Droknar's Rushers

I actually like the idea of having Lornar's there. not as a rushing point, but as a challenge.

It is kinda cool that you can proceed linearly as far as you want then go back and try the Pass, trying it intermittently. Getting to the Forge through Lornar's at lvl 14 or so with a similar party would be quite an accomplishment. In my opinion, its a nice break from the rigid timeline of the game itself.

So, the feeling of self-accomplishment would be there and the effect on the game community would still be ab-so-lute-ly nothing.

Your logic is flawed. I have a 9th Mo/W in Ice Caves of Sorrow. I have played the hell outta this game since the betas, and if you think I don't know what I am doing with my lowbie monk you are mistaken. After playing 350+ hours as a Ranger and thriving, playing a healer monk is simple: watch health bars, apply various heals where needed, use sprint to get outta dodge when all the mobs invariably go after me.

Yes, if someone was brand new at the game and got rushed to Droknars, I can see it sucking to get into a group with them. I am willing to bet that most people that HAVE gotten rushed have been through the game at least once, if not a few times, and just don't feel like doing all the same missions yet again.

Ok, pretty simple. Don't group with extremely low levels or people that act immature. They shouldn't affect your play at all. Thats all on you, not them.

I'm shocked that this 'discussion' which in reality is a big whine session has gotten this far. Get over it. Follow above rules, don't keep bumping this thread. It was started to say 'hey, good job runner.' Lets not beat a dead horse.

Thanks

I like the game, so I'm sorry if I'm critical of things that cheapen it for people (not just myself) who want to play without feeling like they have exploit to get a good game experience. Feel free to disagree with me.

For the record I'm pro-farming, pro-roleplaying, pro-balanced PvP and anything that improves the community and economy.

Seems to me glossing over most of these threads alot of people are mad about something or another, it's not me

...but I've let go.

I too like the idea of the pass, but feel a character should have to survive the pass to make it through. There would still people people who fought their way through, perhaps with a 50-50 spilt of new characters to finished ones. It's the fact that only one guy needs to make it through for the group to be ported that I think is cheezy.

Too much Cheeze in a game makes the over all game unenjoyable.

Unfortunately, this may be true. I never party with characters far below my level to avoid this problem.

Also unfortunate is the fact that without a party "kick" system in place, noobs can leech every mission in the game and arrive at the Forge as unenlightened as the low levels who were rushed there.

There's many reasons for the problems with PUGs. Closing the Pass will not cure them all.

And yes, Dax is just whining at this point and reveling in the attention this thread is getting, so I will feed into his ego no more.

I just disagree with his belief that this is an exploit.

Quick note/point of order/piece of evidence. In the Northern Wall mission (where you run out and see the Char and retreat back to the wall) the game specifically points out via an popup that if one of the team makes it through alive everyone gets credit. This would indicate that Anet put the "porting" there on purpose (perhaps to build teamwork "we'll block, you run for the exit!" since some characters move faster than others (my necro and mesmer move a heck of a lot faster than my friend's warrior does).

In a game where death only incurs a death penalty and most missions are about team building (bringing the proper mix of skills as a whole vs the individual) the porting just allows a different avenue for the players who really don't want to barrel through the opposition.

Just a thought,
Wolfhound

You just did ...lol I think we all need to move on. If it bothers you that much just ignore this thread. I don't respond to 90% of the threads because I just don't care.

You need to work on your flaming that was pretty weak.

For me it's not about getting uber armor early in the game... it's about saving gold that is spent on intermediary armor upgrades over and over again.

I tend to carry three sets of armor that I switch to for different situations, because my Nec/Mo's role in PvE groups changes frequently. This becomes really expensive, and so I tend to just upgrade the chest pieces and let the other ones slide. Buying or crafting all of the materials for a Nec primary for two to three sets, on top of the actual armor costs, simply isn't affordable with the income and drops from regular playing, and those materials don't drop nearly as often as the materials for my warrior primary do.

And then there's the costs of dye... I'm not going through the entire game with default colored armor, thank you very much. And then let's not forget the runes which don't always salvage. The whole armor upgrade process is very expensive if one carries more than one set of armor. Personally I've never had more than 7k gold on hand at any one time, and the biggest reason is incremental armor upgrading.

So I've begun to consider being run to Droknar's now, just to get it on the map. Yet even if I get run to Droknar's, there's no way I'll be able to get the armor once I get there... but at least it will be on the map so that when I do eventually gather up enough materials and gold, I can go there and get it and be done with it until the day that I can start looking at the 15k armor sets, which is a long way away.

True... but for some of the classes, like death magic, many of those skill quests are way late in the game, or can only be found by capturing them for bosses in missions... and please god don't make me run that mission for the umpteenth time just to get that skill. It sucks finding out that the one mission with that bonus that took like five or more tries is where the boss is... and then there was one mission that I did with henchies just to capture a skill, and the stupid Necro boss was so freaking hard to find - had to do the mission 8 times through before actually getting the skill.

On that night if I could've gone back in time, I'd have gladly paid someone to take me to Draknors to get the skill instead, believe me.

I made an E/Me, jumped to Post-Searing at level 2, mass invited everyone in Ascalon Dis 1, two people joined and I asked them if they would run me to The Perch They agreed, but we only made it to the mission past Yak's Bend when I had to go. Hes lvl 5 now, so if anyone wants to run him the rest of the way to the perch for free and then run to droknar's forge for 7k or so, I'de be pretty happy ^^

I don't believe that A.Net will allow Droknar's rushing to continue in an unvarnished form.

I've finished the game so I have been to Droknar's. I dont even use Droknars armor. I use Oasis armor. Infused of course...duh.

One of my other characters is a Monk... that Monk only has a armor class of 60 using Droknars tatoos... sooooo I realised that if I can survive with my Monk with only 60ac then I can survive with my Necro at only 60ac... and you know what? 60ac works just fine for me. No need for me to spend $$$ on 70ac armor. Ill just save up & buy some pretty 15k or whatever.

What does my ac have to do with this discussion? Nothing much save for that fact that I am trying to point out a person DOES NOT NEED Droknar's armor to still be effective. My Necro owns with only Oasis 60ac armor. Woohoo Droknar's is 70ac! BFD Just use your brain a bit more & quit relying so much on you uber armor & you survive for just as long if not longer.

This thread hit on a whole bunch of points...

Yes there are good people offering taxi services. Yes there are scammers... to me a happy medium is pay half at Snake's Dance and the other half at Droknar's Forge. If your runner can make it to Snake's Dance they can make it to the Forge. The hardest part is the end of the 2nd wurm area in Lormar's (where a big group of Grawl are with degen spells).

Is this an exploit? Is it not? No, not all games are linear and if a player can make their way through this path then they gain access to the area. It doesn't give them any skills found in the jungle or desert, it doesn't automatically 'exploit' and giving them things they don't have to go earn later. If ANet thought this was 'an exploit' and closed it then the 'exploiters' would just look for the second fastest path and use it. Price would probably go from 4-5k to 20-30k (you'd run them from say Ascalon City through to Sanctum Cay, do the mission, run them through the desert, do the 3 missions [pretty easy to do the missions with 3 passengers and 3 good players], then tell them how to ascend and be done with it). Instead of 15-40 minutes you're looking at probably 3-4 hours.

Can a L10 be of any use in a mission like 'The Wilds'? Sure it can, especially a healer. Your energy doesn't go up with level, you start off with your base amount of energy and go from there. Your heals are based on your attrributes, sure by L10 they aren't going to have 15 divine favor and 16 healing but they can have enough that through smart play they'll be a much better healer than a L20 who doesn't understand what spells to use when. My L13 ranger led a PUG through Elona's Reach. It did take me 30 minutes or so to get 5 people to join me and believe but tactics and strategy are much more important than equipment or levels in the PvE game.

Graka Ekieron ran me and 4 other people through last night. VERY quick, VERY professional, and a VERY fair price. Thanks again Graka.

rushers are useless ... not because you may know or not know what your doing ... its the fact that now your a level 9 in a level 20 area. I give you congrats for beating the Dreadnoughts Drift ... oh wait ... betch was dragged ... I too am a beta but now not only have you skipped the rest of the game (skills at quarrel falls and henge) ... but you are now a sore thumb.

I am sure you have a good guild, and alotta friends to comfort your needs of power levelling, and thats good, because you will need it. Frankly I wont party with a non 20 ... if i do ... im soloing. But who really cares ... if your level 9 and in ice caves ... then your there for your own levelling, not to party with others im sure.

*smacks head on keyboard and asks the lord why we talk about this .... in fact why do i be tempted to respond, ack ... please tie my fingers up*

Geo is my guild leader! He's an awesome guy.


If I can afford the rush to Droknars, and if I can afford the armor, then obviously I've been through the game at least some distance already. And for those of us remaking a char (which I'm doing now with my necro for appearance and name reasons), then all the better.

The reason PUGs suck is the same reason they'll always suck. People are idiots. How dare you even try to blame every person that rushes for the fact that some people are flat out stupid.

If someone wants to skip an area for whatever reason, then let them. If you don't want a level 10 Mo/Me in your group, then fine, don't invite him. It's not like I'm seeing a lot of level 10's running around crystal desert LFG'ing.

When I made my first warrior, I got her run to Droknars. That armor and my sword/shield combo turned me into a god in those areas after Beacons but before Amnoon. It was awesome. This doesn't make me a shitty warrior by any means. I know how to play my char. I bring appropriate skills/stats for whatever mission I'm going into.

You just have nothing better to do than bitch and moan about something that has pretty much no impact on you. I'd want a team of 5 rushed people over a team of 5 people who hadn't been rushed to Droknar's.

I had about 40K by the time I made it to Beacons....I could have afforded a drokner run and the armor...and I'm sure others could have as well. It's not the ONLY reason alot of PUGs suck later in the game...but it's a solid contributing factor.

The exploit is if the lowbie die and the rusher zones them through area to area. It takes no skill to die. If a lowbie can make it through without relying on the high level player just running through and rezzing them at each zone point it's not a exploit.

But I've movied on. I can help it if this thread stays alive

Well there is a super nice lady I have been playing with lately(hmm..that didn't sound just right..) Anyways, she is very kind,funny, and a pure joy to play the game with. She is a level 15. I am going to ask a couple of friends of mine that are level 20's like me to run her to the Forge. It would be a challenge for us as well. I do not see anything wrong with that. I have been wanting to try it for sometime anyways. I got to the Forge the long way. But to try and defeat these higher level monsters by fighting or Running our tails off would be fun. I rather take someone that appreciates our help and our fellowship.

if you need a ranger I'll help.

IGN: Algren Cole

Before automatically replying and spouting your gut, you need to realise what people are doing.
The MAJORITY of people who rush go to Droknar's, get their armor, then GO BACK TO BEACON'S PERCH.

So they are not level 9s in a level 20 area. They are level 9s with level 20 armor in a level 9 area.

Ergo, your argument makes no sense.

Creston

Does paying higher level characters to "rush" you through a zone fall within the spirit or intent of the game as designed?
Is that the "challenge?"
Let me be the first to say, absolutely not.

If you can't do it and must pay others, how pray tell did these higher level folks ever do it themselves?
Here's as big a hint as I can give:

I did it with the NPCs and FOUGHT my way through.

Again, this is but another loathesome example of people wanting everything on a silver platter, and being in a huge "rush" (pun intended) to get through the game so they can "win" it.

Bah...my opinion of the Guild Wars population continues to sink daily...

Talesin

BS.

I don't believe for a second that you took 5 level 10 (or is it 12, I forget) henchmen from Beacon's Perch and succesfully fought your way through to Droknar's. I can't even picture how quickly they'd be anihilated in Dreadnought's Drift.

Of course you wouldn't.
That would imply that it was a "challenge" and not simply a money making mechanism for "Coyotes." It defies current opinion.

Regardless, as Ripley's says, "believe it or not."

Impossible. You wouldn't make it past the first group of wurms, if you somehow even GOT that far. They'd make mincemeat out of you.

Also, you need to stop letting this affect you so much. If you meet a lvl 10 warrior with obvious platemail, don't team with him. If you see a lvl 13 in Droknar's, don't team with him.
The beauty of guild wars is that the ONLY way your experience can get diluted is if you LET it get diluted (well, okay, or when the devs nerf the next area to combat botters somehow).
Don't let it bother you.

And actually, your argument is false. The large majority of rushers are people who already HAVE finished the game. They choose to enjoy it in a different way their 2nd / 3rd / whateverth time through. This way differs from yours, but last time I checked, your approval was not necessary to make anything valid in Guild Wars.

If someone wants to rush Droknar's, let them.

Creston

Hah. Challenge, yes, for a group of level 17 characters it is quite challenging. For a party of moron AI bots at level 10 or so it's virtual suicide. Record it and I'll believe it, otherwise I doubt you've ever been through. Going South to North doesn't count BTW - it's much easier with 7 lvl 20 henchmen, and the way Dreadnought's drift is set up it's a disadvantage to spawn at the north end of it.

I've been through Lornars with both a level 17 ranger and a level 19 necromancer. Fought my way both times, but doing it with lvl 10 henchmen isn't feasible.

So are you suggesting that dead people don't zone or get credit for a mission? If you have a team member go through a vortex while somebody on the team is dead what happens? Do they get dropped from the party? Is the 'runner' unable to zone?

This has A LOT more implications than just Beacon to Forge running. Before you ask for a solution to what you feel is a problem take a step back and look at the bigger picture and broader implications of what the action will do.

Screenshots speak louder than words - I don't buy it. Also, what is with these pompous asses and their "holier-than-thou" attitude? I have about 360 HOURS with my main, I have been EVERY secondary profession, I have done NEARLY ALL of the quests. Explain to me why I would want to go through the entire game again? And again? And yet again? If that kind of repetition is fun to you, by all means go ahead. Me, I'll take the rush.

I'm not saying it's an easy solution to fix. I am suggesting that if a character purposely dies in order for the runner to port them from zone to zone then you are exploiting the game mechanics. It's as simple as that. .

The simplest solution would to set level limits on what armor/weapons a character could equip. I guarantee that would not only put the nix on this (except for the hardcore adventurers), but would probably solve alot of other issues. But of course no one wants to do that. It's far more palatable to fix a problem by making the game easier. A good example is the bot fix- put more monsters to guard the chest, everyone complains.

If you rush through legitimately for the challenge and actually make it, the my hat is off to you.

Actually, nobody PURPOSELY dies when rushing. You do try to get as far as you can. My lvl 15 W/Mo actually managed to keep up so well with the rusher that the rest of the (dead) team was cheering ME on instead of the rusher

Eventually I died because I had to draw monsters away from the rusher while he was recharging his skills.
Had I had balanced stance I would have made it much farther, but the huge group of giants ganked me.
(I actually made it past the bottleneck group of wurms and grawl in Lornar's WITHOUT balanced stance... )

Creston

Well, I guess it's all subjective. If you act as a meat shield knowing your going to die so the runner can rush through to rez you at the next zone and expect to do that through the course of the journey... well see what I'm getting at?

Hypothetically, if you were not magically whisked to the next zone by a rusher, you could you make the journey? You could use the resurection signet (as it intended, only once per person...)

Since Anet don't seem to bothered that people do it (atleast not yet) I guess its just a matter how you want to play.

You can get through the toughest explorable areas if you can kill a single enemy sometimes. After all, you get infinite resurrections at the shrine, so you could literally spawn 25 times per kill and still fight your way through an area. Is that in the spirit of the game? I don't think so - I kinda figure that you should get a limited number - maybe a reasonably high limit, but if you die 10+ times per enemy you kill that's getting excessive. In that light, yes, most decent parties can fight through an area, since it's just a matter of whether you can kill a single opponent before you expire.

in my opinion, a solution to stop these low level players that have no business rushing to Droknar's Forge is to make the armor available at Droknar's only to players that are level 20. just like some weapons have requirements on them. you must be a level 20 to purchase armor at Droknar's Forge.

i wonder why ArenaNet hasnt done something to stop this? may be they are allowing this to happen. may be it will be resolved in the upcoming big update.

Armor levels at Droknar's won't change anything. It'll just shift people to Amnoon. And then you'll have people that pay to be rushed to the collectors in the desert.

There should be a NPC in Beacon's Perch who will just port you to Droknar for 25+k. Need a gold sink? There ya go.

Actually it was referring to another poster ... so your comments are ... ergo ... in your humble opinion ... understanding works both ways.

Lol, that might work, but it's over the cost that they charge.

If armour works the way weapons do then no biggie - set a hidden level requirement of 20 on the max stuff, 5 and 10 on the two sets in ascalon etc... that way you can wear whatever you want, but you only ge an effect based on your level. Level 10 in level 20 armour only gets AL equal to what a level 10 suit gets.

One big reason I wanted my end armour and walked the stupid passage was to be able to safely socket my runes and to use my dyes - I was tired of waiting. So I fought my way there - it only improved my AL by 9 points, but it meant that I felt comfortable putting my superior runes in, I was willing to use my dyes and so on.

Well if mine was what yours and a couple of other harsh posts following mine were referring to, then I think my post got misinterpreted.

I'm a lvl 17 N/Mo that's gotten as far as Aurora Glade. This is my 5th character, not my first. I've invested a lot of time into learning the skills of my given character, and believe that I'm an asset to any team I join. I have no guild, and on rare ocassions get to quest with a few friends I've met through my journeys, most of who are well past ascension and the end of the game already, but still enjoy partying with me. The other night I helped a group of lvl 20s go through Lornar's to tame a bear, and it was a blast. It was during then that the suggestion I just run to Droknar's came up, and I started considering it seriously.

I'm not looking to be a lvl 9 in a lvl 20 area... I just want to get Droknar's on the map, and then return to where I was and continure playing normally. If I were run down to Droknar's today, there is no way I could purchase a set of +70 armor, let alone three sets. So I'd go back to where I was, and continue playing just fine with my +39 armor (on three armor sets, and a +55 chest piece on one) until I saved up enough to go get a set later on. I don't need +70 armor to play... I'm at Aurora Glade with +39/+55 and rarely if ever die, thank you very much. I'd just like to get it sooner than later so that the armor upgrade/cost issue I illustrated earlier is done with, and so that I can start saving my gold toward getting a sigil and a hall sometime before the end of the summer.

The point of my original post was to simply illustrate that not everyone who runs down there is a noob looking to pwn in early lvl arenas, or skip the game itself and just get to the end to level up faster. Some of us do play the game normally, and many of us have done so on more than one character already. The broad generalizations of anyone who runs down there, or has help running down there, as being noobs, cheaters and all around idiots who ruin the game for everyone else, are somewhat narrow-minded and inaccurate.

And in the end it's my game, my gold and my time... and so I'll do what I like with it.

When my R/W finishes the game, perhaps I will try to be a Droknar Runner

Bingo! Someone else actually gets it too...