An Open Letter to ANet - Part 2

Epic thread; I feel the same about most of the issues addressed.

At one point I was sure that I wanted to buy Guild Wars 2, but after thinking about the state of PvE and the continued direction of the game, I've been having second thoughts. Further, I'm glad to see that ArenaNet is at least making the effort to have a dedicated GW1 dev team, even when GW2 is released. I'm also glad that Regina took the time to read and post in this thread; it at least displays that ArenaNet is not ignoring anybody.

I think this is desperately needed on the login screen, this way the Dev's can get an accurate idea of what the community as a whole wants and not just what the forum users want.

She answered about the part she knows - CR. In short, she said they really don't know how to fix their CR problem, but they know they have one and would like to fix it. Inde certainly has some good ideas here, and I'm sure JR knows exactly how to fix the problems.

Sadly, it doesn't say much about the rest of Avarre's post, likely because Regina isn't a dev.

Yeah thats pretty accurate, QFT.

Hmmmm....maybe if the game itself were designed to make the average player better? By that I mean: raise the expectations and the the rewards for meeting those expectations. The average player can still play, but if they get better (skill>time) their rewards in the game increase proportionately.

I only jab the average player with a sharp stick to provoke them into action...they are, afterall, far inferior to the average player two years ago .

I just hate to see new players come to the game with assumptions that there is only one way to play since the introduction of Ursan, for example. It used to be that players spent time figuring out new and interesting synergies of professions and skills to create unique builds that took full advantage of the cleverness of the player (or ability to copy builds from forums/wikis)...sure it resulted in some overpowered builds: IWAY, Minion Factory, 55-105 monk/necros, Barrage Splinter and the like....but that was the charm of a new game - figuring out how to become as powerful as possible so you could dominate certain areas in the game. ANet has "balanced" the game in a way that has removed a large number of these builds and replaced them with one: Ursan.

With Ursan, everyone can do it without consideration as to class or skill or creativity (I assume that's why so many QQ threads over it...never tried it, personally and couldn't give a rats ass one way or the other). My only objection to it would be the dummy-factor: anyone, regardless of skill or class, can farm for rank, get the skill and plow through the game easily...without skill. To me, that kind of condesention by helping out "joe average" diminishes the overall game. I see why people feel it ruins the game (though I don't particularly feel their pain, I see their point).

I honestly beleive that a game with higher expectaions and greater depth is good for the gaming community as a whole. By making games a little more difficult, requiring creative thinking and a greater degree of problem solving, we end up as better players with more interesting games to play. Catering to the "average" player, and making games too easy, it really makes the game disposable...play to the end and quit because you beat it.

I would like to see changes made to the way things are now to help the longevity of GW2. I plan on playing it, for good or ill, because I dig the way ANet started GW. I hope they return to the basics that made GW a great game while giving us a new and interesting game in GW2...hopefully it will come together.

P.S. I miss my Toyota, but the cost of the commute was killing me...You just can't haul plywood in a Hyundai

Actually the thing is, they haven't balanced the game for the average OR best gamers, they balanced it for the worst player. That is their mistake.
See : Ursan Blessing, consumables, Shadow Form.

I am not saying they should not have implemented the first 2 at all. They simply implemented overpowered versions of those.

PvP and PvE have essentially grown into two different games branded with the same franchise name. While PvE has introduced ways of making the game accessible, PvP remains a highly frustrating juggernaut. One might say that this will make winning to be more rewarding, but I know some people who do not play games for reasons of self-punishment, rather have a more laid back approach towards their free time and do not need competitive self-affirmation. Hence PvE and PvP became two different games. The alleged superior adaptability and skill of the PvP players is, however, very limited when it comes to accepting new game modes besides Team Deathmatch ganking. "Omg, we have to capture strategic locations, wtfbbq, this ain't PvP qq."

I also remember a flash flood of threads claiming that Nightfall was too hard. Big surprise, one year later it is too easy. Could it be that people actually get better? But make no mistake, nerfing Ursan will not bring back an elusive definition of skill based on failing at playing the game. It will only lead to the second dirtiest way of farming gold to be exclusively used. Because that is what Ursan boils down to. It's a gold farming skill used at areas of high revenue. It is an illusion to think that if Ursan did not exist, all of you would find a good Pugging group to raid the UW. No, the game would take a step back to two-man farming or groups of three smiting their way. That's not an improvement, that's another layer of the same thing and you would still not find a group. You would still be poor and you would still be frustrated with drops.

Inside well organized guilds Ursan is not annoying at all. It's a fun addition to the game. Remember when you asked for mounts to ride on that do extra heavy damage? Remember when Izzy shrugged that off? Now Ursan basically does what people always expected of riding a fiery dragon through town and suddenly it is wrong? The only thing Ursan hurts are the feeling of those that lived in the dreamland of exclusivity and representative vanity. But no, you are not the only ones in the world to own equipment X or have a few titles. And yes, those titles are dirt cheap even without Ursan, IF YOU HAVE FRIENDS! Each time Arenanet makes a step to keep the game playable, some players with very elitist attitudes ask for those measures to be removed and the game to be turned into an exercise of self-mutilation which only the forum masters can suffer though. But that's not gaming, that is the reason why Fury failed, that's the reason why many other games failed. Being too hardcore can be a bad thing.

So stop complaining the game is too easy and recognize the truth: dying at Thunderhead Keep were not the good old times of balance, it was your epic fail at playing the game. Even if Ursan forces players down the road where the build itself is no longer the issue, they still can screw up at every corner and they still pump themselves up with consumables. Is the proposed alternative really a game which only 5% of the players can complete? If that's the case, then GW would really be doomed. Tombs of the Hardcore is not a viable expansion. I remember the time when a FoW run took 4h. The build our "leet" team used then would now get us kicked from every group for being noob (even if Prophecies was still the only chapter). Who cares if there is a skill that cuts the completion time down to an hour even for the general public? After all, that's content they paid for and that's fun they are having. You are welcome to shoot your own foot before entering each raid, but don't expect to meet too many players who are on the same page about it.

The same goes for the information policy. Three years of being nailed to an imaginary cross for every delay can do that to a developer, I guess. I remember how open the details about Factions were shared in advance. Like little children proudly presenting a drawing to their parents did the senior staff spill most the guts about Factions in advance to interviewers and podcasters. They even did an open beta which showed off large portions of the game. Boy did they get burned for that by the community. Until today, Factions has not recovered from the hate this open information policy caused. It is still considered the worst expansion, although all current major points of hate towards the game originate from NF or EotN. You might hate grinding, but what you really hate are people having something that you don't. That's called envy. To measure the hate towards grind type /favor in the game. To measure your envy towards other players look at your own suggestions. 99% of the times they are optimized to make your gaming style the measuring stick for all players. How sweet.

/notsigned

Its amazing that in the horribly wrecked game I still manage to have fun, meet up with people regularly that I call friends and enjoy our days, evenings ,weekends doing something that we like.


Sorry, Im not about to stand in line and sing coomby ya to
. Its always the same names saying the same things and amazingly enough, your PvE experience does not matter in the least bit to mine. I paid my money, have enjoyed well over 2500 hours of entertainment for a measly $250. Thank you anet for creating an AMAZING game. I only wish I could get such a return on my money from other investments.

One simple rule in ALL games:

Life cycle. And players experience that life cycle at their own pace.

There will be newbs, noobs, casuals, veterans and elitists. All the game tries to do is find a balance for them all. You just have to accept that not everything will go 100% your way all the time.

Lots of stuff is wrong and unclear in that phonebook length post but its not my fault.

The biggest mistake was when anet forced PvP rules to a complete different game type (PvE), its like balancing skills around Hero Battles and then you say enjoy GvG. Would you like to play GvG with skills balanced around HB ? When you force PvP garbage on PvE the game feels like monster PvP match, not a PvE experience and thats why people leave who want PvE experience. For the same reason you can not balance every skill around GvG and then expect PvE to be happy. That doesn't work, guess why they split the skills of the game. However the changes came too late and most PvE'ers already left the game.

But has anyone else at Anet? I think part of the reasons for this thread is the impenetrable PR barrier that Anet surrounds itself with. The PR team have an easy deflection--that you are simply the conduit between the devs and the great unwashed--that has become immensely tiresome.
Many Anet employees who have a wiki presence keep a journal of sorts on the wiki. It would be nice if more devs are encouraged to do the same, and if these blogs were properly collated and popularized, but at the end of the day you will all be under NDAs and other gag orders, so I doubt a Dev Blog will be a real change from the status quo.
Feedback from users, even ranked feedback, is just as useless as a dev blog. What is needed is interaction -- a developer reading and responding to feedback in a medium like a wiki or a forum and explaining why suggestions are adopted or not -- and pragmatics rule it out, if simply because 90% of the feedback will be disrespectful and juvenile garbage (viz. Izzy's talk page).

Truthfully, the matter has festered far too long and little short of a public firing of the persons responsible for the PvE skills and consumables, followed by an update that removes them and the skill split from the game, will restore any real faith in Anet. Of course, such an update will have to rebalance the entire game in order to do a good job. (Well, I say entire, but only parts of DoA really require it; i know firsthand that no other PvE task in the game requires any overpowered PvE skills or consumables.)

Everyone understands that Anet does not have the will, time or the manpower to do this now to a developmentally dead game.

Instead of feedback gizmos, we need an ombudsman-- someone who advocates for the player community's interests directly to the design team. Hire Avarre in this role, if he'll take the job.

The only way for a Design team to know what the community interest are is to give the community their right to make their own voice heard. Feedback gizmo systems such as polls and quick survey's allow this. It ensures that everyone, from all walks of play styles and time spent can give input collectively.

This is not a jab at Avarre. His intentions are in good faith and I'm sure he'd work hard if it ever came true. But placing an entire communities interest on the shoulders of one or even two individuals, when that community is vast and extremely diverse, is not practical. Keep in mind we already have a CR rep who has the job of relaying information for an entire community. It's not exactly top-secret that players already have severe issues with how that currently works and has worked in the past.

Epic thread +1

PvE skills and their likes was a bad idea from the start to be 100% honest

/signed

this is good shit. not exactly the reason i have quit but wut u stated contributes to my leaving. age of conan is exactly the game taking away from gw playerbase, and wit good reason. it has good pvp with the developers listening to the requests for balance. clarity is definitely needed from developers for this game. i remember a few weeks back there was some update that fixed an "unamed bug." if it was abusable, the least you can do for ur playerbase is to let them know what happened and how they could have been potentially affected. that stunt destroyed my faith in the direction of this company, and i will NOT stay for gw2. (i only lurk these forums cuz i like the community, much like the oldies who have quit this game and why they still go on these forums)

Epic indeed.

I don't usually post when I don't have something to add, but I'll +1 this - only because ANet seems to have become more swayed by numbers than legitimate player concerns

STOP with the "it is a dead game, people got bored, get over it" comments. Guild Wars is a little over 3 years old. There are games that have been out for 10-20 years that aren't anywhere near dead yet, and you are telling me the problem with Guild Wars is that it is "just dead"? I think the problems with the game are much deeper than that.

Many have already been posted by Avarre. The problem is that many minor changes over the years have turned into massive problems, and there are so many minor problems that they can't all be undone. Ursan in reality is a minor problem...the massive problem is the fact that game balance is screwed up. Ursan is just the poster child for the massive problem.

I don't think that is what people are asking for. The problem is that there is a theory that lack of communication directly affected why the game changes were made. The theory goes that if Anet listened to their customers, they would know that many of the changes made to the game were unwanted.

It is a solid theory. All that matters is the perception that the communication lines are not open, and never have been.

The most successful games of all time stuck with their origins. You shouldn't make constant highly controversial changes to a successful franchise. You make fixes and required updates, but not changes that may not be good for the game.

This is where I strongly disagree. The problem with Guild Wars is that NOW the game feels stagnant, generic, and nothing new. NOW the game is 95% of the MMO market in my opinion.

The entire original concept of Guild Wars however was dynamic and unique. The MMO market had seen nothing like it (and still hasn't really). Now the game feels extremely mediocre. It seems like the only thing it has going for it as of now is no monthly fee...and that isn't saying much.

So yes, they have to move forward (GW2). That is probably all they can/will do at this point. But looking at the past makes a lot of people skeptical of the future. As they say...the best predictor of future behavior is past behavior.

Thanks for responding Regina. Really. I have a question though. What is this "strong goal" for Guild Wars 2? Is it anything like the original goal of Guild Wars 1?

I think the issue is that people have seen Guild Wars 1 stray from its original goal. A lot of people are having a tough time believing that Guild Wars 2:

A. Will have similar unique goals
B. If it does have similar goals, it will stray from them just like Guild Wars 1 did

wow, took me a long time to read.

I agree with the OP.

pve is extremely imbalanced with recent changes, and needs some serious attention. please return some order to a once great game...

But should the entire community be heard? Maybe you are not yet disillusioned with your fellow player, but I can predict with more certainty than I have about most things in life that Ursan Blessing and consumables are supported by the vast majority of players.
The "CR" team is primarily tasked with being Anet's mouthpiece. They are not advocates for the player community's interests. Who here knew (of) Regina before she joined Anet? What standing did she have in the community? No one and none. I certainly don't trust her to represent the players' interests.

Avarre? He's a curmudgeon with an itchy trigger finger and megalomaniac tendencies, but at least I trust him to speak for me.

I think the lowest common denominator are people who played GW for more than a year and didn't expect to still like it as much as when they first started.
You know, the ones who've moved on, but will still buy GW2.

I think she gave a reasonably direct answer to one, specific, not-particularly-important subpoint of Avarre's criticism -- the lack of transparency. The feedback-collecting channels she describes may be disappointingly embryonic, but that doesn't make her answer any less direct or honest. You just didn't like the answer.

But, you're right that she did totally sidestep the most important issue -- they've made a total mess of GW1, and seem to be thrashing around directionlessly, destroying the game as they do so. Are they going to fix this stuff? How? Dunno. She dodged the issue.

That letter, i found to be very well thought out, and it did in fact provide me with some insight at various things this old gamer has missed, and many things i have noticed to.

I feverently wish that something is done, to preserve the game i know and love. net from my point of view has made changes with the ideals in mind to cater for us until Guild wars 2 comes, this is a double sided edge, as you clearly stated, by doing what they have done they have made it an easier game to play maybe to reduce the risk of people being left out, because the majority of players have aged into a higher skill level within pve. This gives them a chance i guess. On the negative, it draws out the creative choice of before, why think when 3 skills can do the work of 8? This needs to be sorted.
Titles can be a pain, but when it gets down to it thats what add's to you staying in a game, think you complete the 4 chapters..then what?. There are many, many views. But to conclude, that letter is as perfect in what it tries and succeeds to exsplain.


One last thing, the pvp/pve split, i think that is a great thing. The times i have played to find my favourite skill useless in pve for no reason, due to it being used excessively in pvp was frankly, stupid. I look forward to the variation between pvp and pve.


Best hopes ~Frozenwind

If GW2 represents a continuation of the direction that GW1 has taken over the last year, Anet is going to lose the customers that are looking for a game worth playing. I think (hope!) they know that, the question is do they care? Do they want to make another good game or just fight for a slice of the mediocrity pie with countless other games?

polls seems a great idea, a poll section on the front page of what the majority of players think

Yes! Hence the word "Community".

If we're really going to make the argument about making community relations better, some better start waking up and realizing that community means everyone, not just a select few.

I want my voice to be heard, I want your voice to be heard, I want Avarre's voice to be heard, I want that new player in my guild to have his voice heard. I don't care if we're at opposite ends of the spectrum on what is a good idea, or a bad idea. You and I have butted heads before, but I will never, ever, tell you I think your opinion is worthless and you should not have any resources at your disposal to voice a concern, an idea, a suggestion, or an opinion.

That's great, for you. Now what about the hundreds of thousands of other players?

I see things a bit differently than the OP...

It is really never in the "Best Interests" of the company to create the perfect game. For the simplest reason really, you will never sell another game after that. Yes you could charge a monthly fee and sell ingame items/expantions/ect to pay for the servers but that would go against the model of GW.

Now I am not saying that Anet is deliberately making changes in GW that they know will kill the game, but I can see why they won't put improvements into it that would grant it a full and new life once more. Its day has come and gone, for the good of GW2, GuildWars must DIE!

Before it does die off, or become the domain of a few private servers, Anet should put forth every possible idea/concept/test that they can think of to help make GW2 as close to perfect as can be made.

Based upon what we've seen in GW I would expect a few things already for GW2 that might tick off a few but make perfect sense from a buisness standpoint.

1) The game will likely only come with 1-2 character slots with more for sale at online web site.
2) Storage expantions will be forsale at online web site.
3) Gold/Rare items will be forsale at online web site.
4) PvP tournaments with cash rewards will have entry fees.


These and onther extras will permit them to offer us a fantastic no-monthly-fee game that they can continue to update and maintain for a prolonged period of time.

I love GuildWars, but it's death has been preordained!

So you can't find us an answer as to anythign other than somethign you feel you can loophole your way around?

I'm sorry but you are no different than Gaile Gray was when she had your position. The community relations issue that your company has is severely lacking, if not a total pile of horse sh*t. I would like to point out a thread to you that took place on this very forum right about a year ago. (and I know you have access to view the posts in the thread that were removed if they are still there):

http://www.guildwarsguru.com/forum/s...php?t=10168366

(mods i would ask that you lock that thread for fear of someone thread res'ing it since its over a year old)

Now back to the issue. The problem is that both you, and your predecessors have done a horrid job at addressing player concerns or issues that have been brought up from your product, and it appears to the public that bought your product, that you blatantly don't care what we the consumer, has to say anymore.

I would like to point out posts from JR, Blame The Monks, Ensign, Myself, and others that posted in the same thread as an example.

Gaile herself even responded to this post personally and said how they had screwed up using the AT's as an example of this and how they did need to fix some of the issues of community relations that they had. JR's post was infinitely better than mine was, but his was removed for some reason. (I believe that you can still have access to see it as other mods can as well.

But these are the types of problems that the community has asked about. These are the types of concerns that the community asked to be addressed. It is when you specifically tell us information, take for example this last week when we were supposed to be issued the tournament reward points. There has been absolutely ZERO explanation as to why they were not implemented. We were told of a skill balance, yet there was none and no explanation as to why.

Your company has a huge history of dropping the ball in community relations, and when I had read online your qualifications and your background, I had prayed that you would be able to fulfill this role far greater than Gaile had done, yet sadly I have seen the opposite as the community relations still gives the community the run around. Whether it be here or on your wiki page, either or can never be a straight answer and the answer that is given loops around the question more than a championship racehorse does in the Kentucky Derby.

And this only has to do with the community relations your company has. I haven't even gone into dept as to how shallow the thinking pool must be on some of the more "interesting" game design choices you all chose to implement. This should show you that you all have a lot still to go for a company and for a product if you wish to have a better success than the accidental success you currently expierenced.

Thank you.

Jason aka Yichi

edit: I hit the submit button too soon

You make a lot of good points. But I doubt we will ever see Gold/Rare items forsale in the online store.

Actually she is doing her job perfectly, think about it. Anet probably plans on not doing anything about ursan or doing anything significant to PvE balance anytime soon. So would you rather that Regina out right say "We aren't going to do anything about GW1 because we just don't care anymore"? Or should she lie and say "Yes we will fix everything". No she shouldn't because either way lots of people will be pissed when they read the first quote or find out she/devs lied about fixing the game. It's better that she just side steps the main question, that way there will be less anger among the community because they don't know what the devs plan on doing.

As a PvE only player for 2 and half years, I do agree with some of the things you said, but I do not agree with the fact that the game is dying, it is not, it is getting better and more enjoyable if you ask me, and yes, maybe they are trying to get new players into the game, but whats wrong with that? Would it be better for Anet to cater to the Veterans, and ignore new players to the point where the game would actually die out because there will be barely anyone to join a party with, simply because the game was too hard for most people? I do agree with the point about Ursan, where new players can basically jump into EoTN, get Ursan, rank up, and join into elite missions without knowing alot about actual skillful builds... but I highly doubt someone would be using Ursan all the time, since they would want to learn real builds, and how they work... as some builds can still be more effective than Ursan. Ursan did take away from the ol' party builds because its easy to use, and that it does try to help out those new comers by giving them an easy and fixed build to use to join parties, and that would keep them from learning other builds, but some people might find those other builds kind of overwhelming to use and not bother with them, then end up leaving the game because of not being able to do certain things because of their inexperience... Maybe thats only because some people do have lives that go on everyday, and don't have the time to put into the game to learn every aspect of it.

Games do get old, no matter how much is added into the game. Once you get completely comfortable with how the game works and get very good at achieving stuff no matter what the difficulty is, you will eventually get bored of a game if you play it waay too much, its like that with every game out there. Everything in life will get boring one way or another if you are exposed to something for a certain amount of time, but I would like to say that GW actually has kept me playing for 2 and half years, and thats the longest I have ever stayed playing any game, for an RPG/MMO anyways... The game just drawn me into it so easily, because it was exactly something I wanted in a online game. I have played some other cheap MMO's, but eventually I gave up on them because I didn't want to HAVE to play every single day for 2-3 years straight just to experience most of the game to where it will just plateau and end up falling out anyways because there would be nothing else to do. I also wouldn't want to be like those players that have invested alot into their game, and pretty much be forced to stay playing, and then avoid any other game because that. That's what paying monthly fees does to a hardcore player, keeps them from wanting to put time into trying other games, especially other RPG/MMo's. I never bother with games like that, and I definately would not pay monthly fees for a game I already payed for, and I don't want to be forced to keep up with montly fees, and then be forced to make my investment count by trying to make use of every dollar I spent on it. I like the fact that just about anyone can jump into Guildwars, and experience everything is has to offer in a fraction of the time compared to other major MMO's, like WoW. This keeps those non-hardcore players from leaving the game, and gives them a chance to enjoy the game like everyone else. That is why the lvl 20 player cap I thought was genious, even thought most hardcore players would think it is completely retarded... but that is only because they have a problem, they are crazy game addicts. they have waay too much time on their hands. Get out and live alittle anyways, catch some sun, it's good for you.

As for Anet, I think what they have been doing is more than what anyone expected for a no-monthly fee online game. So far, I have been very pleased with certain changes, and have no negative thoughts about the PvE aspect of the game as I don't really do much pvp, occasional RA is about it. But thats only because PvE is the main part of the game, without it there would be no PvP. Most of the complainers in GW are mainly pvp players I would assume. As for the new skill balance system, I thought it was a great idea, and something they should have done since the beginning. Skills are no longer affecting each type of gameplay, which I thought was awesome for us PvE players. We can no longer blame PvP for anything! Hardcore PvP players couldn't give a crap about changes that affect PvE, and didn't affect them much when some skills were changed in PvP. All I know is, that it was pretty sh*tty when PvP changes affected PvE in a big way, that hurt alot of us players. There were a few times when skill changes made me feel like leaving the game for good, but luckily there was new Campaigns being released to keep me playing.

But yeah, I really don't think all these new changes are causing people to stop playing just because of Ursan and Shadowform, which is basically what everyone is complaining/crying about. If the game keeps me playing, and wanting to try out new stuff, I am all for it and will continue to play... Even though it did kind of upset me when they announced they canceled future campaigns. I mean, I wouldn't mind trying out some new professions, and roam a new continent, but I guess nothing we can do about that now, just hope for the best for GW2.

I just wish they would let us in about GW2, keeping it all a secret I think is a bad idea, that is just setting everyone up for disappointments because of high expectations. I would recommened that they let the whole GW community in on what they are doing with GW2, and have some newer preview articles released to magazines and gw sites. I really wouldn't mind reading more about GW2, get al bit more excited about it, and maybe look forward to it. I do look forward it, but right now I just don't know what to expect, I have no clue at all... I mean, they did talk about their goals and what they wanted to achieve with GW2, but that doesn't mean that it will be exactly what they planned a year ago. It has been way too long in the dark for all of us! They need to give us something to look forward to, instead of making us all wonder what the game is going to be like. Not knowing what to expect at all! not knowing what is ahead, or if it is going to be just another WoW game. I know for sure it won't be nothing like WoW, but we have no clue what Anet is doing at the moment. I kind of feel like they are trying to suprise us all with GW2, thinking everyone is going to fall in love with it no matter what, but that is not always the case if you keep everything a secret. Pretty much like saying "Suprise! Here is GW2! Which is nothing you expected it was going to be... " Good or bad? we will not know until beta, which is what? 6-8 months from now? That is way too much darkness. If we have nothing to expect, we have nothing to look foward to... simple as that. REVEAL GW2 ALREADY! I DON'T KNOW WHAT EXACTLY YOU GUYS ARE WAITING FOR! We are going to start thinking that Anet is way in over their head with GW2, and not letting us in on it because they are failing at accomplishing their goals for GW2. I think people are starting to pick apart GW1 because we feel like we are being neglected all together because they cancelled our campaigns, and now they are keeping us in the dark about GW2. People seem to be getting impatient on what to expect in the future of Guildwars, which in some way is making everyone have higher expectations for future changes in GW1, and when there is these "out of the blue" big changes, they can't stand any of them. I can't speak for them of course, but only for me, and I can say that so far I have not been disappointed with any recent changes. If they gives us good changes, no problem there for me. If they were to kill Invinci builds or something like that, then I would have a reason to be upset.

With all that said, I think everyone needs to chill the hell out, and not get their panties all in a bunch. Anet is doing fine, and I am glad they keep us going by having event's almost every weekend, and new stuff added like new skins and tonics... Give them some credit for once will ya's. I know I am probably one of the very few that actually think the new changes are a good thing. I just don't understand why all the "veterans" think these new changes are taking things away from them...?? I am a veteran myself, and consider myself really experienced with the game, and I don't see many negative things about the game, if any in my own opinion... I just wish these diseased hardcore players would stop writing stupid, pointless threads that is only complaints about GW1. If you don't like the game, or the new changes, please leave and do us all a favor, including yourself. People only leave the game because they feel like leaving, not because of certain changes in the game, but because the game actually allows you to play other games and try knew things if you want to, then come back whenever you feel like it. Thank them for that anyways. Would you rather be like those WoW players, and invest alot of your money to the point where you will not play any other game regardless of how bored you are with the game... would you rather have that? I wouldn't think so. I mean, they can't completely perfect the game to the point where everyone in the world that is playing GW will be completely 100% satisfied, that would be impossible to accomplish, and will never be accomplished with any game, ever! Anet is not going to please one player because they complain too much, but would rather please a majority of the players instead. They continue to do so... end of story.

I don't even know why I just wasted my time writing this big azz comment/reply, it won't affect anyone, it won't make anyone change their oppinions about GW. Everyone has their own thoughts, and no one can force their own oppinions on someone else, especially Anet! So, you are really wasting your time just like I am at this very moment. PEACE OUT!

Failure.

"Try to please everyone, and you end up pleasing no one."

-Aesop, Greek storyteller and philosopher. 800 b.c.e. .

edit: nice point, Rezdog; even though I had to fight through the wall-o-text to get to it.

A really long, and extremely harsh way of saying what I was trying to get at in both my first post (page 10) and my comment a few back about Regina completley worming her way out of the question. Community relations for GW sucks, and THAT is the root of all evil. There is still time to save it though!

OP is too long, too verbose, and employs an inappropriate style/tone that defeats it's own purpose. I did agree with most of the sentiments that I skimmed through though, as I did the many times they have been brought up before.

But I must say that I agree more with Sonata's main post as well as Kinn's and The Way Out's. It seems as if whenever a company pays too much attention to their playerbase, that playerbase develops into an army of 'Single White Females' (Link1, Link2).

Also, there was never any transparency with Gaile 'the spin' Gray's posts. Guild Wars' CM has always been effluent sprayed with perfume and served on a silver tray. Regina's response actually directly addressed some real concerns, for once.

I fel the same. I can deal with what happened in the gurrent game as long as the lessons learned are completely taken to heart and implimented in GW2 to create the most well thought out game yet.

Posted June 6th:
http://www.guildwarsguru.com/forum/s...79#post4018879
Posted yesterday:
http://guildwars.incgamers.com/showt...46#post5359846
Also, using such absolute language isn't likely to get much attention. ANet has responded to quite a lot of player concerns over the years, and has a decent track record of listening to (if not always acting on) player concerns.

I think Avarre makes some very good points, but I think he's very far off when he says that the developers aren't playing the game.

It does seem pretty clear that they have changed directions from how the game was originally designed with the PVE only skills, the Elite area designs and moving away from having the same skills in PVE and PVP. It seems to me that these are done to attract newer players, but I think Avarre is correct that they are reducing the depth of their game (leading to long term play and enjoyment) for short term gains in new players. But this results more from a change of focus than a lack of interaction with their own product.

The OP is well put together and as a player since 2005 I share most of the views presented. As previously stated by others though, we are bound to get bored of the same ol' thing eventually.

However, put yourself in ANet's shoes and I believe they have done the right thing along the line. From a brutally business and profit-making perspective they have probably nailed it spot on.

I PvE mainly and I was wary of the the direction the new chapters were going and held back from purchasing Nightfall until Tyria and Cantha were fairly empty here in Europe, and I had to resort to heroes instead of humans. Not much else of NF was worthy of note though in terms of 'innovation'. I also waited on EoTN and after reading reviews and hearing from friends who did buy it I made the only protest I could against ANet and left it on the shelf in the shop. EoTN offered nothing new for me.

For want of something else to play I bought Oblivion and played that through. I enjoyed it, but I would not be playing it for 3 years after I completed it. To a certain extent I imagine there exists an 'install-complete-uninstall' category of player in GW who then move on to the next game. Maybe the (non-forum going) player base is constantly changing sufficiently not to notice the changes made since day one. These would be ANet's prefered customers... those that enjoy the current product for what it is, not what it was.

That's just my take on it though.

There will be players who have never known GW without Ursan (apart from racing to level 20 and then obtaining the skill) and these players may reflect a good chunk of the currently active player-base. These same players will have seen far fewer changes to their game, and the changes that have come about to PvE'rs would probably not make them blink an eye unless it turned out to be better than Ursan. I would not expect them to be enjoying this game 3 years into the future either, but they're enjoying it now.

ANet are doing their job. That is to be a successful company which will be measured financially, not through the amount of goodwill maintained by us, the punters. It is not ANet's job to keep us entertained 24/7 until GW2 arrives. They have no reason to keep us loyal. If GW2 is good enough in its own right then people will buy it.

Did Anet expect us to be here 3 years later? Perhaps the problem is that GW is so good that nothing else out there in the f2p market can tempt people away so we are forced to remain here and that in itself is causing the boredom.

Any time spent playing a game for anything other than enjoyment is time wasted. As soon as GW is not fun for you, put it down. I have learnt this through GW itself, so I have taken something from the game .

1. Kintana... you can collect and quantify feedback to any level you want. You can use it for practically all your business applications.
   
2. If you don't want to spend money for workflow streamlining software, it's a little more work but easy enough to use Excel for collecting and quantifying data.
   
3. You can also put a survey on your website that feeds into a database that you can use to quantify data.

If you put a little thought to it, you will see this is not the difficult task you initially thought it was.

Thank you for asking.

The problem is that it's not obvious to everyone what they're fixing, or why things are going how they are. If announcements or answers to questions like that were posted on the GW-login screen, I bet a lot more people would be comfortable that ANet actually does stuff.

First, I like what they gave us with Gwen. I don't think it is too easy. I do think there should have been a couple of exite dungeons besides the whole Duncan area. These dungeons should have been on par with the Underworld and FoW. You need to realize that they have to include levels on a broad base difficulity not just the uber hard. I think they have done this pretty well with Hard Mode. I think the rewards in hard mode stink.

I think their biggest problem in no NEW CONTENT. I think they should add some more dungeons all over all the lands. I would not expect this expanison for free. I think it should be on the level of the Dungeons in GWEN with some thought given to trying to stop running dungeons.

I think they should give up trying to force people to PUG. Let them do it however they want to, if that means 7 heros then why no let them. After all they paid for the game.

I think someone should tell them that we were not playing solo because we loved it. We were playing solo as a method to get max rewards in an area. Therefore the bonus mission pack is a flop, especially as the end reward stinks. Loot scaling and not enough reward for playing make it boring. You can do a whole mission in GWEN and only get about 5 drops. Some of this is caused by over playing in a area, but in order to max your titles you have to do the same areas OVER and OVER and OVER and OVER ad nausium. Once again not enough content.

The best new thing in a while is the Zaishen Chest. It has things people want with the new tonics. It should also have a mini. Unfortinately, it's only for PvP. These kind of chests need to be implimented into PvE too.

I think you have got to add and upgrade for selling and buying. Trying to find the one person over 3 countries who wants to buy your bingo bango bowling ball is nuts. They need to incorperate a system that does weapons, upgrades. inscriptions, minis, and tomes and a dealer who specializes in custom sales. One who will take your wand or whatever, ask you what you want for it and then you can come back later to see if any one bought it and collect your money. Oh, and I think they should charge for this as an upgrade to your account.

Now, everyone is going to say that they are too busy doing GW2 to add any contert to GW1. But that is bad business, we are here now willing to pay for what we want, I don't understand why they cannot hire a team to do it. There are many unemployed computer people that could do the work. And frankly I don't have any hopes of seeing GW2 for quite some time, especially as they have not even mentioned any kind of release date in months. Every one is going to say that they already paid for the game these should be free. Well, get real if you want a monthly fee, you can get all the new stuff you want. I personally like that there is not monthly fee and would not buy a game that had one. I was going to get Tablia Rosa until I found out it had a fee.

Now I would like to comment on the view of Anet wanting to please different playergroups. I think this is a good idea, but was often badly implemented by Anet.

Recently there was one example of a good implementation: The deldrimor weapons.
1) They gave the feeling Anet still cares as they updated Prophecies to be on par with factions and Nightfall after finishing the storyline.
2) The weapons were artistically nice, they represented a set of weapons suiting together and with a dwarven touch.
3) Average or poor players could trade in a key to get an endgame green. Other type of players could buy a more costly gold version.
4) that update got positive feedback from all layers of the comunity.


Now an example of a good idea that has been implemented badly: The celestial pig. Instead of just adding common rats, they only made a celestial rat available. In the meantime making a common mini (the pig) rare by exchanging 5 of them to get another rare (the celestial pig). That update brought a lot of heat. The ideal solution would have been: pigs and rats being common (for the average and poor players), adding celestial pigs to the presents at the time celestial rats were added making them both rare (to please other type of players). Everyone could have had a mini somehow, just like everyone can have a deldrimor weapon.

Some things come too late, like adding tormented weapons to the hall. This should have been done when EOTN came out, making it like the deldrimor weapons view:
- destroyer weapons (still costly for the average player but doable especially after a while like we see now when prices of onyx' and diamonds became cheap compared to the price when GWEN got released)
- tormented weapons (for the players with a lot of cash or that live in DoA sorta speak)

Great Read.

/signed by me and all the AFK guildies.

I also have one foot out the door.

/signed!

If this letter greatly influences A-net, it might give me a reason to log on more often. You should mention how GW is a grind > skill game now instead of a skill > time game time that they promised.