Shadow Form meets the end

Originally Posted by Gun Pierson

People can play 90% of the game's areas using balanced or whatever composition of classes in a team as long as the team finds the sweet spot between offense and defense.

There are a couple of areas left where the true powercreep rules. Playing an area for 4 hours to receive like 10k if you're lucky is just not fun. Because most of the veterans already played the game several times and did the elite stuff playing 'balanced' anyway.

Why do people use Shadow Form? Because it's the most efficient way of farming some stuff in a game where rewards suck. A few elite areas still drop some worthy stuff but they're guarded by the powercreep.

Not all skills can be equally effective, it's the nature of the beast, unless you give everybody one skill that does 50 damage and that's it. But that's not GW. GW is a game with a lot of different types of skills like MTG.

The gods use godly creeps in their area, so the tools to beat them should have 'godly' qualities too if balanced can't counter them. The average skilled player can't beat UW or DoA balanced and they don't know how to use shadow form. And in a way that's what an elite area stands for. However, a group of players can farm it, but that group is certainly not casual. So we're left with power traders and 'pro' farmers who have an interest in the subject.

Of course both the powertraders/rich people in the game and Anet are not shun for a nerf because the rich want to secure their gold and Anet wants to drag on the game until GW2 so it takes more grind to get some of the silly titles.

Fix rewards,
Fix powercreep,
Fix silly titles,
After that they might actually have a point to nerf shadow form.

So yeah a skill with godmode characteristics shouldn't be in the game, but neither should be godlike creeps/bosses and crappy rewards for the time invested. RPG's have always been about character progression and cool stuff and GW PvE is no different. Hell, even PvP players want the cool stuff so they can die in style.

Originally Posted by Tenebrae

You dont get it dont you ?. Let me expand your little GW knowledge with 2 words "cover enchant" . Anyway thats not the matter , dont go offtopic , now answer this :
- Why 98% of elite skills have bloody lots of counters and SF combo has so so SO few ? Why should 1 skill combo OVERCOME 98% of GW skills ?.
No one is QQing here about not knowing to counter it dude..

Originally Posted by Tenebrae

Yeah more of that "if you dont like it dont use it" and "how does someone using SF affect YOUR game play" BS pointless arguments to defend SF..

Originally Posted by Tenebrae

No one is forced but there are ppl that are not stupid and if they can pack a colt m4a1 to a battle they will pick that weapon instead a stupid sword and a wand , got it ? ...... dear god when will this **** end ? maybe with the skill update ? god i hope so.

PS: Still can smell fear in this thread .

Originally Posted by Gun Pierson

People can play 90% of the game's areas using balanced or whatever composition of classes in a team as long as the team finds the sweet spot between offense and defense.

There are a couple of areas left where the true powercreep rules. Playing an area for 4 hours to receive like 10k if you're lucky is just not fun. Because most of the veterans already played the game several times and did the elite stuff playing 'balanced' anyway.

Why do people use Shadow Form? Because it's the most efficient way of farming some stuff in a game where rewards suck. A few elite areas still drop some worthy stuff but they're guarded by the powercreep.

Not all skills can be equally effective, it's the nature of the beast, unless you give everybody one skill that does 50 damage and that's it. But that's not GW. GW is a game with a lot of different types of skills like MTG.

The gods use godly creeps in their area, so the tools to beat them should have 'godly' qualities too if balanced can't counter them. The average skilled player can't beat UW or DoA balanced and they don't know how to use shadow form. And in a way that's what an elite area stands for. However, a group of players can farm it, but that group is certainly not casual. So we're left with power traders and 'pro' farmers who have an intrest in the subject.

Ofourse both the powertraders/rich people in the game and Anet are not shun for a nerf because the rich want to secure their gold and Anet wants to drag on the game until GW2 so it takes more grind to get some of the silly titles.

Fix rewards,
Fix powercreep,
Fix silly titles,
After that they might actually have a point to nerf shadow form.

So yeah a skill with godmode characteristics shouldn't be in the game, but neither should be godlike creeps/bosses and crappy rewards for the time invested. RPG's have always been about character progression and cool stuff and GW PvE is no different. Hell, even PvP players want the cool stuff so they can die in style.

Originally Posted by manitoba1073

LAT ME ENLIGHTAN TAHT LITLE KNOWLEDG3 TAHT U HAEV OF GW!!111 TRY 30% OF SKILS IN GW AF3CT SF IN ONE WAY OR ANOTH3R!!!11!1 OMG JUST B/C UR NOT QUIET SMART 3NOUGH 2 FIGURA SOMETHNG LIEK TAHT OUT DO3SNT MAEK SOMATHNG GOD MODE!11!1!!1 OMG LOL BUT PLZ KEP TRYNG 2 SHOW DA AROGENT IGNORANC3 OF UR PURPORT3D HATRED OF SF!1!111!1 WTF LOL

Originally Posted by FyrFytr998

Yet, not one person who is Anti-SF and used the personally affected argument has come up with a valid reason as to how they are affected personally by someone else using SF for SC's and farming. Since they have no answer they just dismiss the question all together. I can at least respect Bryant's position that ANET did not intend for the game to be played this way, so since it's their world, they will change it as they see fit. No arguing fact right there. But you say the above is pointless and BS without even saying why it is so. Ultimately this type of back and forth arguing is more personal than factual.

Originally Posted by manitoba1073

Let me enlighten that little knowledge that you have of GW. Try 30% of skills in GW affect SF in one way or another. Just because your not quite smart enough to figure something like that out doesnt make something god mode. But please keep trying to show the arrogent ignorance of your purported hatred of SF.

Originally Posted by manitoba1073

Yeap because its the argument that is the most true, Dont like tough shit.

Originally Posted by manitoba1073

Yeap I can smell something too, shame its all the BS from the side that wants to nerf stuff for wrong reasons.

Originally Posted by The Drunkard

And exactly how many of those skills do monsters have in order to stop permasins from stomping all over elite areas/dungeons?

Originally Posted by Bryant Again

That re-quote was possibly one of the best things I've seen on here in the longest time.

Originally Posted by reaper with no name

You forgot one of the crucial issues with SF; not only is it powerful enough to do all that grindy stuff, but it's also so good that there's no reason to play anything else. Why even have the other 9 professions, really?

Also, if Anet were to fix those things, do you really think they would do it all at once? Of course not. And if they don't fix them all at once and do them in the order you describe, then none of it would mean jack until they get to the end and finally nerf SF, because until then people will just keep on using SF.

A patient comes into the ER with a malignant tumor on his foot, anthrax, and a bullet wound in his chest. Any one of these could be fatal. Which do you treat first? The bullet wound, obviously, because unless you fix that, the other things won't matter.

Originally Posted by jshrimp3

But why are those cheaper prices bad?
This is, once again, the argument of "THANKS TO SF I CAN'T BE AS COMPARATIVELY RICH AS I USED TO BE."

Originally Posted by jshrimp3

But why are those cheaper prices bad? Oh no, you can't rake in as much dough as you used to? Boo hoo. Prices aren't constant, some things drop in price, some things increase in price, it's the way of the world.

This is, once again, the argument of "THANKS TO SF I CAN'T BE AS COMPARATIVELY RICH AS I USED TO BE."

Originally Posted by Red Apple

Because it hurts the WHOLE economy, people play for rewards and whenever a high-end item would go common all the hours spent on farming it for veterans wouldnt have been worth it.

Pve is for STATUS or FUN (which after 3 years I know you would get bored of the same missions over and over, or whatever float your boat), if you take status then fun only lasts a while.

Originally Posted by The Drunkard

If you don't know what depression is in an economic situation, I suggest you go look it up or take a course on it before posting. How does one go about making money now in our economy without exploiting Sf or any invincibility skills? Chest running has collapsed in profit due to the chest nerf and the depreciation of items, solo play in non-elite areas is lootscaled, and powertrading isn't actually playing the game. Most of the non-sf/600/smite cash I make is from nicholas stuff, farming items for scers, and the free-nf treasures. If you want to use macroeconomics as an example in GW, then name five items in GWthat have gone up in price. I can, and they all are used to aid SCs.

I have achieved: one obby set, mini mallyx, full destroyer wep HoM, defensive caster torm set, and are currently striving for a obby blade (100e's so far), which has all been from SF or 600/smite. I have played the game for 3 1/3 years and I've made more money exploiting invincibility build for six months than by casually farming (splinter barrage, trolls, vermin, etc) for the rest of my time. It's not that i'm not raking in dough, it's that all of my spots I have farmed before have either been nerfed or depreciated by permasins and SB monks- and i've done A LOT of different areas.

Originally Posted by reaper with no name

You forgot one of the crucial issues with SF; not only is it powerful enough to do all that grindy stuff, but it's also so good that there's no reason to play anything else. Why even have the other 9 professions, really?

Also, if Anet were to fix those things, do you really think they would do it all at once? Of course not. And if they don't fix them all at once and do them in the order you describe, then none of it would mean jack until they get to the end and finally nerf SF, because until then people will just keep on using SF.

A patient comes into the ER with a malignant tumor on his foot, anthrax, and a bullet wound in his chest. Any one of these could be fatal. Which do you treat first? The bullet wound, obviously, because unless you fix that, the other things won't matter.

Originally Posted by jshrimp3

Once again, everyone who's arguing against SF has the mindset that PvE is competitive, you versus everyone else in a race to the top of the money pile. And that's not necessarily what it is.

Originally Posted by AOD_EaSyKiLL

Lets finish your analogy "House" fashion.

This ER patient (Guild Wars), with the tumor (600/smite), anthrax (USWC), and bullet wound (SF), had all of these issues fixed, yet he died on the OR table after sowing him back up. Turns out, the bullet wound was preventing blood circulating to the tumor in the leg, once the wound was patched, blood returned and made the tumor grow uncontrollably. The Tumor had to be removed by amputating the leg (nerf farming). The Anthrax turns out to be a misdiagnosis caused by Leprosy (loot scaling) in the patient who had a defective immune system (titles), which was running wild from antibiotics (grind). Turns out the only thing keeping him alive was the bullet wound.

Originally Posted by The Drunkard

So, the weapons that I've been chest running haven't deteriorated in price at all? (I used to CR saurian scythes/eswords btw) And of course SF has nothing to do with the poor prices of tomes, greens, and gemstones. But hey, dungeon end weps are still worth something (even when the price dropped greatly.) It's not like any mats have gone up in price as a result of SCs either (excluding feathers/iron).

You're so right, SF has absolutly nothing to do with the rest of the game at all!

Originally Posted by Bryant Again

I'm more pointing out that playstyles vary. You yourself have said you aren't able to use an SF build too well. That doesn't point to the build being faulty, more that you may have troubles with it.