Domain Of Anguish

Right now, DoA requires anything but brute force. Anyone attempting to brute force anything there gets wiped in under a minute.

There currently exist hints towards builds, like the frost or trapping builds. But that's it. Everything else is patiently applied skill.

Maybe some "cookie cutter" build will apear. B/p is an example of brute force, with only minimal skill required by the puller. But there, if if agro goes crazy, you have a very high, maybe almost guaranteed chance of survival.

If you can spend 2 hours a day playing, then you can almost certainly spend 2 hours a day not playing for 4 hours on weekend. That's the beauty of GW: you are not forced to spend hours after hours grinding some gear which then allows you to pass. Play 4 hours a month, but be skilled, and you'll have no problem.

But it comes down to skill. It also comes down to this: Mobs level 28? So what? Since when did level ever matter in GW? They can be level 50 for all it matters. Mob skills are what everyone is going against, not their level.

Long? Yes, it takes around 4 hours per area right now.It will come down to two. Every group right now has at least one first-timer, at least one with unsuitable skills, equipment and attribute points, everyone almost always makes a mistake. It's new, it's unknown. But even so, people are passing the missions. Groups not only do not get wiped at start, but the question is becoming of adapting strategies for faster and more reliable killing. Finishing is no longer a problem.

And yes, players who are skilled are currently playing DoA and completing quests. How much they play has nothing to do with it. Although, most of the players I do encounter there are long term veteran players, with incredible ammounts of experience (not xp bar), skill and knowledge.

yes its safer to have 2 wars incase of a err7 ^^

we used
2 R/me
1 W/E
1 E/me
3 M/me
not going into detail of skills atm but the monks we had were pretty dam decent and the tank could aggro really well.
1 ranger used cg and targeted the mob casters.
There was a time that our war died and 1 monk tried to rebirth him and the mesmers kept interupting rebirth at 99.9% lol
was funny but eventually we got him out. Our 2nd ranger really help alot with tanking aswell.
Its easy for 3 monks to keep them alive since the others are all out of harms way.

Yes we used MOF not my build either but it works. we just modded around that build somewhat. Try the W/E it really cuts down on the time it takes to kill a mob and the boss died really fast aswell since his mob was attacking our war and sliver armour was hitting the boss ^^


Forgot to add we had
1 N/me Bipper

oh i would soo try it but that would mean me taking my broke chars arse otu and getting silver armour lol and for a ranger to have cg here in doa is almost a must have ^_^ great things come of it lol

we ran
2: monks

2 rangers

2 eles

2 necros

2 warriors

In a varity of ways .. base 2 monks 1 necro 2 rangers 1 ele 2 tanks .. if it didnt work well we would switch it up etc..

I like the 2 necros
what builds u using for them?

Hope something good comes out of this thread.
PPl start posting suggestions for builds instead of complaining ^^.

well i know one was bip ... for energy of course :P the other was running a sv build

yes i noticed that the mobs dont tend to remove hexes as quickly as they should which makes hexes really effective.
i will try adding in an actual mes in the build will post results of that.
Im off home been a long day at work but off to GW yay!!!!
unspokenglory pm me if u want to try some new builds my ign is
I atsushi I or Ming Su ling

Gl with ur build and hope to see u all in the final elite mission soon ^^.

What he is saying is true, though. The only "skill" involved in DoA is how much free time available to you. For students, that might not be a problem. For us professionals, it's a waste of effort. =)

It's simple copy-paste difficulty and "number up". There's nothing new or rewarding in DoA.

This is a silly thing to say, because a 1-shot quest will not be repeated when people "get it right". It might be true of the elite mission, when people finally get that far.

Oh Please DEfine PRofesionals ! becuase i know i wake up at about 4 am take my wife to work go back to bed wake up pick her up go to work intill about 11 pm then i come home hit the computer for about 2-4 hours depending on schedual next day which is usually the same ? i seem to find the time to get it done .. plus on same days are busier then other's.. so please inlighten us all on the term u used

It is annoying that we have no choices. People are being very selective when they face a really hard mission. However, they put a reward that everyone is needing within it......My Mo, W, E, and N can get it, how about my A, my D @@? Do i need ages to get a thing that i should have in general? (For example that Rt hero)

We have to group for PUG, we cant do it with heros, and henchmen, that's fine. But can we have more choices? I do think my A will be excluded from this area forever lol

This time Anets has taught me a lesson, always finish Mo, W, E first before you try other classes

2 hours? You don't have enough time to DoA. I'd kick you out of my group.

Sorry to hear about how you have to pick your sister up every day. Maybe you need to fix her car.

My complaint is not with the difficulty as such but with class/build elitism that comes with it.

I have 2 main PvE characters, paragon and assassin
Takes me about an hour to get a groups with paragon and I don't even wanna try with the assassin.

One fricken hour just to get into a group! Then several attempts, waiting for new people cos someone leaves after each attempt etc... I don't have this kind of time.

If you are paragon, assassin, ritualist or dervish you are screwed. Tankers are only warriors accepted. Then bip or ss necroes, mesmers, monks are the healers(obviously nobody but me sees the potential restoration has), eles are nukers(sf of course) and rangers can be trappers and GC/winter.

This is the thing that pisses me off the most. In SF you couldn't get a group if you weren't part of the oro farm build, Tombs you have to be b/p, UW etc you had to be SS or 55 tank or trapper, and now this area which is way harder than any of those and also likely way more discriminatory.

Always same crap, if you are monk you can get in any group if you are something like assassin you can't get in no group. (I am talking about non-guild on consistent basis of course).

Also areas with hard hitting mobs don't promote elite play, only elitism, because such hard hitters promote abilities that scale with number/power of mobs. Such abilities: Protective spirit. The stronger the mobs, the more powerful and important it becomes. Evade stance: More monsters that hit harder means more damage is avoided by evading. An exaple of ability that doesn't scale: Ballad of Restoration. It ends up as flat 80+ HP heal regardless if you are facing a lvl 1 monster or 10 monsters that hit for 300 each.

And classes that have abilities that don't scale get really shafted and rejected out of parties. Premium example is assassin whose abilities almost always don't scale with power of the target, they are usually single target and the character itself is melee range and low armor.

So nobody wants an assassin. Same is happening to some other classes, though the assassin in the worst.

That is why this pve thing is crap, you can only play with specific classes if you wanna see end game content. Sure you can play end game content with any character/build but for that you usually need a guild that is very dedicated. And heck it is hard to get 8 people together at the same time, cooperating, for gvg, that becomes even harder for pve.

Actually, Assassins should not have a big problem getting in because of Shadow form tanks.

Fertile Season: non-spirit creatures get health and armor.

Aren't margonites considered spirit creatures? They can walk on the sulfur. Could be a good skill to pack. Anyone tried it?

ETA: they leave corpses though don't they? That makes them non-spirit creatures?

Spirits are immune to hexes and conditions. They also have a lower armor rating. It is very clear what is a spirit and what is not Yes, logically, your point would make sense but games don't work on what 'should' be by lore, they work on what is flagged as what in the programming.

To people that replied to my previous comment - in the case of the city, it should take you about 2.5 hours if you're going at a moderate pace. The other areas take longer, this is because very few people have experience in them. A month down the road, I expect all the areas will be around 2-3 hour completion times.

hi all

Make it for 12 players that will be more fun for more players at the same time...

You forgot to include sarcasm tags.

I just want to know one thing:
Have anyone done one of those missions in under one hour?
If you answer is no, you are saying DoA is boken and must be fixed.

In one week? In one month? after next chapter release? When is not the matter, the matter is that it should be done.
The average GW player can play around 30minutes and 2 hours per day.
And they are the ones paying hte servers, not the so-called elite players.

If you spend more time with tactics and researching builds, th server won't be cheaper, they are still to be paid. And the average player is the one that pays them. The so-called elite players may say whatever they want, but they need the average players, without them there is no game. THey rule the game, they make this game go on. Not the ones that play more, no. The ones that buy more. Welcome to capitalism. Bow to the crowd and resign yourself.

Period.

How is this different than ANY elite area in Prophecies/Factions during its first month of release?

You would think DOA is the 1st elite area that *ever existed* -- its not

Just my 2 cents about DoA, after having played 3-4 hours with my monk in PUGs and with my guildmates, and having read the experiences of other players in this forum.


1. I think this is the revenge of A.net against all who complained that GW PvE was dumb, easy, boring, not challenging and all this kind of stuff. Now they put in the game something so impossibly hard that no one can say that he can beat it while watching TV and drinking coffe.


2. That said, I'm worried about this sentence I found in this thread:
I went there with a balance group of guildmates, we know each other, we have TS and decide the build before starting and so on.
And we got wiped at the very first mob of each area, except once when we killed the 1st mob (and I dropped a margonite gemstone ) but got wiped by the second.

I remember when ToPK was released, the very 1st day we went there with a balanced team, had some failures at 2nd or 3rd chamber, but eventually we managed to complete it. It took 3+ hours, but it was doable.
Then B/P teambuild was discovered, and this allowed to clear ToPK in less than half of the time and became the cookie cutter build for that place.

But in ToPK, the difference between B/P and balanced teams was essentially the reliability of the build and the speed. Nevertheless, ToPK was actually doable with a balanced team.

DoA doesn't seem to be doable with a balanced (although skilled) team.
So, at the moment I'm just worried that it will become the new cookie cutter fest.
So far no cookie cutter build has been discovered, but reading this:
the first think that comes to my mind is that this mission are not designed for a balanced team, but there is some "trick" to know, and once it's discovered only cookie cutter builds will be able to do them.

To sum up, I'm worried that this can happen:
ToPK: a walk in the park with cookie cutter build, but doable also with a balanced team.
DoA: doable ONLY with a cookie cutter build, UNDOABLE with anything else.

Maybe there will be a different cookie cutter build for each new area, but my worry remains: if you don't have the specific character that fits to the specific team build, you will never be able not only to find place in a PUG, but even to do it with your well known guildmates, unless they all know and use the cookie cutter build.

That's just my general thought, I do hope I'm wrong and the developers studied well the balancement of those missions.
In the meanwhile, I'm working to complete the game with other characters, to be prepared to every possible cookie cutter build!

I'm still amused to see the same flame baits over and over again. I guess this post will be lost and ignored after 60 pages of people pretending not to hear.

DoA is for players with a brain, decent skills (reflexes, knowledge...) and way too much spare time for their own good. I trust there are many hardcore players out there who did (or will) breeze through the DoA, and I acknowledge their dedication and willpower.

Unfortunately for me, I'm a not-exactly-casual-but-not-hardcore-either player. I completed all NF quests and missions, effortlessly, and only with heroes (because steamrolling them with humans is even less fun). I was somewhat disappointed because even the 'so-called' difficult missions were too easy (way more than some prophecies missions in their original pre-nerf form), and because I can count the number of dangerous areas on one hand. Yet I cannot spare 3 to 5 hours to clear one area or to do a single quest. Unfortunately for me, I'm also not a dedicated farmer. Killing the same mobs over and over again for a couple of golds/greens, or a couple of gemstones is boring and a waste of my time. I understand some people like to chase the ever eluding carrot, but I'm not one of them.

In short, NF had a lot of great features (heroes, hench controls, scenery, storyline, clever level design and reuse of maps, original monsters or skills...) but it was too easy for me. DoA sounded like a great addition, but it is not for me either.

For what it's worth, I also find the game design very sloppy. Not only is it a stronger version of the same old monsters (seriously... margonites and titans again!?), but it basically relies one strategy: to prevent players from playing normally (huge edenial, no damage mitigation, no stance/enchant/shout, no movement/kiting...) while hitting them with a supernatural damage output. Don't take me wrong I don't mind a very high difficulty level, but this place strongly encourages gimmick groups (e.g: using a defensive 'tank') which are neither particularly fun nor hard to play once the first couple of tutorials have been released.

A large majority of players is bitching because this place is too hard, but personally I'm disappointed because it's only a show of brute monster force. No originality, no strategy needed, no ingame thinking needed. Heck, even most PvE challenge missions are more thrilling than this place. My strongest grudge against DoA is that players only have to find the right cookie-cutter build, and practice.

Granted during the first few days or weeks, masochist players will use their brain and experience to find the best cookie-cutter build after hours and hours of failure. But don't be fooled, the think-and-design period won't last long. The main design flaw with DoA is that with a minimum of trial and errors, such a simple show of brute monster force is easy to crack down, and once it's been cracked, defeating it is a just matter of spare time and build copy/pasting.

Lastly, it's good to see some PvE content injected for true hardcore players, but I'm slightly disappointed to see there is nothing left for the others: no difficulty curve with intermediate rewards, no way to explore the area (ex: the slave quest in SF), no original quest or level design, no reward incentive (who still cares about rare weapon skins ?)...

My only relief is that a monk will surely fit in ANY cookie cutter build ever

Found myself having fun yesterday, trying Stygian(sp). We got to the bonefiends - lvl 28 bonefiends hurt btw.

What was nice, nobody rage quit. We tried something a few times with some success. So now I know what the area delivers, it is not impossible. We did manage to take out a bunch of the mobs.

had 2 monks, 2 ele, 2 trap rangers, Derv, and Necro(BiP) - not an ideal set up. The point is, all were willing to try - and nobody was yelling at the monks or anyone else when they died.

At the same time a Guildie was trying another area. We later were moving diff chars through game together, the "you've been playing for: x hours" message came up. He went "wow" a bunch of that was wasted time - refering to DoA.

My guild mate is a good player as am I - 2 diff people with 2 diff perspectives on this new area. My guild mates heart remains with prophecies however, his big thing now is to run his new NF chars through with heroes.

All I can say is I will continue to try, use diff builds, read forums to see what others have tried, etc. BTW - those not sharing skills, etc. what are you afraid of?

ign - Huntress Velasca

At the moment, even though I have access to the elite area, I have no real urge to play there. I find that playing around in the normal Nightfall area, including Torment, is good enough for me.

Maybe sometime down the line I'll try it more seriously.

I'm glad it's there for when I'll need a challenge.

I hope for the sake of the human race you are not serious.

In the city at least, we've been using snares, the walls of the terrain and tapping on the aggro bubbles of mobs to draw out and eliminate stragglers, allowing a fragmented (partial wipes or being split by patrol)/weakened (by err7s etc) team to take down significantly larger enemy parties.

Perhaps could take offensive spirits instead...maybe Dissonance, Pain, Shadowsong and Restoration.

This is so very wrong.

One thing that DoA enforces is everyone to play naturally. Caster standing in one spot for one minute, casting 5 second nukes and never getting hit is not natural. That's pre-searing difficulty.

Kiting is the first thing everyone must learn to make it there. It's the only way to prevent damage that anyone can do. Kiting is one of crucial skills to completely eliminate damage dealt to your group.

Playing normally:
- e-denial: one of very normal and basic anti-caster techniques
- stances/shouts/enchants: Stance tank is the CORE of every group, they are what makes frost groups work, Spell Breaker, protection monk, aegis, bonders are the CORE of builds, Healer's Boon, every monk is heavy enchant based, so are casters
- damage mitigation is the CORE of every build - see bonder, prot monk, Incoming, they're on fire, stand your ground, wards, and more and more and more. These places are first about damage mitigation, then damage dealing
- Gimick groups do not exist and do not work unless you follow all of the above
- supernatural damage output? so wrong again. The only thing that makes the enemies so dangerous are their healers. And healers shutdown is one of most common techniques everyone should learn from first hour of gameplay

Every single point you mentioned is the exact opposite of what you must do to even survive one group.

Anyone who assumes that will find DoA really Dead on Arrival.

Your list is "DO NOT DO THAT" list for DoA.

If we consider the Deep we can see there was some originality there, the KD's and all the strategy to kill Kanax, but here is brute strength.

Also the difficulty itself. I don't find normal that I never got through the first mob, that simply isn't normal

Yes, a map that has made all cookie cutter build obsolete forcing players to come up with new builds - including using non warriors as tanks, non SS/MM and Fire eles as source damage, as monk as the only healing source - lacks strategy and originality.

Yes you are right. I see your point.

Let me bring my 2 fire eles, 2 stance tanks, 2 monks and 1 MM/1 SS and be done with it. According to your logic that should work. Or at least 5 Nukers, 1 BiPer and 2 monks.

:?

You're trying to brute force your way through, and it's not working.

It's the Deep that suffered from brute force problems, and where one single "cookie cutter" build emerged with nothing coming close.

Yes, a map that has made all cookie cutter build obsolete forcing players to come up with new builds - including using non warriors as tanks, non SS/MM and Fire eles as source damage, as monk as the only healing source - lacks strategy and originality.

Yes you are right. I see your point.

Let me bring my 2 fire eles, 2 stance tanks, 2 monks and 1 MM/1 SS and be done with it. According to your logic that should work. Or at least 5 Nukers, 1 BiPer and 2 monks.

:?

The only cookie cutter I ever saw in The Deep was that you had to bring KD's, everything else is pure optimization. In here apparently you have to always have MoF otherwise you can't pass the first mob.

I believe I've tried it with about 10 different PUG's with MoF and we never passed the first mob. Maybe it's all people that isn't skilled, or perhaps there's another problem...

Let me say I now love my sin more than ever. Still need to test it out with a full guild team, but decimating a couple groups using 1 other player and heroes isn't too bad. With humans they might be smart enough to spread out from barrage.

I believe many players try and ignore, or at least minimize, the amount of e-denial, shutdown, interrupt and counter inherent to the Guild Wars skillsets.

See, pretty much every MMORPG out there nowadays relies on the three basics of tanking, healing, and doing damage.

Once a long time ago, there was a 4th piece of this, but it was phased out, due to pvp player demand : Crowd Control. In older MMOs, you had classes that kept multiple mobs mezzed, so the party could concentrate on 1 or 2 at once.

Now, GW doesnt have real CC, but it has counters, interrupts, and e-denial. I would actually group that together in:

Counter

Interrupt

Most people play without either of those, Counter meaning things like blind, daze, weakness that counter the strengths and roles of the target, and interrupt meaning the shutdown or hindering of the targets skill usage.

These 2 are concepts that apparently never were absolutely needed except maybe for Boreas Seabed in a PUG, and it seems to be people like to ignore those functions, and stick to the old tank, heal, damage routine.

Actually, in GW PUGs, its often reduced to damage/heal routine, with tanking being nonexistant.

The Deep was designed in a way that allowed a simple cookie cutter of tank/heal/damage, with the only complication of Knockdowns, to work so well it basically did not force anyone to alter their playstyle from Sorrows Furnace.

Urgoz Warren was and is Ranger territory, I ll leave that out, as there are multiple ways of getting through it even with PUGs.

So now DoA seems to accomplish what others did not: Move away from being doable by MM, echo nuker, sword/shield warrior and standard monk builds.

People complain its too hard, and not clever, when its actually still too clever for them, since they dont even try to adapt, but whine that their old build, even when used "smartly", doesnt work.

Clever and challenging is NOT hitting meteor shower at the right time folks.

I'm not saying that this is for sure, I'm saying that this is my worry.

I used the example of ToPK compared to DoA because in the first case the mission was doable with a normal team, just required more than double of the time, plus coordination and cooperation, but every class could play ToPK, provided that the player was skilled both in using his character and in teamplay.

I'm worried instead, from what I've seen so far, that DoA missions are only doable with some still-to be-found CC build, with some fixed classes and skills and everything else useless.

Motivation is what sets these two places apart.

The only reward to beating ToPK is the greens. Ecto drops are too random, chests are too unreliable as well.

Therefore, ToPK evolved towards a farming build. Time being of the essense, there's no desire whatsoever for anyone to even try something new. All players have left that area never to return. There's nothing left for them. All that's left is the farming groups, who want reliable chances of getting the greens.

ToPK is dead and forgotten.

The Deep and Urgoz suffer from same problem. It's constant fighting till the end where you get a chance for a rare drop.

I see DoA as an incredible improvement over that. You get guaranteed drop, there's replay value for every character, there's lots of diversity, since each area requires different skillsets. But above all, getting to the end is not means to an end. It's rewarded, yet not the only reason.

And SF, the place everyone praises as great content, has been ran by 4-man farming builds almost since start. Nobody cares even remotely about the quests there, not only that, they are so easy, a 4 person group can do them. Even then, that place lacks rewards as well. It once again retains only the farming crowd. Quests merely determine the 4-person group setup.

#1) Given the number of people who have made progress through DoA, the area is not impossible.

#2) I have been in this with groups both cookie cutter (trappers) and random, and have made equal progress either way.

Success in DoA requires patience, coordination, and bringing proper counters/shutdowns. Knowing your enemy is the first step toward victory.

I suggest people read Sun Tzu's The Art of War, and learn a bit of strategy.

Every class CAN play DoA. Every class is useful here. This is the general breakup of what I think is a pretty good and balanced team:

The Tanks(1-2): Generally one, but I've heard people going with two tanks with sucess too.
Warrior: The standard tank, I think City is the only place where he kind of just has to stand there, since every attack will kill his energy. In the other places, he's free to whack things too.
Dervish: I haven't actually seen a Dervish take the role yet, but I've heard of groups who have. Correctly setup, they should function as well as a warrior, if not better in some areas.
Assassin: This is still experimental, but having 2 assasins with Shadowform, and arcane mimicry would give you an invincible pair of tankers that do not need any monk support, be HIGHLY mobile, and still be able to dish out damage/knockdown/conditions (again, not in City). This could also work with one assassin and another class sacrificing their elite slot for Shadow form. I'm going to try this when my other guildmate gets to DoA.

Support/Damage Mitigation (3-4):
Monks: Generally you should run one protector(to lifebond +prot spirit the tank) and one healer to help deal with spikes and damage in general.
Paragon: Great overall support character. "They're on fire" is absolutely great with SF elementalists. Signet of Return is absolutely essential when your res sigs don't refresh until the end (after you kill the boss). Angelic Bond makes your prot monk's job much easier.
Ranger: Generally the one who brings the Winter + Greater Conflag, can ditch mesmer secondary for rit secondary and bring further defenses, or can spec in offense in stead.
Ritualist: Not too sure on these, since Shelter and Union fall way too quickly. I have heard of other people using them with success though.
Necro: The only defensive role I can think of for a Necro is Biping your casters and monks, which is extremely helpful, perhaps wells too, although their use is limited.
Elementalist: I've heard people having success using wards to mitigate damage, not something I've seen personally though.

Damage/Disruption(3-4):
Elementalist: Standard SF/MS setup works well. SF is pretty much the best damage a elementalist can dish out. It's not the player's fault that A-net pretty much made SF one of the only choices if you want to do decent damage. Snares(water elemenalists) are extremely useful in the Stygian Veil.
Mesmer: Spiritual Pain + Mistrust are an excellent source of armor penetrating damage, addional skill slots can be focused on caster hate (generally the casters are the ones you have to worry about the most, especially the monks).
Rangers: Trapping is good here for overall damage and snaring. Choking Gas is excellent at disrupting casters and preventing a lot of damage by preventing them from casting those spells in the first place.
Necro: Most of the mobs are going to be highly packed, so SS would work wonders. Disease would be handy to have around too.


I mean, this in my opinion is extremely balanced. Every class plays a role, and a lot of classes can be subbed out for other classes. The only class I think that is ABSOLUTELY needed is probably a monk, but that's generally true for most teams. Winter + Greater Conflagaration is NOT required. It's very helpful, though. Plus, Mantra of Frost only takes up 1 slot. It's not that hard to just go to your Guild Hall to buy a core skill. Every class can use it, and it shouldn't affect your build significantly, not to mention, mesmer secondary offers some great synergies with most classes.

If you've been reading around, you'd see that MANY people have already beaten City and Stygien Veil. There have been many different builds that people have used (although a lot used the Winter+Greater Conflag+MoF as the core), but what's important is that pretty much all of them have been extremely balanced builds.

LOL great drops in DOA. You must be dreaming . All I hear is that you get non max crap most of the time. If your VERY lucky you might get a max gold from a chest but thats like 1 in 500 if not more. Yes you can get a gem IF you manage to finish the quest. But I see a several people CLAIMING to of finished one of these quests BUT as yet NO PROOF.

Drops ARE what motivates a LOT of people. Thats WHY TPOK and the rest are still played you CAN get good drops in limited time. You don't have to spend hours upon hours on your build or waiting for a group or fighting stupidly hard mobs.

IF you so dislike the constant fighting of The Deep and Urgoz why do you like the same but even harder constant fighting in DOA. You can't have it both ways.

Whats this 4 man farm for SF. I know of the 5 man and done it many times but never seen a 4 man.

There are people with SCREENSHOTS (screenshot forum, Elona explorer's league). People have screenshots of Primeval hero armors (randomly pops up into your inventory when you complete one of the 4 quests). People have green drops from bosses that spawn with the quest boss spawn. How much more proof do you need?

Gemstones drop as a normal drop from any of the monsters in the area. While going through city, we had 2 gemstones drop from the margonites. At the end of the quest, EVERYONE recieved a gemstone from the chest.

this was posted saturday in this thread - complete with screenshots
a walkthu , with screenshots, posted at Elonian forum

DoA: Stygian Veil completed - strategy and build
http://www.guildwarsguru.com/forum/s...php?t=10085279


but yammer on about the lack of proof ...