+1
Leave it as is, Up the skeletons. Fixed.
Is this Anet's solution to shadow form?
Master Sword Keeper
QueenofDeath
Quote:
|
Originally Posted by Zebideedee I'd love it if A-Net removed/changed the game so that SF/55'ing etc wasn't possible, the QQ threads would be hilarious |
) I don't mind people trying to solo just remove all the gimmick builds that make them invulnerable and invincible. All these insane protective armor and protective spirit spells should be taken out of the game period. Just have HEALS and MENDS but remove all the for X amount of minutes you cannot be harmed bs spells and protective armor that can't be hit. Then it will be a fun game again.
)
Targren
Quote:
|
Originally Posted by Mr. Undisclosed
I want to do uw balanced and its nigh impossible in a reasonable time. Then she says not only will it be hard to do balanced you won't be able to use sf to do it, where does that leave us? GG.
|
"Elite" areas are about coordination in play AND builds. Going with what works BEST. If you want to play with "good enough", stick with EotN dungeons. Whatever replaces SF/UWSC, it will not be "balanced", mark me.
QueenofDeath
Quote:
|
Don't understand any other side to an issue except what their narrow minds can create Don't care about what other people think, but believe that their opinion is above that and it doesn't matter. |
Now I can accept you want what you want in the game, but, I want what I want in the game also so there's no one correct answer here, but, what has to come down is compromise and Anet is doing that compromise now in the form of Nerfing SF and hopefully a whole bunch of the GIMMICK builds out there that solo farm. It won't stop farming but hopefully it will tone it down quite a bit where things can become comfortable for all types of plalyers not just the farmers.
Quote:
| Whatever replaces SF/UWSC, it will not be "balanced", mark me. |
Reformed
Quote:
|
Originally Posted by QueenofDeath
As long as they keep nerfing whatever little gimmick build they make will be fine with me. Eventually there will be nothing left but simple builds that it will take a group of skilled balanced players to win in there and that is the way it should be.
|
zwei2stein
Quote:
|
Originally Posted by Rahja the Thief
Has it occured to any of you in opposition to Shadow Form that it may, in fact, have been changed to facilitate those that are still interested in GW1? I mean, without SF the way it is now, what percentage of current players would still be playing? I would guess low 30%s... just a guess, but it seems viable.
|
Also, consider this:
When game runs out of content like GW, only reason to keep playing is OCDing achievements ... err, titles. This secondary 'content' however too only lasts so long. Adding easy-farm skills is highly counterproductive: 10k point titles get completed faster and 'grind' gets bypassed. What keep them playing then? More farms for rarer stuff? Which too is over faster with easy farm stuff.
So, why do you think those 70% really continue playing? Is it really only because they can amass pixel glory fast?
Or is it because they want to get X, and already spent long time getting there and do not quit as easily because of commitment falacy?
---
I mean whoever continues sfing is kinda hopelessly addicted and pretty much only way for him to quit is burn out hard.
MithranArkanere
Have a look at the price of the chaos globes.
Do they require so many ectoplasm because it's easy to get? Nope, because it's easy to farm. Rare materials drop 'more' in HM when going solo. So solo farmers get them more, and that's why you see so many assassins with obsidian armor and chaos globes.
They don't spend time to get that, they get that because they don't have anything else to spend the ectos in!
Do they require so many ectoplasm because it's easy to get? Nope, because it's easy to farm. Rare materials drop 'more' in HM when going solo. So solo farmers get them more, and that's why you see so many assassins with obsidian armor and chaos globes.
They don't spend time to get that, they get that because they don't have anything else to spend the ectos in!
BlackSephir
Quote:
|
Originally Posted by PokeDrop
Good thing you're not a dev then.
 |
I guess since they're getting upset about almost every skill balance you can go one step further.
MithranArkanere
Guild Wars is an everchanging game.
When skills change, you change builds and adapt. If you can't do that, then GW is not your game.
And if something becomes too difficult, they will probably tone it down a bit. (They did so already a couple of times)
I think it should be simple enough to understand.
When skills change, you change builds and adapt. If you can't do that, then GW is not your game.
And if something becomes too difficult, they will probably tone it down a bit. (They did so already a couple of times)
I think it should be simple enough to understand.
Life Bringing
Quote:
|
Originally Posted by MithranArkanere
Have a look at the price of the chaos globes.
Do they require so many ectoplasm because it's easy to get? Nope, because it's easy to farm. Rare materials drop 'more' in HM when going solo. So solo farmers get them more, and that's why you see so many assassins with obsidian armor and chaos globes. They don't spend time to get that, they get that because they don't have anything else to spend the ectos in! |
Arduin
Quote:
|
Originally Posted by DragonRogue
Its gotten to the point now where i need all 10 classes just to play this game and its annoying as hell. At least with Ursan, if i wanted to play in an area my ranger wasnt wanted, id still get to play.
|
w00t!
Let people accumulate personal wealth all they want via solo farming, but don't "force" people into gimmick builds just to be able to get in a team in Elite areas.
Trub
Quote:
|
Originally Posted by w00t!
Let people accumulate personal wealth all they want via solo farming, but don't "force" people into gimmick builds just to be able to get in a team in Elite areas.
|
There are new and very creative team builds developing since the UW change, but it still looks like SF farmers are being catered to....
I will hold my own opinions close until I see if the builds being tested are going to be stable enough for decent teams to run.
(There should NEVER be a 'GOD-MODE' in an on-line game)
P.S.: OMG Zebideedee, that pic is too cute!!
Lishy
Quote:
|
Originally Posted by MithranArkanere
Guild Wars is an everchanging game.
When skills change, you change builds and adapt. If you can't do that, then GW is not your game. And if something becomes too difficult, they will probably tone it down a bit. (They did so already a couple of times) I think it should be simple enough to understand. |
Considering skill changing is a very long process in reality to implement, there must be a huge balance update planned.
DreamWind
Quote:
|
Originally Posted by Zahr Dalsk
ArenaNet apparently missed this when they were testing the update, but Shadow Form is not only still viable with Dhuum in the Underworld; it's actually still the most effective way to beat him.
Just thought I'd bring this to their attention. |
Lord Sojar
Of course, the majority of you are forgetting that the 55 monk has existed for... uh... 4 years + now? These same QQ threads existed for every variation of the 55 monk and still pop up from time to time...
I think I have a few good ideas for how to fix the SF problem, but they don't involve buffing Ursan (that is absolutely an insane idea...), nerfing SF into the ground (it's a fun skill, and should be a viable farming ability), or buffing other skills to come in line with SF. Simple world changes and a tweak to SF's description are all that is needed. We don't need to Smiter's Boon SF people, it is a PvE farming skill. The Guild Wars economy is balanced around a steady supply of ectoplasm, and if it suddenly lacks said supply... kiss your precious trading goodbye.
If any of you players are long standing enough to remember, ecto were at one time, 20k+ each. Do you really want that to happen again? I certainly don't, considering my ranger's FoW armor cost me like 5 million gold back then... no thanks.
NO. Again, you are failing to understand the primary issue... there are too many skills in Guild Wars to effectively balance all of them on a skill to skill synergy level (READ THAT AGAIN IF YOU DON'T GET IT!!). Once you understand that, it is only a short step to a full understanding of why there are no more Guild Wars 1 chapters, and Guild Wars 2 is on its way. You change one skill's description to "nerf" or adjust it, and it suddenly has this crazy synergy with another skill and becomes the new meta or FotM. It's a vicious cycle, and the only way to stop it is to balance very few skills at a time, looking at that skill and any skills that potentially have synergy with it, and making adjustments accordingly. If you can't do that, leave the skills alone.
I think I have a few good ideas for how to fix the SF problem, but they don't involve buffing Ursan (that is absolutely an insane idea...), nerfing SF into the ground (it's a fun skill, and should be a viable farming ability), or buffing other skills to come in line with SF. Simple world changes and a tweak to SF's description are all that is needed. We don't need to Smiter's Boon SF people, it is a PvE farming skill. The Guild Wars economy is balanced around a steady supply of ectoplasm, and if it suddenly lacks said supply... kiss your precious trading goodbye.
If any of you players are long standing enough to remember, ecto were at one time, 20k+ each. Do you really want that to happen again? I certainly don't, considering my ranger's FoW armor cost me like 5 million gold back then... no thanks.
Quote:
|
Originally Posted by Kain Fz
Exactly my thoughts,
Considering skill changing is a very long process in reality to implement, there must be a huge balance update planned. |
QueenofDeath
Quote:
| If any of you players are long standing enough to remember, ecto were at one time, 20k+ each. Do you really want that to happen again? |
They flooded the market with too much loot and now everyone is sitting around just wanting the high end stuff as they can easily afford the low end and middle end gear. There was a time I could get 100k for just a gold item of uncommon drop rate. Now I'm lucky if I can get 5k hell I make more farming feathers for the SF sins lol how ironic than I can farming equipment.
Sorry but I like a world where things have high value for a long time. With this game not having any evolving of gear too many people get to the end game gear too fast and then there is just nothing worth playing for except silly titles or minis.
Fril Estelin
Quote:
|
Originally Posted by zwei2stein
Is that really game where people only farm worth preserving?
|
P.S.: balanced UW clear tonight?
w00t!
Quote:
|
Originally Posted by Rahja the Thief
Of course, the majority of you are forgetting that the 55 monk has existed for... uh... 4 years + now? These same QQ threads existed for every variation of the 55 monk and still pop up from time to time...
|
Quote:
|
Originally Posted by Rahja the Thief
I think I have a few good ideas for how to fix the SF problem, but they don't involve buffing Ursan (that is absolutely an insane idea...), nerfing SF into the ground (it's a fun skill, and should be a viable farming ability), or buffing other skills to come in line with SF.
|
Quote:
|
Originally Posted by Rahja the Thief
If any of you players are long standing enough to remember, ecto were at one time, 20k+ each. Do you really want that to happen again? I certainly don't, considering my ranger's FoW armor cost me like 5 million gold back then... no thanks.
|
Ecto prices have stayed reasonably stable in terms of buying power. The only thing that has really been affected is FoW armor, which is now a dime a dozen.
Quote:
|
Originally Posted by Rahja the Thief
It's a vicious cycle, and the only way to stop it is to balance very few skills at a time, looking at that skill and any skills that potentially have synergy with it, and making adjustments accordingly. If you can't do that, leave the skills alone.
|
zwei2stein
Quote:
|
Originally Posted by Fril Estelin
If you were an Anet employee, part of the small Live Team, what would you say? "Scrap it so that we can show to the world how a game is properly played"?
P.S.: balanced UW clear tonight? |
(definitelly on uw clear :-) )
Verene
Quote:
| You change one skill's description to "nerf" or adjust it, and it suddenly has this crazy synergy with another skill and becomes the new meta or FotM. It's a vicious cycle, and the only way to stop it is to balance very few skills at a time, looking at that skill and any skills that potentially have synergy with it, and making adjustments accordingly. If you can't do that, leave the skills alone. |
I think it's pretty clear that they want to nerf SF in such a way that it's no longer god-mode, but it's still viable for some farms. Hence it's not nearly as simple as taking a bat to the skill and utterly destroying it. They not only have to look at the changes made to it, but also the changes made to the other skills that work with it.
snaek
Quote:
|
Originally Posted by rahja the thief
there are too many skills in Guild Wars to effectively balance all of them on a skill to skill synergy level (READ THAT AGAIN IF YOU DON'T GET IT!!). Once you understand that, it is only a short step to a full understanding of why there are no more Guild Wars 1 chapters, and Guild Wars 2 is on its way. You change one skill's description to "nerf" or adjust it, and it suddenly has this crazy synergy with another skill and becomes the new meta or FotM. It's a vicious cycle, and the only way to stop it is to balance very few skills at a time, looking at that skill and any skills that potentially have synergy with it, and making adjustments accordingly. If you can't do that, leave the skills alone.
|
so tell me why they changed it to bi-monthly updates, which even that schedule they can not seem to follow? it simply takes time, and by the looks of it they are not putting in much if any at all. anet is obviously out of the loop in terms of skill balance, and unless they get back in there and stay there, its unlikely we will see a quality skill balance.
look how long its taking them to balance sf. if they were to actually monitor skill balance daily, they could have prevented the situation from being blown out of proportion. however, that is not what anet does--they do a skill balance, go away for an extended period of time until the community informs anet about the state of gw, at which point anet thinks its suitable enough for them to do a quick cleanup and call it a day.
skill balance requires maintenance. any person with common sense will tell you that it should be done regularly. the more time you spend on it, the more you will notice the subtleties--and careful balance is all about the subtle details.
Hooded Doom
hurray SF nerf.....
now i get to quit the game, gg anet.
horde your ectos guys because their gonna be worth an assload.
now i get to quit the game, gg anet.
horde your ectos guys because their gonna be worth an assload.
qvtkc
Quote:
|
Originally Posted by Joe Fierce
I've got an idea guys, let's all cry about problems we created!!! That's right, you, yeah you, the community, you created this problem, it's not a matter of imbalance, it's a matter of the willingness and free thought to put together something more effective or alluring to other play styles, your laziness and willingness to complain about imbalance is the failing point, had you begun to come up with new ways to do uw/elites months ago then sf would have something to contend with when it comes to groups forming in in toa.
|
EDIT: I was just on a balanced UW clear btw, with a PUG, we reached Dhuum and then we died because no one knew what to do lol. So after two and a half hours (yeah slow) of playing we fail, a disappointment but Dhuum looks so awesome that that made up for it, at least partly. The funny thing though? Even with a balanced setup, our team consisted of a warrior, two eles, a spirit spammer, a necro, two monks... and a SF sin. Without him we likely wouldn't have made it at all.
EDIT2: Even funnier is of course that while we struggled on for that long, a mobway group would be able to clear UW three times over.
Yawgmoth
Yay! After another couple of months waiting we got another confirmation that they're looking into finally fixing SF. An instantly obvious fix that should have been done 18 months ago is too hard? I understand that a bigger project rebalancing other imba skills and practically creating completely new PvE meta has to take a lot of time, but this one SF fix is plain obvious and should be done as soon as possible.
At least not all hope is lost and we may expect some balance before GW2 is released in 2011.
But can we hope they'll handle it right? Shadow Form was a fantastic and Very powerful skill WITHOUT the ability to maintain it, and it had PLENTY of uses (incl. boss assassinations - farming greens, a number of other farms for specific targets hard to reach without it, running through dangerous areas, chestrunning, ...) it was fun to use when you had to watch it ending and get away of aggro before it did. It was still overpowered and allowed doing things no other skill or build could. But I lack words to describe how absurridicullus was the Update that made it easy to maintain it permanently... it was SOOO much over-the-top. Buffing something already borderline imba into the sky. Any competent person who understands this game's mechanics knew how imba it was mere days or even hours after the update, shame that no such person works on GW.
The only good thing they could have done was a quick nerf and apologizing for making a mistake. Letting it run for soooo long was just as horrible as creating it, it's the Ursan problem all over again, with huge player masses simply accepting it as a normal part of the game, not a terrible mistake.
At least not all hope is lost and we may expect some balance before GW2 is released in 2011.
But can we hope they'll handle it right? Shadow Form was a fantastic and Very powerful skill WITHOUT the ability to maintain it, and it had PLENTY of uses (incl. boss assassinations - farming greens, a number of other farms for specific targets hard to reach without it, running through dangerous areas, chestrunning, ...) it was fun to use when you had to watch it ending and get away of aggro before it did. It was still overpowered and allowed doing things no other skill or build could. But I lack words to describe how absurridicullus was the Update that made it easy to maintain it permanently... it was SOOO much over-the-top. Buffing something already borderline imba into the sky. Any competent person who understands this game's mechanics knew how imba it was mere days or even hours after the update, shame that no such person works on GW.
The only good thing they could have done was a quick nerf and apologizing for making a mistake. Letting it run for soooo long was just as horrible as creating it, it's the Ursan problem all over again, with huge player masses simply accepting it as a normal part of the game, not a terrible mistake.
Lord Sojar
Quote:
|
Originally Posted by Yawgmoth
Yay! After another couple of months waiting we got another confirmation that they're looking into finally fixing SF. An instantly obvious fix that should have been done 18 months ago is too hard? I understand that a bigger project rebalancing other imba skills and practically creating completely new PvE meta has to take a lot of time, but this one SF fix is plain obvious and should be done as soon as possible.
At least not all hope is lost and we may expect some balance before GW2 is released in 2011. But can we hope they'll handle it right? Shadow Form was a fantastic and Very powerful skill WITHOUT the ability to maintain it, and it had PLENTY of uses (incl. boss assassinations - farming greens, a number of other farms for specific targets hard to reach without it, running through dangerous areas, chestrunning, ...) it was fun to use when you had to watch it ending and get away of aggro before it did. It was still overpowered and allowed doing things no other skill or build could. But I lack words to describe how absurridicullus was the Update that made it easy to maintain it permanently... it was SOOO much over-the-top. Buffing something already borderline imba into the sky. Any competent person who understands this game's mechanics knew how imba it was mere days or even hours after the update, shame that no such person works on GW. The only good thing they could have done was a quick nerf and apologizing for making a mistake. Letting it run for soooo long was just as horrible as creating it, it's the Ursan problem all over again, with huge player masses simply accepting it as a normal part of the game, not a terrible mistake. |
It's PvE... I mean really now.... balance? LOL
I understand people's complaints that they can't find a group that is non SF for UW, but that doesn't mean I agree. You can do a guild run using a balanced build that uses other classes, and probably clear UW just as fast if not faster considering Dhuum is now present.
Yawgmoth
And you got to the test krewe without understanding what balance is and how important it is. Level of hope -1.
So having one degenerate gimmick completely dominating is acceptable because everyone can make his own guild and play something else? Good luck with that. Lol, seriously, lol.
So having one degenerate gimmick completely dominating is acceptable because everyone can make his own guild and play something else? Good luck with that. Lol, seriously, lol.
Mr. Undisclosed
Quote:
|
Originally Posted by Targren
You're delusional... There's never been, and never will be, effective "balanced" parties for elite areas. Before UWSC was Cryway, etc.., going all the way back to Holy Trinity.
"Elite" areas are about coordination in play AND builds. Going with what works BEST. If you want to play with "good enough", stick with EotN dungeons. Whatever replaces SF/UWSC, it will not be "balanced", mark me. |
pumpkin pie
Quote:
|
Originally Posted by Tenebrae
Instead ill ask you another thing , where did i say that you are a farmer ? or that you farm ? I asked "IF" you like bla bla, dont make mistakes , i wasnt guessing nothing.
See? thats where you are wrong. Im not a farmer and i dont care , im leaving this game in about 2 months so care = -7 . I just see the bigger picture, see skill bars, see what is going on in the game right now ..... and if you do those things and cant see SF is broken, you must be blind. Its a matter of balance, is not like it affects me or not , not like my life is at risk or whatever , its simple perspective. Please, dont be mistaken, you speak like all ppl that agrees with a SF nerf is a cryer and thats not true. Ignoring a problem doesnt solve it; the fact that this problem doesnt bother you or affect you doesnt mean it dont exist or that it dont matter. Like Dr House said "Doing things change things .... doing nothing changes nothing" ( or smthing like that ). Anyway , check reginas post , enough said  |
)Perspective is subjective.
From your perspective, how is SF a "problem" to the game as a whole? other then creating QQers or in your words cryer? Does SF make sales of Guild Wars Drop? Does SF make numbers of Guild Wars' players drop? Does 10 players using SF makes your gold disappear, or your armour disappear? or that 100 players using SF makes your farm drop rate drops? If a skill does not affect you, as much as it does not affect me, how is it broken? What about 55 monks/Necros, Earth Ele that could kill Shiro in 5 seconds (Imperial Sanctum Mission), 600 Smite Monks and many more.
I saw what she posted regarding nerfing SF, and frankly I do not care, because it doesn't bother me and definitely NOT a problem for me weather SF is maintain or nerf, lol, to me ArenaNet doing something about SF, its just a form of ArenaNet saying: "we care about our playerbase, therefore we are addressing the "matter" that has the most QQ." nothing more.
I don't watch House. but heres a "house" quote for ya:
Quote:
|
Originally Posted by Rahja the Thief
It's PvE... I mean really now.... balance? LOL
|
Notes:
farm: sure i farm for holiday stuffs, because that is part of playing the game, where there's a particular holiday I pre farm orr emblems. i think thats about it.
why I posted: apparently or on the surface, me posting here to counter the SF QQ might seems like I care about it being nerf. But the only reason I am here is because I am bored! If there are more GW2 news and I am not using my MAC I'd be playing Guild Wars without using SF and could care less if players QQ about SF or not.
Bryant Again
Quote:
|
Originally Posted by Rahja the Thief
If any of you players are long standing enough to remember, ecto were at one time, 20k+ each. Do you really want that to happen again? I certainly don't, considering my ranger's FoW armor cost me like 5 million gold back then... no thanks.
|
@Pumpkin: it's not that players using it is the problem, rather that such an idea exists. A game that encourages class diversity is a good game.
Burst Cancel
It's interesting that the rage around CoD:MW2 didn't give people some perspective. I'll spell it out for you: the opinions of any small group, no matter how hardcore, knowledgeable, etc., are financially irrelevant, and therefore completely irrelevant in the only way that actually matters to game companies. IW took a huge dump on the vocal minority and got away with it, and there's pretty much no reason why every other developer shouldn't do the same. If you don't command a significant share of hard dollars, there's absolutely no reason why anyone should give a flying **** what you think.
Discussion of whether SF is "degenerate" or PvE is "balanced" misses the point completely.
Discussion of whether SF is "degenerate" or PvE is "balanced" misses the point completely.
IlikeGW
Quote:
|
Originally Posted by Burst Cancel
If you don't command a significant share of hard dollars, there's absolutely no reason why anyone should give a flying **** what you think.
|
Also we've got to be realistic at this point. Yes Dhuum is a letdown and doesn't make the UW a great elite area or revive the game. Yes, nobody outside of Sin and Monk UW runners is going to even see him. But realistically, you would have to redesign all of UW (which was a hot mess to begin with just dumping overpowered stuff on the players) monsters, quest fights, to make it in line with the skill set of 10 classes and PVE skills and consumables. Let's face it, that's mission impossible. It's not ever happening. SF will get nerfed. UW will continue to be for ecto farming. *Some* kind of group will emerge to do clearing, and maybe it will be fast again, but whatever the case it will again not be casual gaming friendly or carefree. You'll have to train up hard in the new methods for sure to use them. And most people won't find it worth it to do these things anymore, but that's the breaks. The game is over, and has been for some time.
MisterT69
Well as it stands now it looks as if UW takes just as long as a DoA run so I think I know where I'll be for the new few weeks until A-net nerfs SF
All this "balancing" A-net is trying to do is just making people go do different things. "Oh UW takes too long? mmmmmk, imma go FoW or DoA." What A-net is doing now is just pushing people from area to area. After the ursan nerf, people flocked to UW to make the quick cash, and once cryway became the bees knees, people flocked back to DoA. A-net's updates never fix the problem, they just move the problem to another area where people exploit it, usually for months on end, and once they fix that problem, the people flock to another area. Eventually this will take people over the edge, and out of the elite areas indefinitely. The "old-school" people say they love the sense of nostalgia and all this blah-blah, but as I see it, you can only do so many balanced UW HM runs before you realize it's not worth doing UW for 2 hours for 1-2 ecto and MAYBE a good chest drop. Eventually people will stop caring about the crap drops, and UW will turn into the new tombs (aka nothin but tumbleweed)
All this "balancing" A-net is trying to do is just making people go do different things. "Oh UW takes too long? mmmmmk, imma go FoW or DoA." What A-net is doing now is just pushing people from area to area. After the ursan nerf, people flocked to UW to make the quick cash, and once cryway became the bees knees, people flocked back to DoA. A-net's updates never fix the problem, they just move the problem to another area where people exploit it, usually for months on end, and once they fix that problem, the people flock to another area. Eventually this will take people over the edge, and out of the elite areas indefinitely. The "old-school" people say they love the sense of nostalgia and all this blah-blah, but as I see it, you can only do so many balanced UW HM runs before you realize it's not worth doing UW for 2 hours for 1-2 ecto and MAYBE a good chest drop. Eventually people will stop caring about the crap drops, and UW will turn into the new tombs (aka nothin but tumbleweed)
joshuarodger
Quote:
|
Originally Posted by Rahja the Thief
very small percentage of the GW community actually bother with forums such as GWG)
|
GWG has 202,000 members. that's 10% of my estimated number and that doesn't count the people that check guru but don't set up an account. even if you take out about 50,000 people for alternate Guru accounts and ad spammers, that's still 8%. that is a significant portion of the community no matter how you look at it.
of course, the 2,000,000 players is just my guesstimation and it could be more players but it could also be fewer, depending on how they count EotN and various other factors. i wonder how many different accounts there actually are for this game, and if there's a way to find out. and of course 150,000 GWG users also includes inactive and banned(?) accts so that could be wrong.
no matter how you see it, though, there's a reason regina, gaile, and martin post on GWG. that's because this fansite is a significant part of the GW world and they know that they're most loyal and hardcore fans (the ones that will buy other products from their company) come here to be heard.
Lord Sojar
Quote:
|
Originally Posted by joshuarodger
i don't know about this statement any more. 5 million-ish copies of GW sold. this number includes prophecies, factions, nightfall, and possibly EotN all listed seperately. this means people that bought all campaigns get counted 3 times and possibly 4 times if EotN is listed seperately. not to mention that a lot of people have multiple accts. i would bet that there are about 2 million people in total playing this game.
GWG has 202,000 members. that's 10% of my estimated number and that doesn't count the people that check guru but don't set up an account. even if you take out about 50,000 people for alternate Guru accounts and ad spammers, that's still 8%. that is a significant portion of the community no matter how you look at it. of course, the 2,000,000 players is just my guesstimation and it could be more players but it could also be fewer, depending on how they count EotN and various other factors. i wonder how many different accounts there actually are for this game, and if there's a way to find out. and of course 150,000 GWG users also includes inactive and banned(?) accts so that could be wrong. no matter how you see it, though, there's a reason regina, gaile, and martin post on GWG. that's because this fansite is a significant part of the GW world and they know that they're most loyal and hardcore fans (the ones that will buy other products from their company) come here to be heard. |
Inde should post active users within the last 2 months numbers. There are probably only around 3-4k active Guru users these days. It represents very little of the community; I stand by that comment.
And Yawgmoth, I complete and totally understand balance. However, PvE is never going to be balanced in any game, no matter which way you look at it. There will always be some builds/classes that are just worthless to play, and other that are far better, so they are played most often and thus preferred in a group setting.
This is a simple and unified fact of MMOs as a whole, not just Guild Wars.
This argument will never end though, considering most Guild Wars players are either too stupid to realize that a skills functionality is broken, or they are content with it being broken for profit reasons.
Unfortunately, PvE in Guild Wars never reached the dynamics that PvP held, so it couldn't inherently be balanced in such a manner. Could you imagine what would happen if they balanced mobs to be PvP centered with AI to fit that? Some areas would be next to impossible to manage...
UnChosen
Quote:
|
Originally Posted by MisterT69
Well as it stands now it looks as if UW takes just as long as a DoA run so I think I know where I'll be for the new few weeks until A-net nerfs SF
All this "balancing" A-net is trying to do is just making people go do different things. "Oh UW takes too long? mmmmmk, imma go FoW or DoA." What A-net is doing now is just pushing people from area to area. After the ursan nerf, people flocked to UW to make the quick cash, and once cryway became the bees knees, people flocked back to DoA. A-net's updates never fix the problem, they just move the problem to another area where people exploit it, usually for months on end, and once they fix that problem, the people flock to another area. Eventually this will take people over the edge, and out of the elite areas indefinitely. The "old-school" people say they love the sense of nostalgia and all this blah-blah, but as I see it, you can only do so many balanced UW HM runs before you realize it's not worth doing UW for 2 hours for 1-2 ecto and MAYBE a good chest drop. Eventually people will stop caring about the crap drops, and UW will turn into the new tombs (aka nothin but tumbleweed) |
Bryant Again
Quote:
|
Originally Posted by Rahja the Thief
And Yawgmoth, I complete and totally understand balance. However, PvE is never going to be balanced in any game, no matter which way you look at it. There will always be some builds/classes that are just worthless to play, and other that are far better, so they are played most often and thus preferred in a group setting.
This is a simple and unified fact of MMOs as a whole, not just Guild Wars. |
However, I do not agree with your general message of PvE: that it has gone way too far down the wrong path.
ANet substituted fixing the game's lackluster AI with higher levels and gimmicky, unbalanced enemy mobs. Then instead of addressing that they gave the players devastating tools - PvE skills, consets, EOTN titles - that put players *on-par* with the poorly balanced enemies. Factor in the tremendous amount of skills and you have a game that can only be balanced by deleting content.
This doesn't mean ANet should give up, though. If they only balanced a fraction of those skills I'd be happy, and putting a nerf to some of the most horrendously powerful skills wouldn't be too difficult.
A nerf to consets in general would also be keen: change them from something that decreases the difficulty of the instance to something that decreases the difficulty of the encounter. Would be cool to see something like Summoning Sickness applied to them as well.
In regards to farming: Some may say I'm incredibly biased against it, but the day PvE is made to be a whole lot more enjoyable is the day that 1 character cannot eliminate mobs in an area designed for 8.
Overall I still say it's still quite possible to have a PvE game with a whole lot more variety and replayability.
Fril Estelin
From Anet's viewpoint, Bryant, why would you do such a thing? So that a few thousand players come back to play the game? To kick out of the game the several dozen thousands farmers? To send a message to everyone?
(practically, you underestimate the complexity of such a balance in terms of examining all the mobs/missions/quests and QA... it'd only be doable over a very long period of time)
(practically, you underestimate the complexity of such a balance in terms of examining all the mobs/missions/quests and QA... it'd only be doable over a very long period of time)
Bryant Again
Quote:
|
Originally Posted by Fril Estelin
From Anet's viewpoint, Bryant, why would you do such a thing?
|
Quote:
|
Originally Posted by Fril Estelin
(practically, you underestimate the complexity of such a balance in terms of examining all the mobs/missions/quests and QA... it'd only be doable over a very long period of time)
|
Tenebrae
Quote:
|
Originally Posted by pumpkin pie
First of all I did not mention you accusing me of anything. I merely stated I do not farm* (read notes for clarification
) |
Quote:
|
Originally Posted by pumpkin pie
Perspective is subjective.
|
Quote:
|
Originally Posted by pumpkin pie
From your perspective, how is SF a "problem" to the game as a whole? bla bla bla ,random things like "if you dont like it dont use it" and "how does affect YOUR game play" bla bla said 32454325 times
|
Dont be mistaken , you think:
- "it doesnt affect me , is not A problem.
Correct sentence :
- "it doesnt affect me , is not MY problem" but it IS still a problem.
Like i said , ignoring a problem is worth nothing. The fact that it doesnt affect me doesnt mean it dont exist or should be solved.
Quote:
|
Originally Posted by pumpkin pie
I don't watch House. but heres a "house" quote for ya:
|
Quote:
|
Originally Posted by pumpkin pie
Lastly: If ArenaNet Care about their playerbase, do something about hackers and cheaters.
|
Why ? hackers doesnt affect anet directly, nor cheaters in game , do they affect your game play ? do cheaters slow your vanquish ? do cheaters make your armor dissapear ? ...... hope you get that.