DoA and FoW with heroes
[Nika]
bhavv
timbo_3101
Mallyx is actually simpler than the four prerequisites. Only the combined groups 18 and 19 may cause grief ...
After defeating groups 18 and 19, I suggest that you immediately cancel the cutscene and run outside immediately before the gate closes, so you can isolate Mallyx away from his four spirits and summons. Deactivate all hero enchantments/conditions/hexes then just bodyblock him outside for a fast kill. Learnt this from DwG farming.
(It takes around 20-30sec to run from the field to the door, so plan ahead otherwise you will need Gaze of Fury etc etc, becomes complicated.)
Good luck.
After defeating groups 18 and 19, I suggest that you immediately cancel the cutscene and run outside immediately before the gate closes, so you can isolate Mallyx away from his four spirits and summons. Deactivate all hero enchantments/conditions/hexes then just bodyblock him outside for a fast kill. Learnt this from DwG farming.
(It takes around 20-30sec to run from the field to the door, so plan ahead otherwise you will need Gaze of Fury etc etc, becomes complicated.)
Good luck.
bhavv
I have a really good build that is working for malyx - 3 rits (SoS, SOGM, ST), 100 blade warrior, 2 invoke ellys, Healing Burst monk, and me as E/Mo (would avoid using enchants at malyx and disable the elly attunemets + auras) ...
However I keep getting party wiped at the wave of several tortureweb dryders
However I keep getting party wiped at the wave of several tortureweb dryders
Jeydra
Searing Flames best Elementalist elite ever!!
I won't exaggerate, Foundry HM is really hard, but once I could consistently get to the fifth room relatively intact completion was only a matter of time. Making do without "Save Yourselves!" - uber defensive skill there, notice how aga, Life Bringing and Relyk all used it - was difficult; I had to cope with ~400 damage nukes that would instantly kill any unprotted target. After failing several times and almost considering going ER Prot myself, I realized that Paragons could not only provide "Stand Your Ground!", they could also provide "They're On Fire!". The first time I tried that build I cleared things a lot easier than before, and that I realized was the answer.
Mucho Gracias to Life Bringing, without whose help I might never have gotten past the third room. The build I used is still imperfect, but it worked, so
Tips for those who would try:
1. Be ready to fail. Foundry is hard, and I mean hard. It makes Forgewight HM look easy. Just about every single mob needs to be carefully aggro'ed, and you absolutely cannot risk deaths. At this point I think I have like a 25% chance of success each time I enter the area.
2. Not every Titan, when killed, spawns monsters. Even two Despair Titans can behave in different ways. You'll have to learn which that do and which that do not, sadly.
3. Try to have a hard res on a hero that you can flag!! If you can't, you'll have to risk your pack of 4 heroes to bring the brunt of your damage to bear, and equally risk a wipe and restart. I didn't; this is a flaw in the teambuild.
4. The spawns from Titans aren't tied to the original mob or to each other. That is, they stay where they spawn and will chase you. It means you can easily take on 6 Anguish Titans, or even 8, by aggro'ing at long range -> kill a couple of them -> run far away and disengage. The Despair Titan spawns will not retreat with the rest of the Anguish Titans, and you can easily kill them at your leisure.
5. The really dangerous Titans are the Rage Titans (Earth Eles). The most dangerous Margonites are the Margonite Sus (Air Eles). Get Burning on them ASAP. Dryder + Dream Rider mobs are very dangerous as well. From experience targetting the Dryders first is better than killing the Dream Riders, because although Dryders don't cast very often if they do cast when they're not burning or - God forbid - when "Stand Your Ground!" isn't up, you risk a wipe.
6. To get past the second room: do the Life Bringing tactic, flag your heroes in first (split up, a lot), set up spirits, etc, and then only walk in yourself.
7. To get past the third room: go for the far corner, and flag there. You won't aggro any random patrols, but you still must be careful with your aggro. If you can fight the patrols one by one, it's not too bad.
8. Midway through the area you get a 10k experience boost. Save it for when you need it; it can immediately remove 60% DP from everyone in the party.
9. When pulling Rage Titans, be sure to avoid bringing Churning Earth and Eruption onto the rest of your team! EBSoH is a luxury (you can afford to outlast the Demons - they don't have strong heals), don't risk AoE exploding on your team just to get your heroes into EBSoH.
10. Remember to micro Panic, spirits, Splinter Weapon on physicals, Prot Spirit and Spirit Bond on DP'ed targets, etc. In fact, be ready to micro all these and ignore your own bar. No one said Foundry was easy.
11. The hardest part of the entire area is definitely The Fury. Know where he will spawn and don't be there when the Black Beast's mob dies. After that know his long pull range (it's slightly behind where I am in the screenshot). Spam spirits beyond that, pull and kill the Dryders first (they will stay behind longer for some reason), then kill the Ki's when you can. Be patient if you must; they will eventually die. Do NOT prot yourself, do NOT cast your enchantments, in fact do NOT even cast any spell, although you can put down EBSoH before aggro. 250 damage from Shatter Enchant / Cry of Frustration is deadly. I learned all this the hard way, that's why I have 60% DP in the screenshot. At this point it might be possible to improve the build with a snare somewhere (perhaps Pin Down on the Ranger), but I haven't tried.
SF best Elementalist Elite ever (even though it hits for 34 damage on Fury Titans rofl)!!
And so we have:
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jeydra
I won't exaggerate, Foundry HM is really hard, but once I could consistently get to the fifth room relatively intact completion was only a matter of time. Making do without "Save Yourselves!" - uber defensive skill there, notice how aga, Life Bringing and Relyk all used it - was difficult; I had to cope with ~400 damage nukes that would instantly kill any unprotted target. After failing several times and almost considering going ER Prot myself, I realized that Paragons could not only provide "Stand Your Ground!", they could also provide "They're On Fire!". The first time I tried that build I cleared things a lot easier than before, and that I realized was the answer.
Mucho Gracias to Life Bringing, without whose help I might never have gotten past the third room. The build I used is still imperfect, but it worked, so
Tips for those who would try:
1. Be ready to fail. Foundry is hard, and I mean hard. It makes Forgewight HM look easy. Just about every single mob needs to be carefully aggro'ed, and you absolutely cannot risk deaths. At this point I think I have like a 25% chance of success each time I enter the area.
2. Not every Titan, when killed, spawns monsters. Even two Despair Titans can behave in different ways. You'll have to learn which that do and which that do not, sadly.
3. Try to have a hard res on a hero that you can flag!! If you can't, you'll have to risk your pack of 4 heroes to bring the brunt of your damage to bear, and equally risk a wipe and restart. I didn't; this is a flaw in the teambuild.
4. The spawns from Titans aren't tied to the original mob or to each other. That is, they stay where they spawn and will chase you. It means you can easily take on 6 Anguish Titans, or even 8, by aggro'ing at long range -> kill a couple of them -> run far away and disengage. The Despair Titan spawns will not retreat with the rest of the Anguish Titans, and you can easily kill them at your leisure.
5. The really dangerous Titans are the Rage Titans (Earth Eles). The most dangerous Margonites are the Margonite Sus (Air Eles). Get Burning on them ASAP. Dryder + Dream Rider mobs are very dangerous as well. From experience targetting the Dryders first is better than killing the Dream Riders, because although Dryders don't cast very often if they do cast when they're not burning or - God forbid - when "Stand Your Ground!" isn't up, you risk a wipe.
6. To get past the second room: do the Life Bringing tactic, flag your heroes in first (split up, a lot), set up spirits, etc, and then only walk in yourself.
7. To get past the third room: go for the far corner, and flag there. You won't aggro any random patrols, but you still must be careful with your aggro. If you can fight the patrols one by one, it's not too bad.
8. Midway through the area you get a 10k experience boost. Save it for when you need it; it can immediately remove 60% DP from everyone in the party.
9. When pulling Rage Titans, be sure to avoid bringing Churning Earth and Eruption onto the rest of your team! EBSoH is a luxury (you can afford to outlast the Demons - they don't have strong heals), don't risk AoE exploding on your team just to get your heroes into EBSoH.
10. Remember to micro Panic, spirits, Splinter Weapon on physicals, Prot Spirit and Spirit Bond on DP'ed targets, etc. In fact, be ready to micro all these and ignore your own bar. No one said Foundry was easy.
11. The hardest part of the entire area is definitely The Fury. Know where he will spawn and don't be there when the Black Beast's mob dies. After that know his long pull range (it's slightly behind where I am in the screenshot). Spam spirits beyond that, pull and kill the Dryders first (they will stay behind longer for some reason), then kill the Ki's when you can. Be patient if you must; they will eventually die. Do NOT prot yourself, do NOT cast your enchantments, in fact do NOT even cast any spell, although you can put down EBSoH before aggro. 250 damage from Shatter Enchant / Cry of Frustration is deadly. I learned all this the hard way, that's why I have 60% DP in the screenshot. At this point it might be possible to improve the build with a snare somewhere (perhaps Pin Down on the Ranger), but I haven't tried.
SF best Elementalist Elite ever (even though it hits for 34 damage on Fury Titans rofl)!!
And so we have:
Quote:
My understanding of UW, FoW and DoA post update, with (relatively) balanced builds:
FoW NM: doable, easily
FoW HM: doable, easily - in fact I've even done it once with 6 heroes instead of 7, some of which weren't runed
UW NM: done with consumables, should still be doable without them
UW HM: unknown, possibly impossible
DoA City NM: doable, easily
DoA City HM: should still be doable, although not so easily
DoA Gloom NM: doable easily
DoA Gloom HM: should be doable, but not easy
DoA Foundry NM: doable
DoA Foundry HM: doable, but exceedingly difficult
DoA Veil NM: doable easily
DoA Veil HM: should still be doable, but not easy
DoA FR NM: doable
DoA FR HM: done with consumables + perma Sin (it's a micro'ed SC, as Life Bringing put it ...), possibly impossible otherwise
It's a jungle out there in this new era
FoW NM: doable, easily
FoW HM: doable, easily - in fact I've even done it once with 6 heroes instead of 7, some of which weren't runed
UW NM: done with consumables, should still be doable without them
UW HM: unknown, possibly impossible
DoA City NM: doable, easily
DoA City HM: should still be doable, although not so easily
DoA Gloom NM: doable easily
DoA Gloom HM: should be doable, but not easy
DoA Foundry NM: doable
DoA Foundry HM: doable, but exceedingly difficult
DoA Veil NM: doable easily
DoA Veil HM: should still be doable, but not easy
DoA FR NM: doable
DoA FR HM: done with consumables + perma Sin (it's a micro'ed SC, as Life Bringing put it ...), possibly impossible otherwise
It's a jungle out there in this new era
Dzjudz
Interesting. What was the approximate /age?
Good for you for not bringing any necros, but was the ranger that helpful? I can imagine swapping him out for something else.
Good for you for not bringing any necros, but was the ranger that helpful? I can imagine swapping him out for something else.
Life Bringing
The only thing that necros are really good for is MoP, and considering that Jeydra never plays a physical it's not really worth it.
Nice work Jeydra. It's extra impressive because you used SF ahaha. Gave me a really interesting idea though with Avatar of Balth, SY, and ToF! for ridiculous amounts of defense. And I'd have to agree that the ranger looks kinda useless especially with the blind spam. Perhaps another SF ele or something with UA on it even if it's not a healer.
Nice work Jeydra. It's extra impressive because you used SF ahaha. Gave me a really interesting idea though with Avatar of Balth, SY, and ToF! for ridiculous amounts of defense. And I'd have to agree that the ranger looks kinda useless especially with the blind spam. Perhaps another SF ele or something with UA on it even if it's not a healer.
timbo_3101
Haha wtf DoA Foundry HM no consets?! Your doing this was as stubborn as me running discordway on Duncan HM (2:30h).
No, I won't try this. Cannot barely handle Forgewight HM let alone -150% DP
P
After >700 gemstones, I consider Foundry of a similar difficulty to Underworld - but you have proven it is possible with a balanced team (I suspect most of us will never be able to reproduce such achievements though).
Sorry Jeydra - thanks again for sharing your observations and an amazing result, but i'll be aspiring towards solo tank tactics with mesmerway as per Life Bringing (and praying I survive rooms three and four).
No, I won't try this. Cannot barely handle Forgewight HM let alone -150% DP
PAfter >700 gemstones, I consider Foundry of a similar difficulty to Underworld - but you have proven it is possible with a balanced team (I suspect most of us will never be able to reproduce such achievements though).
Sorry Jeydra - thanks again for sharing your observations and an amazing result, but i'll be aspiring towards solo tank tactics with mesmerway as per Life Bringing (and praying I survive rooms three and four).
Life Bringing
Haha that wasn't my screen, it was Poms 
PoM PoM PoM PoM PoM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bright Star Shine
Adds up to: 1h10-1h15, which sounds pretty fast imo, so I think you could be done in 1h25-1h35. Easily, if you use the correct tactics.
Damn ! I was so close ^^
But unfortunately I don't have much time. I really like this update, there is a new way to play with heroes. <3
This is my heroes skills bar with locked skills for the spike and I use hotkeys for the emo skills. It's a lot of work but really fun to play.
Enjoy !
Damn ! I was so close ^^
But unfortunately I don't have much time. I really like this update, there is a new way to play with heroes. <3
This is my heroes skills bar with locked skills for the spike and I use hotkeys for the emo skills. It's a lot of work but really fun to play.
Enjoy !
aga
Using SF takes a lot of the risk and difficulty out of the run. But regardless that's a very respectable time for a 7 hero party.
novawhiz
dam dude, how did you micro all that lol.
timbo_3101
Oh the great man speaks!
Thanks Pom Pom - incredible, just incredible on micro/control of seven heroes.
By the way, are you mimicry on UA for each Me hero, or are you actually mimicry on offense eg ESurge?
Thanks Pom Pom - incredible, just incredible on micro/control of seven heroes.
By the way, are you mimicry on UA for each Me hero, or are you actually mimicry on offense eg ESurge?
Ariane
Wow, that's amazing! I just wish this worked with Duncan HM too, so my warrior could finish it :'(
Jeydra
Lol Pom, you're incredible. I could never micro that many skills. One of my friends told me once that there's this macro (whatever that is) that lets you order all heroes to use skill 1 or something, but I never used it ... when I micro, I micro skills that aren't disabled most of the time.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Dzjudz
Quote:
Interesting. What was the approximate /age?
Good for you for not bringing any necros, but was the ranger that helpful? I can imagine swapping him out for something else. I'd say /age was about 1 hour 40 minutes. I pulled really carefully the entire area, and I had to recover from near wipes with BUH a couple of times, adding to the total time.
And yes, now that I think about it the Ranger is rather weird. It was originally there because I had a Paragon before, but decided that the second Paragon really isn't useful. I simply used another physical without thinking too much. Another SF Ele would make most sense; I don't quite see how UA would work on a non-healer and besides BUH sort of compensates for UA anyway. If I make another run now, I'd probably go E/R Fire with EoE in that last slot, and then put Death Pact on Xandra.
PS: Mesmer, Mesmer, Mesmer, Mesmer. Maybe Mesmers are far stronger than I gave them credit for ...
Good for you for not bringing any necros, but was the ranger that helpful? I can imagine swapping him out for something else. I'd say /age was about 1 hour 40 minutes. I pulled really carefully the entire area, and I had to recover from near wipes with BUH a couple of times, adding to the total time.
And yes, now that I think about it the Ranger is rather weird. It was originally there because I had a Paragon before, but decided that the second Paragon really isn't useful. I simply used another physical without thinking too much. Another SF Ele would make most sense; I don't quite see how UA would work on a non-healer and besides BUH sort of compensates for UA anyway. If I make another run now, I'd probably go E/R Fire with EoE in that last slot, and then put Death Pact on Xandra.
PS: Mesmer, Mesmer, Mesmer, Mesmer. Maybe Mesmers are far stronger than I gave them credit for ...
bhavv
Quote:
Originally Posted by Dzjudz
Good for you for not bringing any necros
That really doesnt matter when rits and mesmers are stronger than Necros are
Bright Star Shine
Wow Pom, I don't have merc heroes, so I can't try it like you did, but I will try it using necs I think. Gonna use diff tactics though^^
it's on :P
it's on :P
[Nika]
Mesmers are stonger than everything else, not only in things like Pom ran.
Well gz on that foundry, because i really have to say that the builds arent perfect imo.
But you used good synergies.
I think you can make the PI-mes to a N/rt-Healer or smething like that and the Ranger to a Inep or Pi-mes.
And gz to Pom, that hero management is very impressive.
Well gz on that foundry, because i really have to say that the builds arent perfect imo.
But you used good synergies.
I think you can make the PI-mes to a N/rt-Healer or smething like that and the Ranger to a Inep or Pi-mes.
And gz to Pom, that hero management is very impressive.
EFGJack
Wammoed it up in Foundry. Builds are something I put together and as such they are far from optimal for the zone.
With this done I've done all but Mallyx with 7 heroes. FR on HM is possible but, with old fashioned way & without drugs or merc heroes it'll most likely take 5 to 6 hours, so you won't see me attempting that any time soon.
With this done I've done all but Mallyx with 7 heroes. FR on HM is possible but, with old fashioned way & without drugs or merc heroes it'll most likely take 5 to 6 hours, so you won't see me attempting that any time soon.
timbo_3101
Thanks EFGJack haha no consets - I have an assassin ... Would you recommend I run a melee/SY build to support teammates, or solo tank like Pom Pom?
Seems like Pom Pom would have great aggro control for most of DoA, but I can imagine rooms three and four in Foundry, and the Greater Darkness spawns in Gloom could cause grief?
Seems like Pom Pom would have great aggro control for most of DoA, but I can imagine rooms three and four in Foundry, and the Greater Darkness spawns in Gloom could cause grief?
EFGJack
What I recommend? I have no idea how good you are at this game. If you can micro heroes while shadowforming it up - then go ahead and play like Life Bringing.
And I sucked it up myself. I wasn't aware of a spawn and it spawned on my heroes + I was too content on my heroes' survivability.
Full run in HM is doable in under 4 hours without drugs or merc heroes. I'll give it another go when my brain stops hurting.
And I sucked it up myself. I wasn't aware of a spawn and it spawned on my heroes + I was too content on my heroes' survivability.
Full run in HM is doable in under 4 hours without drugs or merc heroes. I'll give it another go when my brain stops hurting.
Gabs88
just did topk a few times while build testing, definitely a lot of fun to do it in hm. hard but manageable, needs a little flagging on hero side.
oh, and i'd gladly post a screenshot.. but my shiftkey has retired so cant even take one...
oh, and i'd gladly post a screenshot.. but my shiftkey has retired so cant even take one...
EFGJack
Jeydra
With that I think we can conclude that DoA HM full run is possible without consumables, leaving only UW HM without consumables left to figure out. But since UW HM has been done 1 man + 6 heroes, it should be perfectly doable 1 man + 7 heroes, which once again makes everything in Guild Wars that can be H/H'ed doable with H/H'ed.
I'd say congratulations to everyone involved, but for now can I ask this: aga, Relyk, Life Bringing, EFGJack, etc, can you guys stop using Assassins and Warriors and use some caster profession without Save Yourselves?!?!
I'd say congratulations to everyone involved, but for now can I ask this: aga, Relyk, Life Bringing, EFGJack, etc, can you guys stop using Assassins and Warriors and use some caster profession without Save Yourselves?!?!
Damn Rock Gin
Could someone please post the actual build codes used, so that I can set up my heroes exactly the same way? Also is there any other advise that you could give to help someone that has never done DOA before?
What type of hero Micro-Management is needed?
I am anxious to set up my heroes to give this a try in the very near future.
What type of hero Micro-Management is needed?
I am anxious to set up my heroes to give this a try in the very near future.
Cors Seel
I never did doa before so i decided it was time to get an extra statue for HoM. I had a service running the 4 areas so only mallyx was left.
I decided to do this with my 7 heroes. Since it was my first time I was going to try to beat mallyx I was prepared for the worst (and expected to fail). I thought nm should be difficult enough and I didn't use any cons.
I was a normal dagger spammer with SY and Asuran Scan.
For heroes i took:
- My favorite Panic, RoJ, SoS, Minion Bomber and Ineptitude bar. I didn’t change anything to this bars that I use in normal vanquishes, except i gave the RoJ Heaven's Delight and Divine Healing. The SoS had a resto split and the Bomber a prot split.
- The other 2 heroes were an ST protect rit (ST, Shelter, Union, Displacement, Dulled Weapon, Armor of Unfeeling, Signet of Creation, Boon of Creation) and a rather strange n/rt(Consume soul, Pain, Shadowsong, Anguish, Signet of lost Souls, Spirit Light, Protective was Koalai). His attributes were set to SR 8+1+1, 12 Communing and 10 Resto.
I flagged my ST rit a bit back and sometimes i left the last creature of a wave alive for 20 seconds and flagged all my heroes back so they could regen. I disabled consume soul and only micro’d Strength of Honor.
I tried to lure the keeper away with a fury titan but me being inexperienced this failed ofcourse. Surprisingly he didn't die. It went quite well but I had no ideas how much waves I already defeated. Suddenly appeared on my screen: The door to mallyx is now open or something like that, I don’t remember the sentence exactly.
I disabled all enchantments/hexes and the ST Rit made mallyx a laugh. My n/rt destroyed his spirits and we pwnd mallyx quite fast with a bunch of spirits, RoJ, Ancestor’s rage, and me auto-attacking. With 3 copies of Leech Signet and Cry of Frustation my heroes interrupted almost al his spells to make the fight even easier.
Conclusion: Mallyx is a baby and 7 heroes are just pewpew^^
I decided to do this with my 7 heroes. Since it was my first time I was going to try to beat mallyx I was prepared for the worst (and expected to fail). I thought nm should be difficult enough and I didn't use any cons.
I was a normal dagger spammer with SY and Asuran Scan.
For heroes i took:
- My favorite Panic, RoJ, SoS, Minion Bomber and Ineptitude bar. I didn’t change anything to this bars that I use in normal vanquishes, except i gave the RoJ Heaven's Delight and Divine Healing. The SoS had a resto split and the Bomber a prot split.
- The other 2 heroes were an ST protect rit (ST, Shelter, Union, Displacement, Dulled Weapon, Armor of Unfeeling, Signet of Creation, Boon of Creation) and a rather strange n/rt(Consume soul, Pain, Shadowsong, Anguish, Signet of lost Souls, Spirit Light, Protective was Koalai). His attributes were set to SR 8+1+1, 12 Communing and 10 Resto.
I flagged my ST rit a bit back and sometimes i left the last creature of a wave alive for 20 seconds and flagged all my heroes back so they could regen. I disabled consume soul and only micro’d Strength of Honor.
I tried to lure the keeper away with a fury titan but me being inexperienced this failed ofcourse. Surprisingly he didn't die
. It went quite well but I had no ideas how much waves I already defeated. Suddenly appeared on my screen: The door to mallyx is now open or something like that, I don’t remember the sentence exactly. I disabled all enchantments/hexes and the ST Rit made mallyx a laugh. My n/rt destroyed his spirits and we pwnd mallyx quite fast with a bunch of spirits, RoJ, Ancestor’s rage, and me auto-attacking. With 3 copies of Leech Signet and Cry of Frustation my heroes interrupted almost al his spells to make the fight even easier.
Conclusion: Mallyx is a baby and 7 heroes are just pewpew^^
EFGJack
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jeydra
but for now can I ask this: aga, Relyk, Life Bringing, EFGJack, etc, can you guys stop using Assassins and Warriors and use some caster profession without Save Yourselves?!?!
Not a caster profession, but no SY. :> Now I only need to get past 3rd & 4th room and then it's piece of pie from there
Not a caster profession, but no SY. :> Now I only need to get past 3rd & 4th room and then it's piece of pie from thereI Nathanos I
I just came back to game after the heroes update, just finished FoW,here's the screen :
Cheers.
Cheers.
Voodoo Rage
Did ToPK in NM yesterday!
Bask in the glow of my elititude.
Bask in the glow of my elititude.
Lethal Primate
This is what happens when I don't restict myself (it's one of the hardest places to go in HM, why restrict myself to using no cons?). As said before in this thread, mesmer are pretty damn good.