Orders are not overpowered, at all.
Res Sig is overpowered and will be nerfed. It's basically 7 skills with a 3s cast.
Gale will have either an increase cooldown or an exhaustion fix.
Mantra of Resolve should have the recharge increased dramatically to make Wild Blow a better counter.
Heal Party should have a short recharge.
Cripling Shot will have either a 15e cost or a longer recharge.
Distortion will go from 3..1 to 4 or 5...1. That or have a 10s recharge, but I doubt that.
Eviscerate will probably get nerfed, probably with an increase in adrenal cost or decrease in damage.
Shield's Up is going to get a buff to counter ranger spike.
Balance on the Horizon.
Vindexus
Red Locust
I'd be pretty happy with ANet reducing orders to aggro range, the current radar range is just too much.
Other than that, gale and crippling shot are the ones that are most likely getting a nerf.
Other than that, gale and crippling shot are the ones that are most likely getting a nerf.
Lady Lozza
Range on cast, or range throughout duration?
Falcon213
Quote:
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Originally Posted by Vindexus
Orders are not overpowered, at all.
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[quoteRes Sig is overpowered and will be nerfed. It's basically 7 skills with a 3s cast.[/quote]
Res sig is only overpowered in builds where it is broken. Namely IWAY. I honestly don't think that it will change, as it would GREATLY affect ALL aspects of the game.
Quote:
| Gale will have either an increase cooldown or an exhaustion fix. |
Quote:
| Mantra of Resolve should have the recharge increased dramatically to make Wild Blow a better counter. |
Quote:
| Heal Party should have a short recharge. |
Quote:
| Cripling Shot will have either a 15e cost or a longer recharge. |
Quote:
| Distortion will go from 3..1 to 4 or 5...1. That or have a 10s recharge, but I doubt that. |
Quote:
| Eviscerate will probably get nerfed, probably with an increase in adrenal cost or decrease in damage. |
Quote:
| Shield's Up is going to get a buff to counter ranger spike. |
tafy69
I was just thinking why Distortion is so usefull, its down to the hod helm again. If teams had the ability to shut down warriors with hexes there wouldnt be any need for nearly every char to use distortion.
Renegade ++RIP++
warriors can be shut down... the hod helm just makes it a little less painfull on the warrior to see him getting stacked with 6 hexes and be unable to do anything since htere is no such thing as a global remove all hexes cast... like there is a rend enchantment one.
Sigh i so wished that all those items that got nerfed got put back in and that ANET would just make them unusuable in pvp. And problem is solved. Why do we need to make every fun item (that is easy to come by) and that adds diversification and which is content get rid of just for pvp sake... if you can just stop it by not allowing them to be equipped in pvp areas.
Sigh i so wished that all those items that got nerfed got put back in and that ANET would just make them unusuable in pvp. And problem is solved. Why do we need to make every fun item (that is easy to come by) and that adds diversification and which is content get rid of just for pvp sake... if you can just stop it by not allowing them to be equipped in pvp areas.
Numa Pompilius
The HoD helmet hardly "adds diversification" in PvE, though, and it's disappearance wouldn't affect PvE gameplay at all. The only ones who'd really miss it are PvP-wars and droks runners.
Raxxman
uh any warrior in a hex heavy environment will miss the HoD helm, you try fighting ancient Skales with and then without the helm and tell me which one was easier.
tafy69
Id just like to say TF + IWAY = 200% increased attack speed
or Frenzy + IWAY
Just tested it, who said IWAY was not overpowered?
or Frenzy + IWAY
Just tested it, who said IWAY was not overpowered?
Renegade ++RIP++
don't BS tafy69, the speed is capped at 133% and if it did stack then its a bug that needs to be reported but has no bearing on the overpoweredness of iway.
Quote:
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Originally Posted by http://www.guildwars.com/aboutgw/gameupdates/updatearchive-2005-09.php
Update: Thursday, September 29
Balance Changes * Capped attack speed adjustments at 133% of normal attack speed, down from 150% previously. |
tafy69
Quote:
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Originally Posted by Renegade ++RIP++
don't BS tafy69, the speed is capped at 133% and if it did stack then its a bug that needs to be reported but has no bearing on the overpoweredness of iway.
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Renegade ++RIP++
like I said... if it does stack then it is a bug seeing as that according to all the updates IAS is capped at 133%. But it has no bearing on the overpoweredness of iway.
Heck overpoweredness is all about opinions... and anyone has one even me. And last i checked I can post my opinion in here.
Heck overpoweredness is all about opinions... and anyone has one even me. And last i checked I can post my opinion in here.
Numa Pompilius
Quote:
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Originally Posted by Raxxman
uh any warrior in a hex heavy environment will miss the HoD helm, you try fighting ancient Skales with and then without the helm and tell me which one was easier.
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Rajamic
Just because Anet says it's fixed doesn't mean it is. We've seen them be wrong before.
I'm all in favor if IWAY being party members only, but it needs some other buff with it to keep it useful. Maybe double the duration?
Orders do need some sort of nerf, but aggro range on cast is about the only one I can see that won't break them.
Ranger Spirits should be buffed so their level = attribute level + 1. This will make them at least a bit more durable.
Give Dual Shot a 5 Energy cost and a reduced accuracy. Something like only 85% chance to hit with each arrow. (Going 10 to 5 on energy doesn't really help a Ranger all that much, thanks to Expertise, but it does keep the skill attractive despite the miss chance)
Negative Exhaustion. There, Gale's fixed. Wars can still use it, but they have to be much more tactical about when to use it.
Reduce the effect of Deep Wound.
Improved Energy management pretty much everywhere. Cut the Ether Prodigy damage in half and use that skill as the top-end benchmark.
Balance the Warrior armors. Holy hell is this overdue.
Improve either the damage or range of sustained AoE spells.
Well, that's my big list.
I'm all in favor if IWAY being party members only, but it needs some other buff with it to keep it useful. Maybe double the duration?
Orders do need some sort of nerf, but aggro range on cast is about the only one I can see that won't break them.
Ranger Spirits should be buffed so their level = attribute level + 1. This will make them at least a bit more durable.
Give Dual Shot a 5 Energy cost and a reduced accuracy. Something like only 85% chance to hit with each arrow. (Going 10 to 5 on energy doesn't really help a Ranger all that much, thanks to Expertise, but it does keep the skill attractive despite the miss chance)
Negative Exhaustion. There, Gale's fixed. Wars can still use it, but they have to be much more tactical about when to use it.
Reduce the effect of Deep Wound.
Improved Energy management pretty much everywhere. Cut the Ether Prodigy damage in half and use that skill as the top-end benchmark.
Balance the Warrior armors. Holy hell is this overdue.
Improve either the damage or range of sustained AoE spells.
Well, that's my big list.
Raxxman
Thats all well and good but the point still remains perfectly valid. Your statement doesn't change anything
Rieselle
Jumping in on the IWAY thing, for the skill IWAY itself, how about making it have a reasonable duration, and changing it to "if there is a dead ally nearby" rather than "for each dead ally". So it doesnt get stronger with multiple deaths but is usuable in ordinary situations? (After fixing the attack speed bug, of course).
Although it wont affect the IWAY build all that much, it would make the skill more useful in normal situations and less useful in the extreme IWAY-build case.
Although it wont affect the IWAY build all that much, it would make the skill more useful in normal situations and less useful in the extreme IWAY-build case.
tomcruisejr
if warriors can do damage even without using attack skills, why is there a need to nerf distortion?
distortion is a soft targets' life saver.
eh?
distortion is a soft targets' life saver.
eh?
flawless650
This thread contains some of the worst suggestions I've ever read: 50% health on rez sig, make the iway skill totally useless, nerf blackout, etc. The only thing rez sig needs to be changed is disabling adenaline skills for set period of time to stop chain rezzing from being so powerful. After all, every other class loses their entire energy when they die which makes them useless until they regen their energy. Whereas, once the warrior is rezzed, a warrior can go about unloading his andreline spike he already built up. Take out HoD and you've made the warriors more prone to hex shutdown. Nerf deep wound to 10% max health reduction because of how insane amount of damage it does once applied and how it reduces the effectiveness of healing. Debug EoE "unseen" range to give teams an actual fighting chance.
The problem with crippling shot, blackout, and every other skill used by rangers is because of their primary attribute that reduces costs and recharge time of skills by 4%. With high expertise, rangers can effectively spam certain skills making balanced skills overpowered. Nerfing expertise to 3% would probably be sufficient enough to make most of these skills balanced once again for rangers without making them totally worthless for other classes.
Most of all buff up most the elites to be more useful in PvP because most of them are very much useless as of right now.
http://guildwarsguru.com/forum/showt...=Skill+balance <--go to this thread for some nice skill balance suggestions
I just hope that ANet hasn't taken any of the suggestions in this thread into consideration cause most of them are just overnerfing already decent or bad skills.
The problem with crippling shot, blackout, and every other skill used by rangers is because of their primary attribute that reduces costs and recharge time of skills by 4%. With high expertise, rangers can effectively spam certain skills making balanced skills overpowered. Nerfing expertise to 3% would probably be sufficient enough to make most of these skills balanced once again for rangers without making them totally worthless for other classes.
Most of all buff up most the elites to be more useful in PvP because most of them are very much useless as of right now.
http://guildwarsguru.com/forum/showt...=Skill+balance <--go to this thread for some nice skill balance suggestions
I just hope that ANet hasn't taken any of the suggestions in this thread into consideration cause most of them are just overnerfing already decent or bad skills.
antialias02
I trust ANet to do the best balancing job that they can. Just because we say things like "OMG give us infinite candy canes ANet" doesn't mean they will. That's an extreme example, but I don't think that just because people ask for a nerf - or a buff - ArenaNet will swoop down and grant every nerf-wish.
I think that would ruin the game, and they know it. Balance doesn't mean nerfing everything until all skills are useless and weak. And everybody has something that gets used against them all the time. The fact that people are complaining about so many diverse skills, in fact, makes me think that very few skills actually NEED to be nerfed.
But some others need to be buffed. And I believe ANet knows that.
I think that would ruin the game, and they know it. Balance doesn't mean nerfing everything until all skills are useless and weak. And everybody has something that gets used against them all the time. The fact that people are complaining about so many diverse skills, in fact, makes me think that very few skills actually NEED to be nerfed.
But some others need to be buffed. And I believe ANet knows that.
twicky_kid
Quote:
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Originally Posted by tafy69
Id just like to say TF + IWAY = 200% increased attack speed
or Frenzy + IWAY Just tested it, who said IWAY was not overpowered? |
IWAY to me doesn't matter. You can take IWAY out and they will still run the same the same way. Pets are used for well of suffering, profane, and soul reaping not just for IWAY. When IWAY is changed to not count pets that will not stop them from bringing pets.
EoE, NR, and predatory is what gives IWAY the edge. EoE kills their pets faster and adds alot of pressure to the foes. NR screws protection and hexes. Predatory gives the wars some healing while allowing them to outdamage the healing. All of them use eviscerate adding deep wound. With predatory+deep wound that's -40% healing.
You can take away IWAY and the build is still very valid. Until you deal with the true power of the build which is the necros and spirits it is not going to change.
FYI, primal echos alone completely screws IWAY. They cannot afford 10e for each of those res sigs on top of their TF or frenzy. Frozen soil also works nicely and is never left behind due to the ghost's sick chain resing. Res sig is perfectly fine. If you complain about res sig its your enablity to deal with it from a strategy stand point.
EternalTempest
I think Iway will get tweaked but not get altered in a way to remove it, just make it less effective. They created practice vs Iway on the Battle Isle's even.
I think a lot of the skill changes will have to do with how Chapter 2 skills interact or starting to interact with Chapter 1 skills. I expect to see some strange skill balance that doesn't make any sense at 1st for this express reason.
I think a lot of the skill changes will have to do with how Chapter 2 skills interact or starting to interact with Chapter 1 skills. I expect to see some strange skill balance that doesn't make any sense at 1st for this express reason.
twicky_kid
Quote:
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Originally Posted by EternalTempest
I think Iway will get tweaked but not get altered in a way to remove it, just make it less effective. They created practice vs Iway on the Battle Isle's even.
I think a lot of the skill changes will have to do with how Chapter 2 skills interact or starting to interact with Chapter 1 skills. I expect to see some strange skill balance that doesn't make any sense at 1st for this express reason. |
I see some ritualist skills that are completely crazy. Compare vengeful weapon to the vengeful elite. VW is completely insane. Its very spamable and will keep rangers and warriors from being able to do anything with very little cordination.
How about recuperation. Lets give the entire party mending for oh I don't clost to 40 seconds.
In the current environment those skills will walk all over you.
I expect to see a major change in the pet AI. Hopefully a command window since you know you are the MASTER and all.
floplag
im new .. so maybe i havent seen these things as much as others as ive only been playing a couple months and dont really PvP much ... but, it seems to me that almost any spell, with a couple exceptions ... can be overpowering if the opposing build isnt right.
i think too many people get comfy in thier builds and dont want to make the adjustments to try and stop it ... and you certainly cant carry everything. this is one feature i like as opposed to WoW .. you have to actually think about your build
im sure there are a few needed adjustments ... some should go up, and others down ... but ithink the key here is the word "slightly" .. or "adjusted" ... not "nerfed"
if your going to nerf something, take it out of the game entirely if its going to be worthless after the fact. they've taken out alot of things since the beginning that people like me never got to see as we were late to the party that already give people that have played longer and advantage in many ways (HoD sword anyone)
i guess what im trying to say is think more, bitch less, and please dont go crazy on nberfing stuff.. make subtle adjustments
i think too many people get comfy in thier builds and dont want to make the adjustments to try and stop it ... and you certainly cant carry everything. this is one feature i like as opposed to WoW .. you have to actually think about your build
im sure there are a few needed adjustments ... some should go up, and others down ... but ithink the key here is the word "slightly" .. or "adjusted" ... not "nerfed"
if your going to nerf something, take it out of the game entirely if its going to be worthless after the fact. they've taken out alot of things since the beginning that people like me never got to see as we were late to the party that already give people that have played longer and advantage in many ways (HoD sword anyone)
i guess what im trying to say is think more, bitch less, and please dont go crazy on nberfing stuff.. make subtle adjustments
Falcon213
Quote:
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Originally Posted by Rajamic
Reduce the effect of Deep Wound.
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Quote:
| Improved Energy management pretty much everywhere. Cut the Ether Prodigy damage in half and use that skill as the top-end benchmark. |
Numa Pompilius
I think everyone is missing one thing: the goal of these periodic "adjustments" isn't just to make sure that there aren't buggy/unbalanced skills, but also to shake up the metagame. Shaking things up occasionally maintains diversity (that line of thinking even has a name, it's the "intermediate disturbance theory" 
).
Also some skills will no doubt be balanced for no apparent reason - because ANet has found issues with new skills to be introduced with factions.
). Also some skills will no doubt be balanced for no apparent reason - because ANet has found issues with new skills to be introduced with factions.
Mysterial
Quote:
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Originally Posted by Falcon213
Why do this? Boon prot monks spam mend ailment, and even with covers can get rid of it often enough for it to have no effect. Or just bring a martyr mesmer. Your choice.
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Moltov joss
Quote:
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Originally Posted by Valdaran Longfoot
I don't want to say much on what is and what is not balanced, but my thought personally is Spitefull Sprit.
Though I would not bet on it, it could be anything. I am interested to see what they do change though. |
twicky_kid
Quote:
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Originally Posted by Moltov joss
I think that is a reasonable assumption. However with the AOE nerf people turned to playing necromancers for Spiteful spirit as it is a skill that will deal damage to a group of enemies. It's funny to see so many necros running around now, and very few elementalists unfortunately.
|
Only farmers use SS. Which seems to be the majority of the pve community.
I dought they change the skill itself. Just add more hex removal to balance out its usage.
Carinae
Do people actually think Spiteful is unbalanced?
It seems to me that SS is exactly right where it needs to be in regards to damage, recharge and energy. It's an Elite warrior-hate hex.
I see a lot of Warriors calling for it's nerfing, which makes sense. But SS is one of the primary anti-warrior hexes. If the HoD helm wasn't around, SS would be THE counter to IWAY, and the fact that the helm nullifies SS is the biggest reason IWAY has survived this long. Without the helm, SS would have forced IWAY to become a little more balanced.
I see the HoD helm going away and hexes, in general, making a huge comeback. They might make some tweaks to SS on the PvE side (ie: AI's now recongize SS AoE damage) but I just don't see SS as a problem.
I'm interested in other peoples thoughts.
It seems to me that SS is exactly right where it needs to be in regards to damage, recharge and energy. It's an Elite warrior-hate hex.
I see a lot of Warriors calling for it's nerfing, which makes sense. But SS is one of the primary anti-warrior hexes. If the HoD helm wasn't around, SS would be THE counter to IWAY, and the fact that the helm nullifies SS is the biggest reason IWAY has survived this long. Without the helm, SS would have forced IWAY to become a little more balanced.
I see the HoD helm going away and hexes, in general, making a huge comeback. They might make some tweaks to SS on the PvE side (ie: AI's now recongize SS AoE damage) but I just don't see SS as a problem.
I'm interested in other peoples thoughts.
twicky_kid
Don't think HOD helm as anything do with IWAY vs SS. The players got smart enough to know not to attack through it. Reductions are only a 20%. So that 15 sec SS now last a 12. That is not game breaking. Besides no one puts SS on a warrior. Its cast on their pets because they never stop attacking and no way to remove it.
SS is fine the way it is. Just add more hex removal in pve. There is tons of enchantment removal but hardly any hex removal.
SS is fine the way it is. Just add more hex removal in pve. There is tons of enchantment removal but hardly any hex removal.
Carinae
I thought the HoD helm was a 50% reduction to hex duration.
EDIT: Why can't you remove hexes from pets?
EDIT: Why can't you remove hexes from pets?
twicky_kid
Quote:
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Originally Posted by Carinae Dragonblood
I thought the HoD helm was a 50% reduction to hex duration.
EDIT: Why can't you remove hexes from pets? |
The necros are never close enough to use anything on them. Most of the time they don't pay attention to pets at all in the first place so it goes unoticed.
Kate Bloodspirit
Quote:
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Originally Posted by Akathrielah
Warrior : Tactics line just plain needs work
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sun is in us
Quote:
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And so on and so on. Things shouldn't be nerfed just because most people use them. THat's wrong. |
They have got really a one-track mind, and all the reasoning, logic, does not seem to really have any effect on it. But hey, they are welcome to their opinions. I certainly don't want to flame anyone personally, but I can't stand the attitude. It is my problem that I read the threads.....my bad. I am hopeful that ANET will continue with their design concept and are also of the same mind as the MAGIC designers.
Certain games of the Past, discussions about powers and their relationships in PVP are important to sound off on (COH....WOW....boy, COH designers just have no clue about PVP whatsoever), but, I am happy to let ANET drive this game, so far, they have been mostly dead on. So I will most likely feel comfortable with their decisions.
I am debating whether or not to just put all nerf posters on ignore so I won't get sucked in anymore....they get me fearful that their influence will ruin a game I understand (the whole game is based on skills and skill counters) and enjoy playing....so maybe that is just the best thing for me to do personally. I don't want to ruin their fun making "Nerf This" threads and I don't want them to ruin mine either. And I know, Just because I stress counters to skills and not nerfing, I will get flamed...so I should just go the ignore route.
Peace.
zoozoc
I really hope they will buff skills instead of nerfing the only good skills.(like cripple shot, though a long recharge is probably in order) What they really need to get away from is warriors are the only high dps metagame. Which is true, especially for eles who are only good as a supportive role. Please instead of nerfing the only good skills, simply buff the other skills up to their lvl. I alos think that having rez sig rez with 50% health and 50% energy or something to that effect will also help with the warrior being overpowered. It would mena that any class besides the warrior and ranger could be rezzed effectivly instead of being useless until their energy recharges.
Bio-Flame
Quote:
| COH designers just have no clue about PVP whatsoever) |
Lol....yeah. They not only didn't have a clue but also thought that their customers were all retarded and wouldn't see through their so-called "explanations" (=lies).
Anyway, Sun-is-in-Us, Magic the Gathering designers also lost it in the end. They started the nerf path and once you started it's very very hard to stop it. It's a snowball really and that's why I am afraid with the "balancing"in GWs.
Thing is usually the Devs will start with good intentions and will balance things out. The real problem is that once that path is taken people will cry more and more for nerfs to resolve their problems rather than thinking how to resolve them by themselves.
That's the issue.
What happens is that you nerf the best skill...then the second best skill starts being used "too much"...and it also gets nerfed. Then the third best skill....and so on and so on.
Once you open that door.... there's usually no turning back.
In the end you'll have a game that's only vaguely similar to the original game, power-wise that is.
It's like playing CS and nerfing the AK47... then obviously the M4 will be used too much and it'll also be nerfed. Then the sniper...and so on and so on. In the end, everyone will be playing with pistols. And even those will be nerfed so that leaves us the knives. LOL.
All in all, you'll end up with a game a lot different than the original game.
Tuoba Hturt Eht
Deep Wound is fine the way it is, no additional adjustments is required.
In fact, all conditions are fine.
If you don't like conditions, bring condition removal skills.
In fact, all conditions are fine.
If you don't like conditions, bring condition removal skills.
twicky_kid
Quote:
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Originally Posted by Tuoba Hturt Eht
Deep Wound is fine the way it is, no additional adjustments is required.
In fact, all conditions are fine. If you don't like conditions, bring condition removal skills. |
There are only 4 skills in the game that can remove all conditions. 2 of them being elites. Draw conditions is nice but doesn't really remove anything. Purge condition's recharge is too long to even think of ever using it. Plague sig can only remove the conditions from yourself and has a long cast time. That leaves the only valid option martyr.
Conditions are too spammable to remove all the time. Even with martyr your party will be conditioned up again before it even recharges.
I'm still unclear about deep wound. I'd say wait on that one. Its by far the most powerful thing on the game. That goes without question. Is it too strong for the environment? I'm not too sure if it is.
Xero Silvam
Restore conditions is an conditons remover aswell. 
But it's only for OTHER ally, so you'd still need mend ailment/purge for yourself.
But it's only for OTHER ally, so you'd still need mend ailment/purge for yourself.
Eet GnomeSmasher
This thread is hilarious for the things people say that they want nerfed. I'll let you decide what I'm talking about. There really is very little that needs to be nerfed... and even then it's just so borderline that it's not a big deal.
I see more buffing than nerfing in ANET's plans. And for you people that are so quick to call nerf....try the skills first. Then try to put some thought in how to counter it...not just by skillsets but strategy too.
I see more buffing than nerfing in ANET's plans. And for you people that are so quick to call nerf....try the skills first. Then try to put some thought in how to counter it...not just by skillsets but strategy too.