Update - January 5, 2012

Jeydra

Forge Runner

Join Date: May 2008

Quote:
Originally Posted by Yol View Post
http://wiki.guildwars.com/wiki/Arcane_Mimicry

It wouldn't allow you to run all three, but two out of three isn't bad. Run one on your bar and the other two on hero bars and let us know which combo works best
And then Arcane Echo Arcane Mimicry and have all three, right?

The problem is, how are you going to get heroes to do the same? None of those spells are like UA, which you maintain. You are going to want to keep casting them. How are you going to achieve that with Arcane Mimicry?

bhavv

bhavv

Furnace Stoker

Join Date: Sep 2006

I've been testing arcane mimicry - it wont work on heroes for anything other than UA because they cast it on recharge which wastes it, and microing 7 mimicries would be a tedious nightmare.

I used Double Dragon + Arcane Mimicry with Starburst on a hero, and it was mighty powerful ... though I forgot to also use arcane echo, I will do that next.

I'm using 6 Ellys - Double Dragon, Starburst,Thunderclap, Glimmering Mark, Stone Sheath and Shatterstone plus a Healing Burst + Mimicry / UA prot monks with channeling for energy.

Heres a video:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=K22dU5DnIlQ

I've now swapped flameburst and lava font to arcane echo and snowstorm.

Random Namos

Ascalonian Squire

Join Date: Dec 2010

Mu Tants

D/

Quote:
Originally Posted by bhavv View Post
Quite powerfull indeed!
I wonder if this is too OP

bhavv

bhavv

Furnace Stoker

Join Date: Sep 2006

Yes, arcane echoing the double dragon top is just lolwth how fast did everything just die?

Its fun in RA too, I'm trying Lava Arrows, Fireball, Arcane Echo, Double Dragon, Glyph of elly power, Fire attunement and aura of res, stuff just blows up dead without a monk.

Jeydra

Forge Runner

Join Date: May 2008

Does that build work in Slaver's HM?

Swingline

Swingline

Forge Runner

Join Date: Sep 2010

Somewhere far away from you

The Mirror of Reason[SNOW]

W/

Just tested HM out with a 3 ele hero build

1 B surge
2 S Flames
1 Keystone
1 SoS/resto hybrid
1 AotL MM
1 N/rt healer

My thoughts...

HM is is like that 3rd bowl of porridge, not too cold, not too hot, just right.

B surge wasn't even that great because HM melee mobs spread out to far for adjacent range.

Cracked armor is still too important imho. Don't leave home w/o it

I ran this on my ele with the new Elemental Attunement. 20 Fire Magic without cons is... O.o

Searing Heat
Teinai's Heat
Meteor
Liquid Flame
Rodgort's Invocation
Glyph of Elemental Power
Elemental Attunement
Fire Attunement

bhavv

bhavv

Furnace Stoker

Join Date: Sep 2006

B Surge is a bad skill choice in PVE, use eruption, glimmering mark or ineptitude for blind.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Jeydra View Post
Does that build work in Slaver's HM?
I'm not sure if that specific build will work, but I'm going to fill a HM dungeon book with 6 ellys and 2 monks or continuously fail trying. I wont get it done anytime soon though, its just all I have left to do in the game and it will max one last title I need for a full HoM.

In dungeons it would be wise to keep the starburst hero flagged back a bit against larger mobs.

Mouse at Large

Mouse at Large

Jungle Guide

Join Date: Dec 2005

Scotland

Fuzzy Physics Institute

E/

Just did Shenzun Tunnels Z quest with an experimental water bar. 1st impressions are that

a) The Am Fah just melted

b) The Ministry mages are BRUTAL!!!!

c) To make the new elites truly effective, you will probably have to give up PvE skills

Btw, the bar was water attune, AoR, armour of frost, shatterstone, glowing ice, maelstrom, rust & EVAS. Not saying it's optimal, but it's certainly useable. Now all we need is a bit of love for the non-elites and we can get some bar compression back

Swingline

Swingline

Forge Runner

Join Date: Sep 2010

Somewhere far away from you

The Mirror of Reason[SNOW]

W/

Quote:
Originally Posted by bhavv View Post
B Surge is a bad skill choice in PVE, use eruption, glimmering mark or ineptitude for blind.
I figured that out before hand but wanted to test it out since the spammable dmg/blind + 40/40 set looked like a good replacement for invoke but the hero didn't seem to use it as a form of anti melee like Ineptitude from my experience.

Willie Lumpkin

Academy Page

Join Date: Feb 2011

Canada

Sandwalkers of Ascalon

E/Me

I have a few vanquishes left to finish up in Prophecies, so I'll see how it goes with that... but I can't help but think it'll be easier for me, since my main bars just got buffed. Glyph of Energy in particular looks kind of ridiculous now.

Disappointed with the few Air nerfs though. I'll try out the perma-exhaustion just to see how it goes, but I think those two skills will definitely see reduced use. And really, of all skills, elites aren't the ones that need to be nerfed (in most cases).

I hope this hasn't changed the overall difficulty of Hard Mode too much. It's nice to see an attempt to reduce the ubiquity of SoS and replace them with Elementalists, but if HM has become overall harder, it was not really a good move.

enter_the_zone

Jungle Guide

Join Date: Nov 2007

R/

Quote:
Originally Posted by bhavv View Post
This doesnt bother me one bit because I know what prot spirit and spirit bond are. Also a soul twisting rit with shelter would still make everything easy. You can still vanq Cantha before doing WoC, if someone plans on vanqing then its their mistake if they start WoC before completing a factions vanq.

Actually, to clarify, I don't have WoC active, it was the standard Jade Brotherhood eles in Wajjun Bazaar in HM that partywiped me. Prot spirit and spirit bond are of no use either unless you micro and precast because your monks won't have time.

If you get 2 eles together, you can kiss your arse goodbye because Double Dragon and Dragon stomp will wipe your party before heroes even have a chance to scatter. It's totally bonkers, like batshit insane.

Swingline

Swingline

Forge Runner

Join Date: Sep 2010

Somewhere far away from you

The Mirror of Reason[SNOW]

W/

I just got hit by distracting shot with EA half way thru casting and did not get rupted. I carry no anti rupts btw. Same thing happened earlier with rodgorts against CoF. Can anyone else confirm this?

bhavv

bhavv

Furnace Stoker

Join Date: Sep 2006

Quote:
Originally Posted by enter_the_zone View Post
Actually, to clarify, I don't have WoC active, it was the standard Jade Brotherhood eles in Wajjun Bazaar in HM that partywiped me. Prot spirit and spirit bond are of no use either unless you micro and precast because your monks won't have time.

If you get 2 eles together, you can kiss your arse goodbye because Double Dragon and Dragon stomp will wipe your party before heroes even have a chance to scatter. It's totally bonkers, like batshit insane.
Oh yes those things are very hard, i remember that I struggled with many party wipes against them.

Prior to Eotn though, I managed to vanq those areas with an Earth warder build, using Melee, Elements and Stability wards, plus prot spirit on my bar. Make sure stability goes up first to prevent dragon stomp KDs, and then get the other two wards up. The PVE Ebon ward is now better and can effectively condense both melee and elemental wards into one slot as it works on everything.

I also deleted my reroll slot which currently had a 5 month old PVP mesmer, and a pre searing ranger that was only 9 months old to make room for 2 more elly heroes, so I now have an 8 elly team for PVE

Though I dont think that an E/Rt healer and E/Mo protter will work as well as my healing burst + mimicry / UA prot monks.

Jeydra

Forge Runner

Join Date: May 2008

Ok concluding that the biggest change this update brought was to make hero Elementalists weaker, thank you very much nerf to Invoke + Chain Lightning. Nothing else in the update is of much consequence, save slight buffs to player AP Fire and AP Earth. The other skills are all glitzy with no substance, for primary Elementalists in PvE at least. Star Burst might see some play on primary Warriors in PvP (maybe even in PvE), Gust will probably see play in PvP as well, maybe a few other skills, but they're all weak for primary Elementalists in PvE - both players and heroes. Maybe at most a maverick player can opt for one of those in easier areas, but if he attempts to carry those builds to harder areas he'll wipe AND have precious few options to salvage the run. Like it or not, Elementalists are inflexible, and you have hardly a fraction of the sustained power that original, pre-update builds have.

It's going to be a struggle to replace the original hero Invoke template. Sad, but that's just how it goes.

As for Double Dragon and Dragon's Stomp stomping parties, just learn to aggro them right and you should have no trouble.

bhavv

bhavv

Furnace Stoker

Join Date: Sep 2006

I disagree that the update made elly heroes weaker, invoke and chain lightning were rarely ever used in PVE, and they still work if you simply use either one on an Air hero.

I'll be trying this out eventually, all I want to do atm is play RA.

Coast

Coast

Furnace Stoker

Join Date: Jul 2006

Belgium

Whats Going On [sup]

Mo/

Invoke and chain are nerfed cause if was far too easy to spike with them in pvp.
U can still run one or the other and use they often enough.
Also: u wanted higher hp, so there u got it.

Jeydra

Forge Runner

Join Date: May 2008

To be honest with you, you make me angry.

Invoke and Chain Lightning were the best damage skills for Elementalists, prior to their nerf. They are spammable, they are unavoidable, they deal heavy, fully ranged AoE damage. There is no comparison. Just because you and all the other Rt/N/Me worshipers out there did not use them does not change the fact that Elementalist heroes were excellent. Post update Invoke is still usable ... alone. Not with Chain Lightning. And guess what: Air Magic suffers the same things that Water, Fire and Earth do. There aren't enough good non-elite skills out there to use. The original Invoke template is dead, and there does not seem to be a replacement.

It's your call not to use the best skills out there, and I don't care what you do. I'll just point out that you are having trouble with WoC, not to mention almost walk past a mob after they aggroed onto your heroes, not to mention aggro mobs without your preparations up, not to mention you don't call targets, and you actually suggested Ward of Stability to deal with Dragon's Stomp instead of the far more effective, universally useful methods of splitting heroes up + interrupting Dragon's Stomp.

I don't care what you do, it's up to you. But I swear, you are annoying. That is all.

DiogoSilva

Krytan Explorer

Join Date: Feb 2011

Girl

E/

Quote:
Originally Posted by Jeydra View Post
Post update Invoke is still usable ... alone. Not with Chain Lightning.
I wonder, can Thunderclap + Chain Lightning be a good alternative? Less range, and not so much for spike damage; but the extra adjacent-range cracked armor and rupts might make it strong enough. The main problem remains: lack of good non-elite air skills, especially because the new T.C. makes Lightning Orb a bit redudant.

BTW, how noticeable are the HM changes so far? My Shatterstone, out of the 105 potential damage, did 65 against Ministry of Purity spellcasters in HM. Does this applies to all foes, or does it fare better against other stuff?

Lanier

Lanier

Desert Nomad

Join Date: Jan 2010

[Pink]

P/

Does it seem to anyone else that elemental damage is actually doing less damage in PvE, or is it just me? I haven't messed around too much yet with my elemental damage builds, but it seems to me as though the yellow numbers I see are the same, if not lower, than what I saw prior to the update.

Jeydra

Forge Runner

Join Date: May 2008

@DiogoSilva - Yes, it's possible, but the damage lost is quite severe.

Invoke @ 16 Air vs. AL 100, 80 and 60 dummies does 75, 95 and 125 damage respectively.
Thunderclap @ 16 Air vs. AL 100, 80 and 60 dummies does 42, 53 and 70 damage respectively.

The damage lost is serious even after accounting for Cracked Armour, and you lose out on the range as well. You get Weakness in return, but who cares about Weakness? Cracked Armour is more significant, but you'd have to run more armour-sensitive damage to take advantage of it. More Eles? Something might turn up, but if there's a solution it's not obvious.

As for HM armour changes, it's definitely there, but not very significant. It varies between monsters, but something like 10 armour or so is a good estimate.

bhavv

bhavv

Furnace Stoker

Join Date: Sep 2006

Quote:
Originally Posted by Jeydra View Post
Invoke and Chain Lightning were the best damage skills for Elementalists, prior to their nerf. They are spammable, they are unavoidable, they deal heavy, fully ranged AoE damage. There is no comparison.
I disagree again. Invoke and Chain Lightning could only hit a limited number of targets. Energy Surge, Unnautural Signet, Mistrust and Overload all hit unlimited targets within range with armour ignoring damage.

Invoke and Chain Lightning were mostly useful in PVP only, they had very little use in PVE and were no where near as effective as Mesmers were for raw damage output.

[QUOTE=Jeydra;5621841
Invoke @ 16 Air vs. AL 100, 80 and 60 dummies does 75, 95 and 125 damage respectively.
Thunderclap @ 16 Air vs. AL 100, 80 and 60 dummies does 42, 53 and 70 damage respectively.
[/QUOTE]

The test dummies are only indicative of damage against players in PVP, or enemies in NM. HM enemies tend to have much more armour than those dummies do.

Xsiriss

Xsiriss

Jungle Guide

Join Date: May 2008

Quote:
Originally Posted by bhavv View Post
I disagree that the update made elly heroes weaker, invoke and chain lightning were rarely ever used in PVE, and they still work if you simply use either one on an Air hero
Er the only reason why would take an ele in both PvE and PvP(e/mo protters aside) would be for an invoke+chain lightning ele. It could (emphasis on past tense) constantly churn out aoe, armour penetrating damage (even better with numerous cracked advantage possibilities in pve) that was superior to other damage types. It also had relatively decent energy management and support (shock arrow,shell shock,blinding flash for PvP.) Now you can't take both, exhaustion is still a pain and Thunderclap's inferior damage and range make it a weak alternative. Trying out a mindburn build made me realise that one exhaustion skill that's remotely spammable is still a big downside.

In comparison to an e-surge mesmer it could do a lot of damage and much more frequently. Rarely are mobs so stacked together where their slightly better aoe ability makes the difference


I agree with Jeydra, and until we see normal skill getting a buff we won't see much change.

bhavv

bhavv

Furnace Stoker

Join Date: Sep 2006

Quote:
Originally Posted by Xsiriss View Post
Er the only reason why would take an ele in both PvE and PvP(e/mo protters aside) would be for an invoke+chain lightning ele.
That was true previously, but now you have many more valid options to pick from.

There was very little point to taking an Invoke Elly instead of armor ignoring damage prior to this update anyway.

Actually, I remember it wasnt true. Recently my guild was doing successful HM Urgoz runs with fire nuker ellys.

Daesu

Daesu

Furnace Stoker

Join Date: Oct 2008

Quote:
Originally Posted by bhavv View Post
I've been testing arcane mimicry - it wont work on heroes for anything other than UA because they cast it on recharge which wastes it, and microing 7 mimicries would be a tedious nightmare.
It would work on heroes if you choose the skill that they mimic wisely. You don't need a maintained enchantment like UA, all you need is a longer lasting enchantment, e.g. MoM, Mist Form, Energy Boon. Once they cast the enchantment, it doesn't matter if mimicry goes through recharge, the enchantment stays until they can mimic again.

Quote:
Originally Posted by bhavv
I disagree that the update made elly heroes weaker, invoke and chain lightning were rarely ever used in PVE, and they still work if you simply use either one on an Air hero.
I agree with you.

My ele team feels much stronger in HM than they were before the update. Your video proves it, even though there are more powerful build alternatives. I don't think Invoke is the best elite right now, but heck neither is SoS, so we all have to adapt. I am still testing it, but air seems to be a weaker line now compared to the rest.

Xsiriss

Xsiriss

Jungle Guide

Join Date: May 2008

Quote:
Originally Posted by bhavv View Post
Actually, I remember it wasnt true. Recently my guild was doing successful HM Urgoz runs with fire nuker ellys.
Special circumstance. This is because there are mostly plant enemies, and fire actually has an advantage there and because the sheer number of enemies makes them the most effective way to take the mobs out. Especially as they're much easier to ball up as the spawns are very linear (no patrols etc.) You wouldn't say a knocklock warrior was THE build to run because you use it in the deep.

bhavv

bhavv

Furnace Stoker

Join Date: Sep 2006

Quote:
Originally Posted by Daesu View Post
Your video proves it, even though there are more powerful build alternatives. I don't think Invoke is the best elite right now, but heck neither is SoS, so we all have to adapt.
I'm not bothered if there are more powerful alternatives, I've simply always wanted to be able to play the game with full Elly teams with builds from all elements, and now I can.

Previously, the only thing that worked was Invoke. Now every element works in PVE, it doesnt bother me what is weaker or stronger, as far as I can tell I will be able to beat what I have left in the game which is HM dungeons with at least 6 ellys and 2 monks, if not 8 ellys.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Xsiriss View Post
Special circumstance. This is because there are mostly plant enemies, and fire actually has an advantage there and because the sheer number of enemies makes them the most effective way to take the mobs out. Especially as they're much easier to ball up as the spawns are very linear (no patrols etc.) You wouldn't say a knocklock warrior was THE build to run because you use it in the deep.
And the only real reason for why people would take Invoke ellys anywhere else in PVE was due to pity for their favourite class, not because it was the best, or an enjoyable choice.

DiogoSilva

Krytan Explorer

Join Date: Feb 2011

Girl

E/

Against the Am Fah spellcasters, Shaterstone dealt the full 105 damage. That makes me VERY satisfied. 210 single target + 105 neaby > far better than Invoke Lightning; but as known, the non-elites are lacking. I used Ice Spikes, Glowing Ice to recover my energy right after, and Blurred Vision and Maelstrom for the lack of better choices. Maybe I'd take those last two out for some PvE skills. Also had the Glyph+Attune+E.lLord for energy management, and usually didn't have much e. problems.

However, it really depends a lot on the enemies you face. I went to the Marketplace, and against Mantids, SS was at 68 damage per hit. And like I stated before, against Ministry of Purity spellcasters, in Shadow's Passage, the damage was about 65.

Cracked Armor is still definitely needed, if only because the foes armor is way too variable. People might need to check the individual elemental resistances of foes in the area before using their elementalist builds, because that might make a difference in determining if they are worth over some other hero builds or not, and if cracked armor is really needed or just optional.

Necromancers with weaken armor is a must, derv heroes should also probably take that attack skill that applies cracked, and I wonder if Shockwave does fine on melee characters. A constant aoe reapplication of cracked armor might be important to keep ele's numbers big (and make those melee stronger as well), but half of this will only be relevant after the melee AI update (which might come out with WoC part 3).

bhavv

bhavv

Furnace Stoker

Join Date: Sep 2006

Quote:
Originally Posted by DiogoSilva View Post
.... but as known, the non-elites are lacking. I used Ice Spikes, Glowing Ice to recover my energy right after, and Blurred Vision and Maelstrom for the lack of better choices. Maybe I'd take those last two out for some PvE skills. Also had the Glyph+Attune+E.lLord for energy management, and usually didn't have much e. problems.
I agree with this, I really hope that Water magic non elites can be improved for PVE to make Shatterstone / Mirror of Ice / Water Trident builds more valid. I will also try using maelstrom instead of deep freeze, this should help to compensate for the lack of panic.

BTW if you havnt tried it out yet, Arcane echo > Double Dragon is superb fun in RA, and very effective if you have a melee on your team. Otherwise just cast it on anyone thats being attacked.

Daesu

Daesu

Furnace Stoker

Join Date: Oct 2008

Yes double dragon is great with melee.

I am finding Mist Form to be overpowered with multiple copies of it in an Ele team. My heroes also arcane mimic my MoM and just spam. Water magic shows promise. The AoE spells like Ice spike and churning earth are especially devastating.

DiogoSilva

Krytan Explorer

Join Date: Feb 2011

Girl

E/

I just tested Blinding Surge against Mantid Drones/ Am Fah too. When it fully connects, it's almost as strong as Chain Lightning, damage-wise, but with less range and with lots of blind. It dealt about 100-110 damage after cracked armor on assassins (Chain Lightning dealt about 115-130). Seems to be about on par with Ineptitude, with slightly less damage but being more spammable both in casting time, recharge and energy cost. But when it doesn't connects, Blinding Surge damage is that of a Lightning Strike (lol). I suppose heroes might use it wisely (the AI is usually decent at checking conditions), but that might also mean then won't use it for a spike.

Lightning Orb + Blinding Surge + Chain Lightning also have the extra to be very spammable, and after glyph, attunement and E. Lord, you still have two slots left for whatever you want. I tried intensity and EBSoH, but they were a bit underwhelming. I was thinking of Technobabble for a good alternative against non-physical attackers, and maybe an extra spike skill for the same reasons. It would make the build very balanced in support and damage for a player to use.

I'm unsure of this elite, and I think either a base damage of 75 (instead of 50) or a nearby range would have made it an easier choice to pick. Thunderclap might have a more general use (for less damage), but TC suffers more from the lack of spammable non-elite choices, because it substitutes one of them for PvE.

Xsiriss

Xsiriss

Jungle Guide

Join Date: May 2008

Quote:
Originally Posted by bhavv View Post
And the only real reason for why people would take Invoke ellys anywhere else in PVE was due to pity for their favourite class, not because it was the best, or an enjoyable choice.
No you're missing the point in your bias. The invoke build was an all round good thing, capable of consistently dealing large amounts of damage to multiple or single targets as well as being able to take support skills for cracked armour or even stuff like rend enchantments or blind. It was versatile. Something like a mesmer or a rit is more situational and has different functionalities (splinter wep/spirit support and anti caster/interrupts respectively). Yes they deal damage, but through utility. You can't compare the single damage factor of E-surge to the Air line, which is designed for the main purpose of dps. Especially seeing as do make a decent mesmer dps built you need the help of pve skills.

Invoke also has a much better role in places where the raw damage outclasses armour ignoring damage in most cases. This can spell classes or the whole of Normal Mode. Yes NM, it's still a large part of PvE that people play and is worth taking into account.

Caerulei

Pre-Searing Cadet

Join Date: Jan 2012

Circle of Nine

E/Mo

Just gotta say, love this update, but perhaps being an Elementalist makes me biased. I know my Ritualist friend is going to be ticked, all of those nerfed skills he uses in his current build.

I love my Starburst build and this update seriously improved that. I win against just about any Warrior or Dervish in pvp (barring a mystic) if both of us have full health/energy. This certainly makes me want to use it against the hordes in pve as well.

Very pleased.

Daesu

Daesu

Furnace Stoker

Join Date: Oct 2008

Quote:
Originally Posted by DiogoSilva View Post
I just tested Blinding Surge against Mantid Drones/ Am Fah too. When it fully connects, it's almost as strong as Chain Lightning, damage-wise, but with less range and with lots of blind. It dealt about 100-110 damage after cracked armor on assassins (Chain Lightning dealt about 115-130). Seems to be about on par with Ineptitude, with slightly less damage but being more spammable both in casting time, recharge and energy cost. But when it doesn't connects, Blinding Surge damage is that of a Lightning Strike (lol). I suppose heroes might use it wisely (the AI is usually decent at checking conditions), but that might also mean then won't use it for a spike.

Lightning Orb + Blinding Surge + Chain Lightning also have the extra to be very spammable, and after glyph, attunement and E. Lord, you still have two slots left for whatever you want. I tried intensity and EBSoH, but they were a bit underwhelming. I was thinking of Technobabble for a good alternative against non-physical attackers, and maybe an extra spike skill for the same reasons. It would make the build very balanced in support and damage for a player to use.

I'm unsure of this elite, and I think either a base damage of 75 (instead of 50) or a nearby range would have made it an easier choice to pick. Thunderclap might have a more general use (for less damage), but TC suffers more from the lack of spammable non-elite choices, because it substitutes one of them for PvE.
Very cool for confirming that air magic is still powerful. I thought of only trying to bring multiple copies of Gust, in an ele team, for KD.

The most promising elite so far, at least personally, is MoM. It makes previously impossible builds with various non-elite skills possible. As for water magic, I smell water magic solo farming builds in the horizon.

bhavv

bhavv

Furnace Stoker

Join Date: Sep 2006

Quote:
Originally Posted by Xsiriss View Post
No you're missing the point in your bias. The invoke build was an all round good thing, capable of consistently dealing large amounts of damage to multiple or single targets as well as being able to take support skills for cracked armour or even stuff like rend enchantments or blind. It was versatile. Something like a mesmer or a rit is more situational and has different functionalities (splinter wep/spirit support and anti caster/interrupts respectively). Yes they deal damage, but through utility. You can't compare the single damage factor of E-surge to the Air line, which is designed for the main purpose of dps. Especially seeing as do make a decent mesmer dps built you need the help of pve skills.

Invoke also has a much better role in places where the raw damage outclasses armour ignoring damage in most cases. This can spell classes or the whole of Normal Mode. Yes NM, it's still a large part of PvE that people play and is worth taking into account.
Im not talking about nor bothered with NM, anything works in NM. In fact in that case, Searing Flames would be better than Invoke.

Invoke is a good build, but in HM PVE it wasnt close to as good as people are pretending / hyping it up to be. Against larger mobs, both Energy Surge and Mistrust easily dealt far more raw damage than Invoke ever could, and the conditions for them were easily met in PVE (also for Cry of Frustration, Overload and Unnatural sig).

Fire magic was meant to have been designed for more DPS than Air, but as we all know nothing about ellys worked as the class was intended once HM was turned on, and this update is specifically concerning the effectiveness of ellys in HM, not in incredibly easy NM.

The nerf to Invoke is meaningless to a player controlled character, all it affects is heroes. It is still easy to use, and heroes can still use wither one of Invoke or Chain lightning without any problems.

Invoke and Chain Lightning were also incredibly brainless skills to use in their previous form, all you had to do was stand there mashing buttons 1 + 2 without ever thinking about anything. I suppose that is why people enjoyed using them in PVE, as most other builds tend to require additional thought and skill. Now you simply have to be careful not to over spam them, hardly anything worth complaining about.

Avatar Exico

Avatar Exico

Wilds Pathfinder

Join Date: Jun 2006

Way to Cold at Home:Illnois and School:Iowa.

We Trip Hard On [AcID]

N/

This just thought but has anyone notice that with all conditions now that elites are putting wouldn't be smart to bring Fragility. Combining Fragility with Shockwave because the spell what I saw alone does 150 dmg to dummies with 100 armor in AoE and add fragility with that almost 200 dmg per cast. Fragility be very Overpowered now with Eles with all conditions that now afflict.

bhavv

bhavv

Furnace Stoker

Join Date: Sep 2006

Quote:
Originally Posted by Avatar Exico View Post
This just thought but has anyone notice that with all conditions now that elites are putting wouldn't be smart to bring Fragility. Combining Fragility with Shockwave because the spell what I saw alone does 150 dmg to dummies with 100 armor in AoE and add fragility with that almost 200 dmg per cast. Fragility be very Overpowered now with Eles with all conditions that now afflict.
I've already tested that too and it is very powerful - dont forget to also try crystal wave after shockwave.

Fragility > Earthquake > Aftershock > Shockwave > Crystal Wave will be very powerful in PVE.

ashes

Desert Nomad

Join Date: Oct 2007

Beertown ;P

RoP

E/Mo

How will foes flee from aoe dmg now compared to pre-update?

DiogoSilva

Krytan Explorer

Join Date: Feb 2011

Girl

E/

MoM is more exciting than it seemed to me at first glance. It can have so many uses. You don't even need to make a four-elemental build; you can even just focus on one element and having more for additional effects, and MoM can work like a dual-attunement too.

I've tried for Jade Quarry a build that revolves around Fireball, Eruption, Tenai's Heat, Meteor and Ward Against Foes. Eruption+Heat was great for capping, with Fireball giving the final blow and Meteor disabling the annoying cappers in-between the nukes. Fireball is the spammable skill of choice, Ward Against Foes is excellent for so many things there: against melee, to allow your nukes to kill the melee or any other; against cappers/ runners, and against the kurzick/ luxon creatures. This build took MoM over E.Attunement, because the later forced me to spread too much my attributes, and the extra energy wasn't that needed.

E. Attunement is still the best one for dual-attunment, especially when you want to spam some Rodgord's after (if for PvE) an early Deep Freeze.

EDIT: I'm interested in trying Glyph of Energy with Earthquake and Dragon Stomp.

bhavv

bhavv

Furnace Stoker

Join Date: Sep 2006

Quote:
Originally Posted by ashes View Post
How will foes flee from aoe dmg now compared to pre-update?
They still flee from AoE spells like Searing Heat and Churning Earth, but Double Dragon doesnt cause any scatter.

Water hexes and AoE is a good combination to use to reduce scatter too.

Swingline

Swingline

Forge Runner

Join Date: Sep 2010

Somewhere far away from you

The Mirror of Reason[SNOW]

W/

I call it Icy Flames





Perfected