What is Anet's objective for PVE ?

A-net is doomed if Zashien Challenge/Zashien Elite are the norm. They are a tough change of pace for PvPers, but not very interesting generally.

At the risk of repeating myself, I don't the PvEers should be forced to PvP ever. This would include any mission where another human player can kill you. There needs to be more high end content, so the game lasts a bit longer. The content needs to be meaningful. At the same time there needs to be more meaningful PvP, volume and variety need to increase and it needs to be incorperated into the story.

Factions has promised that doing certain PvE and PvP missions will unlock towns, cities and arenas/missions. If the PvE side of this is stupid or PvE light, then we will have an exodus of PvE players. If done correctly, this will mean that a PvE guild will choose missions based on what the alliance needs and there will be more objectives within the mission.

In "Thom Wars", instead of a linear progression of missions which you return to randomly on a whim, you would have a reason to go back to a certain mission on a certain day. Our sister PvP guild is seiging the city? We will kill the PvE reinforcements and supply trains in the surrounding country side...scoring depends on how many of the 15 objectives we accomplish. Next day we hold the city, so while the PvPers are defending the walls, we are now questing in the new PvE sewers we unlocked. If we failed our alliance moves on to another town where the PvEers must defend the passes of a mountainous region against the hordes of Undead... that is "Thom Wars".

Now I feel like John's "Imagine" should start playing in the background. "Imagine there's no Underworld, its easy if you try. No Fissure below us above us a night sky! Imagine all the PvEers playing for today... I hope someday you'll join us and the world will play as one!". I know that hardcore PvPers won't go for that, but not all PvPers are ladder/rank obsessed. I also know that hardcore RPGers won't like the increased structure, but some PvEers will enjoy meaningful structure (guild leadership, objectives, alliances).

In other news: I would buy Factions for the skills only; spent more on CCG expansions in the day. I'll be purchasing Oblivion at some point and I played some 100 hours on Morrowind.

Beautiful post Thom, and I sincerely hope that Factions turns out like that. I'm not into PvP, at least in GW. Give me BF2 for PvP.

If Factions force-feeds me a bunch of PvP-style play, then I know I will be done. Hope it never happens.

Im a 60% pve and 40% pvp guy, right now im using my warrior while farming to get money and exp to unlock skills wihotut using my faction, i also use my pve cahr for pvp anyway, i think beeing able to play both at the same time is what anet intended

*claps like crazy at thoms post*

Finally! someone that sees something like both sides 0.o

however, its not just missions where you pay agains another real world player that are pvp style...thirsy river is a PvP PvE mission....and it is forced down our throats for us to progress....
any mission where sucseeding groups in a small area attack, be t in single or group sets like that is too much like pvp for most of us.....
waves and waves of mobs, sure, i get that....sneaky lill buggers that pop up outa nowhere, i can dig it, but forcing me to get into a small map and fight first one, then two and finally three groups of critters that fight *together*...and all this to get accended...no thanks....

the only pvp i actually enjoy is the snowball arena....
if they had more of that, tweeked to be non seasonal and just snowy, i am SURE here would be more PvE type players trying PvP with that in place.
its fun, and you dont realy feel like you *have* to win..or that your a bag of flaming dogmess if your the one that accidentallly looses the team the match..its all good fun and not *serious*....
which is some of the reason that PvP turns some of us off....

hm.....how to better things....well,theres the random critter thing, as fols sugest...but i would say, NO to the making things always harder/smarter....
the higher the level of critters around, the fewer there should be sometimes....its not realy fair to make them run like buggery from ele's, when they (anet) keep upping the amounts in some areas just cause they dont want botfarmers-r-us to make cash....
nor is it realy fair ether to tweek stuff because in PvP it is being abused, where in PvE, its a stapel of keeping your head and not dying....

it would be much fairer to simply fix it ONLY in PvP, by fixing it in code In the Arenas themselves....it can be done, i say....!
(which would make PvE more fun, allow anyone to have any build or combination they wanted to be ect)

and to help fix the farmer-bot prob..well, i know its not the best way, but just have a a-net *licenced* trade site....
i will trade you a wad of in game cash, for a nice green item...
and you have to regester, and they charge you a *small* sum for allowing you to trade stuff *legally*

sure, some folks will still pay real world cash for gold/items on e-buy sites, but the majority of players would rather do things the leagal way, im sure...

I think past interviews/articles seemed to indicate that nobody would be forced into doing PvP.

Currently the only place where you're forced to do any PvP is the little arena battle before post searing and that's not really that big a deal.

My concern is the Alliance territory thing - not too sure I'm fond of the whole "PvE'ers need to rely on PvP'ers winning" to have access to their part of the game. Current favour system being the prime/only example...

i could not have said that better myself because that is exactly the way i am!

The Gamespot article (front page on Guru has link) seems to confirm a worry of mine. PvE'ers are going to be waiting on PvP'ers to unlock "elite" missions and content for the PvE'ers to play in. So, if your guild plans on a Friday night mission and the servers redraw the battle lines; thus losing access to that mission... you're SoL. At that time I guess it's more farming, log and play something else or sit and look cute.
Since the article claims battle lines are drawn daily, nothing you can do at that point in time to continue on.
Return next day? Yea, if everyone is available...
This, IMO, will not work very well... and I am hopeful I misread the article (though I read it twice).

I'm rather disapointed in this and am reconsidering the purchase of Factions after reading that. Such a bummer... can anyone correct me if I am not understanding that article correctly... please?

A load of crap ? Excuse me ? I mentioned very clearly that I bought the game for competition, therefore the post was entirely my personal opinion. Even if I did write what you claim I wrote, that still doesnt give you license to insult me.

Edit: When I say "Wow" I'm expressing surprise, not being sarcastic.

1. links arent that hard to cut and paste, next time linksplzkthxbye:
http://www.gamespot.com/pc/rpg/guild...54&mode=recent

2. funny typo in that article, "rituatalist"..

3. relevant quote from the article:
"There are faction battles, which are large-scale PVP battles that determine the strategic situation on the map. Once a day, the Guild Wars servers will calculate the results of all the faction battles for that day and then redraw the "front lines" on the map to show which side is winning or losing. You'll want to be a part of these wars, because if your guild alliance can gain control of a city, you'll have access to special events, such as parades, and to certain parts of the city that no one other than your alliance can enter, which will unlock the new elite missions that offer substantial rewards. The elite missions are geared toward the role players out there, because these are cooperative missions where you'll have to pursue a quest, not battle other players. Put this system together, and you have a way for PVP fans and role players to work together for the betterment of their respective guilds."

I dunno, i could envision a situation where the PVP'ers haven't gained control of a section so the pure PVE'ers are stuck without access to a quest for a while, but really, that would seem to say "don't just play one side of the game, play both!" If you're stuck on the PVE side and want access to a particular quest, go make a PVP char and try to push the Faction battle forward for your side so you can get access to the quest. Don't just rely on others (whom you appear to despise) to do things for you.

Seems to me like it's about mixing the two crowds, and bringing them out of the "I R PVE, I HATE PVP" and "I R PVP, PVE R TEH LOSARS LOLOLOL" mentalities and making it one crowd, the "We love Guild Wars!" crowd...

A little competition won't kill ya (for long), and neither will working to get the things you want...

eudas

The redraw will work like clockwork. Every day at the same time you get your access so you can plan your events for that day. You won't know a week ahead of time what will be open, but I am sure you will have access to desired areas fairly regularly (much like favor is a fairly regular occurance).

I was at a library and in a hurry when I posted. The tabbed browser wouldn't bring up the index on guru so I could get a link. Now that you know why, not that I cared if you knew why or not, we can go on. sorry

I find, and many others, PvP boring. I log into a game to have fun. If I do not find PvP fun, why would I want to play. If that's what is needed to progress my character, then I have "finished" the character. With no characters left, as I sit and wait for PvP to "win"... I leave. It's pretty simple actually.

Here's an idea though, lets lock all PvP areas, high end ones, untill a PvE group completes a Mission or Quest 4 times in a row. Then for an hour or two, PvPers have access to the content they want to play. After that, PvE must do it again.

In this, we can now hear some players cry "OMG I HATE PVE!!!11!!!1111 THE GRIND IS SO BORING!!!1111!!! I'M TOO 1337 TO PLAY PVE AND I HAVE RANK 3!!!!11111" and now we can all say together "We love Guild Wars!"

Just a thought...

edit: can't spell /sigh

So on Wednesday we could plan on a mission or quest for Friday? Most of the guild (ones that are most interested in Factions) meet every other day. We don't bother with FoW or UW because of the "iffy" nature of it... we may or may not have favor.
If it is true though, theat we have to rely on PvP to unlock missions and quests, perhaps this can be answered:

Do the areas that are locked (or needing unlocked) contain skills (elite or otherwise) or story line related missions which are required to complete the games campaign?

I have said there is stuff that pve players would like to have. the stuff pve players want would stay on the pve side only. these stuff could be any wheres from being mounts, dragons pets, very powerful or cursed weapons.Such things could be use in pve only, and not in pvp. whY beacause we all know it would unblance pvp game. but there is alot pvp players who say pve players should not have it period, Go figure on that one. Some of the pvp players don't even pve. LOL

Anet said guilds and alliances won't gain a large advantage form holding areas, so I doubt there will be any significant unlocks outside of generally accessable areas. Most of what you unlock would likely fall into the catagory of end game content (which is what prophecies lacked).

I don't have the details here, but you can piece together that much from published articles.

ok, no seriously big deal, just saying links are nicer than no links. you had a good reason, so that's acceptable.

well, see, in this above quote i think you're mostly missing my point. i think they see the potential for the fractured userbase, and are trying to unite it into one userbase again, but with a quote like that you're just kind of stamping your foot and saying "but i don't WANNA play with those kids!" :/

i mean, i understand how you play a game for enjoyment, and don't want to play the parts that aren't fun for you, but there's more than just you involved here. if the userbase stays fragmented and only gets *more* fragmented, eventually one of those two userbase groups is going to just... leave. and then they have half (or less) of the players they did before, and that's bad for the game, and bad for profit. it's bad for the game, as they slowly ruin it trying to please two disparate groups who will never be pleased by the same product, and it's bad for profit, as those who leave not only stop playing but also don't buy expansions/sequels.

so, hopefully, you see why uniting the userbase is a good thing for both players and the company, and a little compromise on mixing pve and pvp goes a long way.

eudas

I always have had this one question when going into post will we return to a rebuilt Ascalon like it was in pre but not exactly.Then the second is will we go up north to finally fight the charr and maybe the guild wars will start all over agian in Tyria.

I agree 100%

Ooops, there was supposed to be a /sarcasm at the end of that. My Bad...

See that corner over there? Yea, I'm gonna go sit in it /blush

Seriously though, any one side having to rely on the other for access to content, end game or not, is kinda lame. I mean, really... if I log on to play and can't access what I'm after, I'll log and go do something else. This happens a few times, I will, and others probably will as well, lose interest in the game as a whole. I have no interest in FoW and UW for this reason.
On the issue of balance that keeps coming up, the game as general keeps getting so unbalanced in terms of the PvE and PvP side of things, it makes me laugh. Mounts, cursed weapons (etc) mentioned above will never happen due to PvP balancing. I can live with that. What I have a hard time swallowing is the fact PvE'ers have to rely on the other side to play the game we want to play.

I disagree completely with the PvE and PvP merger. Anyone play Asheron's Call 2? They tried that. It didn't work. Shadowsbane? Yea, that didn't work either. Course, Shadowsbane was 100% PvPRPG, but it failed - the two just don't mix well. Oil and Water was used once in here, and it's true. Forcing one side to do the other ticks them off, and having either side rely or wait on the other will do the same.

Anyway, my post was all speculation asking for a confirmation or a "shoot-down" of a fear of mine. I think the concern has been validated though. I'll play the game and I'm sure I'll enjoy it till I'm locked out of content and then end up leaving. I hope it doesn't come to that, but if the scenario takes place, I know I will. Not out of rage (I love the game), but out of boredom... I don't even sit still for five minutes saying "lfg" - if in five minutes I can't find a group, it's henchie time. - So I'm sure not gonna sit and wait for a territory to unlock to play... Yea, I'm impatient...

What makes PvE fun for the stock 100% PvE players? World exploration, loot, helping newbs (twink! twink! twink!) and killing stuff.

What makes PvP fun for the stock PvP players? Winning against another team; trying new builds to see how they work, or fighting different builds and learning counters. Oh yeah; and killing stuff.

Now, I like some parts of PvP. I don't want them to take that away. Anet won't; the game was originally geared toward PvP. But I like PvE more and I want more stuff in PvE. Anet, when they put in SF, did so with the admission that they were surprised by how large the PvE fanbase was, that they had never expected GWP to gain popularity with the MMORPGers.

does anyone here actually think that, after they make an admission like that, that Anet is going to try forcing people to PvP? Its been said several times in this thread: you don't force people to play this game; you force them to play a different game. And, now that Guild Wars has opened the floodgates on Free to Play RPGs, they've created a monster no one can control. What are those five, ten fifteen, seventy F2P games that have been thrown out on this thread stating that, if GWF goes too PvP or too PvE, everyone is going to schism to a new series? Alienate 1 side or the other, Anet loses money. I don't see them doing that. Instead, what I understand from that article is that GWF is going to try making the game more Guild oriented. PvEers cringe at that, used to solo farms...

You've forgotten about EQ raids. Large groups of sometimes several guilds pulling together for a common goal; kill the uber boss and get the godly goodies!

Now, with GWF, we're seeing the first vestiges of such. Multiple guilds, with different play styles, banding together toward a common goal. PvP guilds banding (or if you preffer, obliviously huddling) together becomes a waste of time since they have less interest in the "mind numbing" farms that PvEers have come to enjoy. PvE guilds, by proxy, will need strong PvP characters so they can go out, get oodles of plat and greens, before returning to give a share of the spoils to their PvP commrades who are busy planning the next seige.

People are looking at this and saying 'Oh no! I have to do something I don't want to!"

I look at this and say "Hmm. With the right guilds, you could actually start having fun in groups."

Can't we all just agree that killing stuff is fun?

Ummm guys does anyone read the FAQ anymore?

http://www.guildwars.com/aboutgw/faq...ctions-faq.php

PvE stuff


PvP Stuff

As you can see a mix of PvP and PvE guild in an alliance will greatly reward all members (I think).

Go to here and make friends with a PvP guild http://www.guildwarsguru.com/forum/s...d.php?t=122434

My take on it:
ArenaNet have created, what they believe, is the greatest game ever. They have a vision for the game, and they're determined to see it through. This is both a good and a bad thing, depending if you agree on that vision.

That vision, is the idea of a competitive-RPG that mixes team-based PvP AND PvE into one seamless experience.

ArenaNet are not going to change that vision. Solo farmers, you know, just arn't going to find the content in Factions that they have in GW:P. Sorry. It's true. This is not the game for you. Most of the focus, is going to be on coming up with better builds for the PvE missions to obtain better scores to climb up the ranking ladder. While it's true, there will be bonuses given based on the results of PvP play, it's just to give it a bit more flavour, and to be honest, to push you out of the same zone day in, day out.

If you don't like it being competitive. This is probably not the game for you. They are going in a certain direction, for right or for wrong. And they obviously believe strongly in that direction. We'll see what the results are. On a personal note, I do agree with that direction.

Loved EQ, left cause of the endless "LFG" that went with it. If the guildies weren't on, it was LFG time. Which brings us back to this, guildies are on, territory not gained, what then?

So, are you saying we should all join huge guilds? Not interested in joining a new guild, I rather like mine. Besides, most of the things I say here, are a representation of a topic or conversation we have had... speaking to a guildie now on Vent as I type this, for example.

Yea, so why limit it the way they seem to have? If it is indeed non-mission or main line mission stuff that is locked, I could care less. If it is main line missions or skills I'm being locked out of, then I do care. Why? Cause, I love this game. It's great and I don't want to be forced out the door via a boredom key (PvP is borring to me, waiting around for areas to unlock is boring to me... killing stuff is fun)... that's all I'm saying.

It seems though, that my assumption is correct. I think I will cancel the pre-order and wait till others can confirm the details to me, and then make my choice.

Till then, happy gaming all

There got to be fow or UW anet is still not done the other godly realms. There is still 3 gods realms they have not done. I am sure anet will add a temple of ages. However how will that all connect.


your still missing

dwayna

melandru

lyssa

right there is only

Balthazar wich is fow

Grenth wich is UW

Same thing you do now; its PUGs or solo.

If you've read the FAQ (thanks for the link Guardian) you'd know that you don't have to disband your guild to join an new one. Guilds are going to be making alliances; giving your entire guild the option to ally with another guild that is more suited to doing the things that you don't want to, and vica versa. Your weaknesses become their strengths, and theirs yours. Because you can ally with more than one guild, you also can bolster the number of competitent players you need for your PvE missions by allying with other PvE guilds. Its like trippling your friends list without all the typing.

You call it limitations. I call it content for both PvP and PvE. Do you farm UW? There are certain times of day that you can't because your country of origin doesn't have control of the Hall.

From my chair, Anet has just made a few more UWs. There will still be plenty of places to farm, plenty of missions to do (only now, there will be a reason for upper level players to do some of them beyond helping guildies) and doubtless will have no effect on playing through the core story line.

You say you'd care less. After beating the game enough times, come say that again. End game content is lacking in Guild Wars, and I think this is Anets attempt at a solution.

No, I don't farm UW, can't be bothered with the planning of it. It's the same situation, guildies meet, no favor (UW locked) we go do something else. This happened, maybe three or four times and we gave up on bothering with it. Since I don't run a 55 anything, this end game content requires me to group. I can't stand the current PuG must have builds, but that's another topic.

If this is the case, then that is wonderful, seriously. I don't mind that cause I don't need it to finish the game (story line anyway).

What I meant was, getting more content which "allows" us to stand around and wait. This means, we have UW, FoW and now, more content to stand around and wait for. It's just like LDoN in EQ, players get to sit around for 10 minutes to an hour LFG, get an hour to play, then repeat. Actual play time is cut in half thanks to the design. This was a major reason I stopped playing EQ.
SF is great, you can go there and play the many quests as you want, when you want. It doesn't need to be unlocked which means you don't need to stand around waiting. Why couldn't Anet just do that? They could have even made it like a pre-searing situation; certain missions change the game world. You complete mission X for faction X and the borders are drawn giving you access to quests and missions in that area. Make a tier like system, giving you more and more as you go. Go back and change factions and you begin back at tier one again with the new faction. This way, the content is "unlockable" by the PvE players giving them control of what they are trying to access; thus not having to stand around and wait. Yea, players could go PvP, but if they don't enjoy it, why should they have too?
It's cool though, like I said, I'll wait and see what comes about. If friends confirm good things, then I'll go back and buy it. If they confirm bad, then I can say I did enjoy it while it lasted. As it is now, it seems Anet is taking the game in a direction I don't like (and there are those that do like it, which is great). I've already canceled my pre-order and will go from there - no rage, no hard feelings, just not going to buy a game that I end of being bored in.

The problem is that rpg players are non competitive by nature. All they want is to explore the world and find nice goodies. PvP and PvE players have a very differend kind of view on the usage of skills. For PvP players its a MUST to find out the best ways to combine skills in a team. For PvE players its only an option, one they often neglect in adventuring, making them pugs in teambased missions. Bringing those 2 groups together is asking for troubles...

Maybe. It would mean many players would leave. But a very dedicated group would probably stay for years. You are right, the decission is up to Arenanet.

I feel there is no real rpg in this game. There is no story to the game. I really don't feel like my charactor is part of the world. I can't play my favrite charactor in groups. In fact my charactor is useless. Anet keeps nerfing my skills. I have people telling me what skills I should take in pve. I have people inRED ENGINE GORED ENGINE GORED ENGINE GORED ENGINE GOing me in pve. The quest and mossion is mindless, no thinking in the what so ever.There is very little lore in the game. It doesn't feel like a world. I have tryed pvp it is boring, I my charactor i choose to play with sucks at pvp. ( Elemental fire) it use to be fun in beta I can't even farm my favrite spots no more. I have to wait on my guild to farm now in favite farming spots, because no groups want to take my charactor in.

how is fractions going to make things fun rpg players when you are going to have pvp players trying to force skills to pve players that don't want to take them.

I personly think If fractions is not any better, this will be my my last time buying a game from anet.

The more that gets released about Factions, the less I honestly think about it. We were told no forcing PvP on PvE players. It seems, what was really meant, was no forced player killing. What do I mean?

PK, or player killing is either opt in or opt out. Opt in situations are similar to HoH, Death Matches, or any style where a player or group of players tries to take the other team out. Opt out PK is when some putz ganks a player not wishing to play any PvP at all, this is not currently in GW, thanksfully

PvE is of course the role players, or role players lite (as the case is here) play style. They put together characters to simply have fun with and join friends in quests and missions at a leisure rate. There are those who like to rush and push through the game, but largely, just play as is. There is no players vs player situations in the PvE mind set, it's all coop.

PvP is the opposite of the PvE players. Competition drives the PvP players, rewards are different and from what I hear, there's a rush when one wins. PvP can come in many forms; death match, ctf, last man standing, domination, conquer and hold, or in GWs, GvG, HoH and more.

Now enter Factions:

The PvE side is litterally locked out of content unless they opt in to PvP. Note, I said PvP, not PK. These competitive missions and quests seem to be similar to last man standing, domination, or simple defend missions. Mobs are the killable foes in these missions, but you are pitted against another player group for either time, score or last team standing. It is, simply put, a spin on PvP.
This removes the leisure time of playing the game and pushes it into a Quakefest of fast action gaming.
So, whether or not to purchase the game is up to the consumer, I wish Anet had been a little more forthcoming on the content. The details were always sketchy at best and I was constantly wondering what it all meant. Now that information is out there, Factions is, IMO, pushing the casual/leisure players away in favor of the more PvP oriented crowd. This means to me, a similar future for the game as that of Shadowsbane and Asheron's Call 2. Both of which tried to push or spin PvP into the PvE (role players) play style.
Call me old school for not wanting that type of play style, but I'll not be buying Factions and have alreay canceled my pre-order. I will continue to play GW though and hope for better come Chapter 3.

Thanks

You can complain about lack of lore and an un inventive story (I get that), but complaints about the fundamental mechanics is kind of silly. The game is a cooperative game, so if a certain area requires you to play a certain role on the team, the nature of the game is to comply or take henchies and solo. The game is designed for team play although 90% of areas are doable with henchies.

These two things don't make sense: my skills were all nerfed and no one liked my skills. Nerfed skills are the result of high useage, so whoever was upset with them was probably a noob (or you were playing them poorly). Every primary profession has a role on PvP with the right secondary and you can always switch secondaries and get the 5 or so needed skills to PvP with your favorite character. There is much room for creativity in guild wars, but there are also essential roles and totally infeasible builds. Understanding guildwars strategy can be like understanding soccer strategy, to an outsider Brazil seems to play just like England but anyone who vaguely knows the game would find that suggestion laugable. (or you can think of the Colts offense vs the Steelers offense)

Quests generally suck in most games, but I recall a few which were amusing or difficult. Underworld quests would be fun if you hadn't done them 50 times. While I'd love to see the completion of the Godly realms, that was tested late in production and I don't know when or if we will see the remaining three.

While RPGing elements could be improved, you can have a structured RPG that limits certain feasibilities. If you think about it from a role-playing point of view, many of the major PVP build types make sense. IWAY=crazy beserkers supported my dark priests who increase their frenzy. Ranger spike: A group of excellent archers with deadly accuracy supported by their chaplains and medics. WM split is a guerrilla type attack. Balance is what it should be a party with a few warrior and healers with the support of a few various mages. I feel that factions will be a great environment for structured roleplaying, but in a team game there is only so much room for loners. I guess there could be two philosophies of roleplaying: open-fantasy (life is so tough I want complete freedom in my game), simulation (how can we accurately recreated an alternative reality). The second will inevidably impede on the first and guild wars is more of a simulation than an open fantasy.

Was A Guest:
Preview event. Try it out. I agree with much of your criticism, but I lean PvP so I'm likely the winner. As stated in previous posts, making PvEers play "mini-games" won't win them customers. There are ways to do this which will keep a pve pace and feel while having global implications.

here I want you to make mesmer or elemental prime and try get in to a team lets sf or tombs.

Then tell me how much i am part of a team. How can i be a part of a team when I am not even be in a team!


for pvp trying playing a total fire class in tombs and see how meny people take you.

You can lead a horse to water but you can't make it drink. Likewise you can tell a PvE player that they will have to at least take an interest in PvP or participate in PvP for the full content of the game but you won't make them like it. I see this whole thing as creating more bad blood between the two very distinct groups this game caters to. Now it's going to be PvE people complaining because PvP hasn't won something to unlock the mission they want to do. Or they will complain that they have to PvP to get to the missions they want to do. Substantial rewards or not this is still a bad idea. What it boils down to is that PvE players who only enjoy that part of the game will now be forced to at least take a mild interest in PvP if they want to get anywhere at all in the game and I think a lot of people are going to resent that. I know I could care less about the PvP aspect of the game. I like the PvE better. I don't care how big the carrot you dangle in front of me is I'm still not going to care about PvP and it's just going to piss me off when I need to do one of these elite quests to finish out a build or something and I can't or I have to participate in a part of the game I do not like in order to get further along in the part I do like. It seems to me they are pushing the PvP aspect too much and trying to force those of us who have rarely if ever stepped into an arena into participating in that aspect in an underhanded way. It's like saying." Oh well you don't have to participate but you won't have this nice weapon or this piece of armor or this elite skill." They are trying to bait us and for those of us smart enough to realize it it's insulting.

I am going to take a wait and see attitude and see how it actually plays instead of just drawing my own conclusions based on the quote from a magazine. Still if it plays out like I think it will I predict a massive fall out from it. This could be the dreaded Sophomore Slump that so many great games experience when they try to follow up their openinig entry into the video game world. Gamers are a tough audience and a damned fickle crowd and I can only hope that Arena Net knows what they are doing with this one.

What do you really mean because it doesn't make sense.

So um...why is this relevant if its not in GW?

IF you count the Ai as a player then yes it is in a sense PvP.

Not much different if you ask me. ITs just that instead of an Ai, there are real people behind the enemies.

Where did you read that? There wasn't any mentioning that PvE players were FORCED to PvP. HOWEVER, there was a mentioning that PvE players would have to Cooperate with PvP players to keep territory by playing PvE MISSIONS. There was NO mentioning that PvE players were forced into PvP.

OF you don't understand it, let me elaborate:

From what I read and learned about Factions is that BOTH aspects of the game will affect eachother. Say, if a PvP group captured a town, then the lines are drawn. If you are not apart of that particular Faction then you might have a hard time getting to the resources available at the time.

Which means that you would have to align yourself with a faction inorder to get what you need. Now what is NOT known is whether or not a player can go Neutral. ALSO PvP players would have to ALSO rely on PvE players in their faction to finish certian quests or missions in order for them to advance or keep territory.

IT might seem like its forcing PvP on players, but its all an elaborate system to get the alienated aspects of the game to interact with eachother and enhance the game.

There is alot of information. You probabaly didn't read all of it.

Once again. NO. ITs just forcing them to interact with eachother. In Factions both PvE and PvP players will have to get along for a common goal.

You'll be back....they always come back.

I can tell there is alot people in here who don't under stand what rpg is. Talking about a bait stick why did they put a oerge nife in the game when it is not going to be use? here just add more greens the rpg players will love that!

Dreamhunk if you're looking for a roleplaying game proper, Guild Wars is not for you. It is basically a fantasy action game (coop PvE currently or PvP). There may be a few people around looking to rp but the vast majority of this game is simply not that way.

Neverwinter Nights might be more your cup of tea, it's getting on a bit but there are plenty of servers dedicated to roleplaying there.

Edit: that said you could try also posting in the "Lyssa" section of the forum, there's a thread in there about rp'ers wanting to band together.

then tell anet to take rpg off the box! rgp player are different than pvp players.
I can see alot people getting upset if the next game in not up to par.

listen up because what is going to make or break anet is the money factor! Anet has fans you dispoint them. Your not going to have a game!

I'd say the vast majority of players who've stuck with the game do so because they like it being an action game really (think Diablo, another game which can't really be called a true rpg) so if Anet continues, which it looks like they will, the majority won't be disappointed.

The "rpg" term is attached because in the loosest sense you play "as" characters. Albeit all they do most of the time is kill things and are almost never "in character" Oh dear, I played too much NWN rp servers lol...

If anet has the same views as you do. i am sure this Gw will not last to long. I can see a back lash coming.

Show me where the acronym "RPG" shows up on the box? Because its not anywhere on my copy.

it is on their web site, I have the beta box and says RPG on it!

RPG mean role playing game! Not payer vs player!

Loosely translated: action game. With pointy hats.