With this latest update, many people claim utter joy and others decry the "nerfing" of farming areas. I can't imagine the consternation over at Arena Net. No matter -what- they do, how they do it, when they do it and, probably most importantly, why they do it, they are harrangued. It's the old "damned if you do, damned if you don't routine".
So what would help? Is it the WHY of things that is missing here? I think everyone can live with the what, how and when of ANet's updates. But it is the why that seems to be confusing/upsetting to everyone.
If Gaile, or some other ANet representative came on here and gave a "This is why we did it" statement, would it help? Or would it simply be another avenue to berate their update?
I do think it in ANet's best interests to put out some sort of statement with every update. Just a list of changes/patches/bug fixes/enhancements isn't enough, it seems.
I am genuinely curious as to what it is that they can do to help this situation...besides "unnerf" the farming areas?
Please leave reasonable suggestions and/or wish lists for what you'd like to HEAR from ANet.
Would a statement from ANet help?
Aniewiel
Sir Maddox
On some level, I would say that some people believe their ideas are 'the best' ideas and a public statement would involve these people not only questioning, and denying every justification made, but then offering up their own opinions and not accepting any criticism on their own part.
Mumblyfish
Have we even got any concrete information that those oh so precious grinding areas were nerfed? I mean, more than a handful of people stating what could be little more than bad luck?
Theos
I don't know how much it is complaining as it is a cry for help by Average Joe. Though I, like many, may be blind to my own bickoring so do inform me if it happens to be true :P.
What would help the most would be probably a statement from Gaile stating truly what the plan really is, i think that would really help the whole thing.
What would help the most would be probably a statement from Gaile stating truly what the plan really is, i think that would really help the whole thing.
Aniewiel
I agree, Mumbly. It is very possible that bad luck has increased with the update. 
But that could be part of a "why" statement from ANet: Here's -how- we nerfed it, -where- we nerfed and WHY (though for some of us that's obvious).
But that could be part of a "why" statement from ANet: Here's -how- we nerfed it, -where- we nerfed and WHY (though for some of us that's obvious).
suzumebachi
i have a sneaking suspicion that the "nerf" wasn't fully intended, nor was the breaking of the NPC traders. as far as the NPC traders, i have a feeling somebody didn't dot their I's and cross their T's when implementing the "quote" system. but i have no idea about the nerfage, but i've been playing for a while this morning and it seems like a lot more than bad luck. :/
some insight from somebody at ANet would be fully appreciated yes. it seems they left out a few other details of the latest update anyways. like the fact that dyes now show their color when being dropped/picked up. i suppose it's possible someone forgot to mention that and the drop rate changes.
some insight from somebody at ANet would be fully appreciated yes. it seems they left out a few other details of the latest update anyways. like the fact that dyes now show their color when being dropped/picked up. i suppose it's possible someone forgot to mention that and the drop rate changes.
EmperorTippy
I would love some insight. If this is just a bug(s) fine by me I won't say anything until after they are worked out but if this was the intended thing to do even for the most noble of reasons it was an utter failure.
Diomedes
I, for one, would wish that they would include a nerfing statement in their update statement. It doesn't have to be a justification, but a little bullet point, "Dramatically reduced drops in farmable areas" would actually make me feel like someone wasn't pulling one over on me. (although honestly, my drops were the same last night as before, but then again, I wasn't hitting very farmable areas)
-Diomedes
-Diomedes
Arthur Eld
I don't really know where I stand on this point, but dammit I want to say something. I don't know how bad the nerfing was, I never had a farming spot, so I can't speak about that. As for a minor statement of why ANet nerfed an area or changed this to that, as long as it's kept short, sweet, and to the point, perhaps that would help to clear things up. Overall though, I just feel bad for ANet. Not only are we not charged monthly fees, but they've been putting out updates nearly consistently every week. I mean, stating your opinion about things is the only way for ANet to know about user-feedback, but the feedback needs to be more critical and not so aggressive. One can point out things they disagree with in an appropriate way, without bombarding the company that makes and fixes the game you can't stop playing. My hat's off to you, ANet. It's nice to see a company that cares amidst the many companies that shell out crap to make a quick buck.
Dax
While I agree somewhat with your idea, sometimes I wonder if the community has become a bit too dependant on explanations. I'm sure Anet has to consider the game from an overall point of view which includes the people who just bought the game not just the ones who have been playing since the beta. Explanation or not it's not going to change any minds.
I haven't played since the update but the initial posts were "I love it" I wake up this morning and people hate it
I haven't played since the update but the initial posts were "I love it" I wake up this morning and people hate it
Creston
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Originally Posted by Aniewiel
It's the old "damned if you do, damned if you don't routine".
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It's really not that tough to understand, is it, Anet?
Creston
funbun
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| ...they've been putting out updates nearly consistently every week |
Rune traders have completely crashed the rune market. Farming sucks everywhere now and I have to play 10x as much to get the same amount of items. GW needs to wait longer before implementing changes to the econimic system. I think they should stay out of the econimy all together.
Mumblyfish
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Originally Posted by Creston
This statement is incorrect. If Anet, for ONCE, could stop just nerfing everything, I think 90% of the anger to an update would simply vanish. Yet, they simply can't seem to comprehend that PEOPLE HATE HAVING "THEIR" GAME NERFED.
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Aniewiel
While I don't believe in having everything in my world explained to me, perhaps a short statement would help shut down some of the complainers!
And, one thing that everyone is failing to remember: This game is not "our" game. It is the intellectual and actual property of the developers. If they want to nerf the snot out of the game, that is their perrogative. And they don't have to say why either.
The game will continue to sell regardless. A lot of us will continue to play regardless. But I do think a short PR statement with each update would go a long way to fostering communication.
And, one thing that everyone is failing to remember: This game is not "our" game. It is the intellectual and actual property of the developers. If they want to nerf the snot out of the game, that is their perrogative. And they don't have to say why either.
The game will continue to sell regardless. A lot of us will continue to play regardless. But I do think a short PR statement with each update would go a long way to fostering communication.
EmperorTippy
How does nerfing PvE make your game mor enjoyable Mumbly?
(Merely curious not intending to agonize)
(Merely curious not intending to agonize)
Dax
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Originally Posted by Arthur Eld
I don't really know where I stand on this point, but dammit I want to say something. I don't know how bad the nerfing was, I never had a farming spot, so I can't speak about that. As for a minor statement of why ANet nerfed an area or changed this to that, as long as it's kept short, sweet, and to the point, perhaps that would help to clear things up. Overall though, I just feel bad for ANet. Not only are we not charged monthly fees, but they've been putting out updates nearly consistently every week. I mean, stating your opinion about things is the only way for ANet to know about user-feedback, but the feedback needs to be more critical and not so aggressive. One can point out things they disagree with in an appropriate way, without bombarding the company that makes and fixes the game you can't stop playing. My hat's off to you, ANet. It's nice to see a company that cares amidst the many companies that shell out crap to make a quick buck.
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I'm not saying this is good or bad.... I would just be curious (not that they would actually say). Most online games that charges need X amount of subscribers and they need maintain that number.
Dax
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Originally Posted by Aniewiel
While I don't believe in having everything in my world explained to me, perhaps a short statement would help shut down some of the complainers!
And, one thing that everyone is failing to remember: This game is not "our" game. It is the intellectual and actual property of the developers. If they want to nerf the snot out of the game, that is their perrogative. And they don't have to say why either. The game will continue to sell regardless. A lot of us will continue to play regardless. But I do think a short PR statement with each update would go a long way to fostering communication. |
Yea maybe you're right.
Divinitys Creature
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Originally Posted by Aniewiel
While I don't believe in having everything in my world explained to me, perhaps a short statement would help shut down some of the complainers!
And, one thing that everyone is failing to remember: This game is not "our" game. It is the intellectual and actual property of the developers. If they want to nerf the snot out of the game, that is their perrogative. And they don't have to say why either. The game will continue to sell regardless. A lot of us will continue to play regardless. But I do think a short PR statement with each update would go a long way to fostering communication. |
I agree with you about the statement. People get frustrated when they don' know what's going on or why it's going on. It might calm people down. We saw this work with the letter to players a week before the first faction patch.
Loviatar
the people yelling the loudest were the very people getting rich farming their favorite 259k loot patch.now they cant just run out and get an extra umpty k as spare change they are yelling .
as for explanations they have already stated that high concentration loot areas invite botters.
solution is to spread out the loot so you dont have those rich spots to bot or farm
as for dyes showing color when dropped that happened BEFORE this update as i have seen the flash of color dropping for awhile now
as for giving an explanation forget it,
reason is it would do no good for the yelling masses who dont just disagree but flat out state that the developers goofed and it should be their way.
an explanation will not convince them because they already *KNOW* they are right and Anet is wrong
MSecorsky
If they need to nerf things to keep GW from becoming another non-ladder Diablo, then so be it. Rare drops aren't rare if you farm an area and gather 30 of them. It's not ANet's job to make your characters rich easily.
Besides, maybe this will cut into the GW sweatshops profits in China.
Besides, maybe this will cut into the GW sweatshops profits in China.
PieXags
I'd say yes it would help.
If Gaile or someone else from Anet/NCSoft came and told us "This is why we're doing what we're doing, we're moving in this direction with the came and would like this to happen" etc, etc. At least then I'd know if the situation would ever improve or if the game is moving in a direction that would allow me to enjoy it anymore. If they at least let us know what in the world they're thinking, I'd be overjoyed, because at least then I'd know whether or not I should continue putting forth my opinion or whether it's a hopeless case and should move to another game.
If Gaile or someone else from Anet/NCSoft came and told us "This is why we're doing what we're doing, we're moving in this direction with the came and would like this to happen" etc, etc. At least then I'd know if the situation would ever improve or if the game is moving in a direction that would allow me to enjoy it anymore. If they at least let us know what in the world they're thinking, I'd be overjoyed, because at least then I'd know whether or not I should continue putting forth my opinion or whether it's a hopeless case and should move to another game.
Diomedes
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| Rare drops aren't rare if you farm an area and gather 30 of them. It's not ANet's job to make your characters rich easily. |
-Diomedes
silvertemplar
I think a statement saying "We are focusing on PvP, all changes henceforth is aimed to push people into PvPing instead of PvEing" would be enough for me.
I don't know if their "mission statement" is somewhere which resembles above statement, but if it is then it'll explain ALOT. It will also explain almost 99% of their changes or lack of changes to specific places in the game. As it stands, i can only assume that is what they are trying to say :
New Players should PvP, and get their content via PvP. PvE is just a
a playground to experiment and gain a bit of practice without too much human interference/dependence.
I don't know if their "mission statement" is somewhere which resembles above statement, but if it is then it'll explain ALOT. It will also explain almost 99% of their changes or lack of changes to specific places in the game. As it stands, i can only assume that is what they are trying to say :
New Players should PvP, and get their content via PvP. PvE is just a
a playground to experiment and gain a bit of practice without too much human interference/dependence.
Aniewiel
Thanks, everyone, for your very reasonable responses. Keep 'em coming. I suspect that this kind of thread (and not just 'cause -I- started it LOL!) is the kind that they will read and, just perhaps, respond to in a fashion that will benefit all of us! 
Mumblyfish
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Originally Posted by EmperorTippy
How does nerfing PvE make your game mor enjoyable Mumbly?
(Merely curious not intending to agonize) |
Damon Windwalker
I want to say that I appreciate and respect all the effort that is going into the production and updating of GW. However, I do think there is one major problem, and I wonder if it will ever really be resolved to a majority satisfaction.
From my perspective (plerase don't tell me I'm wrong - I'm not knokcing anyone else's gameplay styles of preferences - just stating mine) this is primarily a PvE game with some PvP thrown in. I know others see it the other way, that's fine. - I'm nto saying either view is right or wrong.
the problem is that PvPers and PvEers want different things - and those things are sometimes at odds with each other. My frustration comes from the fact that it seems like the majority of everything lately has been done for the benefit of the PvPers, and the PvE'ers have been mostly forgotten about (with the exception of nerfing everything).
I don' know how a good balance can be found to make both sides happy within the same game.
From my perspective (plerase don't tell me I'm wrong - I'm not knokcing anyone else's gameplay styles of preferences - just stating mine) this is primarily a PvE game with some PvP thrown in. I know others see it the other way, that's fine. - I'm nto saying either view is right or wrong.
the problem is that PvPers and PvEers want different things - and those things are sometimes at odds with each other. My frustration comes from the fact that it seems like the majority of everything lately has been done for the benefit of the PvPers, and the PvE'ers have been mostly forgotten about (with the exception of nerfing everything).
I don' know how a good balance can be found to make both sides happy within the same game.
Dax
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Originally Posted by PieXags
I'd say yes it would help.
If Gaile or someone else from Anet/NCSoft came and told us "This is why we're doing what we're doing, we're moving in this direction with the came and would like this to happen" etc, etc. At least then I'd know if the situation would ever improve or if the game is moving in a direction that would allow me to enjoy it anymore. If they at least let us know what in the world they're thinking, I'd be overjoyed, because at least then I'd know whether or not I should continue putting forth my opinion or whether it's a hopeless case and should move to another game. |
I mean they can only hope that it will help, and if it doesn't they can change it again. I guess it gives us a sense of well being and a chance to get it out of our systems, but I'm pretty sure they make changes to improve the game.
I agree that since Anet has been pretty good about communicating to the community it would be a nice to have a statement though.
EmperorTippy
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Originally Posted by Loviatar
the people yelling the loudest were the very people getting rich farming their favorite 259k loot patch.now they cant just run out and get an extra umpty k as spare change they are yelling . as for explanations they have already stated that high concentration loot areas invite botters. solution is to spread out the loot so you dont have those rich spots to bot or farm as for dyes showing color when dropped that happened BEFORE this update as i have seen the flash of color dropping for awhile now as for giving an explanation forget it, reason is it would do no good for the yelling masses who dont just disagree but flat out state that the developers goofed and it should be their way. an explanation will not convince them because they already *KNOW* they are right and Anet is wrong |
Thanks Mumbly I personally disagree but to each his own. I don't like rerunning and only do it when testing new builds before I bring them into PvP. I wouldn't really mind a bank wipe so long as it happens after I get my FoW Armor. only like 20 ectos to go
Borealis
I keep scrolling though all these threads hunting and hoping for a reply from anet about everything I see on the first forum page and all I hear is the wind blowing in my ear.
MSecorsky
The real problem, imo, is that people are spoiled brats thanks to games like Diablo, where a character can uber-out and solo the entire game without braking a sweat. So now there's a game that's actively reigning that in before it's ruined and the whine-birds are flocking.
Aniewiel
Is it possible that changes are being incrementally made ... seesawing back and forth between PvP changes and PvE changes?
Principa Discordia
This post is directed at nobody in particular, it's just a simple announcement: Stay on-topic and don't post anything that could be flamebait. I am watching this thread.
Aniewiel
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Originally Posted by Borealis
I keep scrolling though all these threads hunting and hoping for a reply from anet about everything I see on the first forum page
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Dax
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Originally Posted by MSecorsky
The real problem, imo, is that people are spoiled brats thanks to games like Diablo, where a character can uber-out and solo the entire game without braking a sweat. So now there's a game that's actively reigning that in before it's ruined and the whine-birds are flocking.
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I don't think they'd say that though
MSecorsky
I don't mean to come across as flamebaiting, but after seeing Diablo basically flat out ruined because it was impossible to complete unless you had uber-everything... well, ANet needs to prevent that. Rare items should be rare. Heck, they are for me anyhow. Seems the whining is that everyone wants everything now with minimal effort. This is and should be the wrong game for that. Besides, if you can't beat or compete without uber-items, perhaps it's not ANets fault you can't compete.
It's a game of skill, not things.
Seems the whining is that everyone wants everything now with minimal effort. This is and should be the wrong game for that. Besides, if you can't beat or compete without uber-items, perhaps it's not ANets fault you can't compete.It's a game of skill, not things.
Borealis
Why the material trader prices are suddenly in the toilet, MCS mentioned to me in another thread in the wee hours of the morning when I made mention of obsidian selling for +4k and buy back is 100g from merch, he says something along the lines of "wait a few minutes it'll get back to normal". It's more then 7 hours later....still 100g??
Why do they feel the need to constantly nerf everything in sight, the economy is hugely inflated yet it seems drop rates have decreased significantly no matter where you are and what you're doing.
They say "you'll get better loot playing the game normally". Then why is it I spent damn near 10 or more hours a day sometimes playing this game and still don't see any very many good drops? The only time I ever get really good drops (which all areas are dead now) is when I was solo farming.
They change enemy movements in fissure making it more difficult yet still no good drops, I was in there last night for over 3 hours and in that time span a whopping 2 obsidian drop, no purple/rare items for a single person in that whole span....yet difficulty seems to be increased?
Maybe others don't see things the way I do, thats fine. Just some of the things on my mind.
P.S. I'm not expecting a response from them about any of the above, as there has been silence regarding all this, this is just for the record I guess.
Why do they feel the need to constantly nerf everything in sight, the economy is hugely inflated yet it seems drop rates have decreased significantly no matter where you are and what you're doing.
They say "you'll get better loot playing the game normally". Then why is it I spent damn near 10 or more hours a day sometimes playing this game and still don't see any very many good drops? The only time I ever get really good drops (which all areas are dead now) is when I was solo farming.
They change enemy movements in fissure making it more difficult yet still no good drops, I was in there last night for over 3 hours and in that time span a whopping 2 obsidian drop, no purple/rare items for a single person in that whole span....yet difficulty seems to be increased?
Maybe others don't see things the way I do, thats fine. Just some of the things on my mind.
P.S. I'm not expecting a response from them about any of the above, as there has been silence regarding all this, this is just for the record I guess.
Aniewiel
Please everyone, stay on topic. Principa has locked most of the "complaint/cheer" threads regarding the update. The purpose of -this- thread is to ask you whether or not you think that a statement from ANet would help or not.
Please, stay on topic. It has been very civil and needs to stay that way. I would like to think that Gaile or one of the other reps might actually read it. If it turns into just another b*(*h session, I can almost guarantee they won't.
Remember, you can always send your complaints directly to them. Please don't put them in -this- thread.
Please, stay on topic. It has been very civil and needs to stay that way. I would like to think that Gaile or one of the other reps might actually read it. If it turns into just another b*(*h session, I can almost guarantee they won't.
Remember, you can always send your complaints directly to them. Please don't put them in -this- thread.
Algren Cole
I had no participation in the creation of this game.
I have no participation in the continued efforst of ArenaNet to update the game
I had no input, no contribution, none of my time was spent building this game
I paid only 50 bucks....and I will never again pay any MORE money to play this game.
ArenaNet doesn't owe me an explanation for why they are doing things....they don't owe you one either.
I have no participation in the continued efforst of ArenaNet to update the game
I had no input, no contribution, none of my time was spent building this game
I paid only 50 bucks....and I will never again pay any MORE money to play this game.
ArenaNet doesn't owe me an explanation for why they are doing things....they don't owe you one either.
Thanas
I expect its an economy based change. Farming devaluates gold. If peoples incomes are bigger then they can spend more and thus I'd expect prices to rise. For those few casual players or those that don't farm, buying items become a "no no". Basically everyone has to farm to buy items, but then the value of gold is reduced anyway.
Aniewiel
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Originally Posted by Algren Cole
I had no participation in the creation of this game.
I have no participation in the continued efforst of ArenaNet to update the game I had no input, no contribution, none of my time was spent building this game I paid only 50 bucks....and I will never again pay any MORE money to play this game. ArenaNet doesn't owe me an explanation for why they are doing things....they don't owe you one either. |