Mini Pig Woes... - Guild Wars Guru archive powered by Guild Wars Legacy

Rhedd

Wilds Pathfinder

Join Date: May 2005

You ever have to clean up after a Moa bird?

True Solunastra [SLA] Profession: Moa Wrangler

09 Feb 2008 at 00:53 - 521

Quote:

Originally Posted by Snow Bunny

Why don't people ever gracefully understand that charity deserves no reciprocity.

It's the RED ENGINE GORED ENGINE GORED ENGINE GORED ENGINE GOing definition of charity.

Doesn't ever deserve a kick in the teeth, either, though, does it?

I was seriously torn between playing GW during the event, or downloading a brand new copy of Sins of a Solar Empire, and playing that instead.

Shooting spaceships or a kick in the teeth... hmm... I hear outer space a-callin' me. Luckily for Anet, I'm not paying a monthly fee, so they don't care.

Snow Bunny

Alcoholic From Yale

Join Date: Jul 2007

Strong Foreign Policy [sFp]

09 Feb 2008 at 00:53 - 522

Quote:

Originally Posted by Gli

And why can't you understand that regardless of whatever useless platitudes you have to offer, it's still not a good idea to go out of your way to screw over charitable people.

It wasn't designed to screw them over. If you think about it economically, pre-event pigs were primarily in the hands of players with low amounts of gold, seeing as their low stashes of gold afforded them only the most worthless pets.

Now with most pigs ranging between 10-100k, those players have more breathing space, and the players who gave them away obviously had no investment in them financially from the start.

Try to think in more than one dimension, alright?

Savio

Teenager with attitude

Join Date: Jul 2005

Fifteen Over Fifty [Rare]

09 Feb 2008 at 00:53 - 523

Quote:

Originally Posted by Gli

And why can't you (gracefully or otherwise, I don't care) understand that regardless of whatever useless platitudes you have to offer, it's still not a good idea to go out of your way to screw over charitable people?

How exactly are they screwed over?

electrofish

Frost Gate Guardian

Join Date: Jun 2006

09 Feb 2008 at 00:54 - 524

I'm sooooo glad that I got myself into a situation where i'm caring less and less about GW.

However, this idea of celestial pig is the worst yet... I completely agree that Anet is smacking the charitable people in the face with a sledge hammer with this.

Gli

Forge Runner

Join Date: Nov 2005

09 Feb 2008 at 01:02 - 525

Snow Bunny, Savio, being disingenuous isn't cool or sophisticated.

Snow Bunny

Alcoholic From Yale

Join Date: Jul 2007

Strong Foreign Policy [sFp]

09 Feb 2008 at 01:03 - 526

Quote:

Originally Posted by Gli

Snow Bunny, Savio, being disingenuous isn't cool or sophisticated.

Being unable to intelligently explain your lack of charitable spirit isn't cool either

Gli

Forge Runner

Join Date: Nov 2005

09 Feb 2008 at 01:05 - 527

I'm able to explain myself, I just don't think it's worth my time to elaborate on what is obvious to most people.

Gun Pierson

Forge Runner

Join Date: Feb 2006

Belgium

PIMP

Mo/

09 Feb 2008 at 01:07 - 528

Maybe making the mini pig common white a while ago instead of leaving it gold would have been a better solution, while abandoning the idea of celestial minis. But it's too late now anyway.

If you can, try to let this all go and enjoy the game. But it's good ofcourse that people voice their opinion.

Savio

Teenager with attitude

Join Date: Jul 2005

Fifteen Over Fifty [Rare]

09 Feb 2008 at 01:13 - 529

Quote:

Originally Posted by Gli

I'm able to explain myself, I just don't think it's worth my time to elaborate on what is obvious to most people.

It's not obvious at all, since I'm not assuming the same things you are.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Gun Pierson

Maybe making the mini pig common white a while ago instead of leaving it gold would have been a better solution, while abandoning the idea of celestial minis.

Does it really matter what color text the minipig has?

Rhedd

Wilds Pathfinder

Join Date: May 2005

You ever have to clean up after a Moa bird?

True Solunastra [SLA] Profession: Moa Wrangler

09 Feb 2008 at 01:14 - 530

Quote:

Originally Posted by Snow Bunny

Being unable to intelligently explain your lack of charitable spirit isn't cool either

Allow me.

I don't think anyone here regrets being charitable. I know if I had it to do over again, I would still give all of those piggies to my friends (and strangers), and I've never once considered asking for them back, even though I have a couple of friends that have one that don't even play GW anymore.

Being nice is its own reward, and I don't think anyone here fails to realize that.

Sometimes, in real life, a person does something nice, and it turns out to make them suffer a bit, in the long run. We laugh, say, "oh well, that's life", and move on.

GW is NOT real life. "Life" is not punishing good deeds, here. It's an actual living human being with authority, even god-like powers, to effect the world and change it, that has DECIDED to punish good deeds. It was a conscious choice.

Did Anet not know what's been going on for a year? They have absolutely no right not to, and therefore I have to assume they did, and wanted to reward people that hoarded pigs instead of giving them away, or went out and bought them for outrageous prices, or sold them for outrageous prices.

Conversely, they must've wanted to try, at least, to make people that gave them away feel like crap.

It's not your place to tell those people whether to rise above this slap in the face, or feel, rightfully, like crap (just like Anet obviously wanted).

Gun Pierson

Forge Runner

Join Date: Feb 2006

Belgium

PIMP

Mo/

09 Feb 2008 at 01:16 - 531

Quote:

Originally Posted by Savio

Does it really matter what color text the minipig has?

Not to me, but gold seems to represent 'rare'. Labeling it common + white would have been another way to deal with the overpopulation maybe. Just like a troll or a devourer etc.

Zesbeer

Banned

Join Date: Oct 2007

LLJK

09 Feb 2008 at 01:18 - 532

i for one think that they should just change it to if you got a pig you can get a new one. i don't think its fair that they are pinalizeing those of us who where charitable or didnt farm the mini pets.

Numa Pompilius

Grotto Attendant

Join Date: May 2005

At an Insit.. Intis... a house.

Live Forever Or Die Trying [GLHF]

W/Me

09 Feb 2008 at 01:23 - 533

Quote:

"The Miniature Pigs: There are just too many of these "out there" in the overall scope of things. Too many people got them in too many final events last year and they have (or at least had) a rather pitiable value."

So it was all about ANet price-fixing the minipig. I wonder at whos request.
And I wonder how many pigs that someone bought the weeks before this event.

Savio

Teenager with attitude

Join Date: Jul 2005

Fifteen Over Fifty [Rare]

09 Feb 2008 at 01:24 - 534

Quote:

Originally Posted by Rhedd

Being nice is its own reward, and I don't think anyone here fails to realize that.

If people realized that, then why would they feel bad about not being able to acquire something?

Quote:

Originally Posted by Gun Pierson

Labeling it common + white would have been another way to deal with the overpopulation maybe.

There still would have been a million minipigs everywhere. Nothing would have changed.

Hyper Cutter

Desert Nomad

Join Date: Jun 2006

Knights of the White Eye [HINA]

09 Feb 2008 at 01:29 - 535

Quote:

The Miniature Pigs: There are just too many of these "out there" in the overall scope of things. Too many people got them in too many final events last year and they have (or at least had) a rather pitiable value

So I guess that means they're going to do something like that with all those worthless 1st year minis (troll, devourer, wallow, etc)? After all, they're worth little more than the pigs were

Also, this whole fiasco could have been avoided if they'd just done the celestial pig thing LAST year, shortly after the festival...

Snow Bunny

Alcoholic From Yale

Join Date: Jul 2007

Strong Foreign Policy [sFp]

09 Feb 2008 at 01:30 - 536

Quote:

Originally Posted by Savio

If people realized that, then why would they feel bad about not being able to acquire something?

Precisely

1234567

Darkveil

Academy Page

Join Date: Jan 2006

LoG

Me/N

09 Feb 2008 at 01:32 - 537

Quote:

Originally Posted by Firebaall

For interest's sake, I want to know what the sheer monetary return would be for a player to complete all 3 chapters, and GW:EN. Without buying any "rewards", or prestige items...I'll bet there's alot of scratch earned.

Even more than what a single Celestial Pig would sell for, I would wager.

If you dont spend anything on expensive dyes, runes, elite armor or rare weaponry above 500g, I'd say somewhere around 200-350 plats...easily!
It includes picking up and selling every drop you get and completeing all side quests, cashing in the rewards. Then there may be a positive gold adjustment in chance of finding and selling a true rare item or two on the way.

By the time I reached Granite citadel in Tyria first time around I had about the exact worth of gold - by just playing the game - for the elite armor and two black dyes

Now me and my two kinds of pigs are going oUT for a walk

Cheerio!

Numa Pompilius

Grotto Attendant

Join Date: May 2005

At an Insit.. Intis... a house.

Live Forever Or Die Trying [GLHF]

W/Me

09 Feb 2008 at 01:33 - 538

Quote:

Originally Posted by Hyper Cutter

So I guess that means they're going to do something like that with all those worthless 1st year minis (troll, devourer, wallow, etc)? After all, they're worth little more than the pigs were

Doubt it. The "someone" who got ANet to do this isn't likely to be able to hoard as many of those as it was possible to hoard of the minipig. "Someone" made millions on this, I have no doubt about that whatsoever.

Rhedd

Wilds Pathfinder

Join Date: May 2005

You ever have to clean up after a Moa bird?

True Solunastra [SLA] Profession: Moa Wrangler

09 Feb 2008 at 01:38 - 539

Quote:

Originally Posted by Savio

If people realized that, then why would they feel bad about not being able to acquire something?

Quote:

Originally Posted by Snow Bunny

Precisely

God, you people will. Not. Read.

There were other sentences in my post, you know.

I give up.

Gli

Forge Runner

Join Date: Nov 2005

09 Feb 2008 at 01:42 - 540

I don't blame you, I gave up a few posts ago.

I'm off, going to beat up some Red Cross volunteers. They've had it coming for a long time.

Savio

Teenager with attitude

Join Date: Jul 2005

Fifteen Over Fifty [Rare]

09 Feb 2008 at 01:42 - 541

Quote:

Originally Posted by Numa Pompilius

Doubt it. The "someone" who got ANet to do this isn't likely to be able to hoard as many of those as it was possible to hoard of the minipig. "Someone" made millions on this, I have no doubt about that whatsoever.

Oshi, conspiracy time! What next, VoD was changed to let a specific guild win the next tourney? Who do I pay to get GM chat?

Quote:

Originally Posted by Rhedd

There were other sentences in my post, you know.

I know, but they have nothing to do with being charitable. You only feel like crap if you're concerned about gold and items, which is a separate issue.

Numa Pompilius

Grotto Attendant

Join Date: May 2005

At an Insit.. Intis... a house.

Live Forever Or Die Trying [GLHF]

W/Me

09 Feb 2008 at 01:47 - 542

Savio: Gimme a break. ANet suddenly, after a year of not caring, decides to intervene to raise the price of the most common and worthless mini in the game. Since you know it all, you tell me why.

Snow Bunny

Alcoholic From Yale

Join Date: Jul 2007

Strong Foreign Policy [sFp]

09 Feb 2008 at 01:47 - 543

Quote:

Originally Posted by Gli

I don't blame you, I gave up a few posts ago.

I'm off, going to beat up some Red Cross volunteers. They've had it coming for a long time.

Go do that.

I'll donate some clothing to Goodwill, and not be upset that they're going to re-sell it.

oshi-

DivineEnvoy

Lion's Arch Merchant

Join Date: Sep 2005

Me/P

09 Feb 2008 at 01:49 - 544

Well as we can see, the current issue is simply the fact that the act of generosity is not being rewarded. With this said, I'm not claiming that there must be a reward to people's generosity, but instead, we need to understand that normal human beings have morals to both the actions they make themselves and the actions other people make. Of course, not everyone has the same standard for their morals; even so, we need to understand that an issue such like this one, where people who kept the pigs to themselves are being rewarded can upset many people. The reason is not that the complainers want to be rewarded, but they are morally outraged, since it seems that they got a slap in the face for being generous. Consequently, the discussion in this thread is more or less just the opinions made from people with different moral standards; nonetheless, it amazes me how many humans actually take their time to flame and claim others of being selfish just because they do not share the same moral standards.

Secondly, after reading the thread for 20 pages or so, I believe I know the source of this issue; a minority has misguided Anet into believing that everyone has stored their miniature pigs, and the fact that there were too many pigs flowing around. I guess this thread can more or less answer the question, who were these people. Of course, this event is done, and nothing can be changed at this point, but the real issue is what will happen in the future. In simple words, look around in this thread, who is trying to misguide Anet even more, and were they the same people who were trying to misguide Anet for a number of things?

Rhedd

Wilds Pathfinder

Join Date: May 2005

You ever have to clean up after a Moa bird?

True Solunastra [SLA] Profession: Moa Wrangler

09 Feb 2008 at 01:51 - 545

Quote:

Originally Posted by Savio

I know, but they have nothing to do with being charitable. You only feel like crap if you're concerned about gold and items, which is a separate issue.

You know, you're absolutely right, they don't.

I'll post again because I realize I wasn't expressing myself well.

This isn't about "charity", and I'm not upset because charity didn't get rewarded.

This is about injustice.

Injustice, you know... where the bad are rewarded and the good are punished?

Most decent people are made upset by witnessing injustice.

Luckily for a lot of people on this forum, it doesn't seem to bother them.

Randvek

Krytan Explorer

Join Date: Sep 2006

Rise From the Ashes [phnx]

W/

09 Feb 2008 at 01:52 - 546

Quote:

Originally Posted by Rhedd

Most decent people are made upset by witnessing injustice.

Luckily for a lot of people on this forum, it doesn't seem to bother them.

Welcome to the human race.

quickmonty

Ancient Windbreaker

Join Date: May 2005

09 Feb 2008 at 01:56 - 547

Quote:

Originally Posted by Rhedd

Luckily for a lot of people on this forum, it doesn't seem to bother them.

At the end of the day, when I turn my computer off, I realize that it is just a game and nothing matters accept that I have had fun and gotten my money's worth out of it.

RL matters .... fantasy gold means nothing.

Gun Pierson

Forge Runner

Join Date: Feb 2006

Belgium

PIMP

Mo/

09 Feb 2008 at 02:00 - 548

Quote:

Originally Posted by Savio

There still would have been a million minipigs everywhere. Nothing would have changed.

Indeed, except that they would be seen as common just like a troll. I wonder, how many trolls are out there. And why was this overpopulated pig a problem? I expected we would get a 'gold' rat like the pig last year, in large numbers. Especially since rats breed even faster than pigs

Loviatar

Underworld Spelunker

Join Date: Feb 2005

09 Feb 2008 at 02:03 - 549

[QUOTE]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Rhedd

GW is NOT real life. "Life" is not punishing good deeds, here. It's an actual living human being with authority, even god-like powers, to effect the world and change it, that has DECIDED to punish good deeds. It was a conscious choice.

Did Anet not know what's been going on for a year? They have absolutely no right not to, and therefore I have to assume they did, and wanted to reward people that hoarded pigs instead of giving them away, or went out and bought them for outrageous prices, or sold them for outrageous prices.

Conversely, they must've wanted to try, at least, to make people that gave them away feel like crap.

It's not your place to tell those people whether to rise above this slap in the face, or feel, rightfully, like crap (just like Anet obviously wanted).

IT IS ALL ABOUT GOLD LOST NOT BEING GENEROUS.

OR HAVE YOU FORGOTTEN ALL THOSE SUPER WHINING THREADS THAT MANY POSTING HERE MADE THAT THEY GAVE OUT SO MANY MINIPIGS THEY WERENT WORTH SELLING SO THE PRESENT WHINERS POSTED ON GURU THAT THEM GAVE THEM AWAY OR EVEN TRASHED THEM

TO FREE UP STORAGE SPACE FOR THE VALUABLE STUFE

GREED IS ALL IT IS

Gli

Forge Runner

Join Date: Nov 2005

09 Feb 2008 at 02:11 - 550

Screw injustice. I'm just offended by the lack of sensible consideration that seems to have gone into this action.

Who on earth would ever think that suddenly making an arbitrary non-rare item (that's no longer attainable through gameplay) more desirable by an absurd faction, overnight, without regard to actual distribution of said item among players, would turn out just fine?

I'll tell you who. No one who should be let anywhere near the decision-making process of an online game.

Changes like this can only spring from glaring incompetence, complete indifference or sheer malice. I don't like either of those three.

Snow Bunny

Alcoholic From Yale

Join Date: Jul 2007

Strong Foreign Policy [sFp]

09 Feb 2008 at 02:11 - 551

[QUOTE=Loviatar]

Quote:

IT IS ALL ABOUT GOLD LOST NOT BEING GENEROUS.

OR HAVE YOU FORGOTTEN ALL THOSE SUPER WHINING THREADS THAT MANY POSTING HERE MADE THAT THEY GAVE OUT SO MANY MINIPIGS THEY WERENT WORTH SELLING SO THE PRESENT WHINERS POSTED ON GURU THAT THEM GAVE THEM AWAY OR EVEN TRASHED THEM

TO FREE UP STORAGE SPACE FOR THE VALUABLE STUFE

GREED IS ALL IT IS

I thought you were gone Loviatar.

I love you for this.

Marry me please?

Snow Bunny

Alcoholic From Yale

Join Date: Jul 2007

Strong Foreign Policy [sFp]

09 Feb 2008 at 02:12 - 552

Quote:

Originally Posted by Gli

Changes like this can only spring from glaring incompetence, complete indifference or sheer malice. I don't like either of those three.

It's actually sensible consideration, if you think about the economics of it, as I explained earlier.

Oh wait, you probably didn't read that post.

Lady Yuna

Academy Page

Join Date: Jan 2008

inside your closet.......

ViLE

Mo/W

09 Feb 2008 at 02:13 - 553

You know what I love about Guild Wars? Its players' stupidity (and by all means, please take no offense as that is NOT pointed directly at you, by "players" I included myself as well(well, just a bit)

and I'm merely exercising my right of expression granted by the 1st Amendment

)

Its funny how people are ALWAYS complain about this and about that.... What is the frigging point? You don't automatically get 100k or 200k for free by complain, and if you're mad, just swear out loud on the forums or in your own living room( or you could play football, GREAT way to get your anger out with these forceful tackles from behind

GRRRRRRRRR

) . The worst could happen is you get banned for a few days or you get yell at by the neighbor to keep it down.

As for "staying on topic":
Anet killed game with the mini pig trading, where is all the surprises and fun?!(see, I'm complaining too, so I included myself in the beginning of my post. I am quite a kind person, if no one has noticed yet.

)

Chronos the Defiler

Desert Nomad

Join Date: May 2005

Calgary, Alberta, Canada

W/

09 Feb 2008 at 02:13 - 554

Ok so now we know the 2 new minis and how they come.

The Celestial Rat you can get through the lunar fortunes, and the "new an improved" Celestial Pig you can get by turning in 5 of the older pigs to the collector.

Anyone who bought 1 of these pigs for 100k is gonna be rightly pissed because they need 5 to get the new one...har har

Savio

Teenager with attitude

Join Date: Jul 2005

Fifteen Over Fifty [Rare]

09 Feb 2008 at 02:13 - 555

Quote:

Originally Posted by Numa Pompilius

Since you know it all, you tell me why.

What do you mean I know it all? You're the one that can explain Arenanet's actions, and with clear, sound reasoning behind them too.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Rhedd

Most decent people are made upset by witnessing injustice.

First charity, and now injustice. Injustice isn't missing out on an opportunity because you gave away an worthless, undesirable minipet that happened to become not worthless.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Gun Pierson

And why was this overpopulated pig a problem?

The problem is that people absolutely hated the minipig and other common minipets because they are so common and worthless. People like minipets that aren't so common and worthless, but hate them when they don't have them.

People want minipets, but they don't want others to have them. The solution? There isn't one. People will complain no matter what happens.

Gli

Forge Runner

Join Date: Nov 2005

09 Feb 2008 at 02:14 - 556

Quote:

Originally Posted by Loviatar

IT IS ALL ABOUT GOLD LOST NOT BEING GENEROUS.

OR HAVE YOU FORGOTTEN ALL THOSE SUPER WHINING THREADS THAT MANY POSTING HERE MADE THAT THEY GAVE OUT SO MANY MINIPIGS THEY WERENT WORTH SELLING SO THE PRESENT WHINERS POSTED ON GURU THAT THEM GAVE THEM AWAY OR EVEN TRASHED THEM

TO FREE UP STORAGE SPACE FOR THE VALUABLE STUFE

GREED IS ALL IT IS

HAVE YOU FORGOTTEN THE CONCERTED EFFORTS ON THESE VERY FORUMS, STARTING BEFORE THE EVENT WAS EVEN OVER AND BEFORE THE MARKET HAD HAD A CHANCE TO SETTLE, TO GIVE AWAY SPARE PIGGIES TO UNFORTUNATES WHO MISSED THE FESTIVAL? BECAUSE IT SEEMS YOU HAVE!

Gli

Forge Runner

Join Date: Nov 2005

09 Feb 2008 at 02:16 - 557

Quote:

Originally Posted by Snow Bunny

It's actually sensible consideration, if you think about the economics of it, as I explained earlier.

Except that it really isn't.

Snow Bunny

Alcoholic From Yale

Join Date: Jul 2007

Strong Foreign Policy [sFp]

09 Feb 2008 at 02:20 - 558

Quote:

Originally Posted by Gli

Except that it really isn't.

Refute my point with sound economic explanation instead of dismissing it with your usual bullshit.

The change aids poorer players with minipigs they had purchased for the sake of having them, as well as from the charity of players like Rahja and myself.

Lady Yuna

Academy Page

Join Date: Jan 2008

inside your closet.......

ViLE

Mo/W

09 Feb 2008 at 02:22 - 559

Quote:

Originally Posted by Snow Bunny

Refute my point with sound economic explanation instead of dismissing it with your usual bullshit.

The change aids poorer players with minipigs they had purchased for the sake of having them, as well as from the charity of players like Rahja and myself.

So as letting these players selling them for 100k+??? The newer pig doesn't well match the "polar bear description" if you get what I mean here.

Navaros

Forge Runner

Join Date: Apr 2005

Mo/Me

09 Feb 2008 at 02:23 - 560

Quote:

Originally Posted by Savio

People want minipets, but they don't want others to have them. The solution? There isn't one. People will complain no matter what happens.

A solution could have been:

Warn players right off the bat that mini pigs may be made worth a lot in the future due to direct intervention by the devs. This way, those who gave away or trash canned their mini pigs wouldn't feel (and rightly so!) screwed over by this action, because they could have made an informed decision not to give away or trash their mini pigs instead of being railroaded by that decision well after the fact.

Another solution could have been: make mini pigs obtainable this year too, but harder to get than they were last year.