New Patch!

I think that's the point. This game is marketed towards being able to PvP competitively right out of the box. They do need to be careful of what changes they make that affect the PvE content. They will lose their RPGers/PvEers to another game if they do too much/too little/wrong thing. For instance, drops. This patch bites for PvEers who like farming. Not everyone does, but I get a thrill when I see that rare item hit the ground. I don't want drops nerfed or monster difficulty increased. (They're already insane in some areas.)

Sekkira, to me he sounds like someone who likes putting effort into winning a fight, which is completely different to putting effort into being allowed cheat once you get there.

Anyone know what this means?

Keeping a boss alive artificially may be fun to you, but to me it's torture, and totally besides the point of the game. The point of the game is to beat the bosses (or other players) by using a strategic mixture of skills, not finding artifical ways of not killing something.

After playing with this for the whole day I've one problem---the rune traders.

I was hoping they meant that you could only buy what you've already unlocked, say in case it didn't salvage in a later version. I personally have unlocked 2 superior vigor runes, and neither salvaged...then they come out with the update. And I still can't buy the runes at the rune trader, what the hell is up with that? This also takes away the value of them. They weren't very hard to get anyways, they were always on sale for a reasonable price (sure not everywhere, but you just had to be smart). I don't see why they had to put near every single rune in the game at a trader...that's sort of dumb.

I'm sure I'll problably appreciate it in time though, go figure.

Love the new updates as a whole, no more henchmen in walls. Awesome.

Anet---I love you and want you to adopt my parents so that I can call you grammy and grampy.

I'm so tired of hearing "silver platter"... Think of some other saying please, I'm tearing my eyes out here every time I see it. I like the SoC change, now when I put some effort towards finding the boss I can get the skill. It was horrible to try to capture stances and trying to fish out the right boss just to have the boss not using the skill or some monster interrupting you when you try to capture.

Hmm...been too busy to play or do much forum-hopping lately...this is a nice bit o' news by my reckoning. The capture change, I like it very much. I'm PvE, and I do like the feeling of satisfaction of being stubborn and finally achieving something difficult, either by combat or sneaky/subtle strategy - but for me, the old capture system didn't fit into my personal definition of difficulty-achievement.

So from my viewpoint, that's a pleasant change. Thanks for making it, anet.

In retail, you used to get fame starting with your second consecutive win. This meant that your first win, you'd get 0 fame. The second consecutive win will get you 1 fame. The third win = 2 fame, etc.

The latest patch made it like in the betas, where you'd start getting fame from your first win (1 fame).

I think there's some thread out there that mentions the number of fame that you get per consecutive win. If you're interested, you may have to search for it.

The rune traders inventory is supplied by the players. We haven't put anything on them artificially. If players don't sell to the trader then the trader will run out of stock and not have anything to offer.

You sure it was the second one? I thought it was the third. (not including the first part where you just kill the monsters).

But yah that's what I thought it meant, just making sure.

Should be a little easier to get fame now, though I must say I liked the old system better. Now you're almost guaranteed to get 1 fame unless your team just completely sucks.

Do you know how many players/henchman I have gotten killed inadvertantly trying to capture an elite from a boss? The new system is much better because at least now I can keep my team alive through the battle and take my time afterwards to get teh skill. It really is quite tough for healers to keep one eye on health bars, and the other on the boss mob all the time. Great patch!!! I can't wait to buy a couple Sup Runes (and unlock it sounds like) from the traders.

patch says you cannot unlock

http://www.guildwars.com/news/gameupdates.html

Farming is officially ruined

Amnoon oasis scarabs just delete your every enchantment, without ever casting a spell on you that you can see // Riverside now has ranged mantle and Abbots, that do the same, Giants got ruined..what's next?..

Can you unlock from trading runes/upgrades?

yea but not all ppl are into pvp. for me, as an example. yeah i know the game is called 'guild wars', and probably made for pvp, but i really enjoy the pve aspect of the game, and one MAJOR, i should say SUPERIOR, reason i bought this game, over another, is no monthly fee.

as for the new soc, i will agree with another poster that it was much more fun, when you heard 'got it!' from a group of similar class fellows that you went on to get the skill. i made two more buddies that way, when we went for the 'battle rage' skill. (this was when you had to drop items for him to use it) now, i can just go with henchies and kill the boss - sure it took time to find ppl willing to go and get it, but its more rewarding before the patch.

trying to comtemplate how they could change it to make it more 'fun' to capture skills, because this new way is too 'boring', for lack of a better word, and also considering you can only use one elite skill atatime

i agree, i think they are trying to focus on pvp and rushing everyone to hurry and prepare for it. need elite skills ? go kill that boss. need runes? rune trader. weapons and black/silver dye seem to be the only things left

Ahhh, this explains a lot and means I'm not stupid! Just my luck as a new player that the very first thing I tried to sell (to another real player) was a spare bag I had. I'd never done trading with a live person before and try as I might I couldn't seem to work out why the bag couldn't be dragged across to the selling area. I thought I was just being stupid and it was highly embarassing when I had to explain that I couldn't sell him the bag because I didn't know how. Looks like it wasn't my fault

nothing has changed with how you unlock runes
- same way as it always been


Rune Traders sell Runes that have already been unlocked by other players

I'm just torked off right now. The only thing the ruination of farming did was give the advantage to those who farmed early. I was having fun watching 4 white mantle fall to my smiting skills! Now, I'm not having any fun while watching my character die painfully from an abbot at the edge of aggro. I'm ticked! How in hades am I supposed to buy 15k/piece armor when there's nowhere I can go solo to amass the fortune in plat and materials needed for the armor?

so true.

Grab some friends and go compete in the Tournament. Riches, fame and fun beyond your wildest dreams await you. Now don't say you'd rather farm than do that.

Anet does not want farming to be a major issue. People are probably always going to be selling their wares, but they don't want players to be the major buyers and sellers in this game. Expect the market for sold out runes and weapon upgrades to skyrocket, and expect Anet to come behind and fix it.

We have to love Guildwars for what it is, and not for what we want it to be. It is not a Camping or farming game. Enjoy the game for what it is and love it or leave it.

I do worry about the SoC working on boss mobs at the end of missions, and whether or not they give you say 20 seconds after the boss dies to use the SoC. Also if the SoC still works while the boss is alive allowing you to capture it if it is the last boss in a mission.

Here's the thing, though. GW was never supposed to be a game in which you were to spend countless hours striving to make your character the best it could be. It's supposed to be relatively easy to get things like elites and good weapons. Grinding for those improvements for your character is precisely the grind that Anet wants to get rid of.

It is *not* just an MMO without a monthly fee. There's a reason it was called a competitive online game and not a massively multiplayer online game. GW, both PvE and PvP, is (supposed to be) about strategy, not grinding for hours and hours to get the best stuff so that you can trivialize things. It's about bringing the right skills (based on what you're doing and the rest of your group), not spending hours hunting down those skills. It's about communicating with your group so that you don't die horrible deaths against relatively tough opponents. And since that's what the game's supposed to be about, why bother with a grind? Why make people struggle for a long time before they can participate in this part of the game? Why not make it relatively easy to get skills and runes and good items? Because people enjoy the grind? Well, okay, but that's not what GW is about.

If you don't enjoy that sort of game--if you prefer grinding to get an uber character--then GW might not be for you. That's okay. It probably isn't the best choice for a lot of people. But it isn't just an MMO without a fee. It's an entirely different sort of game with an entirely different focus.

Edit:
Not really. You're supposed to be able to compete in PvE, too. I think that part of the problem is that people equate PvE and grinding. That's not what it's supposed to be in GW. You say that they need to be careful with changing PvE. I agree. But PvE content in GW isn't farming and getting better loot. PvE should be not entirely unlike PvP in GW; both depend a great deal on planning and not as much on how long you've spent hunting down the best stuff. Giving PvEers better stuff doesn't screw up Anet's vision any more than giving PvPers better stuff does, because in neither case is it supposed to be a peron's items/unlocked skills/unlocked runes that determines his or her success.

Requiring people to spend hours farming to get good stuff for PvE goes against Anet's concept of this game for exactly the same reason that requiring people to spend hours farming to get good stuff for PvP does. PvE and PvP are not suppoosed to be playstyles as distinct as people seem to want them to be.

Has this all been said before? Well, yeah, but it still doesn't seem to have sunk in. Also, I'm procrastinating. But I've written way more than I should, so I'll stop.

Good thing I didn;t do the Villarny quest yet. 500 to 4000, big change

As I said, its not fun spamming the SoC in hopes that the boss will use the elite, which in my case doesnt show up in the skill bar because its a stance. The group I went out with to get it was doing this for 20 minutes. And we had to do the war of attrition that is snake dance to get there.

The SoC system, the rune traders, and also de Dwarves Ale are greats updates to *me*. What does that mean ? There are as many points of view as players are. Let me explain:

I work 10 hours a day with 2 hours lapse to lunch. That leaves me for 22:00 - 01:30 to play, and not everyday. So the new patch is GREAT for me; I was tired of farming, didn't have too many buddys yet, I can't spend 2 hours to get an elite or a major rune. And really really hate the trade system. I've only used it 3 or 4 times with success. The other 10-15 I've spent 20-30 minutes yelling "WTS x", "WTB x" to get *nothing*.

So, there are people that can play 5-more hours a day that found challengin/fun/etc in farm, trade, soc captures etc.

Also, I think we are getting used to get A.net to hear all of our complains and suggestions. It looks like they are "obligued" to do it. I mean, with any other game before u had what you had, and with the updates they wanted.

So, from me BIG THANKS A.net!

This is exactly what I don't understand. (and this isn't directed at you personally Moo)

Isn't the idea about build your character to put in a little work, time and effort and "building your character"? If someone can put in 3 hours a day and you only 2, how is it unfair that he may find better stuff or have more experience than you? If you don't want to put in any time to build a good character then why not play something like Unreal Tournament? You don't have to spend any time there to get an uber character with uber weapons. I just don't get it.

These are probably the same people who, when they were little kids, had to be given a gift at their siblings birthday party to keep them quiet because "Well if Johnny is getting presents then I want one too - that's not fair...."

I sometimes wonder if Guild Wars is too far ahead of it's time. So many gamers seemed locked in that grind/farm/uber mindset. Anyway, I appreciate the changes, think the game is remarkable, and want to thank the dev's for continually striving to improve upon it.

And, right now I'm enjoying the only beverage more intoxicating than dwarven ale: farmer's wine.

Dalia

Prove Your Worth in a World Where Skill Decides
Your Skill Will Be Your Legend

You'll prove your worth with every battle as skill, not hours played, decides your fate. Whether battling horrific monsters or competing in the highest levels of tournament play, it will always be your skill that earns you victory or defeat.

do a search for any of the updates on any of the various guild wars forums and you'll find it there too.....

Awesome patch Anet,

I was so angry at the amout of times i tried to capture an elite, first time i missed the skill, second time the signet started.. but i must have been to slow as the enemy use another skill real quick and i got the "you allready have this skill msg", 3rd time he didnt even use the skill, 4th time we killed him to fast.. 5th time i got it thou..

Unlike some people i think everyone should be able to get elite skills easyer and you've done this !!! its not the skills its the team build & tactics that counts.

Nurfed farming !! yay, did i mention im a addict.. i dont want to farm, its just... i dunno.. like some kind of brain malfunction ive got ! the only thing ive got to say on this is make sure people are still getting plenty of rune drops so there arnt any hoarders to create rune price problems.

And the fixed fame for tombs is great, i noticed some PUG's seem to think people with more fame will be better and dont invite players with less fame than "so so", which is silly really, yeah ok they want experienced players but with PUG teams its a bit more about just having fun even if you do want to be in a serious group.

Everything else yay ! standard patch stuff..

So just toss out all the character building elements of the game, give everyone uber weapons and skills and lets play capture the flag! Woohoo! Unreal GuildWars Tournament!

I also find myself in the "the old SOC system was really cool, but I guess it didn't work well for some skills meaning the new system is probably necessary even if I won't enjoy it nearly as much" crowd. =/

Wish they had a retroactive for Villany of Garath. My guild and I finally took the time to do this mission (w/o dying over and over) this past Saturday night. We all agreed to meet up and finally get it done ( one of our guys is already a lvl 20 ascended dude) and fought are way there, and completed the mission. I then received 500XP and was like "are you kidding me? How on earth can that be correct?" -- then they go and up it to 4K a few days _after_ we finally complete the mission. I guess procrastinating longer would have, in the end, given us a better chance for XP ;-)

so you're happy that they've rewarded you for not being any good at the game? The game is supposed to be tough...you're supposed to have to try things multiple times...you shouldn't be able to just rush your way through the game.

Killing the same things over and over is considered character building? I despair, Morris. I really do. The character building side of the game (at least the statistical side of it) ought to come from your skill bar and attributes, not farming. And then, if you want more character building, get roleplaying!

please wait a minute

go back through every post i have made and you will find that none of the above applies to me so i dont fit into whatever *your kind* you are thinking of

my position is live and let live and have stated recently that skill points have to be made waayyy easier to get and also other things along that line (i oppose the UAS)

FYI, Spectral Agony now does 9 points of damage intead of 3 (if you were fully infused).

I believe you forgot to add IMHO. For me the SoC system sucked. It was total grind to get an elite skill. The process went something like this: Go to a website and lookup the elite you want and the boss to get it from. Go fight through the mission/area to get to the boss. Wait for him to cast the skill while trying to stay alive and keep your party/henchman from killing it. Pray he did not cast it before you got there and will never cast again this run. If it is quick-casting skill or if it is a stance, just spend the whole time spamming SoC and hope you get lucky. Finally kill the boss without getting your skill. Warp out and back in and repeat again. And again and again. This is GRIND and not fun no matter if I am PVP or PVE. So IMHO this change definately took the grind out of the game and put some of the FUN back in--Now I can play with Elites without having to GRIND to get them. They are like quests now - Want an elite, figure out where you can get it, then go quest for the boss and kill it to get your reward -- note there is still grind involved as you only have so many skill points...

Again, you forgot the IMHO. What would be the point of only being able to buy runes you've already unlocked? The whole problem was the sheer magnitude of the farming grind required in order to be able to use a rune. I was lvl20 and ascended and the only runes I ever got for my character were 2 minors I unlocked and a minor I bought. All other runes I ever found were for other professions I could not use. And I never got a superior. And I could not afford to pay $50k to buy a superior from another player. Thus I played the game as it was intended (did not farm) and was punished by never being able to use one of the important items for my profession--while the grinders were able to do what they wanted. Now after this change, I was able to go BUY a superior rune as it only cost 5000gp. This of course wiped out all my money but hey at least now I can try out the character build I've been wanting to try since I started playing! This IMHO is MUCH better.

I disagree. There is still a since of accomplishment. Those runes are not free! You still have to drum up the gold to buy them. Which means you still have to go adventure to earn that money. And the SoC system still requires a "Quest For The Elite Boss" sort of journey--only now you are gauranteed of a reward if you are successful much like a real Quest, instead of having only a 0.005% chance of getting it even after doing everything right.

My only complaint with the patch is that they nerfed farming by making MOB's more difficult. Since I don't farm, it is not the farm-nerfing that bothers me. My concern is that now I am going to be adventuring in a "farming hot-spot" and get my rear handed to me by the mobs b/c they will be TOO TOUGH to kill.

Already the Sanctum Clay Bonus is impossible to do due to the farm nerfing from the last patch - The drake damage increased and the bonus-giving ghost gets killed in one whack long before you can get to him and save him. I hope that ANet will eventually address the PVE imbalances like this they have introduced in their quest to nerf farming.

LOL, sry thats just funny..yes i am happy !

The PVE isnt that tough(and if i know what im doing i can rush if i want :P), Its only tough if you(or your party) make it tough for your self, which is fun sometimes, but for me the PVE is just a means to PVP with different builds and the PVP is the part that can be very tough, but by far the most rewarding.

sorry to tell you that you are wrong. you cannot use the runes you buy at the trader on your PvP character unless you use the on you bought it with. your PvP character will still only be able to use the runes that you have unlocked.