Make Zei Ri available after NM WoC
Slowpokeking
I think it's really painful to go through the whole chain in HM to get her, and seems like many people dislike this. Just like Razah once require 4 gems to get, it's not cool. Please make her available just after NM WoC or add a quest to get her.
Olle
WoC:HM is not hard.
/notsigned
/notsigned
??iljo
It's him.
/notsigned
U get free content in a 7 year old game,and u still want to cspacebar-complete everything in 30 mins just to get everything....
Although,the qqing will get a lot worser imo and they will change smt eventually......
/notsigned
U get free content in a 7 year old game,and u still want to cspacebar-complete everything in 30 mins just to get everything....
Although,the qqing will get a lot worser imo and they will change smt eventually......
Skyy High
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Originally Posted by Slowpokeking
Just like Razah once require 4 gems to get, it's not cool.
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Frankly, I'm not sure where I stand on the issue. I like the idea of players getting something extra for doing harder content, and I think that that's fair...but a hero is a significant and permanent reward....but is a 3rd rit hero really that significant?...well where's the line then? I really don't know.
Slowpokeking
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Originally Posted by Šiljo
It's him.
/notsigned U get free content in a 7 year old game,and u still want to cspacebar-complete everything in 30 mins just to get everything.... Although,the qqing will get a lot worser imo and they will change smt eventually...... |
??iljo
If it was reversed,ie. miku hm,zei nm nobody would give a flying RED ENGINE GORED ENGINE GORED ENGINE GORED ENGINE GO, nor there would be so much qq....
You complain it took you a few hours?
How many hours does it take to complete proph or nf?
You complain it took you a few hours?
How many hours does it take to complete proph or nf?
Slowpokeking
I think we don't even need a third sin. That Jadebrotherhood girl can be a good ele hero.
??iljo
Thats the point lol, ppl would wish u only had nec,ele,mes, mo and rit heroes.
Coz everything else is useless unexploitable "crap"
Coz everything else is useless unexploitable "crap"
Slowpokeking
It's not our fault, Anet didn't do a good job on melee hero's AI.
BTW I always bring Jora unless it's some extremely difficult situation.
BTW I always bring Jora unless it's some extremely difficult situation.
Sagittario
- Same as here
/notsigned - Zei Ri is him, not her
Slowpokeking
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Originally Posted by Sagittario
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Kook~NBK~
/signed. There's a ridiculous amount of work involved for getting this one hero when compared to what it takes to get any other.
cosyfiep
/signed...wasnt there already a thread about this?
(and yes close range melee heroes are about as useful as a heater in a lava pit).
would much rather had another rit hero than another totally useless sin hero. or a mesmer would have been best!
(and yes close range melee heroes are about as useful as a heater in a lava pit).
would much rather had another rit hero than another totally useless sin hero. or a mesmer would have been best!
Cash
/signed
I'm really torn on the matter tho. While I have no problems with greater rewards in HM vs NM, this quest line is just....long. Sure, its a good bit harder, but that isn't the problem for me.
Comparing GW to WoW for a second, truly one of the final nails in the coffin for me with WoW was heroic mode. Not because it was harder, not because loot was different, but because of story/lore. When I play through a questline, I take my time and follow the story....read the chat....watch the cinematics. I did that with WoC NM, just as I did WiK and HotN. So now I'm "done" with it, but yet I am FORCED (meaning "forced" as in there is no other way to unlock Zei Ri) to do it again. And being the nutjob that I am, I HAVE to get every possible hero!
I'm a casual, so its going to take me longer than many to do. HM is harder, so its going to take a good bit longer than NM (I'm sure I will fail several of those end quests a few times.) Again, I am NOT complaining about difficulty. I'm just complaining that now the chat gets in the way...now the cinematics get skipped.....now WoC has lost its excitement. I just think the reward of more guard requisitions, more gold, gold z coins, more xp, etc, etc is enough reward for those who want to go the more challenging route.
There was no added bonus for doing WiK or HotN in HM was there? I don't see why they felt the need to do it this time. Personally, I think ONE QUEST (a NM but very hard "masters quest") after completing WoC NM would have been a more realistic option to unlock Zei Ri. I'm just not a fan of having to do the whole lot of 35 quests over again. ....even though I am in the process of doing so.
I'm really torn on the matter tho. While I have no problems with greater rewards in HM vs NM, this quest line is just....long. Sure, its a good bit harder, but that isn't the problem for me.
Comparing GW to WoW for a second, truly one of the final nails in the coffin for me with WoW was heroic mode. Not because it was harder, not because loot was different, but because of story/lore. When I play through a questline, I take my time and follow the story....read the chat....watch the cinematics. I did that with WoC NM, just as I did WiK and HotN. So now I'm "done" with it, but yet I am FORCED (meaning "forced" as in there is no other way to unlock Zei Ri) to do it again. And being the nutjob that I am, I HAVE to get every possible hero!
I'm a casual, so its going to take me longer than many to do. HM is harder, so its going to take a good bit longer than NM (I'm sure I will fail several of those end quests a few times.) Again, I am NOT complaining about difficulty. I'm just complaining that now the chat gets in the way...now the cinematics get skipped.....now WoC has lost its excitement. I just think the reward of more guard requisitions, more gold, gold z coins, more xp, etc, etc is enough reward for those who want to go the more challenging route.
There was no added bonus for doing WiK or HotN in HM was there? I don't see why they felt the need to do it this time. Personally, I think ONE QUEST (a NM but very hard "masters quest") after completing WoC NM would have been a more realistic option to unlock Zei Ri. I'm just not a fan of having to do the whole lot of 35 quests over again. ....even though I am in the process of doing so.
AndrewSX
I'd say:
/notsigned, cause greater challenge (or at least, getting trough the whole content twice) deserves a greater reward.
Btw, i agree that atm is just silly. Maybe, instead of locking HM content on the whole content base, do it on the 3 chapter separately.
Explaing.
At to be able to do WoC pt. 3 in HM, you have to do:
-Woc pt 1, NM + HM.
-Woc pt 2, NM + HM.
-Woc pt 3, NM.
Instead, could be better to say: if you finish pt X in NM, you can do part X in HM, even is not completed in HM previous ones(that you have to complete in NM anyway).
This way, to get the chance to do Woc pt 3 in HM you have to do:
-Woc pt 1, NM(unlocks HM version of chap. 1)
-Woc pt 2, NM(unlocks HM version of chap. 2)
-Woc pt 3, NM.(unlocks HM version of chap. 3, and acces to Zei Ri).
So now you still have to go through the whole content, but only once to unlock the HM part that awards the hero, instead of 2 times every quest, which is the unacceptable part.
This is the right suggestion imo. Simply making Zei Ri aivable in NM too doesn't make sense.
/notsigned, cause greater challenge (or at least, getting trough the whole content twice) deserves a greater reward.
Btw, i agree that atm is just silly. Maybe, instead of locking HM content on the whole content base, do it on the 3 chapter separately.
Explaing.
At to be able to do WoC pt. 3 in HM, you have to do:
-Woc pt 1, NM + HM.
-Woc pt 2, NM + HM.
-Woc pt 3, NM.
Instead, could be better to say: if you finish pt X in NM, you can do part X in HM, even is not completed in HM previous ones(that you have to complete in NM anyway).
This way, to get the chance to do Woc pt 3 in HM you have to do:
-Woc pt 1, NM(unlocks HM version of chap. 1)
-Woc pt 2, NM(unlocks HM version of chap. 2)
-Woc pt 3, NM.(unlocks HM version of chap. 3, and acces to Zei Ri).
So now you still have to go through the whole content, but only once to unlock the HM part that awards the hero, instead of 2 times every quest, which is the unacceptable part.
This is the right suggestion imo. Simply making Zei Ri aivable in NM too doesn't make sense.
EPO Bot
/notsigned Even tough i find this pretty hard and i may not actually manage to get the hero. 
jayson
/signed
With the condition that you have to at least play the quest chain over again in NM.
With the condition that you have to at least play the quest chain over again in NM.
Why?
what really disappointing me is people in this community saying HM is so easy, and yet I don't see a step by step walk through guide of every single WoC quest in HM on these forums.
I thank the people that have helped. Many on this forum are extremely helpful.
These people who think they are so elite that they can attack anyone by saying hm is easy should prove it and walk everyone else through it step by step quest by quest, showing builds, techniques, hero placement, etc. Enrich the entire community with your knowledge.
I thank the people that have helped. Many on this forum are extremely helpful.
These people who think they are so elite that they can attack anyone by saying hm is easy should prove it and walk everyone else through it step by step quest by quest, showing builds, techniques, hero placement, etc. Enrich the entire community with your knowledge.
Slowpokeking
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Originally Posted by AndrewSX
I'd say:
/notsigned, cause greater challenge (or at least, getting trough the whole content twice) deserves a greater reward. Btw, i agree that atm is just silly. Maybe, instead of locking HM content on the whole content base, do it on the 3 chapter separately. Explaing. At to be able to do WoC pt. 3 in HM, you have to do: -Woc pt 1, NM + HM. -Woc pt 2, NM + HM. -Woc pt 3, NM. Instead, could be better to say: if you finish pt X in NM, you can do part X in HM, even is not completed in HM previous ones(that you have to complete in NM anyway). This way, to get the chance to do Woc pt 3 in HM you have to do: -Woc pt 1, NM(unlocks HM version of chap. 1) -Woc pt 2, NM(unlocks HM version of chap. 2) -Woc pt 3, NM.(unlocks HM version of chap. 3, and acces to Zei Ri). So now you still have to go through the whole content, but only once to unlock the HM part that awards the hero, instead of 2 times every quest, which is the unacceptable part. This is the right suggestion imo. Simply making Zei Ri aivable in NM too doesn't make sense. |
AndrewSX
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Originally Posted by Slowpokeking
Then I guess most of the people will not do WOC Part 1 HM again, not the whole thing.
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Essence Snow
Maybe 1/2 signed....Like others have said...its not that it's just a hero.....it's a useful hero. Currently it takes far too long it get something useful. Since an extra rit hero is useful ppl will want to obtain on multiple toons, which starts too get into some rediculous time spent. I think once most obtain him they will switch rajahs prof, thus still only using 2 Rit hero. dern u auto correct......I like Andrews suggestion more than the op, but agree had the heroes been switched there wouldn't be an issue at all
Maya Cerestiez
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Originally Posted by Why?
what really disappointing me is people in this community saying HM is so easy, and yet I don't see a step by step walk through guide of every single WoC quest in HM on these forums.
I thank the people that have helped. Many on this forum are extremely helpful. These people who think they are so elite that they can attack anyone by saying hm is easy should prove it and walk everyone else through it step by step quest by quest, showing builds, techniques, hero placement, etc. Enrich the entire community with your knowledge. |
How lazy are people nowadays, seems like they require a guide for everything. The people that puplish builds are doing a heavy job and for what gain? I can say that you'll be able to do HM WoC if you just take some builds from PvX and mod them after what you're facing, trial and error.
Sagittario
The first phase was released on July 7, 2011; the second on September 29, 2011; the final phase was released on February 9, 2012.
I agree that if you ignored that there's something like WoC for 6 months, it will take a lot of time to finish it now.
This is the same as asking Anet to get both heroes from mutually exclusive couples before completing NF.
I agree that if you ignored that there's something like WoC for 6 months, it will take a lot of time to finish it now.
This is the same as asking Anet to get both heroes from mutually exclusive couples before completing NF.
Slowpokeking
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Originally Posted by Sagittario
The first phase was released on July 7, 2011; the second on September 29, 2011; the final phase was released on February 9, 2012.
I agree that if you ignored that there's something like WoC for 6 months, it will take a lot of time to finish it. |
madriel222
/not signed
I liken it to a little badge of honor showing that you completed the content. We don't need more heroes (thanks mercs!), but getting something a little extra for going through WoC HM was a nice touch.
I liken it to a little badge of honor showing that you completed the content. We don't need more heroes (thanks mercs!), but getting something a little extra for going through WoC HM was a nice touch.
Bright Star Shine
"Oh no, I have to do more effort to get a better reward, this is so incredibly unfair. Hand me my free rewards without letting me do any effort please Anet, cause otherwise I'm going to complain."
That's how you sound.
/notsigned
That's how you sound.
/notsigned
AndrewSX
(Just for record, i have Zei Ri on my Mes. And yes, some stuff in HM is stupid, on limit of frustration-watching you, HM Cho's prenerf. But i liked it.)
Zaph
/notsigned
WoC is easy in HM as it is at the moment...
If you cant beat it on Hard Mode, either care and don't rush into overaggro carelessly, or check both your knees for arrows... (overused joke.. I know..
)
WoC is easy in HM as it is at the moment...
If you cant beat it on Hard Mode, either care and don't rush into overaggro carelessly, or check both your knees for arrows... (overused joke.. I know..
)
Wielder Of Magic
No.
Stop crying because things don't get handed to you on a silver platter.
Play for it in HM if you want him.
Stop the QQ already..
I hate those lazy crybabies...
Stop crying because things don't get handed to you on a silver platter.
Play for it in HM if you want him.
Stop the QQ already..
I hate those lazy crybabies...
Slowpokeking
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Originally Posted by Bright Star Shine
"Oh no, I have to do more effort to get a better reward, this is so incredibly unfair. Hand me my free rewards without letting me do any effort please Anet, cause otherwise I'm going to complain."
That's how you sound. /notsigned |
What you meant "more effort" is 35 quests in HM all over again and with increased difficulty.
Without any effort? So finish the whole chain of WoC NM(at least a few hours) is nothing in your eyes?
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Originally Posted by Wielder Of Magic
No.
Stop crying because things don't get handed to you on a silver platter. Play for it in HM if you want him. Stop the QQ already.. I hate those lazy crybabies... |
Quote:
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Originally Posted by Zaph
/notsigned
WoC is easy in HM as it is at the moment... If you cant beat it on Hard Mode, either care and don't rush into overaggro carelessly, or check both your knees for arrows... (overused joke.. I know.. ) |
Sagittario
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Originally Posted by Wielder Of Magic
No.
Stop crying because things don't get handed to you on a silver platter. Play for it in HM if you want him. Stop the QQ already.. |
OFC I need Zei Ri on my other toons, but I'd rather do WoC HM with them then complaining how hard it is.
??iljo
What forces you to do it in one day?
Also,there was little or no qq when u had to get gems for razah because back then rits sucked....
Also,there was little or no qq when u had to get gems for razah because back then rits sucked....
Sagittario
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Originally Posted by Why?
what really disappointing me is people in this community saying HM is so easy, and yet I don't see a step by step walk through guide of every single WoC quest in HM on these forums.
I thank the people that have helped. Many on this forum are extremely helpful. These people who think they are so elite that they can attack anyone by saying hm is easy should prove it and walk everyone else through it step by step quest by quest, showing builds, techniques, hero placement, etc. Enrich the entire community with your knowledge. |
Just read disscussions on wiki pages and run PvXwiki builds. They work despite they're boring. You have to do something little yourself.
Gemm
WoC HM is SUPPOSED to be challenging, and that's why Zei Rei is one of the rewards. Being a rit, it opens up big possibilitys for 3 rit hero teams etc (without mercenarys). Miku isn't going to be used as much (IMO) since she's a sin. I'd rather actually have to try for a new hero that can actually be used rather than mindlessly click my mouse and let my heroes kill afflicted.
/notsigned
/notsigned
Zaph
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Originally Posted by Slowpokeking
Finish 35 quests is lazy? Most of heroes are easier to get than beat WoC NM.
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Originally Posted by Slowpokeking
It's much more difficult and time consuming than most of the other heroes. It's quicker to go over NF and EotN to unlock most of the heroes.
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Originally Posted by Wielder Of Magic
No.
Stop crying because things don't get handed to you on a silver platter. Play for it in HM if you want him. Stop the QQ already.. I hate those lazy crybabies... |
EDIT:
Bright Star Shine
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Originally Posted by Slowpokeking
So you would support we have to collect 4 gems to get Razah?
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What I meant with free reward is that WoC is completely free and handed to you. Yes it has its flaws, but it's FREE content. So are Miku and whatever the new Rit hero's name is.
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| What you meant "more effort" is 35 quests in HM all over again and with increased difficulty. |
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| Without any effort? So finish the whole chain of WoC NM(at least a few hours) is nothing in your eyes? |
AndrewSX
Just saying: the only thing i think is legit is being pissed by have to do 70 quests to get a hero, even more if you're planning to do it on more chars.
On the rest, agree with bright and others.
Also, if you can complete WoC in HM...you pretty much do not need a extra Rit hero.
On the rest, agree with bright and others.
Also, if you can complete WoC in HM...you pretty much do not need a extra Rit hero.
Slowpokeking
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Originally Posted by Zaph
If you're a completionist, do it, if not - don't! You can do pretty much all content of GW without one extra ritualist hero...
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Originally Posted by Zaph
It is, as a matter of fact WoC is intended to be harder-then-your-normal-campaign kind of expansion; people asked for challenge - people got it..
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Originally Posted by Bright Star Shine
Please show me where I said this? The gems was a gimmicky thing. I wouldn't care now because I basically have stacks of the little bastards, but it was stupid back at the time. I'm talking about effort for greater reward. In HM DoA you get more gems than in NM. This makes sense. If it doesn't to you, you sir need to get your reason checked out.
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Double money
Double Ministerial Commendation and Imperial Guard Requisition Order
A few more rubies
1 extra Imperial Dragon's Tear
It's much more than you got from the HM of the main campaigns, are you ignoring these? Do we have to beat HM of Prophecies, Factions, Nightfall or EotN to get more heroes? NO, then why make an exception for WoC?
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Originally Posted by Bright Star Shine
What I meant with free reward is that WoC is completely free and handed to you. Yes it has its flaws, but it's FREE content. So are Miku and whatever the new Rit hero's name is.
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Originally Posted by Bright Star Shine
Oh no, I have to play the game to get the rewards. Please petty me.
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Originally Posted by Bright Star Shine
It's not nothing, but it isn't much either.
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Originally Posted by AndrewSX
Just saying: the only thing i think is legit is being pissed by have to do 70 quests to get a hero, even more if you're planning to do it on more chars.
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Zaph
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Originally Posted by Slowpokeking
So you think Razah should require 4 gems rather than just finish NF right?
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Originally Posted by Slowpokeking
Yes, and we already got the NM, 35 quests, harder than any of the main campaign and pretty time consuming, 1 rit hero is too much?
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Slowpokeking
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Originally Posted by Zaph
Getting 4 different gems is as "easy" as doing 4 of the HM WoC quests....
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Originally Posted by Zaph
Expansions are mini campaigns, no? I assume it's normal if it requires more then 10 hours of work, even for (only) 35 Quests (...times 2.. for HM).
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