Guild Wars Update - Nov 10 and Nov 11

You clearly did not read the last handful of posts. Please do so.


And no, it isn't hypocritical because they designed the Beacon's->Droknar's path. If they didn't want to, they could simply have made only 1 exit from Beacon's. That means if players want to get Droks armor at lvl 3 and then go back to Ascalon and do missions/quests, they're ok with it. They designed it ON PURPOSE for it to be possible.

They did not design ON PURPOSE for Monks to be able to solo the desert. Just because you can doesn't mean it was intended.

So, where's the hypocrisy, exactly?

Ummm...the last handful of posts talked about powerleveling. I don't think I mentioned that once in my post.

Okay...so because the Beacon --> Drok run was intentional, it's intentionally okay to get an unfair advantage (as far as skills and equipment goes) that way, but because they unintentionally created skills that gave some characters the ability to solo mobs later in the game, that's not okay.

So...it's okay if I take my level 3 out of pre, get uber armor, and head outside solo to kill mobs 3-4 levels above me, but it's not okay if it's end-game and I'm doing the same thing in a different manner?

If that's NOT hypocrisy, I need a new dictionary.

They really... aren't the same thing. I think you need a new dictionary as it is.

Also, you included "they don't care about getting droks and elites and using in ascalon arena" in your hypocrisy statement, when I stated earlier (in the handful of posts you skipped) that ANet did NOT support that aspect.

A level 6 can solo around Ascalon on his own in pre-searing armor, so getting Droknar's armor does not give him an unfair advantage.

The creatures were created level 24 probably so they WOULDN'T be solo'd.

Again, not the same thing.

"they don't care about getting droks and elites and using in ascalon arena"

I don't know where this mangled attempt at the English language comes from, but it certainly wasn't my quote. As a matter of fact, I didn't even refer to any elite skills. As far as ANet goes, if they were serious about being against Drok armor and elites in low-level arenas, they would have solved it by now. They just reworked AoE and AI...I think code to check AL and skill bars before admitting somebody to the arena is within their programming grasp. Nothing's been done because it's not much of a concern to them.

Back to the original point. This is as bluntly as I can put it - players who get run acquire skills from trainers that they shouldn't have that early in the game.

Who cares about a level 6 around Ascalon in pre-searing armor? That certainly wasn't MY example. Please read it again - I refer clearly to a level 3...and the entire point was to illustrate how getting run to Drok can enable low level players to solo mobs 3-4 levels above them.

As far as your comment, "They really... aren't the same thing" goes, how is the ability to solo a monster 3-4 levels higher than you are different for a low-level character than it is for a high-level character?

BTW - when you reply, maybe you can assemble an argument instead of resorting to insults? I don't think I've insulted you at any point...

Erm, but it's allowed and nothing has been done about it in the 6 1/2 months since the game's release. If they did mind, something would have been done to stop it by now. I think 6 1/2 months is a reasonable amount of time to "draw" a conclusion, and not "jump" to one. When it is addressed and corrected, then I'm wrong, but no sooner.

I seldom if ever see anybody in Beacon's asking for power leveling in Lomar's Pass. I see them looking for Forge runs.

Something else I thought about too... and this makes for part of the problem anyway.

Let's make a (not so) hypothetical scenario, with a brand new player, just got the game, knows very little about it.

He plays through pre-searing, gets into Ascalon City at level 6. Decides to try the PVP thing in the Arena. Goes in, starts playing. "Wow! That level 3 guy isn't even feeling any of my attacks! WTF?!? He just killed me in 3 hits! That can't be possible!"

He asks a friend or someone else online how he just got his arse handed to him by a level 3. "That guy probably had Forge armor."
"Oh! Forge armor sounds cool! How do I get it too?"

"You need to get run to Droknar's Forge and buy it."

"How do I do that?"

"Just ask for a runner to Beacon's Perch, and when you're there, ask for a runner to the Forge. It's gonna cost you though."

"Really? How much?" He thinks he can handle it because he did pretty well in pre-searing with monsters and has ammassed about 900 gold, which he thinks is a lot.

"Probably 5k for all the runs, and then another 15 or 20k for the materials for your armor."

"Oh dang, I guess I had better go kill some monsters to make some money."

So, much like in any other RPG he's ever played, he goes out of town to kill some enemies to make some money. (Oops, is this FARMING, by any chance? But haven't we been FARMING since the NES Final Fantasy days?) Mmm, gargoyles and devourers. Thwack, thwack!

"You pick up 4 gold."

"4 GOLD?!? I'm going to have to do this 6,000 more times to get the good armor to be competitive? No way!"

Then a thought comes to mind. "You know, I heard you can buy Everquest gold on Ebay. I wonder if they do it for Guild Wars too..."

Someone PLEASE tell me this cannot and does not happen. Yet another cause for the farming problem, and one that could easily be fixed, but still it remains.

Notice that in PVE a fire ele is often vulnerable to mobbing because of weak armour and lack of healing (secondaries only in essence). So this update is great for them... they sit there get everybody in on them, splash and insta-AoE (Phoenix then Inferno with 10attrib is still about 240dmg in short time frame- and easily done by Rank 14!! Add flame burst from Droks [pay a runner hehe] and boom add another 70... with attrib 10 ffs!! go to attrib 14 (12 + flame's eye + minor rune) and this is up around 400.) destroy a bunch of them before they can cast/use to heal.

If the going gets tough they cast a cheap lava font... if enemies stick around they take serious damage prob easy to finish (weapon only). If they flee you have time to cast/use secondary/sig to heal.

This should be brilliant for anybody who hasn't finished the game yet and got so bored they've resorted to pro farming :-)

-Mike

forge armor hmmmm. mine cost quite a few k after materials. 2k from ascalon to beacons, 3 k to the forge. 20 k by the time youre done.

point? if its your first toon i doubt youre getting to droknars and getting the armor before level 10. the only way to do that is to buy gold on ebay (or if youre super unworthy scam for it). the people that exploit it know better and do it anyway. couple other points...

armor only stops physical and elemental damage.
you can only get so many skills b4 your level is too high for 1-10 arena. if you have end game skills you wont have many of the prerequisite skills.

if u are a first time player(im not saying u are) u prolly will not know a/b forge armor. therefore u wont bother 2 pay 2k or w/e for a run to beacnos from ascalon since u wont know the point of it. when i was first a n00b(yes we were all n00bs when we first started) i saw run to beacons when i was in yak. i didnt know the point of it so i didnt even think a/b it i just went along and did the stinking missions to get to the forge. i went throught the whole game w/o even a second thought as to y in the heck someone would want to be rushed ahead to beacons when u can get there by doing 2 missions. now when i get a new char yea i get to piken then get him rushed to yaks then to beacons then to drok to get his armor. but most first time players will not even realize the signifagance of the forge.

also if u are smart and this is not yur first char u could possilbly get there and get yur armor for 10k. 3k for the run 7k for the armor. if u were smart u would find out what materials u need for yur new char and then salvage for these materials on yur more advanced guys. thats what i did for my monk and ele after i had beat the game w/ my warrior.

as to the skills for some skills to even be effective u have to be higher then lvl 10 or just put all your attribute points into that one catergory to increase yur best skill.

No insults, eh? Why hello there pot, I'm mr. kettle. And getting droks armor and skills and using in ascalon arena WASN'T your quote?

(found in http://www.guildwarsguru.com/forum/s...postcount=1880)
Weird, according to you, you didn't say that. Yet according to an earlier post, you did. How weird. Yep, I mentioned specifically Elite skills, but because it was bought up in those posts you seemingly skipped.


I don't disagree that something should have been done about it, but managing a game is a pretty busy job. It's not as if they're all sitting around spinning in their chairs thinking "man, I'm bored, I wonder if there's something for me to do." Would I, personally, liked to have seen something done about it before now? Hell yes. But ArenaNet has officially stated that they are against such abuse and will take action against those found doing said abusing. I choose to believe ArenaNet because they do have the best interest for the game at heart.

I'll agree with this. The only reason I get a run to Droks is for the armor. Then I go back to wherever my pre-run progress was, and continue doing quests/missions. I know most people who get runs don't, but seriously, where's the unfair advantage of it when it comes to PvE? One person being run and doing Bloodstone Fen in Droknar's armor in absolutely no way affects you.

And I was illustrating how soloing the Ascalon area is not equatable to soloing the desert BECAUSE you don't need droks armor to do it. Pay attention and play carefully, and you can do a fair amount of quests in the region without buying new armor. Simply because the Shatter Gargoyles are level 8 and you're level 3 doesn't render it impossible. I know, you're saying to yourself "Then why should the desert be?!"

Because Ascalon isn't end-game material. The monsters are a few levels above you in Ascalon because you chose not to level up more in pre-searing. It is entirely possible to enter post-searing a HIGHER level than the creatures, so their levels represent a medium and balanced challenge. The Griffons in the desert however, are always a higher level than you NO MATTER WHAT, simply because they should not be able to all be taken down in 15 seconds by a single monk. Really, where IS the logic in being able to do that?

See above.

Ok.

the reps say that the very hardest highest parts of the game were meant to be tackled as a teamwork many person area and that is where they draw their line.

one said that you can hardly expect to solo a part of the game that was intended to be played (and has loot for) a party of 8 players.

one person getting 8 chances at the all the loot from an 8 person high quality drop area is not intended.

Then wouldn't it be wiser to make farming area unplayable solo? Why do we always see the same areas farmed solo, albeit differently? Because their difficulty is yet to be buffed up. Add disenchanters, stancer breakers, hexes and conditions, and you'll need a team to play in these areas. Simply put, the AoE update wasn't enough to deal with solo-farming, and it wasn't the best way to tackle this problem.

and to be honest i am not the biggest fan of the update

we are not holding the steering wheel but we can still yell and see what happens.

i predict adjustmrnts but it might be weeks (or longer) before it shakes out.

until then the ride may be a bit bumpy

then give me henchies in uw or fow because there are groups there have no clue when or not to talk to a ghost or to/not take a quest or anything for that matter.

half the time you spend time waiting on someone to make a "perfect group" and they fail the first 10-15 minutes into it.

i get tired of this puritan mentality "you will do it this way or not at all"

i play this game for fun and to relax, not to be dictated to by a bunch of whiners, if you want to take out the solo ability of uw monks, fine then give me henchies so that if i don't want to be in a group with people that can't communicate then i should not have to nor should i have to spend 30 minutes trying to find a group that can.

If they made the Ascalon arena such that you couldn't enter with Droks armor, how long do you think it would be before someone entered with weak armor... and changed after they got in?

Indeed. I've considered that as well, but ArenaNet would have to make it so armor cannot be changed in PvP areas. That would be the easiest solution to it (from as much as I can tell.)

That would not be popular, many people change armor in PvP depending on the situation.

Maybe you can't change armor in low-level PvP areas? Or just can't bring in high level armor period?

Well, in my defense, I said easiest, not best or most popular.

I can see a riot happening because of it, though, so you're right. A restriction only to Ascalon & Yak's where you cannot hit "Enter Mission" if you have un-equipped armor in your inventory?

this is split in 2 threads ?? ... ok then, here it goes again

Full AOE Nukers In Sorrow After the updates ...

http://www.guildwarsguru.com/forum/s...ad.php?t=81403

or how about this one for trial .....everybody yell if i have it wrong

simply have any drok armor simply grayed out when you enter a low level for the fun of it arena.

also any other upper level stuff that you had to get as well.

isnt the low level newbie pvp arenas supposed to be fun instead of an *I WONT TRY THIS CRAP AGAIN PVP SUCKS* experience anyway?

let them switch from low level to low level equipment all they want but simply gray out the high stuff while in a low arena

Comeon folks, the "easiest" solution is to just bar admitance to the lower arenas once a char has gone too far afield. If you have made it to Yak's Bend then you can't enter Ascalon Arena. If you have made it to Lion's Arch or Camp rankor then you can't enter Yak's arena.

Problem of twinked chars (skills OR drok's armor) in the lower arenas is solved and there are no loopholes.
- You can't buy armor from someone else (or give it to yourself)
- You can't buy or trade skills from another character
- You can't sneak it in by not wearing or equiping it.

and (as has been stated ad nauseum) this will not affect PvE in the least. Let folks do whatever the heck they want to when going against beasties. Just don't taint the fun of a true low level arena.

how bout armor levels are automatically boosted or decreased to the maximum in ascalon. Then all elite skills are locked. Problem solved. :P

Better yet... you get 'arena armor' to enter, with a minor rune of each type, same across the board for each class. All rangers get Ascalon arena druid, for example, with minor runes in place.

Hey, it's a kids arena, give em kids armor!

You know what... Thank you for all your hard work..

People its just a game, dont let it affect your life. Dont Hurt your self over it

Umm without thinking too hard, here I go...

Fact: Heading into the Ascalon Arenas without Droks armor and high level skill is an open invite to having your entrails served back to you on a Fellblade.

Fact: Heading into the Lion's Arch Arenas without Droks armor, a level 20 character, and high level skills is an open invite to having your entrails served back to you on a Crystalline Sword.

Suggestion: Since Arena appears to have little problem with you entering Arenas unprepared to what others bring, either get yourself to that level or avoid it.

You want Droks armor barred from Ascalon Arenas? Fine by me. Just don't forget to bar anyone under level 20 and max armor from Comp. Arenas, or conversly bar those at level 20 and max armor from Comp. Arenas. Now everyone is at the same playing field.

Fact 1: I agree.

Fact 2: I agree.


Ascalon: 1-10.
Yak's Bend: 1-15.
Lion's Arch: 1-20.

Why ban level 16s from CA?

cool!

All i have to add to this is my two cents......change it back to the way it was simple but is a solution to this problem

More people would buy Ferraris if a million Ferraris were built. Why? The manufacturer, Ferrari, would behave in this manner: a) implement mass manufacturing processes, and b) reduce manufacturing costs by automating labor and buying cheaper parts. This would, in turn, negatively affect the consumer price of a Ferrari and thus enable a wider market the ability to purchase Italian stallions. When a buyer purchases a Ferrari, they're not purchasing a car; they're purchasing a total image. That's what would be communicated to the wider market, the wider market would accept, and Ferrari sales would increase. Unfortunately, the lifetime of each Ferrari product would decrease exponentially as time passes due to a) the increased awareness of Ferrari issues and b) consumerism. If a million people are driving Ferraris, the "Ferrari's not car; it's a total image" promotion would be weakened to the point where, as we see today, classic cars (i.e., classic Ferraris) would assume all the attention, and eventually, consumers would perceive the mass-produced Ferraris in the same light as the new Hummers.

The main problem with your analogy is that Ferraris are high-demand products already. They're just not affordable. If Ferraris were mass produced, the increased quantity and affordable quality would only satisfy the existing demand. After satisfying the existing demand, Ferrari would have to rely on marketing to increase demand through their products' lifecycles. Because Lamborghini and Ferrari handcraft their vehicles, the lifetime of their products and their products' brands are extended, and the lifecycle of their products is slowed. Extensive marketing is then not required; however, mass production quickens the pace and cheapens the game.

Well, after playing 20hrs after the update, I'm actually starting to like it. Maybe it's because I'm only using my E/ME. (haven't tried using my other chars for some time now) I keep playing in FoW as an Echo Nuker, and yes, you can still Nuke. You have to be more tactical now tho and what ever you do, DO NOT USE FIRE STORMS! Meteor Shower is the best way to go. Anyways, I just noticed that after the update, Shard drops in FoW have increased. Lastnite while I was playing we Aggroed 4 Mobs (not at the same time) that dropped 2 Shards at the same time. 4 Mobs x 2 Shards = 8 Shards in one run! And we didn't even reached the Forge! (stupid leavers!) I bet we would've gotten more if we went further.

But yea, I think that's what they did. They made it harder but increased the drops. I think that's a good trade. So yea, you guys should try it! I mean, I'm not saying that the update was perfect. I know they gotta fix a lot of stuff after the 11/10 update, but to change it back from the way it was? I kinda don't want that anymore....

A full set of droknars armor is about 15000 gold, which you'll have when you get to Droknars. Unless you blow it all on beer & keys, of course.

It's hard if you get yourself run to Droknars at lvl <too fricking low> the first time you play the game, but then again complaining about not being able to buy the best armor in the game when you've just started playing is just plain silly, so who cares.

What is the point of having a mage after this update? As soon as you use your aoe spells like fire rain everybody scatters.. Result: instead of 100 dmg u do only 18... Really really bad update. I don't like it at all...

Yawn...

For the love of all that is holy... USE SOME OTHER SPELLS.

Or combo of spells to keep baddies from running...

Really. I have a Fire Ele and it's not that hard, people!

if you already have the materials (without buying them), it actually costs 7,500 for all 5 pieces.

What about the people who HAVE mages and have come to LIKE or NOT HAVE A PROBLEM with this update? They've adapted, you can too.

i have to say that the game was very nice in the beginning, a few things that needed help (like guild invite spamming) but for the most part it was a good game and i liked it...now its just seems so different, i almost had to relearn it from being away for a few weeks

The Farrari is a status symbol I guess thats why so many want 15K or Fissure armor.Good post though.I don't like this update much either and haven't noticed the drop rate increased.

Exploit? Common sense? We'll see...

I've found that Chaos Storm makes a great emergency shield for a Mesmer now. Cast on the guy next to you, all the baddies run away.

i use CS offensively and defensively as you say, but this tactic applies to the eles with their AoE too. I dusted off my ele (air/fire) the other day to see what the fuss was about and found meteor shower is a great defensive spell now

Soz but I can't see why peeps are moaning bout nasties not sitting still under a fire storm or other AoE spells, after all would you really sit there? Meteor shower still works cos of the knockdown and found that tho drops didnt work out, i was enjoying finding different tactics.

Seems to me that if nasties run from your Fire Storms or Chaos Storms slow them down or cripple them so they cant escape - each profession has reasonable slowing spells.

My dear god in heaven i hate hate hate you anet. Once again every farming spot gets a great big nerf. Wth are you thinking. All this patch is doing is keeping the majority of the wealth in the game in the hands of those that allready have it. So in short you keep the poor people poor and help the rich to become richer. Hey this game works just like our country. Now im glad i never deleted my wow account. At least they are fair about farming. And they realize that the economy of the game is driven by players. It isnt some ai that they can tweek to their liking. That hasnt worked yet and it will never work. There are allready players walking around with hundreds upon hundreds of plat and thew will sell to the people who can afford to buy it regardless of patches. And one more quick question. With farming nerfed why keep fow and uw armor available. Noone will be able to afford armor thats total cost is more than 1.5 million in gold now will they. Or even the 15k sets of armor. Might as well take them out too. Thank god i bought all three sets of mine before this idiotic patch hit.

Personally if things dont change this game will become nothing more than an overpriced chat client. And if you think im wrong go to the comp or teams arenas or in lions arch and watch people do nothing for hrs but set there and chat.

Hallo everyone. This is my first post, to let you you know how I feel about the 10th Nov patch. For that, I paste an e-mail I sent ANet a few days ago:


Dear Arena Net

With this update you decreased dramatically the usefulness of elementalists. Why should this class pay for "crimes" commited by the invicimonk build? If the objective was to cut down on farming, well, didn't work quite well. Monks can still farm, they are still able to make money. I don't have a monk, don't like the playing style. I used my elem to farm and get just enough money for my personal needs. Now I can't do it anymore. And, before, I didn't mass farm, like monks. I only took on 3 or 4 enemies at a time, unlike monks who took 10+ hydras (no, wait, I believe there's cases of 30-40 hydras). Is that so unfeasable? Isn´t an ascended lvl 20 elementalist supposed to take on and kill 3 enemies at a time? I don´t see what the problem is with elem AoE skills. Will you nerf a few skills every time someone comes up with a new, stronger than average build? Why don´t you just let us use the skills you created the best way we can? Everyone is on equal terms, everyone can use the same skills for whatever purposes. And on PvP there's always a counter build.

Why this discrimination against elems? Monks are your problem (and only that specific invicimonk build), not elems. I know that the objective is to stop the sale of gold and items on the internet (like on ebay). Most of those companies use asian players wich don't do anything else but farm all day. You just have to go to Augury Rock, at ANY time and you'll see the crowd of asian monks leaving town. I'm all for stopping their activities, but don't do this at the expense of legit players. If the intention was to stop this, I think it won't work because, now more than ever, people will buy gold online. And the prices won't fall because monks can still farm and there will be a steady constant flow of money. On the other hand, items will be more scarce, due to the decrease in farming and to cuts on item drops you made previously. It´s very dificult to get a good gold item nowadays. So, less items supply, demand still maintains, prices will rise. How am I going to get money now? Do I have to create a monk just for farming? That will be boring, and a game should be about fun. Buy gold on ebay?

You say that I can farm with other players. Well, it´s not easy finding players to do it, only on specific areas like FoW and the UW. Use henchmen? No, thank you, drops suck. I would do it if I wouldn´t have to share everything with henchies. I have a sugestion: make them mercenaries, we'll pay them a fee for their services, and don't share anything with them. This way would be enjoyable farming with them and would solve the problem of invicibuilds.

You say that the patch aims at making enemies smarter. Then go all the way. Make them run away from my Warrior when they are about to die under his axe. You say it's realistic to make them run when they feel the first "smell" from an AoE skill. Then why not make them run when they feel the first cut from a blade? It's logical, no? Then we'll have a battlefield full of fleeing enemies. Maybe then skills like Sprint and Charge would be useful in PvE, besides pro runners. It's not logical to make it about AoE skills or any other type of skill, for that matter. They should run, if they should run at all, when their health is low, not when they get the first damage from a certain type of skill.

You say that you want to make them smarter, behave in a more realistical way. Well, a game should be about fun, not realism. And tell me, how realistical is running around with swords, axes, hammers, casting spells, etc? How realistical is Sword and Sorcery? Isn't this called an Heroic-FANTASY game? How realistical is having a radar that warns you of the presence of enemies? How realistical is travelling instantaneously between towns? How realistical is the use of runes? This game isn´t supposed to be a simulation.

And isn´t standing your ground and fighting to the death also realistic? This monsters are supposed to be ruthless, fearless, not afraid to die. They are suposed to be more focused on killing, not on self preservation, and certainly not run away in the heat of battle like cowards. Players who do that in PvP are called runners and noobs by other players.

Is the patch aimed at making fights more challenging? I don't think so. It's easier now: enemies run away from us, giving time to regen. It was more dificult before when they kept attacking no matter what, giving us a hard time surviving. And now there's a bigger chance to land criticals on enemies because they will be running half the time, making figts easiear. So, now what, are you going to nerf criticals also? This is a never ending cycle. What the patch makes more challenging is farming, and more time consuming, that's all (and for my elementalist has made it impossible so far). Oh, and henchies are still as dumb as ever.

This patch doesn't make the enemies more "clever and canny and crafty in figuring out how to win". For instance, if I'm almost out of health and there's an enemie attacking me with full health, I just have to pop up an AoE skill and he runs away, waysting a good opportunity to kill me. How clever is that? In what way does that "bring the game back to more of a shared-experience feeling, rather than a feeling of having two entirely separate and different games" (PvE versus PvP)? By the way, what's the problem in having substancial differences between PvE and PvP? Everyone who bought the game understood that the two would play in different ways. And I'm glad there's differences, that only plays in favor of the game, everyone can choose what one wants to explore more.

So, what I think is that all the reasons you present to justify this patch are not valid, they're there to just disguise the real objective: another strong nerf on farming. But you forget that farming is another aspect that a LOT of people enjoyed about this game and this way you're just taking away a lot of their pleaure. I believe that you'll have a lot of discontent players on your hands that will think twice about buying any more chapters. What for? Having things contantly nerfed? I'm all for tweaking, not nerfing.

I think that the influence of farming in the game economy could be easilly solved if you really wanted to. All you have to do is to stop letting prices fluctuate. Why don't you do with runes, materials and weapons the same that you do with armor? Just put them available at traders at fix prices. This will cut player trade, sure, but I think that trade isn´t what this game is all about. I personally have no pleasure in trading with other players, it's the opposite. When I need to sale or buy something, I have to loose endless time, time wich I could better use for playing the game. There would still be trade between players, only at smaller prices than on traders. It would be good for the general economy. Please consider this seriously.

Another suggestion: consider implementing, on the next chapter, presets for skills, attributes and equipment, like you have now for weapons. It's such an asle changing between builds. And create more char slots.

Well, are my "comments of a constructive nature"? I hope so.This is my opinion about the patch and about some things that could be changed.

By the way, Arena Net, compare the number of pleople that complained about the price of items and the number of people that complain now about this update. What does that tell you?

Good going Arena Net. I think I'll try World of Warcraf now. I have a free trial for 2 weeks and if I like it I'll stay there. And this isn´t just childish blackmail, it's a fact. Best of luck.


PS: Oh, another thing. Just now, as I was browsing your site to try and send this message to you, I saw a news saying that a new profession has been revealed, the Assassin. But for us to learn more about this we have to buy Play Magazine.Nice to see how well you treat your players.

[QUOTE=Silvermoon Sky]
Good going Arena Net. I think I'll try World of Warcraf now. I have a free trial for 2 weeks and if I like it I'll stay there. And this isn´t just childish blackmail, it's a fact. Best of luck.
QUOTE]

here is your 3-4 hydras with an elementalist so what is your complaint?