Anet doesn't care about PvE?

Topic. Do you get this vibe too or is it just me and my guild? My guild is a PvE guild, and with the release of the Factions Preview Event, we think that Anet is almost forcing the PvE gamers to PvP just to unlock more PvE places. I know this is what it is like with UW and FoW, but one faction could take over the ENTIRE land, and the PvE gamers wouldn't be able to PvE where they wanted to. Well, I was just throwing this out there and seeing if anyone else thought this.

apart from the tens or hundreds of new unique pve weapons and armors and the hundreds of hours of explroable new pve areas, i guess u could say anet doesnt really care

There may be new areas and weapons, but we may not be able to explore those areas because we won't have the whole map all the time.

Youve got to be kidding me. Doesnt care about PVE? Most of the new content is PVE... Tons of new monsters, new NPCs, new weapons and armors, new landscapes and environments... The whole game looks different. Yeah, they don't care... right.

not the whole map is going to be contested, youll still be able to have many adventures on either alliance sides, trust me

I understand your concerns Ecksor. However, there are some new dynamics created by the whole Alliance situation which could make it much easier... for example, instead of a PvE focused guild having to incorporate and learn PvP, it will be possible for that guild to create alliances with other guilds that are more PvP-based. The PvP guilds are going to need to embrace PvE just as much as we will PvP, because for an Alliance to claim territory requires PvE play, not just PvP. So they are going to need to form alliances with PvE-based guilds. Anet is trying to use Factions to bring the two aspects together harmoniously, not forego one for the other.

The Alliance dynamic is going to change the way we look at guilds, and the game as a whole. This could actually end up making PvE have greater importance than it currently does. Right now, it's pretty much a prep stage and skill cap zone for PvP players, and few PvP'ers consider it really a 50/50 game. That could very well change with Factions. Just something to consider.

Edit: This is an attempt to sympathize and reassure the OP, nothing more.

Oh FFS, PvP isn't that bad.

/rolleyes

PvP is actually a lot of fun, and if that were it then no problem. The issue is with converting a group who generally plays for fun and on a more casual schedule into a group who plays for competition, practices builds/strategies and takes it more seirously. I've been a member of both PvE and PvP centric guilds, and they have extremely different vibes. And as a general rule, it's hard to recruit good PvP players into a PvE centric guild, because they tend to think that the guild must suck or isn't active enough... something of a catch-22.

Edit: Ok, whatever... you all obviously haven't spent much time in a PvE or RP based guild. PvP FTW... feel better now?

Im mostly a PvE player, but the new PvP stuff is awesome, since most of it is random, its a lot easier for people to get in.

Is the OP under the impression you can't travel to the opposing faction's towns? Granted, I haven't played much in the FPE, but from what I read and from what people I know have said, that isn't true.

Edit: Also, in response to "I know this is what it is like with UW and FoW, but one faction could take over the ENTIRE land, and the PvE gamers wouldn't be able to PvE where they wanted to.", from the updates on the official website... "As the battle shifts deeper into Luxon or Kurzick territory, the Alliance Battles are biased to favor the losing side."

i really have to quote that, 12vs12 has become my first occupation ingame and it is a lot of fun

edit: i'm sure we, pve players, will not be disappointed the continent is really big and there seems to be a lot of possibilities and lots of things to do, i found the quests to be a little more challenging too

There is no way you can say competitive missions and alliance battles are serious PvP. One is random 8 man teams and the other is 3 groups of 4 that aren't necessarily coordinated groups. The PvP gametypes added in Factions are very casual friendly.

dude ... its Guild Wars, for me the pve is enough.

I'm sorry Ecksor, but have you or your guild bothered to play Guild Wars during the Factions Preview Event, or are you just idly speculating about its contents? I mention this because the concerns you're voicing would have been addressed by, oh, an hour or so of actually playing the game.

If you and your guild have been playing PvE during the Factions Preview Event and have come to that conclusion, then perhaps you should be congratulated for managing to form complete sentences.


I have yet to see a single element in-game that would force any grind guild to spend even a second PvPing, or interacting with PvPers.


I'm sorry but that's simply not true. Claiming territory involves two distinct steps. The first is 'moving the line' on the world map. That is done *exclusively* through PvP. They can call 'alliance missions' whatever they want but the rest of us call it PvP. 12v12 is distinctly PvP. There might be some actual PvE missions that one can grind to move the line in release, but they aren't in the game right now.

On the other hand, taking control of a city for your alliance has nothing PvE or PvP specific involved - it is 100% about power-grinding Luxon or Kurzick faction. The more faction you can donate to your alliance, the higher its standing, and the more important the cities it controls will be. If you're a PvP alliance you can grind 12v12 for your faction - if you're a PvE guild you can grind out the various patrol quests and the like. In any case the 'top' alliances will be those that zerg the faction farms the hardest.

The way I'd expect this to play out is that the PvP scene moves the line, while massive PvE farming divisions zerg the guild reputation with contribution and gain control of the major cities. Maybe a 12v12 zerg alliance will pop up and get onto the map, but for the most part I'd expect the various alliances controlling cities to be a virtual who's who of powergamed PvE in Guild Wars, giving that segment of the population some much-needed recognition.

Peace,
-CxE

Ok think Anet does care, about the pve. I personaly think they don't understand RPG very well. I have played fractions and I can under stand why they did what they did. I would say there is not alot a free structure in the game, Not alot of freedom. The rpg was very weak. They have good start on the story mossion. I love the story so far. You can tell that Anet worked hard on the pve. It was thought out.


For people who don't like pvp. There is alot of content still you can do. The map is smaller but there is still alot places you can explore. heck it took me all day just to find the story content of the game. LOL. The map could have been bigger.

Also think the dialog box should be used in all the quests and all mossions. it made things more personal, Easyer to notice.

On the postive note I think they should keep both the story mossions as well as the new pvpve mossion.


I think it is up us fans to tell Anet what you did not like about fractions so they can improve it.

PvP IS that bad
unlike earning their own stuff
they just create a pvp char that
starts with the best stuff WTF??

Meh. I don't think one can judge the total game play just by a tiny preview event. I'm rather skeptical about factions myself, as it seems that the whole factions / alliances thing overly complicates things. There are a few other things that add to the skepticism, (I wouldn't choose the Luxons OR the Kurzicks to align with if I had a better choice, but what's a guy to do?) but I'm going to reserve judgement on the whole thing when the game comes out and I can start it off at the beginning.

There is a bit of misunder standing (sic) here. I know we've been through this already, but there is a difference between heavily structured and open RPGing. I personally enjoyed the level of lore and questing involved in this weekend. It seems that Anet moved away from the prophecies mode of linear story lines and went to more of a quest heavy system. Guild wars isn't ever going to be a free for all, but factions felt much more open IMO.

No where does it say that you can't access content due to guild or personal alliances. I jumped from side to side with no issue today. You clearly don't understand how the line works. It is rigged so that it becomes incredibly difficult to push it back completely. The trailing/defending side gets a map and hench help that is a significant advantage.

What was said sounded like stupid emoting, I have a hard time believing the complaining parties played much this weekend.

I disagree with the OP. I've had no problems befriending btoh Kurzick and Luxon; nor any noticible issues with Questing in either area (though, to be fair, I haven't used a rez shrine since Friday, when I had all Luxon faction in Luxon areas, so Attunment hasn't been an issue). Collecotrs talk to me. Quest NPCs talk to me. I'm pretty sure I can find a merchant somewhere to sell my junk too (minor bug; if you have perfect Faction with both sides atm, they both hate you whether you've befriended them or not).

I haven't had any serious problems with this preview, and I've enjoyed myself. I've grouped a total of four times so soloing is not affected either.

I've found myself playing more and more PVP lately and by playing pve hardcore thru 4 characters completing the storyline, it kinda makes me wish sometimes that everyone should go thru pve to build their pvp character. It was kinda irritating to find out when deleting one of my characters for a dedicated rerolling pvp character that you start off with these weapons and armor that most pve players would love to get their hands on. it really was alot like a kick in the face to see some weapons that i had to save for so long to get obtainable by a click of a button.

but i guess the hardcore pvp players dont want to have to go thru the storyline and actually work on the character they play before taking it into battle? do a little Zaishen farming and you can buy all the skills you need.

Oddly enough, I said the same thing five hours prior but apparently nobody read it.

Edit: Not trying to flame/bash/whatever you Thom, just making a point about whose posts people will actually pay attention to.

You don't need a guild to be good @ PvP in Tyria.

You don't need a guild to be good @ PvE in Tyria.

You don't need a guild to access all the content in Tyria.

These statements are true for the Canthan environment as well.

I consider myself well qualified to have an understanding of PvP AND PvE concepts, given my great enjoyment of both areas.

/signed
tho it is not the problem of pvp itself, it is community that sucks

This has already been discussed long before factions was previewed. I think though that this only confirms some of our fears. Still I think that it is a bit early to tell since we don't get to see any of the progression in the game since it's all high level stuff to start with. I have to agree though this latest chapter is PvP centric. You only have to look at the new dynamics and the interviews with the developers to see that. I personally do not care for PvP. I enjoy the more casual experience of PvE and I do not like the idea of alliances. I too think it overly complicates things and suggesting an alliance with a PvP heavy guild isn't an option for me given the fact that I don't really like most of the people that do PvP. No offense intended but PvE people seem to be nicer and more easy going. I think all that competition get's PvP people wound too tightly and in turn their personality suffers greatly.

Don't even bother telling me about the new areas and items. They HAD to do that otherwise there wouldn't have been much of a game. At the end of the day though it's just a shiney new skin on the same old stuff. They didn't introduce any cool PvE content or functionality. All these nifty dynamic changes are based on PvP stuff not PvE. Dress it up all you like, append a score to it and say"well you fight monsters not other players and whoever has the highest score wins." It is still PvP.

The PvE community isn't much better with Chinese sweatshops, power levelers, mission runners, and beggars. Is it to much to ask people to actually play the game?

Hey I play the game. In fact that's all I really want to do. I want to play the game my way without the sneaking suspicion that I'm missing out on content just because I don't like PvP.

Who here has missed out on FoW or UW because they don't play PvP?

I rest this case.

Comparing a Prophecies instance to Factions is apples to oranges. The PvP and PvE aspects in Prophecies are not nearly as integrated as they are in Factions. It's much harder to just PvE for the reasons most people PvE, the items and exploration, without having to do one of these PvP missions. I can still explore FoW or UW without ever having to step into the Hall of Heros. I can't get the reward for some of these alliance missions without PvPing. Totally different situation.

I was under the impression that there were 2 new professions, new skills and armors for the old ones, new skins for your weapons and shields and additional pve quests and missions in a whole new world.

That's not really what I would call "shiney new skin on the same old stuff".

I mean if new skills, professions and new missions are not enough, I don't think there is much more they can do to please you.

How about making it so that all the cool dynamic changes they instituted are based on mission completion, and no I don't count alliance missions as missions they are PvP with a score, or quest completion. Just a tag to make a certain function run to change my instanced world when I go out. You know if I help the Luxons in this mission I want to see the repurcussions of that. I don't want to see battle lines drawn based on some goofy new PvP gimmic. And don't go bringing all the new skills and the new professions. Again they HAD to do that otherwise there wouldn't have been much of a game to justify selling. I expected that stuff to come my way. That's just a given. You have to give new stuff in a follow-up title otherwise you end up lacking substance. In the end though it is the same old boring do this quest move to point A. Complete mission at point A move to point B. No dynamic content has been added for PvE it's all PvP stuff and frankly speaking you'll never convince me otherwise. It's as plain as day that this game was made for PvP not PvE. PvE went in like an afterthought here and that pisses me off. I'm hoping this is just the Sophomore Slump and that chapter 3 willl see them get it right.

PvP was originally based around PvE characters going head to head. Then the PvP characters were implemented.

Those players are going to be largely unaffected by the whole faction war, unless they want to become involved.


Interesting, when I hit perfect faction with each one they both were friendly. It must get confused about what to do if faction is identical on both sides. The zero case is going to be more interesting though, IMO, since you're going to hit 0 on both sides pretty often by cashing out you faction.

At least I'm going to be.


If you just want to work your way through zones and do quests at your own pace you can completely forget about the faction war, and still have access to an experience on par with what you get in Prophecies. The big difference is that the endgame in Factions is larger and more open-ended. While the endgame in Prophecies was a short jaunt of six missions and a few explorable areas, the Factions endgame is a huge part of the world, and instead of being mission driven it is a sprawling network of quests.

If you're looking for a casual, endgame PvE experience that's on par with what we had in Prophecies, I think it's there.


There's no need to get involved in the faction war at all if you don't want to, and I didn't see any sort of need to PvP. Where that line is on the map is largely irrelevant if what you're interested in doing is a series of quests deep in the forest. The NPCs in some of the 'contested' outposts will change with posession as the line moves, but your access to those outposts never changes. Your individual account can ally with both factions dynamically, regardless of what your guild is doing.

I really don't know what you think you need to ally with PvP guilds for, as everything I've seen in the preview event so far has implied a system that truly gives individuals control over their experience with the conflict only as a backdrop. You aren't forced into doing anything you didn't want to do before.


Or we are wound that way naturally. In any case I believe that is a fair assessment. There's some inherent conflict just based upon the personalities, and it does go both ways - while you can look at a stereotypical PvPer and see someone who's too serious and judgmental, the other side sees the PvE scene as ignorant and frivolous. Everyone is not going to get along, and fortunately the game recognizes that and doesn't require people to do so.


What exactly were you looking for then?


Reality check: you're missing out on content in Prophecies if you don't PvP. If you're going to dislike a game simply because there is optional content within it that you don't like, I don't feel that we can really have any sort of constructive conversation.


I'm sorry but I have no idea what you're talking about. What PvE content is locked off by PvP missions?


Which? I only spent around 6 hours in the PvE portion of the game and never encountered this so I'd like to hear about it.


Just to confirm - you are not suggesting that PvE quest and mission completion be used to move the world faction line, since that would just be 'PvP in a clown suit'. You are suggesting that each individual player has his own faction line that moves depending entirely upon that individual player's actions, correct?

Peace,
-CxE

Ensign

am i correct in my reading that if your faction has control of a city it will offer you some *BONUS* opportunities but the average player of either faction will not notice much difference?

and over on the other side of the line they will have those same type bonuses /benefits for their side?

A given? Hardly. You do realise that this is a gigantic expansion we are receiving? Most companies add a few missions/levels/whatever, a few new features and that's it, we've got a new expansion. Arena.Net is offering us an expansion so massive it can be played on it's own. And they're going to do it every 6 months. Once they get the machine rolling and we get our bianual expansions, we will probably get just as much (or even more) content then MMORPGS without having to pay for the content and the monthly fee.

I honestly do not know why you are not happy. You've basically got a brand new game to explore. They could have just added new professions. They could have only added a couple of missions. It was never a given that they would give us such massive expansions.

And honestly, it's not like there is much to change about the mechanics of PvE play. However you put it, it always boils down to "complete mission A, go to place B". I find the addition of factions to be rewarding even for PvE players, since they can still get faction without PvPing one second.

Without starting several characters you will run out of quests that give faction points and will be unable to gain that needed 10k for the story mission. The only ways to get it all is to either PvP or start a new character and repeat the quests again.

I had 10k faction with Luxon and Kurzick and the Kurzick merchants would not speak to me. So I can assume that I am unable to puchase armor or weapons from them for some wierd design descision. I even went and blitz all my faction points to get the to zero and they still would not talk to me. Totally locked out. No idea why. Bug maybe?

Issues arise in long term looking, not just FPE. In FPE it's easy to make a character and quickly do the quests for faction points. In the real game, it's been said by Jeff Strain in his interview, that after the Factions "ascention" you will then choose a side. This means to me that switching sides will not be easy nor fast. It also means that gaining faction points after the quests are all done will be based off of the PvP mini games.

Faction points, as we now know, will be needed for armor componants, guild (alliance) standing, and access to missions. So all players wishing to take part in the end game will either PvP or not have anything to do. End game is what the PvEers have been asking for, now that there is some, it's being locked out or rewarded to those that PvP. That's where the issue comes up.

The attitudes of players is to a degree a major factor in why Anets desire for the two to come closer, will IMO, fail. For those that enjoy both PvP and PvE, it's a moot point. But for those that enjoy one or the other, the personalities show extreme and conflict results. I haven't heard the following comments since before Asheron's Call 2 failed, but now I'm hearing them so often in GW I got a laugh. These terms: "Carebears" and "Griefers". These competitive missions open this play difference once again and the two playstyles clash.

The PvEers (like me), or "Carebears" want to get through the mission as quickly as possible to gain those points we need as quickly as possible so we can move on. For the most part, I think we cold care less about the borders unless they lock us out of something.
The PvPers, or "Griefers" are seeing PvEers as easy prey and are jumping into grief and gain an easy win.
System wasn't built with that in mind, but see the amount of droppers and leavers and you'll see the system in play.

I didn't make these nicknames, they've been around for years, so don't blame me for them.

After the FPE I am glad to say I did try it. Doing so removed any unsure feelings about my having canceled my pre-order.

If you think I'm flaming Factions, far from. Factions is a great PvP addition to GW and I'm sure those players that enjoy PvE and PvP will enjoy it greatly. PvP also seems to have some much needed upgrades. PvEers may need to wait untill Chapter 3 to get the content we are really wishing to see though.

There were at least half a dozen repeatable faction-giving quests available just this weekend. I'm sure there were plenty more available that I didn't find (I only played for an hour), I'm sure they'll put in more of that type before release, and you'll also have repeatable PvE Challenge missions to gain faction, which were locked for this weekend. The rest of your post is just a rant based off misconceptions.

You are like the 10th person that I've seen say that and they all have a problem playing any sort of PvP match even once.

Sekkira thank you I will make note on my spelling. I am bad at grammer and spelling. English has always been my worst subject. If you wish to help with my grammer feel free to pm, But thank you.

Thom I think we have a little mis under standing. I agree that the first guild wars is linear, But the quest is still linear. Thom I don't know if you have ever tired games like knights of the old republic, Never winter Nigths, and boulder's gates. If you have then you under would stand what I am talking about a little more.

There is no interaction between the plays and npc's. I felt in the game there was little freedom. I will give some examples of what I mean. I will start with hair designs. You only get to choose only six hair styles. I feel there is little chosse from or lack of freedom in that. When I you talk to npc's there is little interaction. It is more like a yes or no to doing the quest, there is no freedom in that and it is very liner. I feel the quest forces you to choose a side. Why can't someone be neutral, See this what Rpg is all about. It is about inter acting with the story.I notice to do the quest you always have to go to a npc. Why can't a npc come to you and ask you about doing a quest. Why can't a npc address you by what you are wearing. Here is an example if charactor is wearing 15k armor have the npc think hat person is rich. As a result the npc act different for the good or the bad.

I also think the story based missions are what is must important to pve players. We want to see the end story of mossions and quest. The first GW failed in that aera too. people are still wondering how chapter one will end. The story doesn't even make since.


I also view lore as different as you do. Lore is the history or information to set the mood of the game. Lore can be usless information too. It makes it fun for rpg players to read them. Tom your a beta tester, if you have tired any of the games I have said do try them on your off time. I also recomend that that the games designers try these games I have said. You will have better understanding of RPG players.


knights of the old republic, Never winter Nigths, and boulder's gates

If you bought Guild Wars thinking it was going be like KotOR, NWN, and BG, you were misinformed. Guild Wars is more like a Everquest/Diablo hybrid. When a game goes large-scale multi-player, you have to give up a certain amount of roleplaying. I found more lore in the Factions preview than in pretty much all of Prophecies, so you should be happy on that account.

As far as the Prophecies campaign goes, if it didn't make sense then you weren't paying attention. It's an odd story, but it's internally consistent and covers everything except a few little epilogue bits that can't really be conveyed in the scope of the game.