Sometimes I wonder whether the old adage "People remember trains late, not the ones on time" is not a good explanation of fansite forums. I wanted to create a thread to list exactly the history of game updates and community interactions, to try to get a clear picture of that, but I don't have the time. The picture of this I have in my head shows Anet in a positive light, but I guess it's down to what each people expect of the game, and this is totally subjective. However, objectively there are many things that Anet did since GW was launched and globally they've done an excellent job.
I will buy and play GW2 as soon as it's out without a doubt, since I know that there's very little risk of not getting back what I paid for in terms of fun and there's obviously no subscription.
Will Anet's Handling Of GW1 Dissuade You From GW2?
Fril Estelin
Nereyda Shoaal
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Originally Posted by Abedeus
Really. So how do you explain that they did so little in EotN, priced it high and GW2 wasn't even announced yet?
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Priced high? I don't even remember how much I paid for it. Proly less than 1 month of playing WoW
GW2 not announced? Eeeer... "When it's done it's done". Fine by me, since I don't sit 24/7
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| You are the only one who mentioned WoW here. |
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| Also, you pay $15 for developers caring about your game. And balancing more often than every two months. And customer support. And lagless play |
I have issues during the special events when 80% of the community sits in one outpost. Which is totally understandable
And lets mention the fact GW servers are up 99.9% of the time unlike others. EVE for instance is shut for maintenance every 24 hours
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| Nope. In 2005, I bought a game expecting it to be a PvP paradise |
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| Also, we have barely any contact with the developers. |
Daesu
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Originally Posted by Abedeus
"-Balance Ursan Blessing!
-Mmm... Maybe in a year. Or year and a half." |
The worst thing is, they say they are going to fix it, but place it in such a low priority then it never gets done for more than a year, while at the meantime disappointing their player base.
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| Also, you pay $15 for developers caring about your game. And balancing more often than every two months. And customer support. And lagless play. |
Riot Narita
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Originally Posted by Daesu
I dont think you get the point. If they dont intend to fix it, why promise that they would fix it in the first place?
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And they did do some work on it.... this from Linsey's journal (Aug 28th):
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We now have an accurate list of XTH winners from the May monthly predictions and are in the planning stages to distribute those points. We’ll need to deploy some new code to upgrade the system, which requires a bit of delicate timing. Part of this deployment must occur through a build, but some of it will happen automatically on the servers. During this time, if anyone speaks to Kun Shao, it could disrupt the system and garble up the list. To address the issue, we’ll be doing this in three stages: first, a Live build to remove Kun Shao from outposts to prevent him from interfering; then, a second build to deploy the upgraded code and distribute the points; and finally, a third build to reintroduce Kun Shao so that you may redeem those points. As a thank you for all your patience, we’ll be giving everyone on the distribution list a free bump to the next-highest reward bracket. At this point you may be saying, "Cool, thanks for the extra points, Linsey, but when will the XTH come back online so I can make my predictions?" Well, that’s still up in the air. We believe that the bug which caused errors in the distribution of points has been identified and fixed, so we’re now preparing to move into the testing phase. We’ll be simulating the Live environment internally and putting the system through rigorous stress testing to see if the fix took. If it did, then yay happy fun time, the XTH will go back up, and hopefully we'll never have to touch it again. However… (You knew there would be a "however," didn’t you?) Should it fail the stress tests, it would mean the fix didn’t take because the bug goes deeper than we hope, and that would be Very Bad. If that is the case, we will be faced with a high probability that this bug is not something we can fix. Nor can we redeploy the Xunlai Tournament House with this database bug outstanding. So, let’s all keep our fingers crossed, and I'll keep you updated on how the testing is going once it gets underway. |
And all because they turned off the "free z-keys" tap?
DreamWind
If there is one thing I have learned from this thread it is this:
People easily forget things. If they don't forget, they easily forgive only if the forgiven has given them something.
Did Anet make a good game? Sure. Does that excuse all the amazing and sometimes unbelievable crap they have committed over the years? Not in my opinion and not in the opinion of anybody I personally know.
Quite honestly I don't consider ANet a very good company as a whole. I consider many people who work there amazingly talented. But if we take the sum of its parts and consider all the things that have been done, I don't conclude they are very good.
They managed to make a good game and make a lot of money and that is great. But they also managed to alienate a community, have below average CR, take months or years to fix obvious issues, and lied to the community on multiple occasions. This list goes on but I won't mention everything now (I don't have the time to type it all out quite honestly). But I will mention perhaps most importantly, that they massacred the face of their game in so many ways I can't even begin to count.
But hey...they gave us a good game that fortunately doesn't have a monthly fee so I guess as long as everybody forgets all that and buys GW2 and the expansions for GW2 everything is great. As long as you all realize the cycle will continue and are good with that, then have fun and be happy.
People easily forget things. If they don't forget, they easily forgive only if the forgiven has given them something.
Did Anet make a good game? Sure. Does that excuse all the amazing and sometimes unbelievable crap they have committed over the years? Not in my opinion and not in the opinion of anybody I personally know.
Quite honestly I don't consider ANet a very good company as a whole. I consider many people who work there amazingly talented. But if we take the sum of its parts and consider all the things that have been done, I don't conclude they are very good.
They managed to make a good game and make a lot of money and that is great. But they also managed to alienate a community, have below average CR, take months or years to fix obvious issues, and lied to the community on multiple occasions. This list goes on but I won't mention everything now (I don't have the time to type it all out quite honestly). But I will mention perhaps most importantly, that they massacred the face of their game in so many ways I can't even begin to count.
But hey...they gave us a good game that fortunately doesn't have a monthly fee so I guess as long as everybody forgets all that and buys GW2 and the expansions for GW2 everything is great. As long as you all realize the cycle will continue and are good with that, then have fun and be happy.
II Lucky Charm II
Close thread
Jensy
No, it won't. Still looking forward to it/still going to move with my guild to it. Why do you personally care what the rest of us are doing anyway? >_>
Rocky Raccoon
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Originally Posted by DreamWind
If there is one thing I have learned from this thread it is this:
People easily forget things. If they don't forget, they easily forgive only if the forgiven has given them something. Did Anet make a good game? Sure. Does that excuse all the amazing and sometimes unbelievable crap they have committed over the years? Not in my opinion and not in the opinion of anybody I personally know. Quite honestly I don't consider ANet a very good company as a whole. I consider many people who work there amazingly talented. But if we take the sum of its parts and consider all the things that have been done, I don't conclude they are very good. They managed to make a good game and make a lot of money and that is great. But they also managed to alienate a community, have below average CR, take months or years to fix obvious issues, and lied to the community on multiple occasions. This list goes on but I won't mention everything now (I don't have the time to type it all out quite honestly). But I will mention perhaps most importantly, that they massacred the face of their game in so many ways I can't even begin to count. But hey...they gave us a good game so I guess as long as everybody forgets all that and buys GW2 and the expansions for GW2 everything is great. As long as you all realize the cycle will continue and are good with that, then have fun and be happy. |
Clobimon
I truly wish some of you people had some extended experience with Funcom. If you think ANet is as bad as you make it sound then you'd be curled up in a corner, shaking and crying after a six months of FC.
That statement isn't really a matter of opinion either. You have one little company that put out a game that wasn't expected to do anything and made it huge. Then you have a larger company, by comparison, that put out a game that was suppose to be huge and it's been crammed where the sun doesn't shine because of the way it's run.
That statement isn't really a matter of opinion either. You have one little company that put out a game that wasn't expected to do anything and made it huge. Then you have a larger company, by comparison, that put out a game that was suppose to be huge and it's been crammed where the sun doesn't shine because of the way it's run.
Dratyan
GW1 is the only game that I played(and still plays) for almost 3 years. I tried most MMOs of the market and felt like paying the first month's subscription was a complete waste of money. That's why I'm definitely pre-ordering CE of GW2, and I'll probly like it.
Even better if there are less WoW grinders and GW1Guru QQers playing GW2
Even better if there are less WoW grinders and GW1Guru QQers playing GW2
Regulus X
cry me a river, and enjoy history repeating itself. GW1 recieved shit support, and the same shir will prolly happen to GW2. /notbuying
Travaail
yeh..i enjoy guildwars now but gw2 i doubt i'll buy. diablo 3..aion..starcraft 2..thats where i'll be. gw2 is a disappointment in my opinion.
Fril Estelin
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Originally Posted by DreamWind
People easily forget things.
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gremlin
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Originally Posted by Akaraxle
It's odd how most people that baselessly accuse GW's PvP of being boring seem to lack literacy as well. Those coincidences...
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If there was a way for the players to move up through the pvp game so they met equally skilled opposition it would be better.
Not saying I know how it could be done just it would improve things.
That is my one and only objection to the current pvp, I apologise for my lack of literacy It may be a justified accusation, rude but justified.
I didn't point out the literacy of the average pvp player who usually comes up with the valuable contribution to most discussions here with "It's PVE crap so who cares"
aapo
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Originally Posted by shoyon456
Two parts to this.
One: Do you think GW1 has been handled well since Anet moved onto GW2 overall? |
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Originally Posted by shoyon456
Two: If not, will in what way will this affect your view on GW2? Will you still start playing/preorder ASAP? Wait for community feedback? Wait to see how good support of the game is?
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Daesu
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Originally Posted by Risky Ranger
All I see here are the usual naysayers and doom-seekers who hate GW and ANET, but for some compulsive reason can't seem to let go and say goodbye.
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If you are not happy with the way ANet handles GW1, then not buying GW2 would be the equivalent of ending your "subscription". Since GW1 is not subscription but transaction based, not buying GW2 would be the best way to show your displeasure with how they have mishandled GW1.
Nereyda Shoaal
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Originally Posted by aapo
(...) I don't have much faith on their expertise in game development. Blizzard on the other hand...
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The founders of ArenaNet were former employees of Blizzard Entertainment who played important roles in developing the highly successful computer games Warcraft, StarCraft, Diablo, Diablo II, and the Battle.net gaming network
*Cough*
aapo
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Originally Posted by Nereida Shoal
*Cough*
The founders of ArenaNet were former employees of Blizzard Entertainment who played important roles in developing the highly successful computer games Warcraft, StarCraft, Diablo, Diablo II, and the Battle.net gaming network *Cough* |
Nereyda Shoaal
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Originally Posted by aapo
Can we say that their contribution was what made those games good?
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I feel so convinced
Traveller
I stopped playing GW about a year ago. I occasionally check these forums and it's the same discussions than back when I still was playing. But still I'm really looking forward to GW2, actually playing LoTRO now but that's just a placeholder for GW2.
aapo
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Originally Posted by Nereida Shoal
Well I bet they were The Weakest Link, that's why they don't work there anymore right?
I feel so convinced |
* Lack of direction in development
* Grouping system
* Half-baked game modes
* Exclusiveness of game content
* Recycled layouts
Some of these mistakes look pretty amateurish. There's no excuse why large majority of playerbase plays PvE alone, especially when Diablo II's grouping system was so effortless.
EDIT: and why on earth did they make a PvP mode like Random Arenas? Doesn't it stand against the whole idea of having distinct professions which complement one another?
Rocky Raccoon
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Originally Posted by Daesu
It is much easier to continue playing the game that you have already paid for than to dish out more cash to pay for another new game called GW2.
If you are not happy with the way ANet handles GW1, then not buying GW2 would be the equivalent of ending your "subscription". Since GW1 is not subscription but transaction based, not buying GW2 would be the best way to show your displeasure with how they have mishandled GW1. |
Nereyda Shoaal
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Originally Posted by aapo
There's no excuse why large majority of playerbase plays PvE alone, especially when Diablo II's grouping system was so effortless.
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The reason I play GW is the PvE system. It is cRPG and it is MMO
I played UT for a very long time (6 years or so) and I'm not interested in playing against other people anymore. The fact it's a different game doesn't make much difference to me
By putting Diablo into the convo you are asking for trouble because I'm massive fan of Baldur's Gate (and Forgotten Realms) haha
Anyway, building a new studio from scratch and selling more than 6 million copies of the game in less than 5 years... that can tell you few things about developing skills
Few months ago there was a bunch of people claiming GW2 doesn't exist, it's a vaporware. Now people trying to convince others it will be as bad as the old one and they'll even make the same mistakes... I wonder what's the next theory in 3-4 months
GW2 will be a massive success with you or without you on board
Now you'll excuse me - bedtime (GMT timezone)
Daesu
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Originally Posted by Nereida Shoal
GW2 will be a massive success with you or without you on board
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There are many things a game company can do to alienate its playerbase and ANet's handling of the XTH issue is a case in point. Whichever side of the XTH argument you are on, telling your players that you would fix something then take more than a year without fixing it, just shows them how much you mean what you say.
Anonymous IXl
I think they have been slacking on GW1 quite a bit recently... And GW2 Should be out mid-late 2010 ( Rumors say Beta 2010 release mid 2011 ). But to be honest. When their priority was GW1 they did an amazing job in my opinion. I am definitely trying GW2. Really hope its as good as the first. For now just gunna PvP Till GW2... Maybe make some money here and there for more Armour/ weaps.
Grunntar
I'm a little disappointed by the implementation of more technology into the game play, but I will still buy GW2.
I don't suffer from the expectation that I "deserve" updates, nor that I "require" care and feeding from a CR.
They created a game for $50. I bought a game for $50. I played the heck out of it, and enjoyed it completely! For thousands of hours...
At some point in the future, the will offer another game for $50. I'll buy it for $50. And if I only gets hundreds of hours of enjoyment, it will be money very well spent!
Simple!
I don't suffer from the expectation that I "deserve" updates, nor that I "require" care and feeding from a CR.
They created a game for $50. I bought a game for $50. I played the heck out of it, and enjoyed it completely! For thousands of hours...
At some point in the future, the will offer another game for $50. I'll buy it for $50. And if I only gets hundreds of hours of enjoyment, it will be money very well spent!
Simple!
DreamWind
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Originally Posted by Fril Estelin
Indeed they do, and: 1) you're no exception; 2) this is where a fansite forum can play a great role. I much prefer the word "forgive" you used, but you then ridiculously devaluate it by insulting people.
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2. Any insult I made was unintentional. I simply posted what I have been seeing in this thread.
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Originally Posted by Nereida Shaol
GW2 will be a massive success with you or without you on board
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HawkofStorms
People really are jaded about GW1.
I mean, really, it is one of the most stable MMOs I have every played. There has been downtime maintenance... what 4 times in the history of the game? That alone shows they are handling this game well.
With all the complaining people give... at least this game doesn't crash all the time and is reliably stable, unlike most MMOs currently in the market. The lag is pretty nonexistant (99 percent of people complaining about that are on their end, and even then its never as bad as some large scale RvR oriented games like Warhammer has ever been). From a coding and an artstyle and a storyline perspective, this game is outstanding.
Problems with balance... loot... grind... all that stuff is secondary. You don't notice those types of problems until you've been playing for a while and already gotten your money worth from the game.
I'll be buying it because I know the game will run smoothly and be enjoyed... at the very least in the starting areas. With no monthly fee, the investment is minimal. If the game has a broken end game or loses its luster once I hit level... 30, big deal.
I mean, really, it is one of the most stable MMOs I have every played. There has been downtime maintenance... what 4 times in the history of the game? That alone shows they are handling this game well.
With all the complaining people give... at least this game doesn't crash all the time and is reliably stable, unlike most MMOs currently in the market. The lag is pretty nonexistant (99 percent of people complaining about that are on their end, and even then its never as bad as some large scale RvR oriented games like Warhammer has ever been). From a coding and an artstyle and a storyline perspective, this game is outstanding.
Problems with balance... loot... grind... all that stuff is secondary. You don't notice those types of problems until you've been playing for a while and already gotten your money worth from the game.
I'll be buying it because I know the game will run smoothly and be enjoyed... at the very least in the starting areas. With no monthly fee, the investment is minimal. If the game has a broken end game or loses its luster once I hit level... 30, big deal.
AlsPals
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Originally Posted by Hissy
It's been what, 8 years since Diablo2's last expansion? Will that put me off Diablo3? No way, I'll buy it in a heartbeat, the moment it's out.
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Always up servers
Limited content
Whiners
zwei2stein
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Originally Posted by upier
Despite my criticism of GW1, it's not GW1 why I am not interested in GW2.
It's GW2. (As far as I can see) It seems that everything that made GW1 good isn't part of GW2. |
I think they learned from their most obvious mistakes in GW1, and they are up to making quite good game, but not game for me anymore.
Anet's handling Of GW1 does not dissuade me from GW2, it's GW2's handling. If I want what they are making, I can just subscribe to WoW, play it casually, and not wait for two years..
DreamWind
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Originally Posted by HawkofStorms
Problems with balance... loot... grind... all that stuff is secondary. You don't notice those types of problems until you've been playing for a while and already gotten your money worth from the game.
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Originally Posted by zwei2stein
I think they learned from their most obvious mistakes in GW1, and they are up to making quite good game, but not game for me anymore.
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zwei2stein
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Originally Posted by DreamWind
I don't think they have learned from their mistakes, but I think I've made that clear. You do bring up a good point though. To me what they have told us about GW2 so far doesn't make me excited in the least. The game doesn't even sound good to me right now. It is much less likely to sound good when I'm playing SC2.
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And yeah, you can see learning process:
Ch1: Total freedom of movement & Storyline following
-> People complain about runs and loose story
Ch2: Locked gates, Required storyline and quest following.
-> People complain about being locked out of exploring
Ch3: Free exploration or big sections of game, natural obstacles, 'normal outposts turning to missions outposts when you complete quest'
-> People go yay, this is what we wanted
Ex1: Adapted system from Ch3 with resurrection shrines.
-> People go meh.
Ch1: People finish game and go "wtf we do now, uw&fow is hard/easy, we dont wanna pvp".
-> Added titles
Ch2: Omg, titles r either too easy or grind, it will never max kurzick and mapping is lame
-> Added more titles
Ch3: wtf, titles r useless, why do we do them anyway?
-> Added PvE effects to skills, HoM.
Ex1: wtf omg, titles r grind, i need like million monies to get to Koabod(30)
-> Added easy-mode way to farm money and to get titles/statues.
Fril Estelin
We're months away from concrete details about the gameplay, apart from general statements on the continuation of the GW1 philosophy and a few important novelties. It's too early to say, and I should have acknowledged that in my previous post.
But I think people will be positively surprised next year, but that's only a big hunch.
But I think people will be positively surprised next year, but that's only a big hunch.
Kenzo Skunk
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Originally Posted by Sir Cusfreak
can't believe some of the utter crap Ive read in this thread.
OP: YES! the way they've handled things WILL affect my decision to buy GW2! I can't wait. I'll have the CE, the preorder, and I'll be there the 1st second I can get my grubby little paws on a login screen. If they were taking money right now I'd send it right now. people bitch and moan and cry and blabber on a billion times here in this thread, but in all seriousness they DO NOT OWE US NEW CONTENT. we paid for X. We got X. and Y. and Z. and more. They dont owe skill balances. They dont owe new quests. They got paid and could have moved right on and instead they continue to add, and its NOT because they owe it. kwitcherkwyin. play and have fun here, or play and have fun somewhere else. but seriously bitching about "how things have been handled" - give me a break - its almost FIVE YEARS later, and no matter WHO you are you got your money's worth - and more. STFU. |
Akaraxle
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Originally Posted by Abedeus
Prophecies - decent PvE as a tutorial before PvP, awesome PvP. Factions, a bit problems with balancing new classes and skills, but then it became one of the best times for GW's PvP. Then it went downhill. Nightfall, powercreep, Dervishes and Paragons, too much focus on PvE. EotN? Everything for PvE except for a handful of skills, destroying the economy a bit more.
<cut> Nope. In 2005, I bought a game expecting it to be a PvP paradise. Two years and about $80 later I was surprised to see how much powercreep happened since Prophecies... Also, we have barely any contact with the developers. |
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Originally Posted by gremlin
The basis for my objection to the current pvp is there isn't a division between average players who could have great fun playing against each other and top players who could well beat the heck out of me every game.
If there was a way for the players to move up through the pvp game so they met equally skilled opposition it would be better. Not saying I know how it could be done just it would improve things. |
When PvP was still an important part of this game, there was a division where it was needed, and it was called ladder play. GvG was the "layered" PvP you seeked, but I'm guessing by PvP all you think of is RA or HA. Not that GvG made you immune to noobstomping (playing during lower peak times, or against smurfs) but it was something.
P.S. /agree with everything DreamWind posts.
Test Me
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Originally Posted by zwei2stein
Ch1: Total freedom of movement & Storyline following
-> People complain about runs and loose story |
I love the freedom Prophecies has and judging by the number of fresh toons looking for runs to get to places, I'd say people love that too.Yeah it's cool to do the story once... but if you want to create one toon of each profession like I did... thank God there is such freedom in proph.
I still think map travel should be unlocked per account not per toon. Do it once on your main, unlock outposts get them unlocked on all toons. Just like PvP outposts are unlocked on all toons. Even sitting there in a run is boring as hell and wasted time, not to mention that in NF and factions you are forced to play the same crappy boring missions you've played 20 times already just to get to an outpost you want to go for unlocking a skill or something.
zwei2stein
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Originally Posted by Test Me
Really? No, come on! I mean how many times can you go through that story before you feel like puking?
I love the freedom Prophecies has and judging by the number of fresh toons looking for runs to get to places, I'd say people love that too. |
Abedeus
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Originally Posted by Nereida Shoal
Eeeer... What? What x2?
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| Priced high? I don't even remember how much I paid for it. Proly less than 1 month of playing WoW |
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| GW2 not announced? Eeeer... "When it's done it's done". Fine by me, since I don't sit 24/7 |
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I don't have problems with the lag, maybe it's time for you to change the ISP I have issues during the special events when 80% of the community sits in one outpost. Which is totally understandable |
You probably don't even remember how there were 3-4 weeks of horrible lags, and then they blamed it on the summer heat.
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| And lets mention the fact GW servers are up 99.9% of the time unlike others. EVE for instance is shut for maintenance every 24 hours |
But you'd have to pay someone to do that.
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| WoW again. I bet you'll love PvP over there. |
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Originally Posted by Akaraxle
I have no idea who you are and I hope you're not a PvP veteran, because if even a casual player realised this much then I'm really happy. If the majority community was made of people like you, all this crap wouldn't have happened.
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...Then again, I had more fun with PvP in those days than with PvE.
Test Me
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Originally Posted by zwei2stein
Yet people thought that running to droknars to get max armor/elite skill caps was worst thing ever.
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Akaraxle
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Originally Posted by Abedeus
If by veteran you mean top 500 guilds in Factions times on a monk, then maybe. But probably not.
...Then again, I had more fun with PvP in those days than with PvE. |