Date: Mar 2008

[DVDF]

P/

29 Jul 2010 at 20:42 - 77

Geez !! If i were at work and it took me 4 months to do my job i would be fired by now. I think when Anet staff go to work they just sit around AFKing all day.

belshazaarswrath

Krytan Explorer

Join Date: Mar 2006

AMP

29 Jul 2010 at 23:19 - 78

Quote:

Originally Posted by Commander Kanen

Geez !! If i were at work and it took me 4 months to do my job i would be fired by now. I think when Anet staff go to work they just sit around AFKing all day.

Yea because testing, tuning, and spitting out updates take just as much time as mopping the floor.

own age myname

Desert Nomad

Join Date: Sep 2007

Minnesota

[TAS]

R/

29 Jul 2010 at 23:33 - 79

Quote:

Originally Posted by belshazaarswrath

Yea because testing, tuning, and spitting out updates take just as much time as mopping the floor.

*With 4 people (I think it's 4).

Celestina

Frost Gate Guardian

Join Date: Jun 2010

Veritas Invictus

Me/

29 Jul 2010 at 23:41 - 80

Quote:

Originally Posted by own age myname

*With 4 people (I think it's 4).

I thought it was 5?

Regardless, still a bloody small amount.