Dishonorable Combatant System = Mega Fail * 10^10

Played some RA today. Had no leavers and no leechers. Looks a million times better than it was before the update... freaking out cause you got a dishonor point once, especially since the system is new, is kind of overreacting, dont you think, lol? In the end its RA...

In Reply to Vazze:

Glad Title:
Here is what I was saying about the point redistribution. Those numbers that they multiplied by mean what? Anyone have an answer? They multiplied rank by 4 and points by 6? Why not 7 or 8? What does multiplying by 6 do? And like I said this skews in favor of either low ranks or high ranks. The only way to keep the point/title system even close would be to redistribute on a dynamic ratio of some sort. But simply multiplying by 6 is probably just an arbitrary number they came up with and it now represents all the hours ppl spent trying to earn those very points. If this was taxes and tax brackets and it was your money earned then it might make a little more since.

And as for this change even being necessary? Why? They had to basically dumb down a title in order for it to be more attainable but then people say the title is meaningless period? Obvious contradiction. The title and points should have remained unchanged. Through this arbitrary multiplication, where no one has seen any sort of reason behind those numbers, somebodies points and titles have been effectively lessened. Also, when you make a rank/title easier to achieve than it was before you effectively lessen the integrity of the title as a whole.

Leavers:

Yes, I have already witnessed several times people charging in and dying in order to leave more quickly. Also I have seen syncers which the system sought to alleviate. And, I have had people leave on my own team and the other team. The dishonor hex as a whole was useless and I am really annoyed by all the people that don't give second thought to what action the system prompts. Most of the people that agree with this I imagine don't really play in RA and so they read the update and say GREAT! problem solved. Umm, not really, now we have a new problem that the original problem was in fact trying to solve.

Side note to half the ppl that post here: If you are gonna say "This is great no leavers" then please be a little more detailed about exactly what you are saying. And take note of the general game play that you experience. If you see /resign or someone charging and dying then reflect that in your post.

Glad Points and Leavers:

The idea of leavers helping ppl win was'nt an argument of any sort for the dishonor hex not being in place. That was stated simply as a side note to all the ppl that apparently loathe leavers. I thought with an open mind they might see through a nice little scenario how that small inconvenience might actually allow them to "have more fun". I think we can all agree that getting beat down and not getting rezzed is altogether no fun. But, the ppl that whined about the leavers definitely did not see this afterthought and now we have a far more rigid system in place that seems to hinder only those that wish to abide by it.

And once again, "rank is just a number"? That statement is one that you hear from people with no rank who obviously could care less or enviously care about ranks. If rank is just a number why did the entire ranking system just get overhauled? About the only thing that is just a number is the 4 and 6 that the title and points were multiplied by. Those are meaningless numbers. When you say rank is meaningless but given the choice to make a TA team I am sure your belief that "rank is meaningless" would change and you would naturally choose higher ranked players. Rank = Experience & Skill;To some degree in the least.

Reporting:

I don't need to go into more detail about how this is clearly an update that ppl think will be a cure all for poor behavior in game. In reality, as I said, this will more than likely create far more problems than it hoped to solve. Kinda like this update as a whole. There are not ppl scouring over your reports. As I read earlier this is a skeletal system. If you really want to have someone banned than I am thinkin a screenshot and message to ANET are your best bet. Although, simply telling them to bug off and ignoring them works great as well and is a good rule for life in general. Hall Patrol will not always be around for you when the mean kid calls you names.

One more thing in reply:

How did progress get faster in TA and slower in RA? I mean I can see a difference in that a great team in TA will obviously go farther but unilaterally the point system is equal. There is no inherit difference in the point system. And honestly I think crippling RA's ability to gain points in comparison to TA's would probably be a bad move. RA in this state is already crippled enough.

Another thing to think about:

RA was and is the most popular PVP. I realize that a game called "Guild Wars" would lead you to believe that GvG is the most played PVP and ppl that HA exclusively will also tell you that HA is the most important. But, numbers alone will tell you that the amount of people in RA always exceeded both GVG and HA. People obviously spent a lot of time playing here and earning glad points along the way. The update as I have said seems altogether short sighted and hasty and the problems it sought to solve were compounded. Perhaps a more tentative approach should have been taken for Guild War's most popular PVP.

Thanks Vazze for the reply and gl.

By making people log off of gw? Yes, perhaps the remaining group is more social when we just look at what is left, but I would always prefer more players to more "random, wammo RA joe's" talking and Riposting' each other to death.

update is pretty stupid and sortsighted, ppl who are praising it seem to be the ones that only play ra once a week or very rarely at all, it pisses me off that they are so dillusional of what is in fact happening.

I think its a step in the right direction. There was a major problem before with leavers and leechers ect.. Now the system is new, let them work out all the bugs first.

I don't like the dishonorment system in general... the /report seems pretty annoying too... I mean I can see fixing the ab leeching problem, but even when i played ab and having 1-2 ppl missing We still won(luxons lol) so I dunno.

In ra ... leechers just wasnt a problem to me. Leavers were only because people were trying to make the most out of their time. Now no one can, and it only makes everything so much longer than it should be.
Your not going to get rid of somethng that is a feeling within everyone. Everyone wants to save time, and not waste it, you can't get rid of that by putting new laws in its place...

Wow, just wow, I played RA last night and it was actually GOOD. The dishonour system works if you ask me, I went in there for 30 minutes and I could actually PLAY for 30 minutes instead of wasting time. I think the fix was a very healthy one. Most people are sports anyways and /resign when the odds are overwhelming, I didn't see any griefing yet.

This is great. The extreme majority of negative comments are pure speculation of "this is no good because ppl will abuse", yet all the positive comments come from people that have actually EXPERIENCED the positive impact. Yes, there are a few genuine negative comments from people who got the bum deal, but the majority is just pure speculation. Don't be surprised that ANet will recognize not to include the speculative comments in their decision making. It is wasted space on this thread and only discredits gwg as a reliable source of player input. It's nice that after seeing all the threads saying "do something about the leechers" and "give us a /report command!", that ANet listened and gave us exactly what we asked for. If you didn't want it, it might have made more sense to voice your opinion then.

By eliminting the ability to leave matches though, you do what RA was meant to do in the first place, act a training ground for PvP. RA was never meant to be competitive (one of the reasons I think adding the glad title there at all was always a mistake). RA was meant to train people how to work together in a team, use res sigs, and learn about positioning. You can't do that if you quit the match to "save time."

Tried RA, had no leechers or leavers either.

Instead I sat through a few dozen teams that did not know how to use res sigs, had terrible builds, and got eaten alive by balanced teams that happened to form. I especially like the kill count maps where it's clear you'll lose within 5 seconds, and people refuse to resign so you have to sit through it for 2 minutes.

Not to mention the usual pack of runners that now, instead of leaving, just run away. Woohoo.


I guess it doesn't really matter.

Any insult to an individual or the community as a whole will be deleted. Please keep your posts on-topic and contributing.

Wow, Guildwarsguru.com is still very much alive! It's been quite awhile since I've come back in here.

I think the dishonorable system should work like this:

1. Any player that leaves a match (currently I'm only thinking of PvP in mind) before it ends (via mapping somewhere else) is treated as a "leaver" and gets a 10 minute dishonorable status that decays only when the player is logged on.

2. If a player is idle (no movement/actions received by server, likeliness of AFK leeching) in a match for say 3 mins, he/she is kicked out of the match and treated as a "leaver".

3. If a player is disconnected from a match (sudden network problems), the system waits for the next 3 mins to see if player re-connects. If the player reconnects within the stipulated time, he/she can continue with the match as per normal; otherwise, kick player out of match and tag player as "leaver" (dishonorable status will persist upon next logon). For this portion, I understand that it may be harsh on those that have genuine network problems, but the penalty is just a short 10 mins.

4. All players that leaves or is kicked out of the match should be replaced by the next person in queue. For this to happen, it is likely that the way current PvP queuing needs to be changed. This point may not be applicable or occur the same way for all PvP matches but it may work as below:

a) For RA, if a player leaves in the middle of a match, that player slot is not immediately replaced. But if the team (with the leaver wins the match), the empty slot is replaced with a new player for the start of the next match.

b) For AB, there should not be a need for a player to be in a group to play it. Instead, provide 2 options to join an AB battle: Enter Mission (as Individual) / Enter Mission (as Group). The group size can be kept at 4 (as of current) but do allow members of the other parties to be shown on party window in the match. When a player leaves an AB match, immediately match-make another available player (currently awaiting a game) to join in and balance up the situation.

c) For competitive missions (e.g. Fort Aspenwood), I feel that it would be good to change it to the same format as what I suggested for AB, i.e. players can form group of 4 to join as well. Basically, this would be similar to my suggestion for AB, an empty slot is quickly replaced by a new player to balance up the situation.

d) For Guild/team-formed PvP match types (e.g GvG), no replacements need to be done. I feel that the guilds/teams themselves should manage leavers on their own. E.g. if a member needs to leave urgently and the whole team is aware, he/she should not be penalized.

5. Players who join a (non-guild/team-formed) PvP match should be able to choose whether they wish to join the "First Available" match or "New" match. Those that pick "First Available" will be put into a queue where they can replace empty slots as a priority. The ones that picked "New" match will always have to wait for the next available match where they will always start form the beginning of the match.

So far, the above 5 points is to tackle issues with leavers and leechers (in PvP only). The flaw in the above is that while it may easily identify and punish leavers and AFK leechers, what about active leechers?

Basically, that's where the /report system could come in, although I can't see how it can't be abused by players who team up to 'bully' another player. Players should be given a limited number of chances to use /report to report a player each day (say maybe 5). If a player is deemed an active leecher, other players may cast a vote (anonymously) to flag him/her as a "leecher". When the "leecher" has collected say 30 votes (from different players) for the entire day (based on game server time), the player immediately gets a dishonorable status for the next 24 hours which decays even when the player is logged off (different form the 10 minute one I suggested at the beginning).

I apologise if some of the things I'm saying don't make alot of sense for GW but that's because I haven't been playing the game for a long time and I don't PvP much in GW; I can't say I know much about how the GW server handles PvP match-making either. I draw the above ideas from WoW (where I PvP alot) which I felt Blizzard has imposed quite adequately and may work well for GW. It's impossible to eradicate/prevent all leechers since there needs to be an obvious pattern for the system to know that a player is indeed a leecher. However, there could be methods available that can somehow minimize the number of leechers.

You know what, I started ABing and RA after this was implemented. No reports on me, and I reported one guy for running around behind me casting Blood rit the whole time. (bot and leeching). Ran into a couple of odd builds, even brought a horrible build myself and declared it on the team chat and appoligized for not changing it before hand cause I was a noob. No report.

The system works. Like gaile and several others have said, I think the claims are a little inflated about the abuse here. Also I wonder if the people complaining the loudest are the one acting in this way and are getting dishonor racked up for false claims and are mad about that.

To the op, I highly doubt you just said POF was anti-melee. it was prob more like PoF is anti-melee you fing noob. Then you get reported and the line is I did nothing wrong. In fact, you did (in that case). You insulted someone for daring to challenge your build. I belive this system will work. I also think to tweek it, anet should give large amounts of dishonor to people who falsely report.

QFT............

Yeah, well you'll always get newbs in RA. It is a training ground after all. Nothing you can do about that. At least runners and invincible builds are no longer useful.

Speculation. Seems to be getting regurgitated in respect to the update and the negative views towards it. Regurgitated btw means you continually throw it up then eat it again but in this since means that you read it in one place then repeated it.

Yes there are far fewer leavers. Please read my prior post to see what the people who previously left do now in order to "leave". This is not speculation this is common sense.

Someone please tell me where anyone officially said RA is a training ground for PVP. I am tired of hearing this speculation that is based upon nothing whatsoever. RA is the most popular arena for PVP. Go and look at the numbers if you don't believe me. Stop degrading the integrity of the Arena by insisting it is practice. If it were practice then why would they have gone through the trouble to readjust point system and change player behavior in a training arena?

And does anyone care to address the point redistribution at all or are we all just looking the other way or simply blissfully ignorant. Please read my prior post where I address this. No this is not SPECULATION this is in fact a record of what actually happened.

Also in my prior post: 1. The system helps bots. 2: Reporting is and has already proved to be useless and counterproductive. 3: Invinci Builds and Longer matches in general due to time limit and a player reaction to survive longer due to time limit. If any one has played they have seen both a spike in healers and in invinci builds. This is from experience and clearly makes since in light of the update.

SPECULATION: People who are satisfied with this update are not very experienced RA players and have yet to read my prior posts. By not experienced I mean they didn't play very regularly before the update and play very seldom thereafter. Not to be insulting but I would say that none of the people whom have read my post and posted here and agree with this update thereafter would be higher than Gladiator Rank 4. And that is me being conservative. I honestly think that Gladiator rank 3 is more likely. So if you don't really have much experience and choose not read the prior post but simply wish to throw in your two cents in regards to an update with a two line explanation of the update feel free to do so but understand that your opinion is largely speculation since it can be assumed you don't really know what you are talking about. You seldom played before and are not really playing now and it's likely that your interest lie in another form of PVP or PVE. Kind of like a dog catcher giving his opinion on brain surgery.

And: Please someone. Anyone. Explain the point redistribution. Does anyone dare. Probably not since all they would have in reply is SPECULATION.

I hope you enjoyed our adventure with the word of the day, SPECULATIONONONALATION. Now go use it as much as possible.

Ah, so r3 noobs cannot comprehend the intricate inner workings of the complexity that is RA...

Here's the thing.

PvP is for all.

This thread is dedicated to whining over /report, not over change to glad title. For some reason, nobody is whining over that.

I will SPECUALTE that this was a typo?

Yeah PVP is for ALL. Your point? Mine was that I believe, and this is speculation, that most of the people commenting on their experience rarely played and still rarely play. A low rank would signify that. It was not to be judgmental. I will also speculate that people see ranks and titles in these post and immediately go on the offensive regardless of the rank/titles context.

For some reason no one is whining over the title redistribution. Well I am. And no one has come up with a single answer so should I stop? And this post is not simply about the /report feature. It has become a thread on the update as whole. I can go through and cite several examples of this throughout the thread. And when you complain about ppl whining arent you just whining about whining? When ppl say whining it is demeaning. Aren't the whiners the people who helped create this new update? Are all the negative posts ppl whininng? We need ANET to setup an Anti-Whiner system apparently to help us with that too.

Now please answer a question I have presented or give some sort of better understanding to the topic itself. Don't post here with grammar corrections and statements that prove to be completely irrelevant to the topic.

Also, r3 being noob is an opinion all your own. I speculate you're probably not r3 or higher but nowhere did I say r3 was noob. I simply said they probably don't RA as much as higher ranked titles. This was probably a mistake to say but I feel like its an honest speculation and if you read my prior post you might agree.

Once again, make some sort of sensible contribution. Try and answer the questions posed. And plz don't resort to grammar patrol. We already see enough of that in game, along with the classic age insults and mom jokes.

I speculate you got verbally pwned. jk.

Three hours of RA (inter dis as starting location, decided not ot play till called noob.). Practically all matches were what i would describe "fun".

Since matches were 4vs4, very few were piss easy thanks to quiters, so dificulty ramped up a bit. Seen few useless builds and players ofc, but its not like RA is serious business. Higher dificulty is gonna weed them out now that "leet" players stay in game to teach em lesson.

The only bad moment was:



Funny that team oposing this "kill me" wammo was the one to protest more against his actions. Especially after facing him twice. 3vs4 is not fun, even if you are on the 4 side.

/sigh

Thank you for meaningful contribution, Mr. Pulitzer.

Dunno bout you, but that looks pretty fun, hehe.

Lol. I guess I don't need to point out what I have already said. But I will. This screenshot perfectly captures the reaction to the anti-leaver, dishonour combatant thing.

People will not leave for obvious reasons. Now they will simply play bad on purpose.

Use your brain Anet. Use your brain people. Do you think that if leaving was rampant before that people will not look for an alternative that has no repercussions. Basically the update has simply made RA a horrible playing atmosphere in general whereas it was once inconvenienced by leavers we now get to watch ppl Kamikaze and commit cyber suicide and when they do we ourselves have to wait out the match. Update was short sighted. It did not look at what actions the players would take in response.

No problem, anytime. You wanna play Hall Patrol well I'll play Pants Shanker.
If you comment on my post then try and say something relevant to the post and the questions posed which as of yet you have failed to do. /Reported for failing to use noodle.

GG.

Remove the title from RA... play in RA just to play... that solves this bs...

Um... I just wanted to say that 'Hara-kiri System' would have sounded cooler ^_^.

That is all...

Which is better then leaving. At least that way they will be forced to soak up damage.

I actually find it fun when I get n00bs who do that on my team. Makes them feel stupid when we win fairly quickly anyways. Hopefully leavers will eventually start to learn that you cant automatically tell what a players use is by their class.

The main problem with a lot of leave-rejoiners is that they are under the assumption that everyone else is playing cookie cutters just like them, and that its impossible to beat a monk team without your own monk.

guess u dont know a lotta interesting people on gw they would

So, from what I can tell:

"OMG! PvP is dying/dead! Fix it Anet!!11!"

*Anet fixes it with Dishonour System*

"OMG! PvP is full of so many noobs!!!11!"

Never Happy Syndrome strikes again.

That's because they update in big packages: best way to piss off thousands of people and never know why. It's like trying to hit a hole-in-one from 300 yards again and again and again...

Exactly. Leaving contributes nothing. At least with "suiciding" you contribute a little. Even if you just start using frenzy and healing signet, at least he's there.

How is someone killing themselves intentionally any better than a leaver?

They soak up dmg? Well yeah but they are contributing nothing and will continue to do so until you lose. My educated guess is that had they left, the substituting player the following round, should you actually win 3 vs 4, would help you win and possibly earna glad point. In this scenario leavers actually were better for your remaining games since them leaving allowed you to get a substitute.

Now in the ol' days of RA when one person left then the others were likely to leave recognizing their odds of winning were lessened. Heck of a lot easier than watching some guy kill himself then proceeding to play and being incapable of leaving the team. I really don't understand how anyone could see this as "better". Even better is when the guy that intentionally kills himself gets rezzed once and dies and then gets rezzed again thereby wasting your team's rez sigs. Better? der.

My answer to this is: No a Kamikaze player is not better than a leaver. Read the above scenario twice to fully understand it. I kind of feel like some people are shortsighted as was the update itself and simply wish to support ANETs update regardless of the logic behind it.

Obviously a guy killing himself on your team rather than someone replacing that person is not better.

Also, in regards to the idea that leavers are n00bs. Well, usually they aren't n00bs. Usually they are as experienced in 4 vs 4 as are you are if not more. They are simply basing their judgments on different winning criteria than you are they are actually in RA to win not to spend 30 minutes then go farm. And, I think everyone can agree a monk in PVE and PVP, throughout all team based play has a better chance of succeeding than a group with no monk at all. So most peoples assumptions are correct. Argue about it if you want but I think that is a fairly true statement.

And also as stated earlier on this page. Yeah throwing multiple changes into one update and completely overhauling the most popular PVP arena was a mistake in itself. Anet would have done better making small tentative changes or even, god forbid, proposing the changes on a forum so they could get some player input.

I really have come to a point with this entire discussion where I feel like people simply don't care about the issue they are discussing and therefore fail to use any logic.

Please read my first post in this thread. pls.

"Kamikaze" players are going to be a lot more rare than leechers/leavers ever were... Lemme ask this... if the glad title was removed from RA before the update would all the "serious" RA'ers who hate this report thing play in it? NO, 90% are there for the easy button on glad points, and dont actually care for the arena itself. If 8 minutes is too long a battle for you on occasion... well Ziashen arena is that way ---->

you know ra used to be called competition arenas...?

Lol, likes its done a lot of help with ppl using res sigs, and like it shows ppl how to work in a team lol, love those solo wamo/sins dont u, great teamwork? You can still learn how to play without wasting time. Obviously if you get a 55 in ur team vs 4 wars ur gona have problems if your team except him dies. If your game is going on forever, then why are we punished if we want to quit to save time? You can decide to quit or you can decide to just stop and let the team kill you. Since you can't quit(2x) without dishonor pts, your just gona have to waste your time, your teams time, and the other teams time by making them kill you and hunt the others of your team down, which who knows one other could be a runner or a super defense wamo ect.

to tell you the truth, if i got a decent ta team, my chances of winning seemed to be just the same as a decent team in ra. i went into ra because it was ezier to get into and took less time to start. all i had to do was go and play and if i got lucky got a glad pt.

btw, 90%? so lets c... if 90% of the ppl wanted to be able to get glad pts in a hypothetical view... then we > u, we would be 90% u would be 10%, we win.

well 8minutes... i remember b4 ra battles were 30 seconds- 5 minutes at normal. u could do 2-3 rounds with a 8 min battle, meaning time saved. faction is completely useless to alot of us since we've already unlocked everything anyways..

this Bust(4) guy sums up exactly how i feel about the current state of RA. i feel your pain, man. i feel your pain.

Do you think the screenshot posted doesn't in some way show you the situation clearly? And the guy that posted that was even saying how much better the system was. Lol. Look, like I keep saying the update did nothing for the leaver situation. Yes people are not "leaving" for obvious reasons, they can't win as quickly if they do. What do you think they were doing initially? Now when you say the rarity of leavers and kamikaze players is any different you are basically saying the rarity of apples and apples is different. Yes, I am sure that some leaving has been curbed by this measure simply because many people have said screw it altogether but i would guess it is marginal. Why would someone that was a leaver prior to update suddenly find themselves with a different point of view and decide he now thought that every team had an equal chance of getting a glad point? They are the same ppl, can you expect this measure to have changed their outlook. Now we have ppl killing themselves intentionally and I get to wait out the game while they do it? Great solution.
If the glad title was removed? Wow, so um thats a great comparison. Let me ask this if you told everyone scratching a lotto ticket that there were no winners do you think they would play? How about if all of you people that I am guessing must be in HA or GVG were told that fame and champ points and rank were removed? Still play? Irrelevant comparison especially in light of the fact they lessened the title's integrity so it was more attainable. Obviously the title is part of the reason the people play in RA and also part of the reason this update is so jacked since the title just got arbitrarily changed. When you took the survey and found that 90% percent of the people in RA were there to get an easy glad point well how many high ranked glads did you actually see? And when you surveyed what was the number of your pool? Oh im guessing by 90% you just mean a lot of people. Well, an easy glad was never easier than it is now so I'm not sure where you are going with that one and your numbers sound a wee bit wacky. As I stated in my first post you can throw a bot in RA now and with the dishonor system get a few glads while you sleep whereas this was close to impossible before the update. (read the full post for more detail). And your opinion about 90% of people not wanting to play in the arena itself. What? More people played in RA just to play. Do you think the same holds true with other organized PVP? No. There are more people simply playing in RA right now just to try and see what they can do thus the influx of unexperienced players. The update basically took the pickup game atmosphere and constrained it so your screwed if you wanna actually play and get left watching some guy run for 6 minutes.Hey man Zaishen arena is there for you too! Actually Halo 3 is out! And well I guess I could be worshiping Satan the Dark Overlord in my spare time. Great point-------->

Yeah sounds kinda silly right? Well your statement is. Please tell me what PVP you enjoy and should ANET decide to screw it let me point you to Zaishen arena or similarly Satan the Dark Overlord. Having to wait out matches sucks. It was not a problem before. Now it is. And for the people that actually enjoyed playing 4 vs 4 randomly this is an inconvenience we once did not have to deal with. If this were the only problem presented by this massive steaming pile of update then I would say "yeah your right I can deal" but it is part of a whole big mess and pointing to Zaishen arena doesn't help fix the issue.

And one more thing, saying RA was an ez glad point machine is pretty ridiculous. How many glad rank 7 or 8 can you recall seeing prior to the update. They were far and few between. Glad points were never easy or capable of merely being grinded. Well now you can. Also if they took HA fame and GVG champ points and every other title and multiplied the titles by 4 then the points by 6 don't you think someone would ask whether they did it accurately and fairly for everyone? Or how exactly they came to implement those numbers. Arena, both TA and RA got jacked. End of story.

Thanks ANET. Now I can either battle AI in Zaishen Arena or worship Satan.

No Im not... If the people who really hate this update think its a waste of time to play in a match for 8 mins what makes you think theyre going to run around for that long with absolutely no point every match they can and not get tired of wasting their time. A small minority will yes... but if you for a minute believe the runners will be anywhere near as abundant as leavers... well its just kinda silly is all

Lotto analogy fails... and for the HA/GvG title, they are both irrelevant they could remove both for all I care because I never played in PvP for the titles, I played just for the fun of playing... yes im a minority I know . (I actually HATE double fame weekends lol)

First.You either misread or misunderstood what i said about the 90% (if you reread it it will say 90% of the people who are posting about hating the report system not in those words but thats what it says). 2nd youre back on the theres a runner in every match theroy... well guess what... I played more RA matches today... not one runner. If you *actually* want to play you get a guild and go to TA (its not that hard...). RA is exactly that RANDOM ARENA, ITS NOT ORGANIZED PVP.


If you actually enjoyed 4v4 randomly you wouldnt have anything against the reporting system im sure... Its even more inconvenient to have people leave 4 out of every 5 matches because its not a perfect team setup in a random team environment lol. Having to "wait out a match" sounds like its torture to you... all of 8 mins of hell eh? If its that bad dont RA, get a guild and TA then no more waiting matches... lol


Really? Why were there leavers again? Was it to have certain pvpers to go up against noobs to grind glad points because it was eaisier than fighting people of their own skill level?? no never... lol nuff said.

I sympathise, but I think this comes down to the usual thing of "its better to be doing something, then nothing!"

If he cant leave ... why join at all?

IF it all about not being able to surf teams to get perfect one ... TA is there for you.

ToP PvPers shoukd be able to leave mending whammos when and where they want. They are above the PVE scrubs. They have a bigger e-peen, you know. That give them the right to piss off mending whammos. This Dishonor system screw their leaving-leeching-jackassing rights, earned from their hard work on the ladder.