Next Update Will Be Next Week - Guild Wars Guru archive powered by Guild Wars Legacy

Tyla

Emo Goth Italics

Join Date: Sep 2006

05 Aug 2008 at 00:14 - 401

Quote:

Originally Posted by English Warrior

I hope Assasins, Rits, Paras, Dervs and PvE skills are removed from the game they make it imbalanced.Thats the problem from factions onwards anet made this imbalanced by bringing new professions that were way more imba then the cores.
Simple.

Then you have all of the skills that were more recently introduced that are still quite powerful.

I believe Ritualists could be a strong heal / offensive support class while being balanced at the same time to be honest, though.

English Warrior

LEET HAXXOR!

Join Date: Feb 2007

Random Arena

N/A

05 Aug 2008 at 00:17 - 402

Your bang on about Ritualists about healing and support its the fact how overpowered channeling spells are.
Post in morning going to sleep.

Tyla

Emo Goth Italics

Join Date: Sep 2006

05 Aug 2008 at 00:19 - 403

Right now there are stronger, more overpowered things to look at. If you ask me though, Ritualists are coming close to balance.

slowerpoke

Desert Nomad

Join Date: Jul 2007

Cuba

05 Aug 2008 at 00:22 - 404

There seems to be a distain for the non core professions in PvP. ANet could always setup a "classic" GvG ladder that restricts skills/professions/maps to prophecies only.
Many sports have multiple league tables.

FlamingMetroid

Jungle Guide

Join Date: Sep 2007

standing on your last control point, while the rest of your team is to busy killing mine

The Luminaries [Lumi]

A/

05 Aug 2008 at 00:23 - 405

Quote:

Originally Posted by Tyla

Right now there are stronger, more overpowered things to look at. If you ask me though, Ritualists are coming close to balance.

Their main problem is that they don't have to put points in to their main attribute line because it sucks so bad. buff2nerf

super strokey

Krytan Explorer

Join Date: Aug 2006

Soviet Canuckistan

N/

05 Aug 2008 at 01:31 - 406

I think rits need a buff myself, how about bringing back ritual lord

pwease lol. That was god mode for sure, nothing except ursan could touch that and it was for a whole team... i miss it a bit

Tyla

Emo Goth Italics

Join Date: Sep 2006

05 Aug 2008 at 01:32 - 407

For PvE Ritlord has been buffed back to insanity.

Free Sigils

Frost Gate Guardian

Join Date: Aug 2007

Puff Puff Pass That Oh W T F [B스n]

Me/P

05 Aug 2008 at 01:38 - 408

Put all weapon spells in Rits primary att imo.

Tender Wolf

Banned

Join Date: Jul 2007

All over Tyria, Cantha, & Elona

The Eternal Night Vanguard [TEN]

R/

05 Aug 2008 at 01:43 - 409

Did I just see someone suggest get rid of four of the ten professions? I don't think that will go over well...

Many people play those four classes as their primaries, but as for buffing, not playing them often I can't say if it's needed. The only thing that I'd prefer to be buffed that way is the sin in AB, so annoying how they shadow step to you and then cripple you even if you're just running on your own not bothering anyone.

But regardless, this thread is kind of turning into a flame fest. Perhaps we should just wait and see what happens. We all want/expect certain things but we won't know what will happen until the update (most likely on Thursday). Keep your fingers crossed that what you're hoping for happens, but let's not start a flame thread if it doesn't.

super strokey

Krytan Explorer

Join Date: Aug 2006

Soviet Canuckistan

N/

05 Aug 2008 at 01:43 - 410

Quote:

Originally Posted by Tyla

For PvE Ritlord has been buffed back to insanity.

When did that happen? What build is it? im intrigued

Tyla

Emo Goth Italics

Join Date: Sep 2006

05 Aug 2008 at 01:46 - 411

Strokey, enjoy your spirits.

@Tender Wolf: The reason people want that is because of the massive imbalance they have caused, and basically killing or removing these professions is the only way to deal with them in PvP.

Tender Wolf

Banned

Join Date: Jul 2007

All over Tyria, Cantha, & Elona

The Eternal Night Vanguard [TEN]

R/

05 Aug 2008 at 01:52 - 412

Quote:

Originally Posted by Tyla

@Tender Wolf: The reason people want that is because of the massive imbalance they have caused, and basically killing or removing these professions is the only way to deal with them in PvP.

Ah okay, well I only do AB once in a while so I wasn't aware of that.

Since I don't have a primary character that's any of those classes that's fine, but I honestly don't think it would be fair to the others who play those classes if they were removed. Honestly I don't see that happening, maybe just buffs or nerfs.

super strokey

Krytan Explorer

Join Date: Aug 2006

Soviet Canuckistan

N/

05 Aug 2008 at 01:52 - 413

Quote:

Originally Posted by Tyla

Strokey, enjoy your spirits.

@Tender Wolf: The reason people want that is because of the massive imbalance they have caused, and basically killing or removing these professions is the only way to deal with them in PvP.

No i was meaning the whole build lol, i remember this being buff but the way spirits kinda suck now its hard to make a build really usefull imho.

Nightow

Forge Runner

Join Date: Feb 2006

Kindred Order of Souls [KOS]

05 Aug 2008 at 02:15 - 414

Quote:

Originally Posted by Tyla

For PvE Ritlord has been buffed back to insanity.

....I am speechless. You do realize that Spirits, especially defensive ones are like dust in the wind when it comes to PvE.

This is the old Rit Lord build: [build=OACjAyhDJPBTnp17xFOBAAgLG]

Displacement is pretty useless... It will only block 4-6 attacks and then die.
Shelter's cost is very high for a non-ele caster.
The only one that's still decent is Union in my opinion.

In the end, if they really want to let communing and spawning make a come back, they're going to have to reduce shelter's cost and lessen the amt of dmg they take per hit. EDIT: Oh, and also reduce casting times while you're at it. >_>

Chthon

Grotto Attendant

Join Date: Apr 2007

05 Aug 2008 at 02:20 - 415

Quote:

Originally Posted by Nightow

....I am speechless. You do realize that Spirits, especially defensive ones are like dust in the wind when it comes to PvE.

This is the old Rit Lord build: [build=OACjAyhDJPBTnp17xFOBAAgLG]

Displacement is pretty useless... It will only block 4-6 attacks and then die.
Shelter's cost is very high for a non-ele caster.
The only one that's still decent is Shelter in my opinion.

In the end, if they really want to let communing and spawning make a come back, they're going to have to reduce shelter's cost and lessen the amt of dmg they take per hit. EDIT: Oh, and also reduce casting times while you're at it. >_>

Agreed. The ritlord build is still as dead as a doornail until that happens.

super strokey

Krytan Explorer

Join Date: Aug 2006

Soviet Canuckistan

N/

05 Aug 2008 at 02:24 - 416

Quote:

Originally Posted by Nightow

....I am speechless. You do realize that Spirits, especially defensive ones are like dust in the wind when it comes to PvE.

This is the old Rit Lord build: [build=OACjAyhDJPBTnp17xFOBAAgLG]

Displacement is pretty useless... It will only block 4-6 attacks and then die.
Shelter's cost is very high for a non-ele caster.
The only one that's still decent is Union in my opinion.

In the end, if they really want to let communing and spawning make a come back, they're going to have to reduce shelter's cost and lessen the amt of dmg they take per hit. EDIT: Oh, and also reduce casting times while you're at it. >_>

That was my fav build in the game, i changed it a bit but i remember it being so good... oh well maybe someting nice will happen... or not lol

Nightow

Forge Runner

Join Date: Feb 2006

Kindred Order of Souls [KOS]

05 Aug 2008 at 02:29 - 417

Quote:

Originally Posted by super strokey

That was my fav build in the game, i changed it a bit but i remember it being so good... oh well maybe someting nice will happen... or not lol

It was my favorite too, now it feels like we either go hybrid, SS or nothing at all...

MarlinBackna

Krytan Explorer

Join Date: May 2007

[TAM]

W/

05 Aug 2008 at 02:41 - 418

Quote:

Originally Posted by English Warrior

I hope Assasins, Rits, Paras, Dervs and PvE skills are removed from the game they make it imbalanced.Thats the problem from factions onwards anet made this imbalanced by bringing new professions that were way more imba then the cores.
Simple.

Simple, eh? I hope that had a invisible /sarcasm tag.
But seriously, what a comment to say. If you suggest something like that, you should seriously consider to stop playing....

Also, Rit Lords were pretty lame. The spirits have been pretty much nerfed beyond belief.

draxynnic

Furnace Stoker

Join Date: Nov 2005

[CRFH]

05 Aug 2008 at 03:33 - 419

Quote:

Originally Posted by distilledwill

no! badman. I dont really see any reason to do this.

The reputation titles represent your characters individual influence with the appropriate factions, not your accounts. I know its a bit of a weak "lore" arguement, but it does seem a bit strange that you should start a new character in NF, be recruited to the Sunspears and immediately become a "Legendary Spearmarshall" in the eyes of your superiors.

"Ah, welcome, NewCharacterXYZ. Your cousin may be one of the legends of the organisation, but don't think we'll be cutting you any slack because of it! In fact, we're going to push you as hard as we possibly can to make sure you fulfill your family's full potential!"

...In short, the lore explanation is that it's a reputation shared among whatever organisation your characters form - whether they're related, represent a chapter of a guild, or whatever, they all share in each other's reputation. For instance, in the L. Spearmarshal case, one of them might be the Legendary Spearmarshal... the others are his or her personal agents acting on his or her authority.

Quote:

Originally Posted by DFrost

Hmm, has there actually been official news about titles becoming account-wide, or is this another case of the community hyping things and getting disappointed afterwards?

There was mention that they were looking at making some titles more feasible for accounts with multiple characters or something like that.

Quote:

Originally Posted by keli

If cryway is that good, then why the hell cries the community for a huge mesmer buff, eh? (ignorance is bliss ?! )

Largely following DarkNecrid's advice, but on this particular point: Cryway doesn't require any investment in Mesmer apart from a secondary and one cheap Mesmer hex among the party. It does little for primary Mesmers and instead provides another encouragement for other classes to go /Me (which was common enough already). Mesmers need reasons for it to be good to be a primary Mesmer.

Also, Whirlwind Attack being adrenaline-based and working for any melee weapon allows for some crazy synergies.

All that said, though, the difference between r8 and r10 isn't all that much with most SS skills, but people do like to be optimally configured with whatever they use.

Besides, one point you seem to have missed is SS is just ONE example - people would like to see the EOTN rep titles account-wided as well.

Moloch Vein

Forge Runner

Join Date: Apr 2007

Reactive Hexing Sucks

[Thay]

N/

05 Aug 2008 at 06:07 - 420

Quote:

Originally Posted by keli

Okay, as you guys say mesmers arent used in pve so cry of pain is out. (btw, its worse than liquid flame..)

Hello. You do not know how to deal damage in PvE. Bye.

DarkNecrid

Furnace Stoker

Join Date: Jul 2006

05 Aug 2008 at 06:18 - 421

Quote:

Originally Posted by Tyla

Strokey, enjoy your spirits.

@Tender Wolf: The reason people want that is because of the massive imbalance they have caused, and basically killing or removing these professions is the only way to deal with them in PvP.

Quote:

This skill is currently bugged, the description say binding rituals but it actually effects the recharge of Ursan Strike while under the effects of Ursan Blessing. It is possible to do this by using Arcane Mimicry.

wut.

THis is a joke right?? I can just see the new Ursanway being a bunch of 5 Ursans, 1 rit with rit lord, and 2 monks. all steal RitLord and you have 5 ursans doingf 100+ armor ignoring damage every second for BIGGER DOMAGE.

FrAnt1c??

Forge Runner

Join Date: Jan 2007

Belgium

Legion Of Sacred Light [LSL]

Mo/

05 Aug 2008 at 06:35 - 422

You know what would be great? That minipets have the ability to follow you around in explorable areas and pick up the loot for you. I've seen that in some other mmo games, and it would be cool to have something in gw aswell, as I always seem to be too lazy to pick up all items...

Jenn

Resigned.

Join Date: Sep 2006

05 Aug 2008 at 06:51 - 423

Not sure if I should have made this a separate thread... anyways, here goes.

What I'm curious about for the next update is ecto prices. There's a lot of speculation that the ecto farm and NOT the perma-sin will get the nerf bat, and ursan will, too. With those two factors combined, it's a reasonable assumption that the prices of ectos will climb back up to the previous 5.5k, or maybe slightly higher. That being said, my concern/thought is this:

Will sellers of high-end items who had to drive up the quantity of ectos on their items to accomodate for low ecto prices be so keen on realizing their 400-450e Eternal Blade is now worth only 300-350e? Will the greedy bastards keep on truckin, and will they win? Or Voltaic Spears - back down to 100k+70e for a q9? There's two possible outcomes - one is the aforementioned possiblity, and the other is that instead of there being a difference between zkeys and ectos, sellers are simply going to jack up the amount of zkeys they demand for an item.

Another possible economical effect to address is armbrace prices. Again, with the speculated HoM/Ursan update, the items are going to be harder to get AND in more demand. What do ya'll predict is going to happen to armbrace prices? I think they'll rise some, but for the majority of people, they're still a luxury item and wouldn't indulge in a full hall of them.

P.S. If this was already addressed in the thread, too damn bad - 22 pages of posts and probably most of them not worth reading. x_X

FrAnt1c??

Forge Runner

Join Date: Jan 2007

Belgium

Legion Of Sacred Light [LSL]

Mo/

05 Aug 2008 at 06:57 - 424

Several people I talked to the past few days, were saying they had started buying ectos and saving gemsets for armbraces.
I havent spent any ectos in a long while and Bought 28 ectos for 100k yesterday ( seemed like a good deal anyway ), if ectos go up in price, profit, if not, cheap ectos wiiii

What about the xunlai marketplace btw? Anyone gave any thought that they might implement that? Or has Anet confirmed that that system wouldnt be introduced untill gw2?

Another mental note: Armbraces and tormented weapons cant go but up, since as people put tormented weapons in their hom, these will be customised, thus reducing supply drastically, combined with increasing demand, will lead to quickly rising prices accordingly to common laws of supply and demand

DarkNecrid

Furnace Stoker

Join Date: Jul 2006

05 Aug 2008 at 06:58 - 425

They'll be keen on it when they realize it's the same amount and they aren't getting sales otherwise.

English Warrior

LEET HAXXOR!

Join Date: Feb 2007

Random Arena

N/A

05 Aug 2008 at 09:09 - 426

Quote:

Originally Posted by MarlinBackna

Simple, eh? I hope that had a invisible /sarcasm tag.
But seriously, what a comment to say. If you suggest something like that, you should seriously consider to stop playing....

Also, Rit Lords were pretty lame. The spirits have been pretty much nerfed beyond belief.

Removed was exagerration but anyway im talking about PvP for them 4 to be nerfed so they are balanced with core professions, also i have stopped playing because pvp is broken i play WoW, Aerie Peak server my name is Holyenglish if you wish to join me back to the topic.

PvP-Wise

Assasins are extremely overpowered still after numerous nerfs.

Ritualists are overpowered in a number of ways, weapon spells for example maybe not a nerf but bring some skills that can remove them, on another ritualist matter there is ritspike very overpowered thanks to spirit rift simple overpowered.

Paragons have been nerfed so many times and they are still overpowered but they are near to balance though.

Dervish EXTEMELY UBER overpowered AoM and Wounding strike are overpowered this was anet trying to make a paladin class i think it needs more healing and reduced damage.

Roman

Lion's Arch Merchant

Join Date: Jun 2006

The Illuminati

Mo/

05 Aug 2008 at 10:19 - 427

Its not really the Wounding Strike that's the problem, but the scythe. AoE, and damage that is too high..

Smurf Minions

Lion's Arch Merchant

Join Date: Jun 2006

Somewhere you can't see

Limburgse Jagers [LJ]

N/

05 Aug 2008 at 10:49 - 428

Quote:

Originally Posted by English Warrior

Ritualists are overpowered in a number of ways, weapon spells for example maybe not a nerf but bring some skills that can remove them, on another ritualist matter there is ritspike very overpowered thanks to spirit rift simple overpowered.

LOLOLOLOLOL Spirit Bond [spirit bond]

you have 2 secs to remove the hexes and the targets kites away, and still got time for spirit bond too cast on the target....

Amnel Ithtirsol

Lion's Arch Merchant

Join Date: Feb 2008

AU

League Of The Fallen

Mo/

05 Aug 2008 at 12:55 - 429

Quote:

Originally Posted by Illfated Fat

Not sure if I should have made this a separate thread... anyways, here goes.

What I'm curious about for the next update is ecto prices. There's a lot of speculation that the ecto farm and NOT the perma-sin will get the nerf bat, and ursan will, too. With those two factors combined, it's a reasonable assumption that the prices of ectos will climb back up to the previous 5.5k, or maybe slightly higher. That being said, my concern/thought is this:

Will sellers of high-end items who had to drive up the quantity of ectos on their items to accomodate for low ecto prices be so keen on realizing their 400-450e Eternal Blade is now worth only 300-350e? Will the greedy bastards keep on truckin, and will they win? Or Voltaic Spears - back down to 100k+70e for a q9? There's two possible outcomes - one is the aforementioned possiblity, and the other is that instead of there being a difference between zkeys and ectos, sellers are simply going to jack up the amount of zkeys they demand for an item.

Another possible economical effect to address is armbrace prices. Again, with the speculated HoM/Ursan update, the items are going to be harder to get AND in more demand. What do ya'll predict is going to happen to armbrace prices? I think they'll rise some, but for the majority of people, they're still a luxury item and wouldn't indulge in a full hall of them.

P.S. If this was already addressed in the thread, too damn bad - 22 pages of posts and probably most of them not worth reading. x_X

I have a feeling Gate of Anguish will have a number of extra districts the next two days or so... people going crazy for gems while Ursan is still around.

Also, have to agree on price increases on both ecto and braces. But only if the nerfbat hit UW and UB hard enough.

We'll see...

Lopezus

Frost Gate Guardian

Join Date: Mar 2007

MDD

D/W

05 Aug 2008 at 14:18 - 430

Quote:

Eternal Aura allows a permanent god form. Perma-Melandru could give you a non-elite RC with spammable deep wound and immunity to all conditions.

Problem is that in pve avatars before EA were pretty much wasted elite skill slot and even now with permanent for example AoG, it's like meh.. better equip different elite.

imnotyourmother

Desert Nomad

Join Date: Mar 2008

in a house

The Knitters Guild

W/R

05 Aug 2008 at 14:23 - 431

Well for me the updates will Not be of any hoot.

I play in Presearing. Nothing has ever changed there for the bad, only for the good. Only place in the game where you can say that!

Have fun with the nerf and spasms and Ursan and shards and ecto's. I will stick to Black Dye. LOL

Sarevok Thordin

Desert Nomad

Join Date: Apr 2006

Scotland

W/N

05 Aug 2008 at 14:36 - 432

Quote:

Originally Posted by imnotyourmother

Well for me the updates will Not be of any hoot.

I play in Presearing. Nothing has ever changed there for the bad, only for the good. Only place in the game where you can say that!

Have fun with the nerf and spasms and Ursan and shards and ecto's. I will stick to Black Dye. LOL

We have plenty of Black Dye already =3

R.Shayne

Wilds Pathfinder

Join Date: Oct 2007

05 Aug 2008 at 14:42 - 433

Quote:

Originally Posted by Illfated Fat

What I'm curious about for the next update is ecto prices. There's a lot of speculation that the ecto farm and NOT the perma-sin will get the nerf bat, and ursan will, too. With those two factors combined, it's a reasonable assumption that the prices of ectos will climb back up to the previous 5.5k, or maybe slightly higher.

If that was the case then July 2nd nerf would have resulted in a permit price increase in ecto, didn't happen. The supply of ecto is there and not going down but the demand just isn't there anymore. The only way we are going to see an increase in ecto is if they introduce more stuff that requires ecto.

TwinRaven

Wilds Pathfinder

Join Date: Apr 2005

W/

05 Aug 2008 at 14:48 - 434

Quote:

Originally Posted by FrAnt1c²

You know what would be great? That minipets have the ability to follow you around in explorable areas and pick up the loot for you. I've seen that in some other mmo games, and it would be cool to have something in gw aswell, as I always seem to be too lazy to pick up all items...

Like NCSoft's Bling Gnome in Dungeon Runners....very handy.

Ate of DK

Wilds Pathfinder

Join Date: Oct 2005

Netherlands

None but Fools [nuts]

05 Aug 2008 at 14:53 - 435

Quote:

Originally Posted by FrAnt1c²

You know what would be great? That minipets have the ability to follow you around in explorable areas and pick up the loot for you. I've seen that in some other mmo games, and it would be cool to have something in gw aswell, as I always seem to be too lazy to pick up all items...

No, they would pick up all the crap that I don't want because my storage can't exceed 1000K. Also my inventory space is limited because I have all these shiny weapons that I have modded for PvP. I request an option to disable minipets picking up crap!

Martin Alvito

Older Than God (1)

Join Date: Aug 2006

Clan Dethryche [dth]

05 Aug 2008 at 15:07 - 436

Quote:

Originally Posted by R.Shayne

If that was the case then July 2nd nerf would have resulted in a permit price increase in ecto, didn't happen.

Quotes like this make me wish people would get their facts straight before posting.

The trader price at the time of that nerf went from a sell-to-player price of 3,300g (and falling) to the current trading range of 4,100 to 4,300.

In the secondary market (player-to-player), the result has been a shift from ectos being 30+/100k to 26-27 for 100k. This is a permanent price increase.

Granted, ectos only recovered about half of their loss from the 20-22/100k days. This result obtained because the instantaneous rate of ecto generation (measure it as ecto/second or minute, on average) remained higher than before, leading to a lower price at which it becomes more profitable to trader ecto and spend the time savings farming more ecto than to chase an extra 300-400g on each ecto by selling.

As for supply matters - I love how everyone in the market currently assumes that armbraces/ecto can only go up. Suppose that ANet doesn't release the HoM update because they've been too busy testing and coding the skill rebalance. Now recognize that there's an Assassin's Promise build kicking around DoA that kills faster than Ursanway.

Here's an alternate scenario for you: armbraces don't go up, the speculators recognize that the price is only going to go down, and suddenly tons of armbraces hit the market as the small investors try to evacuate their positions, creating the price drop.

Happens all the time in real life; it's happened at least once to armbrace prices that I can recall. When EVERYONE starts telling you one thing in a market, it's usually time to quit listening and do the opposite.

DarkWasp

Desert Nomad

Join Date: Mar 2005

Paradise

Agency Of Forbidden Fruits [Oot]

R/A

05 Aug 2008 at 15:11 - 437

Quote:

Originally Posted by FrAnt1c²

What about the xunlai marketplace btw? Anyone gave any thought that they might implement that? Or has Anet confirmed that that system wouldnt be introduced untill gw2?

Now wouldn't that be the ultimate?

MithranArkanere

Underworld Spelunker

Join Date: Nov 2006

wikipedia.org/wiki/Vigo

Heraldos de la Llama Oscura [HLO]

E/

05 Aug 2008 at 15:23 - 438

Quote:

Originally Posted by DarkWasp

Now wouldn't that be the ultimate?

They negated Auctions.
But the Xunlai Marketplace won't be an Auction, it would be a Bazaar:
- Fixed prices.
- No bidding.
- Max of 100k per sell.
etc...

That's better for GW, since it favors a system where selling 1000 items for 1k each is possible and selling 1 for 1000k is not.
And in a system like GW, in which there is no 'king of the hill' drops, a '100 sells 1k each' systems is better than a '1 sell 100k' system.

IlikeGW

Jungle Guide

Join Date: Aug 2005

05 Aug 2008 at 15:35 - 439

Quote:

Originally Posted by Nightow

....I am speechless. You do realize that Spirits, especially defensive ones are like dust in the wind when it comes to PvE.

This is the old Rit Lord build: [build=OACjAyhDJPBTnp17xFOBAAgLG]

Displacement is pretty useless... It will only block 4-6 attacks and then die.
Shelter's cost is very high for a non-ele caster.
The only one that's still decent is Union in my opinion.

Yeah when they rebuffed rit lord but ignored the huge changes they had made to spirits over time, it pretty much proved they didn't even think about this one.

DarkWasp

Desert Nomad

Join Date: Mar 2005

Paradise

Agency Of Forbidden Fruits [Oot]

R/A

05 Aug 2008 at 15:40 - 440

Quote:

Originally Posted by MithranArkanere

They negated Auctions.
But the Xunlai Marketplace won't be an Auction, it would be a Bazaar:
- Fixed prices.
- No bidding.
- Max of 100k per sell.
etc...

That's better for GW, since it favors a system where selling 1000 items for 1k each is possible and selling 1 for 1000k is not.
And in a system like GW, in which there is no 'king of the hill' drops, a '100 sells 1k each' systems is better than a '1 sell 100k' system.

Yep, its about time people started buying normal weapons again. They're out there, theres just no trade system for them to search.