Why only 2 char slots?

Skills are content. If you bothered to read instead of skim over what i posted you would have saw what was meant. What happens if no players have skills or spells? Nothing. Just like tomb raider. Adding more skills is more content. If you dont see it, then oh well, you just can't comprehend it. My appologies you don't see content as content.

a) you're assuming that I'm satisfied, you never asked me, nor did the subject arise...that is other than when I pointed out this issue in the past myself.

b) this issue became more pressing to debate, and I descided time spent discussing this was more important as at least it had an audience.

c) I got banned in the process because apparently this forum is a friggin convent. which lost me valuable time.

d) when I got back I figured this design descision/marketing-ploy had more chance of being revised than that of the implications of how Anet deals with core proffessions.(bigger audience) seeing as some people have a hard time even being able to comprehend the implications of this slot issue, I figured it be much harder concerning a much more complex problem such as professions...and descided time was "better" spent discussing this issue(I'd happily bring it up again though if enough people get their heads out of their y'know-what and starts questioning it)

basically I think Anet messed up on the character profession distribution between chapters. it should have been 4 core professions and 2 chapter specific professions for each chapter, including prophecies.

there's a few problems in this though(but ultimately I think it's better than the way it's currently done)

1) prophecies core professions are indeed very "core" compared to the two new professions introduced in factions. seeing as the 6 current core professions covers far more important essentials than the Ri & As you will have a hard time excluding any of these from faction-only players without leaving them at a disadvantace compared to Prophecies players.

2) there's some work needed to balance core vs. chapter-professions in regard to the introduction of new skills and the need for adding backwards content e.g. updates to past chapters(this issue is still present with the way they do it know as far as I can see) and with this comes and issue of quest locations for aquiring the new skills.

however there's plenty of pros aswell.

1) equal amount of professions pr. chapter.

2) this improves the slot:character ratio, not making it worse like factions is doing(both stand alone and merged) and with 4 slots it will correct the initial lack of slots in either chapters.

3) it'll give people a bigger incentive to buy aditional chapters, and in particular it'll give factions-only(and beyond) players a much bigger incentive to buy Prophecies compared to now. ask yourself what would you rather spend money on in a new chapter:

a) new skills for old professions?

b) two entirely new profesions with completely new primary attributes and playing styles?

------

and yes I did expect 4 aditional slots for each chapter as long as new profesions are being introduced. and before you go turn this around with your "OMG! 40 slots "-rethoric... I'll tell you this....GW will never reach 10 chapters, atleast not with introducing characters. I say they'll max(and it's a big stretch) they'll reach chapter 5 with 2 prof. pr. chapter at a max of 14 professions before professions will start to overlap and dilute the gameplay and ruin it.(although heres hoping that Anet can manage, but I doubt it) and yes if we go with 4 slots for 2 prof. there'l be an excess, but it'll be max 6 more slots than profs.(it's no biggy really)

You added variables on me...that wasn't in your original post. The speed of one hard drive doesn't affect the speed of another. Installing a hard drive that spins at 5400rpm next to a hard drive that spins at 7200rpm doesn't make both of them spin at 5400rpm. Your example related decreased storage space (which has nothing to do with data transfer speeds) to the 'decrease' in merged slots vs. unmerged. The RPMs are irrelevant. You example is still orange vs. orange.

OK...if that's the point we're arguing...why didn't ANet give us 8 merged slots instead of 6? I don't know, that's for ANet to answer.

But those claiming they 'deserve' 8 merged slots because 4+4=8, that's a really poor excuse. 4 oranges + 4 oranges /= 8 apples. That's the only thing that frustrates me...and the only reason I'm even taking part in this discussion...if you think you deserve something, at least give a good rationale for it instead of bad math.

But, yeah, ANet could have given us 8 merged slots. Why didn't they? Don't know. Probably an issue of balance, but now I'm just guessing. I'm just glad they didn't add 4 halves and 4 halves to give us 4 wholes (which would have still been a positive value for us). I see the 6 slots as a balance between value for the customer and value for ANet.

I can't keep up with all these posts...

So you'd be happy with just a single character slot? You wouldn't blink twice if you'd find yourself with just ONE single character slot after adding the factions key to your current account?

Of course you're paying for options. ANet's meaningless 'marketing math' claims another victim. There are apparently plenty of people who feel that 2 extra slots worth of options is plenty. That's okay, really. Your choice. There's also a good number of people who don't think so, but will grudgingly play along. Great, go right ahead if bending over is your thing. Then there's us 'whiners.' Well, what can I say...

To each his own, but let's not for one minute assume that there's some inherent logic that makes 6 the 'right' number. ANet's math sure doesn't. As I've shown earlier, their formulas can even be used to justify no extra slots, and from all the slot-talk on these forums it's painfully obvious that very few people would find that agreeable. Six just happens to be a number that some people find sufficient, but it's an arbitrary number, not a logical one.

Gli is correct.

I don't think questioning ANet makes the community look bad. Providing illogical equations for why you think you deserve something however, does.

I agree. I would like as many slots as there are professions. I never stated otherwise.

I agree it's valid. But it's not valid to equate the value of an unmerged slot to that of a merged when a merged slot inherently has more value...and then give that as the reason why 'I want more'. I want more, too. I'm just not willing to make myself look...well, not quite so smart...by giving an incorrect equation to justify it.

Agreed. I want more, too. Never stated otherwise.

Oranges and apples. 6 merged slots > 8 unmerged. For that matter, 4 merged slots = 8 unmerged slots. Getting 6 merged slots is a pretty good deal. Not better than 8 merged slots, to be sure. But you're paying for 8 unmerged slots. That's the problem with this argument is that people think they have purchased merged slots when they haven't. You bought 8 unmerged slots.

I have no problem with this.

Agreed. No reason not to have more. Never stated otherwise.

That's where you are wrong. I'm not the one who is confused. It's not very complicated, but it's not as simple as you say. You can't say 8X - 6Y = 2 less X. X and Y are not equal. Unmerged and merged slots are not equal.

To reiterate: I'm not against having 8 merged slots. I want 8 merged slots (I just happen to be happy with the 6 I get...still want more...). But the 4+4=8 thing, as justification why we deserve 8 merged slots? That's just ignorant.

Actually, due to the standalone nature of each chapter, an unmerged account is the default... Merged would be...not standalone.

sry for this, but i'm just gonna flame him without reading the rest of the posts.

WTF man. i mean come on people been bitching bout only gettin one slot for the new release for months and months. they finally give us two and people rejoice.

Ur just GREEDY. GREEDY I SAY!!! people are never happy.

again sry for the out right flame o po-loo-za. (i'm sure half the posts made were flamee, so i didn't bother reading)

"woo-hoo, 2 slots!!, yay ANET listens to out whining and pleaing for the past 5 some odd months." ty anet.

and what Eugaet said. look on the second page or use google. topic had been discussed since the 2 slots been confirmed for bout a week or 2.

The truth man. People always want more.

This is patently untrue. Since accounts are identified by email addresses, and many people closesly associate themselves with just a single email address (while perhaps having some junkmail/mailing list/whatever traps on the side), many people would naturally default to using the same email address for both keys.

Also, I'm willing to bet these 2 so-called 'stand-alone' games will share the same client application on your harddisk, which would intuitively lead anyone who's not just arguing for the sake of the argument to think that having a single, 2-key account is the norm.

1)as pr. usual you completely fail to comprehend what people are telling you.
you obviously didn't get my analogy. I never said that the rpms had any effect on eachother the point was that they were differend harddisks(apples & oranges) and that rpms had nothing to do with the storage capacity.

in my analogy the different rpms reffers to Prophecies and Factions respectively. one is "better" than the other(to avoid a stale communism developer dillema just like Anet is already doing) but the price is the same, therefore you have already established an equal price base and there for the the value of the extra rpms(data tranfer and/or factions content) is infact the same as the slower rpms(data transfer and/or Prophecies content) even though they're better. meanwhile storage capacity is completely uneffected(just like you pointed out yourself...how funny) regardless of whether or not I choose to transfer any data. so there's no cost in storage at the expense of the ability to transfer data, as we've just established data-transfer is equal in value.

like I've said:

(P)4 =50$/4
(F)4 =50$/4
(P+F) 4+4= 100$/8

business ratios goes:

most often 1:1(buy 1 for the price of 1)

if you're lucky 2:1 (buy 2 for the price of 1)

never! 2:3 (buy 2 for the price of 3)


2 & 2a) if it's for Anet to answer and you admittedly don't know...why the hell are you in here argueing against 8 slots and justifying Anet's actions....that's just ignorant, especially considering you're not even helping yourself(would it hurt you if you got 8 slots ? )

3) you and Anet are the only ones wit bad math mate. it's not apples oranges! in either case their value is the same and thus the sum of the value should be the same. the ability to consume both at the same time does not increase their value!

2 slots added to each chapter linked would make sence to me IF there were only 4 professions the first profession, then 2 each after that. then, everyone would have enough for each prof. the 6 professions in the first threw everything off. and it would me rea nice to have a pvp only slot that cant b pve.
as for the 6 linked/8 unlinked--it works quite well from a business standpoint. more copies to sell, able to afford more, better content---more profit.
from a player standpoint, its annoying, because MOST(i didnt say all) feel they are being cheated by lacking those 2 slots they paid 50 bucks for, even though they gain more content then unlinked ones.

Agreed. Of course, I want 8 slots, too...

Ugh. Don't I know it. I've been part of it.

i flame-retarded myself..i'm good.

anet's decision is prolly a way to get new players to play the game wwhile making fan content.

they know that an rpg is already overwhelming when u first start out.

having to buy the first game as a requirement to play Cantha will hinge many from purchasing either because they don't want to make the commitment. on the other hand when they are making it an optional merge it tells the buyer that if you like Cantha you can also experience Tyria if they like it that much.

the above statment might not be true because i'm not sure if they give you the option to merge with Tyria if you buy Cantha first. anyone has an answer to it???

your point besides being ignorant is?

your post really has nothing to do with the issue at hand.

yes you can merge Factions with prophecies if you buy Factions first...thats the whole point

o..ok then

and i think the issue at hand has been beaten more than a dead cow...
thats right..i beat dead cows..lol

*Sigh*

Your original analogy equated merging accounts to buying 2 400GB hard drives, but only getting 600GB out of using them combined. A 100MB partition (1 slot, if you will) on one HD is equivalent to a 100MB partition on the other. 100MB = 100MB, orange = orange. By combining them both, you get 800GB of storage, or 8 100MB partitions (8 slots), which is analagous to installing each chapter separately. That's a valid analogy.

Past that, I can't apply the HD example to combining the chapters. It doesn't work. To do so would require that you merged them into one HD, but you can only retain 600GB (6 slots)...but that each of these 6 100MB partitions (slots) somehow gives you access to 200MB of storage (twice the content). It just doesn't work out. 100MB /= 200MB, orange /= apple. Or, well, 1 orange /= 2 oranges, in any case...

Combining GWP and GWF. GWP gives 4 unmerged slots (4 oranges). GWF gives 4 unmerged slots (4 oranges). The value of the sum is 8 unmerged slots (8 oranges). An unmerged slot (orange) only gives you access to content of one or the other. However, a merged slot (apple) gives you access to both contents. A merged slot and an unmerged slot are two totally different kinds of slots, much like how apples are a totally different kind of fruit when compared to an orange. Merged slot /= unmerged slot, apple /= orange.

Your HD analogy still cannot be applied.

I'm NOT arguing against 8 slots. I've already stated I would like 8 slots. I'm arguing against the illogical conclusion that a merged slot is equal in value to an unmerged slot. It's a very poor argument to use to try to persuade ANet to give us 8 slots. I want ANet to give us 8 slots, why wouldn't I? I'm not justifying ANet's actions in any way. I'm just trying to point out that your and others justification for receiving such is ill-conceived. Others that want 8 slots already know this or have realized this and have already stated as much...that a merged account is worth more than an unmerged account.

But I guess I should take this as a clue that people don't want their mistakes corrected. I'll remember that in the future.

The sum of their values is 8 unmerged slots. Not 8 merged slots. And I argue that the ability to access all the content from one slot does in fact increase the value of that slot.

Well, I'm going to sit back and let this one burn itself out. I have tried to make it as easy to understand as possible, without dumbing it down too much so as not to insult anyones' intelligence. I'm wasting valuable GW playing time trying to correct the logical fallacies of others. And I'm not sure why I'm bothering anymore. There's no convincing the stubborn (and I'm stubborn, but only when I'm right). Believe what you want.

Oh, and ANet...please give me 8 slots with my combined account.

you know im about ready to head out to my job and when i come back in the morning, im sure this will be at about 10-14 pages long, geez how did the mods let this thing turn into a math class with equations.

how hard is it for some to understand how the merging, and how many slots you'll get. hell i see if they have a merging gw and gwf for dummys book out yet. be warned though i might only have 3 pages to it the last being how many slot and why your getting those 2 extra slot....see this thread in the morning later all.

Who said you need to go through all threads? And how is the search feature broken?

So, I click the search button and then type in "2 slots"

Who said I'm leet? More-so why would anyone have to be leet to see search results? I can't believe you all let this retarded thread go on to 5 pages. This topic has already been covered, if you have read the other threads you'd know this, and if you haven't don't be silly and say this is a new topic...

Heh, something of the kind may be required. I'll help you write it.

To the OP:
You gain 2 character slots, you lose nothing.

Now, if they took two slots away for merging, you'd lose something. ^_~

Really, how many PvE characters can you people make O_O?

Well, the number of PvE chars someone can make is irrelevant. But you are correct about the gaining 2 slots and not losing anything...well, except for the ability to have 8 chars with half the content.

But the main argument of this thread is supposed to be (as I understand it) 'Why did ANet only give us 6 merged slots when they could have given us 8 merged slots?'. I have yet to hear any good reasoning put forward. The best reason in favor of getting 8 merged slots so far is 'because we want it'. That's my reason, as well. Any reason better than that is going to have to come from ANet.

Lord, why can't I stay away?! Log off of GWG...log off of GWG...

dude the search button breaks down like every other hour lately.

Well I didn't know that, but if it doesn't beat all, you don't even need the search button to find the threads that I circled in my last post. Because they've been right their on the first page of the Factions Thread page ever since they were created...

The answer is simple. The reason why they make 6 instead of 8 slots is cause it'll be more likely that ppl will buy another account.

Just look how many ppl already bought a second account cause of limited slots.

IMO, the reason they made 2 slots is because 1. it saves on server space, and 2. there were only 2 new characters released. This lets you make a primary of both characters, as well as keep 1 slot for PvP, this is better than I expected, which would have been 1 character for both new classes, as they basically did with Prophecies.

To solve this problem simply, anet need to add 1 dedicated PVP char slot.

Eugaet, what's up with -still saying that there is only one reason- ? i gave you several and you did mostly agree.

I agree with the other stuph you had to say Eugaet. Well...

mostly true, but there is no way to say exactly what X or Y are, or if they are equal. -it would be diffrent for everyone.

perhaps you missed where i said:

There is no way(this is where yall use that crazy math) to quantify the value of a slot merged or un-merged. a slot is a slot - this part you can quantify.

edit: the only correct equations you can make are those that are relative to the actual number of slots given or not given. (the 4+4=8 thing)

again: ArenaNet has done a poor job to explain why they are limiting slots.

Also known as "dedicated character appearance customize preview/attribute point allocation worksheet slot" for us PvE players. Not at all what we're asking for.

the math is where 4+4= 2 individual totally separate accounts
4+2=6 where its one account, merged, with access to both parts.

why are we even arguing about this/ can't we all just get along.
it is what it is, just go and make another post of how you want more slots with the 3rd expansion and leave this one be.

You forgot "that were paid for as such"

OK, yeah, those were good reasons...forgot about your post. I'm trying to keep up with this forum, grade papers, and take care of the kids all at once. My brain is getting a bit addled...

Well, that is true, everyone assigns their own value to things. In my equation:

X = the content available to an unmerged slot (whether GW:F or GW:P)
Y = the content available to a merged slot

Rereading my post, maybe I didn't do a good job of labeling X and Y. I feel that Y > X. A merged slot has more value to me. I don't believe there's anyone in this thread who would refute that. The 4+4=8 equation is correct if we're talking solely about unmerged slots: 4 unmerged + 4 unmerged = 8 unmerged. But when you introduce merged slots into the equation, it's not simple addition anymore. That's where X and Y come in. Therefore: 4 unmerged + 4 unmerged = 8 merged is not correct. Thus, my insistence that people really are trying to equate apples to oranges.

Agreed. They've done a great job at explaining how the value of a merged slot is greater than that of an unmerged, however. There's just a lot of people who don't understand it.

And thanks for responding in a civil manner, Gargle.

Autumn Leaf's assertion, with mqstout's corrolary, is correct.

Ok I could only read through page 3 of this before I got a migrane so if what i'm about to say has already been said I apologize.

I understand the way this whole thing works with the merging and seperate acounts and 15646546153-4658498454+54544= eleventy billion spots and we owe arena net $50,000 dollars and im fine with it. I would just be happy if people who merged accounts got a larger vault box for storage say, an extra 10 spots.

It's not illogical to state that you deserve something that you've already paid for. When you buy factions, you've already paid for storage for those 4 characters. Thus, Anet is ripping you off by not giving you access to all 8 characters in a linked account. Please don't give me any bullshit about how the ability to move your characters between chapters offsets this loss of the storage you already paid for. A single 4 byte word, is enough to control access to 32 separate chapters.

Wrong. 6 merged slots < 8 unmerged.

Just how much of the kool-aid have you drunk? You're spouting Anet's marketing spin as though it were the truth, rather than cleverly worded propaganda.

Wrong fanboy. You lose the two character slots that you've already paid for when you bought Factions.

To extrapolate and reinforce the notion this is down to a decision to "encourage" more people to buy several copies of the game, what will happen when chapter 3 comes out?

People will have SIX copies in some cases - 2 copies of Prophecies, 2 of Factions and 2 of the next chapter... and assuming they link their accounts which they'll most likely feel compelled to do. Something's a bit wrong there, and it's all because of the original decision to provide 6 primaries but only 4 slots to play them (or 3 if you PvP a lot). imho that's quite ridiculous.

ok, Eugaet, i can do the first page you can do the second and we'll colleborate on the third page, and then we can make a post, about 2 slot or six slot what should be do? any ideas folks. kinda thread. lol...man the pain...

Buoyancy: You also lose professions (after all, 6 new profession in Prophecy, only 2 new profs in Factions).

I say this to make a point: In terms of new slots and new professions, linking an account will never equal the first Chapter.

However, you are not paying for Professions or Slots alone. You are paying for the other new content in Factions. Please, Buoyancy, if you hate Factions so much, then don't buy it. It's that simple.

No one is forcing you buy it, so you are not getting ripped off. You can continue to play the Guild Wars you've already bought for FREE.

It's useless to try and reason with Buoyancy. He's decided that Anet is evil and cheating him and he's going to post several times (often in a row!) to make sure that we all know it.