Ok, I tried to search for the info, but the search function is broken...again.
Why do existing GW players get only 2 char slots when they purchase Factions, but new users get 4 slots? I think this is unfair to punish loyal customers who have purchased both games.
Why only 2 char slots?
Spiderguard
Eugaet
Oh, dude, the pain, the pain. Please make it stop.
Look for a thread on (currently) the second page of the Factions forum called 'Six character slots confirmed'. Then read and realize there's nothing more to say on the matter except to wait for a response from ANet.
Look for a thread on (currently) the second page of the Factions forum called 'Six character slots confirmed'. Then read and realize there's nothing more to say on the matter except to wait for a response from ANet.
TheMosesPHD
If you can't find the 5000 topics on this already, you better try searching again. Don't you dare start up this crap again in a whole new thread. Can a mod plz close this thread?
JiggyFly
Here's the logic, and the reason why it's fair.
1 account for 1 version of the game = 4 slots
1 account for both versions = 6 slots
You bought the original as your first and got 4 slots, they'll buy the expansion as their first and get 4 slots. It's completely even end of story.
1 account for 1 version of the game = 4 slots
1 account for both versions = 6 slots
You bought the original as your first and got 4 slots, they'll buy the expansion as their first and get 4 slots. It's completely even end of story.
Spiderguard
TheMosesPHD chill out. I am sorry that I don't/can't go through every thread on this forum like yourself. You are better than me for beeing more, leet(or whatever you call yourself.
Also, get the search feature fixed.
Also, get the search feature fixed.
Spiderguard
BTW, thanks Eugaet & Jiggy for an intelligent response.
Buoyancy
Anet's reasoning is that having 6 characters with access to both chapters 1 and 2 is just as good as having 8 characters where four of them can only access one of the chapters. They accompany this with a lot of hand-waving and spin about how Factions is a stand alone product, and not an expansion, so they are doing you a favour by giving you the "privilege" of not having to re-level your PVE characters in Factions if you want to play one of the current 6 classes.
Spiderguard
Oh, ok i got ya. I am a PVE player, so I like to have the varity.
heavy metal rules
man, youl'd think that horse would be dead after repeated hits on the head,...man i just got off of work, working the graveyard shift and after reading the op, i need a beer and its only 7:04 am ....cheers..
Former Ruling
You are looking at it from 1 side.
You bought ch1 and got 4 slots...they bought ch2 and got 4 slots. Its still 6 slots if you merge ch1&2 accounts either way your going.
You bought ch1 and got 4 slots...they bought ch2 and got 4 slots. Its still 6 slots if you merge ch1&2 accounts either way your going.
xxSilhouette
I am going to be honest - why do we need more then two slots? There are two new professions, so that allows you to make one of each if you would like or two of the older ones you don't have but you like, Or 1 of each. At least they didn't give us just one new slot making us choose a ritualist or assasin.
frickett
4+4=8 for people who dont merge
4+4=6 for people who do merge.
4=4 for people who only own prophesies
4=4 for people who only own factions.
4+4=6 for people who do merge.
4=4 for people who only own prophesies
4=4 for people who only own factions.
BellyFlop
fiery
Chapter 1=4 Slots Chapter 2=4 Slots MERGED= Chapter 1 & Chapter 2 = 6 Slots total.
rollntider
and again if you dont merge accounts you dont get full content.
Regardless of your views we only get 6 slots merged or 4 if you don't merge.
Regardless of your views we only get 6 slots merged or 4 if you don't merge.
crimsonfilms
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| Anet's reasoning |
They are trying to sell you marketing logic (aka "we can get more money this way").
striderkaaru
i say keep this thread open, as it is a different topic. that other thread is filled with people arguing over the issue of 6 versus 8 slots, while this is addressing the issue of why you "lose" two slots when you merge.
the thing that most people are missing is that they are only looking at it in terms of the slots and not the actual access to game content that those slots have.
put it this way. each campaign currently makes up half of the total game. with prophecies, you have 4 characters with access to half of the game (4 X 0.5 = 2). when you buy factions as a stand-alone, you get 4 more characters with access to only the second half of the game (4 x 0.5 = 2). So, separately, you get the equivalent of 4 full accesses.
however, when you merge, you get 6 slots with access to the ENTIRE game (6 x 1 = 6). you get 6 full accesses.
so, in terms of the math, merging will yield more. this is also not mentioning that anything you have unlocked in prophecies will already be unlocked for you, while you will have to start all over again if you keep your cantha account separate.
so, you have to look at it in temrs of what you can do with the character slots, and not just how many you have. and those who are complaining aren't taking this into account. you are not being "punished" for merging. as a matter of fact, you are getting MORE for being a loyal player.
the thing that most people are missing is that they are only looking at it in terms of the slots and not the actual access to game content that those slots have.
put it this way. each campaign currently makes up half of the total game. with prophecies, you have 4 characters with access to half of the game (4 X 0.5 = 2). when you buy factions as a stand-alone, you get 4 more characters with access to only the second half of the game (4 x 0.5 = 2). So, separately, you get the equivalent of 4 full accesses.
however, when you merge, you get 6 slots with access to the ENTIRE game (6 x 1 = 6). you get 6 full accesses.
so, in terms of the math, merging will yield more. this is also not mentioning that anything you have unlocked in prophecies will already be unlocked for you, while you will have to start all over again if you keep your cantha account separate.
so, you have to look at it in temrs of what you can do with the character slots, and not just how many you have. and those who are complaining aren't taking this into account. you are not being "punished" for merging. as a matter of fact, you are getting MORE for being a loyal player.
Loviatar
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Originally Posted by striderkaaru
i
you are not being "punished" for merging. as a matter of fact, you are getting MORE for being a loyal player. |
buy either game and play your full game with 4 slots.
exactly as we have been and still are playing chapter 1
either chapter is a full game using 4 slots.
if you merge them you get to play BOTH games using 6 slots instead of 4 slots for just 1 game
Mordakai
Meh, this thread is just going to rehash all the arguments from the other one.
Eugaet
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Originally Posted by striderkaaru
i say keep this thread open, as it is a different topic...this is addressing the issue of why you "lose" two slots when you merge.
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Gargle Blaster
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Originally Posted by rollntider
and again if you dont merge accounts you dont get full content.
Regardless of your views we only get 6 slots merged or 4 if you don't merge. |
BellyFlop
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Originally Posted by striderkaaru i say keep this thread open, as it is a different topic...this is addressing the issue of why you "lose" two slots when you merge. |
Just my Opinion.
crimsonfilms
No you get 8 slots for 2 different content if not merged. 6 slots for two different content if merged.
Its BS. ANet knows it. They want money - plain and simple. All this sugar coating and trying to apply logic to it is silly.
There is no increased cost for them because the same amount of infustructure needed if you DID NOT MERGE, thus 8 slots, would be the same if you merge, 6 slots.
So stop trying to justify it. The only logical answer is - they want you to buy more. Second accounts has a been a very, if unexepected, source of revenue. Where every serious GvG player has one (to smurf) and where every hardcore PvPer wants it (to store/farm).
They just want to milk the cow.
Its BS. ANet knows it. They want money - plain and simple. All this sugar coating and trying to apply logic to it is silly.
There is no increased cost for them because the same amount of infustructure needed if you DID NOT MERGE, thus 8 slots, would be the same if you merge, 6 slots.
So stop trying to justify it. The only logical answer is - they want you to buy more. Second accounts has a been a very, if unexepected, source of revenue. Where every serious GvG player has one (to smurf) and where every hardcore PvPer wants it (to store/farm).
They just want to milk the cow.
Zehnchu
Apparently the horse hasn’t been beaten enough.
Mordakai
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Originally Posted by crimsonfilms
So stop trying to justify it. The only logical answer is - they want you to buy more. Second accounts has a been a very, if unexepected, source of revenue. Where every serious GvG player has one (to smurf) and where every hardcore PvPer wants it (to store/farm).
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Hardcore players who were unhappy with the slots offered in Prophecy already have 2 accounts... I hardly see how limiting slots in Factions is going to make Anet that much extra money.
Now, if they start selling slots...
EDIT: Oh, and what's wrong with Anet making money?
crimsonfilms
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Originally Posted by Mordakai
Sigh. I don't want two accounts... so obviously, not everyone wants one.
Hardcore players who were unhappy with the slots offered in Prophecy already have 2 accounts... I hardly see how limiting slots in Factions is going to make Anet that much extra money. |
No you don't want one, it does not mean it is not a popular and profitable occurence in GW community.
Those unhappy people from GW:P are now more unhappy I bet.
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Now, if they start selling slots... EDIT: Oh, and what's wrong with Anet making money? |
Mordakai
Possible Reasons for 2 slots:
For some unknown reason, Linked accounts do cost more for Anet to run.
Precedent: If Factions offers 4 slots merged, Chapter 3 will also have to offer 4 slots. And on, and on. That will eventually cost Anet something. The current set up is 4 slots with first chapter, 2 with any linked after that, is there to prevent this occurance.
Design Decision: Anet just doesn't want people to have a lot of slots for no particular reason (least likely).
Greed: Anet wants to force hardcore players to buy multiple accounts. Actually, I'm not even sure this is a bad thing: Since there are no monthly fees, Anet figures it will make some extra money off people who really, really want more slots, at any price. Nothing wrong with that (except, as Crimson says, they should be up front about it.)
I'll end this the same way the other thread ended: I wish someone from Anet would join in and explain their decision with something other than "creative math." If for no other reason than to stop threads like these
(3rd one on the topic?).
For some unknown reason, Linked accounts do cost more for Anet to run.
Precedent: If Factions offers 4 slots merged, Chapter 3 will also have to offer 4 slots. And on, and on. That will eventually cost Anet something. The current set up is 4 slots with first chapter, 2 with any linked after that, is there to prevent this occurance.
Design Decision: Anet just doesn't want people to have a lot of slots for no particular reason (least likely).
Greed: Anet wants to force hardcore players to buy multiple accounts. Actually, I'm not even sure this is a bad thing: Since there are no monthly fees, Anet figures it will make some extra money off people who really, really want more slots, at any price. Nothing wrong with that (except, as Crimson says, they should be up front about it.)
I'll end this the same way the other thread ended: I wish someone from Anet would join in and explain their decision with something other than "creative math." If for no other reason than to stop threads like these
(3rd one on the topic?).
Gli
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Originally Posted by striderkaaru
put it this way. each campaign currently makes up half of the total game. with prophecies, you have 4 characters with access to half of the game (4 X 0.5 = 2). when you buy factions as a stand-alone, you get 4 more characters with access to only the second half of the game (4 x 0.5 = 2). So, separately, you get the equivalent of 4 full accesses.
however, when you merge, you get 6 slots with access to the ENTIRE game (6 x 1 = 6). you get 6 full accesses. |
Gaile has given us the Grand Character Slot Unification Equation that you're quoting, but it makes no sense, and I will show you why:
4 * 50% + 4 * 50% = 400% (Okay...)
6 * 100% = 600% (Right...)
But now look at this:
5 * 100% = 500% (Uhm... still better than 400%
)Yet, many people felt that 1 extra slot on a joined account was really not enough. How can they feel this way if the math shows that it's a good deal? Read on.
And the kicker:
4 * 100% = 400% (Awww... no way!
)This last application of ANet math tells us that no extra slots on a joined account is actually just as good as not joining and having 4 new slots on a stand-alone account. Different, but apparently just as good, all 400% accounted for. I bet that few people would accept this as the gospel that many people have taken the 6 * 100% nonsense for, yet it's a logical deduction from that particular mathematical approach.
Apparently, there's something more at work than percentages of content. I'll call this something 'Options'. Character slots add options and this has been completely ignored in ANet's groundbreaking 'marketing math'. They've succesfully abused the maths to obfuscate the real issue.
striderkaaru
wow, are you people daft? seriously.
first of all, although this issue is addressed in the other thread, the majority of the posts there are debating why we should get 8 versus 6, assuming you are already merging. the main topic here is whether you lose anything by merging. keep the 6 vs 8 debate in the other thread.
and honestly, what part of the math do you not understand? if you choose not to merge, you get 4 characters in tyria and 4 in cantha, separately. if you merge, you get 6 character in tyria and 6 in cantha. please look BEYOND just the number of slots and look at what you can actually use those slots for. it isn't 4 + 4 = 8.
and if you really don't want to merge because you want the "8" slots, be my guest. but let's say your warrior is in your prophecies account. when your guild is doing an elite mission to control territory and they desperately need an extra warrior, guess what. you CAN'T do sh*t because your warrior is stuck in tyria. no matter what you say, the logic is there. 6 characters with FULL access is better than 8 with only HALF access.
first of all, although this issue is addressed in the other thread, the majority of the posts there are debating why we should get 8 versus 6, assuming you are already merging. the main topic here is whether you lose anything by merging. keep the 6 vs 8 debate in the other thread.
and honestly, what part of the math do you not understand? if you choose not to merge, you get 4 characters in tyria and 4 in cantha, separately. if you merge, you get 6 character in tyria and 6 in cantha. please look BEYOND just the number of slots and look at what you can actually use those slots for. it isn't 4 + 4 = 8.
and if you really don't want to merge because you want the "8" slots, be my guest. but let's say your warrior is in your prophecies account. when your guild is doing an elite mission to control territory and they desperately need an extra warrior, guess what. you CAN'T do sh*t because your warrior is stuck in tyria. no matter what you say, the logic is there. 6 characters with FULL access is better than 8 with only HALF access.
Katari
Well, if Factions was an expansion, it would make sense. But it's not. It's a full priced game, and that is what bugs me. Of course you get more content if you merge, of course you get better acess to it, but shouldn't that be a given? A loss of two char slots is the price you pay for having acess to both chapters? I donno, I kinda thought the price I pay for that full acess was the full-game-price that I pay for factions.
If I buy Factions, I will certainly merge, not much of a question there, but I still feel a little let down.
If I buy Factions, I will certainly merge, not much of a question there, but I still feel a little let down.
Eugaet
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Originally Posted by Zehnchu
Apparently the horse hasn’t been beaten enough.
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Merged accounts and unmerged accounts are not equal in value. That is why you either get 8 unmerged accounts or 6 merged. You are paying for unmerged accounts when you buy GW:P or GW:F.
The argument that 4+4=8, while mathematically true, is flawed reasoning when applied to merging GW:P and GW:F. Everyone knows that a merged account has access to the contents of both P & F and an unmerged account has access to just one or the other.
So why does everyone think a merged account is of equal value to an unmerged account?
I am in support of more slots. I'm just trying to point out to everyone how illogical their main argument is. I haven't seen any argument yet for the addition of slots that, logically, is any better than "because I want them". 4+4=8 holds no water because you are leaving out all the variables (the extra content) to promote your side of the issue.
Is the extra content worth nothing?
This thread should be merged with the 'Six slots confirmed' thread.
striderkaaru
just to clarify, in light of what gli posted, this thread is not meant to be whether or not anet is justified in only giving us 2 extra slots. that belongs in the other thread.
like eugaet posted, i would like more character slots as well. but that debate is already raging in the other thread. i hope that what eugaet has posted, along with what i have posted, will make you all realize that you get MORE if you merge.
if you want to bring up the issue of options, then i will be giving my scenario again:
"let's say your warrior is in your prophecies account. when your guild is doing an elite mission to control territory and they desperately need an extra warrior, guess what. you CAN'T do sh*t because your warrior is stuck in tyria."
you may have more options, but you can't do much with them.
like eugaet posted, i would like more character slots as well. but that debate is already raging in the other thread. i hope that what eugaet has posted, along with what i have posted, will make you all realize that you get MORE if you merge.
if you want to bring up the issue of options, then i will be giving my scenario again:
"let's say your warrior is in your prophecies account. when your guild is doing an elite mission to control territory and they desperately need an extra warrior, guess what. you CAN'T do sh*t because your warrior is stuck in tyria."
you may have more options, but you can't do much with them.
Gli
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Originally Posted by striderkaaru
and honestly, what part of the math do you not understand?
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Quote:
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Originally Posted by striderkaaru
and if you really don't want to merge because you want the "8" slots, be my guest. but let's say your warrior is in your prophecies account. when your guild is doing an elite mission to control territory and they desperately need an extra warrior, guess what. you CAN'T do sh*t because your warrior is stuck in tyria. no matter what you say, the logic is there. 6 characters with FULL access is better than 8 with only HALF access.
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Quote:
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Originally Posted by striderkaaru
just to clarify, in light of what gli posted, this thread is not meant to be whether or not anet is justified in only giving us 2 extra slots. that belongs in the other thread.
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Mordakai
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Originally Posted by striderkaaru
the main topic here is whether you lose anything by merging.
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Whether you "lose" anything content wise or not, is irrelevent. The question is: Why would Anet limit the slots for linking? (for possible answers, see my above post)
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Originally Posted by katari
Well, if Factions was an expansion, it would make sense. But it's not. It's a full priced game, and that is what bugs me. Of course you get more content if you merge, of course you get better acess to it, but shouldn't that be a given? A loss of two char slots is the price you pay for having acess to both chapters? I donno, I kinda thought the price I pay for that full acess was the full-game-price that I pay for factions.
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For me, here's the difference:
Factions (stand alone) 4 slots, 8 professions
Factions (when linked, not inc. Chapt 1) 2 new slots, 2 new prof.
As you see, you're getting less professions AND less slots. Maybe original GW owners should get a discount, but since there's no monthly fees, I doubt that makes much business sense. On a related note, does anyone know what the retail price of the WoW expansion is?
crimsonfilms
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Originally Posted by striderkaaru
and honestly, what part of the math do you not understand? if you choose not to merge, you get 4 characters in tyria and 4 in cantha, separately. if you merge, you get 6 character in tyria and 6 in cantha.
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Quote:
| and if you really don't want to merge because you want the "8" slots, be my guest. but let's say your warrior is in your prophecies account. when your guild is doing an elite mission to control territory and they desperately need an extra warrior, guess what. you CAN'T do sh*t because your warrior is stuck in tyria. no matter what you say, the logic is there. 6 characters with FULL access is better than 8 with only HALF access. |
And the limitation of having 50% access is imposed by ANet for no reason just to make you merge.
Its circular reasoning.
striderkaaru
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Originally Posted by Gli
You brought up the math in both your last posts, I jumped to shoot it down with reasonable argumentation. I'd been looking for an opportunity, thanks.
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Mordakai
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Originally Posted by Gli
There's a third option: Don't buy. |
Anet has obviously made up their mind. Now it's time to make ours.
striderkaaru: Give up the math argument.
8 slots x 100% content = 800%. And that's what some people want. Telling them to settle for 600% is not going to work...
Gli
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Originally Posted by striderkaaru
if you want to bring up the issue of options, then i will be giving my scenario again:
"let's say your warrior is in your prophecies account. when your guild is doing an elite mission to control territory and they desperately need an extra warrior, guess what. you CAN'T do sh*t because your warrior is stuck in tyria." you may have more options, but you can't do much with them. |
"My guild needs some warriors for an elite PvE mission, but no one has any because they all decided at some point that they didn't want to spend one of their limited amount of slots to a class they don't think is as interesting as the characters they already had. They certainly wouldn't want to delete one of the characters they know they do enjoy to make one."
striderkaaru
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Originally Posted by crimsonfilms
Moot. The issue is what you paid for and what you get.
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Gli
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Originally Posted by striderkaaru
sorry to say, but you shot nothing down. even you admitted that 600% > 400%.
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