Canthan Grandmaster Cartographer in a day - What's A-Net going to do about it?

Just an exe that runs the game and replaces its graphics files and runs alternative ones (.tpf) files at the same time, through the game. All client-side, so no way the servers can even detect this.

I know they've said its fine, my post was in response to someone who said Gaile is looking in to it or something.

The last two responses are different. So it DOES replace some files? Then yes, it can be banned. It doesn't need to be detected serverside.

My point was that if the mod is hard to ban, then perhaps that is the only reason they agreed to it? To stop any debate on it.

No, it doesn't. It's like sticking a post-it on your screen. Maybe.

Doesn't modify any files, just runs new ones on top of it.

Just for education purposes:
TexMod runs GW for you and waits for certain requests to draw shapes or objects to come out of GW. It intercepts those requests and substitutes a different image. The request then continues along to your vid card.

It is not replacing actual files.
It can't change actual functionality.
It can't click a button, send a command, or anything similar to it.

It just replaces skins.

The mods haven't seen this mess yet?

Oh and how would you do that?

Very funny: GW killed my Office application because it didn't like its dlls!

Come on, stop trolling, please.

Yeah sure. And why stop there? Why not detect if you're running P2P software? Or visiting pr0n sites? I mean if your GW software start looking around, that's going to be funny on GWG .

(note to the reader: this is not acceptable behaviour, but since Anet is pretty smart they will never get close to this)

I said it wouldn't need to detect stuff server side, I think it could do it client side.

I wasn't trolling you are doing that with your post... I think it's easy to do, if it was a dll file. Especially since they would know exactly what to ban. Do you code? :].

Being able to see the places we still need to open up should've been something integral to the game and not having to resort to a mod.

I would not have patience to do it otherwise.

I do have a life beyond this game; to blindly try every little gap would've been a ridiculous waste of time. Thank heavens for CHOICES that allow players to be able to make sense of what would otherwise be the silliest title in Guild Wars.

Much better explaination, ty bobrath

i got grandmaster cartographer on my character without using texmod. texmod would not have helped me out one bit since i played the game by scraping from the onset.

with that said, i really don't care that people are using texmod to get that last 0.1% of the map. honestly, i would have done the same thing. i think the "playa haterz" against using texmod are those who want everyone else to suffer multiple area scraping just like them. and i think that's just a sad commentary on humanity in general since you see these types of issues in other areas in real-life (look up 80 hour work week for medical residents).

lol, my thoughts exactly. Guru's official policy is that rant threads are not allowed, yet most of the posts on Guru are rant threads.

I mentioned a thread on this site to a guildie a while back and he responsed, "oh guru? I only use it for price checks. I never read other threads. It's just full of hate trolls." I was surprised to find that quite a few people that I've met ingame feel the same way. I'm started to think they are right.

About Gaile's response....Am I the only one here (besides the OP) that isn't worried about that. Like someone said earlier, what can they do? Well, here's what they can do. Level the playing field. Modify the ingame graphics to make the fogged areas more visible for everyone. Or give cartography percentage numbers per area. Make it easier across the board for everyone and render the mod useless. Would this be a bad thing?

Sure it would make the title wayyyy easier for this generation of characters, but so what. I've only been playing a year but I've heard the horror stories from the veterans...
- Way back in my day we had to cap skills while the boss was still alive!
- Way back in my day we had to figure out the missions without wiki!
- Way back in my day we didn't have uber pimped out heroes to help us fight!
- Way back in my day we didn't have 4 tabs of storage. We had to make do with 1!!!!
- Way back in my day the Doppleganger had a whole gammit of skills to run!
- Way back in my day my minion master didn't have the luxury of flesh golems and jagged bones!
- Way back in my day had to trudge to school 5 miles in the snow uphill both ways!!!!

Get the point?

I don't agree that textmod gives an unfair advantage. It definitely makes the title easier, but it's also available to everyone. If only a select few had access to the mod then I could see the problem. I also highly doubt that 2 guys loaded up the mod and earned the title in a day. Maybe if they were already at 95%+. It's not an instant title getter. As a matter of fact, I think the Tyrian version of the mod is useless. It's way off. It shows areas as unfoggable that cannot possibly ever be reached. No, I'm not talking about little corners here or there. I mean huge sections of fog in places that do not exist in town. I can post a screenie if needed.

This is not a flame, merely an observation. It looks like you are mainly annoyed; they did it in a day, and it took you work and effort to do. It seems like a sort of childish jealousy, which in the case of you working hard and long to get the title, is acceptable.

However I have to say; if the means to do it quickly had been around when YOU started to decide you wanted the title, I find it very very difficult to believe that you would not also have used it. It saves stress and time. I mean granted, not really very nice of them to go around bragging. Infact, it shows they have pretty much nothing better to do.

Personally I don't think Anet has to do anything. They broke no rules in getting this title; they were just being morons for rubbing it in everybodies face that they did it quickly. Hell I know people who use the texmod and STILL it takes time for them to do it.

Did they tell you the percentage they STARTED at? It had to be 70-90 already if they managed it in a day.

OGC Aimbot was available to everyone in CS. I guess it's fair. Floored logic, sorry. You said it yourself, it gives an advantage of which you can only gain if you are to download and use.

Photoshop/Gimp/Paint gave advantages. Posting on the forums and getting others to compare their completed maps with yours gave advantages. How far do you want to take it? :P

I never said I agreed with photoshop either. It also doesn't run while the game is running. So your point is moot, thanks.

Okay, sorry

I won't go into the game of "who's got the biggest one" in terms of programming, because we could end up in a pretty stupid game. But I'll ask you the same question I asked in reply to your PM: how would you "ban a dll"? (that's actually not the interesting question, which is rather "where would you stop", but that's the one implied by your statement)

This mod should be put into the game by anet. It improves the gameplay experience.

Ironically, thanks to this thread, I might actually go for this title now.

Thanks Torqual!

If ANet wanted to prevent the usages of these Cartography mods, they'd have to ban Texmod mods altogether, and here's why:

-If ANet had the power to tell which mods people are running, it wouldn't be enough. People could rename the files so it wouldn't say "easycartomod.tpf" and instead like "blueparashield.tpf" (.tpf files are the Texmod files, if you're wondering.)

-They wouldn't be able to ban people who're using mods that are modifying the map, because someone could've just added a little doo-dad or a signature or some pointless modification to the map.

-I don't think ANet would have this kind of technology/programming anyways.

So the only safe, sure alternative? Ban the use of Texmod works altogether.

First off, it's not a piece of programming at all. It's nothing more than an image file. Saying "it's a piece of programming" will give people the assumption that this is some sort of bot - which it is not.

Secondly: Point me in the direction of the person who made this fantastic feat of acquiring 40% of an uncovered map in half a day. Hell, find someone who made 40% in a whole day.

Find him? Didn't think so. Stop making up facts, please, because people will believe you. Now, excuse me as I go Loviatar on this thread for a sec: THE CARTOGRAPHY MOD DOES NOT MAKE IT THIS EASY. The mod in NO WAY adds any easier routes to your mapping. It is nothing more than having a map in your hands that tells you where to go. It doesn't do anything for you, you still have to wall-walk every single inch of the map, it still takes a long and irritating time, that is all. It just shows you where not to waste your time.

This is my final post on this subject.

I have had a change of mind.

When I originally posted on this yesterday, it was in the Canthan Explorer's forum. It was not my intention to generate 15 pages of grief. The post was moved into The Riverside Inn by a moderator without my knowledge or consent.

It is fairly obvious that the opinions I have expressed are at odds with the vast majority of the Guild Wars Guru community. I had underestimated use of the 'Cartography Made Easy' tool and it's now evident that only a very small minority of Legendary Cartographers obtained their title without using the tool. And even those that did, a fair number are positive towards the use of it by others. Obtaining 100% cartography titles using Texmod is now the de facto 'normal' method and players should not be criticised for following where others have led.

This tool is clearly valued very highly by the community for making accessible a title that was seen as too difficult by most players. Furthermore it is a great piece of programming and a showpiece in the world of GW mods.

It's clear that taking away this mod or the titles that were rapidly-obtained with it would cause a great deal of unhappiness and do more harm than good.

My only request is therefore, to make a level playing field for everyone, the 'unfogging' and borderlines appearance of the in-game minimap should be implemented in the standard guild wars client to mirror Texmod so that all players can benefit from the vastly increased ease of Cartography and enjoy obtaining the titles. Personally, I would enjoy going for Cartography titles with some of my other characters, using this kind of map that clearly highlights unexplored areas. So, please implement this for everyone.

I wish to finish by making a complete and utter retraction of everything I have said in posts above. Please disregard all my previous posts as the incoherent rantings of a lunatic. All my views expressed are false, and unrepresentative of the community as a whole.

Please Gaile Gray, post that you will not take action over this and that there is nothing wrong with using this mod.

Now, this is no longer my issue. I wish to be left alone to enjoy the game in peace. I will not be reading this thread further and I hope that it is closed soon and forgotten sooner.

that's not a good comparison. aimbot gives a distinct advantage versus those without in a competitive environment. this texmod mapping method does not affect anyone other than yourself (unless you count the faster it takes to achieve legendary, which positively affects everyone else by increasing favor time).

And this will be my final post (at least for today : P) about the subject:

Again, it's not a piece of programming. It's just an image file. Secondly, a lot of people here don't want to lose the Carto mod because it makes things just a wee easier, but rather for the reasons I stated before: *The only way to remove the use of this cartomod is to eliminate the uses of mods altogether.* I don't want that. It's wonderful that Guild Wars can become so personal now. I don't want that taken away from a game I love.

@Jhu: It's still cheating. Just like typing 'giveall' in quake was cheating. If everyone got the title much quicker, it would make drastic changes to favour, too. Not just a small one. This could mean that people farm fow more, and prices drop. There is also the fact that some may like to show off their title and it would lose meaning if it became super easy to get. I can see it now 'oh you used texmod to get it', 'no I didn't'. Just like botting to get money, you can argue you're not cheating against someone, but it can effect the economy. It's still cheating regardless of if it effected the economy though. The point about aimbot (and wallhack is more of a fair comparison), it is doing things for you. Who said I was talking about aimbotting vs people, and not the computer?

@Fril Estelin:
Honestly I was not trolling. I made the dll comment with ignorance, clearly. The point was not about banning a dll as such. It was that I would think the thing could be banned easily (forbid you to run it) if it was say a dll.

It would be like saying: If someone distributed an aimbot in CS, everyone knew about it, but there was only one aimbot going around. Then it would be easy to remove. I think if this mod IS to be banned, someone won't waste enough time re-making it, to get over cheat protecting and then re-distributing. I could of course be wrong. I am glad that you know about coding. Seriously. That makes the answer so much easier. As this is just an 'image file' surely they could just hash that?

When I said knowing what to ban, I meant they would have the file. They wouldn't have to search private forums for it or something. It is easier to make anti cheat protection if you know what you're fighting against.

As you don't know what a troll is, here's to help: Seriously, you got the wrong idea, and you completely made a big deal over nothing. Leave me alone.

P.S. Trolling would be talking about how you like to run charm animal on your elementalist .

I agree wholeheartedly. OP did not have his facts straight, and his later posts demonstrate that he still does not have his facts straight. If we're looking at the possibility of modding getting shut down over this, I want "the board" to be looking at what these mods really can and can't do for you, and NOT at OP's warped and exaggerated description.

That last sentence was so important, I'm going repeat it in bold. <ahem>

IF WE'RE LOOKING AT THE POSSIBILITY OF MODDING GETTING SHUT DOWN OVER THIS, I WANT "THE BOARD" TO BE LOOKING AT WHAT THESE MODS REALLY CAN AND CAN'T DO FOR YOU, AND NOT AT OP'S WARPED AND EXAGGERATED DESCRIPTION.

This idea is an old one and a good one. It's what I've always wanted to see for carto.

That and the outermost ring of fog (beyond the edges of the passable terrain) simply not counted as part of the title track (not needed and no credit if you uncover it).

I think you strike perfectly at the heart of the matter. At least with regard to OP's initial post. OP wanted to feel special. He wanted to feel better than the rest of us. He used to feel that him having the Canthan carto title while the rest of us didn't made him special. Now that so many people have it too, he doesn't feel special any more. His response? Complain to a-net to "nerf other people." It's the same pathetic elitist sentiment that infects the community in too many other respects. I'm glad that OP seems to have changed his mind in his final post. I just hope that the community doesn't lose this and other great mods because of it.

Sry didn't read your final post, replied to an earlier one

except that it's not a program but an image file as pointed out by Bryant Again

Do you consider it cheating to read about a mission or quest on a wiki?

Do you consider the use of EOTN consummables to be cheating?

Do you consider people using photoshop to compare screen shots (for help with the carto titles) a form of cheating?

Read what he said:
As for this:
Already answered it.

I'm sick of repeating myself.

So, when you go to cap elites, you just randomly pick a zone, clear it, and hope the boss you want is there?

horray for laziness. quit being lazy and "needing" a tool to help you. do these titles really up your selfesteem? its seems that it does

No, but it helps us get rainbow phoenix on non-main chars

(havent used the mod myself for my main, using it now on 2ndary chars)

My self-esteem isn't based on a game.

Nor do I use these mods, since I have no interest in the Cartography titles. 98% of the map is good enough for me; I doubt that last 2% holds any wonders.

I am disturbed by Gailes' esponse to the OP. ANet includes these mods on their official wiki, with explicit approvalf or their use; it seems quite hypocritical to decide to take "action" now.

Of course, it could well be that ANet is afraid that people will realize that the current game is nothing more than repeating the same material over and over again.

Most of the features introduced since the beginning of 2007 have been "make work" -- time-consuming retreads of existing material. If a grind title like Cartographer gets too easy... well, they need to keep folk addicted and grinding if they hope to have an intact playerbase for GW2.

Shouldn't this thread be closed now? Is there anything really left to "discuss"?

Either Anet condemns this mod, and with it, all user based mods.

Or it stays as is.

No because they don't give an unfair advantage, and the second one is part of the game that everyone who has EOTN has access to. Third one, you still have to figure out where the clouds dont' match, you don't get it out in red and obvious. Anyone who got the title before this mod knows it's god damn hard to max it, I got to 97 and got sick of it and you hear about all these people who have like .1 they have left and they can't find it. You have to scrape every wall and if you can't find which wall it is you'll have to go through the whole game again. This mod is pretty much a free 3 titles and monuments to everyone who downloads it. And dont' think no one is going to do it. Everyone who wants the max titlez is going to want it. You still have to walk there to get it, but it removes the Hours with a capital H of guess work and walking/wall scraping to find it. If it did'nt give an unfair advantage or an advantage alone who would download it?

Call it the mod that killed the honor of the title, it's a waste of time to do it the non-modded way now. Don't be like Socrates and die for principals when you can escape, save your self the frustration, time and mod the damn thing. But if you're one of those people who does'nt like downloading stuffs, I'm sorry for your loss of time, but I would'nt continue normally if I were you. All you can do is hope that Anet will make their fog more clear.

Jumped straigt to the end after reading this, could be covered by others.

Many screenshots, align and paste layers?
You never did compare, that's a thing that's true...
A single zoomed-out map at decent resolution (1280x1024 or larger) is all you need.

That's the way Tyrian exploration was done and how I did compares for guildies on both Cantha and Elona.

You also mention that there seems no update on the screen when walking along some edges.
Also not entirely true.
It's however a small difference, not always visible when you don't pay close attention to the edges on the compass and U-map.

I'm a LC from long before Texmod and did not get any help from the forum on compares.
I however did help others and have earned my tracks with my postings on that subject.
Not only compares, but also (a sticky) posting on where most missed Tyrian spots are.

I have my proven trackrecord on this subject and you tell me that I am talking nonsence?
To me it seems you are taking this way to serious!

I think using the mod de-values it for those people, but it doesn't de-value it for me. I don't play to prove I'm better than them and even before the titles came out I was mapping every nook and cranny of Tyria just because...

Some people map different ways though. When I map I usually run unless I have to fight an area of mobs. There's no way I could do it in a day without a mod like that. Everyone has different skills. The fact they got theirs quick using a mod should bother you unless you all are in some kind of tight knit real-life group that talks about that stuff. I also map as I play throug a game then go back and run zones I know I didn't map. When I have the last piece sometimes it can take a while sometimes it goes quick. I've done it with several characters so I have a feel for what I may be missing. If you're clearing each zone to map then you may be making it longer unless you get every nook and cranny before leaving, otherwise you have to clear it again.

Summary: Ignore them, especially if you don't even know them in real life. Unless someone's cheating or using a mod prevents you or me from doing something, who cares. If it doesn't prevent you from doing anything, it's just an ego thing (which I admit, having KOABD that KOABD is an ego thing and is neat to have).

i can do them all in a day... Textmod FTW .. thats how i got mine lol

i didnt know cartographer titles had any value

why are a few of you so self righteous about a measly little title that doesnt effect your gameplay?

if players want to use a mod to aid them, let them its no different than looking up a fully explored map to see what areas you need to uncover
so what are you saying? these titles are worth value or not?

i got legendary grandmaster cartographer prior to learning about texmod. the only issue is having to wall scrape. that's not that hard. even if you start out mapping from the beginning by wall scraping, it still takes hours upon hours to do. it's a rather colossal waste of time.

type 'giveall' although "cheating" doesn't really affect anyone except yourself, unless you're playing with other people. and if you're playing by yourself, well, who cares? so that's not a good example. as for having increased favor with more farming and decreased prices, i would consider that a good thing. with regard to aimbots, who cares if you're playing by yourself and using an aimbot or wall hack? if it affects other people, it's another issue.

i really don't know why this is getting more attention than it really deserves. the op has dropped out already. so we may potentially see a slight increase in favor prolongation (despite the fact that it still takes many many hours to complete this title). realistically, this affects no one but whoever uses it.