LOL
Under the Ritualist why didnt they just put, STOP USING IT IN DOA the semi nerf in there was aimed directly at that area of the game,
I see that SoS took another hit, instead of nerfing something to the point where people dont want to use it, just go directly for the kill switch and remove the skill completely,
Your nerfing the SoS yet the SF sins can still run around the place farming high end areas with little trouble, the attacks against solo farming is getting bad now, if the drop rate wasnt so bad with a team maybe people wouldnt farm solo,
The Ele update looks interesting.
Update - Thursday, December 8, 2011
rb.widow
The Drunkard
Quite amusing, the nerf to mistrust and decrease in armor is going to shaft mesmers in PvE to strictly use either Panic or shared.
I'm going to call it now: Star burst is going to be the new DwG. People are going to run 4 of them with intensity, and one person with Double Dragon. Have the eles bring Arcane mimicry for a loltastic spike with 5 copies of DD.
/sigh
I'm going to call it now: Star burst is going to be the new DwG. People are going to run 4 of them with intensity, and one person with Double Dragon. Have the eles bring Arcane mimicry for a loltastic spike with 5 copies of DD.
/sigh
AndrewSX
Re-looking down all that wall of text about Elite park for Eles, i don't see any mention to AP changes/nerfs.
Maybe because the focus of that update will be exactely that - the elite choice - but any time we've talked here about PvE Eles someone brought up the AP issue.
Not that needed, cause Eles aren't the only prof using it (and won't HAVE to use it anymore as they do now in PvE anyway to be useful) and non-elite skills weren't buffed that much, but still surprised to do not see it touched.
Btw, also noticed that there isn't a single change to ER, Sliver, most of Tanking Earth stuff and Burning Speed.... looks like an important part SC backbone is untouched too.
Maybe because the focus of that update will be exactely that - the elite choice - but any time we've talked here about PvE Eles someone brought up the AP issue.
Not that needed, cause Eles aren't the only prof using it (and won't HAVE to use it anymore as they do now in PvE anyway to be useful) and non-elite skills weren't buffed that much, but still surprised to do not see it touched.
Btw, also noticed that there isn't a single change to ER, Sliver, most of Tanking Earth stuff and Burning Speed.... looks like an important part SC backbone is untouched too.
DiogoSilva
I don't think AP Caller builds are broken. They just happen to be the only decent options for elementalits right now, and that's gonna change after the update. Especially now that the higher HP is gonna nerf a little AP.
Martin Alvito
A quick look at some of the obvious and subtle PvP implications:
- Blinding Surge: Teams often collapse multiple melee to pressure spike, so this will make the skill somewhat more effective at mitigation. The damage change is irrelevant.
- Chain/Invoke: Not enough to solve it.
- Energy Boon: This one is sneaking under the radar, but there are many possible hex bars that would be lethal if only someone could pass you 50 or 60 energy each minute.
- Glyph of Energy: 20 Earth = 142 Obs Flame, permitting kills with just five spikers. Has the potential to significantly alter the HA meta.
- Gust: Huge. It's not just for griefing, it's for opening up kill windows at will.
- Mirror of Ice: Brutal on relic runs. This, Frozen Burst and a teammate with Energy Boon? Ouch.
- Shatterstone: That is a LOT of pressure.
- Star Burst: Ditto.
- Stone Sheath: You can catch spikes from the midline with this and mitigate. Insane.
- Water Trident: Nasty in confined spaces like Halls. Not so hot in GvG.
- Blinding Surge: Teams often collapse multiple melee to pressure spike, so this will make the skill somewhat more effective at mitigation. The damage change is irrelevant.
- Chain/Invoke: Not enough to solve it.
- Energy Boon: This one is sneaking under the radar, but there are many possible hex bars that would be lethal if only someone could pass you 50 or 60 energy each minute.
- Glyph of Energy: 20 Earth = 142 Obs Flame, permitting kills with just five spikers. Has the potential to significantly alter the HA meta.
- Gust: Huge. It's not just for griefing, it's for opening up kill windows at will.
- Mirror of Ice: Brutal on relic runs. This, Frozen Burst and a teammate with Energy Boon? Ouch.
- Shatterstone: That is a LOT of pressure.
- Star Burst: Ditto.
- Stone Sheath: You can catch spikes from the midline with this and mitigate. Insane.
- Water Trident: Nasty in confined spaces like Halls. Not so hot in GvG.
Skyy High
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Originally Posted by Xsiriss
This is a joke, bring it out before the Holidays and people will come back to check it out most probably. Otherwise most people don't bother for recycled festivals.
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Xsiriss
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Originally Posted by Skyy High
"Most people" is not the same as "me", fyi. Halloween was quite popular this year, so I see no reason for you to make this statement.
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I see no reason for you say such a thing without any evidence to support it, making it irrelevant. Obviously there's a spike in player activity for festivals but it's only newer players/people playing for a reason. The point is it's not reason enough to bring people back and one of the most debated topics about festivals on these forums is the fact that they're recycled.
Kunder
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Originally Posted by The Drunkard
Quite amusing, the nerf to mistrust and decrease in armor is going to shaft mesmers in PvE to strictly use either Panic or shared.
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In addition to Panic/Shared, Fevered Dreams, Psychic Instability, Keystone Signet are all still untouched.
Quote:
| I'm going to call it now: Star burst is going to be the new DwG. People are going to run 4 of them with intensity, and one person with Double Dragon. Have the eles bring Arcane mimicry for a loltastic spike with 5 copies of DD. |
Skyy High
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Originally Posted by Xsiriss
Yeah most people as in the vast majority of people who've bee playing for a number of years. Of course events like Halloween and Wintersday are popular, it offers the chance for people to finish off titles and earn money for HoM. Players who've got their HoM finished up and have been are not going to come back for recycled festivals, but they might for a change in game mechanics.
I see no reason for you say such a thing without any evidence to support it, making it irrelevant. Obviously there's a spike in player activity for festivals but it's only newer players/people playing for a reason. The point is it's not reason enough to bring people back and one of the most debated topics about festivals on these forums is the fact that they're recycled. |
You obviously don't care about them anymore, which is why I said what I said; you're extrapolating from you, and your group of friends, to "everyone who's not a newbie or currently working on the HoM". As a final point, even if we took your definition at face value, the fact of the matter is that 50/50 is not a common achievement, so "most" people would, according to you, be interested in festivals for that reason alone.
@Kunder: you can't make any claims as to how effective mesmers are going to be after this update until you know how much HP they're adding to HM monsters. Anything you say before then is pure speculation.
Kunder
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Originally Posted by Skyy High
@Kunder: you can't make any claims as to how effective mesmers are going to be after this update until you know how much HP they're adding to HM monsters. Anything you say before then is pure speculation.
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The Drunkard
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Originally Posted by Kunder
Mesmers will still be pretty powerful. Right now Elementalists are about 50-60% as powerful as Mesmers in elemental builds that aren't Invoke. After this update Eles will probably be about 120% of pre-update mesmers in damage and mesmers will drop by something like 10% IF they use mistrust (plenty of good builds don't). Mesmers will still also have the shutdown abilities that come with a lot of their skills.
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asb
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Originally Posted by The Drunkard
You're going to start seeing the mesmer heroes getting replaced by eles (aside from maybe panic).
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Xsiriss
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Originally Posted by Skyy High
Sorry, burden of evidence is on you to prove your claim, since you're the one who made the claim in the first place.
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StormDragonZ
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Originally Posted by The Drunkard
This update will hit mesmers hard- more health means that armor-ignoring damage packets that FD and Keystone pump out are going to be mediocre since everything but armor-ignoring damage is getting "buffed," in comparison. You're going to start seeing the mesmer heroes getting replaced by eles (aside from maybe panic).
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Fear not though, I've already come up with a reasonably good Mist Form "healer" Elementalist build that may compensate Signet of Spirits. Then again, until changes are made, I can't say anything is good...
DiogoSilva
Panic, Psychic Instability and etc. are still going to be great builds, it just so happens that elementalists will be back as the main nukers, which at the moment is also what the mesmers do.
Kunder
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Originally Posted by The Drunkard
This update will hit mesmers hard- more health means that armor-ignoring damage packets that FD and Keystone pump out are going to be mediocre since everything but armor-ignoring damage is getting "buffed," in comparison. You're going to start seeing the mesmer heroes getting replaced by eles (aside from maybe panic).
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Mesmer heroes getting replaced by eles is of course normal because the better shutdown elites are horrible with hero AI and more damage is always better.
jazilla
Super stoked for the versatility a lot of these skills offer. MoM is right where I always wanted it to be with this build. I have a set of Prismatic Armor just collecting dust that I will have to don again.
I like the direction the team is taking the Elites and can NOT wait to see what they have in store for some of the non-elites down the road.
As per the discussion going on about heroes, I just think this opens the door for other hero builds to be in play. I really don't see the new Elementalist stuff outshining builds that are already in use. If anything it gives us a lot of new ways to come up with new hero and team builds. That to me is what is most fun about GW.
I like the direction the team is taking the Elites and can NOT wait to see what they have in store for some of the non-elites down the road.
As per the discussion going on about heroes, I just think this opens the door for other hero builds to be in play. I really don't see the new Elementalist stuff outshining builds that are already in use. If anything it gives us a lot of new ways to come up with new hero and team builds. That to me is what is most fun about GW.
NerfHerder
Speaking as someone who hasnt played since WoC and a little bit for halloween, this change will probably be enough to bring me back for a while.
The change in PvE meta will give me chance to finish WoC in a new way on my alts that havent finished it yet, especially my Ele. I always like tweaking my heroes/toons with new builds after skill updates. And Gust alone will probably get me back into some casual PvP. Or even some creative builds for PvE. Conjure/Gust melee gogogo!
This is my preemptive thank you to Anet for this update! See you for the Wintersday Event!
The change in PvE meta will give me chance to finish WoC in a new way on my alts that havent finished it yet, especially my Ele. I always like tweaking my heroes/toons with new builds after skill updates. And Gust alone will probably get me back into some casual PvP. Or even some creative builds for PvE. Conjure/Gust melee gogogo!
This is my preemptive thank you to Anet for this update! See you for the Wintersday Event!
Alathin
Think this will do anything to Frostway DoA?
Swingline
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Originally Posted by DiogoSilva
Shockwave builds aren't that great in RA, really. Both the elite and the 1-dimensional KD chain can be easily avoided. Shockwave is only there for the lack of better options, but the weakness from the new version will help the build a lot. Someone said the new shockwave only needs weakness of the three conditions for PvP, and I might agree, especially because of this build.
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Then there is the altar pvp game type. Shockwave is going to be meta there
Essence Snow
So eles are making a comeback...nice to see after many of us made our gwamm+'s on them after picking them as mains (b/c they were supoosed to be the nukers) years ago, thus having not soo much to do on them now. For those new to eles.....rejoice and have fun.
Some of the ele foes should provide some extra fun, as I would assume that their lvls will still be elevated and thus further benefit from some of the new changes.
Not sure why the rit nerfs.. seeing that really wasn't an issue compare to maintainable spell prot, which makes the much faster tank and spank possible in almost every area of the game. Not really seeing much on the side of spike/SC possibilities on the new ele..maybe starburst....not really though.
For the pvp side...tbh idc much nor does most of the population... only a few do, yet they are very vocal...so expect to continue hearing from them.
Some of the ele foes should provide some extra fun, as I would assume that their lvls will still be elevated and thus further benefit from some of the new changes.
Not sure why the rit nerfs.. seeing that really wasn't an issue compare to maintainable spell prot, which makes the much faster tank and spank possible in almost every area of the game. Not really seeing much on the side of spike/SC possibilities on the new ele..maybe starburst....not really though.
For the pvp side...tbh idc much nor does most of the population... only a few do, yet they are very vocal...so expect to continue hearing from them.
Mercury Angel
Well, they do look interesting, and there do appear to be more viable options. I'll withhold judgment until the update is released, and the nerfbat is swung a few months after.
I'm surprised at the doublecast skills. I believe that when Gust was previewed earlier, it had an Adjacent aoe range. After the Dervish Nightfall Beta Weekend Event PbAoE fiasco, I never expected all of these area of effect buffs carrying over to PvP.
Unrelated, but I'm going to laugh (in a sad way) if Ward Against Harm gives only +25 armor vs Elemental damage due to the armor stacking cap, much like the Ebon Battle Standard of Courage and Great Dwarf Armor.
Edit: And yeah, Double Dragon - huh. Balthazar's Aura got whacked fairly hard for the power of its mobile pulsing damage, and it was in an awful attribute line. (I know it used to last 10 seconds, and I believe it had a recharge of 10 seconds. I'm not sure if it used to cost 15 energy, though.)
I'm surprised at the doublecast skills. I believe that when Gust was previewed earlier, it had an Adjacent aoe range. After the Dervish Nightfall Beta Weekend Event PbAoE fiasco, I never expected all of these area of effect buffs carrying over to PvP.
Unrelated, but I'm going to laugh (in a sad way) if Ward Against Harm gives only +25 armor vs Elemental damage due to the armor stacking cap, much like the Ebon Battle Standard of Courage and Great Dwarf Armor.
Edit: And yeah, Double Dragon - huh. Balthazar's Aura got whacked fairly hard for the power of its mobile pulsing damage, and it was in an awful attribute line. (I know it used to last 10 seconds, and I believe it had a recharge of 10 seconds. I'm not sure if it used to cost 15 energy, though.)
cthulhu reborn
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Originally Posted by Surgo
Great update! I'm not sure why the nerf to some of the Rit armor-ignoring damage was warranted given the upcoming health increases in HM (it's like getting nerfed twice), but I suppose it depends on how much health goes up and how much armor goes down.
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Although I still have to see how effective ele's will be with the new skill changes, it does seem that the elementalists get some extra's and the rits are nerfed on their dps to make ele's more interesting again.
In essence, the rit has become the ele's biggest competitor for dps and was frankly losing against the sos rit. This could be a way of balancing these two classes.
Swingline
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Originally Posted by cthulhu reborn
In essence, the rit has become the ele's biggest competitor for dps and was frankly losing against the sos rit. This could be a way of balancing these two classes.
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_Aphotic_
Not sure if this is has already been answered, but how will Arcane Languor be affected?
Will it still cause a full energy exhaustion, or the amount specified in the skill?
Will it still cause a full energy exhaustion, or the amount specified in the skill?
Mouse at Large
Just off the top of my head, Fragility + Shockwave + Crystal Wave might be fun 
HigherMinion
Quote:
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Originally Posted by _Aphotic_
Not sure if this is has already been answered, but how will Arcane Languor be affected?
Will it still cause a full energy exhaustion, or the amount specified in the skill? |
Also; Stone Sheath prot ele, anyone? Would it be able to replace an ST rit? Spiritway wasn't struck much, if you go back to SoGM and Painful Bond on the SoS. Replace mesmers in every team for Double Dragon+Stone Sheath, perhaps.
Coast
stone sheath will be (ab)used i think
cantalus
Quote:
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Originally Posted by snoozer80
Every update is good if it makes more people come back to PvP cuz HA is dead now.
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HA was on it's last legs, anet's unwillingness to devote serious resources and their laughable buffing of invoke and dervs plus flux killed it
Djoser Tosarthros
I am acctually excited for this update. I get to play more with me ele and maybe bring out my WaR again. Lower armor reduction to HM enemies = higher bigger damage output by wars. Sounds fun, looking forward to it ~
~
Kunder
Quote:
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Originally Posted by HigherMinion
AL doubles exhaustion. Ergo, 5=10 10=20. seempulz.
Also; Stone Sheath prot ele, anyone? Would it be able to replace an ST rit? Spiritway wasn't struck much, if you go back to SoGM and Painful Bond on the SoS. Replace mesmers in every team for Double Dragon+Stone Sheath, perhaps. |
SY is still going to be the universal norm, with ST or monk prots for the few areas with large armor ignoring damage.
AndrewSX
Plus, remember that the +24 +24 ar will be capped at +25....sure, cracked armor won't affect you anymore (the extra armor gets under the cap to cover the loss for CA) but is still lame....
Wielder Of Magic
Quote:
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Originally Posted by AndrewSX
Plus, remember that the +24 +24 ar will be capped at +25....sure, cracked armor won't affect you anymore (the extra armor gets under the cap to cover the loss for CA) but is still lame....
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Else its basically a Ward Against Elements that also gives a partywide mending effect.
HigherMinion
Quote:
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Originally Posted by Wielder Of Magic
We can only hope that by the time the update gets released Anet has fixed the armor stacking issue.
Else its basically a Ward Against Elements that also gives a partywide mending effect. |
Missing HB
Quote:
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Originally Posted by cantalus
HA was on it's last legs, anet's unwillingness to devote serious resources and their laughable buffing of invoke and dervs plus flux killed it
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But well, i'm waiting to see.. this update might be interesting as it will create many kind of OP builds and not only 1 single such as today...( that's in theory though..)
AndrewSX
Quote:
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Originally Posted by HigherMinion
An In the Area mending* it's important, that. no good.
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No wards love (intended as mechanic): to justify the static aspect and range of wards (that expose to enemy AoE) those should be very OP - like spirits are in PvE - or will be eventually dropped to traps level (just like they are now: almost unused apart some gimmick/particular situation - like choke point in HA).
Ah, no Glyph love, excluded the elite one.
I would have preferred less power to some skills, but more mechanics reworks apart doublecast, expecially for above 2 things.
And at second glance...there isn't almost any change to non-elite skills, excluded 4 recharge and 4 cast time(there's a mention to "We'll rework, maybe, cross-element spells later", but that's all). Maybe will come with definitive update, or later one.
BTW, improving elites is ok, but if you don't have anything good to pair it with loose a bit of sense (for example: having uber energy with e-boon, Mom or e-prodigy is useless as long as rest of the bar sucks). Still have to see how much AR get scaled down...that may be the answer.
refer
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Originally Posted by Lanier
while its good to see a new skill update, I am highly disappointed that anet is still releasing updated skills for one prof at a time. Rangers and Paragons probably had it worse off than eles, and they aren't getting... well anything
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The explanation doesn't make much sense to me. Release it already. Think of it as an holiday gift. Everybody knows about the usual holiday events, it's not like they will distract from the update.
Swingline
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Originally Posted by refer
Release it already. Think of it as an holiday gift. Everybody knows about the usual holiday events, it's not like they will distract from the update.
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Red Apple
Quote:
| Energy Boon: changed skill type to enchantment spell; increased casting time to 1 second; increased cost to 10 Energy; reduced recharge to 20 seconds; changed functionality to: "For 36...60 seconds, Energy Boon raises the maximum Health of you and target ally by 1...3 for each point of your respective maximum Energy. When this enchantment is first applied, you and your target gain 1...12 Energy. You gain an additional 1 Energy for every 2 points you have in Energy Storage." |
Anaraky
Speaking purely from a PvE perspective, I think this update is going to be great. Not only does it close the gap between the armour-respecting and armour-ignoring professions it also decreases Mesmers and Ritualists ability to bring a lot of utility while still doing beastly damage.