Poll on the 10/10 and 10/11 Update

They could atleast delete the patch for the weekend.
Work on rretooling, making it less drastic.

We've played this long with AOE working the way they were, I'm sure the gamers wouldn't mind doing it untill a better patch is done, for or against Ele's.
Open question, I'm new to these boards, WTF does nerfing stand for?

Griffons don't mind if My sword can slash them in the face for 50 damage.. but when my AoE hits them for 2's.. they run like cowards.

Is that realsim?

~Ice~

Nerfing stands for... nerfing. It's a term which means to reduce the power of something which is supposedly overpowered and causes an imbalance in a game, such as how ether renewal was quite overpowered.

Stopping the rampant solo farming is good, making fire eles useless is bad, i thought AoE spells were designed for taking out groups, what use are they now?

Too much too soon imo, although the crushing of griffon farming more than makes up for irritating AI.

That makes sense. The game came out in April I think, constant tweaks are to be expected, to equalize the playing field. Even Beta testers aren't in mass enough to find everything.

On that, it's good they're trying to fix things. Someone probably had a deadline and pushed it through too fast. It sure doesn't match their track record(if everything I've read is accurate), so something is up.

Thanks alot though, for the definition, and lack of the words, "you noob" or something similar.

Retribution isn't nerfed. Its not an AoE spell. It deals damage back to single targets if that target hits the actor with retribution on it.

AoE's are just that. Area Effect Spells, if Anet doesn't like the way they cause damage to numerous foes then perhaps they should've considered that before ever releasing the game.

Spawns not only run away from the AoE's but your henchies can take off after them causing a very undesireable increase in agro. The point of AoE's was to inflict max dmg to a wide number of spawns at once, if this is something Anet now suddenly doesn't like then they need to take a good hard swallow. I can accept some of the past Nerfs to things, though many of those pissed me off just the same, but you eliminate all possible combinations of everything. Traps are AoE's, many Necro, Mes, Monk and Elementalist skills are AoE based.

Anet you DESTROY your very game by keeping this update as is and you certainly did more than enough to damage my belief that GW could remain a decent game.

I don't mind change when it's not constantly affecting everything. Just bloody well pick something and just stay with it and move on to actually doing more productive things like cranking out Chapters, because at the rate your going right now I'm quickly leaning towards other games and saying the hell with GW.

I think this option could go either way : I think the idea behind the patch is good, but was implemented poorly.

I was going to vote that but you would assume that i hate this patch. I love it. My Earth Ele loves it. However, Anet did not go far enough. The AI is still stupid. You can trap a monster against a wall and it stops fighting. I want to see them use more than 2-3 skills. I want monster to rez each other even in low level areas. I want this game to be hard. I want to feel some accomplishment when i finish the game.

This is definately a step in the right direction. A few more tweaks and it will feel like i am fighting a real monster instead of some stupid AI.

I've posted this in another thread, and I'm going to say it again. This update really gets on my nerves. I'm standing up for "the little guy," AKA the person who doesn't have hours to spend on the game. Some of us bought this game so we could have fun at AI's expense. Not possible anymore. I was expecting a fun game, that changed a little at times, but not made me have to rethink my entire setup with a single change. I have 200 gold to span 2 accounts now, and I'm having trouble changing that. I think Anet tried to make it harder for ebay farmers now, but in a sense, they made it easier. More people will be resorting to going on ebay and buying 1 mil for 40 dollars, etc. I believe they should reverse this update, because it's made the rich richer, and the poor just poorer. If you're stuck broke, you'll be like that for a while until you think of a new build BUT WAIT, there is more. Now you can't afford the new skills you need, or can't buy the new rune you need to buy, or can't upgrade your armor, etc. I mean seriously, if we wanted a challenging game that made us use up all of our thinking power...Well...We wouldn't have bought Guild Wars in the first place.

That's my two cents,

Bringer Di Morte

-EDIT- About my last sentences, let me rephrase that. We want a game that we can play in the time we have when we have time, not one that can take hours just to think up and test a new build. Please Anet, think about the little guys.

Update!

Metor Shower: Make all foes in the area FLEE!

~Ice~

There's so much on here I want to respond to (See... because I *READ* it before posting. Crazy, huh?) but I'll run with this one.

The game will not suffocate because of this patch. In a week, you'll stop b*tching, and log on again, and go on the internet to find some other build someone smarter than you put together. Which works.

AoE spells were being improperly used. They're not meant to fill every slot in the skill bar. Area Of Effect spells punish people for clumping together, they're not supposed to kill every single one of them in one cast. AoE stop your enemies from attacking you by running away instead. So drop a monk and add a RANGER or a MESMER to kill them faster. Shocking, I know. But it just might work. You... do... realize there are Mesmers and Rangers in PvE too, right? ...just making sure.

The game is more realistic now. And in a month, when another patch has come out, you'll b*tch endlessly about that one, and forget about this one, because you (or smarter players you've copied) will have found new ways to play the Elementalists.

And stop complaining about how farming was nerfed yet again. The game designers don't want you farming. So... maintaining your farming build is not their priority. I farm. But if they manage to stop me, that just means they won, and I lost, and I need to restart, try something different, and go at it again. ....unless you're the type who wants to win every mission the first time.

No no no!!! Not everyone is like that! We don't all have the time to tweak our builds to adjust to the new update, etc. PvP is where you fight something real and not AI. PvP is Player vs PLAYER for a reason! If Anet took the steps you just suggested, I can bet you that they will lose 1/4 of their customers right off the bat.

First off, you have to calm down. Secondly, a lot of the people who are pro the patch treat PvE like it's PvP. If you want to fight something real, go to Tombs.

Whats wrong with griffon farming?
I do it because it is fun, and i want to be able to make money to get my fow armour.

Is this hurting you or anybody else in the game?
Does my having fun make you mad?
Does my eventual having of FoW armour piss you off?

I really see nothing wrong with farming. The making of money.
If it's an exploit, there i see a problem, but if i not making money from some bug in the game, what is wrong with what i am doing? Its just another feature of the game.

To me, its just a balance issue. farming isn't impossible yet, they just run and come right back. And I agree Alexandria, mesmers and rangers are out there in the world and they do wayyy more damage than you probably think. I'm kind of glad A-net did something to help mesmers through. When people call for groups, you always here echo nuker and monk needed. Ever a mesmer? never heard a group want one, so thank you anet for more balance.

You know whats bad? Anet is against farming but they pratically put it into the game as long as their is skills you can USE. You can always solo, and I don't know why Anet just didn't put in some forumula that is like..

If 1 person is in your party, your max rate of a monster droping a item = 25%

...

And they pretty much disabled AoE skills.. wait.. can we even call them skills now?

~Ice~

If people want real how bout real life for ya? There is nothing wrong with farming. If Anet is going to force me to play a certain way then screw this game as I have said many times before on many issues. No other patch has been this bad. That's a fact. Check out the forums. See how many posts there are. I'll give anet 2-3 days to fix this if not well I'm out for good and not coming back even for chap II.

Conspiracy theorist by day, Guild Wars player by night?

Bad idea. Nobody needs a mesmer or necro still. They make things easier but still are not needed. Certainly more viable now but doing it at the expense of the elementalist class is wrong. Seriously wtf was anet thinking. If they wanted more so called "balance" make it so that people actually need them.

Agreed ^.

I liked this update a lot, even though it still needs to be tweaked.

Nukers- Use some of the brains you have. If you want mobs to stay in one area, bring a spell or have somebody in your group to snare them (Barbed Trap, Deep Freeze or Ward Against Foes might help you keep them in place.) I think this game needs to have more strategy if you want to kill everything at once.

Farmers- ANet doesn't like farming. This game is meant for the casual player, and casual players can't farm to easily. I'll agree that the casualness might be toned more for pvp, but pve should be equal too.

Basically, this should make it easier to get necros and rangers into some groups instead of just the Ele, Warriors and Monks.

This is a very bad patch.. I guess Anet is absorbing all the information now.. and hopefully will change it to the players needs. Thats what this game is about .. right? The players and fun?

As for the economy, why DISAPPROVE of farming? Because players get rich? Then counter it with more Gold Sinks! Duh..

Anet has gone from Making the player happy to forcing people to play THEIR way. Farmer haters they are.

~Ice~

All of you for the patch should really see the video on another thread of the drake running from incediary bonds everytime an arrow hits. The monster way overreact. I see Anets intentions, but the game is just no fun. Instead of spending 8 hours playing today I spent 8 hours reading posts and praying the patch would be reevaluated. Okay maybe it makes since that they run from over time AoE but not instant AoE. Second saying trying to fix it more like PvP is stupid. If I wanted the PvP experiance I would PvP (Did anybody really of that).

SIGH.... please don't make the Christmas special be reversing this patch. Do it now so it might be implemented earlier. That way I can be thankful over Turkey day for the great dev team GW has (At the moment I hope your all scrambling to figure out what needs to be changed because you realized you just made the biggest mistake ever!!!)

Congrats to reading, i really do appreciate someone who deosn't set forth without all of that work.

About it being realistic is a matter of opinon though, as most of my posts state. But you cannot honestely say to sprint away with onely one seconds worth of 10 seconds AOE is realistic. Sidestep around it, run through it to get at the caster, sure, thats better. My posts state that even standing in it can be reasoned, I won't repost here.

Sure, something had to be done about 8 aoe spells in one persons skillbar, farming so they can make money on ebay.
Maybe this is just a short term patch to get through untill the anti'farm for ebay patch comes out. One can hope right?

But monsters that do want to kill you, running away so mommy can kiss their boo-boo is entirely too drastic. So is NPC henchies on crack.

Also do you realize that the end game is PvP? The PvE aspect is only getting you ready for PvP.

These skills were broken for a while. I am glad Anet did something about it. Now my Earth Ele is viable in PvE.

I never said it was perfect but it is a step in the right direction.

Most of you say "just get smarter"..

But its really not about smarts, its about organization! You can get a perfect 7 man team with a warrior who doesn't know how to tank and your entire team is faulty.

The "Tank" and 2 ele's behind, plus 2 monks didn't require much organization at all, but did you know that 50% to 60% of players suck at doing such a simple method?

Now if you REALLY want a good team, get a guildy, lock yourself isolated with them and ignore the outside world, because it appears Anet is only making it where you can win through tactical cordinated attacks as if we were AI..

Not too good for the causual player. You can't really help with your average skills, now everything has to be through up and planed before you make a intial strike. Although it should be done BEFORE.. its just not what players do.. and to be honest.. if we have to plan alot of things without the ability to just go in and win 80% of the time.. thats going to suck even more.

PvE = PvP

~Ice~

I have got to see what they do at the mineral springs when the avicara spam ignite arrow attacks o_O

Umm have you ever farmed. Its pretty casual. Talk with some guildies nuke 50 griffons yeah all nice and peaceful. Nukers use some brains? Umm they just used a highly efficient strategy that has begun since this game was on the market. So now they have to go into crappy ways to do things they once did with ease. It's anets fault that nuking evolved and its their fault again for the shitties update yet.

I still get stuck on some stair cracks, while I float over others.
Invisible walls still cause my characters to bounce back 10 steps.
I still walk through solid boulders, and get stopped by small bushes.
My henchies still run at every huge mob like Berserkers, and die
The keyboard sampling rate is still lousy, and 10% of my mouse clicks are ignored by the game

But now, the monsters scramble about like drunk monkeys after a few hits. Of course my character follows them around, since the battle engine is too dumb to just retarget the one monster that is still attacking me.

Yeah, this is one great update. Keep em coming. The developers at WoW will love you for it.

I like the patch.

I've seen a lot of arguments about this and that.
1. Nothing just stands in AoE and takes damage. That has always seemed silly to me. I haven't played a good game yet (online or single player) where the mops just stand there and take AoE.

2. I'm a casual player with family responsibilities and limited time. I don't feel hurt by this patch. In fact like I said above I like it.

3. It does seem ANet is listening. They are still adjusting NPC AI. They did so in todays update (according to the GW site). They have made a great game and I think they make their decisions about game mechanics to improve the game.

Does anyone know what just happened in the update a minute ago?

Well, a new build was just released, and, it seems like some part of us got through. They still run, but it's certainly not as bad anymore, they don't run from things like ignite arrows or fireball, and they don't magically predict a firestorm anymore. I can be happy with this.

Yes, I can live with that as well. A compromise.

And it's NOT silly to run away before you figure damage is lethal? Say 14points of damage, or even before you take aoe damage?


Edit, i hear the patch got improved, slightly...

Update syas it fixes AI

I am one of those who don't like the changes. I liked it the way it was. I like playing PVE and I have no interest is testosterone laden PVP battles. It's the same with Deathmatches in Quake or any of the other games. Boring!!! And, I'm not too fond of the elitest attitude of the PVPers. Who cares if I'm the best or the worst player. It isn't like it's real life. That's my preference. I'm not one of those invincimonks and I stink at solo farming griffins. I do all the quests and I like to go out in areas with henchies and clear an area. I, also, like the economic system of trading and selling to get the K's for the better armor, etc. I've met people from all over the world by buying and selling. To me, it took great skill in mastering other aspects of the game like solo farming. It motivated people to tweak their builds and get the most out of their PVE character. I benifited because many people share their information and that helped me have a better character.

The real problem stems from the fact that some items and some armor are only obtainable through amassing a huge amount of K's. This created the need for solo farming and the invincimonk builds. Also, it's hard to create an 8 team group, by the way I like to play, then go into UW and succeed. We have a 4 person team, with the main character being an invincimonk. We wear headsets to communicate, plot strategy, and, are continually adjusting the build to get the most out of it. It only takes 4 hits at 150 dmg for me to die. The only way I can survive more than 60 seconds in UW is for an invincimonk to engage the baddies and the rest of us to support with ranged attacks and healing. I believe I have the right, like everyone else, to have success in UW. I should have access to ectos like everyone else because I think I should be able, with hard game playing,skill, and dedication to the game, to be rewarded for that effort.

Most of the skills are AoE skills for certain characters. This created a diversity of abilities and, thus, all members of a team had a role to play. Weakening these skills lessons the effectiveness of some characters, like elemental. Most of the ele skills are AoE. In trying to tweak our builds, it is hard to find enough non AoE skills to keep the baddies from running away. For example, we take great care in only aggroing (is that the term) only a few groups at a time. I've found that, now when I'm fighting in close with my Warrior, the thing I'm fighting runs right into an another group, so that I'm now battling 10 instead of 5. I can take on 5 at once. I can't take on 10-20 and survive. This is pretty evident in portions of SF, where bosses are not only protected by a team, but, there are groups in not too far away positions. It takes skill to sneak in and avoid those groups and battle the group with the boss in it. Now the boss runs right into 1, 2, or ever 3 groups making it impossible to not get killed. To me, this takes the fun out of it. I like a fair tough fight. Not one that I have no hope of winning. The other day, Brohn was surrounded by 4 priests. usually there is 2. You kill one and then quickly run over to the other and hack on him, with the mouse clicker lined up on an interupt spell so he can't resurrect the other priest. With 4 and Brohn, I could get through 3 and Brohn himself before the last one resurrected the first priest. So maybe I'm not good enough to take them all out, but, now they run away and by the time I/we chase them down, the other priests are resurrected. After about a half hour of this I just gave up.

I realize much of this diatribe was off the cuff and it only illustrates some of the problems with the changes.

If the creators really want to change the game for the better, they should think about getting rid of the hired sellers that dominate LA, Droknars, and, now Deldrimore. They inflate the prices of the items. It's impossible to read the trade posts because they go too fast. They are continually accosting me , opening unsolicited trade windows and being total pests. The solution would be to either limit them to certain areas or, better yet, let there be a place where true game players can go to buy, trade, and, sell at reasonable rates without the obnoxious distractions.

That's my story and I'm sticking to it.

The company will though.
Any good business will keep the largest number of people happy, for purposes of retention, and purchase of further products.
Therefore, if you complain about something in a rational voice(or typed phrase as the case may be), and can explain why it is unfair or inappropriate, it will be considered. If enough people raise their voice things will be heard and changes will be made, we've already seen progress as a patch for the one this poll is over.

No player, gives a flying FiretrUCK if you as an individual will miss them or not. So, in effect, you wasted your time with that post.

They still run from ignite I just tested this and they do.

I've read through all these posts... and I have something to say that nobody seems to have picked up on...

The Economy.

The last "Ballbuster" patch was designed to improve the economy, yeah? And make weapons a bit cheaper, etc, etc.
This patch may well have completely destroyed that.
I speak from a farmers point of veiw... IE: Prohpets Path Griffon Farming.
This type of farming produces a HUGE input of gold weapons.
Effectively, they've killed "superfarming" IE; 30 or 40 at a time. This will make MANY famers, like myself, simply stop farming.
Suddenly, the HUGE influx of gold weapons has decreased to a trickle.
Now, what will happen to the economy?
2 guesses... and the second guess doesn't count.
We're gonna be back up to 150k for a clean 15^50 sword.

Thanks Anet. You've just made me a Rich, Rich player.

Technically no your are wrong, the end game is not pvp as the game is not really over if there are planed expansions.

Btw Anet Can dictate what ever it wants, you only have a right to play the game on their network and servers, read your license agreement. As far as farming goes I could careless. Farming both helps and hurts the economy just depends on the day and who decides to rip your arm off for an item.

Flame in this thread too, and you'll be one step closer to a ban. This is directed towards everyone. PM me if you have problems.